Could Suzuki do it too?

[merv]

That is could they see the light and get some decent engines supplied to them from the world's greatest engine maker like KR Snr did - put a decent Honda engine in their frame instead of their own stuff? How many years have they been trying to make their bike competitive and their riders still have to kick the shit out of them.

[enigma51]

That is could they see the light and get some decent engines supplied to them from the world's greatest engine maker like KR Snr did - put a decent Honda engine in their frame instead of their own stuff? How many years have they been trying to make their bike competitive and their riders still have to kick the shit out of them.

Look at the superbikes and see a answer. Why they do not have good motogp engine blows me away as well

[onearmedbandit]

Maybe due to the configuration? How many V4 4 stroke engines have Suzuki made? I'm not being smart or anything, but I think that must surely play a part in their problem.

[merv]

Yeah so why didn't they stick with their inline 4, Yamaha did and look how they are doing - mind you without Rossi where would they be?

[Shaun]

Perhaps part of it is budget related, Suzuki is the smallest of the 4 Japanese brands, which means there R+D budget is a lot less than the others.

[onearmedbandit]

Yeah so why didn't they stick with their inline 4, Yamaha did and look how they are doing - mind you without Rossi where would they be?

That I don't know, you'd have to ask them. But when our local racers are getting just over 200 rwhp out of gsxr1000's then it would've been easy for them to get power close to that if not equal to Honda etc.

[Shaun]

Who the heck has told you over 200rwhp in NZ? no way racing the NZ champs has anything over 190, there may be a club bike that is built to that spec, but not in the champs due to our rules, apart from that, no one in NZ could ride over 200rwhp fast around our tracks

[vifferman]

Sorta still on-topic - I couldn't help but laugh when they showed Hoppers kicking the shit outta his Suzook after it carked it, then throwing a wee tantrum, then kicking it some more. Then they cut to the Rizzla Suzooki gargre, to show the mechanics all looking at one another as if to say, "Uh-oh - now we're in trouble. What did we fook up this time?!?"
And then they went to interview Chris Vermuelen, and he was OK to talk, but the team slammed the gargre door shut before they could talk to him.

Understandable frustration on Hopper's part, but still amusing to watch.

[cowpoos]

Who the heck has told you over 200rwhp in NZ? no way racing the NZ champs has anything over 190, there may be a club bike that is built to that spec, but not in the champs due to our rules, apart from that, no one in NZ could ride over 200rwhp fast around our tracks
yer...I was under the impression 180-185 hp was the norm at the top level in NZ...

[Motu]

Dunno if Suzuki are the poor man as far as money goes,but they are certainly poor as far as resourses go.Honda have some serious experiance in racing engines,no one can go back further,and have made some dominant F1 engines too,although their latest F1 program sucks.Yamaha are Toyota's R&D dept,they have made F1 motors too.Suzuki and Kawasaki are also rans,they can do it,but their experiance in high performance 4 strokes is limited.....and no,your GIXER is not a high performance engine.

[Mental Trousers]

The difference in complexity between a V4 and inline 4 are all to do with having to drive 2 different cams and that's it. Otherwise they're essentially the same except things in slightly different places/layouts.

R&D costs involved in MotoGP are huge. Suzuki probably aren't committing enough money to making a winning engine/bike.

Also, nobody on the circuit is able to develop a bike like Rossi can. In the past all of the greats have been people that are exceptional at defining what a bike is doing wrong and how to fix it. Guys like Schwantz, Roberts, Doohan and now Rossi. Suzuki just doesn't have anyone capable of taking their bike to the next level. They've got some really good riders, but nobody sort the bike properly. And with bikes, the rider is 50% of everything.

[cowpoos]

Perhaps part of it is budget related, Suzuki is the smallest of the 4 Japanese brands, which means there R+D budget is a lot less than the others.
kawasakis the smallest of the jap four eh?

[Shaun]

kawasakis the smallest of the jap four eh?

No way, Kawasaki heavy industries make all soughts of stuff, they are a massive company, I believe suzuki's racing budget comes from the sales of there little work related pick up trucks, at least that was where it came from when I raced in Japan in 1990 and 1991 for a Yoshimura satelite team called SUGANO RACING, the owner of this team used to race for POPS YOSHIMURA many moons ago, so I believe my info to be Fact.

[onearmedbandit]

Shaun, maybe I should've verified my info first but it did come first hand from a couple of racers. If I say anymore it would be obvious who I was talking about, and out of respect I will not do that on a public forum. PM me if you want to know where I heard this from.

[Maido]

Usless information: Kawasaki heavy duty industries (and mitsubishi) make weapons guidance systems for military missles
Hence advertisements showing a zxr being chased by a tomohawk missle with the caption "well acutally it is rocket science"
So I imagine some of the big money in weapons filters down to the motorcycle division

[Motu]

GM have a stake in Suzuki....maybe they should try garlic next time.

[cowpoos]

Usless information: Kawasaki heavy duty industries (and mitsubishi) make weapons guidance systems for military missles
Hence advertisements showing a zxr being chased by a tomohawk missle with the caption "well acutally it is rocket science"
So I imagine some of the big money in weapons filters down to the motorcycle division
KHI also make some of the best hydralic pumps avalible....so whats your point???

[slowpoke]

Suzuki are selling ship (shit?) loads of Gixxers on the back of their superbike racing programs so would having a successful MotoGP bike increase sales by that much? Nup. After belting everyone with the RC211V have CBR's been flooding the streets? Nup. Is the R1 the top seller now that Valentino has dragged the M1 into the winners circle? Nup.
I reckon they are applying Honda's own philosophy alah the NR750 and NR500 four stroke GP bike. They are using MotoGP to learn NEW things and think outside their own box, rather than simply applying what they already know.

[cowpoos]

Suzuki are selling ship (shit?) loads of Gixxers on the back of their superbike racing programs so would having a successful MotoGP bike increase sales by that much? Nup. After belting everyone with the RC211V have CBR's been flooding the streets? Nup. Is the R1 the top seller now that Valentino has dragged the M1 into the winners circle? Nup.
I reckon they are applying Honda's own philosophy alah the NR750 and NR500 four stroke GP bike. They are using MotoGP to learn NEW things and think outside their own box, rather than simply applying what they already know.
errr.....that makes sence

[Madness]

kawasakis the smallest of the jap four eh?

Even if that were true, as you know size isn't everything, aye CP?

[cowpoos]

Even if that were true, as you know size isn't everything, aye CP?
thats right....on my lil bike I'ld eassily kick your arse....wanna put a wager on it?

[Maido]

KHI also make some of the best hydralic pumps avalible....so whats your point???

there was no point, thats why I started the post with "usless information"

Anyway, it sounds better that their racing budget is supplied weapons systems than by hydraulic pumps

[suzuki21]

Bernard racings K4 superbike is 191rwhp corrected, Ive seen the dyno sheet. Two years developement on the Dyno has helped, but I do agree about too much power. Brian got slower on it as suspension became an ass. He reckons a more rideable low-mid 180's would be better with our short tracks.
Q:How come suzuki can make such a wicked road bike, and stuff up the GP bike so much!

[suzuki21]

Who the heck has told you over 200rwhp in NZ? no way racing the NZ champs has anything over 190, there may be a club bike that is built to that spec, but not in the champs due to our rules, apart from that, no one in NZ could ride over 200rwhp fast around our tracks

I would be very interested to know who is getting over 200rwhp also. Sounds like a reading with the Dyno temperature probe jammed behind the radiator and uncorrected dreamer horsepower to me:oi-grr:

[gav]

Mat Mladin, 210 apparently :eek:

[Crasherfromwayback]

Who the heck has told you over 200rwhp in NZ? no way racing the NZ champs has anything over 190, there may be a club bike that is built to that spec, but not in the champs due to our rules, apart from that, no one in NZ could ride over 200rwhp fast around our tracks
While that might be the case, sure would be fun trying!
I wouldn't mind betting you'd like a go!!

[Drunken Monkey]

Suzuki do spend a significant amount of resources in the AMA series in the USA, of which they have had significantly more success than in WSB for a long time. We just don't hear so much about it over here.

[Cleve]

Sorta still on-topic - I couldn't help but laugh when they showed Hoppers kicking the shit outta his Suzook after it carked it, then throwing a wee tantrum, then kicking it some more. Then they cut to the Rizzla Suzooki gargre, to show the mechanics all looking at one another as if to say, "Uh-oh - now we're in trouble. What did we fook up this time?!?"
And then they went to interview Chris Vermuelen, and he was OK to talk, but the team slammed the gargre door shut before they could talk to him.

Understandable frustration on Hopper's part, but still amusing to watch.

I was in Qatar for the GP. At the track I talked to a Pom who was staying at the same hotel as the Rizla crew. He said they were on the piss till late at night, the NIGHT BEFORE the GP... now I wonder if that had anything to do with Vermulen's bike blowing up in morning warm up and both bikes failing during the race???!!!