To Race Nationals or Not???

[loosebruce]

After much thinking, discussion with a good mate and a lot of number crunching, i reckon i'm looking at close to $8000 out of my own pocket to race the full nationals in 07. Thats just to get there, add another $3-4000 to be fully competitive, my bike is very good and i'm hardly out riding it yet, but it is down on horsepower compared to the top bikes. But i'm not about to start blaming the bike for slower lap times, as a top rider could go a bit faster on it than what i can atm.

You're looking at:

$1000 just to enter all 5 rounds
$4000 to get me enough tyres to get me by (just), but when Stroud, Clee and co run a new set for each race thats 15 sets alone just for racing, not too mention a set here and there for testing and practice!
$1000 in air flights to the south island and back, i can't just take 3 weeks of work.
$1500 at least in consumables, oil, feul, brake pads etc
$1500 aside for if the worse happens in a off while racing and the need for repairs.
I could prolly shack up with someone to keep accomandation down, and a kind offer from someone to take my bike around the South Island rounds on a trailer for me, gettign teh bike there would be no problem.
I also lose out big time in income from taking a lot of time off from work.

I can find the money to do it, i can get cover at work, i can't go at it half arsed i have to be 120% commited to the nationals if i do it. Thank god food does not cost me a heck of a lot!

My Problem lies here:

So i do the nationals then what? Say i find some good pace and show some good potenial to find even more pace and be competitive. It's New Zealand, how much notice do people take of New Zealand, i might get noticed by someone, but thats a big might, hell i might even not show any potential at all and be wasting my time, at the moment everytime i hit the track i improve so i'll keep racing and keep believing i will get faster and smarter.
Wouldn't i be better off to take my $8000 that i'd spend doing the nationals here and use it to do a couple of rounds of the Aussie Superbike Championship, or too more of an extent even an AMA round, wouldn't it be more benefical to go to Phillip Island and try and qualify as a wild card at a WSBK round (ok these are a little way off for my pace atm, but you see where i'm going with my thinking) even to qualify 28th on a WSBK grid would be something to be proud of.
Would i be better off to put that $8000 towards more moeny i save and head off to the UK to get into the road race scene, the Northwest, Manx, Isle Of Mann, something i could only dream about some years ago, but now i realise this is a real possiblitly for me and something i would give anything to do, racing at the Isle of Mann comes no better, and would rather chase this than any closed cricut racing dream i have.

I am just struggling to see the point of doing the New Zealand Nationals, it i s a huge expense for what i can see as very little personal gain other than track time which i can get through club level racing at a cheaper cost and still ride against national level racers, maybe if i was carving up the club scene i would look at the Nationals but i'm still learning even at club level. I know to put in the hard work now and do nationals i could come away with a top 10 championship position which is more than respectable and also increase any chance of getting sponsorship for the next years championship, but I don't want to be racing in New Zealand all my life.

Maybe some guys who have been there at Nationals before can shed some light as to why i should do the Nationals or if i am thinking along teh right lines of heading overseas with my money saved.

I'm planning on this stage at doing the 4 PMCC rounds at Taupo, Wanganui Street Race, Paeroa Street Race, Gladstone Hill Climb, Manfiled and Pukekohe National rounds. But the extra strectch in my pocket to try and inculde the south island rounds i am unsure of.

Cheers for any thoughts in advance.

[HDTboy]

Would you rather be a big fish in a little bowl? Or a medium sized fish in the ocean?

Ask Sudeep to explain it if you don't get it.

[onearmedbandit]

Putting aside the experience in competitive riding you'll get from doing the nationals (which as you say you could for the most part pick up in club level) I myself can not see much to be gained from doing the Nationals. In fact I was talking with a racer this morning who has competed in the Nat's for a few years now and he, once his visa is sorted, is selling up here, all of his toys, his house, etc, and is heading off to the states to chase the money. Buy himself a motorhome and drive to different events where they actually have some prize money. (no matter how small)

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for supporting the local scene and understand that it is no doubt a great breeding ground for future stars, but for someone in my friends position it is a chance for him to dedicate himself 120% to racing (being away from his business) and get some financial rewards out of it. And who knows, the chance of a paid ride.

[roogazza]

Nationals !!!! pfft ! save your money . Its like being world famous in Taihape..... Fact is no one will know in 5 or 10 years. G.

[Keystone19]

Do the club races, do the north island stuff and then Go Overseas.

[k14]

Yeah there isn't very far to go in NZ as far as bike racing goes but as far as its compared to the world stage its damn cheap to get experience against pretty good competition.

You are wasting your time going overseas with 1 season of NZ racing under your belt. You'd be spending twice that money (atleast) just to get a bit of experience, whereas you could get it NZ alot easier.

I too have been doing the numbers recently and they aren't very flash. Not as much as you but still well over $4k. Really its up to you to decide.

[svs]

I reckon it's worth doing the nationals - just for the experience. The pace is much higher than the the club races and most of the decent riders are out on the track. You'll learn a lot, and in the big scheme of motor racing $8-$10k isn't a lot.

Do the nationals and compare yourself to the top riders, the South Island tracks don't favour top hp like pukekohe so your bike won't be a problem. Once that's done you can go and take on the world.

If you want to prove yourself - sign up for the R6 cup in the UK. All bikes prepped and everything for you. All you have to do is hand over the cash 18000 pounds for entries and bike lease for the year

[Joni]

Do the club races, do the north island stuff and then Go Overseas.Bruce - this might be completely off line as I don’t know what your dreams are and where you hope to see yourself in a few years, to top it off I have only seen you on a track once and it was at the track day... however what did stand out is you have talent and if applied right it could take you places.

Keystone mentions you going over seas - one benefit of doing the nationals is exposure... Its not only getting there financially, its getting there prepared mentally as well, because if you do as well as I suspect you will.... what better platform to boost your movement to racing across the Tasman - you will arrive with credibility and a national (not just club) track record. Once again if you do well it will also boost your possibility of getting solid sponsors, which will take you further than doing it on your own budget.

Its that big pond thing that was mentioned before... I say jump in mate. Swim with the best the country has to offer, not just the North Islanders and move forward knowing what you are capable of 100%.

My last thought and this comes from my experience: the bigger the event, the bigger you need to be... build that "big match mentality" so when your dreams are in front of you, you take them on head on because you know 100% where you stand in the NZ National racing arena.

That’s my humble opinion anyway - Good luck in what ever you decide mate!:wari:

EDIT: Another thing is being exposed to different tracks – from a technical track like Levels to the faster one like Teretonga. I watched KK improve dramatically during the last nationals as his mind got a grip of the different tracks that are not his usual North Island tracks, that linked with the high level of competition was good for him – it was great to see. Its all experience and being exposed to different things.

[Crasherfromwayback]

!

Maybe some guys who have been there at Nationals before can shed some light as to why i should do the Nationals or if i am thinking along teh right lines of heading overseas with my money saved.

I'm planning on this stage at doing the 4 PMCC rounds at Taupo, Wanganui Street Race, Paeroa Street Race, Gladstone Hill Climb, Manfiled and Pukekohe National rounds. But the extra strectch in my pocket to try and inculde the south island rounds i am unsure of.

Cheers for any thoughts in advance.

Stay here first mate. I've done full national rounds three times and loved every series. You've gotta have competitive bike(s), tyres and the will to succeed (which you obviously have). BUT, it's pointless heading off overseas where things are far more competitive (a-la expensive) until you know you can at least cut it here at the very highest level.
You also get used to learning new tracks, the Sth Island tracks are all very different to 'ours'.....something you'll have to get good at if you go 'far'!
It's a LOT easier to get help of ANY kind overseas with some kind of National Title.....no matter how small our pond is.

Pull the pin mate!!!

[k14]

If you want to prove yourself - sign up for the R6 cup in the UK. All bikes prepped and everything for you. All you have to do is hand over the cash 18000 pounds for entries and bike lease for the year
Yeah would be pretty awesome, only one problem though, age limit. There's an age limit of 21 (or 22 maybe) for all competitors. If my memory serves me correctly that counts bruce (aswell as myself) out of it.

[Two Smoker]

Bruce... Your a fucking muppet...

DO THE NATIONALS!!! It will increase you pace hugely!!! The experience you will gain from doing the nationals will be what you need... You will find out whether or not you have the right stuff or not. Then look at Aussie or UK or the USA after doing the one series of NZ nationals...

If you want to save money, dont do Wanganui BOS... After much thought i have decided not to do it due to the huge cost of getting there and racing, the fact that the Nationals are 2 weeks after Wanganui, and that if you crash (even if it isnt due to you) your fucked for the more important racing...

[The_Dover]

if you wanna make some extra cash I'm sure I can get you some work as a he-pussy.

if your dream is to go overseas and do it then go mate. I know fuck all about racing but I do know that NZ is Deliverance country. you gotta get out into the big world, how far will that 8 grand take you?? (Stewart Island maybe!!!)

IF you've got the balls and the talent then go give the UK a crack. I'm sure a few of us poms on here can get you enough contacts to put a roof over your head and a dodgy curry in your stomach from time to time.

[Shaun]

Bruce... Your a fucking muppet...

DO THE NATIONALS!!! It will increase you pace hugely!!! The experience you will gain from doing the nationals will be what you need... You will find out whether or not you have the right stuff or not. Then look at Aussie or UK or the USA after doing the one series of NZ nationals...

If you want to save money, dont do Wanganui BOS... After much thought i have decided not to do it due to the huge cost of getting there and racing, the fact that the Nationals are 2 weeks after Wanganui, and that if you crash (even if it isnt due to you)...


You are a very wise young man Grasshoper

[Mental Trousers]

Just go and do the nationals instead of regretting not doing it in 20 years.

[sugilite]

I might be wrong, but I'm quite sure you need to be invited to be a wild card at the World Superbike championship. Though you could possibly enter the support superbike races they run on the same Weekend. (part of the Aussie superbike champs me thinks)
My understanding about the Australian series is there are a lot more riders that run at the front of mid pack pace. So there is a high chance that you would be behind that mob having to learn a new track etc.
Sure, the experience would be very valuable, but I'm picking your 8k would be pretty much blown on that one meeting. Would you get more experience out of one Australian round than 5 NZ ones? I think not.
Three top running Aussies came over for this years NZ nats, and three went back home with out winning a championship, though admittedly 4 time Aussie champ Shaun Giles did go close. But that shows just how competitive the NZ series is.
Look at mylaps.com, even 12th place were doing 1.9's at the Manfield round.
As someone already mentioned in this thread, the South Island tracks are riders tracks, you go very, very well at Taupo and more recently you went well at the Manfield long track. I reckon you would surprise many down south with your pace.
My personal feelings are if it's experience you want, you will get more bang for buck contesting the 5 NZ rounds for your 8K, not to mention it is a shit load of fun.

Your still young, there is plenty of time to go overseas eh, and wouldn't it be much more worthwhile to go overseas a much faster and competitive rider than you are now? :2thumbsup

[FROSTY]

Bruce--i agree with TS ---In a nutshell to do the nationals means you need to raise the bar on your riding at least one level above club raceing.

The racing is more intense-given that its one meeting a weekend for 6 weeks if you do whangas then one club meeting then the three south island national rounds.
the other thing to keep in mind is you get 3 days of riding per event at the nationals if yopu do the friday practice.

[Kyle]

Id say do the nz nationals, for the practice and the "under the belt" factor. As for sponserships id try to get very proactive, dont wait to be spotted by a selector who happens to be at a race, contact some of the big overseas companys that have outlets over here, especially ones with race teams overseas :2thumbsup you might be surprized who will pay to have their name on your fast bike, and overseas contacts might be handy. But if you have a list of wins and good placings you can show them, that will help alot. Even with some smaller sponsers it might just help make those nz titles more affordable. For example, a tire wholesaler might offer you a very nice deal on tires if you put thier name on your bike, and it sounds like tires are the biggest cost. Just an idea, feel free to shoot me for rambling.

[Two Smoker]

Your still young,

He may be young... but fuck he is ugly!!! But agree with Sugilites Post, Well put :niceone:

[slowpoke]

Yep, it's a classic chicken or ther egg situation: can't get sponsorship without results, can't get results without sponsorship.

Haven't been there and done it myself....but I HAVE seen the Aussie bike racinf scene up close and personal. Mate these guys are seriously quick. Just ask Stroudy, Tony Rees, Craig Shirriffs, sam smith and co about how hard they are tryin'.....just to come tenth. You have definitely got some talent, I can't believe what you and Darryl achieve on a shoe string budget but just stop and think about it objectively. You have raced against Craig Shirriffs who comprehensively beat EVERYONE at the Vic Club rounds in the Superbike class on a fuggin' 600. As quick as he is he didn't make it to the podium in the supersport ranks.

I've seen Stuart Adams murder the local Superbike guys in WA only to place in the mid teens on his HOME TRACK.

Bryan Staring is an up and comer from WA who had a very very well funded team and he managed to win the 125GP class at his second attempt as a 17 year old. The team put him on a 600 and he's done vey well, to point where he got a factory supported Jardine Honda ride but he's still battling to make it onto the podium.

Mate, as much as we'd all love to see you give it a crack I just don't think there is such a thing as a shortcut in this day and age. No one does a Mick Doohan or Mat Mladin and wins the Oz Superbike champs without putting in there time these days.

Having said that if you have got a burning desire to race the IOM, then start working towards it. Same goes for Aussie or AMA. But, I'd just be thinkin' REAL hard about chucking in a job to do it, 'cos the chances of ever making a living out of racing bikes are pretty slim. But it's an awesome dream and only you will know how far you are prepared to go to achieve it.

Bottom line: race the nat's, measure yourself, improve yourself. The 8k is nothing compared to what you are going to spend in Oz, US etc and the knowledge will be invaluable.

[loosebruce]

Cheers for all the replys, PMs, call's etc peeps.

I can see an extra benefit in doing nationals, Sugilite you're right in saying 3 top running aussie guys came over and still got given a run around by our guys. For me i feel my major goal would be to head to the UK and get into the road race scene (not cricut racing) which is why there is a big pull for me to enter the upcoming BOS rounds, but agree with you Chris, to do Wanganui and if i'm to have an off two weeks out from the Nationals :weep: but nothing apeals to me more personally than racing the streets.
But yes doing the nationals would have a good benefit to me if i was to head over having some national experiance and to be honest if i head to the UK i'm still looking long term as in it's not going to happen in 6 months, so might as well fill in that space with the nationals in the mean time.
I hope you're right Sugilite that i might be able to surprise a few with my pace down south, Poo's gave me an interesting offer that i may now consider, but again thats another cost i dont know if i can swing yet.
I have Round 6 at taupo this weekend, i'm really looking forward to this round, if i have any chance of kicking it at the front this will be it, so i am putting a good amount of pressure on myself even though it is a club race but there are going to be some very fast guys there so will be very interesting to see, hope my rearsets turn up in time so i'm not draging shit through most corners.
I'm thinking that i should look at flaging the PMCC rounds to save money and put it towards Nationals and heading down for a round of King of Ruapuna series with Poo's (if the offer still stands mate). Time to forget about doing trackdays as well, unless i have something i want to test out or try.
Time to sit down and have a real major think of just how i'm going to get everything sorted and how i can achieve my goals, find out how and where i'm going to find the nessary money to do so, 3rd job maybe? Time to start hitting trademe with selling random crap, time to get fit too :weep: no more pies for me! :crybaby:

All going to plan you'll see a black an silver GSXR1000K5 #66 on the nationals gird early next year (hopefully at least mid pack)......

[k14]

I'm thinking that i should look at flaging the PMCC rounds to save money and put it towards Nationals and heading down for a round of King of Ruapuna series with Poo's (if the offer still stands mate). Time to forget about doing trackdays as well, unless i have something i want to test out or try.
Ah yes, good idea there. Then you'd know what it feels like to be beaten by a bike with 1/8th the engine capacity :whistle:

[Cleve]

Bruce, one of the good things about this Kiwibiker site, and many of the people on it, is when someone asks a good, honest question, you get well thought, intelligent advice from a bunch of people who actually care and have considered long and hard about their answers.
There is insightful and experienced advice for you to think about (apart from the pommy idiot who reckons NZ is like the deep south of the USA... I say to you...unless you are joking and in which case my apologies for the poor sense of humour, "Squeal like a pig mother f&$#@'r")
Good luck with your plans and your dreams.... and see ya at Taupo (am in Brazil on business right now but fly home on Friday in time to head straight down there...)

[The_Dover]

Hang on while I tune my banjo...........

From what I see Bruce has the raw talent and desire to go overseas, fuck it, do it now while you are young.

He can come back to Appalachia and race the nationals at any time.

Is his pace going to increase due to track knowledge or raw racing experience? Is he better off going where he has a real mountain to climb rather than a small hill? We can already see he's a pretty fast fucker but is he going to improve more by jumping out of his comfort zone and into the rest of the world or by staying in NZ?

[Cleve]

Hang on while I tune my banjo...........

Yeeeehaaww now youse talking Jed :2thumbsup

[sugilite]

Is his pace going to increase due to track knowledge or raw racing experience? Is he better off going where he has a real mountain to climb rather than a small hill? We can already see he's a pretty fast fucker but is he going to improve more by jumping out of his comfort zone and into the rest of the world or by staying in NZ?

His pace will definitely increase by taking on 3 tracks and a fair number of riders he has not faced yet.

With all respect to Bruce, his current Manfield times would not even see him get a look in on the top 15 yet alone the top 10 and that is a track he knows well.
He can stay in NZ and climb that mountain, however go overseas before that raw talent has been developed further and it will be very easy to be crushed by that mountain.

An Australian just took out the World superbike championship (yet another one) yet a 4 time Australian superbike champion could not climb what you Dover, call a small hill. I see others in this thread saying the nats pace is only one level above club racing, I can only presume they have never fronted a national level production superbike or supersport race.

So Dover, while you may feel in your comfort zone struggling to crack the top 20 or indeed stay in front of the pace car on the warm up lap, I'm sure Bruce will be stretching his big time to achieve getting in the top 10.

So as of right now that 8K will give him 15 days of experience against battle hardened riders, then he can take that overseas with him in the near future. Money well spent me thinks.

[The_Dover]

His pace will definitely increase by taking on 3 tracks and a fair number of riders he has not faced yet.

With all respect to Bruce, his current Manfield times would not even see him get a look in on the top 15 yet alone the top 10 and that is a track he knows well.
He can stay in NZ and climb that mountain, however go overseas before that raw talent has been developed further and it will be very easy to be crushed by that mountain.

An Australian just took out the World superbike championship (yet another one) yet a 4 time Australian superbike champion could not climb what you Dover, call a small hill. I see others in this thread saying the nats pace is only one level above club racing, I can only presume they have never fronted a national level production superbike or supersport race.

So Dover, while you may feel in your comfort zone struggling to crack the top 20 or indeed stay in front of the pace car on the warm up lap, I'm sure Bruce will be stretching his big time to achieve getting in the top 10.

So as of right now that 8K will give him 15 days of experience against battle hardened riders, then he can take that overseas with him in the near future. Money well spent me thinks.

Why have a fuckin dig at me dickhead?

I'm of the opinion that if he's good enough and backs himself he'd be better off going and spending his money somewhere with a bigger audience and better challenge. It's all the NZ racers saying that the Nats are a step above club racing, I wouldn't fuckin know, I'm not interested in racing.

My view comes from the scale of the task and whether it matches Bruce's ambition or not. He could take out the Nats and still struggle overseas, he could throw caution to the wind and bag himself to learn in a viciously competetive environment, it certainly wont be any easier whether he gets there tomorrow or in 5 years time.

If it's what I wanted to do and I backed myself I'd do it, Bruce is questioning whether he wants to spend 8k doing it in NZ and then go overseas?

[sugilite]

Maybe some guys who have been there at Nationals before can shed some light as to why i should do the Nationals or if i am thinking along teh right lines of heading overseas with my money saved.


Why have a fuckin dig at me dickhead?

I'm of the opinion that...

Thats why I was having a dig at you, since you have trouble reading, I'll s p e l l it out for you, he was asking people of experience and not looking for answers born out of ignorance

[The_Dover]

My answer is not born out of ignorance, other than ignorance of your experiences.

If I want to be a rockstar I'm not going to sit around playing pub gigs in some backwater because I'm not going to get noticed.

Would the experience of entering competitive races in the rest of the world hinder Bruce's development as a racer? I doubt it.

So why should he sit here wasting money in a country with a small racing scene? If he's good enough he'll succeed.

Or he could be top dog here for a few years and then go struggle abroad.....

[Crasherfromwayback]

Would the experience of entering competitive races in the rest of the world hinder Bruce's development as a racer? I doubt it.

So why should he sit here wasting money in a country with a small racing scene? If he's good enough he'll succeed.

Or he could be top dog here for a few years and then go struggle abroad.....

This isn't a dig at you Dover, but yeah, I think it may well hinder his development.
He needs experience at the top level here before going anywhere else.
If he was to go overseas now, I feel he'd get such a hiding (no disrespect to you Bruce!) that it'd be real easy to blow a shitload more money than he will here, only to run out, and come home with his morale at an all time low.

Gotta walk before you can run!
I dragged my leathers outta 'retirement' while I was over there, and becuase the NZACU (at the time) wasn't affiliated with the AUST ACU, I had to ride in 'C' Grade to prove myself. JESUS, even at a club meet at Lakeside Brisbane where I was, there were 40 odd LOONIES on late model bikes going fucking ballistic! Not to be outdone.....I mashed my RS 250 and myself on the last lap on my first race there showing them....how to crash. Doh.

Confidence will help Bruce no end. He'll get that confidence racing against our best here first. One step at a time. Go BRUCE!!

[kickingzebra]

Talking to a mate today (with much nationals and a bit of overseas experience)
The nationals to the club scene, different kettle of fish.
I am planning on doing the nationals, and know damn well I won't be at the front, but tells ya, I won't be at the back either.
The experience of racing the big boys, hard fought races, more of a contact sport etc, we don't have that level of committment at the club races (not that I am bagging them, great fun, learning, and still way fast!)
Nationals here is going to be of some good, the competitive atmosphere, racing the strouds, shauns, and others of like talent, it will lift our game.
Besides that, I'll need a rent a mate down there for the SI rounds ;)

Do it for love and experience, as has been said, we are talkign campaigns in the $25,000 range (including bike) My mate first time seriously contesting it, off his own back, $65,000
Chalk and cheese, but if you can cut it with those boys, there is grounds to carry on.

Not to mention fulfilling the dream!

[dickytoo]

an important aspect of racing is the mental one. as per all the comments from people who have been involved with racing, doing the nationals will also give bruce the mental conditioning to cope with the step up in competition and stress.

it will also give bruce the exposure to race craft that he might not see in club racing.

Finally, it will also allow him to gauge where he is by competing against the likes of Stroud, Clee etc., etc.,

I think the nationals are vital in his development as a racer and can only help when he does eventually goes overseas.

[Shaun]

Stay here, do no more track days, STOP riding on the road and get rid of those crap slow riding habits that you use on the roads, being a stunter or a hoon does not make you fast on a race track, only brave!

Some would have you jump a plane and be off, but they have not tried to do what you are trying to do, read the replies from the ones with the experience that you asked for in the begining of this thread, and take heed you ugly fucker, Whoops, thought I was Smoker there for a minute mate, Sorry for that:buggerd:

-uck the UK, apart from the road scene, Head to the US, lots of contingency money available, nout available in the UK mate

Will talk to you this weekend about the TT, if you use your head, it can pay for itself! The whole trip.

[Shaun]

PS, what is that saying about arguing on the net and Fighting with IHC kids?

[slowpoke]

I might be wrong, but I'm quite sure you need to be invited to be a wild card at the World Superbike championship. Though you could possibly enter the support superbike races they run on the same Weekend. (part of the Aussie superbike champs me thinks)
My understanding about the Australian series is there are a lot more riders that run at the front of mid pack pace. So there is a high chance that you would be behind that mob having to learn a new track etc.
Sure, the experience would be very valuable, but I'm picking your 8k would be pretty much blown on that one meeting. Would you get more experience out of one Australian round than 5 NZ ones? I think not.
Three top running Aussies came over for this years NZ nats, and three went back home with out winning a championship, though admittedly 4 time Aussie champ Shaun Giles did go close. But that shows just how competitive the NZ series is.
Look at mylaps.com, even 12th place were doing 1.9's at the Manfield round.
As someone already mentioned in this thread, the South Island tracks are riders tracks, you go very, very well at Taupo and more recently you went well at the Manfield long track. I reckon you would surprise many down south with your pace.
My personal feelings are if it's experience you want, you will get more bang for buck contesting the 5 NZ rounds for your 8K, not to mention it is a shit load of fun.

Your still young, there is plenty of time to go overseas eh, and wouldn't it be much more worthwhile to go overseas a much faster and competitive rider than you are now? :2thumbsup

I remember reading a few articles about Steve Manning (top privateer in Aussie Superbikes) getting a wildcard for the Aussie WSBK round. It pretty much banktupted the guy getting his bike up to something approaching WSBK spec. From memory he spent more than $8k(AUD) on tires alone for ONE WEEKEND.

Then there was an article about Shane Ingram, a good rider, running in Superstock. It costs about $20k(AUD) for a season, not counting crashes on a bog stock R6. He finished the season in 4th and will probably be ineligible to run Superstock so is looking to make the step up to Supersport. They estimate a competitive 1 bike team at costing $50k(AUD).

The NZ scene may not have the glamour but I'm sure it's just as cut throat at the front. While it seems like a lot of travelling at the moment, it's way less than anything you'll have to do in Aussie or the US.

Have you considered racing a 600? The running costs and initial bike purchase would be considerably reduced. Just an idea...

Reading Shaun's comments about racing the street circuits in the UK reminds of Guy Martin. He was pretty much riding his arse off on the tracks in the UK, battling, getting good results but little for it. Then after an "incident" with a track official he was encouraged to race the road series in Ireland and hasn't looked back, with good financial returns from good results. The risks are higher though and any racecraft you glean in NZ would weigh the odds more in your favour.

Talking of street racing, while the BOS series here is classed as street racing it looks to be a far cry from the street circuits in Ireland, IOM etc. Check out the Ulster GP, Northwest 200 etc and you'll see what I mean. Our tiny lil' town circuits are a totally different animal to the open country tracks where they are doing 180 MILES per hour on narrow bumpy single lane back roads.

And if you do want to do the IOM don't you have to have a good showing at the Manx TT first? It's the same IOM circuit but restricted to 750's or less. Shaun's your obvious expert there, if you haven't chewed his ear off already and I'm restating old news.

You probably aren't enjoying these sorts of decisions but it's a nice problem to have. Most of us just wish we had enough pace to even dream of heading off overseas. The only speed I'll ever see is sold out the back of the pub......

[loosebruce]

His pace will definitely increase by taking on 3 tracks and a fair number of riders he has not faced yet.

With all respect to Bruce, his current Manfield times would not even see him get a look in on the top 15 yet alone the top 10 and that is a track he knows well.
I'm sure Bruce will be stretching his big time to achieve getting in the top 10



Exposure to new tracks will ehlp greatly indeed, i checked out last nats times round ruapuna, and plan on heading down there for round 3 of their club series, i've set a goal time for first time seeing the track and it should give me a good idea of how i can go, i also believe that Strouds pole time was a new lap record and the fastest he'd been since riding the britten.
Dont know what it is about manfeild short track, but i'm taking my time to get my head round it, wasn't too bad at the long cricut until shirrifs pissed off in a big way with that 53.6, getting closer at Puke and maybe with teh bike on par could see the last second or so come down easily.
You bet ya i'll be stretching my comfort level.



Gotta walk before you can run!
Confidence will help Bruce no end. He'll get that confidence racing against our best here first. One step at a time. Go BRUCE!!

Yea for sure, as i said i aint setting anything on fire yet, and can see how more top level experiance can help me in the long run.




an important aspect of racing is the mental one. as per all the comments from people who have been involved with racing, doing the nationals will also give bruce the mental conditioning to cope with the step up in competition and stress.
it will also give bruce the exposure to race craft that he might not see in club racing.
I think the nationals are vital in his development as a racer and can only help when he does eventually goes overseas.

Thanks Richard and well ture, quite often as well at the VIC series i have found myself get a few crappy starts (getting sorted though) and putting passes on the guys in front but in doing so losing touch with the front guys and finding myself riding around by myself for a lot of the race, not much to gain from this.


Stay here, do no more track days, STOP riding on the road and get rid of those crap slow riding habits that you use on the roads, being a stunter or a hoon does not make you fast on a race track, only brave!
-uck the UK, apart from the road scene, Head to the US, lots of contingency money available, nout available in the UK mate
Will talk to you this weekend about the TT, if you use your head, it can pay for itself! The whole trip.

Already figured out the track day part, just really a waste of money and time, have only been riding on the road to try and build strength back up in my hands which is improving a lot, stunting and shit nah fuck it not on my bike, i've put a lot of money into it and if i throw it away at the track racing thats the way it is, if i throw it away doing a fkn wheelie then i'm gonna feel like a right cock, and besdies brave usually see's you in a gravel trap.
Have no interest in the UK other than the road racing scene, if i wanted to race on the track yes i would head to the US.
Catch up this weekend





Have you considered racing a 600? The running costs and initial bike purchase would be considerably reduced. Just an idea...

Reading Shaun's comments about racing the street circuits in the UK reminds of Guy Martin. He was pretty much riding his arse off on the tracks in the UK, battling, getting good results but little for it. Then after an "incident" with a track official he was encouraged to race the road series in Ireland and hasn't looked back, with good financial returns from good results. The risks are higher though and any racecraft you glean in NZ would weigh the odds more in your favour.

Talking of street racing, while the BOS series here is classed as street racing it looks to be a far cry from the street circuits in Ireland, IOM etc. Check out the Ulster GP, Northwest 200 etc and you'll see what I mean. Our tiny lil' town circuits are a totally different animal to the open country tracks where they are doing 180 MILES per hour on narrow bumpy single lane back roads.

And if you do want to do the IOM don't you have to have a good showing at the Manx TT first? It's the same IOM circuit but restricted to 750's or less. Shaun's your obvious expert there, if you haven't chewed his ear off already and I'm restating old news.

You probably aren't enjoying these sorts of decisions but it's a nice problem to have. Most of us just wish we had enough pace to even dream of heading off overseas. The only speed I'll ever see is sold out the back of the pub......

It is tough decision, basically knowing if i want to do anything with racing, that it is going to be my life, i work sleep eat to ride my bike, it leaves very little time for those people around me.
I have considered going to a 600 for sure, i took a K6 600 out for a short blat in the weekend, my god where's the power, think i've been on the 1000 too long, but in saying that i see how fkn fast shirrifs is on a 600 so they can't be all that bad, and plus if i remeber rightly first timers on the Isle race in Junior Supersport??? which is on a 600, so i cant go over there and jump on the 1000, so time on a 600 would be a good idea.
I've read a fair bit about Guy Martin's career, good write up in last issue of superbike and a lot of what he said makes sense indeed, i hope to catch up with him this year at BOS.
And yea understand that you can't really compare Wanagnui and Paeroa to the Isle etc


Cheers again to all of ya's for your thoughts, has been appreciated.

[Shaun]

Now the fek of here and go earn some money to go racing

[Fishy]

time to get fit too :weep: no more pies for me! :crybaby:




have only been riding on the road to try and build strength back up in my hands which is improving a lot

Mate, if you need any help at all to do with fitness or strength or what ever just let me know. I will help you out with training advice free of charge for mates. :niceone:

[sAsLEX]

PS, what is that saying about arguing on the net and Fighting with IHC kids?

They are both fun?






if i throw it away doing a fkn wheelie then i'm gonna feel like a right cock, and besdies brave usually see's you in a gravel trap.
<img src=http://sportsbike.co.nz/forums/image.php?u=22&dateline=1157283548>



Mate have a search for raceyriders experience getting sponsers, it wont take much to help you out as <8k or so aint that big money for a large company, whos that pizza company that shows extreme sports etc in their shops all the time...... hmmmmm now the motorsport market is young people that like that sort of stuff so write up a plan showing the diff levels of sponsership your after, photoshop some logos on to a pic of your bike and go searching about for some coin.

Oh and good luck whatever path you pick!

EDIT: Iam using a powerball to get some strength into my hands, also look at music stores as they have grip devices with springs that work each finger individually and you can do both of those whilst sitting watching the telly etc

[loosebruce]

Mate, if you need any help at all to do with fitness or strength or what ever just let me know. I will help you out with training advice free of charge for mates. :niceone:

LOL thanks josh, but i have just the person for that sorted out!

[Shaun]

Mate have a search for raceyriders experience getting sponsers, it wont take much to help you out as <8k or so aint that big money for a large company, whos that pizza company that shows extreme sports etc in their shops all the time...... hmmmmm now the motorsport market is young people that like that sort of stuff so write up a plan showing the diff levels of sponsership your after, photoshop some logos on to a pic of your bike and go searching about for some coin.


Waste of time, better off getting another job, there is no R-O-I for these big companies, that shit works from knowing someone that knows someone, and please don't say it is a tax write of, cause I am sure they would much rather spend there own money there way

[loosebruce]

Yep Shauns hit the nail on the head there, there really is no point chasing sponsorship as of yet for me, i'd be wasting my time, i understand that anything i do from here on in i have to be prepeared to do it on my own steam and i will for that fact, help comes in many forms so i have found, from experianced riders, to good mates cutting you a deal, there is no easy way about it.
But you can be smart about it in the other ways, saving you money etc etc. It's basiclly comes down to how much you want it, you want it enough you'll ge there one way or another, and believe me i have a fair amount of want hanging around...............

[emaN]

I'm not a racer...so feel free to disregard my .002 of a sec:

Having lived in UK for 5yrs I noticed that the kiwis/aussies with a year or two experience got the jobs first.

Riding for a team/sponsor would be a job (as fun & frustrating & rewarding as a job can be) so I'm picking any manager would be looking for proven experience and/or something on a "CV".

Looks like you may have made your decision, just hope this helps confirm it bro!

Sure you can't make it to IOM for the centennary?!?! :shifty:

[Motoracer]

The smoker, Suglite and Shaun's giving out the right advise.

I think you've already decided on what you want to do anyway.

All the best no matter what matey! :)

[loosebruce]

As i've now found out all the advice in world helps but doesn't solve the problem that money casues!
Sad for me to say but i've pretty much done my sums and am at an end with racing! I'm gutted to say the least, just when each time i step on the bike i get faster, i learn more, i change things, i get faster, i know i have so much more left in me and in the bike, but i guess as at now it's not meant to be for me. I won't be doing nationals this year or any sort of racing, i was going to do puke this weekend, but the decsion has been made to sell the GSXR, and racing with no insurance is just tempting a fate i dont want to deal with at the moment.
You have no idea how gutted i am, how many sleepless nights i have had trying to find a way around it, if anything it is the perfect time for me to race, i have a very good bike and good people around me, but as of late i have had to start borrowing money or putting things on account, and it was going to end up with me not being able to pay things back and get myself into a alot of trouble financally, i just can't live scrapping through barely each week to make ends meet, i dont want to do that and it's not fair on the people in my life, i have a business to think about as well, and quite a few other changes in my life that need consideration.
As most that know me know how much i enjoy the racing and the challenges i set withen myself, they know this hasn't been an easy decision, but there is no way around it, unless a fkn miracle happens and i get sponsorship (tui ad) i dont have enough of a rep yet to ask for any serious sponsorship, and serious sponsorship is what i need to carry on.

So I wanted to say thanks to those that have helped me out in any shape way or form, and know it will not all be for waste, i will be back at some point, just now is not the best time, i really need to sit down and plan for next season.
I'll be putting the GSXR back into complete stock road tirm, and selling it at a good price, only has 6000km on it, 8 oil/filter changes and well looked after, those that know me , know i ride it reasonably hard, but i need a bike in top condition to do ride as fast as i do, so i wouldn't comprismise on anything, so any one in the market? All the suspension, exhaust etc bits i'll sell off separately, so if you have a K5/6 1000 and looking to upgrade, i'm your man.
There's no real point in keeping the K5, it's a waste on the road at speed, too nice to stunt on, too stupid to commute on. I looked at buying something like an SV650 to race, but as much fun as i'd have it's not the class i want to be, i'd settle in F2 happily but its not much cheaper than running a superbike. So i'll look at a hack bike maybe an old 85/86 GSXR750 and then buying a crash damaged 600 and dedicting it too stunting.

Thanks again to all those who have helped me. :rockon:

Till next time :bye:

[Joni]

I'm really sorry to hear that Bruce, its does take so many variables that all need to fall into place for things to happen.

So good luck with what ever you do... altho I will say never close a door on a dream that your heart is so connected to, you never know what the future brings!

:sunny: <== keep it shining inside!

:hug:

[Fishy]

Yep must be a real hard situation to be in mate, such a shame though seeing so much talent be put on hold.

You'll get there one day mate!. When I win lotto soon I will buy your K5 and then give it back to you in exchange for a couple of large mischief's with hot chilli sauce. Deal?.....

[texmo]

No chance in scrubbing in the diablo slicks on puke in the weekend at all then?

[loosebruce]

No chance in scrubbing in the diablo slicks on puke in the weekend at all then?

No!

What more can i say, i've given it everything i have and can, if anyone doubts how commited i've been, they can fuck themsleves, i've put close to if not more than $40,000 of my own money to get to where i am and get started, i just am not in the position to carry it on.
Tyres are without doubt the biggest cost on the superbike, to be competitive you need to be on a new set for each race at national level, even with a great deal from Pirelli i was still looking at over $7000 just to get through nationals, and agian from my own pocket!

A bit more planning and next season who knows, the K7 will be out, and Stroud was hinting at some changes to the rules in Superbike which would make it quite a bit cheaper to get into for people like me.

I looked at doign just the North Island nats rounds and the streets but even still to get the bike to where i would want it for each race i would have to find $10,000, i can barely afford the $1500 odd i owe on tyres as it is now, $10.000 shit!

[Fishy]

What more can i say, i've given it everything i have and can, if anyone doubts how commited i've been, they can fuck themsleves,

Anyone that knows you bro definitely knows how much determination you have shown and how commited you have been.

Just hope that things work out and you can get out there in the next couple of seasons. Someone's gotta give Stroudy the learn!.

[Joni]

if anyone doubts how commited i've been, they can fuck themsleves, Besides what others think means stuff all - you know why you lay awake at night and why you made the decision you made, anyone who cares will be right behind you!

So yeah, fuck 'em :innocent:

[cowpoos]

Someone's gotta give Stroudy the learn!.

don't worrie lad...I'll sort him out....























just not on a bike though eh!

[Fishy]

don't worrie lad...I'll sort him out....
just not on a bike though eh!

Tui drinking competition?

[cowpoos]

a serious shame bro..team muppet hanging up their hats for the time being..and I'm a broke cunt too....thats why me racings been a bit quite lately....infact my bike hasn't moved a wheel since taupo :(

Its so fucking frustrating not been able to get out there...

[cowpoos]

Tui drinking competition?
nah I'm broke dude.....so I'm alil outta practise.....maybe pies coz I'm hungry!!










feed me!!!

[Cleve]

if its any consolation you can come back in your 40's and 50's like Paul and I did...

[Shaun]

You are a petrol head and will be back unless you become totally focused on MONEY

Mate, you have proved to yourself and that is all that matters

It is your decision so stick with it and live with it dude

See you on the flip side

PS Really good watching your determination so far