Stroker 250 as a daily rider - straight up answer

[JeremyW]

I am a newby biker looking at purchasing an 89 tzr250 and I want some sound advice from people with motorbike knowledge far in excess of mine.

Is it sensible for me to consider using a 17 year old 2 stroke, done 17000km and in overall good condition (forks, frame, electrics, tyres etc) as a daily rider if I am a student earning about $300 per week?

I am really stuggling to convince myself it is a bad idea but after riding one tonight I have absolutely and completely fallen in love...

What do you think? Would you do it?

I will make my own decision but it would be great to hear what you guys and girls would do in the same situation

[imdying]

Heaps of my mates in similar circumstances to you did, and I in worse circumstances did too... If I was 16 again, I'd have another in heartbeat (although I'd try for an NSR). Sensible it's not, but hella fun :D

[hXc]

I'd personally say no. But I'm biased to my naked, 4-stroke, v-twin. It is as my pro says: Pure sex

[Magua]

It'll be great fun on the weekends, but it'll be a total pain in the arse for commuting.

[hXc]

If you want a stroker, go for a 150. EVen though the TZR is older, it is still a performance bike, therefore you'd not be riding it how it should be ridden. Just a waste of an engine.

[Brett]

If you haven't done much riding i really would not suggest getting a two stroker as one of your first bikes! Rather go for a 4 stroke 250cc if you want a sports bike. I recommend the ZXR's!

[Shadows]

I don't consider a performance 2 stroke to be a particularly good bike for a learner, especially if it is going to be a daily rider.
They have to be ridden at consistently higher revs to get anything out of them, otherwise they won't "pull the skin of a rice pudding". Focussing on keeping up engine speeds through corners etc. to maintain efficient engine output isn't the best riding style for somebody who needs to concentrate on developing more important things, like self preservation techniques.
Better to go with something more torquey like a single or twin four stroke, which will maintain a more even and controllable power output throughout a wider rev range so you can concentrate on other things until they become second nature.
Not very exciting but you have to learn to walk before you can run.

[Ixion]

I have been using a 30 year old two stroke for daily transport for the last few weeks. I wouldn't want to do it for too long. I am a big fan of two strokes but daily commuting is not where the sports two smokers shine.

It's OK if you have plenty of money for the maintainance which WILL be required, and another vehicle to use when its off the road . But as a practical ride to work, no sorry I'd not recommend it. Communting is hard on these machines. And DEFINATELY not if your commute requires lane splitting.

I would also echo the "not a good bike for a learner", except that I see you have a street magic, so I assume you have some experience.

Can you not use the Street Magic for cummuntering?

The 150cc two strokes are a different story, they are much more practical (though even they can run up maintainance bills that stretch a student's pockets - ask Mr Magua, or Mr Pyrocam)

Stick with four strokes until you can afford to own a two smoker just for sheer fun.

[slowpoke]

...I'm biased to my naked, 4-stroke, v-twin. It is as my pro says: Pure sex

If your fourstroke twin is pure sex then it's straight missionary style with the lights off: nice but not memorable. The TZR is nasty, dirty, drunken sex behind the nightclub kinda sex: much more fun but it does come with some risks.

You've got to ask yourself can you afford something to go wrong mechanically? Two strokes are simpler than 4 strokes but at this age you've got to expect something to go toes up at some stage. What is the commute like? Are you zipping along some backroads or are you stuck in traffic slipping the clutch for half an hour? Do you have alternative transport?

Just a few things to think about anyway.

[mynameis]

As a general rule of thumb any bike which is ten years or older will require more maintance than newer bikes and obviously two strokers require more than four stroke bikes.

17 000 km on a 89 two stroker is high km's and an old bike. TZR's are less common and parts would be harder to find and hence more expensive from my understanding.

They also have to be ridden in a certain fashion as outlined above and are less forgiving than a CBR or ZXR 250 in corners. And from what I know TZR's are the most powerful two strokers in 250's.

More regular servicing and maintance and more money would be spent compared to four strokes so I think a four cylinder four stroke would be better bike a ZXR 250.

[JeremyW]

Thanks for your comments guys. You have all echoed my thoughts exactly but it is nice to hear it from someone else.

I think I will leave the 250 stroker for a time when I have more experience and definately more $$$! I have the 'you are poor' and the 'you want to live' voices getting very strong.

I think it will be the RG150 for me as I love strokers and this bike will certainly be better for commuting with the odd longer ride on the weekends.

I would certainly go for a 250 four if they werent so damn expensive! I refuse to pay the asking price for most of them so I will wait for my full until I get my first four stroke experience.

Thanks again

[willy_01]

its a bloody silly idea. I did it with an Rg so it aways overheated at the lights in the summer - being kick start it was a bit of a drama. But mate after a hard days uni/work you find your self really looking forward to the ride home, i sometimes smiled just thinking about it in class. My bike was a pain in the arse, and let me down many times, but my only regret is i didnt make it faster - go for it!

[Theatre]

I ride to uni every day on my KR and its fine, the whole 'you've gotta thrash it or else it'll clog up' argument is just a good excuse to go on lots of rides! Got no idea about the older 250s though. I think your plan of a 150 2 stroke then moving up a bit later is a good one, the 150s are still be heaps of fun.

[Jeaves]

i commute everyday from pt chev to manukau via the motorway on the rg , dont have any real issues other than needing to keep the revs up to be Manoeuvrable in and around the traffic . Never ridden a 250 2t though so cant comment on that :weep:

[nudemetalz]

Many many years ago I used an RZ-500 as my daily commuter...needless to say on many occasions it became an RZ-375-V3 and RZ-250-V2....
Quite easy to see which plug had fouled by one exhaust not smoking while others were...
But I reckon no, get a 4-stroke, even just a small one, and save the TZR for weekend blasts.

[MrMelon]

Those tzr's aren't as peaky as some of the other 2 strokes so they're fine to commute on. they've got a lot more bottom end than your average nsr/rgv. I did on my 91 tzr for about a year and it was sweet as. Heaps of fun too! Just ended up costing a bit when the gaskets started leaking but you get that. Teaches you a fair bit about bike maintenance too.

[nudemetalz]

What model is an 1989 ?
Is that when the reverse-cylinder one's came out?
I know that the first model were excellent reliable machines as MrMelon has stated and that the next model (rev cyl) were a bit troublesome. The next model V-twins were basically race-bikes on the road.
I rode a v-twin model once and I definitely would not want to commute on that !!

[JeremyW]

twas the reverse cylinder model. It did have a surprising amount of bottom end and I could see that commuting, although difficult, woudlnt be impossible but being a student means those expensive maintenence/repair costs are way out of my budget unfortunately.

But I know I will soon (when graduated and in the real world) own a 250 stroker because that was the most fun I have had in a long time, clothes on or off!!!

[Ixion]

What model is an 1989 ?
Is that when the reverse-cylinder one's came out?
I.. the next model (rev cyl) were a bit troublesome. ..

Just a bit. Just a bit. Sorta like the Pope's just a bit unpopular with the Moslems.

[JeremyW]

what are the tzr's like compared with a nsr or rgv from 89? performance wise.

[Ixion]

RGV's reckoned the fastest, but fragile.

NSR not as fast (but we're talking subtle distinctions here) , bit more robust.

Early TZRs were on a par with the RG250 (preceeded the RGV, completely different bike). The reverse cylinder ones were a disaster. fast, while they kept going.

MVX Hondas were fastish. But even more unreliable than the TZR.

Owners of the respective models will of course vehemently disagree.

Given their age, and parts availability, only one I'd reckon for an "only bike, ride to work and everywhere else" mount would be the RGV. NSR or TZR would be nice as a second bike for occasional weekend hoons.

As people have said, they're not the best of machines for learners. OK , if said learner is responsible , mature, etc - what am I saying we're talking two smokers here. But, people have started out on RGVs. Some have lived to tell of tehir experiences.

EDIT: With all these bikes, actual performance will depend far more on the condition and tune of the bike , and the skill of the rider, than any paper specification.

Two smokers are notorious for losing 30 kph off the top end today cos the planets are in the wrong astronmical ascension, and getting it back tomorrow, cos the wind changed. Far more sensitive to going out of tune than a four stroke, and require far more skill to actually get the performance the specifications talk about. And putting the horseys onto the road is a whole other matter again. Riding style is completely different to a four stroke.

[nudemetalz]

You haven't mentioned the Kwaka KR-1's there, Ixion.
Beautiful machines, but also very fragile (apparently).

Mate of mine had an MVX when I was younger, was a fast as my CBX400F, but blew up big time eventually. The rear cylinder let go, quite a common problem. They weren't that bad to ride though, quite torquey but RG's & RZ's used to beat them.

[Ixion]

Yes, the KR1-S was fast (not as fast as the older triples though!. Now if you really want to commit suicide ...,). And hung together just about long enough to finish a race. Sometimes

If you're talking older sports two strokes the RZ yamahas were about the pick of the crop. And the GT Suzukis for touring. Now THEY are a two smoker that will never break. But not as exciting , to be sure.

And then there's the four cyclinders. Sigh. :love:

[nudemetalz]

And then there's the four cyclinders. Sigh. :love:

Don't get me started on my reasoning for selling my perfectly good RZ-500....
The 8th wonder of th world !!!

The experiences I had riding that beast, from the fouling plugs, to the vicious front-end bump steer, the power wheelies (small ones) and the noise when she got 4 expansion chambers put on !!!!

:crybaby:

[Motu]

Two smokers are notorious for losing 30 kph off the top end today cos the planets are in the wrong astronmical ascension, and getting it back tomorrow, cos the wind changed. .

And power bands shifting when the sun goes behind a cloud.My TS/TM400 was like that somedays - it has the honour (so far,touch wood,aaaagh,now I've done it!) of being the only bike to dump me on gravel.One day 26 rpm below the power band,instead of 40hp spinning up the rear wheel to square off the corner,I had 20hp punching the front wheel out from under me.I thought I knew it better than that - but that's a 2 stroke for you,like having a pet tiger,one day they will take a swipe at you when your back is turned.

[hXc]

Yes, the KR1-S was fast (not as fast as the older triples though!. Now if you really want to commit suicide ...,). And hung together just about long enough to finish a race. Sometimes

If you're talking older sports two strokes the RZ yamahas were about the pick of the crop. And the GT Suzukis for touring. Now THEY are a two smoker that will never break. But not as exciting , to be sure.

And then there's the four cyclinders. Sigh. :love:
You're forgetting a really beautiful and pretty damn fast machine there: Kawasaki KH250 Triple *drool*

[Motu]

Um,no drooling there - you can only fold a piece of paper into ever smaller sizes a set number of times,and 250 was twice too many.

[ZorsT]

I think an RG-150 is the way to go. Definatly.

They are getting quite expensive at the moment though...

[dawnrazor]

had a 125 aprillia as my second bike - it was fantastic, 33bhp from a 125 was so much fun, I loved it......................except once ever couple of months it would slap me about a bit and demand fully syntetic oil to drink, now thats not cheap......it would be okay then for a little while, but once I did some big K's it would want its engine striped and rebuilt and that usually would involve raping my bank account.

Once I had it off the road for 3 months, just to find the readies to pay its bills.

2 strokes are sweet but they are for screaming the tits off not commutting, you'll only kill it that way.

[imdying]

Many many years ago I used an RZ-500 as my daily commuter...needless to say on many occasions it became an RZ-375-V3 and RZ-250-V2....
Quite easy to see which plug had fouled by one exhaust not smoking while others were...Ahhh... I commuted a bit on my RZ500, never fouled plugs though. The secret lies in B8HVXs ;)

[Nutter34]

If it were the model before the reverse cylinder, I'd have said go for it BUT not the reverse cylinder one. Absolutely brilliant bike. Peaky and found 8-12 thou rpm to be about best, not exactly a commute engine... Looks the dogs though...

As for all these people advocating 4-strokes... You learn a lot more about riding a motorbike with 2-strokes, I'd go so far as to say you develop a better feel for what the engines need and want as well as proper brake control, since you end up learning to use the rear brakes too...

[FilthyLuka]

get a h2 and screw what everone else says!

:2guns: :chase:

[nudemetalz]

Ahhh... I commuted a bit on my RZ500, never fouled plugs though. The secret lies in B8HVXs ;)


Yeah, betcha they weren't/aren't cheap !!
Don't you just miss having the big V4 !!

[imdying]

Yeah, betcha they weren't/aren't cheap !!
Don't you just miss having the big V4 !!
Don't I just!

They were costing my something like $28 each from Darbis, but I ended up buying them for about $12 each from Automotive Supplies in Auckland!!!! So cheap, so so cheap. Also brought my TTS direct from Castrol in 4 litre packs... was actually pretty cheap to maintain imho. Gearbox oil from Penrite and air filters from Yamaha, bout all it really ever needed :hug:

[quickbuck]

MVX Hondas were fastish. But even more unreliable than the TZR.

.

Oh No You have jinxed the thread!!!

[quickbuck]

...TTS direct from Castrol in 4 litre packs...

That shit used to get all through my gear, and made my room stink!

Used to have an RG250 at the time, and my mate had an RG500.
He sold it for a bit of money, but really regrets selling it now, as he didn't have to.

Sold my RG 'cos like most strokers, it went Klack once too often.

Yes, and I once had a MVX, funny old thing that kept going Klack too.

So back to the question, never get a 2 smoke for a commuter, unless you are:
A) Prepared to walk long distances, or
B) Have a very understanding other half with a cage and a trailer.

[Mr. Peanut]

The NSR is far more reliable than any other proddy 2 stroke race rep.

The power valve design is far kinder to abuse than the RGV/RS250/KR/RG, which upon breaking their power valves, consume them wholly.

Unfortunately the cylinder/piston assembly was never designed for this. Although looking at them, you could swear the power valves were.

Not that anyone cares... :innocent:

[imdying]

So, to sum up... Get a 2 stroke, it'll teach you that bikes are indeed fast and fun, with a bit of wick. Unlike inline four 250s, which'll teach you that bikes are linear, slow revving things. Not to mention the fact that they'll give you AIDs. Honest.

[JeremyW]

I have decided on the RG150. But I am gutted I am not in a position to buy the TZR :mad:

Maybe in a few years.... damn that seems so far away...

[imdying]

Just don't ride the damn thing into the ground... if its feeling a bit crappy, get a second opinion. If it needs a rebuild, it's far cheaper to do it before it blows up on you than after.