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Streetwise
1st March 2006, 09:22
Hello all fellow bikers, Is it just me or is the Restricted licence test a complete waist of time, Well for that matter the full test also, Has anyone gone through the testing process and found it to be a good thing ????, :weird:

skelstar
1st March 2006, 09:34
I did the restricted test the other day. Bit of a joke. The guy said I was 'clearly a confident rider'...I said 'I should be, I have done 20000kms in 6 months'. I could see his imagination saying 'jeez....20000kms at 70km/h, fark!!!'.

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 09:37
Who was your testing officer do you remember,

bugjuice
1st March 2006, 09:37
what's your point..?

on the same token then, is any test a waste of time? do we just give a license to everyone who wants to ride/drive them?
altho some times I do wonder about some drivers..

i really want to drive a semi-artic truck with another trailer.. never done it before, but I don't need testing to see if I can do it..

skelstar
1st March 2006, 09:41
street - it was an Indian/Pakistani (whatever) guy from the Tory St VTNZ.

You could tell me was a nice guy, but had to have the 'tude from the get go.

Buggy - I think its flawed the way that the time periods are setup. Esp the 70km/h restriction. Feel bad for our sub 25yr old friends.

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 09:42
My point is that the people tesing us have no idea how to ride,,,,, The testers only need a learners licence to test for a full licence test,, That makes me a tad worried about the reality of the test,

limbimtimwim
1st March 2006, 09:43
Hello all fellow bikers, Is it just me or is the Restricted licence test a complete waist of time, Well for that matter the full test also, Has anyone gone through the testing process and found it to be a good thing ????, :weird:If the majority of road users didn't adhere to at least a similar set of road rules, it'd be chaos. If you pass the test, you (Hopefully) operate a vehicle in a manner not too different from everyone else. So the tests, on a macro scale, are not a waste of time. Having said that, I don't think the tests ever made me as an individual a better road user, they only made me use a road in a manner somewhat consistent with everyone else.

Mooch
1st March 2006, 09:43
Nah , your right ! , Should be able to get a licence out of a weetbix packet.

bugjuice
1st March 2006, 09:43
I think a lot of it is flawed and has been for a long time. But at least something is there. They just need to update it and actually live in the real world.

It'd be nice if someone who made the important decisions like this, actually got on a bike one day, just to see what shit they're causing. Doesn't mean it's all a scam and waste of time tho. If there's no standards, then how do you stop newbies from killing themselves and raising the levies we have to pay?

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 09:44
skelstar, Are you aware that the testers dont actually ride at all, NO EXPERIENCE, how can a non rider be a judge, mmmmmmmmmmmmm i might judge building comps, would you live in the house,

Mooch
1st March 2006, 09:46
My point is that the people tesing us have no idea how to ride,,,,, The testers only need a learners licence to test for a full licence test,, That makes me a tad worried about the reality of the test,

One of my tests was taken with a M/C cop and the feedback was very worthwhile. I think it's a good thing.

skelstar
1st March 2006, 09:46
Make the R test tougher...but make the period shorter or something. The right kinda test would show up inadequacies in someones riding.

Ixion
1st March 2006, 09:46
One could make an argument that, as far as motorcycles are concerned, an incompetant rider will quickly scare himself so much that he'll give up. So it is sort of self regulating. Which I suspect is the thought at the base of the "test is useless" thinking. Poor riders, who might fail the test, never take it, because they get scared (or Mummy does) and buy a cage instead. Anyone who hangs in there long enough to take the test should pass it (nazi testers excepted). Whcich is probably the logic behind the UK rule, where you are restricted to a small bike for a period, but then move up automatically, without having to take a test.

bugjuice
1st March 2006, 09:46
no, they have to hold a license in order to test someone. The testing officer will hold the right license

on a point tho, you don't have to know how to ride a bike, to see that you can use the road correctly. If you can't ride, then that'll show and you'll fail. If you can ride and can't use the road, then you will fail. If you can ride and use the road correctly, you will pass. Don't need a license to see that. Just need a set of testing points to see that you can use the road in the right manor. A license isn't going to show squat.

skelstar
1st March 2006, 09:47
I think for the R test its probably not as important. Do F tests require M/C cops?

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 09:49
Yes i agree that there is something there and that is a good thing. BUT the reality of testing bikes is only there to take the heat off the LTNZ. they really dont give to much worry about the low usage of bikes in this country. If they did there would be systems put in place that only cover motorcycle safety,

Ixion
1st March 2006, 09:49
No, there's a thread somewhere where I found out about this. The tester must have a (full) licence of the class being tested FOR EVERYTHING EXCEPT MOTORCYCLES. And many testers do NOT have any bike licence , and many have never ridden a bike. Go figure.

bugjuice
1st March 2006, 09:49
F - full?
no

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 09:51
Bugjuice, No you are wrong, They only have to hold a learners permit to test.

skelstar
1st March 2006, 09:51
Thats a good point Ix.

Its kinda like the alcohol rule for bikes.

Who in their right mind would get drunk and ride a bike? You can kinda wing it in a car (with multiple car consequences) but on a bike even in an intoxicated state Im gonna be thinking...fuck my bike is hard enough to manouvre (at low speeds) when Im sober!!!

Im not implying there shouldnt be a limit for alcohol for bikes, only using it as an example.

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 09:51
this just seams very wrong to me.

Jonty
1st March 2006, 09:54
My view is that the tests are crap- I didn't look over my shoulder, had a bust indicator and went 50K through a 30k area (didn't see the road works sign) and still passed.

For my full I did the CBTA and that was the best thing since sliced bread. This should be the compulsory test. It requires a full day of "training" and the instructor can assess every part of your riding and make an informed decisions. You will not fail for a silly mistake, and if you have any major flaws you can get this corrected.

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 09:56
The CBTA will be back in action before to long, you can count on that,

Mooch
1st March 2006, 09:59
Learners permit is a worry then , the guy that took me had been riding M/C cop for 10 years or so , while the test was reasonably basic it was his observations of my riding that was just as important and if road rules where being followed. He point out that by riding in the centre of a lane I was more likely to have issues with hitting oil etc. He also suggested better positioning of myself to be seen by car drivers when changing lanes etc. While obvious now it wasn't whilst learning.

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 10:01
As it stands i think that 90% of tests sat pass that first time round, Compair that to cars you might be very supprised, It stands to reason that this could be why young fools jump on fast bikes and kill themselves, They have cruised through the whole process without really being tested, and now yyyyyyyyyyeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaa a 1700 vtwin, yippy

bugjuice
1st March 2006, 10:02
what's got your back up on this anyway?

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 10:03
mooch. Yes thats my point a rider can help another rider, A person that does not ride has no idea of what he or she is on about, This makes things pointless,

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 10:09
i teach young lads and ladetts that are ready to be mad bastards on the road, the only thing i can do to stop them from killing themselves is work hard and try to explain that riding is fun but it has its dangers, i take exeption to the knowledge that once i have finished, This may be the only training or support that they will have through there whole riding career,

bugjuice
1st March 2006, 10:14
well then the only way to make a difference is to make noise to the right people. Organise a big ride and/or petition etc, and get to the Govt. You're in the right place for it. Go and tell them exactly what's wrong with things the way they are, and the few steps they need to put in place to make the roads a safer place for us and everyone else using the roads.

You can bitch all you want on an internet forum, what's it gonna do?

skelstar
1st March 2006, 10:16
You are right Buggy but he did ask for peoples opinions:

Has anyone gone through the testing process and found it to be a good thing ????

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 10:16
You dont think ive gone down the path with the LTNZ. haha thats funny. Are you in the training game.???

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 10:18
isnt this what these forums are for ???

bugjuice
1st March 2006, 10:29
You are right Buggy but he did ask for peoples opinions:
I thought it was rhetorical.

Yes, that's what these forums are for I guess. But it's been done to death, about how under-looked we are, and how much of a raw deal we get on the roads, and for testing, and ACC levies, and bus lanes, and petrol, and this and that.. I know you haven't got too many posts up yet, but bitchin gets you so far, and you'd be forever bitchin..

K, a guy bitches, cos his missus doesn't do much in the sack. Do you not say anything and bitch about it, getting bitter and let it over come you? Or do you mention something, come to a mutually happy agreement, and get 5 years back from your deathbed from stress and bitterness?

Fix it, then you don't have to bitch all the time, doesn't get you anywhere.. (not a personal thing, a general thing..)

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 10:34
Ill give you that, But in reality to fix anything we need the numbers, All bikers need to be in touch and wlling to put pen to paper, Without these people knowing what the story is or getting a feel for peoples appinions how can i argue ,,,, I been in tuch with the LTNZ for years now and had lots of rather heated conversations with more than my share, but as i said before numbers talk, Would you be willing to ride to parliment and park on there lawn to put your point accross,,,,,


If you will i wil,

bugjuice
1st March 2006, 10:44
fuck yeah.. You imagine a thousand bikers all parked up there? It's make some noise. But processes have to be in place before it gets to that.

First, everything by letter. Emails and internet forums can be faked and numbers altered by multiple logins from one person. Which makes the task a bit more lengthy.

Someone writes a letter saying change it to yada yada, and wait for a reply.

reply says no, go away.

you write back saying do it or we protest (to use a bad word)

reply says no, go away.

We all write in, in protest and swamp the mail stuff.

reply still says no, go away.

we ride up there and get ourselves heard, with media coverage.

What's shitty about it, is that it'll take a while for that process. For their replies, they could string it out for weeks. In the event of no reply, then you assume no, go away. So on with the next step.

imho by doing it that way, you've given them reasonable time to respond with a solution. No solution means you have to step the game up. If there's still no resolution, then a physical presence has to be shown so that they can see a face to the anger.

If there's a quicker way, then post it.
But I'd be happy to ride over their lawn for this.. and everything else like tarsnakes and bad white-lining that all gets bloody slippy in the wet.

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 10:48
Ok lets put up a post to test the water. I would like to see if the masses would be keen on doing the same thing..... Im kkkkkkeeeeeennnn as hell, Tney cant ignore 10000 bikes on there front porch,

bugjuice
1st March 2006, 10:49
poll it up then.. know how?

i'd ride from akl to wgtn for it.. just hope it doesn't rain..

skelstar
1st March 2006, 10:52
If one were to organise a protest like this you would have to VERY carefully decide exactly what the issue is, and provide a solution. A solution that is reasonable and doesnt cost a lot of money.

bugjuice
1st March 2006, 10:54
yeah, that is the underlying success to something like this.

Overall, by fixing the problems, it'll reduce the costs, so that's gotta be a strong point..

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 10:55
ive posted, We could start with lowering the ACC contant of out registration costs due to the fact that car drivers cause most accidents....

bugjuice
1st March 2006, 11:16
what presence does motorcycling have in the big-wig decision makers box anyway? They make all these rules for us, and I bet they've never touched a bike themselves..

it's like those cheese-cutter median barriers too.. great idea for anything but bikes..

DemonWolf
1st March 2006, 11:56
Its a good idea.. but as others have stated.. the process needs to be thought fully.

How is the government going to make up a shortfall in the ACC levies if its reduce for bikers? Increase it for Cars? trucks? etc etc...

The ACC Levy isn't there to help reduce the carnage on the roads.. its there to help provide a service fixing up after the fact an accident has been caused.... or so I believe.. could be mistaken.. often have been.

Streetwise
1st March 2006, 14:25
thats true but the argument put forward from the gov is that acc pays for the damage to people on the roads, If less people are hurt there are lower costs,

Shadows
2nd March 2006, 00:09
I think the tests are necessary.
I also think that it should be compulsory for every road user to go through the hassle of obtaining a motorcycle licence before they can progress to learning how to operate other vehicles. With a reduced timeframe for the graduated license of course.
That would get the useless cunts in the motoring population off the roads for good and everybody would be better off.
More importantly we'd end up with a better gene pool too.

Lazy7
2nd March 2006, 06:25
realise that for everybody that passes the restricted test there is probably a person that fails.

and if you thought it was easy to pass... imagine how hopeless the rider would need to be to fail :o

Streetwise
2nd March 2006, 11:30
Well that is a fair call, any test is better than no test i guess, BUT tests should be conducted by people that have experience,,, Well i think so anyway,

John Banks
4th March 2006, 17:14
Harder tests = more that fail = more $$$

I wonder why LTNZ haven't thorugh of it?

Streetwise
5th March 2006, 06:14
Well you have to wonder, hehe

jubilant
17th August 2009, 08:54
guys as a learner just coming up to the 6 month restricted test point i would like to feel that the test im about to take isnt just for revenue but will indicate my riding flaws ( of which im sure i have many ) so if any action is going to happen with regards to protesting government then im in...

in the short time i have been riding i have hit tar snakes, slipped on white lines, sat at traffic lights in the rain that just would not change for me ( so jumped a red in the end ) had cagers by the dozen try to kill me ( but after advice here been keen eyed enough to watch my own arse ) its about time something was done to make our possition on the roads safer, maybe the idea thats been floated around here before about all road users being made to undergo some awareness training regarding other types of vehicals on the road would be a good idea?

70 kph on the motorway around auckland will get you creamed with cars coming at you from both sides and in a rush to enter or exit the slip lanes...lets get that speed changed and fast...

Cayman911
17th February 2010, 12:47
70 kph on the motorway around auckland will get you creamed with cars coming at you from both sides and in a rush to enter or exit the slip lanes...lets get that speed changed and fast...

i think the main idea behind that speed is that they dont want you going on the motorway at all on a learners. just havnt said it in those words like they do with the car one.

aderino4
17th February 2010, 13:14
Holy Thread revival Batman...

CookMySock
17th February 2010, 14:13
Holy Thread revival Batman...It sure is, but curiously relevant in our house at the moment.

My shortass (15 y/o) daughter did her 6R test on monday. I told her the instructor wanted to see a confident, competent, and safe rider, and that she should not ride around all timid like, but on the other hand, not be an ass in the traffic. The examiner was farken pissed off and and ended the 6R test after ten minutes, demanding to know (from me) how long she had been riding and who taught her.

The problem was you see, that he couldn't catch her. At one stage I heard her chop it back a few gears (crackle pop bang boom - noisy vee twin) and belt it around the roundabout behind me, closely followed by the examiner in his little blue truck nearly on two wheels - It looked more like a police chase than a 6R test. The next problem was, in his blind panic he was shouting down the radio, which of course doesn't work at all - massive distortion.

So I told him it was his call whether he issued her 6R or had her repeat the test "properly", and reassured him that she did know exactly what she was doing on a motorcycle, to which he grunted "that much is evident."

So all in all, a puzzling and frustrating afternoon for said daughter and examiner, and a hilarious one for me. :niceone:


S

Love my Bonnie
17th February 2010, 14:44
I think it really depends on the instructor.
When I sat my restricted, the dude was such a asshole that I was in tears for most of the test. (I know, but most women have faulty eye valves, I have tried to claim warrenty but to no avail)
He shouted at me when I lost him in the rain & was a complete fuckwit.
I sat my full licence in dec last year, through a different place.
The tester was such a nice guy, rider himself with 30+ years of riding experence.

Mudfart
17th February 2010, 18:44
what's your point..?

on the same token then, is any test a waste of time? do we just give a license to everyone who wants to ride/drive them?
altho some times I do wonder about some drivers..

i really want to drive a semi-artic truck with another trailer.. never done it before, but I don't need testing to see if I can do it..

this dudes right, Ive seen the uncoordinated person in the history of mankind, driving a car. She was that bad when she goes bowling she has to use the kids ramps on the lanes to launch the ball, poor girl, it still kept going in the gutter too!. She has a license.
I also know a girl (different female), who had over 200 driving lessons, and is still crap. She is currently driving our roads. Scary.
I also have threaded about the monster in law being given her license renewal at age 70, even tho she couldn't pass the eyesight test.

The lady at the AA centre said "just say anything". The MIL said "I told you, I can't read that line!".

The lady said "I told you, JUST SAY ANYTHING!".

PASSED.
2x crashes so far.

bugjuice
17th February 2010, 19:01
of course I'm right.

kwaka_crasher
20th February 2010, 11:13
Is it just me or is the Restricted licence test a complete waist of time, Well for that matter the full test also

It's just you. It's certainly not a WASTE of time - how else are they going to verify you've actually ridden a bike in that time and are competent?

There should be MORE practical tests (every 10 years) and they should be much, much more demanding in the levels required to pass.


One could make an argument that, as far as motorcycles are concerned, an incompetant rider will quickly scare himself so much that he'll give up.

You have altogether too much faith in people.

Ratti
20th February 2010, 17:39
You have altogether too much faith in people.

Absolutely, witness FIL in his 90's, can't see or hear well, bloody dangerous, has had several crashes in last few years, still keeps getting licence. He is adamant that he has been driving for 75 years and knows it all. MInd you he's a bit of a B*****d like that anyway. He has way to much belief in his ability in spite of all evidence to the contrary...much as a few learners do