Tyre choice for adventure riding? (Mixing road and off-road)

[XF650]

Four days (loaded bike) on gravel, seal & a bit of slippery clay. Also included some grass paddocks in the course of some work calls. Ran 20psi in front & 25psi rear.
I'm absolutly rapt with these tyres - fantastic all-rounders. Great value for money too - $120 front & $140 rear.

[oldrider]

Has any one had any experience with the Metzeler Karroo (off road) tyres?

They write them up well for the road too and they are in the Tiger sizes.

Worth a try? Maybe some of you already have, any comments? Thanks, John.

[warewolf]

Has any one had any experience with the Metzeler Karroo (off road) tyres?I used a set of the first edition on the Honda Dominator, off-road they were great, but wore comparatively fast... seems to be a common synopsis. They've been updated since then, and split into two types, although the sizes are very similar. They're definitely a big bike tyre; unlike all the Asian cheapies they come in 140/80s and 150/70s.

The Karoo (http://www.metzelermoto.com/web/catalog/moto/moto_catalogo_schedaDescription.page?categoria=/catalog/moto/off_road/enduro_on_off&vehicleType=MOTO&product_id=145710&uri=/metzeler/en_IT/browser/xml/catalog/moto/OffRoad_Karoo.xml&menu_item=/products/catalog/) looks more off-road.
<img src=http://www.metzelermoto.com/en_IT/browser/attachments/images/Catalogue/Off_Road/Enduro/MCE_Karoo_173X236.jpg>

The Karoo T (http://www.metzelermoto.com/web/catalog/moto/moto_catalogo_schedaDescription.page?categoria=/catalog/moto/off_road/enduro_on_off&vehicleType=MOTO&product_id=126736&uri=/metzeler/en_IT/browser/xml/catalog/moto/OffRoad_KarooT.xml&menu_item=/products/catalog) seems slightly more street focussed, judging by appearance and the description.
<img src=http://www.metzelermoto.com/en_IT/browser/attachments/images/Catalogue/Off_Road/Enduro/Karoo_T_173X236.jpg>

[Oscar]

Has any one had any experience with the Metzeler Karroo (off road) tyres?

They write them up well for the road too and they are in the Tiger sizes.

Worth a try? Maybe some of you already have, any comments? Thanks, John.

I killed one in 850km of hard riding on my 640.
That's quick even for me.

[_Shrek_]

Damn!
I like the tire but don't like this bit...
Would be fine but it looks like it into the carcass :(

<img src=http://www.photostorage.nelson.geek.nz/sports/motorsport/mybikes/DR650/20070914%20Shinko%20244/slides/20070916-111454-000001.jpg>

hey NB it looks like you were running low psi 1 of my EO7 looked like that after i had been running low psi on rough ground it looks like a stress fracture :(

[Transalper]

...1 of my EO7 looked like that after i had been running low psi on rough ground it looks like a stress fracture :(
How low is low psi in this case?
Did you take it to DAS and show them?
What did they say?

[NordieBoy]

hey NB it looks like you were running low psi 1 of my EO7 looked like that after i had been running low psi on rough ground it looks like a stress fracture :(

20psi.

I think it was a bit of sharp rock.
At the bottom of the cut you can see a bit peeled back slightly.

The tube punctured today (on the way back from fixing CycleTreads computer :eek5:).

Raced back at 12:30 as they shut at 1pm on Wed.
The tube was pinched 10cm from the valve right on the centre line of the rim tape.
Absolutely nothing there or on the carcass.

Going to ride the tyre out at 25psi instead of my normal road 36psi and see how long the tread lasts.

[RedKLR650]

I put a Vee Rubber P62 (v208) "Trail Wolf" on the rear wheel of the KLR at 810 Kms. 1430 Km later its down to about 3mm in the centre, after 70/30% sealed / good gravel road.

Hi Pete,

As your KLR was brand new:niceone:, why change the OEM tyre at only 810kms ?:cool: What was the tyre that came standard with the bike ? :rolleyes:
Curious, Stu :scooter:

[_Shrek_]

How low is low psi in this case?
Did you take it to DAS and show them?
What did they say?

20 psi TA but i had already done 14500k so was not bothered :)

[warewolf]

Metzeler KarooI killed one in 850km of hard riding on my 640.Um... I think they've just moved down a few places on my list of tyres to try.

[Oscar]

Um... I think they've just moved down a few places on my list of tyres to try.


To be fair, the things got thrashed.
We rode around Cape Palliser on all sorts of terrain and after letting the thing down to about 15psi for the grass, proceed to thrash the arse of the KTM back to town on the road...(you know, a normal weekend).

[Transalper]

20 psi TA but i had already done 14500k so was not bothered :)

Ahh, 20psi, when you said low pressure I was thinking along the lines of 14 or 15psi. I ran mine as low as that on the Transalp often when worried about grip on the extra loose or muddy bits. It may have been excessivly low at times. I changed them out at 13000km. Now on the DR650 I think I'd go with 19 or 20psi most the time when leaving the seal. I ran 19psi both ends on the Mangatapu on Saturday. Worked quite well in wet clay and rocks.

[warewolf]

To be fair, the things got thrashed. ...(you know, a normal weekend).It's a story I hear a lot with those tyres. I'd try a Michelin Desert first as lots of Aussies are happy with them on 640s.

[cooneyr]

It's a story I hear a lot with those tyres. I'd try a Michelin Desert first as lots of Aussies are happy with them on 640s.

What would a bloody ausi know about anything :bleh:

Read this one (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=57425&highlight=shark+pope)

Cheers R

[XF650]

Ahh, 20psi, when you said low pressure I was thinking along the lines of 14 or 15psi. I ran mine as low as that on the Transalp often when worried about grip on the extra loose or muddy bits. It may have been excessivly low at times. I changed them out at 13000km. Now on the DR650 I think I'd go with 19 or 20psi most the time when leaving the seal. I ran 19psi both ends on the Mangatapu on Saturday. Worked quite well in wet clay and rocks.

How low (psi) do you think, before needing rim locks with EO7's?

[cooneyr]

How low (psi) do you think, before needing rim locks with EO7's?

Depends on the rims, how aggressive you are being and how rubberery (vs plasticy) the tyres are but probably around 18-20 psi min to be safe.

Cheers R

[OV Lander]

Spotted this thread on advrider: "Karoo's the scarriest tyres Ever" - Makes an intersting read when compared against "They wrote them up well..."

Was looking at the Metzler Sahara for my Dakar - any thoughts?

[tri boy]

Was looking at the Metzler Sahara for my Dakar - any thoughts?

Running a 130/80-17 Metz Sahara 3 on the Scrambler.(200+kg).
I'm expecting I'll get 6000km out of it.(that will have some tread, but will be poor at slowing on gravel etc).
Its been a good tyre on road and gravel, can handle light grass/dirt, and hasn't scared me, but be careful on black slick tarmac.
Seem to wear quickly in the first 2000km, but settle down as more rubber contacts the road.
8/10:niceone:

[oldrider]

Spotted this thread on advrider: "Karoo's the scarriest tyres Ever" - Makes an intersting read when compared against "They wrote them up well..."

Was looking at the Metzler Sahara for my Dakar - any thoughts?

Yes but they also clarified that there is a new (T) 2 Karoo that is vastly superior to the original one, the early one was extremely noisy too. Cheers John.

[windboy]

Was looking at the Metzler Sahara for my Dakar - any thoughts?

I tried the sahara's on my friend's dakar and they lack a bit of front control (IMHO). I believe the tread depth isn't quite enough. As for the rear I understand they are great, heaps of grip whilst being quiet.

I've just put a front tkc80 on my dakar and I really liked it. Very grippy and predictable on the gravel. Fine on the seal although I haven't tried on the wet yet. For the rear a sahara may just be the ideal combo... (ask triboy)

later,

[Zukin]

I tried the sahara's on my friend's dakar and they lack a bit of front control (IMHO). I believe the tread depth isn't quite enough. As for the rear I understand they are great, heaps of grip whilst being quiet.

I've just put a front tkc80 on my dakar and I really liked it. Very grippy and predictable on the gravel. Fine on the seal although I haven't tried on the wet yet. For the rear a sahara may just be the ideal combo... (ask triboy)

later,

Hey

The TKC80's are a great all round tyre, I have done about 5000km and the rear is maybe 1/2 to 3/4 worn, so not bad, the fron is less then 1/2 worn.
But the price :angry:
Still happy with them though, and yes you have to watch them on wet roads, especially the slick shiney stuff :)
But that is like any knobbly type tyre I guess

[K slider]

I put a Vee Rubber P62 (v208) "Trail Wolf" on the rear wheel of the KLR at 810 Kms. 1430 Km later its down to about 3mm in the centre, after 70/30% sealed / good gravel road. A mate with the same type of tyre on his DR got similar wear rates on the same roads Might try the Mitas tyres next.
Incidentally Mitas used to be known as Barum - who among other things were the tyre supplier for Jawa speedway bikes. That might explain the LMS connection, as Robin Adlington was a top speedway rider both here and in the UK back in the 70s / 80s

[Transalper]

sorry Kslider, but with all those broken quote tags in there you're not making any sense.:blink:

or was this more what you intended.... (I spent some more time trying to decipher.)





I put a Vee Rubber P62 (v208) "Trail Wolf" on the rear wheel of the KLR at 810 Kms. 1430 Km later its down to about 3mm in the centre, after 70/30% sealed / good gravel road. A mate with the same type of tyre on his DR got similar wear rates on the same roads Might try the Mitas tyres next.
Incidentally Mitas used to be known as Barum - who among other things were the tyre supplier for Jawa speedway bikes. That might explain the LMS connection, as Robin Adlington was a top speedway rider both here and in the UK back in the 70s / 80sHi Pete I have just changed my rear Dunlop 606 after 8000 Kms and you know how much spinning my rear wheel gets over Hinakoura. I have stuck an IRC GT 110 or something like that for a dirty trip down south in December so I will see how that wears and grips . My Vee rubber was bloody hard to balance and vibrated me teeth out so it got the heave.sorry this is Pete GS 650 dakar ex sreedway.

It's all down to being careful not to type over or between the [ and ] with the word quote in them.

[pete376403]

Hi Pete,

As your KLR was brand new:niceone:, why change the OEM tyre at only 810kms ?:cool: What was the tyre that came standard with the bike ? :rolleyes:
Curious, Stu :scooter:
Another thread back from the grave...
The original tyre on the killer was a Dunlop K750. Really good on the road but marginal on any dirt other than hard pack. As we had a long weekend ride that included much off road, I went for the Vee Rubber thinking it was going to be better. It did give reasonably good grip, but at the expense of life. The K750 is still in the shed, and in near as new condition. Will put it back on if I go for any long road-only tours. Currently on the back is a Michelin Sirac, which was bought for possibly the worst possible reason - it was cheap.
In spite of that it's proving very good so far.

[RedKLR650]

Another thread back from the grave...
The original tyre on the killer was a Dunlop K750. Really good on the road but marginal on any dirt other than hard pack. As we had a long weekend ride that included much off road, I went for the Vee Rubber thinking it was going to be better. It did give reasonably good grip, but at the expense of life. The K750 is still in the shed, and in near as new condition. Will put it back on if I go for any long road-only tours. Currently on the back is a Michelin Sirac, which was bought for possibly the worst possible reason - it was cheap.
In spite of that it's proving very good so far.

Personally I've had great luck with the IRC GP 110 rear, but due to all of the ones pushing Mitas on here, am going to try a new Mitas on my spare rear rim, and another IRC 110 on the other, and will record distances and types of road surfaces covered, so lookout for a report in the upcoming months... :laugh:

Cheers, Stu :niceone:

[tri boy]

Finally I've found some time to change out the Metz Sahara3 from the rear of the Scrambler. 70% worn, and I'm only changing it now, as the WWW ride will be a good one to try the Mitas E-07 on.
6000km on the Sahara which probably ended up being 50/50 seal/gravel, with a bit of paddock/soft loam runs.
Definitely a tyre that I would fit again. Handled gravel well, and the carcass seems robust enough not to worry about punctures too often.
Pressures ranged from 20psi-30psi. The triumph was often quite loaded, and its dry weight of 220kg isn't easy on tyres either.
Will post some comparison shots of the Trail Wing/ Sahara soon. Will be interesting to see how the E-07 goes.;)

[Transalper]

...The triumph was often quite loaded, and its dry weight of 220kg isn't easy on tyres either.
..... Will be interesting to see how the E-07 goes.;)
We await your opinion with interest. I run my E07 from 26psi Front 29si Rear Seal to 20 psi F 22 psi R on shingle and go lower if it turns gooey.
My bike is far lighter than yours, so was the Transalp.

[NordieBoy]

I ran 32f/36r seal on my E-07's without any issues grip wise and they lasted well.

[tri boy]

Couple of pics to compare wear rate between the Trail Wing (left), and the Sahara.
Both are down to 2.4mm in the centre, the TW was changed at 5000km, and the Metz at 6000km.
The metz got a harder life, as I got more adventurous, and is also the better gravel tyre, but as you can see, the wear is similar for kms traveled.
Class dismissed....except for you Mary, I have some special "Learning" for you.:buggerd:

Original thread depth was 8mm I think, so both were wearing at approx 1mm/1000km.
And No, you can't have them. They are to become tarmac run outs, or burnout tyres.:headbang:

[tri boy]

Put about 500km on the new E-07 while on the WWW ride. First impressions are:
A pretty good all round tyre. Sealed road holding quite impressive, (running at 34psi, and 30psi), although its let down by its tendancy to "break traction" easily on a down shift that the Metz Sahara would of easily handled.
Like wise, it can not "hook up" on gravel under accel any where near as well as the Sahara. gravel pressures were between 20-25psi, (the side wall flex was starting to show its hand at 20)
It does seem to be slightly noisier than the Metz, but this is irrelevant on a M/Cycle with closed circuit mufflers.
High speed on seal weaving can be felt, but this isn't anus puckering to any extent, just not as stable as the Sahara, or even the standard Trail Wings.

Wear rate should be better than both of the previous mentioned tyres, and this is where the decision needs to be made.Do I want/need a better all round tyre like the Metz, (and pay extra for it), or will the Mitas win me over with its pricing.......hmmmm, at this stage I think I will probably lean towards the Metz. That is after I wear the E-07 out, and then fit and try the E-09 thats waiting in the shed.:devil2:

[nigelp]

I have just swapped over from a Trailwing which I didnt really rate that highly to Mitas EO-7. Will be interested to see how this holds up, my trail wing rear lasted 5500kms, so not that long! I hear rumours of 10,000+ on the EO-7 so time will tell!

Was the first time I have changes a "big bike" tyre myself. Wasnt as bad as I thought it was going to be and took me around 1.5hrs.

[Transalper]

Put about 500km on the new E-07 while on the WWW ride. First impressions are:....
....
...Do I want/need a better all round tyre like the Metz, (and pay extra for it), or will the Mitas win me over with its pricing.......hmmmm, at this stage I think I will probably lean towards the Metz. That is after I wear the E-07 out, and then fit and try the E-09 thats waiting in the shed.:devil2:

Good read, nice and objective, thanks.
Now hurry up and wear them out, I want to hear about the E09s on the Trumpy.
Could you remind us what tyre sizes you are using.
The Transalp I had was a 21inch front and 17inch rear I think. The DR650 is same.

[tri boy]

Running a 110/80-19 TKC80 up front. (very happy with the Conti).
And 130/80-17 on the rear.
It will be a highly positive write from someone to convince to use anything other than the TKC up front. But at some stage I'll refit the old front Trail Wing for mainly tarmac trips.
I also have plans to slip a set of Bridgestone BT45's on, and wobble my way round the occasional trackday. I think the Scrambler could surprise a few, with a decent rider on board. (thats not me):no:

[cooneyr]

Running a 110/80-19 TKC80 up front. (very happy with the Conti).
And 130/80-17 on the rear.
It will be a highly positive write from someone to convince to use anything other than the TKC up front. But at some stage I'll refit the old front Trail Wing for mainly tarmac trips.
I also have plans to slip a set of Bridgestone BT45's on, and wobble my way round the occasional trackday. I think the Scrambler could surprise a few, with a decent rider on board. (thats not me):no:

You might like to check out ThunderBikes trumpy scrambler that they race at the Nelson Port street races. From memory they'd worked it to put out around 90hp. I don't know how well it actually did.

Cheers R

[warewolf]

You might like to check out ThunderBikes trumpy scrambler that they race at the Nelson Port street races. From memory they'd worked it to put out around 90hp.84rwhp IIRC, up from high-50s std. But that's with cams, carbs, pipes etc, "Stage 2" setup. The footrests took a beating, ground clearance was very much a limiting factor after the power-to-weight. They also raced it at Greymouth last year (in the motard class?!) and at a Bears meet at Ruapuna on the Brass Monkey weekend.

[warewolf]

the E09sbtw I paid $143 then $147 for the Pirelli MT21 140/80-18; the Mitas E-09 130/80-18 is $160. It'd want to be pretty damn good and long-lived to be worth the extra money over the MT21, particularly as it is one size smaller (although stated as nearly the same diameter). I thought the Mitas' were supposed to be cheap?! Although I suppose it is vs. the Michelin Desert 140/80-18 (from which it is cloned) at $199.

[Transalper]

btw I paid $143 then $147 for the Pirelli MT21 140/80-18; the Mitas E-09 130/80-18 is $160. It'd want to be pretty damn good and long-lived to be worth the extra money over the MT21, particularly as it is one size smaller (although stated as nearly the same diameter). I thought the Mitas' were supposed to be cheap?! Although I suppose it is vs. the Michelin Desert 140/80-18 (from which it is cloned) at $199.
I fit my own, paying $130 (I think) and $140 (I'm sure) now here at Dirt Action. The price jumped $10 with last shipment, something about freight charges. Suspect on road the E09 is better than MT21, off road the MT21 may have it. Life comparson I can't be sure, wouldn't expect much in it, E09 may last a few k longer?
I wasn't fond of the MT21 rear, but mine was half worn and came with the bike.

[warewolf]

I fit my own, paying $130 (I think) and $140 (I'm sure) now here at Dirt Action.That's for a 17" isn't it?

[cooneyr]

That's for a 17" isn't it?

Yep - your one of the few weirdos (read KTM riders) with a 18" rear on an ADV style bike. There has to be at least one downside to owing at KTM :D

Cheers R

[warewolf]

Yep - your one of the few weirdos (read KTM riders) with a 18" rear on an ADV style bike. The weird thing is that when I had an adventure bike with 17" wheels, the tyre people always said I had limited choice because it had roadie-sized wheels, if it had proper dirt-bike sized 18" rims there'd be more choice... can't win!
:blank:

[Oscar]

Yep - your one of the few weirdos (read KTM riders) with a 18" rear on an ADV style bike. There has to be at least one downside to owing at KTM :D

Cheers R

You got to be joking.
I have used DOT approved knobblies (Pirelli MT21) on both on my KTM's.
Much cheaper...

[cooneyr]

You got to be joking.
I have used DOT approved knobblies (Pirelli MT21) on both on my KTM's.
Much cheaper...

Yep :D

But it does seem like there is more choice for Dot knobbies in 17" if you read Warewolf's mumblings on the subject.

Cheers R

[tigs]

Hi,
Just ordered some mitas EO7's for my triumph tiger today. Seems the man in PN now has a range of EO7 tyres in the larger sizes so looking forward to fitting and seeing how they go over the summer.

[warewolf]

But it does seem like there is more choice for Dot knobbies in 17" if you read Warewolf's mumblings on the subject.Different choices. The bulk of this thread is from riders of 17"-reared machines trying to find cheaper tyres from 2nd-tier mainland Asian (or former communist state) manufacturers... and they just don't do the bigger size to suit the 640. The Asians think that a 250cc v-twin is a "big bike".

On top of that, there isn't enough demand for the bigger sizes in NZ, so even if they do make a tyre in the right size, the NZ distributors don't bring it in to the country - such as the Vee Rubber knock-off of the Pirelli MT21.

Conversely, some of the good Euro tyres are only available in the size to suit the 640, most of the Euros at least have one that fits.

[tri boy]

Heres one out of left field for you.

The Volty is starting to do some gravel runs, and I'm looking for suitable tyres.

Front is an 18" rim that will suit approx 90/90, or 3.00 rubber.

Rear is a 17" rim suitable for 120/90 or 4.50.

Looking for something like a Trail Wing, but finding a 18" front is challenging. A TKC 90/90-18 would be the "ducks nuts". does such a thing live in NZ?

[Motu]

I was the same - used to moan about the lack of good tyres in 17'',I longed for a good old 18'' rear wheel.Then when I did get a bike with an 18'' rear wheel I was shocked at the lack of DOT rubber in 18''.

I am really impressed with this MT17 21'' tyre,I don't use the XT off road,but it sure leaves a a good tyre track in mud.I've only used it on gravel and seal,it's totally planted in gravel,I have total confidence in it.I was worried about how it was going to work on seal.....I like it because of the supported edge knobs,but it goes off the edge with 35mm chicken strips on the rear.But no problems,feels great,although it wobbles around a bit at the start of the ride,then I just forget about it.....get on the gas early is the best way to ride with a front knob.

Just saw your post Tri boy - you can get a TKC80 in 4.00 x 18 - it's not a rear tread pattern,looks more like a front tyre.4in is not too far away from 90mm.

[deanohit]

I have a Pirelli MT-90 ($130) on the back of my bike and the OE Cheng-Shin on the front.
The Pirelli is brilliant, done 1500kms of mixed riding on it so far, but mainly seal where it excels.
On seal it works awesome, heats up and grips really well.
On gravel it is skittish unless the bike has some weight on the rear.
And today, I tested it in the mud, was all over the show, but it gripped in the clay enough for me.
The C-S on the front is great in the gravel and mud, grips great.
Lacks grip on the seal, but any knobbly would, I'm beginning to wonder if it will ever wear out, 5500 kms and still HEAPS of tread!

[tri boy]

Thanks for the input guys.
The 18" x 3.00 is the sticky one to find. I want kanny to feel comfortable on gravel as much as possible, so a fairly aggressive front is what i'm after.
Mich Sirac do an 18" but not as aggressive as i want.

[deanohit]

It's gravel mate, not mud shes wanting to do aye?!
The thing is unless you want to change the front back to a road tyre, a less aggresive knobbly might be the go so she can still be confident in the handling on the road aswell.

[rogson]

Shinko SR244? Is made in 300 x18 size. Cheap too!
Don't know whether they are stocked in NZ though.

http://www.shinkotire.co.kr/english/02product/sub01_detail.asp?pcode=AA00050045

[tri boy]

It's gravel mate, not mud shes wanting to do aye?!
The thing is unless you want to change the front back to a road tyre, a less aggresive knobbly might be the go so she can still be confident in the handling on the road aswell.


Yep, mainly gravel, and some wet dirt/gravel roads, plus seal between sections.
I'm really impressed with the TKC on the Scrambler. Handles everything well, and no worries on the seal.
A 3" (90/90) would be an awesome front for the Volty, and since its light, the wear rate would be minimal.

Never thought about Shinko. Cheers for that.:cool:
Havn't found a Trail Wing front in 90/90x18" yet.
Will be fun looking this week.:2thumbsup

[deanohit]

Good luck in your search then mate.

[cooneyr]

........Never thought about Shinko. Cheers for that.:cool:
Havn't found a Trail Wing front in 90/90x18" yet.
Will be fun looking this week.:2thumbsup

The Shinko R244 is available from Budget Motorcycle Spares in Chch. Not much use to you up there but they are in the country.

Cheers R

[NordieBoy]

Shinko SR244? Is made in 300 x18 size. Cheap too!
Don't know whether they are stocked in NZ though.

http://www.shinkotire.co.kr/english/02product/sub01_detail.asp?pcode=AA00050045

I like mine.
Got it from CycleTreads.
Breaks loose fairly easily but has a very smooth and progressive feel.

[tri boy]

Managed to source one of the last B/stone Tw35's in NZ 18"-100/90 for the front of the Volty.:Punk:
Will probably use a TW42 120/90-17 on the rear, as it has better block pattern than a TW36 which is usually mated with the TW35.

TW35 on the left.
TW42 on the right.

[oldrider]

Geez, tyres are just not lasting like they used to. :nono:

I'm starting to looking at replacements "again" damn it! :eek5:

It's just never bloody ending and my dollars are not worth what they used to be either. :angry2:

I spose that's thanks to Helen and her gang of thugs! (Skyryder !! :dodge:) :shutup: John.

[Denniso]

I know that I'm going to get bagged for this but the best tyres I've found for my riding ( 60% gravel , 39% tar , 1% ditch ,oops ) have been lightly cut slicks and proddy race tyres ( Dunlop GPR alpha 10 ) , they work realy well on gravel roads , to the point of the occasional wheel stand (impressive on a DR 650 ) and have also bottomed the forks out under brakes . This has a couple of bonuses , 1 , they are tyres that I would have thrown out as the are no good at the track , so this makes them cheap . 2 , passing sports bikes on the tar is so godammed funny . So far I haven't had too many front end looses , but the front sticks well enough if the throttle is used correctly , the only gravity check so far was a rear end passing the front due to incorrect throttle use . How much bagging am I going to get for darring to suggest a tyre that don't got pointy lumps on it ?

[Motu]

I've always reckoned that compound is more important than tread pattern,on seal,gravel and hard pack anyway.Mud requires tread.

[cooneyr]

I've had a worn Dunlop D605 on the front for a while now and finally got around to getting a new front tyre. I stuck a Dunlop D606 on a couple of days ago before doing the Rainbow, Mangatapu and Molesworth then seal from Hanmer to Nelson. Very impressed with its handling both on road and off. If is a softer compound than the D605 or the MT21 so sticks to the seal really well. I'm not overly agressive on seal but found I have no chicken strips left and felt totaly comfortable at all times. The tread pattern seemed to work really well on all types of gravel (lower end of the Molesworth has been graded and is deep silty gravel northern end is corrugated and firm).

Not sure how long it will last but it is my tyre of choice at the moment. Just this afternoon I've put the D606 rear on which I've had a little experiance with so will be interesting to give the set a spin on the Dusty Butt.

Cheers R

[tri boy]

Put about 500km on the new E-07 while on the WWW ride. First impressions are:
A pretty good all round tyre. Sealed road holding quite impressive, (running at 34psi, and 30psi), although its let down by its tendancy to "break traction" easily on a down shift that the Metz Sahara would of easily handled.
Like wise, it can not "hook up" on gravel under accel any where near as well as the Sahara. gravel pressures were between 20-25psi, (the side wall flex was starting to show its hand at 20)
It does seem to be slightly noisier than the Metz, but this is irrelevant on a M/Cycle with closed circuit mufflers.
High speed on seal weaving can be felt, but this isn't anus puckering to any extent, just not as stable as the Sahara, or even the standard Trail Wings.

Wear rate should be better than both of the previous mentioned tyres, and this is where the decision needs to be made.Do I want/need a better all round tyre like the Metz, (and pay extra for it), or will the Mitas win me over with its pricing.......hmmmm, at this stage I think I will probably lean towards the Metz. That is after I wear the E-07 out, and then fit and try the E-09 thats waiting in the shed.:devil2:


A quick update on the E-07.

On gravel, my opinion of this tyre has dramatically changed. I think its crap:(, and can't wait to peel the bloody thing off the rear of the Scrambler.
Reasons:
Its square profile that has a good amount of tread on the ground while the bike is being ridden upright, turns it into a nervous, "Razor Edge" strip of rubber with little contact on the earth as soon as it deviates off its centre line. No tyre pressure between 15-30psi stopped this behaviour, and the profile you see on the shelf at the bike shop, is pretty much the inflated profile on the rim. Square.
It may be less of an issue on lighter trail bikes, but 200kg has it seriously struggling to hold a decent angle without tipping off that desired angle.
Good for a rear, or side tyre on a Ural sidecar rig only IMHO.

Secondly. Any resonable throttle opening has it spinning up, and traction loss becomes a pain.
This in relation to its inability to maintain traction on moderate downshifts, (it has you fishtailing crazily), makes for a lively ride indeed. The only good thingto come of that, is you learn to trust your front brake for %90 of the time. Even trailing the rear in conjunction with the front has it doing the same.

Im picking the raised "wear strip' of rubber in the centre line has a fair bit to do with the traction fault, and reshaping the profile witha hot knife and grinding disc may help with the lean issues, but I can't be f**ked.

When i get a chance I'll fling it to the back of the Garage, and fit either the TKC, or the E-09 thats waiting.

These comments are solely related to the Scrambler.

[warewolf]

the profile you see on the shelf at the bike shop, is pretty much the inflated profile on the rim. Square.
It may be less of an issue on lighter trail bikes, but 200kg has it seriously struggling to hold a decent angle without tipping off that desired angle.
Good for a rear, or side tyre on a Ural sidecar rig only IMHO.Interesting. Motoz (http://www.motoz.com.au/), the new tyre manufacturer in Aussie producing dirt bike tyres (NHS only so far) with modified profiles as well as treads, for bigger heavier bikes uses a flatter profile on the rear "to get the power to the terrain". But that is relative, and probably not as extreme as the E-07 looks.

[NordieBoy]

What's your rim width?
What size are standard tyres for your bike?

[tri boy]

What's your rim width?
What size are standard tyres for your bike?


130/80-17.

[Motu]

Exactly the same problem I'm having with the IRC GP110.....I've don't a couple of posts about it.It has a rounded profile so is still pretty good on seal - but the central strip that I suppose gives good wear really makes it a crap tyre on gravel.No hook up,and totally out of control on brakes.

[NordieBoy]

130/80-17.

The 140 width E-07 dosn't have the central strip.
Could be your rim is wider than the DR type and flattening off the profile?

Or you've just got too much power.

[tri boy]

Possibly true re the profile.

Definitely not true re power. The beastie is, how shall i say it, moderately en dowered pony wise.<_<

[Ixion]

My E-07 doesn't have a central strip. It's squarish, but not completely square. About the same as the old Avon Speedmaster.Just alternating blocks

Seems OK on gravel to me , though I'm nowhere near in the league of you guys.

One thing I do notice is that the sideways-sticking-out-little-knobs do a good job of stopping the wheel sliding down into ruts.

I feel more comfortable with it than I did with the Trailwings. But the Trailwings felt more comfortable on seal. The E07 does actually hang on well, but theres a point where it roills round off the big main knobs onto the smaller side knobs with a very disconcerting lurch. It's actually OK, the side knobs take over, but it feels very OhMyGawd.

[tri boy]

know what you mean with regards to the Ohmygawd moment. It did that on the seal last weekend. Felt like I had rolled right off the edge of the tyre, an then it settled, but shit it takes you by surprise,(like gooey tar that would be invisible).

The centre strip is more like a raised rubber band that sits higher than the rest of the carcass, but still below the seperate blocks.
this decreases the block depth in the middle, and possibly is causing the traction dramas, or maybe its the compound.
Either way, its gunna be an emergency tyre. the TKC will be fitted for the passes ride, with a new TKC up front. (the fr has clocked up 8500km and is finally starting to lose its surefootedness).

[NordieBoy]

I never noticed an "edge" to mine even though there were no chicken strips but on the road I was running 36psi in the rear and 25-30psi gravel. Some people say the same about the Kenda 720? You tip it into a corner and there's a definate "edge" you've got to get over. The IRC and Shinko clones don't have the same problem.

If you ever need spare cash there's a few DR pilots that'd take it of your hands :D

[NordieBoy]

My E-07 doesn't have a central strip. It's squarish, but not completely square.

130 or 140 width?

[NordieBoy]

Definitely not true re power. The beastie is, how shall i say it, moderately en dowered pony wise.<_<

But the ponies are "big boned".

[warewolf]

Some people say the same about the Kenda 720? You tip it into a corner and there's a definate "edge" you've got to get over. Do you mean the Kenda K270? On it the edge is very close to the centreline, it happens as soon as you start to tip in. Kinda makes it fun not scary as you are not cranked over when it happens.

[Ixion]

130 or 140 width?

130/80-17

I had a closer look, and maybe I do have the central strip thing. But it's VERY small, if it is the same thing. In the centre of the tyre, about 1 mm high. I thought it was a wear bar (ie, time to replace the tyre); I think it probably is, still. Certainly once you got the tyre worn down to that point, it wouldn't pass a WoF. It's nothing like the IRC Mr Motu was talking about , where the central strip was full height down the middle of the tyre (ie the knobs in the centre are continuous). I'm not sure if it is the same thing Mr TriBoy was talking about or not. If it is, I'd say his tyre is worn out anyway.

I measured the curviness of the tyre : put the bike upright , and measured the VERTICAL distance from the floor to the edge of the tread. It was about 40mm. That's not as curved as a sprotsbike tyre, but certainly not flat . it's a 130 tyre so half that is 65mm. So a perfectly "round" section tyre , that vertical distance would have been 65mm. 40mm in the real world is a reasonable curve.

The rim does seem small for the tyre, theres's a lot of tumblehome on the sidewalls.I suspect the Triumph would have wider rims. maybe the Mitas doesn't like wide rims ?

[greerADV]

After far too much reading in this thread, I think I've finally decided on the Mitas E07 for my replacements.

And after a couple calls to some local shops with replies of, "A what?" when I've asked if they carried them, I think I need some help in locating a pair. Anyone know who carries them and what kind of price to expect?

I'm in Wanaka but can get anything from Dunedin/Invercargill/Alex shipped up for free (working for a bus company has it's advantages, sometimes.) So if cost is all the same, I'd obviously go with a shop in one of the above, instead of paying the shipping.

Cheers
Andrew

[greerADV]

So I manged to find a set of E07s through LMS Imports. It'll be $264 shipped to me in Wanaka. $110 front, $130 rear, $24 for shipping. The price sounds reasonable to me, but being my first set of replacement tyres I really have nothing to base it on.

Anyone know if this is a decent deal for the Mitas E07s?

Cheers
Andrew

[tri boy]

So I manged to find a set of E07s through LMS Imports. It'll be $264 shipped to me in Wanaka. $110 front, $130 rear, $24 for shipping. The price sounds reasonable to me, but being my first set of replacement tyres I really have nothing to base it on.

Anyone know if this is a decent deal for the Mitas E07s?

Cheers
Andrew

Yep a good deal from the importer. He hasn't raised the price for 6mths.:msn-wink:

[greerADV]

Yep a good deal from the importer. He hasn't raised the price for 6mths.:msn-wink:

Thanks for that. I had better order them now before it goes up again! :D

[tri boy]

Nordie hit the nail square on the head re rim size and its relation to the "squareness/knife edge feeling" relating to the E-07's, and I'm certain a similar square profile will happen with the E-09.

The Scrambler rear rim is a 3.50". I measured the bead width of the old Metz Sahara, (which was an excellent tyre), it has a width of 3.50".
I then measured the TKC thats waiting in the wings, it has a bead width of 3.50".

Next, I checked the E-09 that is ready for winter. 3.00". The E-07 had a 3.00" bead width, was a bitch to fit. (lifted skin off my knuckles just trying to feed the tube in, and locate the stem):mad:, and needed a heap of soap, and high pressure(100psi) with a high flow to Bead out.
This explains the piss poor handling, and the squarish appearance to the profile.

Cheers Nordie. Bling to you sir.:niceone:

[Ixion]

Ay-up. Just checked the rear rim size on the Yamaha. 2.5 inch. I said it seemed narrow. Which is why my profile is rounded .

So, the Mitas is not suitable for bikes with large rims.

[oldrider]

As I have posted before on tyres, I really am a fan of the Mitas E07, especially on the later model TransAlps.

Admittedly I did not fully utilize the ones I had because I sold the bike.

While I had it the Mitas E07 tyres were the best by a long shot on every surface I tried them on.

They certainly are funny looking tyres but they stick like bloody glue.

My wife and I were very close to wiping out in a ford over by Naseby one day.

I believe we would have lost it completely had it not been for the E07's, it was a fantastic recovery!

She coolly enquired a little further down the track if that was as close as she thought it was.

She said she was getting ready for the ouch but suddenly everything was OK again.

I love it when that happens!

On my way up to trade the Tranny in on the Tiger I thought I had not really tested the E07's on the wet Tarmac at speed.

It was wet so I gave her a bit of a work out.

They were good enough to take all I could give them on the windies through the Shenandoah's.

They never felt like letting go at any stage, front or back.

It was enough to make me tell my self off and to just concentrate on delivering the bike safely to the dealer for the trade in!

I was very disappointed to find I could not get E07's for my Tiger so am now looking at buying a set of Pirelli Scorpions!

Sooner rather than later too, Damn it, more bloody $$$$$ to pay out. :doh: Cheers John.

[Ixion]

Ah-ha! And I just looked up the rim size for the Transalp. Guess what. Yep, 2.5 inch rear .

[NordieBoy]

Nordie hit the nail square on the head re rim size and its relation to the "squareness/knife edge feeling" relating to the E-07's, and I'm certain a similar square profile will happen with the E-09.

The Scrambler rear rim is a 3.50". I measured the bead width of the old Metz Sahara, (which was an excellent tyre), it has a width of 3.50".
I then measured the TKC thats waiting in the wings, it has a bead width of 3.50".

Next, I checked the E-09 that is ready for winter. 3.00". The E-07 had a 3.00" bead width, was a bitch to fit. (lifted skin off my knuckles just trying to feed the tube in, and locate the stem):mad:, and needed a heap of soap, and high pressure(100psi) with a high flow to Bead out.
This explains the piss poor handling, and the squarish appearance to the profile.

Cheers Nordie. Bling to you sir.:niceone:

Check the bead width on the 140 width E-07 then.

[tri boy]

Might do that through winter. In the mean time I've got to wear out:
1x New TKC.
1x 1/2 worn Sahara.
1x 1/2 worn Trail Wing.
Decide what to do with a brand new E-09, and a 90% new E-07.


More rubber than at a swingers night sitting here.:buggerd:

[marks]

the 21" front tire on the DT230 is just about done. I was thinking about putting a TKC80 on it.

Is the fact the the DT is quite light (120 odd kg) going to make any difference in tire choice?

The DT will be my 'adventure bike' until I have earned enough brownie points by redoing our bathroom sometime this year

cheers

Mark

[NordieBoy]

the 21" front tire on the DT230 is just about done. I was thinking about putting a TKC80 on it.

Is the fact the the DT is quite light (120 odd kg) going to make any difference in tire choice?

The DT will be my 'adventure bike' until I have earned enough brownie points by redoing our bathroom sometime this year

I'd go for something with smaller knobs for the lighter bike.
Try a Shinko 244 from CycleTreads for about $50.

[warewolf]

I'd go for something with smaller knobs for the lighter bike.The TKC80 in 21" has smaller knobs and a tighter spacing that the 19" jobs.

[tri boy]

the TKC 19" on the fr of "Fatty" is taking its time to wear out. (8k and 60% worn), so on the DT I would think it will last for freeking yonks.
Expensive, but could be great value in the long run.

I know nothing about Shinko's, lesbian love, Elephant hearing, Hindu marriage ceremonies, Platypus habitat choice............:zzzz:

[Motu]

Is the fact the the DT is quite light (120 odd kg) going to make any difference in tire choice?


The DT230 is not a light bike for what it is - a 225cc 2 stroke.But it's a 2 stroke and that makes a bigger difference to the front wheel than weight - when you shut the throttle on a 2 stroke it doesn't weight and load up the front wheel like a thumper.You can come into soft,thick and loose stuff with the throttle shut and the front will just roll over top,a thumper will sink in and you will fight it.So yeah,a TKC80 would do nicely.....I just can't stomach the price.

[tri boy]

Right. The Mitas E-07 has been removed from Fatty, (scramblers new nickname), and the new TKC80 is fitted up.
The Sth Isld ride early next month will be a great test of it's durability under all road conditions, plus I will be quite loaded up at times, so handling will be interesting also.
First important point I have noted, is it's ease to Bead Out.(30-40psi), and it ease to fit. These points are almost worth the cost alone. The Mitas took a bit of effort to break the bead by hand/levers.
The other point is that the side wall actually feels softer/more pliable than the E-09 that sat next to it.
13500km was the fitted milage, and 10.0mm cntr tread depth.

The new fr TKC will be fitted next weekish.

[emaN]

...The Mitas took a bit of effort to break the bead by hand/levers....
dude, you're making me feel bad now:shifty:

[tri boy]

dude, you're making me feel bad now:shifty:

Alls good mate.;) Had a similar hold up changing, and beading the tyres on kanny's Volty.
Would love a decent bead breaker at home.:yes:
Can't have everything I guess.

Pic of the Mitas heading your way.

[emaN]

just finished.
she's all gassed up, oil&filter done, almost new rear tyre (big ups to tri boy!) lookin' nice & shiny, just waiting for her rightful owner to go ticky-touring around NZ...again.
if ya see a greeny XT with an older chap cruising around, say g'day to him...proper good sort!
i'll take a pic of him & the bike when he gets here and post it up.

[warewolf]

Has anyone used a Pirelli MT21 and Mitas E-09 on the same bike? Can you give me an indication of the relative durability of them, please?

The E-09 costs more than the MT21 at my local shop.

[Transalper]

I can tell you that the E09 lasts a little longer that a D606 if that's any help. The E09 grips the seal better IMO but isn't quite as good in the dirt as the D606.

If you can compare the D606 with the MT21 then you may be able to work it out.

[warewolf]

Thanks Carl. From what I've read previously the MT21 and D606 are pretty much equal in many respects. I was hoping the E-09 would have more grip in the dirt (mud, actually), so if it's less I'll give it a miss.

[Transalper]

Check with cooneyr later, he is about to give an E09 rear a try. Has a D606 rear on at the moment.

[cooneyr]

Its not going to be till about the CCA ride before the E09 goes on. There is probably still another 1000kms in the D606 rear.

Cheers R

[Transalper]

You could take care of that in a day you know.:laugh:

[cooneyr]

Well it only took one day and 1000kms to deal to the first 2/3rds of the tyre :D Was pretty hard on the rear tyre during the dusty butt but hope to get a few more kms (relatively) out the last 1/3rd.

Cheers R

[tri boy]

This is a bit of an update on how the TKC80 handles being on the fr of the Scrambler.
The worn one has done 8500km on a 50/50 split of seal/gravel. As you can see there is still a heap of life in it, as is only coming off so the new tkc can do the sth isld. I'll run the old one out with the old Sahara/Trailwing/old rear TKC.
I like the TKC on the front, and see no need to change while the bike continues as a back road mount.(that may change, as I'm thinking of getting a DR/XR/KTM or similar for more adv riding).
They may cost around the $180-200 mark but it's quite good value if sure footedness on and off road is what you need.
Pressures have generally been around the 25-30psi range.

[Motu]

I just scored this tyre - being out of step with the rest of the world means I get to pick up things others don't want.I didn't know they made these things in 21in,I thought they only come in 19in...but there are 18in made too.No NHS markings,no DOT label.

So what is it?

<IMG src= 'http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/5288/tyrezl7.jpg'>

[XF650]

Thanks Carl. From what I've read previously the MT21 and D606 are pretty much equal in many respects. I was hoping the E-09 would have more grip in the dirt (mud, actually), so if it's less I'll give it a miss.

Rode the Macetown track on Wednesday with EO9 rear on the DT230, @ 20psi. Seemed to match my limited ability quite well but not much mud that day to really test the tyre. It did move around a bit in loose sand, where a more trail biased tyre would have been better. No issues with all those river crossings though.
So based on what I have "heard", is the EO9 comparable to the TK80?.

[Motu]

I've always reckoned that compound is more important than tread pattern,on seal,gravel and hard pack anyway.Mud requires tread.

True....

I see no one was interested in my tyre,and that's why I was able to get it for a bargain price. It's a Dunlop K180 dirt track tyre - the genuine flattrack tyre.They don't sell the 21in in the US,the 19in is the official tyre....but the 21 must be made for MX bikes to do short track.Man,I would of given anything to have one of these when I was riding on the dirt track,I had to settle for a speedway rear on the front and a trials on the rear.

So I fitted it to my spare wheel and slotted it into the XT620 and took it for a shake down ride today - and man I'm impressed,I think I found the perfect tyre.As I said,compound is important on hard pack,and this tyre is very,very good on gravel.It looks like a street tyre,but it tracks better than the knobs I've always had on this bike before,never slipped once and I was pushing it hard....I can get the throttle on real early and forget about the front,no slip,no tuck.And as you would expect it's very good on seal too,I can get over the front wheel and push it really hard,something I didn't do with the knobs.

So for my adventure riding,which is mainly gravel and the tight nasty seal roads to get to the gravel it has to be the perfect tyre,I reckon it would be good on grass and sand too.....but not a mud tyre.Now for a rear tyre....

[Oscar]

True....

I see no one was interested in my tyre,and that's why I was able to get it for a bargain price. It's a Dunlop K180 dirt track tyre - the genuine flattrack tyre.They don't sell the 21in in the US,the 19in is the official tyre....but the 21 must be made for MX bikes to do short track.Man,I would of given anything to have one of these when I was riding on the dirt track,I had to settle for a speedway rear on the front and a trials on the rear.

So I fitted it to my spare wheel and slotted it into the XT620 and took it for a shake down ride today - and man I'm impressed,I think I found the perfect tyre.As I said,compound is important on hard pack,and this tyre is very,very good on gravel.It looks like a street tyre,but it tracks better than the knobs I've always had on this bike before,never slipped once and I was pushing it hard....I can get the throttle on real early and forget about the front,no slip,no tuck.And as you would expect it's very good on seal too,I can get over the front wheel and push it really hard,something I didn't do with the knobs.

So for my adventure riding,which is mainly gravel and the tight nasty seal roads to get to the gravel it has to be the perfect tyre,I reckon it would be good on grass and sand too.....but not a mud tyre.Now for a rear tyre....


Is it pretty soft?
How fast do it wear?

[warewolf]

From the CCA thread;


Well that looks like it rules me out. XF650 & I were getting quite keen and excited, but this with the changed criteria (previously said something like it was suitable for all adventure bikes including large bikes and pillions) looks too much on the trail side of adventure riding for me. While the E07's are OK in the shingle I'm not really convinced they are right for me and the riding I do, and was considering slightly less aggressive tyres, not knobblies.


Criteria hasn't changed. It's always been OK for all adventure bikes... with the proviso that they have adventure tyres, not general purpose/trail tyres.

Not singling out timg - he is not alone nor the target of this post - but quoting him for context; the sentiment is common. For the interest of those getting in to adventure riding and reading this thread for background...

The Capital Coast Adventure ride is not unique in its demands on tyres. In my experience, no organised adventure ride will accept less. Adventure rides are organised to get in to less-accessible places, usually in tandem with more technical riding - which is what most riders want. Remember, the mystic beauty of any place is inversely proportional to the size of the car park.

In other words, if you want to do any organised adventure rides, you're gonna need TKC80s or equivalents, or better.

As a further aside and gross generalisation, I have noticed that road riders getting in to adventure riding tend to have a limited view; limited dirt experience by definition. Frequently they are under-skilled on over-size and under-tyred bikes (been there, done that meself). One very noticeable effect of this is that they consider the likes of the TKC80 as "phuck-off knobblies" (to quote Big Dave's lovely phraseology) whereas motocross riders consider them "slicks". It's one of those adventure-riding compromise things. For a road rider, going from a sports radial to a thing with slight gaps in the shallow tread is a compromise; for a motocrosser, going from a Not for Highway Service mud-chucker to a road-legal enduro tyre is a compromise.

[timg]

Wasn't bitchin about the ride, more acknowledging where my focus and level of skill is. Initially I thought this was a large bike/pillion friendly ride, and if so would suit my skills and less 'trail' oriented bike setup. Now that I know it's not, it's no big deal but just not for me. Adventure bikes are all about compromise as you say, I choose to be at the softer end of the scale :) (& I've never owned a road bike, just 30+ years of small XL/XR's :) ) Cheers.

[bart]

OK, I've read about half of this thread and got bored. Got one of the Conti TKC80 thingies for the back. Thought I got ripped paying $190. Turns out it may have been worth it.

Cheers guys :niceone:

I can tell the missus I got a bargain...........she won't believe me.

I'll let you know how long it takes to rip to shreds on the gravel.

[pete376403]

True....

I see no one was interested in my tyre,and that's why I was able to get it for a bargain price. It's a Dunlop K180 dirt track tyre -
So where did you find it?

[Motu]

So where did you find it?

Boyds in Hamilton.I got it for $79,they want US$130 on the internet...so a bargain I reckon.It's soft,but not overly so Oscar - because the knob things are long and there are very definite grooves it tracks very well and doesn't move around like any other dirt tyre.On the front with my riding style it's not going to wear much,but it might be a different story on the rear.....but what doesn't....I'm not going to be tossing it into a corner with no brakes and scrubbing off speed with a front wheel slide these days,but it's capable of doing that,so a lot more tyre than I can use.

Having used trials tyres (real ones) and speedway tyres on dirt tracks,gravel and seal,I know they offer more grip in these conditions than normal dirt tyres,so was pretty confidant that a flattrack tyre would do the job too.

[NordieBoy]

Boyds in Hamilton.I got it for $79,they want US$130 on the internet...so a bargain I reckon.

They got any more? :shifty:

[tri boy]

Going to get 6000km+ out of the rear TKC80 130/80-17 on the Scrambler.:cool:Thanks for the pressure advice Oscar. 36 and 28psi did just fine in 90% of the terrain.
They stick really well on the seal too.
Next will be a E-09 on the rear.

[offrd]

I am just scrubbing in a pair of E-09's on the Beemer... Was a wet day when i rode it out of the workshop after fitting, Gently wound on some power as i pulled out onto the wet road..........:blink:

Mate on his Ducati 900 supersport was following me.....

He was pretty sure he was about to witness me turn inside out and dump it in the middle of SH1 as it fish tailed down the road on the wet seal..... :argh:

But no, i held onto it :clap:, Now the slippery, look nice new tyre stuff has gone they feel ok in the wet, Time will tell, still taking it easy! Best way to get the tyre shine stuff they came on was fang it in the gravel on a dry day!

42 this weekend, Kawhia run end of March and then the reason i bought the tyres in April! The CCA! :drool:

[OregonKiwi]

Perrelli MT21's-aggressive
Metzler Tourance-good all round tourer, more street though. (i liked them in the gravel & rocks too.
Anyone tried MEFO's?-all round

[NordieBoy]

Perrelli MT21's-aggressive
Metzler Tourance-good all round tourer, more street though. (i liked them in the gravel & rocks too.
Anyone tried MEFO's?-all round

Which Mefos?

[OregonKiwi]

Which Mefos?



Check this KLR site out Nordieboy.
Thinking of getting these next time.

http://klr650.com/MEFO%20Sport%20Tires.htm

[NordieBoy]

Check this KLR site out Nordieboy.
Thinking of getting these next time.

Mefo Explorers are very similar to the Mitas E-07 tyres most of us here are very happy with. I got 15000km out of the rear with good grip right to the bitter end.
The traction is more a function of the rubber compound than the knob edges with these tyres. If you're not into wheel spinning they're probably. a better tyre for you than a knobbly and they go very well on the seal as well.

[OregonKiwi]

Cheers Nordie, spinning tires... what,me?
I need to stop wheelying off the lights...it is fun though.

[Qkchk]

Cheers Nordie, spinning tires... what,me?
I need to stop wheelying off the lights...it is fun though.

Hahaha just because you can! :lol:

[XF650]

As a result of the organisers recconmending "sharp" knobblies for the KTM CCA ride this weekend, I have had these fitted to the DT230.
They are DOT approved to 130km/hr but I imagine cornering at that speed would be quite exciting.
The tyres are reversable and pricing is good @ $80 front & $90 rear.
Haven't really had a chance to scrub them in yet but have noticed the rear is very easy to lock up under brakes, a typical knobbly trait I suppose. Traction in gravel is excellent though, way better than the EO9 that I replaced.

Will be interesting to see how well they handle & wear but I'm being realistic and will re-fit the EO9 for the run to the Brass.

[XF650]

A quick update on the BFGoodrich rear tyre wear.
Rode the bike (loaded) from Blenhim to Plimmerton (yes, via ferry) @ 20psi. Then did the CCA ride where they performed very well @ 15psi. Pumped back up to 20psi to commute around Upper Hutt & Wellington for 4 days. Then rode back to Blenheim, once again loaded.
Measured the rear lugs & only 3mm wear !!
OK, the centre knobs are obviously harder compound plus I probably ride like a nana, but I'm still impressed.

[simonnn]

Doing mostly road i.e. commute every day as well as a gravel road toy and the occassional foray into Woodhill and Riverhead forests on the TTR600 I've used Dunlop D505s (I think) MT21 and TKC80s. The 505s and MT21s were great on gravel and off road but are completely shagged by 6000ks the contis are better on road and last longer. The MT21 front is also hellishly noisy on tarmac at 60ish kmph. Next will be something even more road oriented since I do 96% road 3% gravel and 1% or less off road. It's a game of compromise as with the bikes, and both are good starters for religeous arguments.

You need to try out Michelin Bajas.

Like a hard terrain dirt tyre but they hook up ok on the road although are better suited to the gravel and dirt.

Derived from Paris Dakar tyres I have yet to find a better serious adventure tyre.

[Transalper]

Anyone out there using the Mitas C-02 (http://www.ityre.com/en/tyres/catalog/mitas/size/9215/)rear tyre.
If you are, what pressure do you run on sealed road?

Edit:
It's ok now, it was a real walker when new, but now it's broken in it is preforming more like expected and I have got it up to my usual kind of pressures.

[mountainboy65]

I'm running a Dunlop 606 at the back and a TKC 80 on the front (Honda XR650R)...superb combination for all sorts of great adventure riding! Ed

[_Shrek_]

i have been runing Eo7's for nearly two years now averaging 16k on the rear after i sold my Gs650 & bought the Gs1150 i put on a set of Eo8's wanted to see how they went as they looked a bit like a tourance i got 16k out of the rear front has just ticked over 19k still has 5m left on it

i do not reconmend them as they tend to let go on corners wash out on the metal

i put an Eo7 back on the rear & what a differance both on & off the tar seal wet or dry even thow the tyre is smaller than what it came out with ie: 150x17 where as the biggist Eo7 is 140x17 so now the bike responds alot quicker when cornering
as i do 60/40 just in my normal use i have found the Eo7's a great all rounder for what i do so will be putting an Eo7 on the front asap

[Eddieb]

I've just put a set of Vee Rubber VRM163 on the Massey Ferguson G/S so will see how they go.

Mileage when they went on was 5990 miles.

The first few km's were pretty hairy. I had TKC80 on the back that had done 7000 miles and the front was a Trailwing that had been on since before time, well at least 2 owners back anyway. Both tyres were very flat profile and the Vee Rubber is a very round profile so that took some adjusting.

The VRM163's are an adv style tyre, I wanted something a bit more road biased from what I had as I don't tend to get anywhere worse than gravel or hard packed dirt. Cost was $200 even for the pair.

[NordieBoy]

I've just put a set of Vee Rubber VRM163 on the Massey Ferguson G/S so will see how they go.

Looks very TW42'ish.

Wonder what the compound is like compared to the "death wings".

[Motu]

Very much like the TW42,although the TW42 is a bit wider in the grooves,but that depends on size.I've just got another TW42 to match my K180 front - they are a great tyre on seal,gravel and hardpack....but shit in mud or anything slippery.They were the only tyre to cope with the power and weight of the XLV750 on seal,everything else was torn to shreds or let go....but they still gave good drive in gravel.

I wanted a tyre with a softer compound to match the K180,and the blocks are shallow,not cube shaped like a knob - this means they won't flex and bend when pushed hard.Be keen to see how they last - I ever got much over 4,000kms out of the TW42's.

[NordieBoy]

I wanted a tyre with a softer compound to match the K180,and the blocks are shallow,not cube shaped like a knob - this means they won't flex and bend when pushed hard.

That's what I liked about the Mitas e-07's. A nice soft compound and big strips of rubber, not knobs.
Use the compound to grip rather than just the knob edges.

[timg]

I tried the E07's on the recommendation of several folks who's opinions I respect, and I know a lot of folks rate these tyres. Unfortunately I did not like them on the Transalp. They were fine on the shingle when new, however once worn a bit the rear had no grip under power or braking. I ride so s l o w I make James May look qiuck! :eek: The lack of straight line grip in shingle may have something to do with the wide centre band in the tread pattern which when the tyre is 1/2 worn or so is exposed. The 140 wide E07 doesn't have it but the 120/90/17 & 130/80/17 do.

On the seal they provided plenty of grip, I even did a 'rider development day' at Levels on them.

There's no question regarding their longevity. I got 12230 km out of the front and the rear is about 2/3 worn at the same mileage. (I said I ride like a nana OK)

So why else didn't I like em? The rear tyre was a square profile when it went on and got even more squared off with wear. However the biggest annoyance was the vibration from them which on a realitively smooth V-twin (unlike Mr Hardly Developedsom's bikes) was really annoying on the seal. They were balanced when fitted, and again after about 2000km. I was going to put something more road orientated on like a Tourance, MT90 or E08 on until I happened to be on a ride with Shrek and saw the lack of grip he had with E08's on a minor river crossing.

On the SI Passes ride Triboy and Delphinus both had TKC80's that seemed to perform well in mixed riding so for the Brass Monkey I put a pair of TKC80's on. What a revelation they were. Great on the shingle through the Haka/Danseys/Blackforest etc & good on the seal in the wet or dry. 1027km for the weekend with no drama's over most kinds of roads I'm likely to encounter and they were a much smoother ride than the E07's.

If anybody wants an E07 130/80/17 with 4-5000 km wear left in it PM me and pick it up :)

Cheers.

[Transalper]

....

If anybody wants an E07 130/80/17 with 4-5000 km wear left in it PM me and pick it up :)

Cheers.
If you are giving it away and no one else wants it I will finish it off for you.
I have an oversize 140 E07 to try on the DR sometime. Theory being that the thing will sit with a more rounded profile and so cut through the shingle better.
Also as you say the 140 doesn't have that solid band in the center.

[timg]

If you are giving it away and no one else wants it I will finish it off for you.


Yep - free to a good home :) It's got your name on it. Give me a call some time when you're out this way or what ever. Cheers

[_Shrek_]

this Eo8 front has done 20226kms at 25-29psi
i'm not sure if you can see that the tread looked like it had lifted from the casing
the rear Eo8 i got 16000k & it still had 2mm left that was run at 34psi
bike weighs 239kgs me a petite 132.5kgs

good mileage but would only reconmend it be used on seal & by someone who does not push their bike hard

timg i would be keen to know what psi you were running

[timg]

timg i would be keen to know what psi you were running

I stick with the recommended pressures for my bike 29/29 and 29/33 two up or loaded.

[NordieBoy]

I stick with the recommended pressures for my bike 29/29 and 29/33 two up or loaded.

How many km's did you get out of the e-07's?

[timg]

How many km's did you get out of the e-07's?
See post 251 :)

[Peril]

E09 on the rear at 2000ish Km's...does half worn sound bad?:eek5:
I do have a heavy right hand off road mind you...

[JATZ]

I tried the E07's on the recommendation of several folks who's opinions I respect, and I know a lot of folks rate these tyres. Unfortunately I did not like them on the Transalp. They were fine on the shingle when new, however once worn a bit the rear had no grip under power or braking. I ride so s l o w I make James May look qiuck! :eek: The lack of straight line grip in shingle may have something to do with the wide centre band in the tread pattern which when the tyre is 1/2 worn or so is exposed. The 140 wide E07 doesn't have it but the 120/90/17 & 130/80/17 do.

On the seal they provided plenty of grip, I even did a 'rider development day' at Levels on them.

There's no question regarding their longevity. I got 12230 km out of the front and the rear is about 2/3 worn at the same mileage. (I said I ride like a nana OK)

So why else didn't I like em? The rear tyre was a square profile when it went on and got even more squared off with wear. However the biggest annoyance was the vibration from them which on a realitively smooth V-twin (unlike Mr Hardly Developedsom's bikes) was really annoying on the seal. They were balanced when fitted, and again after about 2000km. I was going to put something more road orientated on like a Tourance, MT90 or E08 on until I happened to be on a ride with Shrek and saw the lack of grip he had with E08's on a minor river crossing.



Cheers.

Interesting comments. I'm needing a set of rubber for the DR soon and was thinking of E-07's.
Might have to go back to the drawing board (or have another rum or 2) and think about it

[Quasievil]

Im running Avon Distanzia and bloody impressed, not expensive $350 a set and good off road (gravel) and on road, Im sold on them. Done 5000kms and bucket loads left.

[NordieBoy]

See post 251 :)

231.

I was running 35psi in the rear and 32 front on seal and about 18f 20r on gravel and got 15000 out of the rear and it kept the grip right down to the bitter end.

[oldrider]

Interesting comments. I'm needing a set of rubber for the DR soon and was thinking of E-07's.
Might have to go back to the drawing board (or have another rum or 2) and think about it

It's personal, try them. (EO7's)

I had them on my 650 TransAlp and loved them but didn't wear them out because I sold the bike first.

Timg didn't like them on his T/A but then again you just might find they suit you on your bike.

I was not as fussy about the front as I was with the rear.

but Oddly enough the front was put on back to front (rotation) and I didn't notice at first. ( about 800km before I had a chance change it)

I thought it was better that way and didn't perform so well when it was correctly fitted.

IMHO Mitas EO7's are a bloody good all round tyre. :yes: Cheers John.

[NordieBoy]

Interesting comments. I'm needing a set of rubber for the DR soon and was thinking of E-07's.
Might have to go back to the drawing board (or have another rum or 2) and think about it

Ask Murray (Nerdneh) what he thought of them.
You've got quite a narrow rim on the back of the DR havn't you? - It'd keep a nice round profile on the E-07.

For offroad biased adventuring I'd go with the E-07 rear and a more knobblie front like an MT-21 (The Aussies seem to like that combo).

[cooneyr]

E09 on the rear at 2000ish Km's...does half worn sound bad?:eek5:
I do have a heavy right hand off road mind you...

Thats better that I get out of the D606's. The one I used for the Dusty Butt 08 (the year we finished) was pretty well done in about 2000kms with about 3mm left and the one on at the moment is about 2500 with about 5mm left. New is 14mm. I've taken to running the D606's at 30psi the whole time - did the "monkeying about the brass" trip though snow, mud, gravel and seal all at this pressure. Doesn't seem to affect grip to adversely for most of the riding I do and they defiantly last longer - maybe it has something to do with the loaded bike.

Seriously contemplating a mitchy desert for the next tyre. About $180 for the rear but from what I've read and heard I figure it will last quite a bit longer. Just hoping that a 140 will fit.

Cheers R

[Peril]

It's times like those I wish I had a spare rear rim.One for street work and one to throw on for the adv/trail rides with a decent road legal knobbly on.
I've just read that around 2000kms is actually pretty good on the E09.So I'd guess I should see another 1000-1200kms before it's throw away time.Might also look at the Michelin as well.

[Transalper]

....
I thought it was better that way and didn't perform so well when it was correctly fitted.

IMHO Mitas EO7's are a bloody good all round tyre. :yes: Cheers John.

I have heard of a few people that prefer the front E07 installed backwards for shingle performance.
They also put an oversize rear on too.

[oldrider]

I have heard of a few people that prefer the front E07 installed backwards for shingle performance.
They also put an oversize rear on too.

I am disappointed that Mitas EO7's are not readily available for the Tiger.

The Tiger is a great all round venture tourer but I must confess to being "very, very," careful just where I take it or point it.

I would like to lower it a bit but don't want to compromise the excellent handling attributes that it delivers for the riding we do most of.

I only need it to be lower and have more confidence building tyres in order to take the bike into more challenging (albeit modest) off road type of situations.

Quite frankly I don't really have the legs or probably the balls for some of that riding any more (been there done that) and the Tiger is a big top heavy bike for an old guy (and lady) to manage when the shit hits the fan!

With the bike set up to go that little bit further, (as history has proven that even) frail old guys still try to bight off more than they can chew and try to go where they shouldn't!

I will just stick with my Pirelli Scorpion S/T's and leave the bike the way it is and limit our touring to tarmac, gravel and very predictable farm tracks. (Sigh) :shifty:

I guess that clearly illustrates what the term, "Ridin like your Nana" really means! :lol: Cheers John.

[jezzaNZ]

Seriously contemplating a mitchy desert for the next tyre. About $180 for the rear but from what I've read and heard I figure it will last quite a bit longer. Just hoping that a 140 will fit.

Cheers R[/QUOTE]

Ryan like I said the rear Desert on the XTZ has 10k km on it and still has a little wear left. I totally recommend this tire for larger machines as I have had fantastic wear and has an awsome tread that gives huge grip off-road as will as OK handeling on road. Mind you a good chunk of the 10k was commuting but still pretty good for a knob!

Hey it is the tire of choice for Dakar riders...need I say any more.

Reasonably prices also!

[cooneyr]

Ryan like I said the rear Desert on the XTZ has 10k km on it and still has a little wear left. I totally recommend this tire for larger machines as I have had fantastic wear and has an awsome tread that gives huge grip off-road as will as OK handeling on road. Mind you a good chunk of the 10k was commuting but still pretty good for a knob!

Hey it is the tire of choice for Dakar riders...need I say any more.

Reasonably prices also!

You dont need to convince me, I'm sold on one, the only thing I need to check is that the 140 will fit. John mentioned that the one on the XTZ had 10k on it - that's crazy kms on a knobbie.

Cheers R

[jezzaNZ]

Ryan, the one on the 950 after doing 1800km at the Brass only looks to be about 20-30% worn. Still a lot of life left in it even on the bigger machine!

Have a look on the Michellin web site for fitment. I know the 450 will fit a 140 in a Perelli but although they say it is a 140 they are equivalent to a 120 in other brands.

[warewolf]

Have a look on the Michellin web site for fitment. I know the 450 will fit a 140 in a Perelli but although they say it is a 140 they are equivalent to a 120 in other brands.You are mixing up two tyre sizing standards here.

One measures the overall width including tread knobs (eg 140/80-18). This is the ETRTO (European Tyre and Rim Technical Organisation) standard, aka ISO.
The other measures only the carcass width (eg 120/100-18).
Note that changing the width number affects the reported aspect ratio, too, as the height doesn't change. The above two tyre sizes are physically the same, or near enough.

Typically, road tyres & Euro dirt tyres use the ETRTO system. The Japanese will use either for their dirtbike tyres. Americans tend to the latter.

The relationship between the two sizes is roughly:

80/100-21 = 90/90-21
100/100-18 = 120/90-18
110/100-18 = 130/80-18
120/100-18 = 140/80-18

[warewolf]

Seriously contemplating a mitchy desert for the next tyre. About $180 for the rear but from what I've read and heard I figure it will last quite a bit longer. Just hoping that a 140 will fit.I've just been down that route and decided against it. The Michelin Desert (http://two-wheels.michelin.com/2w/front/affich.jsp?codeRubrique=2092004112852&codePage=2092004112852_09092004172723&lang=EN) rear is a tougher-carcassed, harder-treaded version of the Michelin T63 (http://two-wheels.michelin.com/2w/front/affich.jsp?codeRubrique=2092004112903&codePage=2092004112903_09092004174612&lang=EN). The Desert might be built for and excel at high speed, high load and high heat conditions, but the T63 is reported to be much better when it is wet, muddy or rocky. The T63 is lots cheaper (now) and readily available in the smaller sizes. It's even cheaper than the Mitas E-09 which I suspect is a copy due to the identical tread pattern.

I'd run the Desert maybe-and-only in summer, rest of the time T63. I'm very happy with it so far. Grips better than an MT21 on wet tar, maybe better on dry tar too - certainly no worse - but I haven't taken it for a good thrash. Dirt performance is fine/good; it's been so long since I ran a new MT21 I can't compare them - call it a tie! I like it even thought it is slightly too small for the 640A. Wear is said to be about 25% better than the MT21.

It is interesting that the characteristics of the T63 reported here (by myself and others) matches elsewhere eg advrider.com. More often opinions are varied.

[cooneyr]

I've just been down that route and decided against it. The Michelin Desert (http://two-wheels.michelin.com/2w/front/affich.jsp?codeRubrique=2092004112852&codePage=2092004112852_09092004172723&lang=EN) rear is a tougher-carcassed, harder-treaded version of the Michelin T63 (http://two-wheels.michelin.com/2w/front/affich.jsp?codeRubrique=2092004112903&codePage=2092004112903_09092004174612&lang=EN). The Desert might be built for and excel at high speed, high load and high heat conditions, but the T63 is reported to be much better when it is wet, muddy or rocky. The T63 is lots cheaper (now) and readily available in the smaller sizes. It's even cheaper than the Mitas E-09 which I suspect is a copy due to the identical tread pattern.

I'd run the Desert maybe-and-only in summer, rest of the time T63. I'm very happy with it so far. Grips better than an MT21 on wet tar, maybe better on dry tar too - certainly no worse - but I haven't taken it for a good thrash. Dirt performance is fine/good; it's been so long since I ran a new MT21 I can't compare them - call it a tie! I like it even thought it is slightly too small for the 640A. Wear is said to be about 25% better than the MT21.

It is interesting that the characteristics of the T63 reported here (by myself and others) matches elsewhere eg advrider.com. More often opinions are varied.

Yer but ... let me know what life you get out of the T63. Really, please do I'm curious.

I've read that the T63 is a softer compound and works better in mud etc. Thing is I don't ride that much mud and I'm getting a little sick of changing tyres at 2000 to 3000kms. I like having the extra grip of the D606 but I want the life of a E07 - guess I'm just a greedy bugger.

I figure then that while it might look like a full on knob it is actually a reasonable way to get a tyre with more grip than a E07 or similar but with a much longer life than a MT21, D606, or dare I say it at T63. I know that the road handling will not be as good but I'm a woose on the road anyway and prepared to make that compromise.

Besides there is only one way to find out!

Cheers R

[jezzaNZ]

WW, thanks for theat clarification of the tyre standards. I knew they were different types of measurements but didn't know exactly how they were measured.

I have been running a T63 on the fron of both the XTZ and 950 and found them wanting in the wet and mud. They may be suited to a lighter bike in the muck but for the heavier machine you need something more aggressive.

I agree with Ryan on this one, the Desert is far better wearing then the T63. I did origionally have a Desert on the fron of the XTZ but it wore reasonably quickly but shit it had some grip in the wet. In summary I personally like a more aggressive tire on the front and will experiment with perhaps an Enduro type tire on in the future.

[Motu]

I didn't get to use my T63 much before taking the bike off the road (it's running,and may ride it this week),but in just a few hundred kms the DT230 savaged it....I doubt it will last longer than anything else.It has plenty enough grip in all conditions for me.But it has a very stiff carcase,I used a tyre machine to fit it....and wouldn't want to fit one by hand.It has to have the stiffest sidewall of any tyre I've ever used.

[warewolf]

Yer but ... let me know what life you get out of the T63. Really, please do I'm curious.

I've read that the T63 is a softer compound and works better in mud etc. Thing is I don't ride that much mud and I'm getting a little sick of changing tyres at 2000 to 3000kms. I like having the extra grip of the D606 but I want the life of a E07 - guess I'm just a greedy bugger.

I figure then that while it might look like a full on knob it is actually a reasonable way to get a tyre with more grip than a E07 or similar but with a much longer life than a MT21, D606, or dare I say it at T63. I know that the road handling will not be as good but I'm a woose on the road anyway and prepared to make that compromise.

Besides there is only one way to find out!I understand completely! I, too, am doing a 'suck it and see' with the T63. So far, so good, but too early to tell for wear. The Desert is 47% more expensive for me, can't remember if it was expected to outlast a T63 by that much.

Transalper, chime in here: haven't you run the T63 against the MT21? Someone here has, IIRC. I would line up your selection in terms of longer life as D606, MT21, T63, Desert.

I do a huge mix of riding, and I'd rather chew up a good mud/wet-tar tyre on rock, gravel & dry-roads, than have a gravel/dry-road tyre slide in the wet & mud. It's all a huge compromise; getting any better 'fit for purpose' requires multiple tyres in the shed and changes for bigger chunks of riding in one style.

Having said that, NZ roads tend to be sharp and tear at the tyres (as you probably know professionally) so a Desert would likely be fine here on wet tar. :scratch:

[warewolf]

WW, thanks for theat clarification of the tyre standards. I knew they were different types of measurements but didn't know exactly how they were measured.On the weekend I rode a WR450F with a 120/90-18 on the rear... it did feel under-tyred. Didn't think it would be so obvious, especially since that's the size I was running on my 200EXC. Suspect that someone missed the difference between a 120/100 and a 120/90.


I have been running a T63 on the fron of both the XTZ and 950 and found them wanting in the wet and mud. They may be suited to a lighter bike in the muck but for the heavier machine you need something more aggressive.

I agree with Ryan on this one, the Desert is far better wearing then the T63. I did origionally have a Desert on the fron of the XTZ but it wore reasonably quickly but shit it had some grip in the wet. In summary I personally like a more aggressive tire on the front and will experiment with perhaps an Enduro type tire on in the future.Fronts are a different kettle of fish. T63 fronts have shallow knobs, lots of people complain about front-end grip in the mud.

I'm with you on the enduro front front (ha ha); currently running a Bridgestone ED661 intermediate front (worn out ex-race tyre) and like it a lot. Best all-round front I've used so far, despite being past its best before getting near the 640A. It is similar to the Dunlop K490(?) that is a favourite in Aussie.

[warewolf]

T63
...
But it has a very stiff carcase,I used a tyre machine to fit it....and wouldn't want to fit one by hand.It has to have the stiffest sidewall of any tyre I've ever used.The Desert will be worse.

Is that what you want on those already difficult DR650 rims, R? :shutup:

[Transalper]

....

Transalper, chime in here: haven't you run the T63 against the MT21? Someone here has, IIRC. ....
I have compared the Mitas E09 to D606, as to say in my opnion the D606 gives a bit more dirt grip but is not as good on seal and doesn't last as long as the E09.
I had a couple of MT21 experiences, but they came with the bikes and both were already well worn but I understood them to be the equvilent to the D606 although the front MT21 pattern may make some front ends wobble in a minor way on hard ground (at least we think that was the reason).

[cooneyr]

.....Is that what you want on those already difficult DR650 rims, R? :shutup:

:yawn: no worries - NOT. Yes that will be a challenge :wacko:

Cheers R

[NordieBoy]

The Desert will be worse.

Is that what you want on those already difficult DR650 rims, R? :shutup:

As opposed to the 640A where you just bend the rim out of the way :D

[warewolf]

As opposed to the 640A where you just bend the rim out of the way :DPretty much! Rears seem to be OK, it's the fronts that give the most grief. :weep:

[snoop]

A newbie here with an o7 dr650se up in jaffa land. there is probably an answer to this somewhere... but looking at getting rid of the Trailwings and queation if a 130/80 tkc80 will fit on the rear? and do I need rim locks? i will be doing 50/50 commute and trail/gravel?

[Oscar]

A newbie here with an o7 dr650se up in jaffa land. there is probably an answer to this somewhere... but looking at getting rid of the Trailwings and queation if a 130/80 tkc80 will fit on the rear? and do I need rim locks? i will be doing 50/50 commute and trail/gravel?

The TKC would be great for the DR.
You wouldn't need rim locks unless you were gonna use very low tyre pressures (and if you were, you should be using a proper knobblie).

[cooneyr]

A newbie here with an o7 dr650se up in jaffa land. there is probably an answer to this somewhere... but looking at getting rid of the Trailwings and queation if a 130/80 tkc80 will fit on the rear? and do I need rim locks? i will be doing 50/50 commute and trail/gravel?

Assuming the TKC80 130 is the same as other 130's (D606 or MT21) they will fit fine. I've had the D606 and MT21's on my DR650. Before I got rim locks I managed to make the MT21 slip a little on the rim running about 18 psi when riding along a gravel road with bits of bed rock when it was raining. I think the wheel was spinning on the gravel then suddenly gripped on the rock which caused it. If you keep the pressures up 22+ you should have no worries - the DR650 rear rim is a basted for hanging onto beads (pain when tyre changing).

Cheers R

[Gizzit]

Has anyone got a recommendation for tires for road use for my DR650SE ? I want to use some tires suitable for 90 - 95% road use, with the balance on metal roads.
I think Pirelli does a 95/5% tire, that is supposedly good on wet and dry seal. I find my use is pretty much sealed road, with some exploration down metal roads. I tend to take it easy on the metal, so really need a set of street tires for the riding I'm doing at the moment. I want to stay with the standard wheel size for the DR, but maybe even use a fatter profile tire ? I'm unsure about the viability of that on standard rims, or any road holding benefit ?
Thanks for any ideas,
Grant.

[clint640]

I'd try a Pirelli MT90AT. They're about the cheapest roadish adv tyre you'll find for a 21" front, I've used a rear that went well. The slightly knobbier MT70 is good too, but the rears don't last nearly as long.

For 95/5 tar/gravel I'd probably run an MT70 front & an MT90 rear. The MT70 front was really good on wet or dry tar & lasted well, while still being ok in the gravel, so I don't really see the point of going more 'roady' unless you're really really pushing it on the seal. On the back it's worth having something less aggressive however as you'll get twice the life out of an MT90 compared with an MT70.

If you want a full road tyre the Bridgestone BT-45 is available in 21" & are good value, I use a set on the track & they go alright.

Cheers
Clint

[OV Lander]

Have been looking at tyre options to replace my now tired Pirelli MT90 S/T, have been looking at the TKC and the MT90 A/T.

Very different tyres, but here's my logic:

Would love to do more learning off road, and to be honest the S/T is just too dody on a 200kg machine in the sloppy mud (Surprised?), so was looking to the TKC's - But, they seem expensive for a relatively short mileage tyre, particularly given that most of my riding is on-road at present.

So, looking for alterantives. Very pleased with the wear, grip and general comfort of the Pirelli, but what about something more aggressive? the MT90 A/T perhaps?

Am seriously looking at the A/T tyre, as I am not sure that I really need anything as knobbly as the MT21, or confident that I'd be happy with them on-road either.

SO, FINALLY, here's the question:
Teh Pirelli A/T is not available in the 13/80 R17 currently fitted on the back of the BM. So, how would ride, fell, grip corner lean over etc be affected if I changed tyre size the Pirelli A/T in a 120/90 R17?

- 8mm greater diameter and 10mm but how would this affect the machine ro the ride?

Grateful in advance - cheers.

[Transalper]

.....Would love to do more learning off road, and to be honest the S/T is just too dody on a 200kg machine in the sloppy mud........
Am seriously looking at the A/T tyre, as I am not sure that I really need anything as knobbly as the MT21, or confident that I'd be happy with them on-road either......You'd probably be better off forgetting about the mud then.
Just remember which forum this is. It's the 'compromise' forum. IMO the TKC probably offers your best compromise for high performance street with some mud capability. All else swings further one way or other. I'm a fan of D606/MT21 for when the talk turns to mud but yes you loose some street performance. Get use to it.
I suspect the A/T tyre will be fine until the dirt gets wet.

[dutchman49]

Has anyone got a recommendation for tires for road use for my DR650SE ? I want to use some tires suitable for 90 - 95% road use, with the balance on metal roads.
I think Pirelli does a 95/5% tire, that is supposedly good on wet and dry seal. I find my use is pretty much sealed road, with some exploration down metal roads. I tend to take it easy on the metal, so really need a set of street tires for the riding I'm doing at the moment. I want to stay with the standard wheel size for the DR, but maybe even use a fatter profile tire ? I'm unsure about the viability of that on standard rims, or any road holding benefit ?
Thanks for any ideas,
Grant.

I have tried all my DR650. Had a 130 TKC and fits fine. 2500ks and stuffed. Great all round including mud and some Rimutaka fanging. If I was a rich bastard I would only use TKCs, but at way over 300 bucks for a set. No can do.

Have now settled on IRC 110s. Can get 4000ks easy and 210 bucks for a set. Great on gravel, seal, but obviously no good for mud. Really anything should do on gravel, just do your steering with the rear wheel, rear brake and the throttle.

[tri boy]

2500km only from a TKC 130:pinch:
What pressures were you running?
I did a 5500km trip to the sth isld on a fat Scrambler loaded, 50/50 seal n gravel at 30-36psi and it was 1/2 worn.
Took it off to put a E-09 on for the CCA, but gunna slip it back on for clints MMMM ride.

[Gizzit]

I'd try a Pirelli MT90AT. They're about the cheapest roadish adv tyre you'll find for a 21" front, I've used a rear that went well. The slightly knobbier MT70 is good too, but the rears don't last nearly as long.

For 95/5 tar/gravel I'd probably run an MT70 front & an MT90 rear. The MT70 front was really good on wet or dry tar & lasted well, while still being ok in the gravel, so I don't really see the point of going more 'roady' unless you're really really pushing it on the seal. On the back it's worth having something less aggressive however as you'll get twice the life out of an MT90 compared with an MT70.

If you want a full road tyre the Bridgestone BT-45 is available in 21" & are good value, I use a set on the track & they go alright.
Cheers
Clint

Thanks for that info. I'll check those Pirelli and Bridgestone's out. Maybe I should have bought a Versys after all !!! lol

[dutchman49]

2500km only from a TKC 130:pinch:
What pressures were you running?
I did a 5500km trip to the sth isld on a fat Scrambler loaded, 50/50 seal n gravel at 30-36psi and it was 1/2 worn.
Took it off to put a E-09 on for the CCA, but gunna slip it back on for clints MMMM ride.

The lack of ks is something to do with my affinity for coming out of gravel road corners sideways with full throttle on. My mate on his KTM 950 cleaned his TKC 80 out in under 2000ks. In fact, ripped a few of the knobs off. Pressures were 34 rear, 30 front no matter what the terrain. Great tyre on the seal tough. Never slipped out once. I guess if I just road the bike instead of always trying to catch the KTM i would probably have got a few more ks. But thats not my style.

[NordieBoy]

Thanks for that info. I'll check those Pirelli and Bridgestone's out. Maybe I should have bought a Versys after all !!! lol

Wash yer mouf out boy!

[NordieBoy]

The lack of ks is something to do with my affinity for coming out of gravel road corners sideways with full throttle on. My mate on his KTM 950 cleaned his TKC 80 out in under 2000ks. In fact, ripped a few of the knobs off. Pressures were 34 rear, 30 front no matter what the terrain. Great tyre on the seal tough. Never slipped out once. I guess if I just road the bike instead of always trying to catch the KTM i would probably have got a few more ks. But thats not my style.

Yep.
KM's is to a very large extent dictated by your riding style (or lack of).
If you're a tyre spinner you'll chew most any tyre out in no time and you'll probably prefer tyres at the knobbier end of the spectrum.
If you're like me and prefer to grunt up hills at 2500rpm riding the torque then something closer to the E07 end of the spectrum is more suited as you're using the tyre compound for grip rather than the knob edges.

The TKC 80 is a good compromise and I would advise at least trying a set as the knobs are nice and big so you can see which style of riding suits you and fine tune your tyre choice from there.

[warewolf]

Have been looking at tyre options to replace my now tired Pirelli MT90 S/T, have been looking at the TKC and the MT90 A/T.

Very different tyres, but here's my logic:

Would love to do more learning off road, and to be honest the S/T is just too dody on a 200kg machine in the sloppy mud (Surprised?), so was looking to the TKC's - But, they seem expensive for a relatively short mileage tyre, particularly given that most of my riding is on-road at present.

So, looking for alterantives. Very pleased with the wear, grip and general comfort of the Pirelli, but what about something more aggressive? the MT90 A/T perhaps?

Am seriously looking at the A/T tyre, as I am not sure that I really need anything as knobbly as the MT21, or confident that I'd be happy with them on-road either.Hmm, interesting choices.

TKC80 = most expen$$$ive tyre and worst value
MT90 A/T = best value, beating even the Kenda K270


You'd probably be better off forgetting about the mud then.What he said. The MT90 A/T might be "more aggressive" than the MT90 S/T, but it's still basically a road tyre. It's the most road-oriented thing that will correctly fit my 640A. On gravel roads, they felt worse than the Metzeler ME33/ME55A road tyre combo on my DR-Z250, likely because the 640A is heavier and more powerful.

You will need chunky knobs for mud, no two ways about it.

Knobbies grip far better on the road than road tyres do off-road.

[Gizzit]

Wash yer mouf out boy!

:shifty: :dodge: lol.

[Oscar]

Hmm, interesting choices.

TKC80 = most expen$$$ive tyre and worst value
MT90 A/T = best value, beating even the Kenda K270

What he said. The MT90 A/T might be "more aggressive" than the MT90 S/T, but it's still basically a road tyre. It's the most road-oriented thing that will correctly fit my 640A. On gravel roads, they felt worse than the Metzeler ME33/ME55A road tyre combo on my DR-Z250, likely because the 640A is heavier and more powerful.

You will need chunky knobs for mud, no two ways about it.

Knobbies grip far better on the road than road tyres do off-road.

Surely you mean "most expensive"?
Very difficult to quantify safety - I'm sure I'd rather pay the extra and keep my arse upright...

[clint640]

Have been looking at tyre options to replace my now tired Pirelli MT90 S/T, have been looking at the TKC and the MT90 A/T.

.

A mate of mine runs a TKC80 front & an MT90AT rear on his Dakar & likes the combo. I think the MT90 he's got might be 140 wide.

Cheers
Clint

[warewolf]

Very difficult to quantify safety - I'm sure I'd rather pay the extra and keep my arse upright...Yep, agree with you there.

If TKC80s worked for me, I'd consider paying the extra... if there weren't other tyres that worked the same or better for less money.

[Oscar]

Yep, agree with you there.

If TKC80s worked for me, I'd consider paying the extra... if there weren't other tyres that worked the same or better for less money.

I've got a TKC on the front of my LC4, and a Pirelli MT21 on the back. I actually managed to slide the front corning on seal, racing Brucee Marshall over the Whanga Saddle.

[OV Lander]

I've also got one of their Trelleborg ones which is good on the Transalp...

Mr Transalp - can you tell us more about the Trelleborg please? Have been looking at the T-644 Army Special as an alternative to the Conti?

How have you found it on/off road> Civilised or wayward?

Keen also to learn how well they last with the heavy Transalp on the seal? The blocks look a bit small so wondering if they squirm and wear un-neccessarily...

Cheers

[Transalper]

The Trelleborg I have is the T434 front tyre in size 80/100-21.
I had it on my old Transalp for a short time and now it's on the DR650.
From what I remember the Transalp road slightly better on the T434 than the DR does.
It appears to be lasting longer than the D606 Dunlops but does not handle as nicely on the sealed road as the D606.
In shingle I still prefer the Dunlop and off road in Mud they are possibly about the same, or maybe the T434 could be better.
I find the D606 Dunlop to be very civilised on the road in all conditions and very civilised off seal and off road.
No idea what you ride like on the seal so can't really say how I think you'd find them. I do not consider myself to be slow but there are a lot of people out there who seem to like pushing their bikes a lot harder than me in the corners.
In case you haven't picked up on it I will proberbly stick to the D606 fronts in future for my more serious choice. Am currently trying the Mitas C-02 on rear.

My summer choice remains the Mitas E07 for both wheels.

Attached is a pic of the T434.

[hondav2]

How much are you guys paying for your tyres, I am importing a trial shipment from overseas for my self . I can get Metz, tourance, Karoos, karoo t, sahara, michilin desert and anakee , dunlop 606, 607, rally raid 908, TKC 80, kenda k761, pirelli scorpian at,st, mt60r corsa, mt21. As for milage the tourance beats the lot, i got 10,000 miles out of a rear TKC 80 and anakee, i do like the Karoo t on the front better than a tkc80 . Cheers Toddy

[NordieBoy]

15000km out of an E-07 rear.
Favorite front so far is the IRC GP21F.

[XF650]

Local supplier informed me today that the BF Goodrich Crossengo tyres are no longer imported. So it looks like remaining shop stocks are all that's available.
This is sad news because they are an excellent road legal knobbly trail tyre that are DOT, hard wearing, hook up well in soft going & under $100.

[Transalper]

How much are you guys paying for your tyres.........
I payed $140 for my Mitas C02 rear and same for the E07 rear about two months ago.
The front Mitas E07 and front Dunlop D606 were both about $120 or $130 when I last bought them (early this year).
I fit my tyres myself.

[Motu]

Favorite front so far is the IRC GP21F.

The GP21/22 is OE on the DT230,and wish I could find some more.Excellent grip everywhere...and the GP22 rear had more hook up totally bald in gravel than the K760 I replaced it with.Still using the GP21F with 6mm on the DT230,excellent on seal and gravel,and damn good off road on the 2 stroke,but maybe a bit slippery with a thumper with more load on the front tyre.

[NordieBoy]

Still using the GP21F with 6mm on the DT230,excellent on seal and gravel,and damn good off road on the 2 stroke,but maybe a bit slippery with a thumper with more load on the front tyre.

I loved the front. It never seemed to mis-behave at all. Just seemed to be the right knob size to allow the compound to grip as well as the edges of the knobs when needed.
CycleTreads got me my one.
I didn't have all that much confidence in it on my first ride though. I'd just come from using a 3/4 worn E-07 which was fantastic on the road to a knobblie and a ride from Nelson to Christchurch was my introduction. Once I realised it was a very neutral feeling tyre I just rode without thinking anymore about it.

I'd like to try some more road biased tyres now but keep feeling winter isn't the time of the year to do this.
Although I'd have no hesitations going through the Maungatapu with my current almost bald TW-42 rear I wouldn't on a roadie tyre with probably more grip :wacko:

[G-spot]

I'm running a Mitas 20% enduro and 80% road on the back of my TT500,
See my album for pictures.

[NordieBoy]

I think I'd like the Mitas E-08 as a road biased tyre.

I was quite happy with the IRC GP110 on the rear yesterday except in the snow.
Ran it at 25psi and gravel was no problem and it churned up through the rocks and grit on the Porika no issues as well as being quite nice on the seal.

The R100GS with E-09's on fared slightly better grip-wise in the snow.

As for my "Golden Boy SR244" it doesn't instill confidence but it doesn't really do anything wrong.

[_Shrek_]

I think I'd like the Mitas E-08 as a road biased tyre.

I was quite happy with the IRC GP110 on the rear yesterday except in the snow.
Ran it at 25psi and gravel was no problem and it churned up through the rocks and grit on the Porika no issues as well as being quite nice on the seal.

The R100GS with E-09's on fared slightly better grip-wise in the snow.

As for my "Golden Boy SR244" it doesn't instill confidence but it doesn't really do anything wrong.

I found that the Eo8 let go under heavy cornering in the front on the seal & was ok on the metal if you didnt push it to hard & kept it up right

the Eo9's i'm runing at 30 & 25 make it a awsome bike to ride on the metal & in the snow not sure what sort of k's i'm going to get but will let you know

i will be putting Eo7's back on for the summer as i get 16 ks out of them (just road legal)

[CrazyFrog]

Anyone tried the Metzeler 6 Days Extreme on a dual purpose bike...they are road legal, but what's tarseal grip like. They are a reasonably meaty hard compound knobbly, so should ride accordingly- noisy as hell with vibration to boot. Treat 'em with respect on the seal I'd say, esp if wet, and I'd imagine they'd be a treat on the gravel/hardpack. Any comments on tyre life with these bad boys?

[cooneyr]

For those who like their front tyre aggressive this tyre may be worth checking out - Pirelli Scorpion MX Hard 486 (http://www.pirellityre.com/web/catalog/moto/moto_catalogo_schedaDescription.page). It is DOT (even though the rears appear not to be). Cost $99 (probably closer to $110 normally - Don at Pit Lane was being nice this arvo) each for a front.

<a href="http://www.pirellityre.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.pirellityre.com/en_IT/browser/attachments/images/MOTO%20catalog_long/Dettaglio%20Battistrada/imgdet_scorpion%20mx%20Hard%20486.jpg" border="0" alt="Pirelli Scorpion MX Hard 486"></a>

We came across these in Alex over Q's Bday after El Scooto cut a nice big hole in his newish D606 front. Not a lot of experiance with them yet but both El Scooto and I have new 486's ready to go on the XTZ750's (along with the Michy Desert's when they come). We are hoping because of the single row of blocks around the centre they will wear better than the D606/MT21 and expect they will be better of the seal.

Will report back in a couple of months with how they are going.

Cheers R

[NordieBoy]

I've got that front pattern on my mountain bike :D

[OV Lander]

Ok, so I am now preparing for the Xmas hols. Planning 800 kms to Northland from Wellywood and back, and a couple of weeks beach and gravel riding whilst up there.

Seesm this could be right on the limit for (range wise) for a set of TKC's but reading peoples reviews, I 'd be well advised to go with a set of E-09's.

What say you?

[topher]

I've done a few trips around Northland including baylys beach from dargaville to the nothern end - there's a 4wd track from the end of the beach up to the road (we got a R1100RT up OK with a bit of pushing), ninety mile beach and pretty much all the gravel roads between Awanui and Cape Reinga. The bikes i've used have been Triumph tigers and my current R1150GS with big fat touring tank; all with touring luggage. So these bikes aren't your svelte dual-purpose machinery at all. But I've never used aggressive tyres and haven't had any real issues. I'm currently running Michelin Anakee but will go back to pirelli Scorpian (can't remember the code but are 90-10 on-offroad). The pirellis are better on wet tar but get 4k - 6k rather than the 6k-8k on the michelins. I had metzler tourance on one of the Tigers. And my Scottish heritage loved them - over 20k BUT not good at all on wet tar and not as good as Michies or Pirelli in the dry. All three brands were fine on the beach and better than road tyres on gravel in that the stronger carcass doesn't get punctured by stones and rocks like road tyres can. the only issue I've had is forgetting to turn the ABS off on gravel. An arse puckering experience - no matter how hard you push the brake pedal it won't lock and bite - so with nearly 450Kg of Bike, luggage and rider srcreaming downhill towards a corner it pays to have brakes that work.

After you get back from Cape Reinga you can wash the salt off your bike with hoses which pump out heaps of water at the Kauri Tourist rip-off shop north of Aweanui. for a couple of dollars.

Enjoy your ride, Northland's got miles of low volume traffic roads to explore and fantastic scenery.

[hondav2]

Ok, so I am now preparing for the Xmas hols. Planning 800 kms to Northland from Wellywood and back, and a couple of weeks beach and gravel riding whilst up there.

Seesm this could be right on the limit for (range wise) for a set of TKC's but reading peoples reviews, I 'd be well advised to go with a set of E-09's.

What say you?

I got 10,000 miles out of a rear TKC80 rear and 16,000 miles out of front one in Nth America, same tyre here rear would go 10,000km first half wears quick then last bit goes forever. Cheers Toddy

[warewolf]

Ok, so I am now preparing for the Xmas hols. Planning 800 kms to Northland from Wellywood and back, and a couple of weeks beach and gravel riding whilst up there.

Seesm this could be right on the limit for (range wise) for a set of TKC's but reading peoples reviews, I 'd be well advised to go with a set of E-09's.

What say you?Have a fresh set of chunky adventure tyres waiting for you in AKL. Ride up on long-life road-oriented tyres, swap to the knobbies, enjoy Northland.

Afterwards, you could leave the knobbies there for the next time you are adventuring up that way, ride them home, or put the other tyres back on and ship the knobbies home.

But the F650 won't destroy a TKC80 or E-09 in the 2000km you are planning. And if it did, I'd like to watch!!

[cooneyr]

......But the F650 won't destroy a TKC80 or E-09 in the 2000km you are planning. And if it did, I'd like to watch!!

I agree - with decent pressures (30ish) when running on the seal and not spinning up around corners the E09 or D606 will give pretty reasonable life. I did the CCA from chch and back i.e. around 1000kms with the D606 on the DR650 and there was minimal tyre wear (about 1/4). In the next 1000kms around Sth Canty and Central over the the brass weekend I managed to wear about about 2/3rd of the tyre cause of spinning up on gravel, snow and muck. It's all about riding style or lack there off.

Cheers R

[Eddieb]

I've just put a set of Vee Rubber VRM163 on the Massey Ferguson G/S so will see how they go.

Mileage when they went on was 5990 miles.

The VRM163's are an adv style tyre, I wanted something a bit more road biased from what I had as I don't tend to get anywhere worse than gravel or hard packed dirt. Cost was $200 even for the pair.

I've now done 1000miles (1600km) on these and no issues so far. They allow fairly serious angles of lean with no feeling of instability on dry roads.

I'm a wuss when it comes to wet roads and the round profile and the lean that that causes I find somewhat disconcerting in the wet but they have never slipped or felt like they were about to, I've not pushed them though.

I've done a bit of deep gravel and a few stream crossings on the South Wairarapa coast and around and was pleased with how the tyres performed, good grip and tracking in the gravel and I was a lot more confident and stable than with the worn combination I had previously.

Mud, as expected with such a tread design was crap and the treads clogged fairly instantly.

As to wear, the front has only just worn the new sheen off the knobs, the rear wouldn't have more than 1mm of wear I think. Most of that 1000miles has been highway commuting though (>90%).

[Phreaky Phil]

These tyres look similar as far as there off road grip is concerned. Who has used both. Which are quieter on the road.??

[Transalper]

These tyres look similar as far as there off road grip is concerned. Who has used both. Which are quieter on the road.??

Running them on a DR650 IMO I'd say the E09 are quieter on sealed roads, also feel firmer on sealed roads, but the D606 is a wee bit better performer off road.

[Oscar]

These tyres look similar as far as there off road grip is concerned. Who has used both. Which are quieter on the road.??

Quieter?
What sorta muffler you got?

[Phreaky Phil]

[QUOTE=Oscar;1691779]Quieter?
What sorta muffler you got?[/QUOTE
Jeez Oscar, Thats a bit personal, askin a guy about the size of his muffler.!!!

Ever heard a big bike comin down the road that has a set of Trackmasters on it? Ya hear it before ya see it.

[tri boy]

Still enjoying the combo of TKC up front, and either a E-09, TKC, or Metz Sahara on the rear of Fatty.
FWIW, the E-09 has worn really well. Probably will see about 8-9k on the rear.
The scrambler hasn't got ferocious power delivery, but the rear works hard keeping 4tonne together into/out of corners. Braking from speed (130ish) for a gravel corner is like dancing with a big woman. Get it wrong, and it gets ugly real quick.:eek5:

[Oscar]

[QUOTE=Oscar;1691779]Quieter?
What sorta muffler you got?[/QUOTE
Jeez Oscar, Thats a bit personal, askin a guy about the size of his muffler.!!!

Ever heard a big bike comin down the road that has a set of Trackmasters on it? Ya hear it before ya see it.

Is this yours?

[Phreaky Phil]

[QUOTE=Phreaky Phil;1692149]

Is this yours?
GUILTY

[talbertnz]

just found these on tardme

any one know them??? look like just the thing i'd like

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/Motorbikes/Parts-accessories/Wheels-tyres-brakes/auction-176205771.htm

http://www.savatech.eu/index.php?Itemid=92


http://www.savatech.eu/slike-nove/ENDURO-MC-30-puscica.jpg

[jon34]

I need a new rear tyre on my DR650. Stock size is 120/90-17 but there seems to be a few other choices ie 510-17, 130/80-17.
What's the best for the DR?

[cooneyr]

.... 510-17, 130/80-17.....

Never run anything but these sizes for the 12000kms I did on my DR. Heaps of choice in this size.

Cheers R

[cooneyr]

Finally managed to find a couple of 17inch (only come in 140/80) Mitchy deserts in Chch today. I get the impression that either Mitchy are not making very many 17 inch deserts or Northern Accessories are not bringing them into the country very often any more. Anybody else know anything about this?

Not many choices in 140 wide (or 5.6") 17inch knobblies unfortunately (Mitas E09 only other one I've found), does anybody else have any ideas?

Cheers R

[NordieBoy]

Finally managed to find a couple of 17inch (only come in 140/80) Mitchy deserts in Chch today. I get the impression that either Mitchy are not making very many 17 inch deserts or Northern Accessories are not bringing them into the country very often any more. Anybody else know anything about this?

Not many choices in 140 wide (or 5.6") 17inch knobblies unfortunately (Mitas E09 only other one I've found), does anybody else have any ideas?

Will a 150 wide TKC80 fit?
What's the rim width (inside bead)?

[warewolf]

Not many choices in 140 wide (or 5.6") 17inch knobblies unfortunately (Mitas E09 only other one I've found), does anybody else have any ideas?Welcome to the hard-to-find 140 club!! :bleh:

[Peril]

Finally managed to find a couple of 17inch (only come in 140/80) Mitchy deserts in Chch today. I get the impression that either Mitchy are not making very many 17 inch deserts or Northern Accessories are not bringing them into the country very often any more. Anybody else know anything about this?

Not many choices in 140 wide (or 5.6") 17inch knobblies unfortunately (Mitas E09 only other one I've found), does anybody else have any ideas?

Cheers R

You couldn't see wether a late XT600 or maybe 660 18in disc brake rear wheel would fit?
I'd imagine they wouldn't,but could be worth some research.

Edited - just found the 88-90 600 Tenere ran the 18in disc brake rear before they went back to 17in for some weird reason.

[XF650]

Finally managed to find a couple of 17inch (only come in 140/80) Mitchy deserts in Chch today. I get the impression that either Mitchy are not making very many 17 inch deserts or Northern Accessories are not bringing them into the country very often any more. Anybody else know anything about this?

Not many choices in 140 wide (or 5.6") 17inch knobblies unfortunately (Mitas E09 only other one I've found), does anybody else have any ideas?

Cheers R


Why not the EO9?

[Kevnz]

O.K. so standard DR 650 tyre is 120/90-17 but you can run a 130/80-17. This is a smaller profile so the circumference is smaller meaning more revolutions to cover the same distance. Would this have an effect on fuel economy ? I imagine it is similar to changing a sprocket by a tooth or so , or do you not really notice it ? I think I may have even confused myself !:wacko:

[cooneyr]

Will a 150 wide TKC80 fit?
What's the rim width (inside bead)?

Rim bead width is 3.0. TKC rears are kinda pricey - not sure I want to go there.


Why not the EO9?

Nothing, but 10k kms from a Desert (Jezza recond he got this on his XTZ) for about $30 more seems like a pretty good value for money. Will give the E09 a spin next time if I don't like the Desert or cant get one.


O.K. so standard DR 650 tyre is 120/90-17 but you can run a 130/80-17. This is a smaller profile so the circumference is smaller meaning more revolutions to cover the same distance.....

The metric tyre sizes (like those you quoted) are width/percentage of width in profile(side wall height) and rim size in inches (kinda weird having inches in the metric tyre sizes). So with the 120/90 there is 90% of 120mm in profile i.e. 108mm and with the 130/80 there is 80% of 130mm in profile i.e. 104mm. So over all the rolling circumference is very similar between these two tyre sizes and the 130 is 10mm wider. Your revs will be almost exactly the same speed and gear with either tyre.

Cheers R

[NordieBoy]

Rim bead width is 3.0. TKC rears are kinda pricey - not sure I want to go there.

Got a cheap one here.
Probably won't fit on the DR :D

[Kevnz]

Thanks for your explaination on that cooneyr, I'm looking at the Mitas E09 as I do a lot of riding on the tarmac and only the odd bit of gravel at present. Seems to be good mileage in them from what I've read. Had some Michilin Siracs on my DR250 and found them excellent for what I needed and the Mitas look pretty close to these but better wear I imagine, cheers

[NordieBoy]

Thanks for your explaination on that cooneyr, I'm looking at the Mitas E09 as I do a lot of riding on the tarmac and only the odd bit of gravel at present. Seems to be good mileage in them from what I've read. Had some Michilin Siracs on my DR250 and found them excellent for what I needed and the Mitas look pretty close to these but better wear I imagine, cheers

If it's only the odd bit of gravel then Shinko 244's or Mitas E-07's may be more appropriate than E-09's.

[JATZ]

I thought the E-08 looked pretty similar to the Siracs I had on the BMW, I'll take a photo if you want, seemed to grip pretty good too and should get pretty good mileage

[Kevnz]

If it's only the odd bit of gravel then Shinko 244's or Mitas E-07's may be more appropriate than E-09's.

The E-08s are supposed to be a 70% road 30% off road so should be ideal for my needs, the E-07s are 50/50. As for the Shinko 244's ? The price is right but is it the old you get what you pay for ... www.motorcycletyres.net.au have some great photos ,thanks

[Phreaky Phil]

I fitted an eo9 on my r80gs for last weekends ttttt. After getting some miles on it it feels ok, had no problems with grip although i was taking easy on the wet tarmac. The only down side is it must be a slightly lower profile than the tkc80 as my speed at 100kmh was 5kmh lower ie; speedo reading 100, gps saying 95. This is a pain as the r80 is already geared low. Ok for adv riding, no good for long distance

[hobbes]

Hi Phreaky.
.. Following my abismal sideways performance at the AWESOME TTTTTT... what'd ye suggest for the Dakar? What were you running on in Alaska?

[NordieBoy]

As for the Shinko 244's ? The price is right but is it the old you get what you pay for ...

Same pattern as the IRC GP1 and Kenda 270.
Worked well on the Dusty Butt and I got 8000 odd km out of a rear and 18000km so far out of a front.

I paid bugger all and have had bugger all problems.
You get what you pay for.

[_Shrek_]

I fitted an eo9 on my r80gs for last weekends ttttt. After getting some miles on it it feels ok, had no problems with grip although i was taking easy on the wet tarmac. The only down side is it must be a slightly lower profile than the tkc80 as my speed at 100kmh was 5kmh lower ie; speedo reading 100, gps saying 95. This is a pain as the r80 is already geared low. Ok for adv riding, no good for long distance

have just put an Eo7 back on after running Eo9's
i found the Eo9's great off road & on the tar seal just went a bit slower on the corners in the wet
this one has done 13877ks & the front had done 14979ks )no pic) it had worn a bit off as i run it at 25psi a bit low for tar seasl running but owesome on the metal etc..

will run the E07's for the summer then go back to the Eo9's

[cooneyr]

.....this one has done 13877ks ....

That's damn good Kms for an E09 on a Big Monster Whale :bleh: Better than expected for the Desert on the XTZ. Definatly have to try one next time.

Get the feeling that twins are much easier on tyres/sprockets/chains than singles? I'm guess it is because you don't need to thrash them quite so much?

Cheers R

[warewolf]

Get the feeling that twins are much easier on tyres/sprockets/chains than singles? I'm guess it is because you don't need to thrash them quite so much?Generally it is put down to the smoothness of a twin.

Twins are usually heavier so require more power, not less. That weight also means more contact pressure so less tyre-destroying wheelspin. Even if you are not doing smoky burnouts, the tyre still has some amount of slip against the road surface.

[talbertnz]

you peoples looked at this link??? made by KLR peoples.....

http://www.standoutnet.com/extras/mike/motorcycles/klr650/tires/#contents

[NordieBoy]

Generally it is put down to the smoothness of a twin.

Twins are usually heavier so require more power, not less. That weight also means more contact pressure so less tyre-destroying wheelspin. Even if you are not doing smoky burnouts, the tyre still has some amount of slip against the road surface.

More tractoring - less wheelspin.

[Phreaky Phil]

Hi Phreaky.
.. Following my abismal sideways performance at the AWESOME TTTTTT... what'd ye suggest for the Dakar? What were you running on in Alaska?

In Alaska we ran Continental TKC 80 rears and Metzler Karoo fronts.
This combo worked well. the karoo front is a bit more open than the TKC 80.
Both tyres wear out at about the same time so you can replace them as pairs.

[Kevnz]

Same pattern as the IRC GP1 and Kenda 270.
Worked well on the Dusty Butt and I got 8000 odd km out of a rear and 18000km so far out of a front.

I paid bugger all and have had bugger all problems.
You get what you pay for.

Sounds like they are a genuine bargin, will put them on my list

[Tony W]

I fitted an eo9 on my r80gs for last weekends ttttt. After getting some miles on it it feels ok, had no problems with grip although i was taking easy on the wet tarmac. The only down side is it must be a slightly lower profile than the tkc80 as my speed at 100kmh was 5kmh lower ie; speedo reading 100, gps saying 95. This is a pain as the r80 is already geared low. Ok for adv riding, no good for long distance

Just whack another tooth on the front sprocket!:laugh:


Also on the subject of TKC 80's, I have never used these tyres.
Why are they so expensive (about $300 ) ?
Everyone says they wear out quickly.

My cynicism suggests they are merely a fashion accessory.

Can any TKC 80 owners quantify their choices. (more sizes perhaps?)
I have used Michelin T63 Tyres about 1/3 the price. They were fine.
On paper the Mitas E09 represents good value.

[NordieBoy]

Just whack another tooth on the front sprocket!:laugh:

Or go up 3 on the rear but then you'd need to lengthen the driveshaft a link.

We're on fire today :laugh:

[NordieBoy]

Also on the subject of TKC 80's, I have never used these tyres.
Why are they so expensive (about $300 ) ?
Everyone says they wear out quickly.

My cynicism suggests they are merely a fashion accessory.

Can any TKC 80 owners quantify their choices. (more sizes perhaps?)
I have used Michelin T63 Tyres about 1/3 the price. They were fine.
On paper the Mitas E09 represents good value.

They just work.

But as I'm cheap I'm not going to be getting any more.
The 150x70x17 for the Nordie rear was $300 :buggerd:

The T63 does look very E-09'ish.



It may be a bit of "you get what you pay for" mentality.

[Phreaky Phil]

Just whack another tooth on the front sprocket!:laugh:


Also on the subject of TKC 80's, I have never used these tyres.
Why are they so expensive (about $300 ) ?
Everyone says they wear out quickly.

My cynicism suggests they are merely a fashion accessory.

Can any TKC 80 owners quantify their choices. (more sizes perhaps?)
I have used Michelin T63 Tyres about 1/3 the price. They were fine.
On paper the Mitas E09 represents good value.

Be nice if it was that easy, i've only got 1 chain on my bike & whackin another tooth on that wont help. LOL

[Tony W]

It may be a bit of "you get what you pay for" mentality.

If you mean that if something is priced expensively, people
will think it is better, even though it's not, I agree with you.

( I also admit to having a major hang-up regarding Arai )

[NordieBoy]

If you mean that if something is priced expensively, people
will think it is better, even though it's not, I agree with you.

I like my $25 dealer price front Shinko SR244.

[MXNUT]

Also on the subject of TKC 80's, I have never used these tyres. Why are they so expensive (about $300 ) ?
I have used Michelin T63 Tyres about 1/3 the price. They were fine.

I have just fitted a Michelin T63 to the rear of my DRZ. So far have only done just under 1000 kms but with very little wear.
Previous tyres i have been using have been over half worn by 1000 kms.

Like you Tony, i refuse to pay $300 for a tyre. Michelin was $115.00 from cycletreads and so far i am very happy with on/off road performance and wear.

[Phreaky Phil]

I have just fitted a Michelin T63 to the rear of my DRZ. So far have only done just under 1000 kms but with very little wear.
Previous tyres i have been using have been over half worn by 1000 kms.

Like you Tony, i refuse to pay $300 for a tyre. Michelin was $115.00 from cycletreads and so far i am very happy with on/off road performance and wear.

Thats a good price for the Michelin. I paid $140 for the Mitas E09 and they are the same tyre as the T63 with a different badge

[NordieBoy]

Thats a good price for the Michelin. I paid $140 for the Mitas E09 and they are the same tyre as the T63 with a different badge

Close. The E-09 has a symmetrical pattern whereas the T63 is asymmetric.

[Phreaky Phil]

Close. The E-09 has a symmetrical pattern whereas the T63 is asymmetric.

Jeez, your right. Bloody close tho !

[warewolf]

Jeez, your right. Bloody close tho !And the side knobs aren't quite the same. Close enough that at first glance the E-09 appears the same as the T63. I wonder if the changes are as much as the legal boffins suggested in order to avoid copyright infringement?

That doesn't worry the SE Asians, quite a few tyres I've seen are all-but identical in tread pattern to known European models. Rubber compound and carcass construction can be VERY different though.

[timg]

Also on the subject of TKC 80's, I have never used these tyres.
Why are they so expensive (about $300 ) ?
Everyone says they wear out quickly.

My cynicism suggests they are merely a fashion accessory.

Can any TKC 80 owners quantify their choices.

$360 a set fitted & balanced on my Transalp and easily the best tyres I've had on it for my riding/use. The previous tyres were OEM Trail Wings which were good on seal but hopeless on gravel, espc once a bit worn. Good on the 'rider development days I did tho :). Twitchy in the wet :shit: & lasted just 4800km. Mitas E07 good allround tyre but very noisey and vibrated badly despite being balanced twice. Very square profile in 130/80/17. Rear is very loose in gravel when the tread wears down to the central rib. They lasted around 14k km. The TKC is my tyre of choice at the moment. They've done 4000km and look likely to go at least that again on the rear and the front shows barely any wear, but I do have an E09 rear in the rafters to try :) next. Cheers.

[Howie]

Also on the subject of TKC 80's, I have never used these tyres.
Why are they so expensive (about $300 ) ?
Everyone says they wear out quickly.

My cynicism suggests they are merely a fashion accessory.

Can any TKC 80 owners quantify their choices. (more sizes perhaps?)
I have used Michelin T63 Tyres about 1/3 the price. They were fine.
On paper the Mitas E09 represents good value.

I have run TKC80's on my KLR for the last 9000km, probably at about a 40% gravel/4wd track, 60% seal, Found them to be a good tyre all round,but only got about 4500km out of each rear, and the front is pretty near needing replacing at just over 9000km, Just fitted a IRC GP-110 on the rear, it seems to be ok on seal, and doesn't quite have the grip and drive of the TKC on gravel/dirt, but I expected that with tread pattern. I got quoted $270 as the RRP for the 130/70 17 rear TKC, which makes it fairly expensive. One thing I didn't check on that price was if it was the tubeless rear or the tube type which is a bit cheaper if they have them in stock.

[NordieBoy]

Just fitted a IRC GP-110 on the rear, it seems to be ok on seal, and doesn't quite have the grip and drive of the TKC on gravel/dirt, but I expected that with tread pattern.

How do you find the GP110 when leaned over a bit?

[Howie]

How do you find the GP110 when leaned over a bit?

I find it fine when leaned over on the road, (wet and dry) Makes an interesting noise though as you turn in. I did the WGTN wed night ride last week and the Paekakariki hill rd was wet although the rain had stopped, and seemed to have no more problems than others, I think my nearly worn out TKC on the front was limiting me more than the GP-110. I haven't really pushed then on the gravel yet, as I seem to have been picking a few of the freshly graded gravel roads since I put them on. I did the Mangahoe dams up behind Shannon last week, and even came across a grader working up there.

[Motu]

I can't let a mention of the GP110 go by without heaping on my scorn....even on seal it would slip,kinda fun....but a full knob was just as secure on seal,and a whole lot better everywhere else.

I fitted a 130-80 TW42 on the XT600 saturday - this is a big sucker meant for the Triumph Scrambler,and on the skinny 2.75 Yamaha rim the profile is a bit round.So it was a bit loose on the loose bits,and hooked up well on the hard pack.But bejeezers,these things hang on to the seal real good - and matched to the K180 flattrack front I was in 7th heaven.NO chicken strips on the wide 130 on my first ride....lean angle a sprotsbike rider would be proud of.The TW42 was the only tyre that could cope with the XLV750 on seal,everything else would step out on entry,but the TW42 was sticky enough to cope with the massive engine braking.I was looking forward to this combination,and it's going to be good.....for my riding anyway.

I've come to the conclusion that a totally worn rear tyre....that is worn to a flat or square profile has more grip on gravel than a new tyre.I've noticed that everytime I fit a new rear tyre I find it doesn't hook up as well as the worn tyre I just took off.More rubber on the ground means more traction than a new tyre with a rounder profile.

[NordieBoy]

The last TW42 I had on the back was an ex-rental 130-80-17 and it went fine. I just kept thinking that if the compound was a bit softer and it had a more compliant carcass it'd be sweet.

[Motu]

I like the TW42 because of the soft compound,and the tread pattern is about as street as I like to go.I put the carcase as a medium flex - it was pretty easy to fit,not like the rock hard T63.I like a flexable tyre too,and run pretty low pressure compared to what is considered appropriate.I don't take this bike off road on purpose,and as a back road tyre the TW42 is one of the best I've used.

[Underground]

I've tried lots of combinations including the infamous GP110 (coudnt wait to get rid of the buggers) I now use TKC80 front TW42 rear and that suits everything I do ,great on the gravel and you can really hammer them on the seal ,wet or dry. I too have just suffered the dissapointment of a new rear , seem to get a bit more control on the gravel with the baldy and you can slide it around more , new ones much better on the grass and clay tho ,also better for getting WOF's