Why own a bike far beyond your abilities? [Archive]

Funkyfly

5th July 2004, 15:47

duckman

5th July 2004, 15:54

Good question - I bought my TL knowing full well that I can't ride it to it's fullest capabilities but I don't think it matters. If I could ride it's arse off then I'd be looking for a faster bike to buy. I like having a machine that has more power than I would care to exploit.

Guess it might be a power trip thing ... ???

jrandom

5th July 2004, 15:58

People buy bikes that they like riding.

If you enjoy riding a GSXR1000 or R1 and can afford it, why *not* buy it?

The converse also applies. Just because you may be a very skilled rider does not imply that you somehow 'should' be riding a bike that is as close as possible to an open-class circuit racer. Perhaps you don't have much spare cash, or you prefer something with more luggage capacity, or something with better fuel efficiency, or something dungy that you don't mind dropping on the way to work in the morning, or ...

vifferman

5th July 2004, 16:03

No, FunkyFly - you're not the only fool.

I guess for me it comes down mostly to ego, as most of my riding is mostly commuting so a 250 would probably do me. But then again, I don't think I could drop down to a less grunty bike after owning 2 500s and a 750 before the VTR.

Ideally I would have a stable of bikes: a commuter, a dirt bike, a tourer, a sports bike, and a track bike. And mebbe a cruiser. But I can only have one bike, so I made sure it had some future-proofing built in, and that I could use it for commuting, sports riding, and the occasional medium to long trip. It also had to be summat that feeds my needs as far as sound, performance, handling, etc. go - all that visceral stuff that makes biking a real experience. I couldn't afford a Ducati 998, my wife didn't like my second choice of bike, so I bought the FahrtSturm, and I'm slowly getting it the way I want it. I may never get the pipes, the custom seat and screen and the hugger, but at least I've dealt to the brakes, bars, gearing, lighting, etc.

Bandito

5th July 2004, 16:05

Good question, I bought my Bandit to slow me down after being told by some long term and very experienced riding buddies that I was riding too fast (read stupid) for public roads on my zx6. My point is that a sports 600 is too much of a weapon for public roads that are littered with unforseen dangers so an R1 or similar must be total overkill!

Funkyfly

5th July 2004, 16:14

If you enjoy riding a GSXR1000 or R1 and can afford it, why *not* buy it?

Well from what i have seen and heard there are plenty or reason not to.

biggest reason being that its dangerous - now i always thought that line of reasoning was a load of rubbish, and that you had total control over the speed you did, and to a certain extent its true, but big powerful bikes are certainly more likely to make you pay for your mistakes! its just so much easier to get into trouble.

Heh, i remember an old dude telling me a 250 was too fast, certainly my first couple of rides on the open road freaked me out! just like the first couple of rides on a litre bike (TL1000s) a year later, and just like the 1st couple of rides on the GSXR a year after that!

Funkyfly

5th July 2004, 16:26

My point is that a sports 600 is too much of a weapon for public roads that are littered with unforseen dangers so an R1 or similar must be total overkill!

Sounds like you were riding the bike like it was designed!

I havent meet too many people that have taken advice like that on board and brought a more "sedate" bike. im impressed.

I like to think i have a bit more self control.

White trash

5th July 2004, 16:30

The whole reason I bought a 600 over a thou' is that I can ride it close to it's limits.

I find it very satisfying to wring every bit it's got out of it.

It's also fulfilling giving blokes on 750s and 1K's a hiding.

In saying that, Cycosis just gave me a thumping at Manfield riding, what I consider, an inferior machine. So maybe I can't ride for shit.

curious george

5th July 2004, 16:34

My RGV250 is still faster than I am, but my next road bike I would like a TL1000 purely because they look and sound terrific! If it was a 500cc with the same looks would buy it. The SV650 is probably the closest I will get, but it just don't look the same!!!
I would feel like a complete monkey on a TL, but I don't think it's to show off, just an aesthetic thing. Or maybe it is to show off. Probably is.

Mongoose

5th July 2004, 16:39

Truth being that there is a whole heap of people(me included) who ride bikes way outside their own capabilities. Same would be true of car owners so where is the problem? As long as you accept that this beasty will out handle whatever you throw at it I see no problem, infact it could be looked at as a safety feature. In saying this i mean if you should accidently go into a corner too hot the bike will appear to be a tad forgiving and you stand a chance of coming out the otherside. If, on the otherhand you ride a bike to with ion an inch of its capabilities, and yours, and things go a bit wrong, too late because there is no built in safety factor.

jrandom

5th July 2004, 16:40

The whole reason I bought a 600 over a thou' is that I can ride it close to it's limits.

'sfunny. I can't comment properly, because I haven't ridden hardly any Proper Bikes. But certainly in cages, and I suspect in bikes too, once I get on 'em proper, I really enjoy the feeling of having an enormous 'power headroom'. Knowing that I'm just kicking around in the bottom 30% makes me go all goosebumpy.

But then, perhaps riding around on a 20-something HP machine is giving me a skewed view on power over-compensation. Ie, I want a LOT of it. I want a fecking rocket with wheels. I never want to feel the frustration of feeling the bike bang against the rev-limiter in sixth gear halfway down a straight piece of road again. Or have to hurriedly adjust my corner line halfway because the gear I needed to drive into the corner with doesn't have enough acceleration to take me out of it properly.

In saying that, Cycosis just gave me a thumping at Manfield riding, what I consider, an inferior machine. So maybe I can't ride for shit.

I bet your arse still looks better in racing leathers, though. :love:

Motoracer

5th July 2004, 16:42

In saying that, Cycosis just gave me a thumping at Manfield riding, what I consider, an inferior machine. So maybe I can't ride for shit.

I was just curious. Does Cycosis ever get his knee down or hang off the bike at the track?

scumdog

5th July 2004, 16:51

I've never even looked at riding my bike at 10/10ths of its ability, I bought it because I can ride it all day and not have to "work" it, I liked its looks, style and sound and the fact that out of the Harley range it was the best accellerating/stopping/handling bike available that would be o.k. for touring two-up with a bit of gear. :niceone:

If I had a bike that I COULD ride to its limits I probably would, but I would also probably kill it (and very likely myself).

I like the seamless torque and the fact I don't have to "wring it out" to pass cars etc.

My 2-cents worth :whocares:

Hitcher

5th July 2004, 16:58

Depends surely what you mean by "its limits". Modern sportsbikes have many attributes, of which top speed is but one. They generally stop well, track like they're on rails and have stacks of acceleration whenever needed. They also look good, although sometimes at the expense of rider comfort and pillions, well who needs them? If a bike goes where you point it, stops straight and true and has enough whoomf to overtake quickly and safely, that can't be a bad thing? The issue here surely is what goes on in the head of the monkey astride the thing -- the bit that all of the engineers and product developers have absolutely no control over.

White trash

5th July 2004, 17:02

I was just curious. Does Cycosis ever get his knee down or hang off the bike at the track?

No he doesn't. He's not a hangy off kinda guy. Although, when he saw the state of his pipe at Manfeild, he definitely knows the benefits

Skyryder

5th July 2004, 17:13

Choose the bike that you want. So you will never ride like ...............your choice, so who cares.

I think bikes are a bit like woman. It's the looks that catch the eye then the personality. And if the looks and personality gel, then you have a great ride. Mind you there are exceptions to all rules. As for riding to the limits, nothing wrong in going to the edge the secret is having control at the edge: no matter what you ride; sportsers, naked, cafe racers, cruisers, or anything else you can get your leg over. Just treat your ride with respect and you will never get tossed off.
Skyryder

Motu

5th July 2004, 17:21

I really enjoy riding a bike I can exceed the limits of - pushing so hard you can feel the forks and frame flex,tyres slide,brakes fade,just going way over the top - you get this on a small bike.I just loved tossing my XR200 into a corner at 110%,not knowing if I was going to make it or not,like,who cares,just go hard out giving it all you got.Try this on a bike that exceeds your abilities and you are in big trouble.

Come and ride my 1971 XS1 sometime - it doesn't take much to get to the abrupt edge of it's package...like playing with a vicious dog,it bites....oh yes,it bites....but it's fun to tease sometimes eh?

Two Smoker

5th July 2004, 17:32

Jinx3d

5th July 2004, 17:43

Who says that the point of owning a bike is to take it to its limits? And who says big bike owners cant control themselves?

I ride my TL slower with far more restraint than I did my first 200 cc.

The track is a different story, blasting round manfield is just about one of the most fun things I have ever done but that sort of thing is just plain crazy on the road.

Its all just for some fun - its not worth dying over it.

best R.
Capt safety (aka Jinx3d)

marty

5th July 2004, 17:47

Hhhhmm intersting, after riding 2 different 600cc Sports bikes, i dont see why there is a need for a 1000..... they have plenty of torque through the rev range, plenty of power, acceleration in lower speeds (below 200kmh) comparable to litre bikes, and handle better to top it off....yes but do they scare small children and old people, and set off car alarms when you ride past?

it's the same old story - we ride/drive/play with whatever our wants desire. i drive a v6 wagon, that will do 200k. it's a family car. i drive it well within its limits. i ride a v2 bike that will do 270k. it's my toy. i like it for lots of reasons, one of them being that i will never find its limits, the other being that i don't feel a need to get close to them. i'd race it if i did. i understand motu's statement, and agree - sometimes it is nice to play close to the edge. i have other outlets that will let me do that.

Funkyfly

5th July 2004, 17:48

Hhhhmm intersting, after riding 2 different 600cc Sports bikes, i dont see why there is a need for a 1000..... they have plenty of torque through the rev range, plenty of power, acceleration in lower speeds (below 200kmh) comparable to litre bikes, and handle better to top it off....

well i guess riding style comes into it, from what i hear your a damn fast rider, and the fact your on a 150 suggests you carry really good corner speed (something i wish i could do), but im no good at corners, i get my kicks outta booting it in a straight line, i shy off at around 200 but the rush of a big 1000 is amazing! one of the other reasons i got a litre bike.

Two Smoker

5th July 2004, 18:05

well i guess riding style comes into it, from what i hear your a damn fast rider, and the fact your on a 150 suggests you carry really good corner speed (something i wish i could do), but im no good at corners, i get my kicks outta booting it in a straight line, i shy off at around 200 but the rush of a big 1000 is amazing! one of the other reasons i got a litre bike.
Nah mate, im slow as hell, and i guess after riding a 150, the 600 is going to accelerate blody quick lol.....

Yep Marty, thats right, it is about the guy/girl on the bike that controls it..... I would think though that in a corner on a 1000cc bike you have too worry about the throttle too much rather than the lines etc.... And mmmmm V-Twin

Big Dog

5th July 2004, 18:27

The issue here surely is what goes on in the head of the monkey astride the thing -- the bit that all of the engineers and product developers have absolutely no control over.
Nor do they get to decide on the aerodynamics or the cog of said monkey.
I ride 1100 for many reasons now, but at purchase time it had a lot to do with having to ring the nuts off anything smaller unless I wanted to hear valve bounce.

Now it has to do with,
* It is so good to be able to go into corners hot because I don't have to worry the % of mass that is my weight .
* It is so good to be able to rely on the bike tocover for me if I overcook a corner from my abilities point of view.
* Being able to set off half a dozen car alarms at start up.
* How excited kids get when they see you coming.
* Seeing other bikers look impressed when you roll up, even if your bike is ten years older than theirs.
* being able to make the pipes bark like a dog when cars don't see you as they pull into your lane.
* being able to line lock it in the wet without using the brakes.
* being easier to ride in heavy wind.
*being able to get my knees under the mirrors.

I could go on but you get the idea.

FROSTY

5th July 2004, 18:30

I guess I kinda went the other way.I'd become a family man so I bought an evil handling underpowered pile of dung.Its limits are soo far before mine that
I was forced to slow down my pace.
One thing im noticing is that the modern sports bikes are capable of masking rider deficiencies -basicly get you out of the cack you got yaself into

Wonko

5th July 2004, 18:50

Speaking as a learner rider, I went to an old 600 over an old 1000 or a higher performing 400, for a number of reasons.

I can ride two up
It's not to much power for me, even though it's beyond me to reach it's limits.
I'd rather move from a older less performing bike to a better perroming bike, than move between two bikes that are move evenly matched.

What?

5th July 2004, 19:10

I've only been riding for thirty-odd years, but one day I might actually be good enough to explore the power of my XR200. Meanwhile, it makes me look good :ride:

Quasievil

5th July 2004, 19:12

Two Smoker

5th July 2004, 19:18

from the short piece ive seen you riding hard, it looks like you know how too ride the 750SS pretty hard........

Quasievil

5th July 2004, 19:29

from the short piece ive seen you riding hard, it looks like you know how too ride the 750SS pretty hard........

I guess you refer to the Karangahape gorge the other weekend :rolleyes:
yeah I felt like a bit of a go ,doesnt happen often lol.
I would be interested to see you on a bigger more powerful bike :eek5:

Two Smoker

5th July 2004, 19:45

LOL, wont be happening for another 12months unless people keep "loaning" there bike too me hehehe....... I was getting more used to the power and handling after the second 600...... Didnt scare me as much when i red lined second and third lol....

Badcat

5th July 2004, 19:55

i have a bike that is PERFECT for my 20 years of road and off road experience.
.
.
.
.
my vanvan...
16hp and all the aggression of Benny the Ball from Top Cat.
now it's nearly run in - it's really getting a little snarl on.

ken

mangell6

5th July 2004, 21:04

"Why own a bike far beyond your abilities? "

Cos I can and I like to scare myself.

Would also like to own a trail bike and a 250/400 street bike to be able to "ride".

Sensei

5th July 2004, 21:45

Great topic to bring up . Have owned big HP bike's over the last 30 year's & have tryed to give them the best I have to offer .Only to be reminded that it still had alittle more up it's sleeve that I didn't know about .The more I tryed to find mine & the bike's limit's I learnt there was no need to do either . It's great to have HP but as some of the other's on here will know it take's real skill to beat a 600 cc bike with a good rider on it , even if your bike has double the power if it . "Less is more" It's taken me over 30Y's to learn this but we all most find out these thing's in our own time Sensei NP :yeah:

Zed

5th July 2004, 22:00

In saying that, Cycosis just gave me a thumping at Manfield riding, what I consider, an inferior machine. So maybe I can't ride for shit.Why do you consider his F4i inferior to your Gixxer? Have you riden his bike or compared dyno results or something?

Like you say dude, it's not always the machine that's inferior! :kick:

FROSTY

5th July 2004, 22:50

I could be blowing smoke but it seems to me that our NZ scratching roads actually seem to suit smaller more nimble bikes rather than out and out horsepower

White trash

6th July 2004, 07:55

Why do you consider his F4i inferior to your Gixxer? Have you riden his bike or compared dyno results or something?

Like you say dude, it's not always the machine that's inferior! :kick:

Because it's a Honda :kick: Of course it's inferior!

Nah! Just a bit softer is all. I will say the brakes are a hell of a lot better than the Suzukis and the midrange is stronger.

Cajun

6th July 2004, 10:00

Firefight

6th July 2004, 10:34

I am not a fast great rider, i brought a bike i could have fun on, throw around. I could have brought a 1000cc bike but i was not after a bike for speed, brought a nice little 600 which i have read also decided myself they are the most fun on the road. There are tons better than me on the road, my bike will out handle me to no end, but its also good having a bike there, that i know will out handle me, means i can keep trying and get better and better

Yeah good point Banana Man, speaking of rides, are you going to come to Rags for Lunch this wednesday ?, The Good Dr Quazz, myself and I think one other were hoping to meet in Hamilton and pop across to Ragalan for eats, are you up for it ??

Firefight

Cajun

6th July 2004, 12:32

Yep let me know more details, i need to go to plastics place, to look if they can do me a rear hugger, as well go look at visual plastics at the high screen for me bike as well

txt me

KATWYN

6th July 2004, 13:39

im more interested in hearing from those who cant ride ANYWHERE NEAR theirs bikes limit as to why they brought it?

Cos I worked hard and could afford the one I wanted. It happened to be
Yamaha 2001 YZFR6 at that time (3 years ago.)

Things change I may be on a scooter soon

Wenier

6th July 2004, 14:31

i want a 600 cus i feel it will best suit my ability and when im not going for it wont have to give it all jus to go how i want. Ive ridden mates SV650 and R6 and they dont scare me anymore after a couple of goes, of course i can wheelie their bikes and they still havent figured out how to yet :laugh:. Still i jus want a 600 to make me enjoy riding that much more.

DEATH_INC.

6th July 2004, 14:55

vifferman

6th July 2004, 15:03

I think with a lot(most won't own up to it)of guys it's an ego thing.Everyone(ok,nearly everyone)wants to own the meanest fastest beast out there,even if they never use it to it's potential.I can name a few guys that won't own anything smaller than a thou,and it's just because they can't bear the thought of owning a LITTLE 600/750.Yeah, I'll own up to it being at least partly an ego thing. But then there's other factors: I like Vs, and I think I'd find it a bit frustrating going down to a VFR400 or a VT250 or whatever.

jrandom

6th July 2004, 15:13

Yeah, I'll own up to it being at least partly an ego thing. But then there's other factors: I like Vs, and I think I'd find it a bit frustrating going down to a VFR400 or a VT250 or whatever.

I think Death was talking about the big inline 4s. Most of the litre twins make similar power to the 4-cyl six hundies.

In fact, I applaud the social bravery and obvious lack of inflated ego you display by riding such an outmoded, underpowered motorcycle. :bleh:

vifferman

6th July 2004, 15:49

I think Death was talking about the big inline 4s. Most of the litre twins make similar power to the 4-cyl six hundies.Indeed, but more easy-going, lazy torque. Better for saving front tyre wear.

In fact, I applaud the social bravery and obvious lack of inflated ego you display by riding such an outmoded, underpowered motorcycle. :bleh:You fogot to mention ugly.
And somewhat unreliable (for a Honda).
And thirsty.
And rattly (though nowhere near as loud as a Ducati dry clutch).
(Damn! I should have numbered this, so I could've made this a "Spanish Inquisition" style reply).
Your applause is somewhat misplaced, however. I must admit to feeling rather envious of the several owners of V-twin Suzuki TLs on KB, due to the extra power and noise they enjoy. I would have a 'better' bike, but for the fact that Mrs FS has proclaimed
"Nein! Dat es verboten!!" (or summat like that). :cry:

V Twin Raver

6th July 2004, 21:17

Cos I am a red blooded male that should know better but gets what he wants anyway.

I love that V-Twin growl. I would have a Ducati but had to compromise some of my other requirements in a bike, not excluding touring 2 up. The VTR is known as being a pretty forgiving bike so it certainly helped form a decision. I looked at making a step before the V-Twin but I knew I would only be looking for another update in six months so took the plunge. It speeds up the learning phase too.

But oh that noise. Same reason I like a high revving highly tuned 308 V8 and the bark of the 1995 Prodrive Subaru Impreza Group A Boxer engine with anti-lag. Something about all that screams MANLAND!!! Yes I have mentioned cages but damn, you gotta like that racket.

MadDuck

6th July 2004, 22:02

well in hindsight I was advised against going bigger than the VTR250 but I found that I needed the next step up, a new challenge. Forget a 1000 (cos apart from my height the power would be way tooo much) but a nimble lil 650 sounded the go.
We know the results of that decision. Ride a bike you are comfortable with at a speed you are comfortable with be it a 150, a nifty 50 or a VTR1000. At the end of the day who cares ? Stay safe and have fun KB caters for all :)

Paul in NZ

7th July 2004, 16:43

Lotsa people buy cars that are WAY beyond their ability to drive in the manner they were intended... Indeed... Some of these cars don't actually last very long IF driven in the manner people who buy them would like to think they are intended.. (erm I think)

Personally, I admire the restraint of people that own modern flash BIG bikes... I have very little restraint which is why I have no friends and have to hang out here)

I like to ride the nuts off my crappy old guzzi and thankfully. I can scare myself shitless at reasonable speeds... It's FUN!

I don't mind people having all the fruit but it is a bit daft watching people wobble about nervously with knee sliders, replica helmets, carbo wassit gloves and full leathers on a 160hp bike....

me? I look like a fat old git and always will... I choose random lines with no racing merit at all and have an utter ball at (mostly) legal speeds... The feel of the lovable old lump giving it's all is worth all the tea in china...

Same with the wee Triumph 650 twin, Oh lordy how that bike TRIES so darn HARD... It's HUGE fun to flog it over a twisty road. But not too hard or else...

;-)

Paul N

Rather be fast on a slow bike, too scared to ride fast on a fast bike... :eek5:

andy1

7th July 2004, 18:02

Just been riding a 450cc bike and the thing scares the shit out of me! :shit:
:2guns: sport bikes

Kwaka-Kid

7th July 2004, 21:38

they can't bear the thought of owning a LITTLE 600/750.THEN WHAT DOES THAT MAKE MY 400?!

and i think this question goes far deeper then many intially consider... I own my 400 for exactly the reason of wanting to master it! And to be perfectly honest i know ive got a good 5 years at least ahead of me on it! Ive test ridden 600's/ an older gsxr750, the old gs1000 and other numerous things... and have to say that they are all fun but man my 400 is just as much if not more!

anyway i will say people have bikes for all sorts of reasons - someone might want an R1 just because they need it to do wheelies or something (not enough skill to pull up a 400 or something) and or someone might own one as they love to travel @ an average of 200kmph - my 400 engine would blow if it was ridden at that for more then 10mins or something i bet.

There are so many reasons, i own my 750turbo(with daddy course) just because i wanted in on an old bike that i wanted to fix up! and just to feel that boost... its great, i sure as hell couldnt be a master of it though.

hmmm... so many ideas/thoughts cant get em all down though. My own reasons for the 400 are because a race one came cheap - i then wanted a street one to build skills on and get more feel for the 400 on the street etc, if it wasnt for that then shit id b happy having a ball on a RG150 like TS is! but oh well, things happen, deals turn up, and i wind up with a bike bigger then i can manage properly for the time being.

Also - where do you draw the line at having the ability to ride a bike well? my line is wayyyyy down that line - i would say when i can finish in the top 5 of F3 on my stock/sub-stock racebike i know how to ride it well-but ask any racer-thats not going to happen :P-least not in the forseeable furture!

8th July 2004, 05:41

I chose the bike I wanted as opposed to the bike I could of had, for the money I paid for the Ducati I could have brought a new SV1000 or Firestorm
it wasnt so much about the power it was more about the fact Ive always wanted a Ducati, now I have one. I know that obviously the Ducati isnt any where near the fastest bike around, But it handles really well and its SO MUCH fun to ride, I love it.
Next Bike will be a 748 or a 996 then I will have some serious grunt at my disposal but I will be able to handle it first ,thats for sure

Pretty much sums up why I ride Ducs. I have never really ridden any of my bikes to their limits, or anywhere near it.

And MadDuck: your quote "Ride a bike you are comfortable with at a speed you are comfortable with be it a 150, a nifty 50 or a VTR1000" is pretty much how I feel too.

DEATH_INC.

8th July 2004, 07:04

Yeh,I know what you mean KK,I just listed what I consider the main reason....
I too can think of many reasons not to own a bike bike,but I can think of just as many in favour..... :wacko:
BTW,I'm always getting in trouble for calling Draco's bike a 'little 400' so we won't even go there.....

Big Dog

8th July 2004, 16:50

I could be blowing smoke but it seems to me that our NZ scratching roads actually seem to suit smaller more nimble bikes rather than out and out horsepower
Thats for real! The motorways are the only place the big bikes have a distinguishable advantage, and who wants to ride those all day?

Coldkiwi

8th July 2004, 17:23

One thing im noticing is that the modern sports bikes are capable of masking rider deficiencies -basicly get you out of the cack you got yaself into

...which is a great reason to have one! I've noticed how much more forgiving my newer gsxr is than my 97 Zx6R was. Its certainly more noticable when you are pushing it on the track but its also the times that you get caught out on a blind corner that tightens or when you need to swing the bike over in a hurry to avoid something that the extra ability of a bike beyond your normal use can really be worth having.

I often wonder how many cruiser accidents could be avoided through up speced brakes/suspension/chassis that would let the rider get around the hazard. Any thoughts on that one?

DEATH_INC.

8th July 2004, 17:33

I often wonder how many cruiser accidents could be avoided through up speced brakes/suspension/chassis that would let the rider get around the hazard. Any thoughts on that one?
Yeh,ground clearance is the killer here,I know a guy with a Hardley that hits the clutchcase on the ground all the time.....And when I had the old sabre i always usta drag the pegs round corners....wonder what would happen if you had to tighten up the turn then???

Motu

8th July 2004, 17:33

I often wonder how many cruiser accidents could be avoided through up speced brakes/suspension/chassis that would let the rider get around the hazard. Any thoughts on that one?

Ground clearance is the issue,they get down to the cases and jack the rear wheel off the ground - yeah,some good MX suspn would cure all cruiser ills.

aff-man

8th July 2004, 17:41

hmmm i am about to sit my full (could have 2 weeks ago gotta get off my ass) and will need to upgrade. I have always thought that a 400 would pefectly satisfy my every need because they were nimble with a short wheelbase(due to me only wieghing about 60 and a little under 6 foot). But as to the ability of the bike i know i will never get to the very limit of a 1000 or possibly even a 600, but i really want to be able to over take without having to change up 2 or 3 gears. As was previously stated it might not be used but it's nice to know you have the power and handeling abilities of bigger bikes(the zxr gets awfully loose when pushed to the limit). Just my little 2c worth

FzerozeroT

8th July 2004, 17:50

Ground clearance is the issue

ground clearance is the issue with anything if you fang it hard enough, I got rearsets to solve tha and now the stand drags on the left and the fairing on the right.

I could be blowing smoke but it seems to me that our NZ scratching roads actually seem to suit smaller more nimble bikes rather than out and out horsepower

Unfortunately as TS will know, some of the smallest smaller bikes are set up for 45kg asians on ludicrously smooth tarmac, which makes them jump and bottom out like wild bulls on mid-corner ripples. Which is probably another reason to move to a 250 oil burner.

Marknz

8th July 2004, 17:53

I don't mind people having all the fruit but it is a bit daft watching people wobble about nervously with knee sliders, replica helmets, carbo wassit gloves and full leathers on a 160hp bike....

I'll take a bite here 'cause that "may" well be me that Paul is referring to... yea for sure I was lucky enough to own one of the most powerful 1 litre bikes out there for a couple of months, and yes I do happen to have all the gear as result of me spending the last 2 years racing in Aussie.

But I was always just trying to learn to ride the Gixxer before I had to sell it. I found it nowhere near as comfortable or easy to ride as my Firestorm... but then I didn't really expect that. It's an out and out sports bike after all. That said, after 2 months on the Firestorm I could have gotten over the 'taka's a helluver lot quicker on the that than after two months on the Gixxer.

So why did I buy it? 'Cause I could! I'd spent 12 months on the 'Storm and while I can't say I rode it to it's absolute limits, I was pretty bloody good on it and their are some supposed sports bike riders in Aussie who have been embarrased by it both on the road and the track. But I bought the Gixxer 'cause I wanted to know what they were like and if I could handle them. I'm man enough to stand up and say that, despite the fact I had to sell it, I probably would have gotten rid of it sooner or later as it was just far too much of a bike for me.

DEATH_INC.

8th July 2004, 17:55

unfortunately as TS will know, some of the smallest smaller bikes are set up for 45kg asians on ludicrously smooth tarmac, which makes them jump and bottom out like wild bulls on mid-corner ripples. Which is probably another reason to move to a 250 oil burner.
Yeh,that's the other major issue,the small (sub 500)bikes are generally physically smaller....

FzerozeroT

8th July 2004, 18:12

Yeh,that's the other major issue,the small (sub 500)bikes are generally physically smaller....

with the exception of suzuki's 'new' GSX250, that thing is HUUUUGE. i suppose they've got to use all those leftover GSXR750 fairings from the 80's somewhere

What?

8th July 2004, 19:07

... I own my 400 for exactly the reason of wanting to master it! And to be perfectly honest i know ive got a good 5 years at least ahead of me on it! Ive test ridden 600's/ an older gsxr750, the old gs1000 and other numerous things... and have to say that they are all fun but man my 400 is just as much if not more!
Anyone doubting the abilities of a 400, go for a ride with Digsaw...

Mooch

8th July 2004, 19:24

Why own a bike far beyond your abilities?

Coss people got sick of me drooling over their nice bikes.

NordieBoy

8th July 2004, 19:37

I could be blowing smoke but it seems to me that our NZ scratching roads actually seem to suit smaller more nimble bikes rather than out and out horsepower

Sounds like you need to have a go on a motard mate :D

Kwaka-Kid

8th July 2004, 20:18

whos digsaw?

Bob

8th July 2004, 22:24

Is my SV "a bike beyond my abilities"? I don't know - but I don't use its full potential (or close to it) much of the time (got 'chicken strips' in place, but then I work hard on my positioning etc, so I don't need to get it really leaned over that much).

But back to the question - I reckon if your bike can do more than you, then in that hopefully ever so rare occasion when you're asked to push yourself harder than ever before, the bike will be able to cope with the demands suddenly thrown at it. If your bike is pushed to its limits and then you need a little more... it isn't going to be there to use!

But that is just my thoughts... of course, it'd be interesting to see what Rossi thinks on this point!

Joni

9th July 2004, 07:41

Was talking to a friend of mine yesterday - he lives in the states - he was saying that you would battle to find a bike smaller than a 500 in the US.

Now I am thinking whaaaatttt??
You want to learn to ride, so you buy a lets say an R6 - looking for trouble I think!!!!

wkid_one

9th July 2004, 07:52

Meh - when I bought the VTR it was WELL beyond my abilities (and I mean well) - yet it gave me heaps of room to improve.

I believe you buy a bike beyond your abilities for one reason: I would rather be riding a bike at 60% of its capabilities, the riding one at 110% of its capabilities - why, it is safer. Having a bike beyond your skills provides a safety buffer as the bike can more than handle how you ride.

Everyone assumes because the latest bikes have 150+ that they are dangerous - which is crap - the RIDER is dangerous, not the bike (unless it is a piece of engineering crap with defects).

My argument is more like - why would you bother buying a modern thou (eg: 180hp R1) for the road? You are never going to use the bikes potential on NZ roads? Why spend $24k on a bike, where say a $16500 CBR600RR will more than perform on NZ roads?

This is a more valid question in my mind

Joni

9th July 2004, 08:07

"My argument is more like - why would you bother buying a modern thou (eg: 180hp R1) for the road? You are never going to use the bikes potential on NZ roads? Why spend $24k on a bike, where say a $16500 CBR600RR will more than perform on NZ roads?"

I agree with that as well!!

DEATH_INC.

9th July 2004, 14:06

I don't.I used every bit of power the ZX12 had on the road,never found it excessive.Only the handling let it down,which the new thou's have sorted.

Two Smoker

9th July 2004, 15:10

I don't.I used every bit of power the ZX12 had on the road,never found it excessive.Only the handling let it down,which the new thou's have sorted.This coming from a guy that owns a bike with over 200+hp LOL......

But yeah FzerozeroT, i know what you mean, for one thing it jumps around alot mid corner (especially on jennian :wacko: ) and the pegs are a problem on my bike too..... where did you get your rearsets from??? But i agree to a certain point about having a bike where you are using it at 60% of its capabilities and on the freak situations have plenty of reserve to get out of trouble, where on the RG where im pushing it past its limits, im screwed.....

Big Dog

9th July 2004, 15:40

My argument is more like - why would you bother buying a modern thou (eg: 180hp R1) for the road? You are never going to use the bikes potential on NZ roads? Why spend $24k on a bike, where say a $16500 CBR600RR will more than perform on NZ roads?

This is a more valid question in my mind
Why buy A 32" plasma when a 32"crt will do the same job?
Same question. Same answer. Because you want to and you can.

Do I want a ZX10? Hell Yeah!
Can I afford one? (No, but thats not the point)
If I could would I shell out or save the money and get a 636? Hell Yeah!

Would I be any faster on the thou on nz roads? NO!
Would I be any faster on the track? Dunno, I don't race.
Would there be any benifit other than bragging rights? Yes because:
* It is actually possible for me to get on without putting my head over the tripple clamp.
* I would be less exhasted by a long w/e ride ergo be able to ride for longer.
* The ratio of my mass to the thous mass is actually less than 1:1 when in full gear. (meaning braking is less hairy)

But ultimately someone elses old signature line best describes what I would get out of it (sorry don't remember author): "You can't reason a man out of what he wasn't reasoned into in the first place"

Vehicle purchase is 75% an emotional decision. Don't beleive me, ask your self two questions,
1) have I ever gone out to look for a car / bike and come home with something else?
2) Have I ever bought a new vehicle without actually going out looking for one?

I have on both counts.
People are constantly asking themselves how they would feel about their car. Smart manufacturers play on this, eg a TLR feels fast stationary, harleys market a lifestyle not a machine etc.

The other 25% are your deal breakers.
Can I get on / in it?
Can I get insurance for it for less than the purchase price per annum?
Can it tow the horse float?
Is it a really wrong color? (I'm in no hurry to get that ZX10 in hot pink, in fact my available funds for such a purchase would be about half!)
Will the wife leave me for this? (could be an incentive or disincentive)
Will I pick up more / better chicks?
Will other bikers laugh at me. (if you have to ask the answer is yes!)

Big Dog

9th July 2004, 15:43

But i agree to a certain point about having a bike where you are using it at 60% of its capabilities and on the freak situations have plenty of reserve to get out of trouble, where on the RG where im pushing it past its limits, im screwed.....
Ditto, I kinda like the feeling when your tipped in so far the blobs get shorter, but hate when this is the only way to get around a corner.

Kwaka-Kid

9th July 2004, 15:59

two smoker - thought could be improved with suspension, what prolly also happening is that ur suspension is so soft (street litle 150) that with the force around abend it bottoms out - my vfr's old soft setup was a classic example, and i bet the 150 is worse, putting you so much closer to the ground etc that the pegs scrape way to easy. I also suggest maknig rearset plates, go get a bit of 10mm thick alloy plate and cut out a shape, relocate the current rearsets 1inch up and 1inch back.
whats wrong with dragging pegs anyway? they have little kicker mechanisms in them and everything, they are yet another RP for how far over you go, a changing RP at that as they get ground more and more! hehe./

Big Dog

9th July 2004, 16:51

whats wrong with dragging pegs anyway? they have little kicker mechanisms in them and everything, they are yet another RP for how far over you go, a changing RP at that as they get ground more and more! hehe./
Cos that's the guide for when if it has to get any tighter your F&*%ed

DEATH_INC.

9th July 2004, 17:15

Cos that's the guide for when if it has to get any tighter your F&*%ed
Yep that was the prob with the 12,once bits start scraping (not actaully the pegs in this case)you don't lean any further.....

Kwaka-Kid

9th July 2004, 17:46

Yep that was the prob with the 12,once bits start scraping (not actaully the pegs in this case)you don't lean any further.....
i dont actually agree with many bikes, on my VFR the stock pegs are quite long, you just pull in your foot and crank it some more... then you just lift your foot off the peg and keep it cranking! my vfr loved it and despite it soft as feck suspension did it all so well, damn well enjoyed it, plus it just hearing those pegs scraping makes me feel good! - got a thing about hearing scraping metal in corners.

Two Smoker

9th July 2004, 17:50

i dont actually agree with many bikes, on my VFR the stock pegs are quite long, you just pull in your foot and crank it some more... then you just lift your foot off the peg and keep it cranking! my vfr loved it and despite it soft as feck suspension did it all so well, damn well enjoyed it, plus it just hearing those pegs scraping makes me feel good! - got a thing about hearing scraping metal in corners.
LOL, ive got a thing about scraping plastic, and leathers.... and the leathers are beside the bike, not on it :wacko: not i good thing i think...... Yeah im thinking about putting in a spacer on the rear shock, otherwise its the custom rearsets......... Ill bring it over sometime so we can have a good geez at it :niceone:

Kwaka-Kid

9th July 2004, 19:04

LOL, ive got a thing about scraping plastic, and leathers.... and the leathers are beside the bike, not on it :wacko: not i good thing i think...... Yeah im thinking about putting in a spacer on the rear shock, otherwise its the custom rearsets......... Ill bring it over sometime so we can have a good geez at it :niceone:
yeah, not Custom rearsets as such (VERY costly, ones on my racebike have RRP of around $400).. but just some jackup plates - even they cost $100 odd to buy for my bike! im hopefully gonna get some red anadised jackups for my street NC30, if i beat Gary @ the next race meeting.. :2guns: doubtful :( and the $60 he won off me last time :( :bash:

FROSTY

9th July 2004, 19:38

Holey cow -new rearsets better exhaust and new leathers--you wont know yaself KK

Kwaka-Kid

9th July 2004, 22:58

yeah tell me about it! howd u know i been weighing up a new exhaust? or are u talking about my street chopped Vance and Hynes system? That i still need to put back on the GS1000 soon, or the Carbon fibre muffler im getting putman to re-make and end for, the ill repack and cut to optimal size for my Viffer.

Zed

10th July 2004, 08:16

I know even some of the experienced/fast/talented riders on here dont think they ride their bike to it limits, but im more interested in hearing from those who cant ride ANYWHERE NEAR theirs bikes limit as to why they brought it?

People like me who have mimimal years riding/miles under their belt yet like to ride some big ol nasty machine that only the seasoned race vetran can ride how its supposed to be ridden.

Im guessing some of it is ego, i know i like that fact i own one of the fastest bikes out there, but with that comes the shame of not even being able to pull a wheelie, or not being able to keep up with some dude on a 400!

Some of it may be future proofing - buy a fast bike now so you wont lose money upgrading in a the future.

whateva ur excuse is lets hear it - or am i the only fool in here? :o

Funky Fly
Personally, I worked my way up from a 100cc to a 250cc - 750cc - 900cc down to a 600cc...and I realised that for me the 600cc is my niche size bike having everything I need & more, the previous 3 bikes I've owned all being 600cc.

You sound like the best case scenario in here Mr Funkfly!

Why exactly did you go out and buy a GSXR1000 with minimal riding experience?

Why do you call yourself a fool? :thud:

Zed

FzerozeroT

10th July 2004, 08:16

TS - F1 engineering in Hamilton made my rearsets, KK's price is a good guide (starting point!) but they are very nice to use. The originalpegs are designed for the point at which the original tyres let go, with the higher pegs and stickier tyres you end up feelng like one of those guys in a G-force machine :D

I had a ride on an NSR yesterday and it was crap, you need to turn the tiller a lot into corners and so it really makes you work it, I think it's probably the tyres. Mate with a RGV racebike had a quick go on the KR and was impressed with how easy it is to ride.

What?

10th July 2004, 18:58

whos digsaw?
Kb'er lives in Thames. Rides a CBR400.

RiderInBlack

10th July 2004, 20:29

Cann't be fart assed reading the rest of this thread, but I'll give you MY excauses for the Heavy Hamster (AKA the CBR1000F).

Touring: The 1000 copes better with the kitchen sink type packing I tend to do when going on those long trips. In say this the little GSXR250 did handle having an 80L backpack, tent and bed roll strapped to it (and still made the 160KPH mark), but it was not good for it in the long ran.
Two-up: Although the GSXR250 could (and had) take Two-up, it is not recommended. The VFR750 coped quite well with light to medium pillions, but was never happy with the medium+. The Heavy Hamster on the other hand could not give a fu*k unless the pillion is >120Kg, and then I would probably be quite happy for them not being sitting behind me. We (happily) leave those for the HD riders:msn-wink:
Power: Yes, I have fallen in to the power trap, but at the end of the day I'm quite aware that a smaller bike set-up for racing (with the right rider) is always going to bet me around the Puke:finger:
At the end of the day you might as well ask us "why did you buy a bike, is it because you like taking more risks?"

hondav2

11th July 2004, 21:42

Your better off to have it, than allways wanting it and you havnt got it. Cheers Toddy

dreamride

12th July 2004, 08:33

I think it is true, good to have the power when one needs it or if one needs it. No need need to ride it to the limits all the time. Good way to better one's skills as well, I guess :cool:

avgas

18th November 2004, 00:54

live fast, die hard
leave a road side cross.

Kerosene Cowboy will avenge your death!

rodgerd

18th November 2004, 06:05

with the exception of suzuki's 'new' GSX250, that thing is HUUUUGE. i suppose they've got to use all those leftover GSXR750 fairings from the 80's somewhere About the same size as a Bandit or an Across. There's a few 250s built on 400 frames out there.

Bonez

18th November 2004, 06:50

This is a good thread. I guess it realy comes down to choice. If we didn't have the variaty the industry would be so boring. Each rider has there own reasons for the bike they choose to ride. There's sometrhing out there for every rider. I decided quite a while back around 750cc is plenty for me. Others cast offs seem to be magnetly attracted to the garage for some strange reason. :eek: Absolutely love trashing the old '76 CB550F around the country side. It'll cruise along quite happily at 110-120kmph all day. The roads are certainly better than they where. As I think Motu has stated there's something about riding an old clunker of cikle about in ones own little world. :shifty:

Madmax

18th November 2004, 10:03

live fast, die hard
leave a road side cross.

Kerosene Cowboy will avenge your death!

dont start about those bloody crosses :brick:

I like my ZX10R
its like a bloody addictive drug
its small feel is deceptive though,
you learn the meaning of throttle control real quik
try opening it up in first on a motorway onramp
its like pulling the pin on a hand grenade
Fun Insane and Addictive :eek5:

18th November 2004, 10:29

I'd love to get on a 1000cc bike a ride it to it's limits, but I don't think that would ever happen... Maybe on a 600cc though :innocent:

Joni

18th November 2004, 14:06

I'd love to get on a 1000cc bike a ride it to it's limits, but I don't think that would ever happen... Maybe on a 600cc though :innocent:

If I can open up a 1000 and handle it.... so can you.... :spudbooge

Sniper

18th November 2004, 14:10

I would like to take a R6, R1 or a triumph daytona for a ride and take it to the limit, just so that I can say I did when people ask.

vifferman

18th November 2004, 14:18

Why, you ask? Why?!?

Because I can. (Actually, I have a vague suspicion that's what I said last time I replied to this....)

OK.
Try this then:
Because my wife made me buy it.

Do I use all the abilities of my PC? - No.
All of its software's features? - No.
Do I drive the car flat out like a moonshiner running from the Feds? - No.
Do I eat all the food in the fridge everytime I'm hungry? - No.
Do I utilise all of my considerable intellect every time I get sucked into answering inane questions like this? :spudwhat:

Sniper

18th November 2004, 14:25

Motu

18th November 2004, 14:36

I'd say my XS1 was far beyond the abilities of anyone on this board,to extract the max out of this bike takes big balls.

SPORK

18th November 2004, 14:55

Hey FS;

What exactly is a LuxoSport? I have not heard of them... :spudwhat:

vifferman

18th November 2004, 15:04

Hey FS;

What exactly is a LuxoSport? I have not heard of them... :spudwhat:It's that blue thingie in my avatar.
2001 VFR800.

While I don't believe in names, for some reason all my bikes have taken on their own persona when Ive been on a forum for long, apart from the VF500.
The VFR750 was variously SluttyFartBlast, FartySlutFeast, FartySlutBeast, etc.; the VTR1000 was FahrtSturm, and now the VFR800 is the LuxoSport (but only in my profile thingo - it doesn't quite feel right, but I don't have a better monicker yet...)

SPORK

18th November 2004, 15:08

Sheesh! You sure love your VF/R's! It looks very nice, onya!

almonster

18th November 2004, 16:49

for me i would rather push my limits not the bikes its safer

Coyote

18th November 2004, 18:04

Try riding a 1995 KX80 with only a years experience. I shouldn't of been riding that thing, let alone racing it, for at least 2 more years. It was damn good fun though learning to ride on it.

18th November 2004, 18:34

If I can open up a 1000 and handle it.... so can you.... :spudbooge
You have been around motorbikes WAY longer than I have.. and you have raced on the track etc... :yes:

*bows down to you*

Joni

18th November 2004, 18:36

You have been around motorbikes WAY longer than I have.. and you have raced on the track etc... :yes:

*bows down to you*

Whats that a weetbix as well?

Oh and I get your point... :spudwave:

jase

18th November 2004, 19:10

I'm a big guy so I brought a big bike, and I liked the colour. :2thumbsup

Motu

18th November 2004, 19:19

I'm a big guy so I brought a big bike, and I liked the colour. :2thumbsup

I'm a little guy,so I bought a big bike....got a mustache too cause it gives me the look of authority....got the missus to sew some red stripes down the sides of my jeans too.I need all the help I can get.

SPORK

18th November 2004, 19:42

Nice avatar NC30! :D D-Unit!

Joni

18th November 2004, 19:44

Nice avatar NC30! :D D-Unit!

I still think it looks that that other weetbix....

SPORK

18th November 2004, 19:50

You mean Wenier's avatar? Yeah, it's just Domokun

Joni

18th November 2004, 19:54

You mean Wenier's avatar? Yeah, it's just Domokun

OK so explain to this foreigner what is a Domokun??

:wacko:

SPORK

18th November 2004, 19:57

Domokun = Proper Noun. Domokun is a Japanese plush doll and anime thingy that is too cool for school. Just google image search him up

That Guy

18th November 2004, 20:00

It's that blue thingie in my avatar.
2001 VFR800.

While I don't believe in names, for some reason all my bikes have taken on their own persona when Ive been on a forum for long, apart from the VF500.
The VFR750 was variously SluttyFartBlast, FartySlutFeast, FartySlutBeast, etc.; the VTR1000 was FahrtSturm, and now the VFR800 is the LuxoSport (but only in my profile thingo - it doesn't quite feel right, but I don't have a better monicker yet...)

Clearly we are going to have to offer some help with a suitable name.

LuxoSport. Kind of hints at Laxative. Laxative for the brain perhaps? LaxoBrain? Not sure where I'm going here.....
SluttyFartBlast + FahrtSturm + LuxoSport =......
SluttyLaxoLuxo?
LaxoFahrtFeast?
BeastyLaxyFahrt?
FarhtyLaxoSturm?
SportyFahrtLux?

vifferman

19th November 2004, 13:54

Sheesh! You sure love your VF/R's! It looks very nice, onya!Thanx. Yes, I do love Vs (three V4s and a V2), but also like triples, so I considered a Triumph ST.

Clearly we are going to have to offer some help with a suitable name.

LuxoSport. Kind of hints at Laxative. Laxative for the brain perhaps? LaxoBrain? Not sure where I'm going here.....
SluttyFartBlast + FahrtSturm + LuxoSport =......
SluttyLaxoLuxo?
LaxoFahrtFeast?
BeastyLaxyFahrt?
FarhtyLaxoSturm?
SportyFahrtLux?
Thanx for the suggestions. I think... :blank:
Two Wheels once said that 'VFR' stood for "Very Fine Roadbike", but that's a bit lame.

It really howls when on the gas (hence the "Howling Banshee"), but yesterday I (unkindly) noted that when cruising the engine sounded like a cakemixer...

I dunno... maybe it doesn't have enough character to have a real name. Perhaps I should ride it for a week sans spud and see how the character develops :sly:

2_SL0

20th November 2004, 07:46

I found myself in this position earlier than expected. So I sat down with myself and we discussed. We came to the conclusion me + R6 = :gob: .
Im presently purchasing Fz6 which will parked in the garage for a short time until Im confident to hop on. As I have said before I loved the idea of a very fast lean mean machine, but as someone else stated. "Look at the guy with all the leathers and rep helmet and knee sliders, and some grandma has just past him on a wheel chair." The Fz6 six I can sit back on and cruise and noone will blink.
Then when I want to give it some stick, well hehehehe. Butthe answer for me is Im well aware of my ability and the style in which I ride and I decided against a R6 at THIS point in time. Maybe in a few years I will have a FZ6 for those slower cruiser days and a R6 for the more faster days. Theres no rush I have plenty of time.

zooter

22nd November 2004, 00:54

My gsx1100g was in the shop for servicing and they loaned me a gn250, still had a blast on it.
I missed the torque of my g monster but the Kawarau gorge was just as much fun.

scumdog

22nd November 2004, 01:06