Here's yet another one...

[Paul in NZ]

Oh god!

I gave up on television news because frankly, it just got too damn depressing.. So I stuck with the newspaper and a few online news sources..

This morning I read this....

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/story.cfm?c_id=1&ObjectID=10391050

oh ho - but there is MORE.. Seems it's a family trait...

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/story.cfm?c_id=1&ObjectID=10391051

Of course, this is not a direct relative but I bet they went to the same school..

http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/0,2106,3729693a11,00.html

Now... After my rage settled and I calmed down a little..... Could some one PLEASE tell me why the heck we tolerate this? Those of you that know me will hopefully vouch that I'm not a 'bad' person. I try to be a good guy and contribute to the greater good where and when I can, I can have a firey temper when provoked (more rash than violent) which seems to get worse when my blood sugars go wonky (Type 1 Diabetes). My biggest fault is speaking my mind at seemingly inappropriate times which some people find insulting but insults are not usually intended, think of it as more of unfortunate social skills from an independant thinker.. but I'd no more attack someone physically than fly to the moon.

So why do I want to exterminate these people with extreme predudice? Am I disgusted by them or scared of them? Is this something deep inside us all??

If am not allowed to execute this filth, what can we do to eradicate these vermin from our lives?????

Seriously - what the heck is the answer here - I really don't get it....

Perhaps it IS too hard and we really should let god sort it all out????

Paul N

[Dadpole]

Head down to your local secondary school and you can pick the ones who will turn out like that.
Then kill them

[Motu]

I've written my reply Paul...it scared the hell out of me and I have burnt it.But it feels a little better to vent.

[The Pastor]

just send them all off to the south island. out of site, out of mind.

[SARGE]

. I try to be a good guy and contribute to the greater good where and when I can, I can have a firey temper when provoked (more rash than violent) which seems to get worse when my blood sugars go wonky (Type 1 Diabetes). My biggest fault is speaking my mind at seemingly inappropriate times which some people find insulting but insults are not usually intended, think of it as more of unfortunate social skills from an independant thinker.. but I'd no more attack someone physically than fly to the moon.

So why do I want to exterminate these people with extreme predudice? Am I disgusted by them or scared of them? Is this something deep inside us all??



Paul my friend.. you can party with me anytime..

[dnos]

Fuck that pisses me off.
why are they allowed to get away with shit like that wen they have such a history.
And as far as i can see it is getting worse

[GR81]

and the best thing of all... we pay their wages (dole)

boo! :nono:

[sels1]

Seriously - what the heck is the answer here - I really don't get it....

Perhaps it IS too hard and we really should let god sort it all out????

Paul N

I suspect too many people wouldnt like the real answer.....

[Paul in NZ]

Fuck that pisses me off.
why are they allowed to get away with shit like that wen they have such a history.
And as far as i can see it is getting worse

Thats my problem in a nutshell. Is it getting worse or do we just have better access to this sort of info?? I just don't know and before anyone talks about knee jerk reactions, it's not, I'm sorry but this is not right. I mean, this is not trivial stuff... Imagine the impact these two brothers have had on the the lives of others and ask is this fair?? Imagine what this has cost in resources and damage?? You are paying for it...

Preventitive detention?

I wonder if there is a method where if closely related family commit serious crimes of a broadly similar nature some sort of double jeapordy comes into play??

[Paul in NZ]

I suspect too many people wouldnt like the real answer.....

I suspect the difference would be those who have been affected by these clowns and those who have been lucky so far.... I guess I look at this as a husband and a father of 3 daughters....

[Motu]

Me too...it could of been one of my daughters.It would be extremely hard to cope with...I'd explode in a serious way.....

[Lias]

Personally I think we should have the death penalty re-introduced, and used not just for murders but for serious sex offenders too.

I'm sure some will disagree, but to my mind when you act like that, you are proving that you cannot act like a human being. As such you give up your rights as a human being, including the right to continue breathing.

[placidfemme]

Speaking of all the violent feelings these people raise in us, what does everyone think of the death penalty?

Edit: Lias beat me to it

[muzz]

[QUOTE=Paul in NZ]I suspect the difference would be those who have been affected by these clowns and those who have been lucky so far.... I guess I look at this as a husband and a father of 3 daughters....[/QUOTE



It sounds like i have a very similar nature too you paul and i would hate to think what I would do to these pricks if it was my girls this sort of behavier should not and will not be tolerated. But how do you know that someone is an arsehole until they prove it.

[Paul in NZ]

It sounds like i have a very similar nature too you paul and i would hate to think what I would do to these pricks if it was my girls this sort of behavier should not and will not be tolerated. But how do you know that someone is an arsehole until they prove it.

I really don't know the answer to that...

And I really don't like the feelings these things generate in me.. I suspect that it's due to frustration at 'societies' complete in ability to deal with this?

I have no doubt that the people that commit these crimes are damaged units and possibly mentally ill BUT I feel for the victims and my belief is that there are crimes, so terrible in nature that the people that commit them cannot be trusted again OR forgiven.

I'm not suggesting slaughtering people - but I am asking a serious question - how do we deal with this??

Paul N

[SARGE]

Speaking of all the violent feelings these people raise in us, what does everyone think of the death penalty?

Edit: Lias beat me to it


totally in favor of it 1000%.. and none of this pussy gas chamber shit..

lets let thoose affected have a go with hockey sticks

Cruel and unusual punishment is bullshit.. no such thing imho.. let the punishment fit the crime

[placidfemme]

totally in favor of it 1000%.. and none of this pussy gas chamber shit..

lets let thoose affected have a go with hockey sticks

Cruel and unusual punishment is bullshit.. no such thing imho.. let the punishment fit the crime

Exactly!!! Saves a LOT of taxes too, more space in prisons and a lot more satisfied victims and family of the victims

[Macktheknife]

Imagine the impact these two brothers have had on the the lives of others and ask is this fair?? Imagine what this has cost in resources and damage?? You are paying for it...
Preventitive detention??
Paul, I think you have echoed many people's sentiments exactly but Preventive Detention is hugely expensive. It costs on average $72,000 per inmate, per year to incarcerate someone in NZ. This is in my view not the correct option for serial offenders of the sexual or murderous type.
I firmly believe that we could do a great deal more good to volunteer these people for organ donation and save people who are worth keeping in our community. This kind of scum are simply not worth the effort of keeping alive. I believe that some types of criminals can be rehabilitated, and some cannot. Clearly these fall into the latter category.
Placid Femme, I say bring back the death penalty for serial offenders in sexual or extreme violence cases, we do not need or want them in our society and they are too expensive to keep locked up, so kill them in a humane way and harvest their organs for others more worthy.

[Motu]

Oh please NO! I'd hate to wake up after surgery with this guys brain!

[Swoop]

This appears to be evolution in action.
Dumbarses breeding dumber dumbasses, who are in some respects smarter.
The newer generations are smart enough to realise the law/s and their loopholes and also the welfare system and its exploitable areas.

The losers?
1: the immediate victim/s (obviously)
2: the taxpayer who funds all of this (thank you for voting these bastards in)
3: society in general, whose standards decline...
4: the police, for ending up having to deal with the dumbarses on a day to day basis.


A diminishing circle.

[placidfemme]

Placid Femme, I say bring back the death penalty for serial offenders in sexual or extreme violence cases, we do not need or want them in our society and they are too expensive to keep locked up, so kill them in a humane way and harvest their organs for others more worthy.

Thats a very good idea. I believe that anyone given a "life" sentance (who will actually be serving "life"... which means no-one in NZ:angry: ) should get the death penalty. Why should we as tax payers support some criminal for 10+ years.

Harvesting the organs is an awesome idea... they are paying back thier debt to society by helping people (in more ways than one... less tax... less crime... and saving lives) :first:

But honestly I don't think there is any chance in hell of NZ bringing in the death penatly, our government are too PC and shit

[yungatart]

I don't have all the answers, but have long thought that serial sex offenders should be taken to some derelict shed, their dick clamped in a vice, give them a blunt rusty saw blade and then set the shed alight. That way, whatever happens to them is their choice!

[placidfemme]

I don't have all the answers, but have long thought that serial sex offenders should be taken to some derelict shed, their dick clamped in a vice, give them a blunt rusty saw blade and then set the shed alight. That way, whatever happens to them is their choice!

And what about the female sex offenders (there are a fair few out there)

[yungatart]

And what about the female sex offenders (there are a fair few out there)
I have no idea... give me some time and I might come up with something fitting for them too

[The_Dover]

And what about the female sex offenders (there are a fair few out there)

Sentence them to a week on the farm with Mr Poo's.

[Lias]

I have no idea... give me some time and I might come up with something fitting for them too
I had a discussion about that with someone years ago and we came up with an idea for a device that was basically a cross between a soldiering iron/curling iron and a dildo.

Now THAT would be cruel and unusual punishment...

[avgas]

Death would be too easy - i say we butcher the fuckers and sell the meat to the third world

[MSTRS]

Death would be too easy - i say we butcher the fuckers and sell the meat to the third world
What, you mean South Auckland?

[Lou Girardin]

It sounds like even Sharia law is too soft for some folks.

[scumdog]

I have a bottle of wine waiting for the day a person such as them gets out of prison and is found painfully dead the next day...:yes: It WILL happen one day.

[Ozzie]

As a father of two daughters, and a son, I would want to cause serious harm, in a fitting way....eg.....

A tube up the arse, poke razor wire up there, remove the tube, then remove the razor wire.

I think in reality, if anyone did anything to my kids, I'd be sitting across the road from the court house and just shoot the fucker in the head on his way in.

Perhaps for these people we could invoke a combination of old methods, castration and deportation. Not our problem where they end up, but don't let them back here.

[SPman]

Drop him in a room full of women with PMT and knives,who know what he's done...........................

[Skunk]

It costs on average $72,000 per inmate, per year to incarcerate someone in NZ.

I didn't know bread and water cost so much...

[placidfemme]

I didn't know bread and water cost so much...

no but the heated floors, tv and entertainment does

[Beemer]

Well, that explains it ALL then - family history of it, means they had no self-control or will to do otherwise. What's the bet they had a deprived childhood - no Play Station or pokies?

I like SPman's idea - women, PMT and knives - hell, they probably wouldn't even need the knives!

[The Stranger]

Speaking of all the violent feelings these people raise in us, what does everyone think of the death penalty?

Edit: Lias beat me to it

Ok I am all in favour of the death penalty as a principal, however perhaps we should ask Arthur Allan Thomas as well for his view before we pass the law.

[Ozzie]

perhaps we should ask Arthur Allan Thomas as well for his view before we pass the law.

Who? Who is Arthur Allan Thomas?

[Marmoot]

I'm not suggesting slaughtering people - but I am asking a serious question - how do we deal with this??

Paul N

Send them on Hard Labour in war-torn countries where we go as PeaceKeepers.

Either they survive to go to another war place, or die killed, or commit crime and get death/life sentences.

They'll die doing something good for others.

[Marmoot]

Perhaps for these people we could invoke a combination of old methods, castration and deportation. Not our problem where they end up, but don't let them back here.

I support castration, but you want to deport this filth to........where???

[The Stranger]

Who? Who is Arthur Allan Thomas?
The guy who was convicted for the murder of Harvey and Janet Crew and was finally acquitted after many retrials and about 11 yrs (if memeory is correct) inside.

But you could also include a few others. Lindy Chamberlain , David Bain, Peter Ellis (though not murder), or Scot Watson. The last 3 were all convicted on what I (and many others) feel could be considered very flimsy evidence.

[Ozzie]

I support castration, but you want to deport this filth to........where???

I like your suggestion, but basically don't gve a F***, as long as they are away from my family.

[riffer]

I have a bottle of wine waiting for the day a person such as them gets out of prison and is found painfully dead the next day...:yes: It WILL happen one day.

And they will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law ... try and tell me that the Police won't do that. I double-dare you. :angry:

My father in law served 9 months for beating the shit out of the arsehole who molested my ex as an 8-year-old, leaving her with massive bruising around her neck where he tried to kill her but wasn't successful as the noise woke the rest of the family up.

I vote vigilantism. :angry:

[ManDownUnder]

Seriously - what the heck is the answer here - I really don't get it....

Perhaps it IS too hard and we really should let god sort it all out????

Paul N

I think it's a long term plan... which likely means the pollies don;t have the ability to make it happen.

1) Stop the kids from doing the small stuff. You do somethign bad - you get busted. Broken windows policy as la Juliani in NYC is what I have in mind
2) Lock the bad bastards up... some of them for keeps. It pains me to say that because I am all for correction of a person where possible... but some of the, so maybe if they get a decent sentence (like 20 years) first time up, then a life sentence after that...?

With no role models, and the police and public suitably empowered with the "kick in the pants" mentality kids don't go wrong, so big kids don;t go really wrong.

Too much PC and lenience these days. The cops have less rights and abilities than the crims... they also have less numbers. As a member of the public I'm so confused about what I can and can not do to assist it's not funny.

Too many rules, too much leniency, too much "understanding", and not enough accountability. Take the bad bastards out of circulation... and have a crime free generation... that'd change things.

[Fryin Finn]

The answer is simple eugenics - everone is sterilised at birth (reversible at later date) and only given the option to breed when they are shown to be capable parents.
As Fascist dictator of this country I would implement this.

[Paul in NZ]

Well a lot of creative suggestions and one that provided a rather - um - interesting insight into areas that I really didn't know even existed...

Look, the desire for revenge is a part of us all but i see no need for cruelty, I think that just traumatises the initial victim even more as they will feel some guilt about it. (or be made to by some)

I'm more for a quiet clinical end if required BUT.....

One thing is for sure - reasonable doubt must have a place. In a lot of these cases there is NO DOUBT at all and thats the difference. Personally, in many ways I consider rape etc a far worse crime than murder and perople that just don't care how many lives they scar and ruin for their own selfish pleasure are really dangerous and in my limited experience take no responsibility for what they have done.

How are these poor people ever going to deal with this. That young girl tied up in the back seat while her older sister gets raped? Sorry - forget arthur allan thomas - this turkey crossed the line and it was a great big bold one with circles and arrows highlighted in neon and if he could not see it then too bad...

Ah crap - I dunno.... That poor family (and others) must be torn apart by this. I wonder how they are doing? damn...

[Lou Girardin]

And they will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law ... try and tell me that the Police won't do that. I double-dare you. :angry:

My father in law served 9 months for beating the shit out of the arsehole who molested my ex as an 8-year-old, leaving her with massive bruising around her neck where he tried to kill her but wasn't successful as the noise woke the rest of the family up.

I vote vigilantism. :angry:

I think there's something to be said for it too. As long as the vigilantes are brighter than the bunch that thought a paediatrician was a kiddie fiddler.

[ManDownUnder]

...only given the option to breed when they are shown to be capable parents.

LOL - mate that's like allowing people to have access to education so long as they pass Higher School Cert or whatever

Na - it's a case of learning as you go with parenting

[Macktheknife]

Ok I am all in favour of the death penalty as a principal, however perhaps we should ask Arthur Allan Thomas as well for his view before we pass the law.
Ummmm, I think the point I raised was for SERIAL offenders of the sexual predator/extreme violence type, not one off madness like the Crewe murders or similar. When someone has shown a complete reckless disregard for the lives of others on several occassions they have shown they are not going to be rehabilitated, so thats fine, you have volunteered for the criminal organ donation programme. Make sure they have no incurable nasties or other crap to pass on to the receiver and supply the usable organs to the much under-supplied health system.

[scumdog]

And they will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law ... try and tell me that the Police won't do that. I double-dare you. :angry:


Gotta catch them first.
How much effort would YOU put into catching a person that did that? Tickets are more imprtant.

After it happens a couple of times maybe those scumsuckers in prison will have enough fear and paranoia to top themselves first.

Ta-da, we're all winners, no guilt anywhere!