So who's got their knee down?

[Coldkiwi]

Right, and no lying about it either! You may of course have been hanging off like a monkey with 4ft arms to get some 'knee down action' but we'll let that count.

and before you decry me for being an egotistical rice rocketer.. Fazer Bloke asked!!

[k14]

Nope, not me. Got some virgin knee sliders on my spidi leathers and i intend to keep them that way. Maybe have a go at a track day at ruapuna sometime. But i am quite happy not to have done it at the moment.

[Solarwind]

No point, I just use counter-steering if I need a tight turn :niceone:

[duckman]

Yea on the race track (taupo) a few times but never on the road, and not because I think it silly,irresponsible, reckless e.t.c. but because I can't get that low on most public roads. I guess I do think the roads a bit dodge for getting a knee down but I wouldn't bag anyone for doing it.

[Motu]

I don't do knee down,but foot down is cool - this is my old steel shoe.

[jrandom]

Had both knees down at various times, closely followed by elbow, shoulder, back and head.

[bungbung]

I tried getting my knee down, I got such a fright when it actually happened, it put me off going again

[Hitcher]

Oh yeah, I tried that once... But I didn't inhale!

[Joni]

Only on the track for me.....

[Jackrat]

The type of bikes I ride,the day I get a knee down it will be closly followed by the rest of me.Even on me old duke' I never did,I don't think my style of riding lends it's self to it.

[slob]

Was bit of a struggle getting it down on my previous bike (TL1000S), piece of piss on my current one (FZR400), but I've cut down on doing it on the road after an encounter with a cateye... (**ouch**) :crazy:

[SpankMe]

My legs are too short. Thats my story and I'm sticking to it.

[Two Smoker]

WIth my arse all the way off the seat and knee fully out, my pegs followed by my Exhaust chamber scrap :thud: so next time, im goin to try even harder and hang off even more... Its really hard on a really skinny bike :sneaky2:

[matthewt]

I got both knees down last year !!!

[jrandom]

Seriously though, it's quite difficult on a skinny wee bike like the FXR or an RGV150, the problem is that it turns in so quick with not much more than a general thought cast in the direction of the corner.

I pretty much have to climb right off and drop down on one side while the bike goes round the corner nearly upright if I want to GMKD. Being a fat bastard has a lot to do with it I suspect, I can drag the bike through corners with very little countersteering just by flopping my torso over the tank in the right direction.

In any case I've only achieved touchdown a couple of times at roundabouts (the one in Massey at the top of the northwestern motorway where SH16 heads off to Kumeu is a good 'un).

[andy1]

had my ass down, does that count? :beer:

[Coldkiwi]

had my ass down, does that count? :beer:

judging by the state of your leathers (and sliders from memory) I reckon that should count!

[DEATH_INC.]

My legs are too short. Thats my story and I'm sticking to it.
yep,me too.The only time I ever managed it was quickly followed by my shoulder/foot/bike...... :doctor:

[Wenier]

only got peg, but if i stuck my knee out it would probably hit the ground happily, but thats not a good idea in jeans is it? :)

[Zed]

No point trying without sliders on, and I've never had the pleasure of wearing any. I'm quite happy watching you do it CK! :not:


Zed

[Racey Rider]

Nope. Not yet! But still learning how far I can lean the bike in corners. And haveing worn tyres doesn't help. And no sliders yet. Hope to get some cheap Motomail ones soon.
I made some feeble attempts to get the knee out in the corners at Manfield a few times, but it just didn't feel right.

So a question. When getting your knee down in a right hander, is your right foot middled on the foot peg? or are just your toes on the peg? :ride:

[Marknz]

Nope. Not yet! But still learning how far I can lean the bike in corners. And haveing worn tyres doesn't help. And no sliders yet. Hope to get some cheap Motomail ones soon.
I made some feeble attempts to get the knee out in the corners at Manfield a few times, but it just didn't feel right.

So a question. When getting your knee down in a right hander, is your right foot middled on the foot peg? or are just your toes on the peg? :ride:



toes on the right peg, inner left knee/thigh hugging the tank tight and middle of the left foot having good downward pressure on the left peg

[riffer]

When I first got the bike I had to see if I could do it. Roundabout at the start of Upper Hutt central just opposite the pool/repco/shindlers auctions.

Round and round and round - and it finally happened.

Hurt like hell. Not a good idea. :argh:

Decided countersteering is probably a better idea. Being somewhat of similar proportions to jrandom (5ft10, 95 kilos) I look like a fool hanging off even a 750, but my bike will lean a real long way before the pegs touch. I've never touched the pegs down (possibly because the spurs at the end of my pegs are broken off). However my chicken strips are now down to less than 5mm.

[Holy Roller]

However my chicken strips are now down to less than 5mm.
?
:confused2
Too much scrapes b4 I can get anywhere near having my knee down. except for when I part company with the bike :disapint:

[fzr400rr]

Yeh sure, why not. I'd be embarrased to take my bike in for new tyres with only the middles showing wear.
Never had the knee down (in my coupla months riding exp.), sortta come close thou. Hit my foot today on a 35k corner on hwy2 during another highspeed run back from Auckland, must've been hanging off the peg a little. Well - as you do when you take 75corners at 130+ :Punk:

[Posh Tourer :P]

Nope. Not yet! But still learning how far I can lean the bike in corners. And haveing worn tyres doesn't help. And no sliders yet. Hope to get some cheap Motomail ones soon.
I made some feeble attempts to get the knee out in the corners at Manfield a few times, but it just didn't feel right.

So a question. When getting your knee down in a right hander, is your right foot middled on the foot peg? or are just your toes on the peg? :ride:



Sorry, did you mention cheap and motomail in the same sentence? Maybe your brand of motomail is different down there in the land of the setting sun...

[onearmedbandit]

Very common misconception present here, people talking about counter-steering. A bike won't turn without counter-steering, fact. To prove this point Keith Code (him who teachers racers, knows all there is to know) created the 'No B.S. Bike), which is a normal bike with the bars locked straight ahead. Doubters, and everyone for that matter, ride this bike to emphasise the point. You always counter-steer, just might not realise.

Check this pic out, very helpful.

[Firefight]

Sorry, did you mention cheap and motomail in the same sentence?


Yep, Id have to agree PT, Motomail and cheap,thats an Oximorn.


Firefight.

[bluninja]

Knee down track and road, but not since 2002...amazing how a crash or three shakes your confidence :argh:

TTFN

[Kwaka-Kid]

Nope, im Still a Virgin biker:innocent:
in the would like to learn coloumn.

anyway i just wanted to post to agree with the counter-steering bit, reading what ive read and knowing what i know - and thats not very much and all - but i do know that it doesnt make sense to say "i dont use knee down, i use counter-steering" and no offence :) but even when dragging your knee around you are still counter-steering, you are always counter-steering, thass the way the front wheel works isnt it(gyroscopic precession or something yah?)? even if you think that you are just trying to lean, your mind is being all trixie on you! but its like when your thinking about it you can do it and notice it.
anyways why are we talking about getting knees down when we could all be playing a nice game of roshambo with our neighbors. -:kick: -

[White trash]

Yup. Wherever.

[Grumpy]

No, but not through lack of trying. I ride with my toes on the peg and scraped the shit out of the outside of my boot but never touched the knee.

I 'spose you could say that I have more of a Mike Hailwood style of riding. I did a couple of 'Puke track days on my old TL. I had fitted a lower fairing to it which I managed to scrape on both sides......but still didn't get the knee down :brick:

Not much chance on the 1400 though. Huge piece of Japenese alloy hanging out the sides although the pegs get a good grinding from time to time.

[Coldkiwi]

i agree on the sliders.. if nothing else, they give you confidence to try it and not be so afraid of pulping your knee cap. The sound/feel just takes a little bit of getting used to!

no, it IS possible to get something cheap from motomail. I bought my existing sliders for $15 in one of the runout sales last year. Sure, they're soft as butter (good for the initial ego but annoying once you get stuck in) and thin as paper (ok 20mm but very annoying once you start wearing away at the velcro base and can't lift them any higher to protect your leather).... but they're a cheap way to start.
Sadly mine are wearing down at the very tops and they're not sitting very well in the place they need to be so I may have to start hunting round for some thicker hero versions :p

[SPman]

... but my bike will lean a real long way before the pegs touch. I've never touched the pegs down (possibly because the spurs at the end of my pegs are broken off).
Dont you believe it. Ground off the end of my LH peg at a Taupo trackday.
Bloody thing just wouldnt lean any further on the hairpin - got quite boring after awhile!. Didnt get knee down - not wearing Cordura trou anyway!

[Kwaka-Kid]

Bah you dont need knee sliders! touch your jeans or leather down. And my thought has always been you touch knee before peg? is this not true? i mean i know it can be different for everyone but the way it works on my racebike is i hang off... knee touches.. lift it and gentally slide and push lower till pegs touch and thats my limit, and i have now hacksawed 1/4 of my pegs off and she continues to go lower and touch them *just* so the only kool thing i find is proving myself wron each time i go out on the track and seeing how the tyres go even further, but i have to be honest and say im not sure theres much further mine go because they start to slide/fall which makes me think maybe im starting to roll off the edge?.

[Big Dog]

Bah you dont need knee sliders! touch your jeans or leather down.
Yes but I have never done it intentionally :whistle:
My knees get in the way on round abouts and hairpins.

Must remember not to hang my leg down until I buy more leather. The last time was in Deane apparel dress pants on the Te Atatu round-a-bout when late for work. The only evidence when I got to work was a white scuff on my pants that just brushed off. It doesnt hurt unless there is a chunk sticking up. Then you tend to get home to find either a graze or a cut without a rip in the pants. :rolleyes:

Note to self, Keep your knee up by the tank!

[Posh Tourer :P]

Nope, im Still a Virgin biker:innocent:
in the would like to learn coloumn.

anyway i just wanted to post to agree with the counter-steering bit, reading what ive read and knowing what i know - and thats not very much and all - but i do know that it doesnt make sense to say "i dont use knee down, i use counter-steering" and no offence :) but even when dragging your knee around you are still counter-steering, you are always counter-steering, thass the way the front wheel works isnt it(gyroscopic precession or something yah?)? even if you think that you are just trying to lean, your mind is being all trixie on you! but its like when your thinking about it you can do it and notice it.
anyways why are we talking about getting knees down when we could all be playing a nice game of roshambo with our neighbors. -:kick: -


I'd agree re countersteering from personal experience. Going from the CB125T (piss easy to flick around) straight to the BM (big heavy lump), I've really had to concentrate... To flick the BM around you really need to give it a huge hit of countersteer, and I found, firstly, that I had to make myself do it (wasnt used to using that much), and secondly, as I was holding on hard to the throttle cos it has heavy return springs, it was harder to do it when turning left. Having ridden the bike for a month now though it's all subconcious again..... But the only way to throw that bike around is huge gobs of countersteer....
Thus countersteering makes you steer/lay the bike over. Countersteering in the middle of a corner would probably make you crash. :doh: The question of on the seat or off the seat is a question of physics. Sliding your knee is only a consequence of trying to get lower CG while hanging off.

Knee down is not necessarily pushing it, its when you are scraping bits of your bike as well that you have run out of room (assuming you have the tyres to do that... I've had a two wheel slide on the CB without scraping anything)

[Coldkiwi]

is it just me or do other people find it harder to get their knee touched down on slower corners than faster corners?? the though of getting that low through a round about freaks me.. I'd much rather do it at 90kmhr+!

as to the question of decking stuff out is that it really depends on your bike/suspension set up. a cruiser will deck out at 45 degrees whereas my GSXR needs to be damn near 75' before it would start scraping so theres not too much point in worrying about whether your pegs are scraping or not

[pete376403]

I'd agree re countersteering from personal experience. Going from the CB125T (piss easy to flick around) straight to the BM (big heavy lump), I've really had to concentrate... To flick the BM around you really need to give it a huge hit of countersteer

Ever read the Usenet newsgroup Rec.motorcycle? Its an article of faith on there that shafties cannot countersteer. There were some glorious flamewars over that one.

[Kwaka-Kid]

CK you dont like slow speed? my slowest is approx 15kmph on the lovers drive in hte domain. and fastest, dunno at a guess 100kmph? maybe not quite that fast? 80, really not too sure.

[jrandom]

shafties cannot countersteer

And on uk.rec.motorcycles you will be told with great solemnity that shafties cannot wheelie. Of course ukrm is the Font of All Knowledge so they must be right.

And it's bollocks that one *always* countersteers. I don't countersteer through the back gate at the end of the driveway when I park the FXR behind my house so nyaaahhhhhhh :bleh:

And I bet that at higher speeds it would still be *possible* to drag a bike around a corner by hanging off while turning the wheel toward the corner.

Oooh, look, it's turning into a countersteering thread, I love those.

[Big Dog]

CK you dont like slow speed? my slowest is approx 15kmph on the lovers drive in hte domain. and fastest, dunno at a guess 100kmph? maybe not quite that fast? 80, really not too sure.
In books/mags offering instruction in the "art" they reccomend practicingat round abouts at 25-30 kmph to hone your skills before attempting it at higher speeds as even a small ripple in the road can send the unprepared into a full on slapper if your "throttle balance" (the area between acceleration and deceleration is not out side the boundaries of your available grip) is not right.

Note: you need to be accelerating to be stable that far over, otherwise you have none of your grip matrix availible if you need to change direction or speed.

[Big Dog]

I don't countersteer through the back gate at the end of the driveway when I park the FXR behind my house so nyaaahhhhhhh :bleh:

Put down some paint just before said gate. Then review the line taken by your front wheel. If there is no wiggle there could be a spot for you on crusty demons world tour (unless you put your feet down).
As it is a physical imposibilty on rounded tyres to turn without "rolling off" the centre line. Even at low speed (read that paddling) you need to tip the bike into the corner. Otherwise the bike will not turn just tip.

If you just turn the wheel without tipping you will "roll off" the other way and so turn that way. At low speed if you just lean without steering input then turn the wheel the bike will just stand back up as lean potential off weight shift is very limited before you just "park" in untidy heap, and the counter steer generated will stand her back up.

I did not beleive this either until in push bike training class we actually did the paint test (15 and a lot fitter). If you could ride a push bike before you first straddled a motorbike you are probably countersteering without any knowledge of it and you will be unable to manage it consciously except at higher speeds than you were ever capable of on a push bike due to "muscle memory" taking over before you can manage a concious thought. :Pokey:

[jrandom]

Even at low speed (read that paddling) you need to tip the bike into the corner. Otherwise the bike will not turn just tip.

If you just turn the wheel without tipping you will "roll off" the other way and so turn that way.

Hmmmmph yes well. Hmmmmph.

One of these days I shall code up a physics model for myself and gain final enlightenment regarding the necessity of countersteering beyond my current finger-waggling-in-pub level of certainty. Until then I'll just defer to anyone more energetic or aggressive who disagrees.

[Urban Terrorist]

Ever read the Usenet newsgroup Rec.motorcycle? Its an article of faith on there that shafties cannot countersteer. There were some glorious flamewars over that one.

I thought that was only in the Northern hemisphere (due to the Corialis Effect) and if your bike isin't fitted with a countersteering adapter. Now to start a good dino vs. synthetic gun oil thread. Adny Lvies

[Big Dog]

Hmmmmph yes well. Hmmmmph.

One of these days I shall code up a physics model for myself and gain final enlightenment regarding the necessity of countersteering beyond my current finger-waggling-in-pub level of certainty. Until then I'll just defer to anyone more energetic or aggressive who disagrees.
Try reading "the ultimate gide to motorcycles" in your local libray it has it all in very laymans term's, how else do you think I understand it? or for even more general understanding I could lend you Graham Allardices bikers bible.
:moon:

[Two Smoker]

YES FINALLY!!!!!!!! IM NO LONGER A VIRGIN!!!!!!!! I GOT MY KNEE DOWN:done: !!!! Just went for a blat with Milky and got my knee down a few times hehehe, and i feel like a million bucks because i can now say that i can get it down and can prove it.

Another plus is my sliders look less shiny:whistle: ....

[jimbo600]

Right, and no lying about it either! You may of course have been hanging off like a monkey with 4ft arms to get some 'knee down action' but we'll let that count.

and before you decry me for being an egotistical rice rocketer.. Fazer Bloke asked!!

Knee doon on track and road. Check out my avatar, and it's really me in the pic. Top of Paekakariki Rd

Paekakariki Rd as a good practice area for knee down shenanigans. Watch out for daydreaming day trippers though.

[Posh Tourer :P]

YES FINALLY!!!!!!!! IM NO LONGER A VIRGIN!!!!!!!! I GOT MY KNEE DOWN:done: !!!! Just went for a blat with Milky and got my knee down a few times hehehe, and i feel like a million bucks because i can now say that i can get it down and can prove it.

Another plus is my sliders look less shiny:whistle: ....

I thought when you werent a virgin you could get it up and prove it...... maybe thats in another universe....

[Motoracer]

YES FINALLY!!!!!!!! IM NO LONGER A VIRGIN!!!!!!!! I GOT MY KNEE DOWN:done: !!!! Just went for a blat with Milky and got my knee down a few times hehehe, and i feel like a million bucks because i can now say that i can get it down and can prove it.

Another plus is my sliders look less shiny:whistle: ....

You sound like a bit of a hoon :niceone: Definetly looking forward to seeing you in action on the S'es in Pukie on the 23rd!

[brockhaus]

Hey I also got my knee down - motorcycle on top and that on a gravel road (lake Weikaremoana) But of course I had to wait till someone came along to get the bike back up :laugh:
But getting the knee down without droping the bike -- not yet but :soon: !!!
Hope to get my knee down on a bucket race in Invercargill on Wednesday :rolleyes:
cya, Marcus

[Kickaha]

Hope to get my knee down on a bucket race in Invercargill on Wednesday :rolleyes:
cya, Marcus

I take it that means you have got a hold of the Jones clan,have a good time down the end of the Island

[pete376403]

I thought that was only in the Northern hemisphere (due to the Corialis Effect) and if your bike isin't fitted with a countersteering adapter. Now to start a good dino vs. synthetic gun oil thread. Adny Lvies
Yes. YES! Another true believer! :banana:

Do you have a DoD number?

[Kwaka-Kid]

firstly Bigdog: you dont need to be accelerating, u can be decelerating or at constant speed? second: good stuff TS, but just quit trying so hard or youll hurt urself!! (you too Putman if ur reading this!) slow down you guys on little bikes your making me look worse!

[Motoracer]

Went to Wahi via kopu-whangamata today. First time on the GSXR. I was so excited that I forgot to bolt on the fairings properly. It started flapping around after hitting fairly fast top speeds. :Oops: Bit of ducktape and fencing wire we found somewhere and off we went again. Brakes were spot on, track setup on the road was a tad bit hard on the body though. Perelli super corsas where awesome in damp conditions as well as the dry.

More to the point, knee scraping is F-ing mean on it eh! :Punk:

Finally, I went on a ride and didn't have to complain about the bike! Tis a good feeling fur sure :apint:

[PeteThePom]

Got my knee down.......every time I've binned it!

No, seriously though, my style doesn't include getting my knee on the deck, I tend to shift my whole body over to the side of lean and kinda let it all hang off a bit, and the only bit that hits the deck is me toe! On the ZRX, the brake pedal is the first bit to hit the deck, which, the one time I got over that far prompted a 2 wheel slide that almost saw me become intimately involved with a set of steel crash barriers!, right hand side, I dunno, have been to the edge of my tyres and nothing decked out, and I dont wanna go off the edge!!!!

[wkid_one]

Yes, I have gotten my knee down road and track.

[Coldkiwi]

CK you dont like slow speed? my slowest is approx 15kmph on the lovers drive in hte domain. and fastest, dunno at a guess 100kmph? maybe not quite that fast? 80, really not too sure.

nah, roundabouts don't do it for me at all. Maybe its because I need a little while leaned over before i can convince myself to go right down and a roundabout doesn't give me enough time. A nice long sweeper is my ideal knee down location. That said, i've had as much success on 45kmhr posted corners (not doing 45 kmhr mind!) as I have on the Jennian homes one (good for near 190-200kmhr if you know what ya doing?). I think i probably just feel more stable at speed (gyroscopic wheel forces and all) and that helps the confidence

[wkid_one]

Same here - I prefer high speed knee down rather than low speed.....I just don't like high speed knee down followed by high speed head down!!

I don't see how going around slow corners can achieve knee down unless you are hanging off the bike to buggery? As the slower the corner the less the lean anyway as you are carrying less speed?

The only corner I hated knee down on at Puke was the left hander before the back straight as I had an annoying habit of hitting the ridge in the road and unbalancing the whole bike. That and hitting the ripple strips with your sliders on Castrol was an arse.

However! These are a dismal second to hitting a catseye at full tit with your knee down.....that F&*(en hurts to high heaven!

[Angry Puppy]

and before you decry me for being an egotistical rice rocketer.. Fazer Bloke asked!!

Oh! my fault is it! Well, actually yes I did but no I haven't. yet :argh:

[Two Smoker]

Yea i hit my knee on a cats eye just yesterday, luckily though i was only doing about 60 kmh (around a 25 corner) so it didnt hurt.....CK i wish my bike could do 190-200 because i can only get 170 on the front straight and hold it through Jennian :brick:

[Kwaka-Kid]

I don't see how going around slow corners can achieve knee down unless you are hanging off the bike to buggery? As the slower the corner the less the lean anyway as you are carrying less speed?
Now dont call me physics boy or anything dude, but actually it doesnt make sod all difference? this would only imply you dont push your low speed corners fast enough and carry the speed through them, right? because so long as you enter the corner rather fast and HAVE to push the bike so low that you scrape your knee just to make the corner then your going to have a fair bit of force, just that at low speed everything happens faster if you ask me, i really dont mean to sit here and show off but at taupo i touched my left knee once going around the hairpin, although i cant say how fast that is exactly i know its slow but i had to do it to make the corner (maybe not quite HAD to touch the knee but i was stickin it out there and it did) and what i notice is at lower speed everything wobbles and the bike just about falls over and is like teatering on the edge of falling and going up, and its ALOT harder to balance there, but shit i still carried some good speed for the given corner and as i said tapped the knee and the left peg, i compare this with the left b4 it where you are doing a guestimated 80-100? and its so easy and the bikes movement is very predictable and slow, i think its mainly too because of the gyro forces etc it takes alot more effort to push hte bars anywhere so slows down any "tweaky" movements(e.g that slow hairpin you slightly counter-steer etc and makes a diff wayyyy too easy). Alright ill admit now ive forgotten where i was going with this i guess i was just trying to throw an example of a few experiences ive had, that example is comparable to Pukekohes Castrol corner where its piss easy to gentally and progressivly push the bike lower as you go faster just to make the corner perfect and touch your knee/pegs, and the hairpin takes more concentration because of the slow speed but still, can be done if you enter it fast enough that you must push the bike lower to achieve the task of making the corner :) whoa, sorry guys i just came home from work and being in the heat wearing wet-weather gear, dont think anything ive said makes sense but im sure some examples could be related to and thought about. :weep:

[Coldkiwi]

oh damn.. I'm starting to agree with KK

that cannot be good!

[Big Dog]

In books/mags offering instruction in the "art" they reccomend practicingat round abouts at 25-30 kmph to hone your skills before attempting it at higher speeds as even a small ripple in the road can send the unprepared into a full on slapper if your "throttle balance" (the area between acceleration and deceleration is not out side the boundaries of your available grip) is not right.

Note: you need to be accelerating to be stable that far over, otherwise you have none of your grip matrix availible if you need to change direction or speed.
:lol: KK, the young are so rash :lol:
In the absence of perpetual mothion, every thing is acc or decelerating.

All I said was it is easier to stiy inside your grip matrix if you are accelerating if you need to take emergency action. :lol:
Read posts before you criticise them.

It is easier to get it down when decelerating given the bikes increased tendanct to tip. it is safer (and wears down your chicken strips faster) if you accelerate).

Your call KK as we don't all get staff discounts on medical treatment :lol: :shake:

[Kwaka-Kid]

oh okay? well i dont understand all this flash yabba! but sorry dude i didnt mean to fully flame your post or nothing, and im not up to speed with all the text book stuff but i did see the matrix, and yeah i got a good grip on what was going on i think, some chick with tight leather and guns runs around trying to keep all the dudes turned on or something right? but yeah i was just talking seat of the pants what i thought was going on and how i felt etc, but cheers and sorry once again if u thought i said it like nasty, heheh and yeah i prolly do need to read into posts more and try to understand them

[wkid_one]

[QUOTE=Kwaka-Kid]Now dont call me physics boy or anything dude, but actually it doesnt make sod all difference? this would only imply you dont push your low speed corners fast enough and carry the speed through them, right? [QUOTE]

Are you saying the speed you travel as no bearing on how far you lean your bike???

My point is thus - the slower you are going the further you have to hang off your bike to drag your knee. By sheer nature of a bikes physics - a bike becomes less and less stable the further it is lent over as the speed decreases - it is the gyroscopic forces at work as there is reduced gryoscopic forces to get the bike upright and the front wheel wishes to tuck instead. Therefore - the slower your speed, the more difficult it is to NATURALLY get your knee down. Physics is against your here KK....a slow bike wants to either stay upright or fall over. Dragging knees around a slow corner is not a life prolonging activity. This is as CK referring to it being easier to drag a knee at higher speeds - why? Because bikes are more stable lent over at higher speeds. I refer to slow speed - NOT SLOW MARKED CORNERS. Hell the first corner I got my knee down on was the Hairpin at Puke....

But the most enjoyable are the corners that go on forever with your knee on the ground as you pick up speed. The 45kph LHer after the entrance to Kaitoke Kart Track is a good example of this, as is the north bound onramp at Newlands.

Hanging off the bike serves one main purpose and that is to shift your COG closer to the inside of the corner and therefore allow you to corner faster by sheer virtue of the fact the bike remains more upright throughout the corner than it would ordinarily without shifting your weight.

Rather than 'hanging off the bike' - try cornering like this. When you come to a corner, weight your outside foot peg, and pivot your hips around the tank so the inside hip comes as close as possible to the bars and drop your inside shoulder. This weight shift alone is better than hanging off the bike - your corner speed will increase and you will find you will naturally slide your knee eventually.

[Coldkiwi]

not sure if I fully follow/agree with your gyroscopic forces explanation wkid (I'll have to read it again when i have more time) but I do agree with the pivoting method. Only flaw in it is when you can't lean any further because your thigh/slider is between the road and fairing. Of course... that may not be such a bad place to stop leaning over further!!

[Kwaka-Kid]

wkid i hear you, and althought what you said i think is true, when you are going faster, there is more centrafugal force acting on your bike towards the outta of the corner i.e putting more sideways pressure on your tyres right? so if you got shit tyres like i always do you drift at high speed, and low speed is better because there is less-you jsut have to learn how to be stable smooth and balance better. right? maybe not :( sounds right to me and it feels right, just take care on the slow ones be smooth and balanced and youll be right.

[Posh Tourer :P]

wkid i hear you, and althought what you said i think is true, when you are going faster, there is more centrafugal force acting on your bike towards the outta of the corner i.e putting more sideways pressure on your tyres right? so if you got shit tyres like i always do you drift at high speed, and low speed is better because there is less-you jsut have to learn how to be stable smooth and balance better. right? maybe not :( sounds right to me and it feels right, just take care on the slow ones be smooth and balanced and youll be right.

You'd be surprised by how much centrifugal forces matter... have you ever ridden anything with solid wheels ie no spokes? Very difficult to turn/change direction. That particular situation doesnt apply to cornering, but shows how much centrifugal force can do to change handling

[pete376403]

You'd be surprised by how much centrifugal forces matter... have you ever ridden anything with solid wheels ie no spokes? Very difficult to turn/change direction. That particular situation doesnt apply to cornering, but shows how much centrifugal force can do to change handling
That was the logic behind 16" front wheels back in the '80s. It was likened to power steering. Unfortunately the factories just basically stuck 16' wheels and longer forks on bikes that had dubious handling with 19" fronts, so all they did was make the handling even more dodgy than it was before

[Kwaka-Kid]

hmm interesting and yeah, +force on the actual bikes weight etc going around hte corner, i.e me going around a corner on 260kg GS1000 then trying on 150kg race VFR400, difference is amazing in how much more speed you can take, hence why those damn little 250's etc can hold such high corner speed, for if you run the same rubber compound as a big bike, the big bike slides like with less speed around hte same corner then a light bike would, does anybody know a guestimate on the % of speed difference/force difference per kg or something? interesting.

[pete376403]

Dr Gordon Blair of Queens University, Belfast did a study back in the '70s to find the optimum engine size for racing. Looked at weight, fuel consuption, power, rider fatigue, power, tire wear, all sorts of things. He found the ideal size was a 300. This was in the era when 54 HP Yahama TZ350s were winning everything while competing against 750s from everyone else. The TZs were so successful that the open class was restricted to over 350s. Didn't stop them though, they just bored the motors out to 354 and won anyway

[Two Smoker]

Yep my Uncle Jim (Who's 70 years old) still races them now :Punk: , he said his is pumping out about 70 hp and is good for 240 kmh (At 70 i reakon thats fucking legend....) Ill see if hes going to Puke on the 23rd......

[wkid_one]

Try this explanation then CK

Why is it harder to balance on a stationary motorbike compared to a moving one? Is it a gyroscopic effect on the wheels?

As you suspect, gyroscopic effects do play a role. Because it has only two wheels, a motorbike is inherently unstable. When it's stationary, it is only in equilibrium--that is it experiences no net force or torque--when it's perfectly upright. The slightest tip causes it to fall over. You must be very careful and agile to keep it balanced. A physicist would say that the motorbike is statically unstable or that it has an unstable static equilibrium.

For the motorbike to remain upright, you must keep the overall center of gravity (yours and the motorbike's) directly above the wheels (actually the line formed by their contact points on the ground). That's very hard to do when the motorbike is stationary. But when the motorbike is heading forward, it naturally steers itself under the center of gravity. If the motorbike begins to tip to one side, its front wheel automatically steers in the direction of the tip and the forward moving motorbike soon drives its wheels back under the center of gravity. This automatic steering is due to both gyroscopic precession in its spinning front wheel and to the shape and angle of the front wheel fork. If you hold the motorbike (or a bicycle) off the ground, spin its front wheel the right direction, and then tip the motorbike, you'll see its wheel turn toward the direction of the tip because of gyroscopic precession. If you return the motorbike to the ground and then tip it to one side, you'll see that its wheel will automatically turn toward that side because of the fork shape.

With both effects helping the motorbike steer under the center of gravity, the moving motorbike is very stable. A physicist would say that it is dynamically stable. Everything I've said also applies to bicycles and was pointed out by British physicist David Jones in 1970. Bicycles are so dynamically stable that almost anyone can ride them without hands and not tip over!

If you apply the brakes while making, say, a left turn on a motorcycle, the motorcycle will tend to "stand up." That is, it will tend to fight the lean you make into the turn. Why?

When you turn left, you are accelerating toward the left and your velocity is changing toward the left. This leftward acceleration requires a leftward force and that force is supplied by friction between the ground and the motorcycle's wheels--the ground pushes the wheels toward the left. However, this leftward force on the wheels also exerts a torque (a twist) on the motorcycle about it's own natural point of rotation--its center of mass. As the ground pushes the wheels toward the left, the motorcycle tends to begin rotating. In this rotation, the wheels begin moving toward the left and the driver's head begins moving toward the right--the motorcycle "stands up"! Actually, if you lean far enough to the left as you turn, an opposing torque due to the upward force that the road exerts on the wheels will balance the first torque and your motorcycle will experience no net torque--it won't stand up at all. On a high-speed turn, you must lean quite a bit to avoid the "standing up" problem, which is why motorcycle racers practically touch the ground as they turn.

[Big Dog]

but sorry dude i didnt mean to fully flame your post or nothing,
and I was not torching you merely having a laught at your expense:lol:

[Big Dog]

If I underdstood it it makes sense.... but the most significant centrifugal force in relation to a knee down event is the one that holds your tyre down and your rear suspension compressed as you take said corner. Imagine you are a yo-yo, not a big stretch for most bikers, being swung around in circles.

To maintain sufficient compression to acheive grip you need to exert X G's (where x is a variable quantified by the grip of your tyres, the quality of your suspension, and the weight of your machine). these g forces can be increased in one of two ways you can accelerate, or you can turn in even tighter (going back to the model above you can shorten the string or you can speed up). As you don't want to change your line uneccessarily the obvious choice is to accelerate.

Knee down or not aside, it is the same skill fast or slow.

There are various techniques to avoid knee down style lean angles that are very useful in the wet or other poor grip conditions, but ultimately the fastest way through a corner involves the shortest possible line, coupled with the latest braking and the earliest acceleration.

In the dry, knee down is the fastest and safest way through a sharp or long turn.

This is of course why knee down is so popular.

IMHO To be considered a good rider you need to have several availible options for every corner. To blow off upskilling because a particular tactic seems a bit blow hard is a bit like cutting your C*&* off to get more girls. Having the confidence to throw my bike on it's ear has saved my life many times.

I'm not a fast rider anymore but I reckon you need all the skills you can muster out there.

[FROSTY]

That said its been a bloody long time since I've tried and Pukie is a bloody hard circuit to get your knee down on. My race/riding style involved a heap of body english-- I literally used to hang on by the underside of my leg and knee on the ground then kinda pull the bike down onto myself. No logic to it it was just what I felt comfortable with.
Now the guys I just cannot believe are those GP 125 racers--
Correct me if Im wrong but I swear theyre dragging their elbows on the ground -amazing angles of dangle :Punk:

[scroter]

na never had my knee down. tryed heaps. not hanging off the bike enough i suspect. Took my TL1000s on Track time twice had a lower fairing on it hit that on the road even without hitting bumps. Only had chicken strips on the front tyre not the back one. I agree with CK i feel much more comfatable at higher speed than low speed. well find the knee one day when I get some decent tyres not these crappy D207s they suck

[Motoracer]

Well find the knee one day when I get some decent tyres not these crappy D207s they suck

Try Rennsport or Perelli Supercorsa man. If you are into going a bit fast, you'll never go back. The first time I tried it, I said it was almost like cheating cause they are that good.

[Two Smoker]

na never had my knee down. tryed heaps. not hanging off the bike enough i suspect. Took my TL1000s on Track time twice had a lower fairing on it hit that on the road even without hitting bumps. Only had chicken strips on the front tyre not the back one. I agree with CK i feel much more comfatable at higher speed than low speed. well find the knee one day when I get some decent tyres not these crappy D207s they suck
If your getting your left knee down, you right inside knee should be hugging the tank (near where the man spuds set :niceone: ) , your arse shouldnt really even be on the seat, but it might be a little because the TL is a wide bike..... Then its the bottle factor of going into the corner at a speed that feels too fast.... Hope that gives you an idea on how much to hang off the bike :niceone:

[FROSTY]

Hey I hate to argue here but look if ya whole and sole purpose is to get ya knee on the deck then hey Id find a series of corners and go back over em again and again till ya got the knee on the deck.
Thats the way the magazines do it for the pose shots
If ya just wanna go fast then dont worry about if you have or havent got the knee down -It really aint a biggie

[wkid_one]

and Pukie is a bloody hard circuit to get your knee down on.
I actually find it quite easy - the only corners I didn't touch down on was the left before the two rights than make Castrol (the VTR hated the sudden changes in direction)......and the other left after the hairpin due to the great big fecken bump that is in the middle of it that I didn't see eye to eye with.

I found - that once I got used to it - I felt strange not to go around corners with the knee down. I suppose it is what you get used to. I found I focused more on my body position and weight movement with dragging my knee - whereas when I didn't do it - I got lazy going around corners.

[wkid_one]

That said its been a bloody long time since I've tried and Pukie is a bloody hard circuit to get your knee down on. My race/riding style involved a heap of body english-- I literally used to hang on by the underside of my leg and knee on the ground then kinda pull the bike down onto myself. No logic to it it was just what I felt comfortable with.
Now the guys I just cannot believe are those GP 125 racers--
Correct me if Im wrong but I swear theyre dragging their elbows on the ground -amazing angles of dangle :Punk:
Like these pics SPMAN posted before

[FROSTY]

I actually find it quite easy - the only corners I didn't touch down on was the left before the two rights than make Castrol (the VTR hated the sudden changes in direction)......and the other left after the hairpin due to the great big fecken bump that is in the middle of it that I didn't see eye to eye with.

I found - that once I got used to it - I felt strange not to go around corners with the knee down. I suppose it is what you get used to. I found I focused more on my body position and weight movement with dragging my knee - whereas when I didn't do it - I got lazy going around corners.
Hey good onya -did ya try a different line through that left?--
I was at a slower pace throgh there but I tried a few different lines to see if I could avoid that lil gutwrencher

Oh and yea -That's the kind of dangle angle that boggles the mind

[Motoracer]

I don't scrape the left hander after the hairpin but I don't think I have to for that anyway. My fav one is Castrol and the one previous to that (its a nice big semi circle with the two combined). I also love scraping on turn one.

[FROSTY]

If ya love that --wait till ya get to taupo or manfeild --woohoo scraper wear is huuge

[Kwaka-Kid]

Quit Knockin' the D207's :D They are on my racebike at the moment and now that im used to them they are not so bad, i think they are a little too triangulated for my liking however - they tip in very fast ya' know.
Next lined up are some GPR70SPP's then back to some BT090's then the brand new BT014's.

[Coldkiwi]

[QUOTE=Kwaka-Kid]Quit Knockin' the D207's :D QUOTE]

errr no! Unless they're the RR or GP version (I have never used them but never will for fear of the entire overpriced Dunlop brand), the standard D207's are the crappiest tyre I have ever had the misfortune to use. The suzuki marketer that decided to put 207u's on the 03 G6's (cruisers maybe but track bikes!?) should be beaten with a spade...repeatedly...till it really hurts... and they repent and put Pirellis on!

weee... I love ranting :)

[wkid_one]

D208's are no better in their standard form - the GP's are better but take some brutal riding to keep enough heat in them.

[wkid_one]

Hey good onya -did ya try a different line through that left?--
I was at a slower pace throgh there but I tried a few different lines to see if I could avoid that lil gutwrencher

Oh and yea -That's the kind of dangle angle that boggles the mind
yeah - played with line quite a bit....been around puke more times than I care to think about - and found that one of the better lines to allow a good set up for the hill necessitates you going over the bump....however by turning in to it late you can largely go over it full throttle without to much lean.

[White trash]

[QUOTE=Kwaka-Kid]Quit Knockin' the D207's :D QUOTE]

errr no! Unless they're the RR or GP version (I have never used them but never will for fear of the entire overpriced Dunlop brand), the standard D207's are the crappiest tyre I have ever had the misfortune to use. The suzuki marketer that decided to put 207u's on the 03 G6's (cruisers maybe but track bikes!?) should be beaten with a spade...repeatedly...till it really hurts... and they repent and put Pirellis on!

weee... I love ranting :)

Hey ranty-boy! i think the std 207s fitted to our bikes are Canadian spec tyres made for use in Canadia (wherever that is?).

I had NZ spec 207s on my GSXR750X and they were primo.

And haven't you just purchased a half shagged Metzeler *shhhhhh* :whistle:

[Coldkiwi]

oh well, maybe NZ does get different tyres.. .but I sure feel sorry for the canadians!

yeah I did... but I've yet to hear anyone moan about rennsports as I do about 207s :)

[Bandito]

Right, and no lying about it either! You may of course have been hanging off like a monkey with 4ft arms to get some 'knee down action' but we'll let that count.

and before you decry me for being an egotistical rice rocketer.. Fazer Bloke asked!!
Yep but only on a roundabout so I could have the bragging rights-and finally you have given me a forum with which to brag Blah blah blah.....some good advice from one who knows- make sure you do it in something better than jeans!!!. :confused2

[Kwaka-Kid]

Your Advise is about 4months late as ive already given it from experiencing it first hand :) hold myself back in jeans now (or at least thats what i say, truth is im not good enough:no: )

[Two Smoker]

Your Advise is about 4months late as ive already given it from experiencing it first hand :) hold myself back in jeans now (or at least thats what i say, truth is im not good enough:no: )Common KK i know you can't hold back, im sure those holes in your jeans a getting bigger :whistle:

[headhoon]

Knee down and foot down both sides and ground the sliders to the max on an RG150...!!!...going to the track soon to do it on the R1...

[Two Smoker]

Knee down and foot down both sides and ground the sliders to the max on an RG150...!!!...going to the track soon to do it on the R1...
LOL like me, knees down, toes (on side of boot) scuffed, pegs scraped and exhaust chamber scraped hehehe

[toads]

The type of bikes I ride,the day I get a knee down it will be closly followed by the rest of me.Even on me old duke' I never did,I don't think my style of riding lends it's self to it.

Yes this is true for me also, I have no intention of becoming one with the tarseal

[Indiana_Jones]

[QUOTE=Coldkiwi]You may of course have been hanging off like a monkey with 4ft arms to get some 'knee down action' but we'll let that count.
QUOTE]

That's sounds like me :D
Too much Torque and Great escape for me :niceone:

-Indy

[Artifice]

ah yes, I once got my knee down...

it was the middle of winter in chch and after a hard nightshift at 8:00 am i was going home from work.. this was back in the day when i had an srx250 and not a tonne of experience. i was turning of fitzgerald ave on to morhouse ave caught the lights just right. Anyways the road was looking a bit wet but what the hey a little water never fussed me much. i was halfway round the corner when i thought for a split sec, cool kneedown then arsedown then oh f!. yes there was ice on the road. rush hour too. good thing i could hide my shame inside my helmet.

[aff-man]

nope never have. But then again due to not haveing sliders i kinda tuck my knee up as close against the fairing as possible. Looking to get some pants with sliders at the moment. (well when i get some cash) and then i suppose if i had the knee out onstead of tucking it in i might be able to get it down :bleh: :bleh:

[Sparky Bills]

I can get knee down on both road and track.
But usually only try on the track. I have Sparking toe sliders too (hense the name). It looks Cool with sparks flying out from the bike while on full lean dragging my knee!

I love wearing shit out!! :cool2:

[Kwaka-Kid]

haha lucky for some!

my knee sliders are shiney :) i like em like that.

[Mr Skid]

Managed to get both pegs scrapping at the weekend before I got everything scraping at once :Oops:

I think I'll get some cheap 'n' nasty skateboard knee pads and put them over my fabric suit if / when I get back on the bike to see if I can get my knee down.

[White trash]

I love wearing shit out!! :cool2:

Huh? Keep that quiet. Jimbo'll be PMing ya for a secret meeting in a public toilet somewhere.

[TwoSeven]

I got me knee down on an old bsa D7 bantam once. Was shortly followed by the rest of me as I discovered you cant lean over on square wall tires. :)

I used to practice on roundabouts and the like, but since I never use sliders it got painfull. Much prefer to keep the bike upright now for some reason - perhaps just getting old.

[Midnight 82]

:scooter: But not on this bike HA HA

[BUBBLE]

oh well, maybe NZ does get different tyres.. .but I sure feel sorry for the canadians!

yeah I did... but I've yet to hear anyone moan about rennsports as I do about 207s :)
I would have to agree that the original 207's on my Alstare GSXR600K3 are crap, I used every last bit of my tyre until it was sliding (and I'm not a small guy) and still could not keep up with the SV1000's thru the tight stuff. Ive had the bike 2 months and the tyre was worn out in under 3000k's, I stretched it to 3500k's (original k's since new) and this afternoon fitted a second hand reinsport off trademe just to get a feeling for what it would do with a better tyre. I've been for a quick ride and the reinsport feels good, I didnt even get to the edges of the tyre so maybee on a good road Ill get to drag the knee.

I'll get a good chance to test the Reinsport on Friday night over the Napier - Taupo's, heading to the bike rally in Taupo. Hopefully heading to Auckland for Big Boys Toys on Saturday, back to the rally then to the Taupo track on the Sunday.

P.S. Dunlop 207's are still good for burnouts after 3500k's. LOL

[scroter]

finally got my left knee down on the sweeper at taupo. only did it one mind you and wasnt really ready for it so pulled it out of the way pretty quickly but i keep trying still not bothered on the road tho.

[magnum]

at taupo trying to keep up with scroter,pegs grinding everywhere giving me the willies decided to hang off and the rest is history. :spudbooge

[Two Smoker]

Welcome to the club guys :niceone:

[avgas]

i used to drop my knee on any corner i found - even on my GB. But since my accident, and having that titanium pin in my shin i havent done it yet on my kamakazi :brick:

[Mr Skid]

Finally, after entertaining many motorists and passers by I managed to get my knee down On the Welesley St > Mayoral Drive left hander.

Luckily I'd had the foresight to put some gaffer tape over my cordura trousers, so they are still in one piece.

This raises the question though: Where to buy titanium gaffer tape? :spudwhat:

[jimbo600]

No not me not ever.

[sAsLEX]

This raises the question though: Where to buy titanium gaffer tape? :spudwhat:

just rivet some chopping board on to you knee!!!

[Mr Skid]

just rivet some chopping board on to you knee!!!

What? through my pants? :eek:

I'm thinking about sewing some velcro to the knees of my cordura pants, or maybe cutting a chopping board in half and gaffing it to my knees..

Either way it'll look as rangi as my bike :yes:

[sAsLEX]

What? through my pants? :eek:

I'm thinking about sewing some velcro to the knees of my cordura pants, or maybe cutting a chopping board in half and gaffing it to my knees..

Either way it'll look as rangi as my bike :yes:

yeah or the sewing of velco could work as well

[enigma51]

I always put the knee out and sometime it touch and sometimes it does not who cares!

[WINJA]

THE FIRST TIME I DID IT WAS BY ACCIDENT AS I WAS SO FAR CRANKED OVER . I THINK IF YOU TRY TO PUT YOUR KNEE DOWN ON THE STREET YOULL PROBABLY END UP GOING SLOWER. I GOT MY KNEE DOWN ALL DAY AT A WET BUCKET RACE I MUST HAVE GOT MY KNEE DOWN IN THE WET ABOUT 50 TIMES AT LEAST AND CRASHED ABOUT 10 OF THOSE 50 TIMES. THEN I DID A STOPPY IN THE PITS THRU A PUDDLE AND I WENT RIGHT OVER AND THE BIKE LANDED ON ME MY HEAD WAS STUCK IN THE PUDDLE AND I ALMOST DROWNED

[Mongoose]

THE FIRST TIME I DID IT WAS BY ACCIDENT AS I WAS SO FAR CRANKED OVER . I THINK IF YOU TRY TO PUT YOUR KNEE DOWN ON THE STREET YOULL PROBABLY END UP GOING SLOWER. I GOT MY KNEE DOWN ALL DAY AT A WET BUCKET RACE I MUST HAVE GOT MY KNEE DOWN IN THE WET ABOUT 50 TIMES AT LEAST AND CRASHED ABOUT 10 OF THOSE 50 TIMES. THEN I DID A STOPPY IN THE PITS THRU A PUDDLE AND I WENT RIGHT OVER AND THE BIKE LANDED ON ME MY HEAD WAS STUCK IN THE PUDDLE AND I ALMOST DROWNED

Almost - pity. Oooops, did i say that out aloud?? :killingme
Would be one way of finishing a racing carrier though, one that would be remembered by others. "Oh yeah, wasn't he the one that drowned in the pits?"

[Motoracer]

THE FIRST TIME I DID IT WAS BY ACCIDENT AS I WAS SO FAR CRANKED OVER . I THINK IF YOU TRY TO PUT YOUR KNEE DOWN ON THE STREET YOULL PROBABLY END UP GOING SLOWER. I GOT MY KNEE DOWN ALL DAY AT A WET BUCKET RACE I MUST HAVE GOT MY KNEE DOWN IN THE WET ABOUT 50 TIMES AT LEAST AND CRASHED ABOUT 10 OF THOSE 50 TIMES. THEN I DID A STOPPY IN THE PITS THRU A PUDDLE AND I WENT RIGHT OVER AND THE BIKE LANDED ON ME MY HEAD WAS STUCK IN THE PUDDLE AND I ALMOST DROWNED
LOL :laugh:.........

[345]

try mini motos. :shit:

[scumdog]

THE FIRST TIME I DID IT WAS BY ACCIDENT AS I WAS SO FAR CRANKED OVER . I THINK IF YOU TRY TO PUT YOUR KNEE DOWN ON THE STREET YOULL PROBABLY END UP GOING SLOWER. I GOT MY KNEE DOWN ALL DAY AT A WET BUCKET RACE I MUST HAVE GOT MY KNEE DOWN IN THE WET ABOUT 50 TIMES AT LEAST AND CRASHED ABOUT 10 OF THOSE 50 TIMES. THEN I DID A STOPPY IN THE PITS THRU A PUDDLE AND I WENT RIGHT OVER AND THE BIKE LANDED ON ME MY HEAD WAS STUCK IN THE PUDDLE AND I ALMOST DROWNED

WELL! That sure as hell explains a lot!!!! :thud:

[Monsterbishi]

Closest I ever came to getting my knee down was on my old '83 CB250RS, only problem was the solid footpegs that would dig in everytime...

[Bonez]

Closest I ever came to getting my knee down was on my old '83 CB250RS, only problem was the solid footpegs that would dig in everytime...Must have been modded as they came out with folding ones as standard.

[Juan]

Just not my style at all, did the Ron Haslam race school in July at Donnington and kept being told to "hang off some more" still quicker than the other guy I did it with... Knees down all over the place, and in my way!!!

Me (http://www.eddysphotos.com/2004%20Endurance/1ds_00167.htm)

[Coyote]

try mini motos. :shit:
Never got that minimoto bike in my stocking last year

[jonnyrr1]

on my old gsxr1100 i couldwithout a problem, better on right handers than left,
but on my 2001 R1 iv got it down about 3 times and it feels all dodgy,
i think il crash if i try to do it any more round the akaroa hills,
so mite have to save it for the track,

[Biff]

I tried to get my knee down over a period of three weeks about a year ago an succeeded with the help of a amateur racing buddy of mine. Have never had a need or desire to do it again since (been there done that).

This matey of mine told me that about 90% of people that actually have managed to get a knee down (as opposed to the 60% that bullshit?), cheat. What he meant was that when leaning into a corner with their respective arses hanging of their seats they really poke out their knees as far as they can trying desperately to make contract with the ground just so that they can say they've done it (as you'll see in many bike mag photos). He reckons that the trues "knee down" experience only happens when your leaning over so far that the only thing stopping your bar ends/faring/exhaust/pegs scraping the floor (and in order to assist with stability) is your knee, and not directly as purely an attempt to get your knee down.

I'm not sure that there's a difference myself. But I do think that anyone that wears knee sliders without any scratches on them is a wishful show off
:Pokey:

[vifferman]

I'm not sure that there's a difference myself. But I do think that anyone that wears knee sliders without any scratches on them is a wishful show off
:Pokey:... or doesn't own an angle grinder. :whistle:

[Biff]

... or doesn't own an angle grinder. :whistle:

and where the hell would you plug one in when going around a corner on your bike? some people!

[Ghost Lemur]

... or doesn't own an angle grinder. :whistle:

Someone had to admit it. :msn-wink: :lol:

[XP@]

Hey I also got my knee down - motorcycle on top and that on a gravel road (lake Weikaremoana) But of course I had to wait till someone came along to get the bike back up :laugh:
But getting the knee down without droping the bike -- not yet but :soon: !!!
Hope to get my knee down on a bucket race in Invercargill on Wednesday :rolleyes:
cya, Marcus
:doh: you supposed to put your foot down on the gravel!

[Bonez]

and where the hell would you plug one in when going around a corner on your bike? some people!You don't get it do you?

[vifferman]

Someone had to admit it [owning an angle grinder and/or using it to grind down their knee pucks]. :msn-wink: :lol:I don't own an angle grinder or knee sliders :disapint:

[Biff]

You don't get it do you?

that depends on what IT is ......

Viffers humorous response - yes
My half hearted attempt at humour in response to Viffers response - yes
Your response in response to my response to Viffers response - no

your response ?

[azaa]

Id be to worrid if I didnt do it properly and my knee conected whit the ground
Even the thought freeks me out!!!

[Ghost Lemur]

Id be to worrid if I didnt do it properly and my knee conected whit the ground
Even the thought freeks me out!!!

My only fear doing it would be going round the corner and having a big rock take my knee out. OUCH

Although the chances of going round a blind corner to find a rock in exactly the right place to erradicate my kneecap, are probably so miniscule that it's not worth giving any more thought to.

[magnum]

any policemans out there???if you see someone on a bike going round the corner with a knee down would you pull them up??and if so why??thanx in advance. :scooter:

[onearmedbandit]

I tried to get my knee down over a period of three weeks about a year ago an succeeded with the help of a amateur racing buddy of mine. Have never had a need or desire to do it again since (been there done that).

This matey of mine told me that about 90% of people that actually have managed to get a knee down (as opposed to the 60% that bullshit?), cheat. What he meant was that when leaning into a corner with their respective arses hanging of their seats they really poke out their knees as far as they can trying desperately to make contract with the ground just so that they can say they've done it (as you'll see in many bike mag photos). He reckons that the trues "knee down" experience only happens when your leaning over so far that the only thing stopping your bar ends/faring/exhaust/pegs scraping the floor (and in order to assist with stability) is your knee, and not directly as purely an attempt to get your knee down.

I'm not sure that there's a difference myself. But I do think that anyone that wears knee sliders without any scratches on them is a wishful show off
:Pokey:

I'd have to disagree with your matey, the term is 'knee-down' not 'lean angle of 45deg or more with knee down', so whether you're hanging off or not in my book doesn't matter, knee down is knee down.

As to your last statement, well call me a 'wishful show off' if you want but my suit came with knee slidres attached, looks funny with them off, they're virgin but thats because I haven't had to deck my knee out on the road yet. Could almost say someone with a 280km/h sportstourer that doesn't ride at 250km/h+ is a wishfull show off too.

[Biff]

I'd have to disagree with your matey, the term is 'knee-down' not 'lean angle of 45deg or more with knee down', so whether you're hanging off or not in my book doesn't matter, knee down is knee down.

As to your last statement, well call me a 'wishful show off' if you want but my suit came with knee slidres attached, looks funny with them off, they're virgin but thats because I haven't had to deck my knee out on the road yet. Could almost say someone with a 280km/h sportstourer that doesn't ride at 250km/h+ is a wishfull show off too.

280KM/h + been there on a track. You know the one - it leads to Akaroa.

[Motoracer]

any policemans out there???if you see someone on a bike going round the corner with a knee down would you pull them up??and if so why??thanx in advance. :scooter:

Yep, in about 5 odd years of driving and riding on the road, I have only come across one prick cop who deserved to be called a pig. The rest of the cops have always been cool and I have nothing against cops in general.

I was going home casually one day on my ZXR400 going at the speed limit. I turn off from the motorway, made a right turn on a round about, then left at a give way and then I see the disco lights from an undercover car behind me. I pull over and the imidiatly this prick jumps out.

Cop - OI, YOU!! GET AWAY FROM THE BIKE!
Me - Ok, ok, I am just turning the bike off.
Cop - What did you think you were doing back there?
Me - What do you mean?
Cop - DON'T GET SMART WITH ME!
Me - Ummm, I don't know what you mean.
Cop - I was following you for the past 10kms, now what do you have to say?
Me - Ummm, Was I speeding?
Cop - Can I have a look at your licence?
Me - *gives the licence*
Cop - How did you get this, cause you are obviously not fit to ride. You are a threat to your self and other road users, mate. Go to a riding school and learn how to ride before you kill your self or others.
Me - What did I do?
Cop - What were you trying to do with sticking your knee out?? Don't you know that is dangerous? Besides, you were going too quick for that round about. You are going to kill someone.
Me - But that's how I go around corners.
Cop - Well you obviously don't know the first thing about riding. Like I said, go and do a bike handeling course before you kill yourself or someone else.
Me - How would you know how to corner a bike?
Cop - DON'T GET SMART WITH ME! I RIDE A BIKE TOO!
Me - ......

Anywhoo, let's just say after that I got chucked into the squad car cause matters turned to the worst and I got threatened with an arrest. All this was just cause he was a complete ass and being fully unreasonable. I think too many bikes had run away from this cop and I was the lucky one to take all his shit.

In the end, he was just an agro prick trying to scare me or something... Despite quoting me a $600 fine, I didn't get charged with anything at the end.

So next time you try to corner a bike with the hang off or knee down method, think twice (yea right! LOL) :niceone:

[onearmedbandit]

280KM/h + been there on a track. You know the one - it leads to Akaroa.

Yeah, I know the one very well. I just wouldn't go judging a rider because there's no scratch marks on their sliders. The late Dave Jefferies admitting to never getting his knee down on the road (quote recent PB mag) although he wore sliders, and as they said can't imagine too many people going past him.

[sAsLEX]

hey MR your lucky!
I got done for $600 for "using a vehicle to the annoyance of any person" cause I pissped off a cop at the wrong time of night!!!!

[magnum]

aye,say it to there face and dont hide behind a keyboard :Pokey:

[Bonez]

What is it with this fasination on getting ones knee down on public roads. Surely getting around the corner as smoothly and as safely as possible should be a priority whilst riding. Is it an ego thing? Something to gander about whilst pissed at a rally. You like those fishing tales we all hear about. Or am I missing something? :ride: Wouldn't it make you more succeptable to hitting those unexpected objects on the road such as curbs, possums - well you know what I mean. Will it enhance my riding experience? If not why bother?

[magnum]

i only started doing it because at taupo i was scraping my pegs to much[which is dangerous] so i started hanging off doing the same speed and no more peg scraping.now i do it for a larf because i can but it does help with ground clearance,i used to think it was all kaka but its not. :ride:

[mattt]

What is it with this fasination on getting ones knee down on public roads. Surely getting around the corner as smoothly and as safely as possible should be a priority whilst riding. Is it an ego thing? Something to gander about whilst pissed at a rally. You like those fishing tales we all hear about. Or am I missing something? :ride: Wouldn't it make you more succeptable to hitting those unexpected objects on the road such as curbs, possums - well you know what I mean. Will it enhance my riding experience? If not why bother?

I think getting your knee down is alright (I've never done it / never tried).

What I think is gay is climbing half way off your bike so far that your right foot is on the right handle bar in order to get your left knee on the tarmac.
I've seen TS and co getting their knees down, that's cos they were hauling and got it down due to speed through a corner. That's when getting your knee down is cool, cos you've just perfected a corner :2thumbsup

[onearmedbandit]

For myself its just a neat feeling, part of being so close to the road at speed, bike cranked over and a part of your body dragging. I'm only 172cm tall so to scrape the knee I need to be fair cranked over, hence why its not a regular occurance on the road. Really couldn't give a flying fuck if someone thought I was cool or not, or a poser for wearing virgin knee sliders. There is only a few people in this world that have an opinion that I'll take to heart. As long as I'm happy with what I do.

[Mongoose]

Riff Raff can :gob:



Does being in the pillion seat of a cage when you "do it" count? :killingme

[magnum]

For myself its just a neat feeling, part of being so close to the road at speed, bike cranked over and a part of your body dragging. I'm only 172cm tall so to scrape the knee I need to be fair cranked over, hence why its not a regular occurance on the road. Really couldn't give a flying fuck if someone thought I was cool or not, or a poser for wearing virgin knee sliders. There is only a few people in this world that have an opinion that I'll take to heart. As long as I'm happy with what I do.
well said :apint:

[NordieBoy]

I've got no chicken strips but am nowhere near getting a knee within cooee of the ground.

Damn motards :shifty:

[Riff Raff]

Riff Raff can :gob:
Does being in the pillion seat of a cage when you "do it" count? :killingme
Hmmm... I see that is not an option in the poll. How silly! :shake:

[Ghost Lemur]

I've got no chicken strips but am nowhere near getting a knee within cooee of the ground.

Damn motards :shifty:

What do the soles of your boots look like though? :shit:

[zooter]

They tell me the kickstand on the gsx1100G is the first thing to catch the tarmac and does gnarley things to the handling so being thje relative novice that I am I have no intention of attempting it. Leather clad knee procludes it too!

[Biff]

I just wouldn't go judging a rider because there's no scratch marks on their sliders. The late Dave Jefferies admitting to never getting his knee down on the road (quote recent PB mag) although he wore sliders, and as they said can't imagine too many people going past him.

Fair dinkum it was said in jest anyway :bleh:

I was bought a Playboy t-shirt which I wear (under another top) from time to time, but it's not as if some gorgeous, sex crazed model is gonna want to bump uglies with me!

[WINJA]

MY PASSENGER GOT THERE KNEE DOWN ON THE OLD WELLESLY STREET OFF RAMP

[Motoracer]

I've got no chicken strips but am nowhere near getting a knee within cooee of the ground.

Damn motards :shifty:

Yea I know eh man.

Do you stick your foot out or down when going around a bend when there is chance of sliding? I was trying this method and found it a pain in the ass. I prefered to just keep my feet in and just control my slides like I would on a sportsbike. I was talking Death and F/F who have both raced in the dirt before and they don't see any reason for putting your foot down around a corner other than to gain more corner clearance by getting it out of the way (for MX racing).

On Saturday when I rode my bro's dirt bike (XR600) on SH22, I was just having real nice and tiny front end slides and a few quite exciting rear wheel slides but I didn't see how my foot down would help (going about 120 i think).