Army?

[Indiana_Jones]

Is anyone here in the army, or have been?
Just wondering if you tell me what it's like, the training etc?
Looking at joining

Thanks

-Indy

[SpankMe]

Spent two years in the infantry. Bloody good experience, but I wouldn't want to do it for a living. They don't pay enough and the Army doesn't have the dosh for the real good toys like Oz or the UK.

Join the Territorials first to get a feel for what it's like before joining up full time.

[pete376403]

I was in the Territorials way back in 70 something. The first volunteer intake after labour scrapped CMT. Becuase it was volunteer my employer had to keep me on. I was in Burnham in mid winter- feckin cold. Playing with guns is fun. Standard weapon in those days was a 7.62 SLR. Quite heavy on a route march. Neato down at the butts, tho. We had sadistic corporals who had done time in Vietnam. It really paid NOT to upset those guys. The food was pretty stodgy, but there was lots of it. Dunno if you'd be allowed to do this now, but several guys got helicoptered inot the bush one weekend to go hunting. Company supplied the guns, ammo and supplies, air force provided the chopper, the whole thing was treated as a training exercise. Innoculations (in case we went overseas) were administered with a big blunt needle, that hurt.
On the whole I think it was good, character building stuff. OTOH, at that time there were not any wars going on so there wasn't much chance of getting killed at work. Now it's not so certain.

[Indiana_Jones]

Thanks for the replys guys, keep them comming if you have anything else to say :apint:

-Indy

[jrandom]

They don't pay enough and the Army doesn't have the dosh for the real good toys like Oz or the UK.

You can say *that* again. I looked up the pay rates not too long ago. Absolutely shocking. These guys are putting their lives on the line and they get paid jack shit. Why would an intelligent young guy these days want to be an army officer when it'd take him 15 years of promotions to earn the same as he can make within two or three years in industry? And don't even get me started on what the grunts and noncoms get paid.

But then, what would you expect from a Labour government but tac radios that don't work, no light armoured units and pay rates that would embarrass McDonalds. If anyone ever *did* seriously invade NZ, our Army would put up a valiant fight and be slaughtered within the first 48 hours.

I'm not even going to *comment* on a certain bundle of gear in a certain acquaintance's garage at the moment that may or may not have been 'liberated' from an unattended Army camp up at the Kaipara bombing range. Suffice to say that their water canteens still have "1967" stamped on the side...

[Two Smoker]

i havnt been in the Army yet, but i have applied and wanting for a response (they are taking their fucking time :angry2: ) I did 5 years of Cadet forces and that gave me a huge taste of military life.....

If you join the army as NCO then join as a Field Engineer, those guys generally go on from there to do a trade (plus you get to blow stuff up to put it in simple terms)

Best bet is to apply as an officer and if you dont like that go in as a NCO.

As everyone is saying the pay sucks, about 19000 (before tax) as a NCO and about 24000 (before tax) as an officer (starting rates).

Military life is 100% good, just ignore the first 13 weeks of basic training (although that will be where you make most of your mates) and once you have finished initial training it becomes very cruisey (the airforce being the most cruisey) Huge life experiences and skill will be gained and alot of fun will be had :niceone: the only thing i can say that is bad about the military is the shit pay..... but meh its all about the fun :niceone:

[Indiana_Jones]

Which area in the army are you looking at TS?

-Indy

[Posh Tourer :P]

You can say *that* again. I looked up the pay rates not too long ago. Absolutely shocking. These guys are putting their lives on the line and they get paid jack shit. Why would an intelligent young guy these days want to be an army officer when it'd take him 15 years of promotions to earn the same as he can make within two or three years in industry? And don't even get me started on what the grunts and noncoms get paid.

Remember that you get accomodation and food, so your pay is mostly disposable income......

[Two Smoker]

Well ive applied as an officer, and if i like that then Field Engineers, if i go in as a NCO then also a Field Engineer.....

Actually PT nowadays you have to pay for meals and accomadation aswell.... its like 40$ a week (from memory)?????

[Indiana_Jones]

what's the SAS pay like? :D
Man you have to be hard as shit to get into that :cool:

Army seems cool, all those exercises etc.

I phoned them today, and ask for an info pack, they said that all their stuff is online now, you even apply online as well. Nuts :D.

-Indy

[Two Smoker]

Actually the SAS pay aint that great either ( i know a few guys that were in it or are in it) it is better though. Ive got the requirements to pass selection if you want to know.

[Posh Tourer :P]

Well ive applied as an officer, and if i like that then Field Engineers, if i go in as a NCO then also a Field Engineer.....

Actually PT nowadays you have to pay for meals and accomadation aswell.... its like 40$ a week (from memory)?????

Well that is a bit shitty then innit....

[Indiana_Jones]

lol chuck us a copy of those requirements plz TS :D
Thanks

-Indy

[James Deuce]

Worked for the Army and Defence for a year. I was the Data Communications Engineer for the NZ Army. I ran seminars, installed the first multi domain NT4 server network in the world (Got to meet Steve Ballmer), went on field exercises and helped convince the Navy and Air Force to ditch Novell and go NT. Also installed FDDI at the camps started getting into people management big time. I was on a Lt Colonel's pay, and carried the brevet rank of Major. My boss was a WO1 (Warrant Officer 1st Class), which made for an interesting time in the field :).

In short the pay was lousy, but I had a ball! It was a great training ground for all sorts of things, a big chunk of the crap pay is made up by huge discounts at the Canteen for White goods, and stereos and stuff, and of course cheap booze in the mess. The local businesses around the Army camps know which side their bread is buttered on too, and make sure that the lads and ladesses are looked after.

One warning though. ATG Waioru is a shit hole and you will be "de-civilianised" i.ie.treated like scum while you are there. You'll be sleep deprived, humiliated, challenged in more ways than just physical - but you'll make good mates, and have a damn good time, a damn boring time (most of the time :) - in the Army bored is good) and then when you've done your 20 years (assuming you stay in) you'll be looked after. One question - are you going to be a real man or an officer? ;)

[Two Smoker]

Im tending towards real man even though i have applied as a rupert...:niceone:

[Indiana_Jones]

lol officer if I can :laugh:
I'm also looking at LAV's crew, and the Brit army.
Also got my eyes on the navy, so many choices :brick:

Also does NZ have a sniper devision? I like rifles :D

-Indy

[James Deuce]

Im tending towards real man even though i have applied as a rupert...:niceone:

Don't bend over to pick up the soap in the shower block lad. You''ll be OK :)

[Two Smoker]

Don't bend over to pick up the soap in the shower block lad. You''ll be OK :)
LOL... bend at the knees is my rule, but soap on a rope is a must. Where the navy has liquid soap....... (think about it, trying to pick it up????)

[jrandom]

Also does NZ have a sniper devision? I like rifles :D

Well you'll get to play with the Steyr no matter what you're doing. If you like crawling around in the mud all day with bigger caliber stuff your best bet might be the SAS. AFAIK our Army doesn't field dedicated sniper teams these days like the merkins etc do. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

[Indiana_Jones]

Well you'll get to play with the Steyr no matter what you're doing. .

True, but when I say rifle, I mean like bolt-action styles stuff :D

-Indy

[Al]

I can't comment much on the NZ armed forces, but was in the army in South Africa. We had to do 2 yrs compulsory service and then 12 yrs part-time, usually between 1 and 3 months per year.
I was in the Infantry, went to Officers Training School, came out as a Lieutenant (officer).... Training was shit, rewards at the end were choice!
My advice is to do everything to the best of your capabilities, some guys were not cut out to be officers, make sure you are super-fit and don't volunteer for anything!

Good luck!!
:niceone:

[jrandom]

True, but when I say rifle, I mean like bolt-action styles stuff

No guarantee that any given sniper outfit these days will use bolt-action rifles anyway. The merkins use accurised M14s as their standard light sniper rifle. That's a .308 cal semi-auto.

If you like playing with rifles, then why not just buy or borrow some and go play on your own out in the boonies? Works for me. Bypasses the unpleasant training and bad pay. ;)

Now of course if you want to rip up the countryside with automatic weapons and explosives I'm afraid that enlisting is your only real option.

[Holy Roller]

One warning though. ATG Waioru is a shit hole and you will be "de-civilianised" i.ie.treated like scum while you are there. You'll be sleep deprived, humiliated, challenged in more ways than just physical - but you'll make good mates, and have a damn good time, a damn boring time (most of the time :) - in the Army bored is good) and then when you've done your 20 years (assuming you stay in) you'll be looked after. One question - are you going to be a real man or an officer? ;)

I found ATG Waiouru a fantastic place :eek: not many people say that.
Being in the Navy and posted to Waiouru the best advise I was given was "If U want to enjoy the place go there thinking you will and the above will not be a problem" Being treated like scum is only during the basic training or first year, once that is out of the way you will make some really good mates and have one fantastic time (the good times anyway) to remember as you grow older.
Waiouru 20 mins from the ski field join the Army ski club cheap rentals also take advantage of the unimog that takes you up the mountain. The shift work worked out great, after nights (sleeping, but only disturbed if something goes wrong) into the unimog and up the slopes for the day. :bleh:
Some of the best fishing right on the back doorstep.
Even better hunting.

Went for a visit after the last cold kiwi to see our house that we lived in but the whole street of houses had gone just grass.
Life is what you make of it,
enjoy every moment and the good times seem even better after some not so good experiences. :D

[Two Smoker]

True, but when I say rifle, I mean like bolt-action styles stuff :D

-IndyThe majority of Sniper Rifles are semi automatic nowadays........ If you want to use a bolt action rifle, get your firearms licence and buy a bolt action rifle :niceone: ..... But afterusing both bolt action and semi auto myself, i know what i would prefer in the field........

[jrandom]

But afterusing both bolt action and semi auto myself, i know what i would prefer in the field........

I'd prefer neither. I'd prefer to be inside an M1A2. Actually I'd prefer not to be in the field getting shot at in the first place TYVM.

Anyway... if it all turned to custard and I had to pick a shoulder weapon I'd take an FN Minimi.

If you guys think the idea of going into combat with modern bolt action rifles is tough you should try running around all day with an SMLE Mk 4 or an old Mosin Nagant. Gives you a new respect for soliders back in WWII it does.

[Indiana_Jones]

The majority of Sniper Rifles are semi automatic nowadays........ If you want to use a bolt action rifle, get your firearms licence and buy a bolt action rifle :niceone: ..... But afterusing both bolt action and semi auto myself, i know what i would prefer in the field........

lol I guess I did'nt use the right wording, I kinda ment like non-assult rifles :D
But it's all cool :banana:

-Indy

[Indiana_Jones]

and don't volunteer for anything!

Good luck!!
:niceone:

What is that meant to mean ? :laugh:

-Indy

[Hitcher]

Ah, the summer of '78... Trooper Hitcher did his basic training at ATG Waiouru. Queen Alexandras. What a stunning locale! Marching up and down, blowing shit up, dying of exhaust fume and dust inhalation in the rear of various armoured vehicles. Character-building stuff, or so I'm told. Could have been worse -- I could have been regular force or a cadet (poor little bastards).

One thing I learned that I have never forgotten is the subtle distinction between insubordination and just taking a while to get something done...

[Two Smoker]

If you guys think the idea of going into combat with modern bolt action rifles is tough you should try running around all day with an SMLE Mk 4 or an old Mosin Nagant. Gives you a new respect for soliders back in WWII it does.
Yep it sure does, im quite profecient in using the Lee Enfield Number 8 rifle, single round bolt action, based on the Lee Enfield Number 3, although they were very accurate considering thier age, (getting aa inch grouping on a 25 yard range..) the reload factor was appaling, makes me wonder why more people didnt lose their lives during the wars.......

[Timber020]

The smle's werent so bad, ever tried to carry a Bren gun? (no im not that old!) It makes the pig seem light!

The armys a pretty good life, but its way sheltered. You will be surrounded by like minded guys (and the occational non minded guy) your never short of mates, drink is cheap (last time I shouted 10 guys steiny stubbies at the corpers bar in burnham I got change from ten bucks!)
Keep a few mates on the outside, can be tough to do but it will make life easier to adjust when you leave. Get a trade that you can use as well, I have met quite a few gas station attendants that know how to call in a fire mission.

[James Deuce]

I found ATG Waiouru a fantastic place :eek: not many people say that.
Being in the Navy and posted to Waiouru the best advise I was given was "If U want to enjoy the place go there thinking you will and the above will not be a problem" Being treated like scum is only during the basic training or first year, once that is out of the way you will make some really good mates and have one fantastic time (the good times anyway) to remember as you grow older.
Waiouru 20 mins from the ski field join the Army ski club cheap rentals also take advantage of the unimog that takes you up the mountain. The shift work worked out great, after nights (sleeping, but only disturbed if something goes wrong) into the unimog and up the slopes for the day. :bleh:
Some of the best fishing right on the back doorstep.
Even better hunting.

Went for a visit after the last cold kiwi to see our house that we lived in but the whole street of houses had gone just grass.
Life is what you make of it,
enjoy every moment and the good times seem even better after some not so good experiences. :D

I thought I said that? (shrug)

I got stuck there during the last major Ruapahu eruption. It was cold, I expected to be there for a day trip, didn't have enough gear, and boy did the Army come through. They chucked me in the oficer's mess, forgot about my bar tab, got me some thermals, fatigues, boots, and a nice jacket, and gave me the run of the place. Made some really good mates that I still occasionally keep in touch with. The next time I was there on a night exercise, the command tent (I was in it) got run over by an M113. I didn't know I could fly.

[Indiana_Jones]

If I join the army, after my training, where will I be posted?
Also Do they have like housing accom for like maybe 2 guys etc?

PS: In the navy do you get to learn cool hand to hand combat stuff?

-Indy

[pete376403]

If I join the army, after my training, where will I be posted?

That used to depend on what your specialty was, ie Tankers go to Waiouru. Now with all the cutbacks maybe they just send everyone to one place.

Also Do they have like housing accom for like maybe 2 guys etc?
PS: In the navy do you get to learn cool hand to hand combat stuff?
-Indy

Navy? Two guys?? Hand to hand??? Ohh, bad mental images.....

[Indiana_Jones]

Navy? Two guys?? Hand to hand??? Ohh, bad mental images.....

har har har :sly:

-Indy

[Gixxer]

lol officer if I can :laugh:
I'm also looking at LAV's crew, and the Brit army.
Also got my eyes on the navy, so many choices :brick:

Also does NZ have a sniper devision? I like rifles :D

-Indy

Yo IJ, Spent 5 1/2 years in the Navy, Did not learn any Hand to hand combat unless you count the many pub brawls. as everyone else has said pay is shit. joined @ 17 and started on $13,000, when I left I was only on $22,000 so don't go into the service thinking of making it rich (unless you can sell shit on the black market)
You have to do your time in the service before you can apply for Squadron. I only know of 1 guy that joined the SAS from civi street.
it is a great life and the friends you make there are for life. Army do more :ar15: training, but the navy travel alot and drink a shit load. when I was in basic we got treated like shit, once you pass the training it is alot of fun, I understand alot of the hardcore basic stuff has been replaced by
F%$k%n P.C tree hugging shit, everyone has rights and all that crap.
join up any of the services dude, you will love it.

[Indiana_Jones]

Yo IJ, Spent 5 1/2 years in the Navy, Did not learn any Hand to hand combat unless you count the many pub brawls. as everyone else has said pay is shit. joined @ 17 and started on $13,000, when I left I was only on $22,000 so don't go into the service thinking of making it rich (unless you can sell shit on the black market)
You have to do your time in the service before you can apply for Squadron. I only know of 1 guy that joined the SAS from civi street.
it is a great life and the friends you make there are for life. Army do more :ar15: training, but the navy travel alot and drink a shit load. when I was in basic we got treated like shit, once you pass the training it is alot of fun, I understand alot of the hardcore basic stuff has been replaced by
F%$k%n P.C tree hugging shit, everyone has rights and all that crap.
join up any of the services dude, you will love it.

Thanks for the Info Gixxer :niceone:

-Indy

[Hoon]

Is anyone here in the army, or have been?
Just wondering if you tell me what it's like, the training etc?
Looking at joining
-Indy

Sorry my reply is a little late, ironically I've been away at Waiouru with my Army Shooting team competing in the Freyberg Shoot this last week. 1RNZIR (NZ's regular Infantry Battalion) took out most the comps except for the Machine Gunners match which was won by the gun team from 2 Canterbury (TF).

The NZ Army comprises of 2 fulltime units 1RNZIR (Linton) and 2nd/1st (Burnham?) and 6 TF units from all around the country including 3 Auck North (http://www.aucknortharmy.mil.nz) my unit. Oh and also the 1NZSAS guys who are also part of the Army but do whatever they want.

I remember seeing lots of threads about joining the Army at nzgames.com too so have a look here (http://www.nzgames.com/forums/search.php?s=&action=showresults&searchid=104445&sortby=replies&sortorder=descending) and also this one. (http://www.nzgames.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=35330&highlight=army+mod2)

I've been in the TF (Territorials Forces) for about 3 years now as an Infantry soldier. Sure it can be hard work sometimes but you get to do lots of cool stuff. Asides from shooting on the range against the Armys best for the last week, the other weekend we were blowing claymores, live grenades and popping off 40mm HE rounds with our grenade launchers. Earlier this year I did a 2 wk exercise in Australia and carried this LSWC9/Minimi/M249 depending where you are from.
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You can either join as a private (enlisted) or officer which you will need to do Officer Cadet school.

If you become a good soldier you can try out for the SAS. A few guys from our unit tried doing selection last year and one of them made it.

Now is a good time to join the Army as they are commited to boosting numbers (hence the Tomb Raider type ads) and have all sorts of schemes going........hey actually, if you tell them I told you about the Army when joining and then you make it past basic training, I will get a free Army t-shirt!!

[SpankMe]

.. and 6 TF units from all around the country including 3 Auck North (http://www.aucknortharmy.mil.nz) my unit.

Thats my old unit. :niceone:

[pete376403]

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They let you take that home in the weekends?

[sAsLEX]

Have you looked at the Navy seriously?? Some of the training schemes give you some good qualifications and the pay aint really that bad.

Only been in three years, on 32,000, starting is about 19,000 for an officer. Accomadtion is 54 a fornight in devonport so not to bad at all. Employed as a full time student with all fees paid for doing a BE in computer systems at Auckland University, work for the Navy in the Uni breaks.

My initial training was nine months, think this is shorter now, of PT, parade(get to use swords), base tours, leadership training, Weapon training, sailing and far to much to mention here.

Spent three months on a ship before uni started. Trained in basic hand to hand combat as part of Ships Protection, also carried a Sig Sauer while on duty as part of this.

Its a great life, make heaps of mates and once I finish Uni will get to travel over the world.


edit: and the sniper rifles in this countrys army were bolt action when I saw them during training!

[Gixxer]

also carried a Sig Sauer while on duty as part of this.

Its a great life, make heaps of mates and once I finish Uni will get to travel over the world.

I love Sig Sauer's, when I joined we still had the old brownings and SMG's, then came the styers and Sig's.

Ha sAsLEX, you officers get paid 2 much, what is the starting rate for OD's these day's?

[sAsLEX]

I love Sig Sauer's, when I joined we still had the old brownings and SMG's, then came the styers and Sig's.

Ha sAsLEX, you officers get paid 2 much, what is the starting rate for OD's these day's?

Pay rises have been coming left right and centre recently. I think starting 14-15. The new median salary for army privates will be $26,438 pa( out of training)

The Minister of Defence Mr Mark Burton today annouced pay rises for the NZDF.

"The pay and allowance adjustments announced today are recognition of the fact that the greatest assets of the New Zealand Defence Force are its people," the Minister of Defence Mark Burton said.

Pay and allowance increases targeted at lower paid ranks and identified technical trades with recruitment and retention problems have been announced today.

Over 80 percent of uniformed defence force personnel will receive increases. The average increase is 5 percent and individual increases range from 1 to 19 percent.

That was 2001 I think and there have been more since then.

[Indiana_Jones]

Have you looked at the Navy seriously??

Its a great life, make heaps of mates and once I finish Uni will get to travel over the world.




Yeah, Have been looking at the navy quite abit as well, I think I might be going navy.

What type of officer are you? and was it hard getting in?
Thanks

Also, thanks for the info Pete about the army, lol free T-shirt :D

-Indy

[sAsLEX]

Yeah, Have been looking at the navy quite abit as well, I think I might be going navy.

What type of officer are you? and was it hard getting in?
Thanks

Also, thanks for the info Pete about the army, lol free T-shirt :D

-Indy

Have the warry title of Weapons Engineering officer (well will do when finished training). Need good grades at school, for engineers 300+ bursary is helpful. There is quite a comprehensive selection process of tests and stuff, then a three day selection board where some high up brass, and phycologists put you through your paces. Just look at ?navy.mil.nz? and email your area recruiter, they wil send you all the info and can organise ship visits and the like so you can try before you buy kinda thing.
Hope this helps.

[georgedubyabush]

Just wondering... How big do our Navy guns get? Can they do this?

[pete376403]

Is that the Mighty Mo? (Missouri) - 16" guns, will be a while before the Anzac class boats can mount that size tube :laugh:
I read somewhere that when the Mo fired a broadside, the whole ship moved a few meters sideways in the water. May be an urban legend kinda thing, tho

[jrandom]

Is that the Mighty Mo?

Ahh, the days of proper naval gunnery are long gone. It's all 'push the button' now, and let the $1M SSM do the work.

Although that's probably what the Hornblower generation said when these newfangled 'shells' came out.

Hmmm. Have you heard the story about the German sniper up a bell tower in Normandy who had a naval bombardment called in on him? One 16" shell later from a mile or so offshore and there was no more bell tower...

[Indiana_Jones]

lol imagine that

"Ach! what is dat whilsting noise?" BOOM

True about what was said about the old school naval days gone :D
NZ should make a Bismarck :stoogie: then we'll look tough

-Indy

[sAsLEX]

Is that the Mighty Mo? (Missouri) - 16" guns, will be a while before the Anzac class boats can mount that size tube :laugh:
I read somewhere that when the Mo fired a broadside, the whole ship moved a few meters sideways in the water. May be an urban legend kinda thing, tho

And if I am correct those guns look as though they have been filled with a bit of Diesel for effect, there pictures around base taken from the deck of these ships while doing this.

[pete376403]

They're BIG guns, they don't need no steenkin diesel. The Mo didn't need diesel to do a burn out, she ain't no boy racer shit box
Have a look at
http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/sh-usn/usnsh-m/bb63-k.htm

[Hitcher]

They're BIG guns, they don't need no steenkin diesel. The Mo didn't need diesel to do a burn out, she ain't no boy racer shit box
Have a look at
http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/sh-usn/usnsh-m/bb63-k.htm

The noise from these guns must be phenomenal. I have had the "experience" of being in front of a tank during live firing at Waiouru and the amalgam in my dental work has not been the same since!! To give you an idea of the physics involved in these big guns, have a look at the photos on Pete's link and see how down the the bow and high in the stern the Missouri is. Note that this is a battleship -- not a Rayglass fish killer!

[Holy Roller]

Is that the Mighty Mo? (Missouri) - 16" guns, will be a while before the Anzac class boats can mount that size tube :laugh:
I read somewhere that when the Mo fired a broadside, the whole ship moved a few meters sideways in the water. May be an urban legend kinda thing, tho
Even our small 4 inch guns on the Otago when fired broadside one had to hold on to the dinner plate or loose it on the floor. Not a big shift sideways but enough to know what had happened.