Uprgrading CCs before licence allows?

[slimyxylofone]

Hi everyone, I've been riding a GN250 for about two months now, and I'm getting a bit sick of it :laugh: . I've got about 1,500km under my belt and in a few weeks I'll be blitzing my way down from Auckland to Dunedin (1800km) on it. So that'll be a good experience, even with the sore arse I'll get!

My question is, how many people have ignored their licence conditions and upgraded to a 400cc or even 600cc bike before they have their full? If so, did you ever run into any problems with the police, and has anyone regretted upgrading so early?

I've been thinking about upgrading to maybe a Suz Bandit 400 or 600 after I have my restricted and another 3-5000 kms on the GNs clock. How does this sound to everyone? I thought that a bandit would be a good transition as it would be a little more forgiving than a racing replica like a GSX-R or the like, and the powerband wouldn't be a real shock after the GN. Am I correct in thinking this?

Will insurance companies still insure a restricted on a 400cc bike? Do bike shops allow test rides on bigger bikes with only a restricted?

Thanks to anyone who could provide some feedback!

[Devil]

If so, did you ever run into any problems with the police?

Will insurance companies still insure a restricted on a 400cc bike?

It's called breaking your licence conditions, and no, they wont insure you.

[ManDownUnder]

I'd suggest you get (quite) a few more miles under your belt before going for more power too.

Nothing personal but if you've only got 1,500kms - you ain't seen nothin' yet. No hurry and learn to ride, so when you DO go to the bigger beast it's doesn't rhow you off, or under a bus.

And yeah - Insurance Companies won't go near you. Tell 'em lies and they'll take your money (and lots of it) but not pay out...

[sAsLEX]

Tell 'em lies and they'll take your money (and lots of it) but not pay out...

tell them the truth and they will take your money then just not pay out


I am riding a 400 on a R. No probs from the fuzz, though I regularly pay my extra road tax, they seem to understand that they have had their "contact" so dont need to harass me anymore.

[skelstar]

I can TOTALLY understand your desire for a bigger bike, but do you reckon youve gone far enough yet? Best idea is to ask the mates that you ride with and see what they think. Notably the ones that are good riders, on big bikes, and ones who you think are sensible/responsible.

I would say that no bike shops would let you test ride bikes on a restricted licence...unless you know them and they do you a favour. Insurance companies would insure you (maybe) as third party, but it would only cover you for fire/theft. Riding into the side of a Merc or Ferrari would more than a physically painful experience.

Surprising the number of people that ride outside of their licence restrictions. A few dont even have licences!

Welcome to the site BTW.:niceone:

[slimyxylofone]

Yeah I realise 1,500 is fuck-all! And I definitely wouldn't go for such an upgrade at the moment. I was wanting some others' experiences, as I would only be thinking of doing this in about a years time, at which point I'd likely be up around the 7-8000km mark (my original 3-5000km was pretty conservative) and would have some very extensive touring of the south island.

How does the power on, say, a Bandit 250 compare to a GN? I don't want to buy another bike and then proceed to get sick of it again is all :)

[chickenfunkstar]

I upgraded a wee bit soon, but I had about 20,000k under my belt, I'd say that its a really good idea to do a few k's before you upgrade.

As for getting caught, obviously don't do anything to draw attention to your self, keep to 109 on the open road etc, and you Should be ok. There's still checkpoints, I went through two and never had a problem but ya never know. Make sure you've got a few demerit points 'in the bank' just in case.

You won't get insurance.

[ManDownUnder]

Yeah I realise 1,500 is fuck-all! And I definitely wouldn't go for such an upgrade at the moment. I was wanting some others' experiences, as I would only be thinking of doing this in about a years time, at which point I'd likely be up around the 7-8000km mark (my original 3-5000km was pretty conservative) and would have some very extensive touring of the south island.

How does the power on, say, a Bandit 250 compare to a GN? I don't want to buy another bike and then proceed to get sick of it again is all :)

:niceone:

I'd suggest a riding handling training course too. Well worth it!

[Sniper]

Bad idea. Ask ducatilover.........

[skelstar]

I too have done about 20000kms in 6 months (all L-licence).

At about 10000kms I thought I had it all pretty sussed. There were def faster riders around on a 250 but I thought I had learned it all. Nutting down the Takas behind an SV1000S riding the best I ever had, I got a gust of wind that put me in a situation I hadnt experienced in 10000kms. I reacted like a learner and ended up binning (a little). Who knows, on a bigger bike I with better brakes I may have been going a lot faster? Probably.

[gamgee]

bandit 250 is probably about twice as powerfull as a gn250, go get yourself either a 2 or 4 cylinder 250, they are a lot more fun, and can actually handle cruising at 100kmh

[zadok]

I bought an XZ550 while I was on my restricted licence (not thru a dealer). I still had my CB250RS at the time and would go for sneaky rides around the neighbourhood on the 550. I made sure I wasn't doing anything stupid to attract attention to myself. When I had my full licence, I sold the 250. You run the risk of getting caught and no insurance etc.
I'm not condoning this of course.:ride:

[gamgee]

and going from a gn250 to a bandit 600 would be a very bad idea!!!

[Highlander]

I bought an XZ550 while I was on my restricted licence ...
I'm not condoning this of course.:ride:



I was starting to worry about you then mate. Good thing you clarified.

Note that I edited your Quote. Does that, mean I miss quoted now ?

[Finn]

I got my litre bike with no bike license at all but was booked into the CBTA course. My circumstances were a bit differant as I've owned several bikes before. So I took it really easy until I got my full.

Some words of wisdom. If you're going to ride with the wrong class of license make sure you only bend one law at a time. In other words, don't pull a wheelie while splitting with a pillion at 140kph with no rego... and with the wrong class of license.

[sAsLEX]

There's still checkpoints

Been through one once taking my front tire for a last ride as it had turned into a slick pretty much and needed replacement as the WOF was well overdue, but the cop just looked at it then gave me a big ok sign!

[crashe]

So the GN250 aint fast enough for you...

Then change it to another faster 250cc bike...
and then you are still within your license restrictions...

Sure I could say a Virago 250 cruiser but I am guessing that you will want a sportbike 250cc.

That way you are still covered by your insurnace company and also not breaking the law.

If the police do stop you the fine is hefty....

The other lads on here can recommend different 250cc sportbikes that you could go and test ride.

You won't be able to test ride any higher cc bikes as they check out your license. So stick with the 250cc.

[skelstar]

If I got a big bike outside my licence period I would be riding my 250 to work, and to my folks place as I dont think my folks would approve ;). Its a hard thing to explain to someone who doesnt ride bikes.

Goddamn learner drivers can drive 300KW Skylines on a learners!

[slimyxylofone]

Okay, a higher powered 250cc it shall be then :2thumbsup , after I get more experience on the GN that is

Nice to know there's plenty of constructive (:eyepoke:) advice to be given around here. I am liking the look of the GSX bandits (250) more and more though, have many people had much experience with their performance and need for maintence etc?

[T.W.R]

Not meant to be a PT but at 1500km your still a motorcycling virgin, your far better off to gain as much experience as possible on the GN even though its a plain docile machine, learning everything that it has to offer properly will prepare you for up-grading to larger more powerful motorcycles.
its the old story of learning to walk before you run, a GN will throw everything at you without punching your lights out where are larger machine wont be as forgiving & get you into a shitload of trouble without warning.
enjoy a steady learning curve instead of rushing & missing the fundementals

[slimyxylofone]

Sure I could say a Virago 250 cruiser but I am guessing that you will want a sportbike 250cc.


lol, do you ever not recommend a Virago to someone? Why is it you love them so much?

[crashe]

lol, do you ever not recommend a Virago to someone? Why is it you love them so much?


There are a few reasons...

1. They are great to commute on and also great out on the open roads.
I can zip zap throu traffic on mine.

2. They are well within the 'L' and 'R' licenses.

3. Ideal for the shorter person.

4. I just love my bike, it is really great to ride... as I love to cruise and I am not into the "Need to speed". I can sit back on them and enjoy the countryside and have fun cruising...

[Ixion]

When I was 16 I knew everything there was to know about riding motorbikes, and I definately knew I could handle any size of bike. Then I found out about Chapter Two of The Big Book of Biking. Mate, at 1500km, you haven't even started Chapter One, you're still reading the flyleaf. Take your time and stay alive.

[bigbadwolf]

Sure I could say a Virago 250 cruiser but I am guessing that you will want a sportbike 250cc.

What are you talking about? Nobody in their right mind would buy a crappy sports bike when they could get a Virago!!! :p

[slimyxylofone]

When I was 16 I knew everything there was to know about riding motorbikes, and I definately knew I could handle any size of bike. Then I found out about Chapter Two of The Big Book of Biking. Mate, at 1500km, you haven't even started Chapter One, you're still reading the flyleaf. Take your time and stay alive.

Lol, I know that at 1500 kms I'm an unbroken virgin! I even said that in my first post. I asked the original question because I was thinking of upgrading next summer because I'm already starting to feel the GNs limitations. No need to keep telling me not to upgrade at 1500kms, as I was NEVER going to. I'll even have 4000kms of road at least under me in a few more weeks.

I'm not stupid, and would never jump on a 400 or 600cc manchine right now, so please read that I'm not trying to upgrade at 1500kms!

Learning in steps was exactly why I bought the GN, and is why I'm attempting to make an informed decision about which upgrade to make a year before I actually make the upgrade!

[skelstar]

Arguably you are going to be in a much better position to make an informed decision when you have more Kms under your belt anyway, hence the misinterpretation of your question I guess.

Can I assume that you have a long enforced licence period because of your youth?

[bugjuice]

why don't you look at a faster 250? There's some very quick 250 riders here, makes me almost wonder why upgrade to a bigger bike, if you can go that quick. Then I remember, cos they're cunts to wheelie.

Look at something like the CBR250RR or ZXR250 etc, or if that ain't quick enough still, then you've got the good ol' 2 schmokes like the RGV250 and NSR250 which is just mental considering they're 'learner' bikes. Anyway, 2stroke bikes will leave most 400s wondering what happened. Plus, you aren't breaking any conditions of your learners (provided you can keep it under 70kph - tui), and you can still be insured and scared shitless about how fast they go.

[slimyxylofone]

Arguably you are going to be in a much better position to make an informed decision when you have more Kms under your belt anyway, hence the misinterpretation of your question I guess.

Can I assume that you have a long enforced licence period because of your youth?


Yeah I'm 20. So if I don't take the time-shortening course then it's 2 years untill I can get my full. Bit of a pain in the arse, but have to work within the system that's set up. I've had my car licence for just over 5 years now (including L and R) and don't find actual rode-craft daunting like a total learner would. I'm usually pretty composed riding in heavy traffic on my bike, it's the handling skills that I need to keep working on.

I've been really making an effort to have the safest road-skill I can, and am always learning. I've had about 5 people pull out in front of me already, but all of them I had already seen them and was keeping an eye on them incase they did pull out on me. Some were looking right at me too, fuckers :angry2:. I can see my middle finger will be getting more of a workout now that I'm riding :ride:

[skelstar]

Sounds like you have a good attitude. 6 months of riding has been too long for me (250cc-wise) so sympathies to you for the inappropriate licence period you have to suffer through :).

[marty]

considering you can get the total time on your learners/restricted down to 18 months, do what you need to get your full, and THEN look at what you can ride/buy. put up with the GN til then. your bank balance/riders brain will thank you for it.

[Momentum]

the gn's are grate. they may be abit slow but they dont cost as much to maintain as the cbr rr that i ride they they cost alot less to buy too.
mins a 91 and it set me back $4500. Put up with the gn and save your cash.

you wull have more money for a bigger bike when your able to get one

[gamgee]

i can never understand people who buy brand new gn250's, it's not like they hold their value or anything, and they're no more reliable than their late 80's/ early 90's counterparts, and they still look the same as the old ones! but in saying that if you can afford to fork out 3-3.5grand for a quicker 250 you should be able to pick up a nice kwaka zxr/zzr/gpx250 yamaha fzr250 suzuki gsx/gsf250 all early 90's models, and all should be relatively reliable, and parts readily available should anything go wrong

[Sniper]

If you move from the GN to say a CBR or ZXR, the power and handeling should keep you amused for a long while yet.

[EZAS]

I dont know anyone who has stayed on a 250 while being on there learners.

One mate never rode a 250, I rode a 250 for about a year (on road time was about 3 months).

250's are small capicty engines that arent made to be ridden at a constant 150-180kmh on the motorway for 50km everyday. I found this out the hard way.

As soon as I get my liscence back I'll be back on the 900 with a good set of 250cc stickers all over it, along with a cbr250 plate. :p

[Momentum]

and that is why EZAS dase not have a LICENCE :eyepoke: :weird: :weird:

[Jonty]

I too have done about 20000kms in 6 months (all L-licence).

At about 10000kms I thought I had it all pretty sussed. There were def faster riders around on a 250 but I thought I had learned it all. Nutting down the Takas behind an SV1000S riding the best I ever had, I got a gust of wind that put me in a situation I hadnt experienced in 10000kms. I reacted like a learner and ended up binning (a little). Who knows, on a bigger bike I with better brakes I may have been going a lot faster? Probably.

Nah mate the bigger bike would have just had more plastic to break :doh:

[loosebruce]

Sorry if this got covered, but i see it too often, people think that becasue they have ridden 10,000kms or whatever that they are a good rider and ready to upgrade, it's not the case.
In saying that as soon as i got my rescricted i brought my first TL1000S. If you were going up to a bandit 400 you'd prollly be alright. But depending on the cop that pulls ya and what you're doing to how much trouble you'll get into.

[Big Chim]

I rode a GN250 for a bit before i got my CBR RR 250. Recomend it for a lot more power, speed and fun and keeping it legal. I didnt find thechange to servear but i did spend a lot of time as a pillion before deciding to get my license. I rode on the back of mates gsxr 400's and 600's so i think it helped to get a feel for those kind of bikes before i got my license which helped with the bike i have now

[HDTboy]

As Bugjuice said, there are guys on this site who ride 250s fast enough to make the others wonder why they bought bigger bikes. I've never ridden a 2 stroke 250, but have done 25'000Ks on my CBR250, it's not slow

[bladez]

well i upgraded to a gsxr750 befor i got my full but got the book tossed at me for riding 2 up not displaying a L plate and exceeding the speed limit but the cop let me ride of again :headbang: so if ya dont like tickets dont do it if ya do buy bigger cc take it easy :sweatdrop

[iwilde]

I think it's all up to the riders abillity and common sence on what they ride. I've noticed that the 400s-750s don't hold their value as well as the 900+ bikes, is this because even they get boring after awhile? I also agree that expercience plays a big part, but anyone can be idiot at anytime and on any sized bike.

[N4CR]

Hmm.... no offence but a gn250 really has nothing on the sporty 250's. I have ridden a large amount of the 250's normally availiable and it was a slow POS.

Go ride a zxr/cbr/gsxr across/fzr etc (inline4 250's) and you will shit yourself.

Consider it this way: I used to think my zxr250C pulled decently in 1st untill I rode a zx7r. Now I just watch the RPM's and it screams with no kick - I'm now bored after 20,000kms :| I shat myself on the 7r and I hardly used the throttle, the speed build up/pull is immense compared to the 250.

I think going from a gn250 to a 600 is a little silly. Just my opinion - why risk liscence etc and life when you can wait and make it so much more worth it without checking your shoulder all the time?

[SuperDave]

1,500Kms is fuck all, as others have said. I'm sure many riders here can easily clock up over 500kms in one weekend or even a day. The jump from a GN250 to a 400cc bandit or 600 or what not will be huge. The jump from my old FXR to my ZXR was definately big.

Unfortunately the faster 250's prices are hyper inflated whereas 400's more often than not seem to be much more reasonably priced. So I can understand you wanting to jump to one, as I too thought the same thing at one point.

Even if you don't run into problems with breaking the licence restrictions the inability to get insurance can cause you some big problems.

Bandit 250's are real nice bikes, definately a lot more powerful than your current GN whilst still being legal. They are also usually well priced. Maybe check one of them out?

[Leong]

I did 1875km last week, but that doesn't necessarily equate to experience unless you encounter situations during that time that teach you something.

I agree with SuperDave, Tristank and the others about the different 250's. Going from a GN250 to a ZXR or even a VTR250 would keep you entertained until you can get your full. Enjoy those real tight twisties that you can throw a 250 through and make it a challenge for you to keep up with the bigger bikes, by being able to ride well!!

[SARGE]

suggestion for ya man... Flat MX bars and some decent rubber.. then ride them like a Motard... that should keep you well entertained for a few months.


and anyone who thinks a GN cant wheelie should come see me

[Shadows]

Originally I couldn't bring myself to ride a 250 after taking a few of my mates 250s for spins. Too small and light. I started riding on a 400 single, then got my learner licence, they weren't too happy with me on a 400 at the riding skills course, especially when the first impression of me was when I did a power slide into the place on the wet.
After I got sick of the 400 I got a 900 four. I didn't need wet roads to do power slides any more. That was cool.
With the MOT and then the Police for a while it used to be the case that if you were caught outside the conditions of your licence they'd just add 6 months to licence period. That was it. Big deal. It got to the point I'd get pulled over and I could say to the cop "bugger ya I can only sit my test 3 years ago now!" Actually I forget how many years it got up to but you get my drift. They never even used to make my pillion walk home.
Then the fines and demerits started. Had to buy a 250 to sit my licence so that I could get back on something a bit more suitable without breaking the bank all the time.
Bottom line is I wouldn't do it now, you get too much grief. Ratshit really.

[Shadows]

I too have done about 20000kms in 6 months (all L-licence).

At about 10000kms I thought I had it all pretty sussed. There were def faster riders around on a 250 but I thought I had learned it all. Nutting down the Takas behind an SV1000S riding the best I ever had, I got a gust of wind that put me in a situation I hadnt experienced in 10000kms. I reacted like a learner and ended up binning (a little). Who knows, on a bigger bike I with better brakes I may have been going a lot faster? Probably.

On a bigger bike the wind probably wouldn't have been a problem. That's one of the major problems with 250s, they are sooooo light.
I think the 250 rule is fucked up. At most it should be an HP restriction like they have in Aussie. And the 70k limit???? How fuckign stupid is that????
How could they make it easier to have riders forced off the road like those poor bastards on bicycles, or simply run over!? No wonder the ACC levies are so high with cars running up the back of bikes all the time.

[skelstar]

So the rules say that while you are on a learners licence you should 'avoid the motorway'. Sat my restricted two days ago and the instructor asks 'so how far have you ridden [young man]?'....ummm...'20000kms..'. Instructor utters expletive. Very ammusing. Theres no way anyone would believe I did ANY of that at 70km/h.

[Jonty]

So the rules say that while you are on a learners licence you should 'avoid the motorway'. Sat my restricted two days ago and the instructor asks 'so how far have you ridden [young man]?'....ummm...'20000kms..'. Instructor utters expletive. Very ammusing. Theres no way anyone would believe I did ANY of that at 70km/h.

I think your competing with a courier driver for kms in a calender year:msn-wink:

[kiwifruit]

i bought a cbr400rr when i was on my restricted licence
bugger all difference compared to a 250, power wise
it was cheaper by enough to make me risk it
paid 2500 for the bike
and 800 in tickets (400 a time for riding over 250cc) in 6 months
this was a few years ago now, there were less cops on the road
i wouldnt recommend you do this.
i think the 250 rule is a little silly
but, its better than nothing... in the states for instance, n00bs on litre bikes first up! Bugger that!! Imagine the acc levy then!!
prehaps a hp restiction would be better?
sorry, im rambling on now........

short answer, dont do it :)
Cheers, Allan.

[skelstar]

Its pretty hard for a young guy sitting here getting advice from the more experienced riders that have ridden big bikes outside their licence allowances, but have the luxury of retrospect. Esp the guys that have to wait a millenium for a full due to their age. Im lucky in that respect and remind myself all the time.

Sure, riding on a big bike on a restricted licence is tempting fate in respect to a $400 fine, but you cant (the ones saying 'dont do it') tell me that you dont filter/lane split/pass a car doing over 100km/h. All those acts tempt fate also...and whos discouraging these acts?

Of course if you run your bike into the side of the finest german or italian motorcar then you are royally screwed.

[slimyxylofone]

Thanks to all of those who added their opinions and experiences (even those who seemed pissed off that I asked in the first place).

I guese I'll upgrade to a faster 250cc if I can afford it in late 2006.

To those who have ridden a few 250s, how do GSF Bandits compare to VTR and CBRs? I've already had some feedback that they're pretty equal in power and acceleration. Not really interested in buying 2-smokers.