Poverty

[Lou Girardin]

Yet another survey has just been released.
Maori and Pacific Island poverty has increased enormously between 2000 and 2004.
During Labours watch funnily enough.
But what got my attention was the policy wonk from the Ministry of Social Developement blaming this on ' multiple family impacts', namely divorce, death and the usual tragedies that occur to people.
He went on to say that people can handle one or two of these at a time, but when they have seven or eight it has a serious affect on their economic well-being.
No shit, Sherlock!
The really worrying thing is these tens of thousands of people that are having so many of these 'multiple family impacts'.
No wonder councilling is such a growth industry.
I always thought poverty was only having a Playstation 1.

[Motu]

No,it's only having a Serena van when you really need a Pajero to handle the weight....

[Finn]

Poverty is mostly a lifestyle choice in NZ. They get enough money from us, it's just the way they spend it is the problem.

That's all I have to say on the subject.

[frogfeaturesFZR]

Have you guys noticed common sense has been replaced ? Now somethings only for real if a study or poll has proved it. Reading through that list in the herald anyone with 1/4 a brain can see the events listed are life altering things. And we need a study to tell us this ???:gob:

[scumdog]

Povert in NZ means having enough for a PS2, a $9,999 vehicle, booze and a fancy cellphone but don't have enough for frivolities like food, kids clothes and stuff like that.

Just from what I've seen.

[MSTRS]

And any idiot can work out that if you give someone enough fish, there is even less reason for them to want to catch their own.

[scumdog]

And any idiot can work out that if you give someone enough fish, there is even less reason for them to want to catch their own.


And if you GIVE them the fish as opposed to making them WORK for the fish they will probably be less gratefull and appreciative of said fish and use them less wisely.

But maybe I'm a tad cynical.

[DMNTD]

Poverty is mostly a lifestyle choice in NZ. They get enough money from us, it's just the way they spend it is the problem.
I concur...it IS a choice!






...any idiot can work out that if you give someone enough fish, there is even less reason for them to want to catch their own.
Whoa that's deep man...and so very true too!

[Str8 Jacket]

Poverty is mostly a lifestyle choice in NZ. They get enough money from us, it's just the way they spend it is the problem.

That's all I have to say on the subject.

As much as it pains me to say it, Finn is right... Even the "homeless" usually collect some type of benefit.

[dhunt]

And if you GIVE them the fish as opposed to making them WORK for the fish they will probably be less gratefull and appreciative of said fish and use them less wisely.

But maybe I'm a tad cynical.
Yip I totally agree with you.

I think a lot of is too lazy to actually do anything to help themselves while they are getting free handouts. Some people can actually earn more money doing nothing than actually doing some real work.

Another issue that comes with getting handouts is loss of self respect as dependent on other people. Then again our government is trying to make everyone dependent on them so that we can't survive without Uncle Helen.

If they made it much harder to get benifits or actually make you do work for your benefit I think the difference would be huge.

[Quasievil]

There is no Poverty in New Zealand.....none, what we do have is a great deal of reliant people, people who depend on the huge industry we have set up to support them, Social welfare industry is the root cause of a great deal of our social problems, it is also responsible for our crap government as the huge number of reliant people always vote left, hence we have a handbraked economy. If you dont work, you dont vote in my opinion

[madboy]

From personal experience, I took a paycut in real terms to go off the DPB and go back to work. Thank God I didn't stay on that salary for long! I was an educated, experienced and motivated worker. Imagine how it must be for those people who have none or only some of those three qualities?

Hmm... do I sit on my ass and watch my big screen TV all day while my kid/s run riot, or do I go to work at [insert generic low-mid paying job here]??

It's a choice. Scumdog, MSTRS and Finn's comments deserve better than green rep.

[Swoop]

There, there... uncle heilen will make it better!
Here, have some more handouts of taxpayers money, and off to the pub/TAB you go! Don't forget to get some takeaways on your way home!

[Fatjim]

Kiwibiker.co.nz: "where every redneck can have his say"

[Quasievil]

Kiwibiker.co.nz: "where every redneck can have his say"

WHo's a redneck ??? anyone seen a redneck around these here paerts??:doobey:

[N4CR]

And if you GIVE them the fish as opposed to making them WORK for the fish they will probably be less gratefull and appreciative of said fish and use them less wisely.

But maybe I'm a tad cynical.

Yep


Povert in NZ means having enough for a PS2, a $9,999 vehicle, booze and a fancy cellphone but don't have enough for frivolities like food, kids clothes and stuff like that.

Just from what I've seen.

Yep


Poverty is mostly a lifestyle choice in NZ. They get enough money from us, it's just the way they spend it is the problem.

That's all I have to say on the subject.

Yep

And what Quasi and MSRTSSTTSRSSTSR said.

I don't even need to write anything now. Cheers guys.

-Rep heartily splashed out.

[Quasievil]

I didnt get any rep??? Im so desperate for rep, I only got 3500 points, how can I go on :yawn:

[Lias]

WHo's a redneck ??? anyone seen a redneck around these here paerts??:doobey:
*hurridly changes out of his flannel shirt*

[N4CR]

I didnt get any rep??? Im so desperate for rep, I only got 3500 points, how can I go on :yawn:

I did your rep in the 2nd batch ;) , Settle down!

[yungatart]

I've been pretty short of money odd times in my life - only difference between me and those in poverty is I didn't spend my money on booze, videos, takeaways, TAB or non nutritious food. Took me a year of hard graft and going without luxuries (wants vs needs) to get back on my feet. It is totally an attitude thing with people who are poor in NZ. They can't be bothered doing anything different to get out of the trap they put themselves in to. Why should they? WINZ will always help them out.

[Macktheknife]

I was unemployed once for about 3 months, I just couldn't find a job. Then I got one and was earning about $10 more than the dole, I had people asking me why I bothered. That was an experience I have never forgotten... and never repeated.
When people see no reason to work they have, in my opinion, lost all respect for themselves, their family, their community, and their country. It is a cancerous growth on our society. Cut it out.

[Beemer]

What about that beneficiary protesting outside a bank last week - reckoned they were ripping off low income workers. Excuse me, you are a BENEFICIARY - not a worker, so we could argue that she's one of the ones ripping US off.

I've been unemployed a couple of times and it's quite soul destroying. I am self-employed now and whenever I go into town in the middle of the day I worry that people will think I don't have a job! I once got a job where I was paid $25 a week less than the dole. I quit, but went temping, so not only did I get a much better hourly rate for more interesting work, I had the time to look around for a better job too.

The whole time I was ever on the dole, I fully expected to be asked why I hadn't got a job - and each time I had to report, I took copies of job application letters I had sent off, to prove I had been trying. They never even bothered to look at them. I did strike one wonderful woman in the WINZ office in Lower Hutt years ago, she was really encouraging even if she did admit it wasn't likely they would find me a job to utilise my skills. I don't know who was more excited when I got a job, her or me!

As for poverty being a choice, for some people I truly believe that. Look at that couple on that money show last night - they were spending $1400 a month more than what they earned, putting things on the credit card or hire purchase. Sorry, but if you are financially struggling, that is the last thing you do. Get some budgeting advice and learn how to cook - spending about $70 a week on snacks is appalling - that would feed us proper meals for more than a week! I spoke to someone at a food bank once and he said they gave this woman a food parcel with some mince in it but she brought it back a short time later, saying they may as well keep it because she didn't have a cat. So many people nowadays have no idea how to cook basic meals. If it doesn't come out of a packet with microwave heating instructions, they have no idea what to do with it.

[buellbabe]

Totally agreeing with everything especially Finns comment about Poverty being a lifestyle choice... somewhat harsh but true to a large extent.
I am a single white female with my own house, bike, car, couple of dogs etc... I have worked my BUTT OFF for everything I've got and I am struggling to keep my head above water alot of the time but I refuse to be without toys... its my choice and I don't rely on a Govt handout.
Oh BTW I DON'T have a Playstation...

[madboy]

Oh BTW I DON'T have a Playstation...Don't tell me you crossed to the dark side and got an XBox?

[buellbabe]

whats an Xbox?:doobey:

[scumdog]

Totally agreeing with everything especially Finns comment about Poverty being a lifestyle choice... somewhat harsh but true to a large extent.
I am a single white female with my own house, bike, car, couple of dogs etc... I have worked my BUTT OFF for everything I've got and I am struggling to keep my head above water alot of the time but I refuse to be without toys... its my choice and I don't rely on a Govt handout.
Oh BTW I DON'T have a Playstation...


I agree, it ticks me off when some broken-arse says to me "it's alright for you, you're lucky, you've got a Harley/house/hotrod" (or whatever).

Lucky?, lucky? do they think I just found the stuff in a gully somewhere or it was a heap of raffle prizes?

I've worked for the past 36+ years to get the stuff, last thing I need is a snotty 20-something year old dole-bludger telling me I'm 'lucky':nono:

I often tell them to get there sorry-arse of the ground and get a job.

Not one has said "But I can't"

[scumdog]

Kiwibiker.co.nz: "where every redneck can have his say"

Even the lazy slack-arsed dole-bludger rednecks....

[yungatart]

I agree, it ticks me off when some broken-arse says to me "it's alright for you, you're lucky, you've got a Harley/house/hotrod" (or whatever).
Funny, isn't it? The harder we work, the luckier we get!

[Ixion]

Bah. Humbug. Etc.

Who else saw today's Harold report on "poverty". With a emotive picture of someone dossed down in the open . With the implication that that was what "poverty" in NZ meant.

It gets right up my nose when I see my tax payments going to support a lazy bunch of shirkers, who are perfectly capable of working but choose not to. And MY tax payments provide them with a life style which includes a lot of stuff that I can't afford myself (or, choose not to afford).

Poverty? Humbug.



People in that category experienced at least some of the following: no telephone, no washing machine, less than required fresh fruit and veges, no heating in main rooms, postponed doctor's visits, did not have good shoes or a winter coat, relied on gifts for clothes


Oh, yeah?

No fruit and veges? Where's the vege gardens then? If you're out of work, first thing you do is GET FUCKIN' DIGGING. An able bodied person can feed a family from a back yard vege garden. I've done it. It doesn't require a big section, you can do it on the road verge if you have to.

No heating in main rooms? Oh , my heart bleeds. I don't heat the main rooms in winter either. No-one did in my day, the family gathered round the kitchen range, or went to bed with a hot water bottle. Which is what I do today. When we have visitors, often as not they say "Oh, how cold your house is". Yeah. Harden up. (Different for the really old, or sick. Though my gran lived to 92 and never heated)

Postponed doctors visits ? Don't we all. Though health care should be free, blame our right wing government for that one.

Do not have good shoes or a winter coat. Yeah? No Sallie Army second hand shop where they live? You can get jolly good clothes for a few dollars. I'm not too proud to buy them , so I don't see why beneficiaries should be.

I have IMMENSE sympathy for those who can't work through no fault of their own. And for workers struggling to make ends meet on the minimum wage, whilst exploiting corporations send billions of dollars in profits off shore. But I have ZERO tolerence for shirkers. And most of the sob stories put forward about "poverty" are shirkers.

Vote Communist. The only vote that makes sense.

[Goblin]

whats an Xbox?:doobey:
That's what my ex calls me.

[madboy]

Fatjim - if it weren't for the rednecks working, how would the poor afford the long necks? F***in slackers need to get off their lazy asses and start giving something back to society instead of take take take. I'm guessing from the nice suit you were wearing the other day that you're trolling :innocent:

Buellbabe, if you don't know what an XBox is you're too old :nya:

Goblin... :first:

[Fatjim]

I was kinda trolling, but not completely. I've got a question for all us red/white/brown necks here.

When you think of poor, what image comes to mind? for example, do you imagine a homeless blanket man, a huge woman with facial hair & 7 kids, a old person who can't get work cause they've spent 30 years working in a tyre factory.

I'm not justifying being poor, just that most people have an internal image of poverty in NZ (as apposed to Somalia) and I'd like to get a feel for what those images may be.

[The_Dover]

I think poor is not having a gixxer.

[Fatjim]

Bugger it Dover, you've started thinking. Whats next? Talking properly?

[MSTRS]

And if you GIVE them the fish as opposed to making them WORK for the fish they will probably be less gratefull and appreciative of said fish and use them less wisely.

But maybe I'm a tad cynical.
Yeah, join the club (Cynics Inc.) - if you haven't worked for it, how you gonna appreciate it? Or have any respect for those that do....?

[Str8 Jacket]

Well obviously poverty in NZ is entirely different to poverty in Somalia etc. How ever in NZ we have people who 'struggle'. This is not poverty, poverty is when there is no housing, no work, no farming no food etc. In NZ almost anyone can get a benefit, they can be given food certificates, they can be bought clothes, fridges and have cheap medical care. Alot of these beneficiaries in some way are better of than those of us who work. This is what angers me! When I was 15 and still at school I was on the Independant Youth Benefit with $20 a week for groceries. My high school used to send debt collectors to my flat as I could not afford to pay my school fees etc so I had to drop out of school. Lucky I wasnt stupid enough to stay on the benefit I got a full time job which then gave me $40 week for groceries. Then I got an apprenticeship and was saved. In some ways I was lucky but I prefer to call myself motivated. I have never been on a benefit again and all though at times I struggle with debts etc I survive just like most "normal" people (not on benefits). Unfortunately we have idots breeding bigger idiots and no one to take responsibility for them so the Government "look after" them. The Government should be alot more strict with benefits and people who are able bodied should be made to some type of work or course that would take x amount of there time each week, if they dont turn up then they should lose their benefits. There are some people who genuinely need benefits, but alot dont they have become lazy self serving individuals and that is why there is so many shitty things happening in NZ now.

[Fatjim]

Hels, you quoted the question but didn't answer it. You might as well go back to work.

[Str8 Jacket]

Hels, you quoted the question but didn't answer it. You might as well go back to work.

Yeah sorry, I started to answer it and then went of on a tangent. Now I cant remember what I was trying to say... ah well womans perogative eh?! Ive taken your quote out now... happy? :p

[yungatart]

When you think of poor, what image comes to mind?

Overweight, dressed in track pants that are too small to cover their distended stomachs, barefoot or jandal clad, in desperate need of some soap and hot water, lank greasy hair. They are usually followed by their tribe of poorly behaved ill disciplined snot nosed whining brats, around the supermarket. The trolley has beer and wine for Africa, plenty of coke and chippies, ice cream, biscuits and lollies. No matter how hard you look, you cannot see any fruit, vegetables, meat, canned fish or indeed, anything of nutritional value - apart from the two loaves of bread and the jar of peanut butter. They get to the checkout ahead of you, order their carton of smokes and proceed to pay using a voucher from WINZ.
They pack their groceries, pausing only to yell at young Junior, while giving Junioress a biff around the ear.
They head out to the parking lot, load the bags into a van bought from the local "No deposit- only 60 easy payments" car yard, yelling all the while at their kids who know that playing with a trolley in the carpark is sure to put a dent in some rich bitches car, (who cares- not my car). Mum screams at them one more time, "If you f***en kids don't get in the f***en car now, I'll f***en bash you, now hurry the f*** up, we're going to McD's"
Trash, poor white trash or poor brown trash- makes no difference, they are just trash.
Does that help, Jim?

[Indiana_Jones]

Well poverty for the kids, mum and dad need the money for fags and the TAB

-Indy

[Swoop]

I think poor is not having a gixxer.
Poor IS having a gixxer because of all the repairs and higher insurance from binning them...

[The_Dover]

Poor IS having a gixxer because of all the repairs and higher insurance from binning them...


Good point, that's why I can't afford clothes, shoes or food.

[Swoop]

Good point, that's why I can't afford clothes, shoes or food.
NOW you are a perfect candidate for uncle heilens handouts! STOP all work and sit on your arse at the TAB...

Seig Heil!

[madboy]

I think youngatart has summed it up nicely. It's not a colour thing, it's not an education thing (as pointed out by Str8) it's an attitude thing. Like others have said, it's a choice. You may not be able to entirely control your income, but you can certainly choose your expenses. And you can control the general level of your income.

My upbringing was substantially different to Str8s (which may explain a few differences we have). I had well off parents, I lived in a lovely house in a lovely suburb and drove lovely cars. I had as much education as I wanted. I didn't even think of food/clothing/shelter as an issue because it was always there for me. But my parents weren't born with all of that, they worked for it. No one gave them money to give to me, or to buy me nice clothes. And fortunately they've been able to pass on to me a work ethic, so that I can start building my own life, reliant on no one but myself. And while I'm lazy and will always take the easy option, at least it's the easy option that I'm paying for!

Now look at the role models the "impoverished" have. Bit hard to instil positive attributes in the kids if you are completely devoid of them yourself.

[Skyryder]

Only those who have never known poverty claim it is a choice. Poverty is a result of bad decisions...............not from choosing to be poor.

Skyryder

[The_Dover]

Poverty is a result of bad decisions

Skyryder

Such as buying a Guzzi?

[Grahameeboy]

Interesting debate......for a lot of us here who have broken marriages, we tend to be in the often forgotten about hole inbetween poverty and being comfortable.....I am lucky cause my folks are helping me keep house as I want to look after my daughter, however, it is still a struggle some months and I am sure I am not alone.

Yes poverty is a state of mind and not just about money....I see a lot of Pacific Islanders who are probably struggling but they all get together and go to the beach and enjoy life.....compared to them I am wealthy and life is all about putting things in perspective.

[The_Dover]

I see a lot of Pacific Islanders who are probably struggling to decide whether to spend their dole at the pub or the TAB

Yeah, tough decisions require mental strength and the kind of faith only the good lord can provide.

Pub it is then.

[Grahameeboy]

Yeah, tough decisions require mental strength and the kind of faith only the good lord can provide.

Pub it is then.

You are awful.......................

[mstriumph]

Bah. Humbug. Etc.

........................It gets right up my nose when I see my tax payments going to support a lazy bunch of shirkers, who are perfectly capable of working but choose not to. And MY tax payments provide them with a life style which includes a lot of stuff that I can't afford myself (or, choose not to afford).

Poverty? Humbug. ..........................



OH .......... erm ....... for a minute there i thought u were talking about polititians - and i was about to agree with you :o


Vote Communist. The only vote that makes sense.

but --- i'm an anarchist ... to me NO vote makes sense?

[or is that 'antichrist' ?? spelling has never been my forte ..........]

[Grahameeboy]

The problem is that NZ is a country that does not actually support 'responsibility'

An economic paper a few years ago said that 98% of the pop. think the Govt should help them.

Hence ACC which is a non fault system....you know drive whilst drunk...so breaking the Law....but it is okay cause if you crash you will get help....

No compulsory insurance for cars / bikes.

I need a car for work...lose licence......okay I will get a work licence.

Try this in other Countries??

[NhuanH]

jandal clad
Does that make me three times as po' because I's gots three pairs of jandals?

By the way, the plight of "middle" NZ needs to be raised here. There are families with parents working, dual income, that are struggling just above the poverty line.

Does that re-pitch your quick-to-conclude view of poverty?

[Grahameeboy]

Does that make me three times as po' because I's gots three pairs of jandals?

By the way, the plight of "middle" NZ needs to be raised here. There are families with parents working, dual income, that are struggling just above the poverty line.

Does that re-pitch your quick-to-conclude view of poverty?

Exactly...................poverty is very subjective......

[Sketchy_Racer]

You want "nice" stuff?

Get the hell off your fat fucking ass. Put down the McD's

And get a job.

Nuff said

[chanceyy]

Well poverty for the kids, mum and dad need the money for fags and the TAB

You forgot to add pub

[Indiana_Jones]

You forgot to add pub

My mistake, love.

-Indy

[Grahameeboy]

Valid point Mr Jones but I also know parents who do not do that.....

[John Banks]

Hence ACC which is a non fault system....you know drive whilst drunk...so breaking the Law....but it is okay cause if you crash you will get help....
I wouldn't fault ACC for that. Pretty much the doctor's dilemma... how are you supposed to judge if someone deserves to live or die?

[The_Dover]

The only place I've ever seen you is the pub.

Beer in one hand, bible in the other....

[chanceyy]

My mistake, love.

-Indy

no problem honey ... just gotta go to the local to see the kids in the car while the olds are inside drinking, gambling, etc .. always on benefit day ;)

[Edbear]

But maybe I'm a tad cynical.



Now whatever would bring that on....?:wait:

[yungatart]

By the way, the plight of "middle" NZ needs to be raised here. There are families with parents working, dual income, that are struggling just above the poverty line.

Does that re-pitch your quick-to-conclude view of poverty?
In a word, no! Mstrs is self employed, I work as a teacher aide at a high school. We have brought up 6 kids,1 left at home now, paid child support, received child support sporadically from the other parent, and stuggled heaps of times. 1 of our kids had huge medical expenses not covered by benefits or ACC, they all played sport and had other extra curricular activities. We manged! Our bills were always paid, there was food on the table and all the kids had decent warm clothing and shoes to wear. The clothes weren't up to the minute latest fashion stuff, it was either home made or second hand, the food wasn't restaurant style but there was plenty of it and our fun times were free, picnics bush walks, bike rides(pushies) or walks to the library etc. We had priorities, it was always needs vs wants, and there was no money for luxuries - read lotto, booze, takeaways etc
Poverty is a choice - and not one that I would ever make!
PS Prior to meeting Mstrs I was a solo mother on DPB with 3 kids, same lifestyle as above.. I paid the horrendous monetary debt that my ex- husband left me with in a little over 12 months on a benefit, was it easy? No way! Was it worth it to be able to hold my head up, maintain my dignity and show my kids a work ethic - hell yes!

[Indiana_Jones]

Valid point Mr Jones but I also know parents who do not do that.....

It's Dr. Jones........well in dream land

In real life I'm a cadet lol

-Indy

[Indiana_Jones]

no problem honey ... just gotta go to the local to see the kids in the car while the olds are inside drinking, gambling, etc .. always on benefit day ;)

She's onto it :)

-Indy

[Hitcher]

If you dont work, you dont vote in my opinion
No representation without taxation. That would create an interesting social dynamic...

And don't forget to add big dogs to the list of Sky TV, 42" plasma, Pajero, cigarettes, beer, casinos and McDonald's. Big dogs fed on tinned dog food or prime meat from the butcher's.

[jrandom]

This is all very silly. Lank, fat, greasy-haired brown, white and purple people will always be among us. What do all you whingers expect to do about it? Turn on the showers and fire the ovens?

Just shut up, pay your very reasonable tax bills, and get on with enjoying life. Jesus H. Christ. It doesn't get a whole lot better than this.

[oldrider]

Anything that is "free" means that someone else is paying for it! (There is no such thing as a free lunch)

Beneficiaries are not low paid, they do not work, they are actually beggars. (One of my children is a beneficiary)

There will always be a percentage of any community that will fit into that category and most people accept that as a necessary burden.

The trouble is the Government steals (Taxes) our money and gives it to those that will vote for "them".

Governments create as many false beggars as they can to create dependency upon themselves and ensure continuance in office.

Expecting governments to get rid of beneficiaries is like expecting rabbit boards to get rid of rabbits, the reason for their existence.

That will never happen as long as the government can make us pay for it and support them in doing it! (suckers aren't we)

How would it be if you were able to keep your own (Tax) money and give it to someone of "your" choice, how many beneficiaries would there be then?

I feel like a beneficiary but I have been paying the premiums for that privilege for the past 45yrs, I expect to be paid back now, just like any insurance premium, my pension policy has reached maturity.

I am still being taxed by the thieves to pay for those who will not work and if I take up a job myself I am denying someone of working age an opportunity.

It's like a dog chasing it's tail around isn't it. :blip: Cheers John.

[Hitcher]

It doesn't get a whole lot better than this.
Good lord, it's the Rt Hon Helen Clark incarnate!

[Str8 Jacket]

Good lord, it's the Rt Hon Helen Clark incarnate!

Do you mean the Right Horrible?...

[jrandom]

Good lord, it's the Rt Hon Helen Clark incarnate!

Ignore me; I'm stoned.

[Biff]

Good lord, it's the Rt Hon Helen Clark incarnate!

I thought 'it' was a vertebrate?

[jrandom]

Do you mean the Right Horrible?...

No, he doesn't.

And your sig is misspelled.

[Hitcher]

Ignore me; I'm stoned.
With comments like the above, you bloody well ought to be.

[jrandom]

With comments like the above, you bloody well ought to be.

Well, I am. Or, at least, I will be. This temporal dilation business is confusing. But don't try and tell me that this is not the best of all possible worlds.

Deary me, I think I need to change my undies.

[Grahameeboy]

I wouldn't fault ACC for that. Pretty much the doctor's dilemma... how are you supposed to judge if someone deserves to live or die?

I am not saying it in that context......sorry if it did not come across that way....

[jrandom]

context...... way....

Where are the Ellipses Police when you need them?

Hai'm h'arrestin' yew for h'over h'ewse of them wee dotties, matey. 'tain't right. 'taint proper.

[Hitcher]

Deary me, I think I need to change my undies.
Too much information. A vertiable affront to Y-fronts.

[jrandom]

vertiable affront...

Oh, I say, that's a bit forward of you, isn't it? I only verti my affronts on alternate Tuesdays, old bean.

[Pixie]

Clark & Cullen have,brilliantly,turned $ 100,000 families into beneficiaries,thus ensuring more votes next election.

[mstriumph]

Ignore me; I'm stoned.

... and so you SHOULD be! :blip: ......... boom BOOM .............

....... oh BUM and damnation - Hitcher got there first .......... mutter mutter mutter

[KATWYN]

I read this email once that said "a rich person is not one
that has the most....but one that needs the least" :blah:

[Edbear]

I read this email once that said "a rich person is not one
that has the most....but one that needs the least" :blah:



Mmmm! Got anyone in mind...?:innocent:

[mstriumph]

I read this email once that said "a rich person is not one
that has the most....but one that needs the least" :blah:


yippeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!! was just pondering a new sig. and *whammo* ...... thanks KATWYN and your anonymous email sender!! :yes: :rockon:

[KATWYN]

yippeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!! was just pondering a new sig. and *whammo* ...... thanks KATWYN and your anonymous email sender!! :yes: :rockon:


I wonder if its one of the many Dalai Lama quotes??