How long does it take to learn to ride a sprot bike [Archive]

Lazy7

16th June 2006, 20:20

okay - opening myself up here for a bit of abuse here. undoubtedly.

But - I dont seem to be getting any better at riding. I just plain suck at it. I think its a confidence thing mainly. i just dont back myself into the corners. And dont trust that if i go too fast or go too far over in a corner - i am going to get out the otherside in one piece.

So - what can I do? It being winter doesn't help. I crap myself everytime I go out on a wet road.

I was thinking of getting a cheap bucket bike and going out and doing some go-cart racing. might be a good way to gain a bit of confidence.

anybody got anymore ideas? cause i am sitting on an ex-superbike and its just plain wasted on me.

you think some people are just plain destined not to ever get the hang of it?

White trash

16th June 2006, 20:27

Start off little. I went A50, GT250, MVX250, RGV250, X7, RGV250, GSXR400, GSXR750, RM250, GSXR600, GSXR1000, minimoto, 110cc pit bike.

Without being able to handle the littlies, you'll never master the Superbike.

SlowHand

16th June 2006, 20:27

100hp is too much for you. Ask winja for a private tuition on his street magic.

:nya: Im perfick/.

EDIT: ah, Mr white trash, I went from RG150 to a 125cc Pit bike. therein lies my troubles. perhaps i should hurt myself first on a 105cc (i heard you were purdy good roider)

SwanTiger

16th June 2006, 20:28

Wanna buy my Hyosung Andrew?

You'll learn so much and be absoloutely frustrated with the lack of power that within 5 months you'll be looking for a bigger bike.

N4CR

16th June 2006, 20:29

OKay dude there are a few threads on this search confidence I have said to get into a carpark without ya fairings and do figure 8's around obstacles many a time. You lean over more and more untill it will start sliding or else you'll scrape something probably won't on the 7r they have better peg height than the 2r etc lol.

I used to spend hours doing that a week for a long time made me much more confident, also who you ride with helps if you ride with someone quicker than you then you will push yaself to follow them..

Something like this ;)

http://www.bikepics.com/pictures/599285/

imdying

16th June 2006, 20:30

Darkman

16th June 2006, 20:33

Just ask some of the better riders out there to give you some tips. And go ride with them. I just spend a few hours with Uncle B the other day and learnt alot from him in just a few hours. Already starting to take corners better and its good cause they can see where you are going wrong and point it out to you.
I had the same problem with.confidence...One of the main things I was doing wrong in the beginning, was to look straight in front of the bike and not far ahead and that made everything look so much faster, so I backed off a lot everytime I entered a corner..now I look further ahead and way better.
Also if you follow some of the experienced riders youll see that they take way beter lines that make it easier and you dont have to tip in that hard.

Badcat

16th June 2006, 20:36

chickenfunkstar

16th June 2006, 20:37

I'd just get there and stop worring about things. If you keep focousing on the negatives, you'll be expecting to screw up and because of this you probably will. Over time you'll get heaps better without really realising it.

Not really sure of any specifics but there was one thing I used to do to get used to leaning the bike. Make sure there's a corner that you know well, its good condtions etc. Start off the corner as you normally would, then when you're sure you're going to make it roll on the throttle more and turn it in even more so you hug the center line onto the next straight, rather than drifting back towards the edge of the road like you usually would. (hope that makes sence). This way you can get used to more lean without feeling that you're going into a corner way too quick.

Keystone19

16th June 2006, 20:41

Sign up for a track day. Getting on the track will help you learn the limits of yourself and the bike.

Once you know how far over you can get it on the track in a safe (ish) environment, you'll know that when you're on the road and it turns to custard, there's probably a lot more room to get yourself out of it then you think at the moment. Does that make sense?

And I agree with the above posts - ride with someone who is better than you - but make sure they are better than you and DO know what they are doing. A lot of people think they do but may just teach you bad habits.

kiwifruit

16th June 2006, 20:47

what Keystone said :)

Toast

16th June 2006, 20:49

http://www.bikepics.com/pictures/599285/

Who's arse were you chasing in that pic with a big randy grin on your face? Man I'm not riding in front of you...

bladez

16th June 2006, 20:51

good luck i have been riding for around 15yrs now and still carnt take corners to well but always still try and have fun trying.
i seem to ride better when relaxed and corners feel alot better:scooter:

N4CR

16th June 2006, 20:51

Who's arse were you chasing in that pic with a big randy grin on your face? Man I'm not riding in front of you...

Mmm I just got excited thinking about the last time I saw Gremlin with a camera. :lol: Yeah it is a bit of a faggerish pic eh... Oh well just something to show the shenanigans of a carpark. Shitty lean in that one too, can see me cheating with my toesliders :shutup:

Deano

16th June 2006, 20:51

okay - opening myself up here for a bit of abuse here. undoubtedly.

I was thinking of getting a cheap bucket bike and going out and doing some go-cart racing. might be a good way to gain a bit of confidence.

anybody got anymore ideas? cause i am sitting on an ex-superbike and its just plain wasted on me.

you think some people are just plain destined not to ever get the hang of it?

As WT said, staged progression is a good thing - riding a bucket or small bike hard will teach a lot of skills that you might not bee keen to try on your minta.

Confidence is a huge factor (as is over confidence - I've come a gutsa a couple of times from getting cocky).

Unless you are doing any basics badly, then just follow peeps slightly quicker to learn off them, but don't overcook it.

If you are determined and have a positive attitude you will get there for sure.

As long as your having fun.

Lazy7

16th June 2006, 20:53

ZeroIndex

16th June 2006, 20:54

Wanna buy my Hyosung Andrew?

You'll learn so much and be absoloutely frustrated with the lack of power that within 5 months you'll be looking for a bigger bike.
and how much is that selling for? if you think you're frustrated with your 'lack of power', try 15bhp.. to turangi, or to auckland, or just down to the bike shop..

SwanTiger

16th June 2006, 20:59

and how much is that selling for? if you think you're frustrated with your 'lack of power', try 15bhp.. to turangi, or to auckland, or just down to the bike shop..

PM me if you are genuinely interested. Its cheap.

15bhp, almost as much as my bucket, good for wheelies.

Madness

16th June 2006, 21:01

For me it's a time and place thing. Under the right conditions and perhaps more importantly, the right frame of mind and I'll take corners hard. Add wet, dark, gravel, or a bad head-space and I'm a nana. It's suprising how well the big Zed goes round when pushed, good grip is essential.

I've ridden for 20 years and have never been on a track. My riding has improved gradually over the years and for me control has been the hardest lesson to learn. There's 2 things that need controlling on a bike, the bike and the rider. To have them in-sync is to be in "the zone".
:doobey:

Toast

16th June 2006, 21:05

Mmm I just got excited thinking about the last time I saw Gremlin with a camera. :lol: Yeah it is a bit of a faggerish pic eh... Oh well just something to show the shenanigans of a carpark. Shitty lean in that one too, can see me cheating with my toesliders :shutup:

hahaha...all good.

I used to do the same thing around roundabouts in Gulf Harbour when there were roads but not many houses yet...it is good for your skills...gives you a good feel for the front tyre I reckon...something I've lost lately, so maybe I should go back to that school...

Ixion

16th June 2006, 22:04

Why worry? I've been riding for 40 years, and I wouldn't know a racing line if it bit me on the toe. But I do have a SHITLOAD of fun riding.

Do you ENJOY your riding ? Are you having fun?

If you are, where's the problem? If not, trying to learn to go faster probably won't help.

There's a hell of a lot more to riding than going fast.

Put 20km behind you, with the engine purring in just the right bit of the rev range, leaning over just nicely through the bendy bits, feeling the tyres squirming just that LITTLE bit as they wibble around on the shoulder of the tread, flicking through the apex of the corners just SO, all smooth and effortless so that you don't even feel you're going fast -- who gives a STUFF if it's not how Rossi would do it.

I believe that the folk who can't see anything more in motorcycling than "how fast can I go" and the wankerism of "getting the knee down" will not last the distance.

After a while they'll get bored, decide that they can't go through there any faster , and sell the bike to buy a Subaru. I've seen them come, blow on about how good they are , and go. Good riddance. The REAL bikers are still there , burbling along. Sure, Rossi could do it faster. So what?

Go out and ride. Don't stew about whether you're going fast or not. Just enjoy the feel of a corner taken exactly right - the grin of coming out the other side thinking "hey, that was SWEET". Bugger Rossi.

And the bonus is, set yourself to try to do the "racing way" and it's near certain you'll crash. Which is a good way to lose all interest in riding (maybe in living!). Forget about trying to be a racer on the public road and not only do you have more fun, you don't get hurt!

Gremlin

16th June 2006, 22:07

First up, I agree with everything said, but I'll add a zx7r perspective.

Fact. It is not as easy to ride the 7 quick as a brand new 600. I rode one, not fast, but was amazed how quickly I could go with little effort. If I thought I was going a bit quick, a touch on the brakes, and everything was sorted. The 7 is far more demanding to ride as fast. It doesn't drop into a corner simply by looking at the corner.

Equally, at least with my current setup, you really do have to muscle the bike into quick left-right combinations.

Learning to ride a 250 to the limit will help a lot, but also expect to take a while to adjust to a bigger bike. I'm still happy with the 7, and if I can ride that to the limit, I should have no worries handling anything to a certain extent.

Confidence will be your biggest issue. If you are uncertain coming into a corner, the bike will feel uncertain. And the opposite is true as well, hence a bike being a machine that you ride with all senses. Naturally the soaking wet is not the best time to be trying to improve your confidence.

Either the carpark, which tristan really seems to have benefitted from, or a section of road with very tight 25s/35s, one after each other. Having someone you can follow may help too. In the beginning you don't necessarily need to be able to follow, just realise you can do better.

You WILL get faster over time, I have always found that true, just how soon you want to be faster.

N4CR

16th June 2006, 22:08

Nice point there Ixion. I am quite content pootling along most of the time but sometimes I will get into the grove.. I get a bigger rush riding faster with nice lines and brake points than burbling along. I guess L7 just wants to feel that... for me it's what I love about a big ride. Happens every few of them not everytime. It's what distinguishes bikes from other pleasurable things I guess - the zen feeling of being one with the bike, pushing it a little and knowing YOU are in control. And great scenery and stories.

Clivoris

16th June 2006, 23:05

For me one of the joys of motorcycling is the endless potential for improvement. So I understand wanting to ride faster. Have a read of Keith Code's Twist of the Wrist, he has some awesome insights into riding. Mostly applicable to racing, but racing does improve the breed. One day when I'm big enough I'll get a street-stock bike and go racing. It has to improve your skills without busting the bank.

T.W.R

16th June 2006, 23:29

One thing is you never stop learning to ride motorcycles, there's always something new to experience.
Learning comes in stages, you learn something then become complacent with it, get smug & casual, then start making basic errors. It's learning to minimise making basic errors and knowing how to rectify those situations and becoming aware of the variables, it's a cycle that goes on & on.

Being fast is a fixation & a myth, becoming smooth & flowing in your approach & style to riding, learning the feel of the bike and understanding the messages it sends you whilst riding is more rewarding. Having all the HP in the world isn't any good if your rough with it, it'll cause more damage than good, but being smooth with what ever HP you have will make you deceptively quick.

As said spending time on a trail/MX bike develops the sense of feeling the bike. Trackdays let you experiment with developing handling skills & finding limits.
blanking off the bikes speedo used to be handy for developing speed, just riding on the feel of the bike & not being drawn into glimpsing the rate of knots your doing.

Trying to emulate your favourite racer on the road has never worked & never will. Enjoying the ride for the experience and making it a smooth ride is more rewarding and in the long term you'll be supprised how much speed comes from becoming smooth.

Mrs Busa Pete

17th June 2006, 06:25

Why don't you pm CaN and ask him about the ride rite ride safe course that he runs out at whenuapai airbase and then maybe go on rides with him it's a really good course to do.

iwilde

17th June 2006, 06:42

A big thing is knowing the roads you're riding on. No point pushing it on a road not ridden before. Evertime you use the same road try a wee bit faster but keeping in your comfort zone

Maha

17th June 2006, 07:57

Why don't you pm CaN and ask him about the ride rite ride safe course that he runs out at whenuapai airbase and then maybe go on rides with him it's a really good course to do.
Thats a good idea, i think all those who feel the same as Lazy should do that.
Recently went to the Puhoi from here with 3 others, 1 of them had a 05' 750 and only had for 2 weeks, we all left together from Warkworth and we waited for about 7-8 mins at the Puhoi turnoff for him. Not judging him, he had just come off a gn250 to that Suzuki and the cornering really needed to be adressed, confidence is a bastard to master sometimes

FROSTY

17th June 2006, 08:23

Short version--don't sweat it dude.

Long version
Thit time of year I'm not brimming with confidence on a sprot bike either. There are just way too many extra variables to deal with to go hurtl;ing into a corner with the knee down etc --MY OPINION anyhoo
Reading what you are saying I'd suggest you have a good strong survival instinct working there.NOTHING wrong with that
If it would help I'm happy to take ya bike for a ride but I bet I ride as slowly as you do.
Doing a trackday or two will help and a tuition session with a ride instructor will help too.
One other thing that might help is to pick a section of windey road and ride it slowly checking out the slippery patches etc then just ride up and down it a few times.
Ohh and i agree with above posts --maha man and doing the ride right course --

Badcat

17th June 2006, 09:10

how long have you been riding?
i'm still a nana (in my opinion) - and it's been 24 years for me.
K

k1w160

17th June 2006, 09:21

Gidday,

I think I know exactly how you feel about the lack of confidence, I binned the race bike in January and it really rattled me the next time I got on the track.
I whole heartedly agree with all of the above comments about riding at a pace your confortable at and putting on heaps of km's, BUT there is an excellent way to improve your riding and the enjoyment you get from it.

As I had lost a bit of confidence after binning it, I came to the conclusion that the problem is in my head, as the bike was perfectly capable of getting round the track in reasonable times prior to the off (there was only panel damage to the bike so there were no other mechanical factors slowing me down).

So...I went down to Technical Books in Newmarket and picked up a copy of "Twist Of The Wrist 2".

This has to be the most valuable thing I have ever bought for my bike as it teaches you how to relax and let the bike work under you instead of fighting it. Although it's written toward a race senario, it transfers to all road riding situations.

As an example, I often ride with tensed arms, WRONG, this only unsettles the bike more!!!

Once you know what's happening with your rider input to the bike and what it is causing the bike to do, you can then adust your riding to work with the bike - not against it.

As your bike appears to be set up already, then it sounds like the rider needs work (no offense ment).

Think about it - what makes Rossi so fast - he KNOWS he can do it (ok - a full factory bike helps but I don't see the other Yamahas getting the consisant results he does. Come to think about it - he could lap fast on a tricycle).

I'm not so sure an ex-race bike is a bit over the top as it should be well set up and they only go as fast as you let them, but take your time and definatly get a few track days in to boost your confidence as well.

This book will be the best money you ever spend on your bike (oh yeah - I hate riding in the rain as well).

Cheers

aff-man

17th June 2006, 10:00

ride heaps. Ride with different people. TRy find someone a little faster that you and try stick with them. The more you ride the more you'll get to know the bike. The more you get to know the bike the more you'll be able to "feel" subtle changes in what the bike is doing. Then you just start pushing a little harder each time a little faster in the corner etc etc etc. Unless your bike is set up really really badly it should be able to handel quite a bit.

Another area to work on which slows me down heaps but it one of the scariest things to practice is late breaking cause at first you feel like you are always going to overcook the corners, this is followed closley by holding corner speed.

Now i'm no speed demon and also feel I've reached a point where the learning has slowed down to a little less than a dribble. Track days are probably my next source of education but not wanting to drop the bike / the cost involved has always put me off. But I'll get there eventually.

beyond

17th June 2006, 10:17

Well said all.

Aff-man, you are quite right too. I thought I had reached the limits on my bike sometime back until I started following Gary on his R1. I haven't met to many people who are as quick or quicker than Gary and he can really ride.

When I first started riding with him, I was in front and going for it and I really thought I was doing quite well until we came to a sweeping right hander and he passed me like I was on a push bike.

Sure, there will always be someone faster and better and at all times, you really need to be comfortable with your riding. But follow a fast rider and push the envelope a bit each time and follow their lines and before long, you will be amazed what your bike will and can do.

I've now got to the stage that around 90% of the time, I can stick with Gary, except when he goes into what I call race mode and that's when I just keep going at my own pace. There's no way in this wide world a GSX1400 is going to stay with an R1 in the fast tight stuff with the ground clearance and tyres I've got for a sports tourer.

But. I have learnt heaps about the right lines, how fast and how hard I can go into a corner while on the brakes, when the bike is at or near it's cornering limits. I'm actually amazed that a 1400 weighing in at 250kgs gassed up, can actually get around the tight stuff and the sweepers like it does when pushed hard.

If my bike can do it, any other bike surely can especially if it's set up for racing. :)

aff-man

17th June 2006, 10:20

When I first started riding with him, I was in front and going for it and I really thought I was doing quite well until we came to a sweeping right hander and he passed me like I was on a push bike.
:)

Hmmm now where have I seen that before... I seem to recall a certain 1400 doing the same to me just our of clevedon:blah:

scracha

17th June 2006, 10:23

Try just slowing down and relaxing a little. I sometimes find when I'm trying too hard (e.g. trying to keep up with latest sports tackle) my lines, braking, etc are all borked up and I end up going slower than my normal riding..

Try going out in the wet more, it REALLY increases confidence and teaches the importance of shifting body weight.

Practise braking on the straights, then you'll know how much abuse the front tyre can take before it lets go.

Get your braking done before the corners so the suspension is setted before the turn in, find nice smooth long sweeping corners and get on the gas as soon as possible. Better still, find a nice big quiet roundabout.

You'll find some of the "faster" riders don't leave much margin for error (some of them are just FAST though!). This is a bad idea (dodgy road surface, bad camber, diesel on road, etc) so don't ride on the roads like they're a race-track (race track's are a LOT stickier too). Life's too short to spend time in hospital.

Ride regularly and enjoy it, regardless of how fast your corner speed is.

On a different note...the purple ZX-7 was one of the nicest looking bikes ever. How the hell they didn't copy it for the ZX-9 beggars belief.

WINJA

17th June 2006, 11:39

beyond

17th June 2006, 13:55

Good point Winja.
It's easy to not notice a change in your bike as you ride it all the time and make compensation for components that are wearing slowly. Can't ride a decent bike fast to start with if it handles like a bent banana for any reason. :)

aff-man

17th June 2006, 13:59

get someone who is good to take your bike for a spin to make sure the bike inspires confidence in the first place , some people cant ride bikes that arent set up well , have you got matching rubber?is your suspension set up? are your bearings good?

You wanna take my 600 for a spin:bye: . Suspension is letting me down a little in the corners......:blip:

imdying

17th June 2006, 15:21

Oh yeah, make sure you tyres are always at the right pressure, and I mean always. Here's a good trick... let your tyres down to 25 psi, then go for a good 3-4kms of riding. Then put the right pressure in (I'm guessing closer to 36 for your ride). Once you've experienced just how bad your bike will handle on underinflated tyres, you'll always keep them right. It's simply amazing just how bad even a good bike handles with the wrong pressure. If I could give just one piece of advice to someone new to sportsbikes, tyre pressures would be it.

diggydog

17th June 2006, 16:09

:scooter: Excellent reading and good infro, i thought that i might check out that book on (twist of the wrist 2"). I took note that some bikers had different ways of tackling these corners which gave me some new ways of achieving better cornering.:blip:
I have a feeling about the handing of different bikes, as i dont think a cruiser would be able to keep up with a sport bike.?:wait: :yes:

Lazy7

17th June 2006, 16:16

okay - so seems there are two schools of thought. comes with time and just enjoy it.

or:

go out and actively find ways to improve myself.

its all good comments and thanks guys.

i will book my bike in to get brakes and suspension looked at. you are right. it would be nice to hear from somebody who knows that my bike will stick to the road rather than me thinking its about to give up. Its got matching 208rr's so rubber isn't a problem.

i am going to nail this. i hate not being good at something.

in answer to some of your comments. i love riding my bike. but i have way too many "moments". hit the brakes, stand up the bike and nearly straightline off. that part isn't fun. and the more of those i have - the more i seem to have!

i will get better at this. but if you see me at a ride and spot me doing something really stupid. please say something!!!

thanks heaps guys.

trumpy

17th June 2006, 16:25

Try just slowing down and relaxing a little....

Great advice. Sometimes you have to slow down to go faster. Sounds daft but it's true. As a BAB I am no expert here (I ride slower than my grandma) but when I struggled with smoothness (and hence pace) racing single seaters my business partner, a National single seater champ himself at the time, made me slow the whole process down and focus on smoothness. Two meetings later I had moved from the middle to the front of the grid. Control is the word....

avgas

17th June 2006, 16:28

Get a small bike, and go do 10000's of twisties. Once you cant stop - cos your having too much fun, change to a bigger bike. Repeat until the ZX dont feel like a waste anymore (and the tyre is destroyed).
There is no easy way to get good, only practice.

Lazy7

17th June 2006, 16:57

Clivoris

17th June 2006, 16:57

okay - so seems there are two schools of thought. comes with time and just enjoy it.

or:

go out and actively find ways to improve myself.
They're both true. You don't have to choose.

slowpoke

17th June 2006, 17:20

Yup, some good stuff comin' outta the woodwork here...
For myself time on the bike is always going to be my biggest problem, due to being rostered offshore for half of every year, 3 weeks at a time.
Whenever I come home from work and drag the sickle outta the shed it feels just a lil' bit like hard work. It's like I'm following the bike around, having to concentrate on just about everything.
I like to get on the track too (a wannabe racer but really only trackdays so far) so I know about the "wanna get faster" gene.
When I know I've got a track day coming up and limited time, I try and make a point of riding my favourite bit of quiet, windy stuff every day for a week. It's not usually a long ride, 50km each way, but I just try and stay smooth, stay comfortable, doing the right things, pushing along but not too much 'cos that's what the track is for, right?
By the end of the week the bike is following me rather than the other way round. I'm more relaxed, concentrating on WHAT I am doing rather than HOW I'm doing it, if you know what I mean.
If you are having sphincter puckering moments on a regular basis already I wouldn't be so keen on you riding with an even faster crowd. Slow down a bit, get comfortable to a point where you aren't really having to think too much about what you are doing. Once your brain has got used to the fact that there isn't going to be a "FAAAARK!!" moment around the next corner you'll be in a position to start feeding it information at a faster rate by ramping it up a bit.
If you are serious: take it to the track. Trying to go warp speed on the road is for dickheads, full stop, end of story. You can learn a lot more going around the same track all day with no cars coming the other way secure in the knowledge that if it all goes pear shaped you won't be lying the bushes for six hours until someone comes looking.

Edbear

17th June 2006, 18:39

Try just slowing down and relaxing a little. .

This is a ZX7R we're talking about...?:laugh: Seriously, though, (and sadly there are times we must be serious!), I agree with your advice. Slowing down and relaxing, getting into a cruise mode where one can concentrate on smoothness and control, then gradually increasing the pace.:rockon:

SwanTiger

17th June 2006, 19:04

Try just slowing down and relaxing a little

Isn't that his problem, he goes too slow?

The Pastor

17th June 2006, 19:12

Maybe a mindset change? You don't have to 'back into corners' to enjoy riding. Maybe the group you're riding with is too fast? Find some people your own pace, and just enjoy riding... once you're having fun, you'll get faster.

Word. Having fun doesnt always = go as fast as you can on a public road/ corner. Nothing wrong in going slow, we have a beautiful country no need to speed through it. (dont get me wrong im not a hippie hehe)

Huntaway

17th June 2006, 20:34

I'm wth Ixion: riding fast isn't the b all. Riding public roads like they are a race track is always to court disaster (if not a speeding ticket!).

I wonder if you're as bad as you make out Lazy7. We all have moments such as you describe. If you feel you are having too many, are you pushing yourself too hard? Focus on riding well first and fast will follow.

Track days helped me explore my limits. The car park thing is something I should try too as I still struggle controlling tight turns.

Ride safe dude. Enjoy your good bike!

Hellraiser

17th June 2006, 20:49

Now i'm not really one to be giving advise but speaking from experance i think its all in your head, you need to trust the machine that you are on treat it like a woman and pray that it won't let you down.

Recently i went for my frist ride with a group of KBer's now i was totally blowen away at the break neck speeds that these guys were capable of i mean my comfort zone is around the 140 - 160km/h and although i was probably only averaging 130ish km/h i was always at least 5-10min behind these guys.

At first i thought i really needed to go back to school and learn how to ride, which i still think will be an advantage, but after taking my little GT250R (which i ride 8 hours a day 5 days a week) along the same rodes i came to the conclusion that i didn't trust my 636 like i do the 250.

Now i know there is a small HP differance between the 2 bikes but the point I'm trying to make is i know the limits of the GT250R, I know how late i can break coming into a corner I know when to start pedeling coming out of the corner .....etc ... etc

Give it time and trust your bike if she lets you down kick her out and get a new one

SuperDave

17th June 2006, 20:53

I'd say stop worrying and thinking about it so much and just do.

I found myself going through the same sorta thing for the first few weeks with my old zxr and now the gixxer, all it took for me was taking a step back and just enjoying the ride without expecting to feel myself improve - you'd soon find that you'll start enjoy riding very much more and without realising it you should gain more confidence.

beyond

17th June 2006, 22:28

Ok, one other thing. If you've done less than 5000kms on your trusty steed, then quite honestly, you aren't up to taking it to the limit or testing it's limits yet.

No matter how good a rider you are, I believe you have to have covered at least 5000kms on your current bike to know it's true capabilities without finding you've exceeded your knowledge envelope.

I stand to be corrected here but it took me around 5000kms to really know my 1400 inside and out and even then I found I was riding outside my abilities from time to time. After 10,000kms I found I knew it inside and out enough to test it's limits and cornering limits without doing something ugly.

Now, when riding with others, I don't care what anyone says as I believe this effects us all until you have got to the point where you really know your bike. (Males anyway.) No matter how level headed you are, in a group you are going to push harder than you would normally. If in front, you feel like you have to set the pace and go faster than you should and can easily over cook a corner or do something you wouldn't do when riding on your own.

When following, you feel you have to keep up or look like a woos. Again, you can outride your abilities.

In either case, remember you have nothing to prove and you aint going to prove anything looking at the proceeding from the top branches of a T tree somewhere off road.

Most modern bikes are going to outride even the most experienced rider in the above 750 classes. On the road, it's virtually impossible to outride a modern sportsbike.

If like me, you own a sports tourer, you begin to find it's limits a lot earlier than a full on sports bike and then you can try and push it too hard for what it's designed for.

If your sphincters getting too much of a work out, yeah, slow down and get your cornering lines right and technique sorted. Follow a quick rider and always ask for them to slow down so you can follow their lines till you get it sorted.

Most bikers are more than happy to teach techniques to others if it means they are going to be a round longer to enjoy riding.

Old adage here: if it feels uncomfortable slow down till it feel second nature. You have nothing to prove and can't prove anything if you aint here. :)

trumpy

17th June 2006, 23:08

"Testorerone and bravery receive too much emphasis in the motorcycling world. No Fear might work for bungee jumping, but not for riding a motorcycle on the street.
Technique and concentration deserve much more credit. Add to them intelligence, intuition and desire, and you'll begin to describe not just the fastest road racers but the best street riders as well..."

- Nick Ienatsch (raced the Britten at Daytona and Road Atlanta in 1994)
Sport Riding Techniques (available Tech Books)

Read, Trumpys excuse for riding slow....:yes: Seriously tho, great advice from someone who has more riding skill in his little finger than I will probably ever achieve.

Keystone19

17th June 2006, 23:19

Reading these last two posts, it seems to me the answer is obvious - just ride with us girls.

You'll find that the lack of testosterone will mean that you learn speed and control in a safe, non-threatening environment...:innocent:

Lazy7

17th June 2006, 23:21

yeah. i guess i need to clarify.

it was never about going fast. it was always more about feeling comfortable.

the problem i was finding when riding with groups is the bike obiviously has enough in it to keep up legally on the straights (lets not argue about straightline speed of the whale - you know what i mean)

its just that when riding with groups, under-confident people like myself can cause as many problems as overconfident people who go too fast.

if i have a couple of bikes behind me going into a corner and i brake early - it causes problems for the bikes behind me not expecting it.

i guess its mainly that i have "keeping up with the guys" issues and whenever riding with groups i feel like a bit of a liability.

you are right about getting to know your machine. i am feeling better on it every single day. i do a lot of riding daily - but its mainly tyre squaring commutes.

i do need to trust in the bike however. if the hyosung just went around the corner in front of me - stands to reason i should be able to do it as well right. :blip:

thanks for all the comments guys - i am seriously taking it on board. its actually turned out to be a pretty dam good thread.

haha - i am going to get seriously baby sat on the next group ride i can just tell. :-p

i hope more people struggling with the same stuff get as much help out of this thread as i have!

Hellraiser

17th June 2006, 23:58

its just that when riding with groups, under-confident people like myself can cause as many problems as overconfident people who go too fast.

if i have a couple of bikes behind me going into a corner and i brake early - it causes problems for the bikes behind me not expecting it.

Don't worry about the riders behind you if they're good then they will already be thinking 3 corners ahead of you.

One thing MX taught me was to race your own race the faster guys will always find a way around you.

Worry about whats in front of you not whats behind (unless it has Red & Blue lights of cause)

T.W.R

18th June 2006, 00:42

i guess its mainly that i have "keeping up with the guys" issues and whenever riding with groups i feel like a bit of a liability.

i do need to trust in the bike however. if the hyosung just went around the corner in front of me - stands to reason i should be able to do it as well right. :blip:

Never feel like a liability when riding with mates :oi-grr: If their real mates they'll never put you in a position where you feel like that.
A group ride is meant to be a group ride, not clusters of individuals having individual rides, sure there'll be times when a group will get strung out but if those who do get ahead of the rest the group have some sensibility they slow or even stop so the crew can re-group.
When you are in the situation of following a more experienced rider watch their lines but don't feel committed to try chasing them if their disappearing into the distance. Ride your own ride at a pace your comfortable with, not at a pace someone else faster than yourself sets, if your with a more experienced rider & they know your wanting to learn they'll pace in front of you so you can watch & learn lines without stropping off into the distance.

Plain & simple; anyone can go fast in a straight line & you don't have to be a brain surgen to crack a throttle open & smack a bike up through the gears. Theres plenty of places around this fair country where a smooth rider on a smaller, heavier, less powerful, & older bike will totally shaft Joe Blow on the latest, gruntiest hyperbeast because they were being smooth & letting the bike sing instead of being all rip shit n bust.

Enjoy your riding at your own pace not someone elses, develop yourself and learn at your own pace. You can read all the advice & info in the world, but it's how you apply what you learn that is the important factor, absolutely no-one rides the same way, we all may experience similar things in our path of learning but it's how apply what we learn that makes us better. We're all individuals in life and the same applys to riding as well, there's basic principles in everything but our application of those principles is unique.

Having belief in yourself & your bike is important, but one thing in your favour with the ZX7 is that at their peak they were noted for the best/ most confidence inspiring front end in the business.

Being fast doesn't make you a better rider, knowing & understanding your bike fully and connecting with it is a better sense of motorcycling. Enjoying what you have and enjoying the experience it offers is what makes a motorcyclist.

FROSTY

18th June 2006, 01:27

Dude I've been thinking about your "problem"
I would like now to STRONGLY suggest ya might want to let someone with some nouse have a play with the suspension settings on your bike.
I have a funny feeling the bike has been set up for the track.
I promise you track settings DON'T work on the road.
"someone" took a SV650 racebike for a running in type blat down peak/old north etc with the suspension set up for the track--The ride was hell with tank slappers,bump steer and nasty kidney pounding going on.

SwanTiger

18th June 2006, 01:45

I do need to trust in the bike however. if the hyosung just went around the corner in front of me - stands to reason i should be able to do it as well right.

Haha! this lack of confidence wasn't caused by my over taking you that night was it? Gremlin is still in denial...

"Keeping up" is a myth and a shit hole thing to get caught up on. One thing I learnt very quickly by being a member of this site and going on rides is to "ride against yourself'.

The only person holding you up in that corner is you.

If you like we can go back to that corner (I remember which one, the 35 one after the straight on Sunnyside Road) and you can take me on the outside.

:nya:

On a serious note. Practise is the key here.

Let me know when you have 4 hours one fine weekend spare and you and myself and some other riders can go out to woodcocks / west coast road and go backwards and forwards. That road will turn you into a Rossi. Once you can beat Tristan through there you'll be able to confidently play with the 1000's.

Gremlin

18th June 2006, 01:59

Jamezo

18th June 2006, 10:20

I always found the "if that bike can take a corner like that, I should be able to", a great confidence aid, which was especially useful when I started riding with alarumba, on an identical machine.

Using that confidence, I was carrying ridiculous corner speeds (scraping almost every corner, cause I hadn't discovered the whole mass shifting thing...), beyond all my rights to as a week-old rider.

When I ride with others, I feel like I'm pushing my limits less, even when I'm going faster than I would on my own.

Pixie

18th June 2006, 11:18

You could start learning on a proper bike rather than a sport bike.(the worst possible type to learn on)
But I suppose appearances are more important than learning the skills.

N4CR

18th June 2006, 11:56

250s are also much much more flickable through tight twisties than a 7r, unless you are a good rider, with a good setup.

200+Kg Dry vs 160kg wet and 2/3rds inertia.. hahaha no competition. Might be more stable in the high speed stuff where a 250 ain't great though, I LOVE THE FRONT END ON YOUR BIKE :D 'Tis surely one of the best ever...

skidMark

18th June 2006, 12:03

http://www.bikepics.com/pictures/599267/

i want to see texmo explain why his knee aint down...not that i can talk i am self admitting i am the shittiest rider on these forums

N4CR

18th June 2006, 12:28

http://www.bikepics.com/pictures/599267/

i want to see texmo explain why his knee aint down...not that i can talk i am self admitting i am the shittiest rider on these forums

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/gallery/displayimage.php?album=346&pos=9 (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/gallery/displayimage.php?album=346&pos=9)

Go suck a dick.

imdying

18th June 2006, 13:44

N4CR

18th June 2006, 13:48

Interesting to note in those two pictures; the first one where the fella in behind hasn't got his knee down, he's got his visor up, and is looking at the camera. In the shot where he does, he's looking through the bend, and just looks more committed.

Yes, it's called exit and entry points.. something mark needs to learn about. That was just a bit of a muckaround day with the cameras really, nothing too serious. Good fun though, tex got much more confident on his new bike (had it for.. 1 week at that stage..) and had a good time (he sorta dissed the carpark method I swear by beforehand ;) ). Started off a bit average and not too confident with the bike, left dragging his knee and getting used to cranking the bugger over a bit.

Proof enough of a 'carpark session' working? Give it a go lazy!

Hitcher

18th June 2006, 15:21

I reckon it takes about 8,000km to get properly "zoned" on a bike. But then again, I've never done 8,000km on a sprot bike...

Titanium

18th June 2006, 15:47

Got to everyone you can get to, a fantastic way to learn yours and your steeds limitations........

You will find out how far you can lean your bike over, how hard you can hi the brakes.

I am learning to ride again after 7 years off.

cheers

Peter

Gremlin

18th June 2006, 18:35

I LOVE THE FRONT END ON YOUR BIKE :D 'Tis surely one of the best ever...
bike isn't set up properly yet, I suspect. Rear is much too hard, front was very soft until I did the preload up a bit. But now the bike may be a little on the hard side, not good for winter, and not good for handling in general. Sharper in smooth corners though. You shoulda seen my first little ride after adjusting the preload, I was weaving a bit in corners, the front was sooo much more responsive to input.

Knowing that your bike is well set up, aids your confidence no end. Having doubts in your bikes ability will totally screw up any confidence you have. You will wonder if the bike will be ok on this bump, or "oh shit, it'll never cope with this problem". Been there, and almost screwed up when I didn't think my previous bike could cope with something. Only pulled it back just in time.

Squeak the Rat

19th June 2006, 09:35

Definitely get the bike checked. Ditto Gremlin - even if it is ok, it at least removes doubt in the machine.

Other than that, I had about 4 years off riding myself recently, and was very surprised how much slower I was, or more accurately how much confidence I'd lost. Combination of new bike and lack of riding (and getting older). What I did was decide that I like going around corners more than the straights so I concentrated on corner entry speed and forgoed the squid 100-240-80 accelerating / braking before the corner.

I still have problems decelerating the bike to the correct entry speed, stabilising it, and turning in a the correct place when hard on the brakes after giving it death down a straight. But that's next on the practice list....

ZeroIndex

19th June 2006, 10:14

Got to everyone you can get to, a fantastic way to learn yours and your steeds limitations........
You will find out how far you can lean your bike over, how hard you can hi the brakes.
I plan to do that once I have a bike with an engine..

Macktheknife

30th June 2006, 16:56

i have ridden the 7r since february.

before that it was almost 4 years since i rode - and the bike i had then was a zxr400 for about 8 months. i definitely felt a whole lot more sorted on that than i do on the 750.

maybe 4 years younger = immature big balls syndrome? i dont know.

so only about 13 months total riding experience. maybe i am just expecting too much.
I would say yeah.... you are expecting too much.
All the advice here is good especially the carpark tips IMO.
I have some cones and a convenient carpark nearby on the shore if you want to practice, PM me if interested.

kawa

4th July 2006, 20:21

N4CR

4th July 2006, 20:26

Bike: ,2006 ZX14,
Listen to God guys....

Nice bike mate - one of what, 6 in the country? :D
<img src=http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/customprofilepics/profilepic5064_2.gif>
I'd love to have one of them or similar in my profile one day :wait: welcome to the site!

Hitcher

4th July 2006, 21:14

I was tempted...

Gremlin

4th July 2006, 23:48

Nice bike mate - one of what, 6 in the country? :D
Like any decent manufacturer, that stat didn't last long. Last time I checked, Mt Eden had sold at least a couple I think, and had 4 on the floor...

I would *hope* that somewhere else in the country, there was one or two more :doobey:

mind you... I would assume it could stop better than a ST...

Hitcher

5th July 2006, 09:19

I would assume it could stop better than a ST...
Don't be too harsh on the ST's stopping abilities. On "the day in question" its ability to stop in time had a few things conspiring against it. The black line up the Kaitoke passing lane is testimony to the fact that it was doing its best.

The_Dover

5th July 2006, 09:36

But - I dont seem to be getting any better at riding.

Wellington to Whangarie with one fuel stop will up your skills heaps.

Hitler will even pay for the gas!!

Lazy7

5th July 2006, 10:53

Wellington to Whangarie with one fuel stop will up your skills heaps.

Hitler will even pay for the gas!!

Also up my hemeroid count as well! :sick:

I am picking up a set of full race leathers this weekend - then i will be terrozing a track near you soon. We will see how shit I really am I guess.

kiwifruit

5th July 2006, 11:13

I am picking up a set of full race leathers this weekend - then i will be terrozing a track near you soon. We will see how shit I really am I guess.

so we'll see you at Taupo on the 28th? :)

Gershon

5th July 2006, 23:26

Reading all the earlier tips about confidence, I took a ride this week up the twin coasts route. SH16 up to Welllsford, out to Mangawhai Heads, up through Waipu, then on toward Whangarei and looped down through Paparoa before heading back to Akl. Great roads and views - great thing about it was little traffic, good mix of corners, bends, sweepers, twisties and great to practice building confidence by focussing on smoothness. Getting back into riding and upgrading to a 600, this is the type of riding that's good for me. Maybe for you too.

skidMark

5th July 2006, 23:36

best way to learn is to go to one of the race track days where they have an experienced racer giving you tips. Practice and more practice. But remember once back on the road it's never quite the same, better to be safe than splattered.

**dreams of even just sitting on your zx14**

you must get so many looks from people when they click what it is jaws must drop when you are having a chat at lights with some pimply 16 year old on thier learners aye....

N4CR

5th July 2006, 23:38

chat at lights with some pimply 16 year old on thier learners aye....

SO YOU ARE 16 YOU FUCKING FAG THAT EXPLAINS ALOT EH? JEEEUPERs!!!

skidMark

5th July 2006, 23:44

SO YOU ARE 16 YOU FUCKING FAG THAT EXPLAINS ALOT EH? JEEEUPERs!!!

it was example cock knob .....i'm 19 retard

skidMark

5th July 2006, 23:55

That explains a lot. I thought you were a 16yr old retard.

LOL...........

kiwifruit

6th July 2006, 08:02