Helmets 101

[Colapop]

Who's got pointers about what to look for? Obviously the big one - it has to fit comfortably. What does that actually mean though? How should it fit? It may sound like a stupid question but, I'm serious. Most helmets I put on feel, ok. Not superb and not bad. I've been told that different helmets fit differently - that just means to me that many people have many different shaped heads.
What is the difference between a $100 lid and a $800 one? How many vents do I need? Do I need a flip top lid? Do colours make a difference (visibility)?
Apart from just saying "You should get "X" brand" can you guys give some pointers?

[MattRSK]

Make sure you get one that is tight to start with. They do crush down inside them. When I bought mine it felt like it was going to rip my ears off everytime I took it on or off, but now it is real comfortable and does not move around on my head. Well worth the money too. Shark RS800.

[Mental Trousers]

Even pressure everywhere is a good thing to aim for. It means the helmet is actually the right shape for your head. It should be tight enough that when you grab the chin piece and move it up and down or left to right that it doesn't actually move on your head. Once you've found one that seems to fit wear it for 5 minutes in the shop and see if you start getting a headache. If you do, go up to the next size. And remember helmets will loosen up a little over time.

[RantyDave]

What is the difference between a $100 lid and a $800 one?
Weight; noise; aerodynamics (particularly when doing a headcheck prior to changing lanes); whether or not the liner can be removed practically; vents; a thing that directs breath down instead of at the visor; pretty colours ... I think that's about it. Almost certainly not how safe it is. I'm steadily becoming of the 'more expensive' school of thought on helmets, what with using a basically cheap one every day.

Would be interested in a discussion about whether or not one can test ride a helmet - don't know how you'd assess noise and aerodynamics otherwise. Bike shop people? Hello?

Dave

[Str8 Jacket]

Definately look out for a pastel coloured open faced helmet. THey're the best.

[Squeak the Rat]

Parroting some of the above:

Snug fit with no pressure spots. It should be tight enough that your cheeks and forehead move with the helmet when it is moved side to side or up/down.

Given the same helmet design, more vents = noisier. That doesn't necessarily mean a well vented helmet is noisier than a lesser vented competitor.

Noise is also generated by airflow around the base of the helmet. Ensure a good fit around cheeks. Some brands have chin spoilers (eg Arai) while some use neck curtains (i think Nolan).

Most of the more expensive ones conform to Snell standards. This involves a two impact test at certain weight/force. Most cheaper ones conform to Dot or some other standard I can't remember. However there is a line of thought that suggests a the double hit test is unlikely to be needed as it is tested in exactly the same point so Snell helmets might be over-engineered and subject the head to higher G-forces.

Colour? White is supposed to be the safest colour but not sure if that is scientifically proven or not. Another thought is that heavy graphics act as camoflauge and solid colours are better for vis. But you wear black leather...?

Flip lids - most/some don't conform to full face safety standards. I think Nolan are ok, not sure about others. Good at gas stations but of dubious aesthetic value at supermarkets.

Weight - obviously lighter is more comfortable, especially over longer distances.

Regarding the fit, most bike shops are pretty good at helping out. You should be able to tell fairly easy who knows what they are talking about.

[Shadows]

Do I need a flip top lid?

Apparently not if you have one of those Reach toothbrushes.

[sAsLEX]

What shape is your head?

Arai shoei etc?!

Also Asians are better off getting their helmets from over there as to pcompanies have diff shapes for diff markets etc

I am not saying your asian though, just dont be fooled into something cheap on the net if you dont know what it is exactly.

Should be snug, if not slightly tight as your head will mould into the inner linings.

D rings are better than clips.

Look for black or plain as they will be cheaper so you can buy a better quality helmet rather than a prettier one.

Some fitment tips here http://www.araihelmet-europe.com/site/manuals/Manual_ENG.pdf

[Colapop]

I've seen these (http://www.a-bug.com/index.php?q=uggc%3A%2F%2FJJJ.GENQRZR.PB.AM%2FGenqr-Zr-Zbgbef%2FZbgbeovxrf%2FUryzrgf-pybguvat-sbbgjrne%2FUryzrgf%2Fnhpgvba-66546135.ugz) on Tardme or this (http://www.a-bug.com/index.php?q=uggc%3A%2F%2FJJJ.GENQRZR.PB.AM%2FGenqr-Zr-Zbgbef%2FZbgbeovxrf%2FUryzrgf-pybguvat-sbbgjrne%2FUryzrgf%2Fnhpgvba-66744306.ugz) - I like the black one better (as a style) but I'll get one from a shop I think.

[Gremlin]

Make sure its SNELL approved as well... its a higher standard than dot, and uses batch testing, not design approval (well, what I was told, anyway).

You might be surprised just how small the size of the helmet might be. I'm not little, but buying a medium was not a good idea, as its loose now. I'm going for a small next time, as crazy at it may seem.

[sAsLEX]

Make sure its SNELL approved as well... its a higher standard than dot, and uses batch testing, not design approval (well, what I was told, anyway).



Just the HJC cls type that was banned in the states?


And wouldnt really look at that zues helmet. $5 head then get a $5 helmet.

[Colapop]

yEAH BUT i CAN'T AFFORD A $10,000 HELMET

[Hitcher]

Helmets? Harumph! It would be nice to have a choice...

[Lou Girardin]

With flip fronts, look for 'P' or 'N/P' on the certification serial number. NP means it has been certified as an open face. (The chin bar won't pass the tests)
To check fit, hold the sides of the helmet with both hands, move your head from side to side slightly, the skin on your forehead should move with the helmet lining.
Then check whether it will roll forward by doing up the strap and trying to roll the helmet forward on your head. It should not move much.
Go for the snuggest fit that is comfortable, helmets padding does compress with use.
When you decide on one, give it to Dover to test.

[Motig]

Wouldn't worry about a flip front unless you wear glasses. Thats the only reason I'm going to get one of those new Nolans,to much hassle with the glasses, otherwise normal full face would be fine.As for price get the best you can afford, as long as its a well known make you'll be right.

[sAsLEX]

Wouldn't worry about a flip front unless you wear glasses. Thats the only reason I'm going to get one of those new Nolans,to much hassle with the glasses, otherwise normal full face would be fine.As for price get the best you can afford, as long as its a well known make you'll be right.

I wear glasses off and on with contacts and for example I find the Shoei I wear everyday to be rather fine with them, but the HJC I wear on weekends etc aint the best with them


so make sure you try them on with glasses if you do wear them.

[Colapop]

Yeah I do wear glassess. Maybe getting contacts soon. What about sunny's - just get a tinted visor? How easily are they interchangeable?

[pastybee]

Who's got pointers about what to look for?

I have seen your head so any helmet covering that ugly mug of yours would be helpful for all of us

P

[Colapop]

That's Rich Coming From You - Pastybeagle!!

[Gremlin]

Just the HJC cls type that was banned in the states?
Thats another thread ;) When I read that story, it also looked like the cl (presumably the 14 as well) was also excluded... and given that quite a few of us wear cl14's??

From all that I have read, and I could be wrong, SNELL approved helmets are better than only DOT... and SNELL pass both, so if money can afford it, make sure its SNELL.

As people say, $5 helmet protects a $5 head... even if you aren't made of money, you do only have 1 head...

[Colapop]

I've got two... :shutup: :innocent:

[Gremlin]

can you afford 2 helmets then?? :lol:

[Colapop]

One's inbuilt! :p

[DevoDave]

Just bought a Nolan N102 $599.00, anti fog visor that really works, this is about the 20th helmet I've owned and the best, it is also set up so that sounds can be fitted. http://www.helmetharbor.com/streethelmets/helmets/nolan/opening.htm

What I was looking for was a helmat that was snug and comfortable and ablve all aerodinamic. To many helmets I have owned in the past have had a tendancy to try and lift at speed.

[scott411]

Snell and Dot are not reconised by LTSA, all helmets that come into NZ are marked with either AS1698 (australian silver and red sticker on outside of helmet) or ECE standard (european, white sticker or sew on patch normally on the strap, current one starts with 05 in serial number) the australian standard is actually higher, but most meat both and just come with one sticker on them

as for fitting, try some different helmets on and see shat fits better, your head is different to every one elses, the main reason SHoei's and Arai are dearer is they make different shells for each size, wear the Asian manufactures make one shell for 2 or 3 sizes and jsut put extra padding in the smaller size, SHoei and Arai also make a shell for european countries and a shell for asian countries for different shapped heads.

[Lou Girardin]

Snell and Dot are not reconised by LTSA, all helmets that come into NZ are marked with either AS1698 (australian silver and red sticker on outside of helmet) or ECE standard (european, white sticker or sew on patch normally on the strap, current one starts with 05 in serial number) the australian standard is actually higher, but most meat both and just come with one sticker on them



Snell most definitely is. DOT is only recognised if the helmet is manufactured in the US.

[Colapop]

... and a shell for asian countries for different shapped heads.

Slope heads?

[sAsLEX]

Snell most definitely is. DOT is only recognised if the helmet is manufactured in the US.

Wierd that isnt it, is DOT different in differnt parts of the world or is it just our crazy laws?

[McJim]

Would be interested in a discussion about whether or not one can test ride a helmet - don't know how you'd assess noise and aerodynamics otherwise. Bike shop people? Hello?

Dave

Not a bike shop person BUT here's an idea - little mini wind tunnel at roughly shoulder height with a helmet sized aperture in the bottom. Customer tries on Helmet, inserts head into said aperture - shop person turns mini wind tunnel on, customer turns head from side to side and decides on helmet.

Bike Shop people - would you buy such a thing?
Do you think it would help you upsell helmets?
How much would you be prepared to pay for such a piece of equipment?

Has anyone had this idea before me or should I nip off to the Patent office?

Cheers

[Colapop]

It may be a pisstake but I think it actually has some merit.

[Lou Girardin]

Wierd that isnt it, is DOT different in differnt parts of the world or is it just our crazy laws?

This is LTNZ genuis at work. I can only guess that it's designed to stop helmet imports from the US as almost none are made there now.

[dawnrazor]

Colapop - I recently bought a new helmet, I took the chance to try on a few different makes as I've only ever had Arai, not because I'm a flash git, but because they have been the only make that I find comfortable (wierd shaped head or something).

Anyway I tried on shoeis and sharks and nolans yada yada yada, and I ended up buying another Arai 'cus it was the only one that didn't give me a headache after 2 minutes, (I got my new one on special and got $500 off the price, although it is a very green colour)

So there is no subsitute for trying on plenty of makes and find the one that suits you best, I can recogmend Arai - they are great and don't be to bothered by colours or pretty designs - you can't see any of that shit when its on your head.

Lastly and this is very cliched but true - if you've got a $5 head get a $5 helmet. You get what you pay for I guess.

[NinjaBoy]

go shopping somewhere where they have quite a few different brands. They do have different shapes and some will fit you head shape better than others. A firm fit is needed to avoid movement.

Also they do not last for ever so expect to replace them every few years or so.

[scott411]

Snell most definitely is. DOT is only recognised if the helmet is manufactured in the US.

try to bring a batch of helmets in with snell rating and they will get turned down even tho they meet the ECE standards as well,

[Lou Girardin]

We've sold Snell approved helmets at AMPS. CL14's to US spec.

[magicfairy]

A firm fit is needed to avoid movement.

If, while wearing helmet and chewing some gum, you bite your cheek :( then you have nice firm fit.

[McJim]

It may be a pisstake but I think it actually has some merit.
It wasn't a pisstake - I've got a couple of ideas in the draft stage already in terms of materials and suppliers - all I need to know is "Is a small, portable, folding wind tunnel something that Helmet retailers think will help them upsell helmets?"
I know I would never have bought my current helmet if I'd tried it in a wind tunnel for example - I'd have paid another couple of hundred bucks for a quieter one that didn't try to snap my neck every time I checked over my shoulder above 100kmh. Is that $200 lost to the shop for the want of an invention that could cost as little as $150 delivered....

[Colapop]

You'd need a fairly powerful fan to give the right wind speed. It'd be harder than you think I'm guessing - not to put a dampener on things. The airflow would have to be channelled so that you got direct flow. The issue of getting people in and out easily would have to be addressed. Yep there's the hole in the bottom thing, but you gotta look at helmet damage. How about a wind tunnel collar typ deal - sort of hinged lengthwise. The customer would then stand withthe helmet on and have the tunnel closed around them. I think the K.I.S.S. (Keep It Simple Stupid) method should be applied.

[Lou Girardin]

It wasn't a pisstake - I've got a couple of ideas in the draft stage already in terms of materials and suppliers - all I need to know is "Is a small, portable, folding wind tunnel something that Helmet retailers think will help them upsell helmets?"
I know I would never have bought my current helmet if I'd tried it in a wind tunnel for example - I'd have paid another couple of hundred bucks for a quieter one that didn't try to snap my neck every time I checked over my shoulder above 100kmh. Is that $200 lost to the shop for the want of an invention that could cost as little as $150 delivered....

The only problem is that helmets behave differently on different bikes. Things like screens, riding position etc all affect airflow over a helmet. Just standing in a wind tunnel won't prove much.
A good guide is that the dearer brands like Shoei, Arai, Nolan/XLite etc all pay more attention to aerodynamics.

[Skunk]

Don't foret the air will have to be sucked though the tunnel, not blown into it.
The fan would create turbulence that would upset the results.

[McJim]

It was never meant to be a scientific product - just something to give the lay customer an idea of "Oh, this helmet really is quieter then that, I'll pay the extra $200" rather than the approach that I take in shops of "that mercenary salesperson is trying to upsell - I'm now personally offended and will never come here again - I'll take my business to a shop where they're not pushy".

Anyway - I asked the question "Are any of the helmet retailers interested in such a prioduct being developed?" No one answered in the affirmative so the idea has been unceremoniously shelved due to lack of interest.

Guess you're just going to have to persuade those Helmet Retailers to let you have a test drive with the helmet on after all Colapop - nothing else for it.

[Highlander]

Echoing a number of these comments.

Like the idea of doing a ride test cause otherwise "noise" is guess work. Any one know of any shops that will let you do that on a you ding it you bought it basis?

Think about the visor thing too. Tinted (or mirrored) visors are good on sunny days but less than usefull when it gets dark. How easy they are to change is well worth looking into.

A comment here was D rings are better than clips. Is that a personal preference or an actual safety thing? - My last helmet had a clip and I preferred it to what I have now.

[davereid]

If you crash your bike, the first thing the well meaning bystanders will do is wrench off your helmet and break your neck. So choose the simplest fitting you can - maybe youll be a C3 tetraplegic and able to use your elbows rather than a C2 who cant. For me I wear a helmet to avoid gravel rash. It will never save yr head from a hard impact, the laws of physics are not diverted by japanese fiberglass. Don't woory about how flash you helmet is, its just a wank anyway except for gravel rash.

[sAsLEX]

If you crash your bike, the first thing the well meaning bystanders will do is wrench off your helmet and break your neck. So choose the simplest fitting you can - maybe youll be a C3 tetraplegic and able to use your elbows rather than a C2 who cant. For me I wear a helmet to avoid gravel rash. It will never save yr head from a hard impact, the laws of physics are not diverted by japanese fiberglass. Don't woory about how flash you helmet is, its just a wank anyway except for gravel rash.

You seen ngkano drop it at 340kmhr and see him hit the deck hard and tumble?!?!?

Best advert for Arai ever.

[Dafe]

.

Would be interested in a discussion about whether or not one can test ride a helmet - don't know how you'd assess noise and aerodynamics otherwise. Bike shop people? Hello?

Dave

Kerry at Sawyers always offers to let me try a helmet before buying.

My first rule in buying a helmet - Only buy Carbon fibre/kevlar multistrand helmets.
My second rule - Only buy Shark (Fits me best and great quality for great price, and I'm biased).
Last but not least - No less than an RSX model helmet. (Top quality starts here).

I've brought four Shark helmets in the last two years.

Note: I find the cheaper RSX helmets far more comfortable and quieter than Sharks top line RSR2 helmet.
Hence, I brought a RSX for my everyday riding.

I've also personally tested an RSX model, highsiding at 100kph and landing head first into the concrete.
The RSX did a great job, just a scraped off some paint. However, obviously the helmet is now retired.

[davereid]

Yeah you are quite right, if you get to tumble without being stopped by a lamppost or an LTSA cheesewire cutter safety barrier you are living proof that speed doesn't kill.

Of course better design works.

But if you watched telly the other night, they crashed a 5 Star safety SMART car and a 2 star GM car into a barrier at 70 mhp. The 5 star car could still open its doors. The GM car was bent but passenger cell intact. But all dead, as the human body cant handle the de-acceleration.

Same when you bump yr head.

My head bruised and dead in el cheapo helmet. Yours pretty as, but still dead. Maybe youll survive an accident in the small window of chance that I would. For my money, Its just luck... I'll never moan about having a better helmet... but I'll always drive as if I don't have one at all !

[Dafe]

Yeah you are quite right, if you get to tumble without being stopped by a lamppost or an LTSA cheesewire cutter safety barrier you are living proof that speed doesn't kill.

Of course better design works.

But if you watched telly the other night, they crashed a 5 Star safety SMART car and a 2 star GM car into a barrier at 70 mhp. The 5 star car could still open its doors. The GM car was bent but passenger cell intact. But all dead, as the human body cant handle the de-acceleration.

Same when you bump yr head.

My head bruised and dead in el cheapo helmet. Yours pretty as, but still dead. Maybe youll survive an accident in the small window of chance that I would. For my money, Its just luck... I'll never moan about having a better helmet... but I'll always drive as if I don't have one at all !

Good call Davereid.

Crumple zones in helmets are an important consideration.
My RSX helmet has a polystyrene inner than is designed to compress in an accident, thus allowing a slight deceleration process for the brain.

[davereid]

Yep its all got to help. I'm not dissin helmets....i'd never suggest that.... but if they really helped us avoid head injuries, car drivers would have to wear them... after all a head injury is the most common cause of death for a car driver...

[Lou Girardin]

It was never meant to be a scientific product - just something to give the lay customer an idea of "Oh, this helmet really is quieter then that, I'll pay the extra $200" rather than the approach that I take in shops of "that mercenary salesperson is trying to upsell - I'm now personally offended and will never come here again - I'll take my business to a shop where they're not pushy".


If you want quiet, see the Schuberths when they arrive. They are tested at 85 and 86 Db for the Full Face and the Flip front respectively. You can put one on in the shop and hear a major difference in ambient noise. But you'll be paying $1000 or more. To my knowledge they're the only manufacturer available in NZ that quotes noise levels.
Bu even they say that screens, riding position etc wll affect noise levels.

[Hawkeye]

I've got two... :shutup: :innocent:

I know a few managers who have 2 faces.... does that count:laugh:

[jester67]

I have a nice (but older ~ 1990) Arai that gets a bit sore after a long ride. It has a couple of small pressure points just above my forehead and at the top back of my head. I heard an urban myth that there is an Arai fitment service available in NZ that does the rounds of the paddocks and shows etc - does anyone know morw about this?

[vifferman]

I have a nice (but older ~ 1990) Arai that gets a bit sore after a long ride. It has a couple of small pressure points just above my forehead and at the top back of my head.
If it's a 1990 helmet, it's pretty well past its use-by date! :shit:

But (however!) my AGV was like this, and you can fix it (provided it's only slightly the worngA shape, otherwise you'd be better off getting a helmet that better matches the shape of your skullbone).
Get a spoon (teaspoon or soupspoon) and rub the helmet with the 'bowl' of the spoon where it's too tight, while pressing firmly with your thumb on the back of the bowl. This should compress the foam in the liner enough to relieve the pressure on your forehead. You may need to repeat this two or three times before it's OK.

[jester67]

Thanks Viffer, fresh back to riding after a 13 year break. Glasses and helmets have come a long way in the interim so I may be shopping for a new flip Nolan.

Thanks again.

[Hitcher]

The flip Nolan is only a solution for spectacle wearers with "normal" heads.

[HenryDorsetCase]

I wear glasses all the time (darn these bookish good looks) and my Shoei is fine.

there are times a flipper front would be minimally more convenient, but all the ones Ive tried on were the most bizarre fit imaginable.

my Shoei (its a cheap one too) is the best fitting helmet Ive ever had. I wanted to buy an Arai because its what the cool kids wear but they just werent as comfortable.

also, with some of the money you save, buy decent gloves.

[mattimeo]

I bought an Arai last week. It was a big investment but i'm treating it like accident insurance... Of sorts. It sure is good though, amazingly aerodynamic and so quiet. I wouldn't spend $900 on comfort alone, though i hope not to test its considerable saftey features!

The pinlock visors RAWK! No fogging -at all-. I rode from Palmy to Masterton early Saturday morning, thick fog for about half an hr. Only the outside of my visor clouded slightly, not so much as a whisp on the inside.

[cooneyr]

From all that I have read, and I could be wrong, SNELL approved helmets are better than only DOT... and SNELL pass both, so if money can afford it, make sure its SNELL.

I did a bit of reading about helmets after my crash (broke C1 but full recovery) and from what I've read I'd say don't go for the Snell. This is because of the helmets having to be stiff enough to withstand the double impact testing method they use. Because they helmets are stiff they transmit too much energy to the head i.e. don't absorb enough themselves. The DOT and ECE 22.05 standards are not suppose to be dissimilar (ECE requires the helmet to withstand slightly more G's therefore transmits slightly more) hence are softer on the head than the Snell standard.

From what I've read if you are going to suffer a helmet crush type injury during the crash you are stuff no matter what happens. The benefits of helmets is that they protect you from gravel rash and attenuate the G forces transmitted to the head (if they are "soft" enough).

Here is a website (http://www.webbikeworld.com/motorcycle-helmets/ece-22-05.htm) to start with but there is stacks of reading you can do.

Cheers R

[roogazza]

Just updated from older Shoei to Shoei X Spirit. Great hat , but guess it should be for the price ($1200 ). Good fit, lightweight and much quieter than anything I have ridden with. Gaz. :yes:

[Freakshow]

A friend who use to race mentioned a test that was pulled at a track meet and several people failed. They thought their helmets wer fitted and the officals reached over to the back and rolled the helmet in one swift movement over the front and off. So check that even done up that it holds your head in place and you cant roll out!

[Dodger]

I've seen these (http://www.a-bug.com/index.php?q=uggc%3A%2F%2FJJJ.GENQRZR.PB.AM%2FGenqr-Zr-Zbgbef%2FZbgbeovxrf%2FUryzrgf-pybguvat-sbbgjrne%2FUryzrgf%2Fnhpgvba-66546135.ugz) on Tardme or this (http://www.a-bug.com/index.php?q=uggc%3A%2F%2FJJJ.GENQRZR.PB.AM%2FGenqr-Zr-Zbgbef%2FZbgbeovxrf%2FUryzrgf-pybguvat-sbbgjrne%2FUryzrgf%2Fnhpgvba-66744306.ugz) - I like the black one better (as a style) but I'll get one from a shop I think.

WTF :rofl: I guess those links expired?

[FROSTY]

Im kinda qualified to answer this one.
I can say without a doubt that wearing a high quality lid has saved me from becoming a vegtable My accident in May LAST year was a decelleration from around 100km/h to zero in 3.0m followed by the back of my head smacking the ground HARD. The accident I had recently resulted in my head hitting the ground hard
You can argue --"yea a cheaper lid would do the job"
Ya know what I don't wanna find out the hard way that my lid diddn't do the job.

[babyblade250rr]

don't lids need to have some minimum safety rating european standards or something? before they are classified legal?

[xwhatsit]

don't lids need to have some minimum safety rating european standards or something? before they are classified legal?

Yep there's all kinds of standards, I believe the European ones (and possibly the Australian ones too?) are better than just DOT (US standard), but any will do to make it legal. However there's probably a difference between just meeting the standards, and the more expensive manufacturers exceeding them by some margin.

[babyblade250rr]

Yep there's all kinds of standards, I believe the European ones (and possibly the Australian ones too?) are better than just DOT (US standard), but any will do to make it legal. However there's probably a difference between just meeting the standards, and the more expensive manufacturers exceeding them by some margin.

Acutally thats a good point and a topic of interest!!

what do ya'll think maybe the difference with say a $300 kbc lid in comparison to a $1000 shoei lid? lets say they both meet or exceed us.aus.euro standards what could possibly justify the price difference??

[Hawkeye]

Are you still looking at lids Col? I can recommend a good import. I've got a Caberg V2 which I imported from the UK. 1.5 kg and so much more comfortable than the HJC which I was using. Has the added advantage of an internal coloured visor which comes down with a flick of a lever.
It cost me 116 GBP ($340) plus delivery. Mine has graphics but for the plain version its 89 GBP. Meets all of the European standards.

You can find the details here :

http://www.harpersraceshop.co.uk/item2516.htm

I actually ordered it from :

www.thehelmetplace.co.uk

[xwhatsit]

Acutally thats a good point and a topic of interest!!

what do ya'll think maybe the difference with say a $300 kbc lid in comparison to a $1000 shoei lid? lets say they both meet or exceed us.aus.euro standards what could possibly justify the price difference??

<hints id="hah_hints"></hints>I personally believe (this is completely unfounded, mind you) that it's just features, really. Less noise, better aerodynamics, more comfortable lining, nosepieces, vents -- and a big one -- the big sticker on your forehead saying `Shoei' or `Arai' which makes you look cool in front of your mates. I think in some other thread people mentioned that the MotoGP crowd tend to wear the expensive brands, so that may imply good protection, but never forget sponsorship and commercial interests having a play there.

I'm happy with my head being in my RJays helmet -- bloody comfortable, meets Australian standards -- but I might be feeling a little safer in an Arai, despite my thoughts on what the extra money is really for.

[babyblade250rr]

yeah suppose like i said on another thread regarding cheap oil filters that quality comes from reputation and research shoei and arai have both hmm who knows almost gives me an excuse to buy a new helmet hahaha perhaps ill hmmmmm acidentally drop mine!!:dodge:

[kaz]

Hi all, just to add my 2c: I was recently shopping for a new helmet too (I ended up with a Shoei Raid 2 which I am very happy with) and I did a little internet research. I found this very interesting article which really made me think about things differently: http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/gearbox/motorcycle_helmet_review/

It is a very long article but it's pretty readable (plain language) if you stick with it. Basically the article explains how helmets actually work to save your head. And it argues that Snell rating system is inferior to the ECE rating system because Snell tests helmets in a way that does NOT reflect what actually happens to you in a road crash. They say that because Snell do things like test helmets by dropping them onto a spike from some height, you have to have a very hard shell to get Snell certification. But a hard shell (impervious to puncture) does not help you with deceleration. In fact, it makes it more difficult to decelerate your brain safely.

Whoa!

There's also an interesting response from Snell included at the end of the article and then another response from Motorcyclist mag.

[cooneyr]

Hi all, just to add my 2c: I was recently shopping for a new helmet too (I ended up with a Shoei Raid 2 which I am very happy with) and I did a little internet research. I found this very interesting article which really made me think about things differently: http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/gearbox/motorcycle_helmet_review/

It is a very long article but it's pretty readable (plain language) if you stick with it. Basically the article explains how helmets actually work to save your head. And it argues that Snell rating system is inferior to the ECE rating system because Snell tests helmets in a way that does NOT reflect what actually happens to you in a road crash. They say that because Snell do things like test helmets by dropping them onto a spike from some height, you have to have a very hard shell to get Snell certification. But a hard shell (impervious to puncture) does not help you with deceleration. In fact, it makes it more difficult to decelerate your brain safely.

Whoa!

There's also an interesting response from Snell included at the end of the article and then another response from Motorcyclist mag.

This is the same conclusion I came to when I did some reading after my crash. Snell helmets are to stiff and dont decelerate your head gently enough.

Cheers R

[Kwakajack]

Who's got pointers about what to look for? Obviously the big one - it has to fit comfortably. What does that actually mean though? How should it fit? It may sound like a stupid question but, I'm serious. Most helmets I put on feel, ok. Not superb and not bad. I've been told that different helmets fit differently - that just means to me that many people have many different shaped heads.
What is the difference between a $100 lid and a $800 one? How many vents do I need? Do I need a flip top lid? Do colours make a difference (visibility)?
Apart from just saying "You should get "X" brand" can you guys give some pointers?

I found this out by an expensive case of exploring my options.

1. Buy the best you can afford, if its worth $1000, get it, as you WILL notice the difference. My current lid is an HJC HQ1 Lordship, the Carbon Fibre one, now it's taken three sizes and different shapes to settle on what I need in a helmet.

2. Make sure its damn near too tight for you, that way, at speed once its worn in, it won't move around and will be comfortable to wear. Again, only my HQ 1 is the lid that fits, the other two are the wrong shape and too large. Make sure its a really firm fit everywhere on your face too.

3. Shop around, look for deals and ALWAYS ask for advice from more experienced bikers, read reviews of helmets if you can get them, and try plenty of different brands.

4. Vents are up to personal preference, I ride sportsbikes and intend track time soon so I like helmets that have lots of internal airflow and are not lift face helmets as they are too front heavy and whistle.

This is simply my experiences, but I hope it helps

[Crowdog]

Its good to go to a shop with quite a few brands then just go from one to the other trying them all on, you get a good feel for what is comfortable and what is a cheap piece of plastic, i ended up with a shoei comfy and good for glasses

[swbarnett]

Personally I don't like the flip top lids. They're probably fine for most accidents but if you get a side impact they're not as good as a normal full-face. I saw a report on one accident where the bike was almost unrecognisable. The rider came off with relatively minor injuries but because of the hinge mechanism in his flip-top helmet received a severe bash to the cheek that caused a major break.

[bert_is_evil]

Also the flip front helmets jut out further at the chin bar which can get in the way. My bike requires me to reach forward a long way to the bars, which pulls your shoulder armour up and turning your head you can catch your chin on your shoulder (does that make sense?)

[xwhatsit]

Also the flip front helmets jut out further at the chin bar which can get in the way. My bike requires me to reach forward a long way to the bars, which pulls your shoulder armour up and turning your head you can catch your chin on your shoulder (does that make sense?)

Maybe you should grow a longer neck :lol:<hints id="hah_hints"></hints>

Yes I know what you mean, though -- I wear a scarf to keep my neck warm, and that can cause complications as you describe if it's not tied up right. Wouldn't want any bigger a chin guard.

[jester67]

The chin on my new (brand new from eBay) Nolan N102 does not stick out any further than my Arai F1. It is amazingly comfortable and refreshingly easy to use one handed. I accept that it may be slightly more vulnerable to a side impact.

[Storm]

Acutally thats a good point and a topic of interest!!

what do ya'll think maybe the difference with say a $300 kbc lid in comparison to a $1000 shoei lid? lets say they both meet or exceed us.aus.euro standards what could possibly justify the price difference??

According to a mate of mine, they difference is in the impact dispersal. A cheap helmet will spread the impact over a 2-3inch circle. A medium price polycarbonate one will spread over 6-7 inches, and a top end fibreglass (Shoei, Arai, any $1000 lid) will spread it pretty much over the whole helmet.
Same theory as crumple zones in your car- the helmet acts as a shock absorber and distributor to lessen the amount of force that is then transferred to your delicate swede.

[babyblade250rr]

According to a mate of mine, they difference is in the impact dispersal. A cheap helmet will spread the impact over a 2-3inch circle. A medium price polycarbonate one will spread over 6-7 inches, and a top end fibreglass (Shoei, Arai, any $1000 lid) will spread it pretty much over the whole helmet.
Same theory as crumple zones in your car- the helmet acts as a shock absorber and distributor to lessen the amount of force that is then transferred to your delicate swede.

excellent explanation and makes alot of sense cheers!

[Holy Roller]

Did a bit of quick research into helmet standards as there are a few cheaper ones on trademe that claim meeting some standard or other.
Was wondering why a flip top lid being sold as an off road lid yet meeting the DOT standard and other sellers selling similar as if they were legit for road. I asked the seller if they were road legal but no reply as yet.

http://www.ltsa.govt.nz/road-user-safety/motorcyclists/importing-helmets.html
* Because of the lack of a formal certification system for the US FMVSS 218 standard, this standard only applies to motorcycle helmets that have been manufactured and purchased in the USA. Helmets complying with FMVSS 218 will be marked with the letters 'DOT'.

Motorcycle helmet retailers are responsible for making sure that any helmet they sell for road use complies with the requirements set out above. This means that if you're a retailer of motorcycle helmets, you must be able to produce, on request, appropriate documentation proving compliance with one of the approved standards. (These documents will be available from the helmet manufacturer.)

Anyone selling motorcycle helmets that do not comply with approved standards can be fined up to a maximum of $500 per offence. They may also be required to recall any non-compliant helmets that have been sold.

The legislation relating to motorcycle helmet standards is set out in Land Transport (Road User) Rule 2004.

So be careful out there:Punk: