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The Stranger
9th June 2006, 09:05
So it's night time and you are on a country road with no street lights.

How do you know which way the next bend is going go?

You got a choice of left or right so hey there is a 50/50 chance of getting it right.

Most people say look at the small road edge markers. But if that is your answer, what specifically about them do you look for?

Green Bling for the first one to get the correct answer.









The judges (me) decision if final and no correspondence will be entered into. The contest is not open to Boomer or Busa Pete.

SimJen
9th June 2006, 09:09
Isn't it yellow markers one way and white the other?
I just generally use my eyes :)

Wasp
9th June 2006, 09:10
I tend to look for which way the corner goes as this directly relates to which way the bend is going :bleh:

marty
9th June 2006, 09:11
i use the power poles - the almost always follow the road.

except for once. when the posts went over a gully,and the road wound around it.

Finn
9th June 2006, 09:12
Have you tried turning on your lights?

marty
9th June 2006, 09:15
white to the left, double yellow to the right.

i remember when the tamahere flyover was opened, and the north-bound off ramp to the airport was fitted with the markers the wrong way around. acouple of trucks and more than a few cars turned the wrong way onto the grass at speed before they swapped them over.

Blackbird
9th June 2006, 09:17
That is exactly what I'll be doing on the coast road to Coromandel tonight. As you know, there are few edge or centre line markings on that road and the penalty for a mistake is going into the sea:yes: . I adjust my speed until I can actually see where the road goes. Mind you, with 100W xenon bulbs, my transit time isn't much different from daylight.

Fishy
9th June 2006, 09:22
I can see fine with my lights on.

carver
9th June 2006, 09:23
the bikes i ride have lights that are pathetic anyway, so if i ride without lights i hug the centre line, and follow the centre lines, if there are no centre lines and no markers...then i Pray.
ps, always look ahead of the end of the light from your headlight

WickedOne
9th June 2006, 09:30
So it's night time and you are on a country road with no street lights.

How do you know which way the next bend is going go?

You got a choice of left or right so hey there is a 50/50 chance of getting it right.

Most people say look at the small road edge markers. But if that is your answer, what specifically about them do you look for?

Green Bling for the first one to get the correct answer.


The judges (me) decision if final and no correspondence will be entered into. The contest is not open to Boomer or Busa Pete.

White markers on the left hand side of the road and yellow ones on the right side of the road.

The Stranger
9th June 2006, 09:30
I can see fine with my lights on.


So can I, but I can tell far beyond the effective reach of the head light.

Mrs Busa Pete
9th June 2006, 09:32
I can remember this conversation but cant remember what it was but can i have some green bling anyway please please:wavey: :grouphug:

Fishy
9th June 2006, 09:32
So can I, but I can tell far beyond the effective reach of the head light.

You ride with a road map? or GPS :blip:

Ixion
9th June 2006, 09:33
Mr Finn has the only correct answer. It is folly to rely on roadside markings or reflective gadgets, many roads do not have them .And even if they do, that amounts to aiming the bike at a distant gleam and ignoring the fact that you cannot see the road itself. What if there is something on the road between the reflecting marker and the end of the visible road ?

Ride within the range of your headlamp. It is no different whatsoever to riding by day. If you cannot see where the road goes - SLOW DOWN. Sorted.

WickedOne
9th June 2006, 09:34
So can I, but I can tell far beyond the effective reach of the head light.

By only riding roads you know well?

GR81
9th June 2006, 09:39
i avoid riding at night :P

marty
9th June 2006, 09:41
i ride every night, unless it's really cold. i guess it's just what you get used to.

Lou Girardin
9th June 2006, 09:42
Anyone know where I can get night-vision goggles?
Some new cars have a night vision head-up display now, the goggles would be great as long as you don't turn your head at 160 plus.

The Stranger
9th June 2006, 09:42
White markers on the left hand side of the road and yellow ones on the right side of the road.

Close, but no cigar

Squeak the Rat
9th June 2006, 09:45
Sometimes useful if cars travelling the opposite direction illuminate the corner for you.

Night vision goggles? stuff up your depth perception, so you'd need to invest some serious practice time.....


I'm with the "ride within your headlights" group. There's enough gravel, blind corners, cowshit, cows, hedgehogs etc on the roads.......

The Stranger
9th June 2006, 09:48
Mr Finn has the only correct answer. It is folly to rely on roadside markings or reflective gadgets, many roads do not have them .And even if they do, that amounts to aiming the bike at a distant gleam and ignoring the fact that you cannot see the road itself. What if there is something on the road between the reflecting marker and the end of the visible road ?

Ride within the range of your headlamp. It is no different whatsoever to riding by day. If you cannot see where the road goes - SLOW DOWN. Sorted.

I am not saying to rely on this to the exclusion of all else(though in 25 years it hasn't let me down). I am saying to use it as a part of your decision making process. Use it as one of your inputs, not the only one of your inputs.

If it is unavailable to you, sure you are still going to ride, but you adjust your style accordingly.

T.W.R
9th June 2006, 09:50
Actually living in a rural township (smudge on the map:yes:) we've got a grand total of 5 street lights, 3 giveways & 0 stop signs. All travelling at night is in the abo's butt hole blackness, and not all rural bends or intersections are marked or indicated :angry:

A few years ago a local rode a XR600 straight through a Marcrocarpa Hedge because they missed/didn't see the corner (result : 1 severly injured rider & 1 wrecked bike).

So simple rule: ride within the effective reach of the headlight beam

WickedOne
9th June 2006, 09:51
Accordnig to the LTSA

34333

SimJen
9th June 2006, 10:03
Anyone know where I can get night-vision goggles?
Some new cars have a night vision head-up display now, the goggles would be great as long as you don't turn your head at 160 plus.

Night vision is all good, unless someone is coming towards you with their lights on :gob:

SlowHand
9th June 2006, 10:03
You talking about the road markings getting closer as the corner radius reduces or summin?

But why bother all you need is some flashing red LED lights and turbo boost

dun dududun~ duhdudu dun~ dundudududun dun~

T.W.R
9th June 2006, 10:13
Anyone know where I can get night-vision goggles?


these guys have them

www.cabelas.com

Hunting & Fishing out-fitters from the US, basically got anything & everything you can think of :yes:

terbang
9th June 2006, 10:13
The road edge markers (those plastic things with reflectors on them) are on the outside of the corner and their spacing heralds how tight the bend is.
Lou NVG technology is no good for road use as it would bloom every time you had some other light scource. The answer would lie in the Infra red area however I just cant find anywhere to mount the FLIR turret on me Busa..

terbang
9th June 2006, 10:26
Check out this sort of Tecnology it is IR based..EVS (http://www.gulfstream.com/product_enhancement/evs/)

sunhuntin
9th June 2006, 11:08
i hate riding at night in the country!
when i rode to welly one night, i nearly hit the side of every bridge there is! mainly cos thered always be a car coming the other way, blinding me, so id veer to the left [otherwise fixation would see me smushed into the front of said car]
ive got to the stage now that i ride on full and if i know theres a corner coming, plus cars i can see, i stay on full till i can read that corner and know what it is enough to go around it blind...i may as well shut my eyes for all the good it does.
the reflective markers on the side, the markers in the middle plus the paint disappear when im coming up to a car headed towards me. i lose them entirely, unless i look down at my boot to see the paint...thats not a good idea either.

crashe
9th June 2006, 11:19
If you can't see which way the road is going... (left of right) then you are riding too damned fast for the conditions...

So slow down.


Never rely on the markers on the side of the road, as some idiot may have taken out a few the night before in a crash.

Ride to the road conditions.

Biohazard
9th June 2006, 11:22
Night riding options:

1/ Drive a car
2/ Get a taxi
3/ Get someone else to drive you
4/ Stay in
5/ Walk
6/ Get drunk and then a/ walk b/ get a taxi or c/ get a lift

But never go for a blat on ya :scooter: at night...fook that for a game of soldiers.

sunhuntin
9th June 2006, 11:25
If you can't see which way the road is going... (left of right) then you are riding too damned fast for the conditions...

So slow down.


Never rely on the markers on the side of the road, as some idiot may have taken out a few the night before in a crash.


Ride to the road conditions.

i do slow down....lol. usually to about 50 or so...then i get blinded by headlights in my mirrors. either way, ive decided no more night riding till the summer.

Blackbird
9th June 2006, 11:29
Night riding options:

1/ Drive a car
2/ Get a taxi
3/ Get someone else to drive you
4/ Stay in
5/ Walk
6/ Get drunk and then a/ walk b/ get a taxi or c/ get a lift

But never go for a blat on ya :scooter: at night...fook that for a game of soldiers.


Why not? Night riding is really enjoyable when you've done it a few times.

Two Smoker
9th June 2006, 11:32
White posts, with a red strip and white reflector on the left, White post and red strip on the right UNLESS its a left hand corner where the will be a yellow reflector... (I think???)

The Stranger
9th June 2006, 11:58
Ok No green bling.

If the next bend curves left the right hand side road maker posts will have a yellow reflector then a space and a second yellow reflector vertically.

If the next bend is right the left hand side road marker posts will have a single long white reflector the same length as the yellow ones described above.

And yes they can very often be seen well beyond the effective range of the headlight.

WickedOne
9th June 2006, 12:03
Ok No green bling.

If the next bend curves left the right hand side road maker posts will have a yellow reflector then a space and a second yellow reflector vertically.

If the next bend is right the left hand side road marker posts will have a single long white reflector the same length as the yellow ones described above.

And yes they can very often be seen well beyond the effective range of the headlight.

Sweet as, I'll bare that in mind next time I ride in the dark!!!!

Ixion
9th June 2006, 12:04
,,

But never go for a blat on ya :scooter: at night...fook that for a game of soldiers.


Why ever not? Night riding is a piece of piss now that one no longer has to worry about the wind bloiwing out the acetylene flame.

Turn on headlamp. Ride as normal. What is so difficult?

I am constantly astonished by the number of riders and drivers who do not ride/drive at night: do not ride in the rain: do not ride in the wind : do not ride etc etc.

What happens if you are out on a ride and are delayed. So by the time you come home it is night? And rain has started to fall ? Do you abandon the bike?

I have always maintained that it should not be possible to obtain al licence without demonstrating competancy at riding/driving at night.

Jonty
9th June 2006, 12:18
Ok No green bling.

If the next bend curves left the right hand side road maker posts will have a yellow reflector then a space and a second yellow reflector vertically.

If the next bend is right the left hand side road marker posts will have a single long white reflector the same length as the yellow ones described above.

And yes they can very often be seen well beyond the effective range of the headlight.

And you expect me to put my life in the hands of a council worker who may not know the difference between horizontal and vertical? No thanks, I prefer to slow down....

Motu
9th June 2006, 12:40
The night riding I do the roads often have no markers at all,I've been led astray often by mapping out the road beyond my headlamp in my mind....sometimes the road doesn't go where you think it should! Here's a tip - ever notice how many one lane bridges have a sharp turn at one end? So if you have a straight entry onto a one lane bridge get ready for a sharp turn at the other side.

On my XLV750 I mounted twin driving lamps,I could reach down and pivot them out to give a better side view and see deeper into corners than the headlamp - pity the electrics couldn't cope with the drain.

idb
9th June 2006, 12:43
To be a kNight Rider you first need the Kit..................

The Stranger
9th June 2006, 12:49
And you expect me to put my life in the hands of a council worker who may not know the difference between horizontal and vertical? No thanks, I prefer to slow down....

No. as per any piece of information which comes your way, I expect you to observe and if you find it helpful use it for what it is worth to you.

I have spent the last 25yrs looking for an exception to this rule and haven't found one yet, and I drive a lot of miles.
But I would not put my life on the line for it, no way.

It is like travelling along a road with cars parked on the LHS. You watch the cars, you look for a person sitting in the car, you look to see if the motor is running (if you can see the exhaust), you look for the head turn and watch the wheel to see if it moves. Maybe you cover the brake and back off the throttle, maybe you don't. Last thing you want is a dick to pull a U turn in front of you. You employ a lot of observations to make your decisions. What I am advocating is simply one more.

WickedOne
9th June 2006, 12:54
i do slow down....lol. usually to about 50 or so...then i get blinded by headlights in my mirrors. either way, ive decided no more night riding till the summer.

My only suggestion would be to try riding a quiet country road that you know very well. There are some roads that I ride at night which I could probably ride blindfolded. After riding the same roads over and over in the dark you will become a lot more confident.

If you get blinded from behind pull over if you really can't see, just wave the person behind you past.

Jonty
9th June 2006, 12:58
No. as per any piece of information which comes your way, I expect you to observe and if you find it helpful use it for what it is worth to you.

I have spent the last 25yrs looking for an exception to this rule and haven't found one yet, and I drive a lot of miles.
But I would not put my life on the line for it, no way.

It is like travelling along a road with cars parked on the LHS. You watch the cars, you look for a person sitting in the car, you look to see if the motor is running (if you can see the exhaust), you look for the head turn and watch the wheel to see if it moves. Maybe you cover the brake and back off the throttle, maybe you don't. Last thing you want is a dick to pull a U turn in front of you. You employ a lot of observations to make your decisions. What I am advocating is simply one more.


I agree with the point you make. I suppose what I am concerned with is that people rely on it 100% and what it doesn't do is give you corner angle etc. If you are using it in conjunction with other rules then it may be useful in setting up for the corner early.

One feature of the new lexus is the automatic headlights. I wonder if any bike manufacturers have considered making the headlights of a bike tilt up in corners. With the lean angle it will actually allow the headlight to line up with the corner. Surely a small pivot and computer would not be too heavy?

WickedOne
9th June 2006, 13:19
I agree with the point you make. I suppose what I am concerned with is that people rely on it 100% and what it doesn't do is give you corner angle etc. If you are using it in conjunction with other rules then it may be useful in setting up for the corner early.

One feature of the new lexus is the automatic headlights. I wonder if any bike manufacturers have considered making the headlights of a bike tilt up in corners. With the lean angle it will actually allow the headlight to line up with the corner. Surely a small pivot and computer would not be too heavy?

Think this could be a bit heavy, you would probably need some sort of gyroscopic mechanism considering the constant leaning in and out of corners as well.

Hotchefnz
9th June 2006, 13:37
IXion never a truer word spoken - in wainuiomata on the moores valley road theres a piece where u can see the reflectors up ahead only problem is there is a sharp u bend between them and the point you look at them, has a dip in front many a cager and bike has gone straight ahead into the gully.

Biohazard
9th June 2006, 15:42
To be a kNight Rider you first need the Kit..................

roflmao - surprised no one noticed this little gem of a post.

Night riding, for me way too dangerous tbh im always knackered come night fall......not enough concentration left in the ole headtop. I agree it is fun on a nice warm summers evening to have a nice blat having a laugh.....

Bugger it..

U TURN

Mmmmmmmmmmmm summer night rides....

Bewarned user changes his mind like the weather :blip:

Blackbird
9th June 2006, 15:46
roflmao - surprised no one noticed this little gem of a post.

Night riding, for me way too dangerous tbh im always knackered come night fall......not enough concentration left in the ole headtop. I agree it is fun on a nice warm summers evening to have a nice blat having a laugh.....

Bugger it..

U TURN

Mmmmmmmmmmmm summer night rides....

Bewarned user changes his mind like the weather :blip:

My concentration has been waning all bloody day. Not good with a 200 km night ride coming up in 2 hours - must have strong coffee!!!

Edbear
9th June 2006, 16:26
The Road Code says to never outdrive your headlight range, and that you must be able to stop within half the visible distance. Obvious, really, - if you can't see where you're going, slow down or stop.:doobey:

boomer
9th June 2006, 17:29
That paticular night i was leading, it was pissin down, i had my old helmet on which was usless, i was frozen solid and my teeth chattering, fogged up visor and i couldn't see shit on roads i wasn't that familiar with.. if i'd slowed down any more i'd have been busted for going too slow; i think i was already doing 50 in a 100 :cry:

cAn i have green bling too.. :yes:

i learnt a new trick thanks to Noel that night... :first:

APPLE
9th June 2006, 18:45
dont like nite riding,had a bad experiance one nite,and that was it for me man.to close.......:gob:

sunhuntin
9th June 2006, 19:04
My only suggestion would be to try riding a quiet country road that you know very well. There are some roads that I ride at night which I could probably ride blindfolded. After riding the same roads over and over in the dark you will become a lot more confident.

If you get blinded from behind pull over if you really can't see, just wave the person behind you past.

yeh....i tried riding my nearest country roads [bout 5 mins away] and nearly wound up in a ditch cos i misjudged the corner. second time i tried that, heading back towards town, car coming with a car following. second made to overtake the first and blocked my lane. i dont know what happened, but he seemed to pull back in, and i left a skid mark as long as the bike.
i know the road between here and sanson well, as i usually ride to palmy and back each week [to give the bike a run :blip:] but even that one caught me out in the dark.

in saying that, i will ride in any conditions, but rain at night would not be preferable. i would likely look at the sky before going, and if it looks like rain, wouldnt go if i was going to be home late.

White trash
9th June 2006, 20:06
What do you do when the headlights pointing way up into the fricken sky and nowhere near the road?

You don't wanna stand up and peer over the front of the bike, I'll tell ya that.

Free Rider
9th June 2006, 20:24
Yeah i tend to turn on my head lights and look.. since im a "good boy i only go 70 kmph" so i can see my corners easily.. i also use those relection things on side of the road.

sunhuntin
9th June 2006, 21:27
What do you do when the headlights pointing way up into the fricken sky and nowhere near the road?

You don't wanna stand up and peer over the front of the bike, I'll tell ya that.

need to adjust the level of your bulb...dont ask me how cos i wouldnt know!

do you get a good view of the stars?

XP@
11th June 2006, 10:11
Some bikes have their headlight attached to the frame, others to the forks.

In both cases there are times when your lights are just not pointed in the right direction. Expecially if, like motu, you are on a back country road with no markers.

Added bonus on these roads is that they are often so twisty that the bit of road you think is just ahead is still three corners away. Fields track just off the paraparas is a prime example.

If you are going to do a lot of km's after dark then look at running lights... maybe they will help? I've never added them but on many occasions wanted too.

scracha
12th June 2006, 22:01
What do you do when the headlights pointing way up into the fricken sky and nowhere near the road?

Elbow the fat pillion off the back? Seriously though, just adjust your headlight.

Also, the Philips Vision Plus bulbs are meant to be 50% brighter than standard...I found them about twice as bright as the OEM Yamaha ones.

I actually LIKE night riding. I find it relaxing [1]. Plus you can see the idiot cagers on side roads etc (assuming they're not driving about with headlights off).


If you are going to do a lot of km's after dark then look at running lights... maybe they will help? I've never added them but on many occasions wanted too.
No use whatsoever for riding at night apart from being seen by cagers more easily.

[*1] Maybe due to the fact I can't see all the dodgy shiny surfaces and gravel on the roads?

ldnz
18th June 2006, 22:56
i know the road between here and sanson well, as i usually ride to palmy and back each week [to give the bike a run :blip:] but even that one caught me out in the dark.

in saying that, i will ride in any conditions, but rain at night would not be preferable. i would likely look at the sky before going, and if it looks like rain, wouldnt go if i was going to be home late.

There isn't a single corner between wanganui and palmerston that couldn't be(and I haven't at some stage) done at 140 plus without any trouble at all. Its the areas most boring stretch of road. I do it once/twice per week, nearly always at night or very early in morning wet or dry. Oh and a pox on the cops that pull me over (without a reason?) and then just want to have a chat... that happened twice last week about 10km norwest of bulls.

The Halcom (sp?) road is a shady one though, I went through that for the first time a couple of nights ago in the rain. Very hairy as many edge markers were missing (or I couldn't see them!) and I had a new back tire.

sunhuntin
20th June 2006, 20:29
There isn't a single corner between wanganui and palmerston that couldn't be(and I haven't at some stage) done at 140 plus without any trouble at all. Its the areas most boring stretch of road. I do it once/twice per week, nearly always at night or very early in morning wet or dry. Oh and a pox on the cops that pull me over (without a reason?) and then just want to have a chat... that happened twice last week about 10km norwest of bulls.

The Halcom (sp?) road is a shady one though, I went through that for the first time a couple of nights ago in the rain. Very hairy as many edge markers were missing (or I couldn't see them!) and I had a new back tire.

yeh...i rarely slow down on corners when riding anywhere during the day, unless it has been/is raining. but that road is a totally different kettle of fish at night for me. that corner with the calico creations thing on it...between turakina and bulls...first time i went that way at night, must have been icy or something as my back end stepped out, and i know that bit has no little dips or anything to warrent a move like that....thought it was oil or something but not so sure.
where abouts is halcom road? i dont know the names of the road sections very well.
when daylight saving reverses itself, i will start doing evening rides when i can, so i can get used to it in fading light. i need to learn to ride at night without becoming a deer in the headlights.

i think those road markers may have been scattered outside the wangas burger king...heading home from work, nearly hit one in the middle of my lane, and another 2 on the footpath. kicked the road one as far to the side as i could.

diggydog
20th June 2006, 21:03
[QUOTE=SimJen]Isn't it yellow markers one way and white the other?I WOULD SAY YOU ARE CORRECT ON THAT, BUT CANT REMEMBER WITCH WAY LEFT OR RIGHT, NIGHT RIDING IS SAFER THAN DAY RIDING IF YOU ARE GOING FOR IT.:scooter:

ldnz
20th June 2006, 23:49
Weird - I guess that would give you a scare. I can't think of anything out there so it may well have been oil.

Halcombe is sorta midway between bulls and fielding, sometimes I head out through Fielding to Halcombe (its sign posted as you mosey through fielding). The first part is pretty wide and looked after, but the corners are fun and i've never seen a cop out there. From Halcombe you can either head north and rejoin onto SH1 slightly north of bulls, or cut across to Mt Stewart(?) just south of sanson. Both ways there are some fun corners and it certainly adds a bit of interest to the otherwise boring ride. I wouldn't recommend doing it at night first time round, i've seen quite a bit of traffic at nights through there and most cars give it heaps.

sunhuntin
21st June 2006, 12:23
Weird - I guess that would give you a scare. I can't think of anything out there so it may well have been oil.

Halcombe is sorta midway between bulls and fielding, sometimes I head out through Fielding to Halcombe (its sign posted as you mosey through fielding). The first part is pretty wide and looked after, but the corners are fun and i've never seen a cop out there. From Halcombe you can either head north and rejoin onto SH1 slightly north of bulls, or cut across to Mt Stewart(?) just south of sanson. Both ways there are some fun corners and it certainly adds a bit of interest to the otherwise boring ride. I wouldn't recommend doing it at night first time round, i've seen quite a bit of traffic at nights through there and most cars give it heaps.

yeh...it just sorta woke up me a bit....by the time i realised the back end had slipped, it was gone and all was fine. wasnt raining either, so dunno what it was.

ok, gotcha....havent been to fielding enough to know the roads yet....generally once i get into fielding i wind up getting lost, so spend the rest of my time trying to find out how to get out again. lmfao.

grandpa_dave
22nd June 2006, 11:43
Night riding is pretty sweet on country roads although a little tip for those wearing tinted visors, even if you think you will be home before dark, on a long ride carry a clear visor anyway. You can usually fit them somewhere.
Had to ride from Thames back to Hamilton one night with my dark visor because a coro loop got started a little late and went a bit long.
The ride was slow and strenuous and I was buggered afterwards, although it was a learning experience and I am more confident at night because of it I think.

buellbabe
22nd June 2006, 12:09
..Turn on headlamp. Ride as normal. What is so difficult?

I am constantly astonished by the number of riders and drivers who do not ride/drive at night: do not ride in the rain: do not ride in the wind : do not ride etc etc.
....

Yeah I agree, its pretty simple, ride to the conditions... I had a nightmare ride home from Whangamata one nite and the sole reason for that was because my visor was so scratched up that I couldn't see shit... if I pushed it up out of the way it was no better cos it was pissing down...:doh:
So as well as all the other excellent advice given I highly recommend having a pristine visor when riding at night...

Unforgiven
27th June 2006, 12:57
Up here in northland its not the way the bend goes thats the problem.
Its the bloody great pothole mid-corner that you dont see till the last second! :shit:

petesmeats
28th June 2006, 10:19
Night riding, for me way too dangerous tbh im always knackered come night fall......not enough concentration left in the ole headtop. I agree it is fun on a nice warm summers evening to have a nice blat having a laugh.....



Yeah i have the same problem but i have found that a point of P and im raring to go....

Na in all seriousness i find it quite fun riding in the dark... As long as i can layer up enough to keep the cold out.... Go up the Port hills and stop at a lookout and you get a good view of the city... Providing you choose the one day of the year that there is no smog. Only thing is watching out for boy racers up there:angry: ... Generally if i see people coming i slow down and make sure that im well out the way of them and leave my headlight on full beam.

As to riding with people coming the other way with headlights i use the left hand white line To help me know where i am on the road and generally just hug that.... And slow right down.

sunhuntin
1st July 2006, 21:14
ldnz...think i figured out what made my backend step out....went to porirua yesterday...you know that calico and creations thing on the corner there? its next to a turn off to marton, closer to bulls. that bit of road is very shaded in the morning, and it was wet yesterday....light enough to see this time. was wet the whole way through that corner....

ldnz
2nd July 2006, 17:13
Ah yeah that will do it. Had a damp run through paikak hill this morning and Matt was bitching about sliding all over the place. Gotta be really careful in winter, thinking about where the sun gets to

sunhuntin
2nd July 2006, 18:34
yep, that is true...i think some sections of road never truly dry out over the winter...they seem to be in shade almost all day. bein able to see the damp makes things heaps easier!!

paikak, thats down welly way? when is the corner they are redoing meant to be finished? [its on the 10k no passing bit of coastak road.]

ldnz
2nd July 2006, 21:14
Yeah Paikak hill is the road thats runs from Paikakariki (sp?) across to Pahatahunui (again sp?). Its where (the only place?) 150cc 2strokes are king!

The bit of SH1 they are working on hasn't changed in a long time. Progress seems pretty slow, though I don't go past often enough to know really whats being done.

sunhuntin
3rd July 2006, 19:51
Yeah Paikak hill is the road thats runs from Paikakariki (sp?) across to Pahatahunui (again sp?). Its where (the only place?) 150cc 2strokes are king!

The bit of SH1 they are working on hasn't changed in a long time. Progress seems pretty slow, though I don't go past often enough to know really whats being done.

havent ridden that hill...must get on to it one day when ive got time to mess around on new roads!!

slopster
3rd July 2006, 23:02
I love night riding. Go out in the early hours of the morning and there is no traffic. I've got two 50 Watt halogen spotlights mounted on my helmet with velcro. They are wired to the high beams on a relay so that they only go on with the high beam. They are excellent on windy back roads because they point exactly where you are looking and allow you to look around the corners where the headlights don't point. Only problem is they start creating a lot of drag at 160 and hurt your neck at 200.

Zapf
3rd July 2006, 23:37
I've got two 50 Watt halogen spotlights mounted on my helmet with velcro. They are wired to the high beams on a relay so that they only go on with the high beam.

Is this for real?

ldnz
3rd July 2006, 23:50
i'd love to see a pic of that! I don't think my bike could power anything extra, and its headlight is remarkably good. But wow, to have 2 extra halogens....

Sunhuntin - gotta ride that hill sometime, its just sooo much fun!

sAsLEX
4th July 2006, 08:31
Anyone know where I can get night-vision goggles?
Some new cars have a night vision head-up display now, the goggles would be great as long as you don't turn your head at 160 plus.

No they dont! They have infrared which is different!



On my XLV750 I mounted twin driving lamps,I could reach down and pivot them out to give a better side view and see deeper into corners than the headlamp - pity the electrics couldn't cope with the drain.

You could always rewind the stator with a bit heavier wire and a few more turns!


Think this could be a bit heavy, you would probably need some sort of gyroscopic mechanism considering the constant leaning in and out of corners as well.

Gyros are getting rather cheap these days, alot of cars already have them in them, plus the system would not need to be too heavy with the actuators acting on the reflectors within the headlight arrangement rather than moving the whole thing it would only weight a few hunred gramms all up! Not much on a big tourer thats likely to get something like that!

sunhuntin
4th July 2006, 11:59
i'd love to see a pic of that! I don't think my bike could power anything extra, and its headlight is remarkably good. But wow, to have 2 extra halogens....

Sunhuntin - gotta ride that hill sometime, its just sooo much fun!

your only 45 mins away from me [depending on head wind, lol] should make a blast down that way one day...could be interesting.

Zapf
4th July 2006, 14:52
I am quite keen on developing some sort of cornering lights for motorcycles, after riding back from NP at night... not being able to see thru corners are not fun.

There is 2 general ways of doing this.

1.) Mechnical / Gravity. Keeping everything simple and use some sort of gravity / direction change + weights thing to alter the lights.
Potential material would be Nylon6 and Nylon bearing. Using Hella Micro DE fog lights.

2.) Electronic / Servos. Using either tilt / G / gyro sensors. which in turn works the servos altering the angle and direction the lights are pointing.

Looking for potenial partners in creating something for sale.

sAsLEX
4th July 2006, 15:13
2.) Electronic / Servos. Using either tilt / G / gyro sensors. which in turn works the servos altering the angle and direction the lights are pointing.

Looking for potenial partners in creating something for sale.



Gyros are getting rather cheap these days, alot of cars already have them in them, plus the system would not need to be too heavy with the actuators acting on the reflectors within the headlight arrangement rather than moving the whole thing it would only weight a few hunred gramms all up! Not much on a big tourer thats likely to get something like that!

Wouldnt be too hard for a uni student to do! Or someone like Allun!

Depends how trick you want it though, setting up a pair of auxillary lights on turrets say would be fairly simple, compared to making a design that altered the shape of the internal reflectors of the head lamp/

Zapf
4th July 2006, 15:35
Wouldnt be too hard for a uni student to do! Or someone like Allun!

Depends how trick you want it though, setting up a pair of auxillary lights on turrets say would be fairly simple, compared to making a design that altered the shape of the internal reflectors of the head lamp/

if its servo rotated then even 1 light will do. Have it mounted close to the center line of the bike. Which keeps the power draw down.

Just need a tilt sensor (http://www.frederickscom.com/products/tilt_overview.html) interfaced with 1 servo, and then it should be possible to link the servo and light using a link similar to a steering damper.

Any Uni student you recommend? think Allun is going to get a PM soon :)

one of these might be better? (http://www.frederickscom.com/products/pdf/0729-1723.pdf)

XP@
4th July 2006, 16:08
The problem with lean angle or bar movement is that you want to see round the corner beore you commit to it.

How about a sensor which detects your head movement. This tech is quite easy, and has been round for years. Just add it to a servo and you light follows your gaze. Unfortunatly getting the light far enough forward and free of obsticles to handle a hairpin would be a tough one. the only way round that would be to head mount a light.

Would some High output led's on the lid be enough to give something more than black in the unlit area? The Police version of the Shoei flip up lid has a led built in, but I guess this is more like a torch for when they are filling in the tax collection forms. This is works for the brake light, but not the head light:
http://www.challengermotors.co.nz/Web-Pages/helmet_stop_light.htm

Another really useful thing would be the ability for the light to change focus depending on speed (wide = slow, narrow = fast)

Warr
4th July 2006, 16:11
Depends how trick you want it though, setting up a pair of auxillary lights on turrets say would be fairly simple, compared to making a design that altered the shape of the internal reflectors of the head lamp/
I'm with Saslex on this one... Auxillary lights. Saw some of the guys on the Grand Challenge with a pair mounted each side last year.
To get an intelligent answer out gyro with all the forces going on during cornering mm. Ok.. well some tilt information could control a servo all stuck inbehind the headlight?? Guess I'd be interested in what someone could build :)

Zapf
4th July 2006, 16:19
The problem with lean angle or bar movement is that you want to see round the corner beore you commit to it.

How about a sensor which detects your head movement. This tech is quite easy, and has been round for years.

Another really useful thing would be the ability for the light to change focus depending on speed (wide = slow, narrow = fast)

yes this is quite correct. I was just thinking about it too. Question... how do you detect head movement?

re focus... this would require optics... $$$ ?

XP@
4th July 2006, 16:47
yes this is quite correct. I was just thinking about it too. Question... how do you detect head movement?
a sensor on the dash / bars area and 2 or 3 stickers on your lid.
still think it would be easier to attach a headlight to your lid.
it may need to be plugged in but it would offer the best directional beam (even a small light pointed in the right direction is better than a thousand watts pointed away from you.)


re focus... this would require optics... $$$ ?

if you had a 2 light system then you could lift and centre the beams for higher speeds.

sAsLEX
4th July 2006, 17:08
how do you detect head movement?


optical Recognition more than likely, small camera pointing back at your noggin from the headstock are, good thing is with a nice easyily distinguished shape such as a helmet or the stiker mention by XP is the processing would be alot easier! But now we are getting expensive....

A little micro to watch the lean angle turn etc could tell how much/rate of turn and sweep the light in front of that ie sense what your doing and predict your next move by working out the gradient of the last few measurements and following that through..... would be cheaper than cameras etc

Could use a little bluetooth sender in the helmet linked to a rate gyro thing up there to measure you head twisting and send that back down to the light and have one on the bike to isolate the rider from the bike movements to find where the head is pointing

many options!

slopster
4th July 2006, 17:47
Yeah heres a photo of my helmet mounted lighting. They are 50watt halogen bulbs like you would use for interior lighting but I had to order them in with a 10 degree beam (standard bulbs ar 30 or 45 degrees). Mounted in pvc pipes with velcro to helmet. They are good for normal riding but when you start hanging off the bike in corners the wiring can get caught between you and the bike. What I really need is a curly cord like a phone cord which self retracts. It has to be able to handle about 8 amps. Anyone got any ideas where I could get a heavy duty curly cord.

sAsLEX
4th July 2006, 18:43
Yeah heres a photo of my helmet mounted lighting. They are 50watt halogen bulbs like you would use for interior lighting but I had to order them in with a 10 degree beam (standard bulbs ar 30 or 45 degrees). Mounted in pvc pipes with velcro to helmet. They are good for normal riding but when you start hanging off the bike in corners the wiring can get caught between you and the bike. What I really need is a curly cord like a phone cord which self retracts. It has to be able to handle about 8 amps. Anyone got any ideas where I could get a heavy duty curly cord.

ahh they are 12 volt aint they! Be important to check the ability of ones power system before adding.

The first year engineers at Auckland Uni had to develop a system to attach a camera to a helmet, will find out what the winning design was as it could be used for some lights, with thier permission of course.

Then its just getting a slightly more professional housing for them out of plastic, and finding that suitable cord


curly cord here http://www.surplustronics.co.nz/shop/product-PW0054.html

slopster
4th July 2006, 19:07
I'd be supprised if they draw much more than heated grips and I haven't heard of charging system failures due to these

thehollowmen
4th July 2006, 19:18
And people think the bugeyed V-Strom looks silly.

I put in some HID lights (H4 draw 65W 55W output equivilent: 130W and 110W) and when I put it on highbeam it is like riding in the day.

sAsLEX
4th July 2006, 19:19
I'd be supprised if they draw much more than heated grips and I haven't heard of charging system failures due to these

100W is a touch more than heated grips at a rough guess!


There site confirms they draw under 2A which is rouch as guts 24W those lights draw 8.33A

sAsLEX
4th July 2006, 19:25
And people think the bugeyed V-Strom looks silly.

I put in some HID lights (H4 draw 65W 55W output equivilent: 130W and 110W) and when I put it on highbeam it is like riding in the day.

aftermarket HID are illegal, only OEM are allowed

thehollowmen
4th July 2006, 19:29
aftermarket HID are illegal, only OEM are allowed

I asked about it and got passed on it just fine.

at full beam, everything in 90 odd degree arc has high lighting, everything in about 160 degrees has a low level of lighting.

And about 30 degrees or something up.

Brent_B says there is a fact sheet on the LTSA website.. I'll go looking.
EDIT: I'm running halogens, not HIDs. but yes, 110 and 130 W respectivly.

slopster
4th July 2006, 19:34
Yeah fair enough I'm supprised heated grips are only 2A. Anyway my alternator is rated to 27A @ 6000rpm. I don't know how much the ignition system draws but the lighting is well withen these limits.

sAsLEX
4th July 2006, 19:35
EDIT: I'm running halogens, not HIDs. but yes, 110 and 130 W respectivly.

HID are the bad ones for some reason from what I read about them, only in the LTSA eyes though


EDIT: was half right



from http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/vehicles/get-your-lights-right.html
High intensity discharge (HID) conversion kits

HID conversion kits (an HID bulb with a high voltage power unit or ‘ballast’ which fits into the original headlamp unit in place of the original bulb with no change to the headlamp lens, reflector or housing) are illegal on any vehicle being used on New Zealand roads.

However, a complete halogen headlamp unit can be replaced with a complete HID headlamp unit provided that the replacement headlamp unit complies with approved standards. If in doubt, get advice from a vehicle lighting retailer you trust.

soundbeltfarm
4th July 2006, 19:50
What do you do when the headlights pointing way up into the fricken sky and nowhere near the road?

You don't wanna stand up and peer over the front of the bike, I'll tell ya that.


In your case you might want to ease off the go fast handle a bit and let the front wheel come back down to earth.

What is it like when you doing a wheelstand at night?

Zapf
4th July 2006, 21:36
optical Recognition more than likely, small camera pointing back at your noggin from the headstock are, good thing is with a nice easyily distinguished shape such as a helmet or the stiker mention by XP is the processing would be alot easier! But now we are getting expensive....

A little micro to watch the lean angle turn etc could tell how much/rate of turn and sweep the light in front of that ie sense what your doing and predict your next move by working out the gradient of the last few measurements and following that through..... would be cheaper than cameras etc

Could use a little bluetooth sender in the helmet linked to a rate gyro thing up there to measure you head twisting and send that back down to the light and have one on the bike to isolate the rider from the bike movements to find where the head is pointing

many options!

Re helmet direction detection.. How about 1 x IR sender mounted on the bike pointed at the helmet with 2 reciever each tuned to recieve polarised IR light of a different plane. Mount 2 x IR reflective sticker that also has a polarised film at different plans on each side of helmet. Then you'll have a signal that shows which direction the helmet is pointed at.

Anyone on KB know enough about light polarisation to confirm if this has a chance of working?

ldnz
4th July 2006, 21:47
Re the tilting turret idea, i'd have a lash at it. Figure an accelerometer being used to measure tilt, a picaxe 08m and a servo. Shouldn't be too difficult, though I've had a barstard of a time keeping a picaxe going on my bike, despite having built the most robust powersupply I could easily do. Pity i'm outa here in 2 weeks, it could be a fun project.

ldnz
4th July 2006, 21:49
Stuff doing head tracking - too much processing to do. Maybe you could start with those TrackIR thingys that gamers use though. Pretty much a webcam with some IR Leds and a bit of filtering, plus some interesting image processing.

Zapf
4th July 2006, 22:26
Re the tilting turret idea, i'd have a lash at it. Figure an accelerometer being used to measure tilt, a picaxe 08m and a servo. Shouldn't be too difficult, though I've had a barstard of a time keeping a picaxe going on my bike, despite having built the most robust powersupply I could easily do. Pity i'm outa here in 2 weeks, it could be a fun project.

keeping in mind I don't think I know anywhere as much about electronics as you do. Re power supplies, won't something like a solid state transformer thing that they use for notebook computers be good?

Zapf
4th July 2006, 22:30
Re the tilting turret idea, i'd have a lash at it. Figure an accelerometer being used to measure tilt, a picaxe 08m and a servo. Shouldn't be too difficult, though I've had a barstard of a time keeping a picaxe going on my bike, despite having built the most robust powersupply I could easily do. Pity i'm outa here in 2 weeks, it could be a fun project.

FYI the servo can rotate the light source as well, instead of moving it about on its axis. when used with Hella Micro DE Fog patten lights (http://www.rallylights.com/hella/hella%20images/Micro_DE_Fog_Pattern.jpg)

ldnz
4th July 2006, 22:34
Initial thought is too much drama. Though yes I would probably need to try a switchmode/transformer isolated supply soon.

The current theory is based around zener's on input and output, lots of large caps, 3 pin regulators, lots of tinfoil shielding and fuses on bloody everything. With this I can get my datalogger to hold up for up to 10 mins, but when I heavily brake there must be a fair bit of noise from the ignition and it packs up.

Anyway - I just fitted up my KR with a radar detector yay! Its a POS uniden, but i've already made it infinitly more useful by building a new set of lights that sit on the edge of my screen (the radar is out of sight) and logicing it so that it only displays Ka band alerts. Blasted through town an hour ago, picked up 3 cops from miles out, while I was in traffic and no false alerts yet. Not bad for $40 me thinks.

ldnz
4th July 2006, 22:37
You can do damn near anything with a couple of servos. That would be the (relatively) easy part. The hard parts will be mounting the lights/building the turret, and getting the accelerometer interfaced to the microcontroller and providing useful readings. I doubt that could be too difficult, but I haven't had the luxury of playing with an accelerometer yet.

Control code is easy and quick if you used something like a Picaxe, they are cheap ($6?) easy to get ahold of and very very easy to program. They would be plenty fast and powerful enough to handle a job like this.

XP@
4th July 2006, 23:39
Was searching for some other stuff and came up with this...
robotics programming...
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyID=66d1363e-36a4-46be-ad36-01bcfbfb4969&DisplayLang=en

XP@
4th July 2006, 23:43
Yeah heres a photo of my helmet mounted lighting. They are 50watt halogen bulbs like you would use for interior lighting but I had to order them in with a 10 degree beam (standard bulbs ar 30 or 45 degrees). Mounted in pvc pipes with velcro to helmet. They are good for normal riding but when you start hanging off the bike in corners the wiring can get caught between you and the bike. What I really need is a curly cord like a phone cord which self retracts. It has to be able to handle about 8 amps. Anyone got any ideas where I could get a heavy duty curly cord.
Yup, along those lines.
I would be willing to give one a test ride in October (going for my 4th Grand Challenge).