Red lights are the new Stop signs?

[Lou Girardin]

I've seen this a couple of times but never by a biker.
Stop at the red - check both ways and go.
It's perfectly safe from a ticket point of view, I've never seen a cop at the intersection of Onewa and Sylvan. They're often 1/2 km up the Sylvan checking speeders.

[Grahameeboy]

I've seen this a couple of times but never by a biker.
Stop at the red - check both ways and go.
It's perfectly safe from a ticket point of view, I've never seen a cop at the intersection of Onewa and Sylvan. They're often 1/2 km up the Sylvan checking speeders.

So what are you saying?:confused:

In the States you can turn right at a red if clear which is not a bad idea....

[Sniper]

Red means Stop! Not go now, later or at any stage, it means stop.

[sAsLEX]

Some of the light phases around the shore are bordering on insane so I often do the stop check for the 5-0 and traffic and go, waiting on a red arrow for 5 mins while there is no oncoming traffic etc is just dumb

[Lazy7]

its a bit tricky on a bike sometimes, if you are at the front of a queue waiting for your green right turn arrow and your bike isn't heavy enough to set off the censors so you miss your phase.

i was sitting at the lights waiting to turn right one day and realised my bike wasn't triggering the lights so i moved forward a bit and signaled the car behind me to move up and over the pad.

little asian girl had NO IDEA what i was doing, but sometimes you got to do what you got to do.

running reds is a dumb idea. give up all your rights if you cause or are in an accident.

[Grahameeboy]

Some of the light phases around the shore are bordering on insane so I often do the stop check for the 5-0 and traffic and go, waiting on a red arrow for 5 mins while there is no oncoming traffic etc is just dumb

Sorry guys but it is "Red" which means STOP.........:mad:

[sAsLEX]

Sorry guys but it is "Red" which means STOP.........:mad:

Laws need to be reasonable to be obeyed, Now I am not saying that I run every red I see, just that some of the phasing around this town is down right ludicrous *sp* . Its not dangerous to turn on a red arrow when you can see 1km up the road on the opposite side, and see that it is empty, its illegal but hell I am seldom not doing something wrong according to the law :oi-grr: :eek:

[Grahameeboy]

Laws need to be reasonable to be obeyed, Now I am not saying that I run every red I see, just that some of the phasing around this town is down right ludicrous *sp* . Its not dangerous to turn on a red arrow when you can see 1km up the road on the opposite side, and see that it is empty, its illegal but hell I am seldom not doing something wrong according to the law :oi-grr: :eek:

You you Lawbreaker you....but seriously though I see where you are coming from but there is no point complaining about cagers doing things if we do not set an example......I mean what if some cager sees you doing it and then one day thinks the road ahead is clear does the same thing and hit's a motorcyclist that he didn't see....or thinks he has time to pull cross of.

Wash your bike you scoundrel....:Police:

[Finn]

I do it all the time. Car or bike. I need to remind myself everyday that I'm not a conformist and that I'll decide when it's safe to go and not a little filament or worse, a bureaucrat.

Between Council and Transit, they're just installing traffic lights hap hazardly in Auck with absolutely no thought to timing or synchronisation. The right turn on a red in California is a great example of smart thinking seldome found in NZ authorities.

Oh yeah, and for those of you who say "Red mean stop", I would add also that "Green means GO!!!" What is it with kiwi's? They all complain about the traffic and yet in rush hour they get a green, look down at the gear lever, stick it in 1st and then it's a competitiion to see who can take off the slowest. Stupid islanders.

[sAsLEX]

Wash your bike you scoundrel....:Police:

I have no prob with cages doing, I do it in mine, but I do ensure bloody well that the coast is clear before going.

I nearly got sideswiped the other day after a lady came through a red a couple of sec after my green phase, was unsighted to the right where she came from due to road set up but spidy senses told me to just hang on a bit before going, I gave her a fair fright though!

oh no need it rained just the other day!

[Lou Girardin]

Some of the light phases around the shore are bordering on insane so I often do the stop check for the 5-0 and traffic and go, waiting on a red arrow for 5 mins while there is no oncoming traffic etc is just dumb

Yeah, red arrows are a different thing. It's our duty as citizens to ignore the phasings set by some anal-retentive retard at NSCC

[sAsLEX]

Yeah, red arrows are a different thing. It's our duty as citizens to ignore the phasings set by some anal-retentive retard at NSCC

the other thing is the pedestrian phase is crazy long, a bloody slug could evolve and then walk across in the time they last for! Now I have watched an old guy with a walking frame get across the diagonal at a set of lights as slow as buggery and still got across half way through the phase

[Finn]

Yeah, red arrows are a different thing. It's our duty as citizens to ignore the phasings set by some anal-retentive retard at NSCC

Having done some work for NSCC Lou, I can say that a lot of them aren't anally rentitive if you know what I mean. Stupid, uneducated, institutionalised, bad dress sense, ugly, narrow mined, low IQ yes, but I'd say they'd be quite partial to a bit of sausage.

[Lou Girardin]

I do it all the time. Car or bike. I need to remind myself everyday that I'm not a conformist and that I'll decide when it's safe to go and not a little filament or worse, a bureaucrat.


What cage do you have again?
Has it got any mirrors left on it?

It's funny though, how all the nit-picky irrational road safety measures turn us into law-breakers. I would never have considered passing on yellow lines once. Now the proliferation of them in totally inappropriate places makes you ignore them. (on a bike that is)

[Grahameeboy]

I do it all the time. Car or bike. I need to remind myself everyday that I'm not a conformist and that I'll decide when it's safe to go and not a little filament or worse, a bureaucrat.

Between Council and Transit, they're just installing traffic lights hap hazardly in Auck with absolutely no thought to timing or synchronisation. The right turn on a red in California is a great example of smart thinking seldome found in NZ authorities.

Oh yeah, and for those of you who say "Red mean stop", I would add also that "Green means GO!!!" What is it with kiwi's? They all complain about the traffic and yet in rush hour they get a green, look down at the gear lever, stick it in 1st and then it's a competitiion to see who can take off the slowest. Stupid islanders.

You need to remind yourself!!

I guess the choice is yours Finn and no one can take that away from you...except a car when you run a red light I guess.....:msn-wink:

[Ixion]

The morons who decide these things have completely changed the logic of yellow lines. They *used* to signal "Although this bit of road looks like a good place to overtake, beware, it's not. There is some hidden danger". Used sparingly thus, they were respected (by me , anyway).

Now , the morons have them signal, as for instance on SH2, now a yellow line from end to end, "we , the power tripping, who know nothing of you or your vehicles capabilities, don't want you to overtake. Not here, not there, not anywhere in fact. Stay in line like a good little sheep".

Overuse=abuse. I now ignore them because they tell me nothing useful. Which is a pity, because I no longer have the useful "this bit is more dangerous than it looks" message.

[Grahameeboy]

the other thing is the pedestrian phase is crazy long, a bloody slug could evolve and then walk across in the time they last for! Now I have watched an old guy with a walking frame get across the diagonal at a set of lights as slow as buggery and still got across half way through the phase

Guess he rushed knowing you would not stop........

.....and I thouht Kiwis were laid back, no worry's types....geeze some of ya are begining to sound like cagers

[Al]

waiting on a red arrow for 5 mins while there is no oncoming traffic etc is just dumb

Unfortunately my wife found out that it is $150 for doing the look and go on the red arrow!

Al

[Zed]

the other thing is the pedestrian phase is crazy long, a bloody slug could evolve and then walk across in the time they last for! Now I have watched an old guy with a walking frame get across the diagonal at a set of lights as slow as buggery and still got across half way through the phaseLol, reminds me of the attached file (been on KB b4 i think?), blimmin hillarious!

As for going thru red lights, i have done it a few times on the bike but only very late and night with no other vehicles anywhere in sight, having waited for a least 20 secs for the stoppid thing to change before going thru! :crazy:

[Keystone19]

Traffic lights are simply a means of controlling the way we think, act and behave.

[Finn]

You need to remind yourself!!

I guess the choice is yours Finn and no one can take that away from you...except a car when you run a red light I guess.....:msn-wink:

It's no more dangerous than going through a stop sign. Same rules apply. Of course I'm not talking about major intersections, just pointless traffic light intersections. Most of my "give way reds" are when I'm turning.

[pritch]

I don't normally go through red lights. Maybe late at night if there was no other traffic and even then only after stopping.

To get to my street there is an arrow permitting a right turn and if the way is clear I will ignore that if it's red. Got stopped by a mufti once, and in answer to his question said, "Well there was nothing coming."

The officer informed me that he felt that was like saying there's nobody about so it'll be OK to speed.

I thought, you're telling that to the wrong guy...
But I Kept my mouth shut and he let me off with a warning.

I still do it, but not as frequently these days.

[Grahameeboy]

It's no more dangerous than going through a stop sign. Same rules apply. Of course I'm not talking about major intersections, just pointless traffic light intersections. Most of my "give way reds" are when I'm turning.

You are a worry Mr Finn........:eek:

[denill]

It's funny though, how all the nit-picky irrational road safety measures turn us into law-breakers. I would never have considered passing on yellow lines once. Now the proliferation of them in totally inappropriate places makes you ignore them. (on a bike that is)

So I sense that they may be a consensus here for a rule that allows - 'free to turn left on a red light IF able to do so safely', with the onus on the turner.

Don't hold your breath for such forward thinking from the rule makers. They still think the smart thing to do is to give way to right turning traffic when turning left??? Overseas visitors must raise their eyebrows with that one..........

[Karma]

You gotta be joking right denill??

"with the onus on the turner" don't think so somehow.

I'd rather stop and wait at a set of traffic lights than deal with plebs who can't drive on something like the Panmure roundabout.

[denill]

You gotta be joking right denill??
"with the onus on the turner" don't think so somehow.
I'd rather stop and wait at a set of traffic lights than deal with plebs who can't drive on something like the Panmure roundabout.

Ummm, did you miss something Weasel?? The road is clear - WHEN you decide to turn left.............

[Grahameeboy]

You gotta be joking right denill??

"with the onus on the turner" don't think so somehow.

I'd rather stop and wait at a set of traffic lights than deal with plebs who can't drive on something like the Panmure roundabout.

I agree toilet idea "with onus on the turner".....just adding to an already frequent hazard.........I think he is in deniel.......

[Grahameeboy]

Ummm, did you miss something Weasel?? The road is clear - WHEN you decide to turn left.............

yeah so why do people have accidents........."it was clear when I looked, he just appeared from no where".......:bash:

[Lou Girardin]

Having done some work for NSCC Lou, I can say that a lot of them aren't anally rentitive if you know what I mean. Stupid, uneducated, institutionalised, bad dress sense, ugly, narrow mined, low IQ yes, but I'd say they'd be quite partial to a bit of sausage.

And they'd retain it.
They sound like the civil servants of old.

[Lou Girardin]

So I sense that they may be a consensus here for a rule that allows - 'free to turn left on a red light IF able to do so safely', with the onus on the turner.

Don't hold your breath for such forward thinking from the rule makers. They still think the smart thing to do is to give way to right turning traffic when turning left??? Overseas visitors must raise their eyebrows with that one..........


THey tried it at two intersections on the Shore in the 70's. The results were "inconclusive". So they changed the Give Way rules instead.

[ZeroIndex]

In the States you can turn right at a red if clear which is not a bad idea....

That would be a left turn in NZ (or any country that drives on the 'correct', not 'right' side of the road :D

[denill]

I agree toilet idea "with onus on the turner".....just adding to an already frequent hazard.........I think he is in deniel.......
So I was wrong - there is no consensus.
But what do you guys do when confronted with a 'free left turn' intersection?? WTF is the difference??? The onus is on the turner............

[Finn]

And they'd retain it.
They sound like the civil servants of old.

No, these ones don't smell as bad.

Sorry, your wing mirrors comment went over my head. Explain please sir.

[Grahameeboy]

That would be a left turn in NZ (or any country that drives on the 'correct', not 'right' side of the road :D

:clap:......................

[Grahameeboy]

So I was wrong - there is no consensus.
But what do you guys do when confronted with a 'free left turn' intersection?? WTF is the difference??? The onus is on the turner............

does there have to be a consensus.....I agree the onus is on turner but I was just saying that we don't want to add to more of these hazard situations and giving road users the "shall I shan't I" choice of being able to turn on a red light when they struggle with this indecisional balance at uncontrolled junctions.

What is wrong with just waiting at the lights......I must be a laid back non whinging POM........no surely not......more pills required I am British...

[denill]

does there have to be a consensus.....I agree the onus is on turner but I was just saying that we don't want to add to more of these hazard situations and giving road users the "shall I shan't I" choice of being able to turn on a red light when they struggle with this indecisional balance at uncontrolled junctions.

What is wrong with just waiting at the lights......I must be a laid back non whinging POM........no surely not......more pills required I am British...

It seems pretty simple to me. If there is something coming - don't go!!!

If you are saying, and you would probably be right, that there are fuckwits out there who would have difficulty dealing with a free left turn at traffic lights - they're going to cause mayhem somwhere anyhow.........

I really marvel that there are not more road fatalities than there are.

[Sniper]

The amount of cars that we (our buisness) lose per year with the Turn right/left at a red from Americans gives me enough ground to say that the rule is FUCKEN STUPID

[Ixion]

An alternative interpretation might be that Americans are fricken stupid ? Or just expect everywhere else in the world to follow US practices ?

[Finn]

Okay, so it's 3:30 in the morning and you happen upon a red light. It's stuck on red. You're sitting there on your motorbike in the pooring rain in the middle of winter. Would you;

a) Ring for help and wait until it arrives
b) Leave your bike there with a note and walk home
c) Look both ways and carefully move on

It appears alot of you would choose "a" or "b". You lot deserve the outstanding law abidding citizen award.

[Ixion]

(d). Ride up onto the footpath on the other side of the road, down a business driveway , round out the other side of his front yard, out the other driveway on the road that's got the green light (still). That's what I did last time, anyway .

[Finn]

(d). Ride up onto the footpath on the other side of the road, down a business driveway , round out the other side of his front yard, out the other driveway on the road that's got the green light (still). That's what I did last time, anyway .

You just broke 4 laws that I can count.

1) You crossed the centre line and lane at an intersection
2) You recklessly rode up onto the footpath
3) You tresspassed
4) You tried to make fun of my post

[skidMark]

its a bit tricky on a bike sometimes, if you are at the front of a queue waiting for your green right turn arrow and your bike isn't heavy enough to set off the censors so you miss your phase.



they don't get set off by weight.... they sense the metal alot of newer bikes contain alot of alloy so are harder to set off.... also the road works guys sometimes bury the strip too deep

[Lou Girardin]

No, these ones don't smell as bad.

Sorry, your wing mirrors comment went over my head. Explain please sir.


Just asking if you had any left after jumping red lights around bikers.

[Lou Girardin]

What is wrong with just waiting at the lights.......

Nothing. Everyone bar taxi drivers used to do it. then they came out with arrows controlling every direction, multiple (unnecessary) phases and people just got pissed off with the stupidity.

[Grahameeboy]

It seems pretty simple to me. If there is something coming - don't go!!!

I agree but life ain't simple these days.

[If you are saying, and you would probably be right, that there are fuckwits out there who would have difficulty dealing with a free left turn at traffic lights - they're going to cause mayhem somwhere anyhow.........

I guess I am concerned that we would just increase opportunities for fuckwits with a different Red light system....I mean the turning left rule is crazy......it is because of the give way to your right rule but isn't the turning right vehicle actally oncoming, not coming from right....maybe it's me....okay it is then...

I really marvel that there are not more road fatalities than there are.

[/B]Well per head of pop. NZ is around 2nd despite having one of the lowest average speed limits in the world.....

.....................................

[Grahameeboy]

Nothing. Everyone bar taxi drivers used to do it. then they came out with arrows controlling every direction, multiple (unnecessary) phases and people just got pissed off with the stupidity.

So wait then..............:Police:

[skidMark]

.....................................

righto....

then we need the 50 kph is residential areas lifted..hell lets just make suburban areas autobahn? :clap: :whistle:

[Grahameeboy]

Okay, so it's 3:30 in the morning and you happen upon a red light. It's stuck on red. You're sitting there on your motorbike in the pooring rain in the middle of winter. Would you;

a) Ring for help and wait until it arrives
b) Leave your bike there with a note and walk home
c) Look both ways and carefully move on

It appears alot of you would choose "a" or "b". You lot deserve the outstanding law abidding citizen award.

or d) stay at home.

That is an isolated scenario Finny.......if the lights were broken then that is different, same as if the lights were not working....

You must be desperate to pull this one out as an argument.......:yeah:

[Grahameeboy]

righto....

then we need the 50 kph is residential areas lifted..hell lets just make suburban areas autobahn? :clap: :whistle:

?? Marky.....2 points....your little putt putt can just about do 50kph and secondly why increase residential limit....

[Karma]

Ummm, did you miss something Weasel?? The road is clear - WHEN you decide to turn left.............

Dude... wasn't a personal attack or something...

It's bad enough dealing with auckland drivers as it is, but I don't want the added fun of approaching an intersection, and even if the light is green for me, I'm wondering if some [insert crap driver stereotype here] is going to decide the road is clear and pull into my lane.

If you pass a law like this then you are making an assumption that the drivers on the roads can a) judge correctly that nothing is coming and b) carry out this maneauver safely... that in my mind is one huge assumption.

[skidMark]

?? Marky.....2 points....your little putt putt can just about do 50kph and secondly why increase residential limit....


then we can all go as fast as we do and not get tickets.....and run over little children that run out.....

(my last post was intended to show sarcasm)

[Lou Girardin]

So wait then..............:Police:

You don't ride/drive around Auckland much then?

[skidMark]

so that's what red lights are for they mean stop.

now green light means reputation right?

damn i miust be on this forum too much

[Grahameeboy]

then we can all go as fast as we do and not get tickets.....and run over little children that run out.....

(my last post was intended to show sarcasm)

Yep you bit like a shark.........:bleh: :moon: :niceone:

[skidMark]

for once i took hook line and sinker and the whole frigging boat.....

you are progessing well old decreped grasshopper:wari:

[Grahameeboy]

You don't ride/drive around Auckland much then?

Is that the best you can come up with........Mmmmmm...I lived in London Lou Lou and Auckland traffic lights are wanky in comparison and I get a ferry to work and when I go for a ride I don't ride around Auckland which is why I am happy to wait which is why we don't see ya much...... I guess cause we don't have KB rides in the CBD....funny that..:woohoo:

[Grahameeboy]

for once i took hook line and sinker and the whole frigging boat.....

you are progessing well old decreped grasshopper:wari:

Domo Sensei.....

[Lazy7]

i'm sorry guys. but if i'm in my car and you pull out in front of me cause you are going through a red - i will run you down.

then i will laugh at you out my window at your broken ass bike and drive on.

edit: it would be even better if you were in a car, cause then the damage to my car would be enough to warrant a replacement at the cost of your insurrance. and my mazda is seriously on its last legs.

[skidMark]

i swear mr insurance man...i parked it on the big hill next to the cliff......and i'm sure i left the handbrake on .....

[Grahameeboy]

i swear mr insurance man...i parked it on the big hill next to the cliff......and i'm sure i left the handbrake on .....

and being an automatic I forgot to put it in 'park' too................

[Lou Girardin]

Is that the best you can come up with........

No, it just sounded like you don't see much of our national sport.
Traffic light roulette.

[Finn]

I applied the Finn rule to 2 reds today. One was a pointless red on Grafton Road (the hospital exit - used to be give way) no cars coming - thank you mam! The other was Jervous Road. Wanted to turn left, absolutely no cars coming, quick check for police, bam!

Just call me ahead of the times. When NZ has achieved true third world status, my driving will be the norm.

[Zed]

I applied the Finn rule to 2 reds today. One was a pointless red on Grafton Road (the hospital exit - used to be give way) no cars coming - thank you mam! The other was Jervous Road. Wanted to turn left, absolutely no cars coming, quick check for police, bam!Lol, well hopefully the powers that be will send you photographic evidence of your triumphant red light running, along with a bank-breaking fine or two hehe - go hard Finn! :Punk:

[Finn]

Lol, well hopefully the powers that be will send you photographic evidence of your triumphant red light running, along with a bank-breaking fine or two hehe - go hard Finn! :Punk:

Ah that's bloody charming. Stick to 100 on your Coro loop Zed?

[SPman]

How did a post about moving off at reds when the way was clear, after stopping, at times of (presumably) low traffic volumes. turn in to red light running in rush hour, with four part harmony?
Does anyone actually use their fucking brain around here?


Yes - I do move off through reds - especially on the Shore.

[Finn]

Does anyone actually use their fucking brain around here?


When did you grow an overy?

[Jackrat]

I've seen this a couple of times but never by a biker.
Stop at the red - check both ways and go.
It's perfectly safe from a ticket point of view, I've never seen a cop at the intersection of Onewa and Sylvan. They're often 1/2 km up the Sylvan checking speeders.

Hell, ya' havn't seen me then.
I do that heaps.
It seems by far one of the less dodgy things you could do on a bike.
That an riding over the foot path when turning left because the lights won't change,becuse your on a bike an they hate you,,,or the bike ain't heavy enough or whatever.
I don't lane split though:bleh:

[Skyryder]

Yeah, red arrows are a different thing. It's our duty as citizens to ignore the phasings set by some anal-retentive retard at NSCC

So that applies to cages too..............the ones that knock down bikes.

Yea I can just imagine some of the posts if that happened.

Lou you usually get it 'so' right. What happened??


Skyryder

[spudchucka]

I've seen this a couple of times but never by a biker.
Stop at the red - check both ways and go.
It's perfectly safe from a ticket point of view, I've never seen a cop at the intersection of Onewa and Sylvan. They're often 1/2 km up the Sylvan checking speeders.
Its ok to do that so long as you stop twice at the next red light.

[Ixion]

Does that mean that I can run a savings account for traffic lights? So, if I stop a few times at green lights, I've got a stopping credit, and can sail through a few red lights safely?

[spudchucka]

Why the hell not? Everybody else seems to do it!

[Lou Girardin]

So that applies to cages too..............the ones that knock down bikes.

Yea I can just imagine some of the posts if that happened.

Lou you usually get it 'so' right. What happened??


Skyryder

Come and check out the Shore. The light phasing would try the patience of a Saint.
I'm not remotely saintly.

[Lou Girardin]

Its ok to do that so long as you stop twice at the next red light.

Instead of stopping twice, would a stoppie do?
That means you REALLY want to stop.

[Grahameeboy]

No, it just sounded like you don't see much of our national sport.
Traffic light roulette.

Nah don't ya mean "Loudo"

[ZeroIndex]

Instead of stopping twice, would a stoppie do?
That means you REALLY want to stop.
That's just showing off... cops don't like showoffs :rofl:
Then again, doesn't the ability to do stoppies, give one reason to stop-pie at red traffic lights?

[ManDownUnder]

You can speed 'em up (sometimes) by going over and pushing the pdestrian cross button.

Sometimes it cycles through (i.e. you get the green after the pedestrians have "crossed"), but sometimes is reverts back to the original setting - in which case yes... sneak on through.

[Oakie]

Sitting on Cashel St yesterday at the intersection of Fitzgerald Ave on a red light. 3 guys on pushbikes sat there beside me. There was a large gap in the traffic and all three took off across the road (6 lanes for you out of towners) and made it all the way across while the light was still red. Stunned I was!

[Skyryder]

Christchurch is somtimes known as the Redlight city. It's not the hookers but the redlight runners.

Skyryder

[imdying]

It's scarily true... also, we have other different rules down here. Did you know that indicators are optional in Chch?

[Ixion]

They are in Auckland too. I have had this argument with WoF inspectors. So are brake lights.

[Milky]

I don't mind if it is the middle of the night and the bike doesn't trip the sensors, but any other time I think we should wait - what then is the justification for getting angry at bicyclists running red lights, cars rolling through stop signs and so on? Hell it was only a couple of days ago that the lot of you were up in arms about the bicycle issue, and now there is a complete about face.

Hypocrites.

[slopster]

When turning left I like to roll up to a red light, check that its clear, then walk your bike 2 metres across the inside of the corner, mount up and your off. Can't get done for it either (maybe jaywalking?). But you should deffinitely be allowed to turn left on a red light if clear.

[Jackrat]

Okay, so it's 3:30 in the morning and you happen upon a red light. It's stuck on red. You're sitting there on your motorbike in the pooring rain in the middle of winter. Would you;

a) Ring for help and wait until it arrives
b) Leave your bike there with a note and walk home
c) Look both ways and carefully move on

It appears alot of you would choose "a" or "b". You lot deserve the outstanding law abidding citizen award.

Take a good look to make sure no cops are about,then give it a big handfull making sure the rear spins up nicely allowing you to speed way round the left hand corner you were waiting for.
That's not a hyperthetical situation,that's the lights by founders thearter in Hamilton.Can't remember the street names but the lights there won't change for a bike an havn't since at lest 1975.

[Jackrat]

When turning left I like to roll up to a red light, check that its clear, then walk your bike 2 metres across the inside of the corner, mount up and your off. Can't get done for it either (maybe jaywalking?). But you should deffinitely be allowed to turn left on a red light if clear.

You can get done for it,I was.
At those poxy lights by founders theater in BLOODY HAMILTON.:brick: