Traffic lights in bus lanes

[Pogo2]

Over the last few days on my commute to work I have seen scooters using the bus lanes and then proceeding through the red lights at intersections using the white "B" light (reserved for buses I think).:gob: Is this legal - without researching it it sounds a bit dodgy? Mostly seen in the Gt North Rd and K Rd area.

Whats the go with that!

[Karma]

Illegal.

B light refers to buses only... we can use the lanes but not the signals.

[Filterer]

Illegal.

B light refers to buses only... we can use the lanes but not the signals.

So you get to the front of the bus lane. A 20+ tonne vehicle pulls up behind you wanting to go through the B light and you hold it up?

I don't think the GN would stop a bus.

So practically it seems a little strange

[sunhuntin]

So you get to the front of the bus lane. A 20+ tonne vehicle pulls up behind you wanting to go through the B light and you hold it up?

I don't think the GN would stop a bus.

So practically it seems a little strange

in that case id simply try and remerge back into traffic before the lights. we dont have bus lanes here, so doesnt matter.

[Nicksta]

what Weasel said....
can use bus lanes apart from on the m/ways......
i just merge at the front of the que at the lights..... B is for bus... not bike!! ;)

[jtzzr]

what Weasel said....
can use bus lanes apart from on the m/ways......
i just merge at the front of the que at the lights..... B is for bus... not bike!! ;)

OOps:innocent: Are you sure it does`nt mean blast? For safety reasons of course: Just wondering

[Calo]

I use bus lanes all the time and I've yet to have a bus behind me on a 'B' light so I wait for the green. I'm just lucky I guess. :innocent:

[Lord Derosso]

No. I have come to the conclusion that scooter riders are a law unto themselves and can do what they want. Observations from my daily commute through Wellington city in heavy traffic and very noticeable patterns of great desires to be wiped out at all costs by said scooter riders. As I have posted before... you hear them coming, you know what they are going to try to attempt and then you wait for the impact. I would be curious to know how many scooter riders actually have a bike licence or just use their car licences. Isn't it 50ccs ?? My reasoning is that you have to EARN a bike licence through showing skill and then a period to allow you to gain road experience. Some of the local scooter riders are giving all bike riders a hard name. As for the bus lanes... the further away I am from our local buses the longer I am going to be around to ride.

[Lord Derosso]

As for earning your bike licence. In case any scooter riding member thinks this is no big deal, look at the newbies thread and the number of members posting their sheer joy in achieving this goel. In saying that, I have nothing against scooter riders but there are large numbers on the road now and the odd idiot gives everyone a bad image which reflects on all bike riders. Something that tends to piss a lot of members off in postings.

[Karma]

Lets put it this way... I've yet to see someone on a 250 bike mount the pavement and cut through pedestrians for 30 metres to get around a corner when a red light is showing... something I've seen scooters do many many times.

[sAsLEX]

Illegal.

B light refers to buses only... we can use the lanes but not the signals.

That used to be the case when BUS lanes where controlled by local councils as the lanes where under their jurisdiction , yet the lights where under transits.

With transits new law allowing bike to use all bus lanes unless specifically excluded surely this includes the signals associated with those lanes!

[Karma]

Nope.

http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/roadcode/giving-way/controlled-intersections6.html

[curious george]

Haha!!! I can on my bicycle! So long suckers!!!

[sAsLEX]

Who has priority – cyclists or buses?
A bus lane is treated as a shared facility, which means no-one has priority – but the law says that neither should impede the other unnecessarily.

Which means one should not impede the bus by waiting at the B light....kinda


bus lane means a lane reserved by a marking or sign installed
at the start of the lane and at each point at which the lane
resumes after an intersection for the use of—
(a) buses; and
(b) cycles and motorcycles (unless either or both are specifically
excluded by the sign)



AND
3.6 Traffic signals in form of T or B
(1) While a white T or a white B signal is displayed, a driver of a
light rail vehicle (in the case of a white T) or a bus (in the case
of a white B) facing the traffic signal may—
(a) travel straight ahead or turn right or turn left; or
(b) turn right or turn left even though a traffic signal is
displaying a red signal in the form of a disc.

So yet again LTSA or whatever they have called have released a LAW that they hoped was based on some common sense yet they did not apply any first!

So a long bus lane that traverses multiple sets of lights is actually multiple small bus lanes. And the lane does not extend through the intersection but stops and starts either side.

So lawfully one has to wait for a green disc before crossing the intersection from the end of your bus lane to the start of the next, all the while holding up the bus wanting to go on the white B.

But common sense would have one follow the bus lane through the intersection and go on the B light.

But common sense is removed when you get in any governmental position.

[Flatcap]

No. I have come to the conclusion that scooter riders are a law unto themselves and can do what they want. Observations from my daily commute through Wellington city in heavy traffic and very noticeable patterns of great desires to be wiped out at all costs by said scooter riders. As I have posted before... you hear them coming, you know what they are going to try to attempt and then you wait for the impact. I would be curious to know how many scooter riders actually have a bike licence or just use their car licences. Isn't it 50ccs ?? My reasoning is that you have to EARN a bike licence through showing skill and then a period to allow you to gain road experience. Some of the local scooter riders are giving all bike riders a hard name. As for the bus lanes... the further away I am from our local buses the longer I am going to be around to ride.

The antics of some plastic fantastic 50cc moped riders really piss me off as well - it will be those with no intention of getting a bike license.

Having said that - I have seen plenty of antics on large motorcycles...

[sunhuntin]

The antics of some plastic fantastic 50cc moped riders really piss me off as well - it will be those with no intention of getting a bike license.


yep, thats the one. where i work is right by a high school. every morning without fail, a group of 5 moped riders come buzzing along. morning traffic here is suicidal...5 way roundabout....and all roads backed up as far as the eye can see.
these moped riders are high school kids and dont have a clue. one was showing off on the forecourt and nearly fell over in a puddle of petrol, and then he and his mate nearly collided in the flooded gutters.
and they class them and us together...no wonder everything is so expensive for us! i really think a learners motorbike should be needed to ride anything on 2 wheels that has a motor, but restrict em, so they cant ride bigger than a moped.
the kids themselves are decent, and seem to ride somewhat normal when alone, but get them near their mates and they lose all sense! i saw one the other afternoon towing a kid on a bicycle!

[Pogo2]

I thought it would be illegal and have never tried it myself.

Even though I ride a scooter myself I agree that some scooterists give the rest a bad name. After many years of riding a big bike (my BMW K) I feel extremely nervous lane splitting to the point I haven't tried it yet, let alone use a "B" light to go through an intersection!

[Lord Derosso]

The antics of some plastic fantastic 50cc moped riders really piss me off as well - it will be those with no intention of getting a bike license.

Having said that - I have seen plenty of antics on large motorcycles...


I totally agree with you on that point though the antics I am most concerned with would be impossible to proform on a full sized bike. And when scooter riders do it.. it looks bad. I mean one regular clown not only lanesplits(taboo subject warning), they pass on the inside, on footpaths, around cars and all at 30-50 kpm. BAD and MAD. And the scooter is weaving around so much its a wonder they dont can off. I think I may check out this bus lane thing a bit further though I do notice local bikers DONT go near them for good reason.

[Lord Derosso]

[ i saw one the other afternoon towing a kid on a bicycle![/QUOTE]

Sure it wasn't a HD ?

[IkeKrull]

I used to ride a 50cc scooter - I bought it because I really enjoy motorcycling, but since i had no real road experience, that it would be a good idea to start out with something small and easy.

Learning how to handle traffic conditions and gain a good awareness of the hazards you will face without the acceleration, speed and relative complexity of 'real' bike controls out there has been invaluable to me. Once i felt comfortable riding in all conditions on my scooter, i upgraded to a 250cc bike, and since my experience on the scooter has shown me you can't trust car drivers, pedestrians or anyone else on the road to do the right, or safe thing 100% of the time, its given me a healthy paranoia at all times on the road.

I had already seen my nephew destroy 2 bikes and have 3 accidents in about 6 months - one life-threatening lowside with the bike going under an SUV, a stupid side impact from a car (his fault as far as I can gather) and a rear-end collision in traffic (technically the cagers fault but probably avoidable with safer riding behaviour).

It's not what you ride, its how you ride. My nephew had his learner license and a shiny new 250cc bike, but just had (i'm not sure if he does now) no appreciation for the risks of riding in traffic.

Regardless of his licensed status or his ability to display basic handling skills, the guy was/is a danger to himself and others. Perhaps if he had started out on a scooter, he might have spent less on written off bikes, insurance claims from the other drivers involved and not racked up the road rash and bruises (thank god he had the good sense to invest in decent protective gear.) Its hard to take yourself too seriously on a scooter and theres less temptation to show how macho you are by showing how fast you can go.

I guess my point is that having a motorcycle license doesnt give you any sort of moral high ground, because theres as many idiots on 'real' motorcycles as there are on scooters - you havent 'earnt' anything passing the license tests, any more than the idiots who carelessly plough through traffic in their SUVs, forgetting to indicate and yapping on their cellphones. They think they have 'earnt' the right to operate a car on the road too.

A scooter is a responsible choice for a first road bike - many of us got a start on dirt bikes on the farm, which is the best training you can get, but for those that don't have that available, i think it is better to 'learn the hard way through stupidity' on a machine that has a low top speed and minimal weight behind it - you just have more of a window to avoid many accidents that would flat out kill you at higher speed on a bigger machine.

Sure, you see people doing crazy stuff on a scooter, and to be fair, the scooter with its extreme manoeverability and small size kind of makes those antics reasonably practical to do with some measure of safety - Similary, cycle couriers can be observed doing all kinds of stuff on pushbikes at speeds that would guarantee injury in a pedestrian collision too, but by and large they do it without coming to grief.

I'm not advocating mounting the kerb and using the pavement to avoid red lights on a scooter, but lets face it, johnny shithead with his learners license on his 60hp race-tuned NSR250 that his daddy bought him for his 16th birthday isn't going to be any less of a risk out there than a kerb-mounting scooter-hoon.

[Lord Derosso]

You are quite right of course on all points however having been one of those whom was riding bikes on farms and trails at an early age, I am bemused by the process of being able to buy a scooter and hit the road with NIL experience of the skills needed to survive. At least with a car, you might get second chances. In saying that though, you could also argue that its really no different from a learner bike rider starting off but I would like to think that at least the 250cc or whatever would allow skills to be learnt quicker and the machine would have superior brakes and handling ?? Tough call. Yes, theres always people whom should never be allowed up ladders let alone on bikes.

I am thinking of getting myself a smaller commuter to get to work on next year. perhaps a little GN125 or similar. I think I will keep away from the scooters though. Saw a guy doing 20 kmph up Adelaide Rd 4.45 pm today and the bus driver nearly took him out in passing because he didn't even bother to change lanes in doing so.... wouldn't have even feel the bump.

[dawnrazor]

Over the last few days on my commute to work I have seen scooters using the bus lanes and then proceeding through the red lights at intersections using the white "B" light (reserved for buses I think).:gob: Is this legal - without researching it it sounds a bit dodgy? Mostly seen in the Gt North Rd and K Rd area.

Whats the go with that!

see below post - might help

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=33325&highlight=red+amber+green

[sunhuntin]

krull, you are right...there are idiots everywhere...for some reason i see more idiots on scooters than anything else...i work at a petrol station which is very close to two primary and secondary schools [one of each] and naturally, 3pm is insane with parents, 15 year old hotshots in their cars, cyclists cutting inbetween the queues. i never see any one of a motorbike acting the way the scooters do...they came buzzing onto my forecourt in groups, hold up the cars, get in the way, a lot come in zig-zagging back and forth. im just waiting for one to hit a patch of diesel and take a spill, lol.

[rwh]

I think I may check out this bus lane thing a bit further though I do notice local bikers DONT go near them for good reason.

Probably depends on the bus lane a bit. I'd be very careful using the ones in town - Lambton Quay and Manners St - but I use the one coming down from Karori in the mornings, no problem. Only lets me jump about 8-10 cars, but feels good nonetheless :)

Richard

[LilSel]

Interesting...
Have never been stuck in a bus lane with the white B (seen them tho)... If I encounter this tho... good to know that B doesnt stand for bike and bus lol :)

Wonder how much tooting and abuse one would get from a bus driver should you be in the bus lane and there is a white B to go... and you dont... lol.

This actually happened to anyone??

[JKWNZ]

Yep... when the light goes B and there's a bus behind I just go anyway... figure its that or get runover by a bus driver who will only be to happy to get another bike out of their lane. Dont think there's much competition between the bus and the Cibby.

[Karma]

Interesting...
Have never been stuck in a bus lane with the white B (seen them tho)... If I encounter this tho... good to know that B doesnt stand for bike and bus lol :)

Wonder how much tooting and abuse one would get from a bus driver should you be in the bus lane and there is a white B to go... and you dont... lol.

This actually happened to anyone??

In most instances the B light is phased to go white about 4 / 5 seconds before the regular lights, this is so that the bus can merge back into traffic at an upcoming intersection or something.

Oh, and best thing I saw the other day, guy on a scooter with an open face helmet, pulls up to the lights, then lights a cig and starts smoking, lights go green, and he takes off, still smoking!

[ManDownUnder]

I raised this very issue with the Min of Transport Safety... Harry Dynhoven... who responded informing me that it's ok to park in front of a bus depite the "B" light being illuminated.

It's perfectly safe because it's illegal to cause injury with a motor vehicle.

I felt like reminding him it was also illegal to speed, rob banks and a large variety of other things, but it doesn't stop people from doing them.

Perhaps it makes sense for users of that lane to follow the direction of lights controlling that lane? Makes sense to me anyway

[LilSel]

In most instances the B light is phased to go white about 4 / 5 seconds before the regular lights.

and he takes off, still smoking!


:yes: Sometimes it seems like forever lol.

Ash in face?? :shutup: It wouldnt keep going for long I would imagine...

JKWNZ- :rockon: lol

[LilSel]

Perhaps it makes sense for users of that lane to follow the direction of lights controlling that lane? Makes sense to me anyway

If anyone were to get pinged for going on a white B...
Stating 'I thought B was for Bike as well as Bus' might get a laugh from the cop n a let off?? lol

[rwh]

I raised this very issue with the Min of Transport Safety... Harry Dynhoven... who responded informing me that it's ok to park in front of a bus depite the "B" light being illuminated.

Perhaps time for some 'civil obedience' to make the point? Could result in being banned from the bus lanes altogether, though ...

Richard

[ManDownUnder]

Perhaps time for some 'civil obedience' to make the point? Could result in being banned from the bus lanes altogether, though ...

Richard

I fear you're right. The simplest answer is to ban bikes from those lanes altogether...


If anyone were to get pinged for going on a white B...
Stating 'I thought B was for Bike as well as Bus' might get a laugh from the cop n a let off?? lol

I can see the comeback now

"Sir 'B' is also for Bozo... "

[LilSel]

I can see the comeback now

"Sir 'B' is also for Bozo... "

LOL... or Blonde :yes: