Turbochargers?

[craigs288]

Does anyone on this website have a turbocharged bike?
If so, did they buy it ready to go, or put it together themselves?

What I am after is hopefully someone is a bit of a know-it-all ( or at least know-something).
I'm hoping if I post as many details about my turbo, i.e. A/R numbers, inlet and outlet diameters, maybe even a digital photo, that someone will be able to give me an idea of airflow/horsepower potential.

Anyone?

[Deano]

Does anyone on this website have a turbocharged bike?
If so, did they buy it ready to go, or put it together themselves?

What I am after is hopefully someone is a bit of a know-it-all ( or at least know-something).
I'm hoping if I post as many details about my turbo, i.e. A/R numbers, inlet and outlet diameters, maybe even a digital photo, that someone will be able to give me an idea of airflow/horsepower potential.

Anyone?

Send Fizzerman a PM - he is pretty keen on turboing one of his bikes, and seems to know a fair bit about it.

[crazybigal]

turbo charging bikes is a real bitch ive been told. Supercharging is the way to go.

[sAsLEX]

Death has a turbo.......spends most its life in his gargre though



The FSAE used a supercharged R6 engine this year in their vehicle, so supercharging is a viable alt for bikes.

[R6_kid]

the FSAE supercharger cost them around $5k, then they had to engineer the extension to the driveshaft to power it.

However, the supercharger has no lag whereas a turbo on a bike might be too large and have lots of lag, or spin up too fast and wear our very quickly (or reach full boost way before your redline).

In principle it is easy to do...not so easy when you go to do it!

[craigs288]

I've got a SC14 in the shed, destined(?) maybe for my 4 litre falcon, but I had been eyeing it up for the bike.
But there is nowhere really to put it. It doesn't quite fit in front of the engine and it doesn't quite fit behind it, even with the carbs and airbox out of the way. The frame is too narrow and I would need a tricky pulley setup off the altenator as its the only convenient direct drive from the motor.
Could drive it off the drive sprocket, but that would give a boost increase with each upshift.
I'll PM Fizzerman and see what he has got to say about things. Cheers.

[R6_kid]

Also check for superbike magazine from the UK, not sure if they have a website (im sure they do) but they had a couple of articles on a company in england that does bolt on supercharger kits i think. One of the bikes may have been a 1200 suzuki but dont take my word for it. Just remember a Z1000 that was pushing 200 and a bit on a baseline charger kit.



Could drive it off the drive sprocket, but that would give a boost increase with each upshift.

if that worked it would be rather interesting to ride!!!

[JeremyW]

Our supercharger (FSAE) was probably one of the best decisions we ever made. It has turned the high revving R6 powerhouse into a angry torque monster. While breathing through a 20mm restictor we are making more torque at idle (3000rpm, 69Nm) than the standard R6 engine was making at full noise.

So I can only imagin what would happen if you were to put it onto a more tourqey motor...

In saying that I think bolting on a supercharger is a lot more work and engineering than a turbo. But if your serious I think it would be a pretty good option. You are welcome to come and check out our setup if you are interested. Just PM me. Engine is in bits at the moment but Im sure our engine guys can talk you through it.

An bigups to the R6 engine... how bout 12.4:1 compression and 12.5psi boost sound? And not a hint of knock anywhere :shit:

[craigs288]

I went to google and typed "gsxr100 turbo".

Seems there are a few guys in sweden with nothing better to do than turbo a few of these old monsters. Most are blow throught carb setups and look very do-able.

[Wenier]

For your size engine you'd want a garrett GT30R or GT35R. Or a turbo that is equivalent to that one. There are guys doing things for GSXRs and being your bike is a GS it might give ya some ideas.

Here is there site http://turbobikeresearch.com/index.php?&

Also R6 Kid if a turbo is setup right it can be almost as good as a supercharger off the line and has better top end. And not having it mechanically connected gives some advantages as well. Getting full boost before the redline is also what you want otherwise you are not utilising what airflow the turbo can give you over your rev range to get the extra power.

[Wenier]

Also with this new injection tuning thing the motorbike shop has in chch if a shop near you has it you might not need the computer, as they could remap your one.

[DEATH_INC.]

There is so much bs on this subject I'm a bit reluctant to give advice on the forum, but if yer real keen (turbo's work fine) pm me and I'll give ya my ph no. so we can discuss it properly.

[iwilde]

Check this out
http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/Motorbikes/Parts-accessories/Performance/auction-75177866.htm

[scumdog]

I've a turbo bike - a Suzuki XN85 factory job, it's injected, not carb'd.

Also seen a supercharged V-Max in Dunedin a couple of years ago , it seemed a natural for it but don't know the details.

[classic zed]

The turbo turned up today for the new Z1300 project. Its a custom made IHI VF24 as used on the Subaru's, Ball bearings on the shaft, back cut steel turbines to help them spool up quicker.

I am putting it behind the engine so that I can run the two, three into one headers down under the engine, then join both headers into one before coming up behind the engine and into the turbo. I have to make a custom inlet manifold for the fuel injection so that everything matches up.

Turbo is good for about 240bhp so Im told and uses mimimal oil from the engine to feed the bearings.

As you can see its still in the mock up stage.

should be fun:rockon:

[scumdog]

The turbo turned up today for the new Z1300 project. Its a custom made IHI VF24 as used on the Subaru's, Ball bearings on the shaft, back cut steel turbines to help them spool up quicker.

I am putting it behind the engine so that I can run the two, three into one headers down under the engine, then join both headers into one before coming up behind the engine and into the turbo. I have to make a custom inlet manifold for the fuel injection so that everything matches up.

Turbo is good for about 240bhp so Im told and uses mimimal oil from the engine to feed the bearings.

As you can see its still in the mock up stage.

should be fun:rockon:


Very much like the XN85 set-up, looking good:Punk:

[Jonny Rotten]

I went to google and typed "gsxr100 turbo".

Seems there are a few guys in sweden with nothing better to do than turbo a few of these old monsters. Most are blow throught carb setups and look very do-able.


there is/was a turbo kit for a gixxer thou on trade me

[Wenier]

When they say it good for 240hp that usually refers to the amount of horsepower produced when running 1bar of boost. But yea who knows depends what they meant when they said it

[craigs288]

That Z1300 looks like a serious piece of work.
If I had a smaller turbo I would consider positioning it in the same place, but the only place where mine will fit onto my bike is in front of the engine, as low as possible (without hitting the ground on corners). Probably will have to avoid the steeper speed humps that are around. And not ride off curbs, when I am stuck behind cars trying to pull out of Waterview BP during evening rush hour. The dents in my headers are currently hidden by header tape.
My brother says I come from the land of no mechanical sympathy. I say 'fuck it', toys are there to be played with.
Hopefully some photo's will attach themselves to this thread. If not, they should appear soon after.

[craigs288]

Here goes.

The compressor housing has M12 stamped on it (not sure what that refers to) and also A/R .50 The total outside diameter is about 180mm (not including the short length of outlet pipe).
I know the compressor A/R obviously affects the shape of the airflow graph and the efficiency of the compressor.
The ID plate speaks for itself.
The inside diameter of the compressor housing inlet is 66mm. The inside diameter of the compressor housing outlet is 44mm.

The compressor wheel has an outside diameter of 76mm at the base, and 50.5mm at the tips of the blades.

The exhaust housing has A/R .63 stamped onto it and the total outside diameter is about 120mm.
The inside diameter of the inlet is rectangular and approx. 57x45mm. The outlet is 58mm. And the outside diameter of the exhaust wheel is 57mm.
Obviously about 1mm of clearance between the housing and wheel.

I haven't tried to measure the clearance between the compressor wheel and housing, but I don't intend to have it machined bigger to soften the blow when the boost comes on, so it's pretty irrelevant.

So. If there is anyone who can give an estimate of what the turbo might be capable of (airflow/hp), I am all ears. Bearing in mind that I am not after any specific output at any specific revs.
I am more than certain it will give the 50 - 100% torque increase that I am after. Most likely somewhere above 4000rpm.

[craigs288]

Here are some photos of the bearing and comp/exhaust wheels

[Edbear]

should be fun:rockon:



Just nobody tell the Missus! - Yet!:shutup: :shutup:

[Ham]

.63 a/r is usually good on a 2.5 litre motor so it might be a little "laggy"

[RM125king]

.63 will be fine on that motor. i use to run 1.44 on my rotary. hahaha. thing lagged hard until 6k then just spun the wheels in every gear. the only problem i found with the turbo thing was the ecu. there is a crowd in aus that do bike turbo ecu's. you need to find one that has a MAP sensor so you can read the boost pressure at any one time and inject the right amount fuel. you could also get away with using two power commanders one for of boost and switch to the other for when you are on boost.

[classic zed]

Another idea I am working on is some sort of boost control attached to a tilt sensor, I dont want it boosting when my knee is on the ground in a corner. Therefore cutting the boost at anything over 10 degrees lean should sort that problem. Coming out of the corner and onto the straight and she should boost like a dream.:scooter:

[EZAS]

Whats up with Turbo'ing carby's.

My only expierence with turbo's has been with my EFI rotary engine. I have no idea on how a carby turbo would work or how you would tune your Air/Fuel ratio's without an aftermarket ECU. Carby's don't have no ECU's so I have no idea on how to tune a carby (pathetic eh?)

So my basic question is, after making up an exhaust manifold and mounting up the turbo, how does it run through the carby's and how do you tune it?

[Dai]

Whats up with Turbo'ing carby's.

My only expierence with turbo's has been with my EFI rotary engine. I have no idea on how a carby turbo would work or how you would tune your Air/Fuel ratio's without an aftermarket ECU. Carby's don't have no ECU's so I have no idea on how to tune a carby (pathetic eh?)

So my basic question is, after making up an exhaust manifold and mounting up the turbo, how does it run through the carby's and how do you tune it?

Correct ma if I am wrong but I was always under the impression that turbos worked through the exhaust not the carbs. Superchargers worked through the carbs.

[imdying]

Correct ma if I am wrong but I was always under the impression that turbos worked through the exhaust not the carbs. Superchargers worked through the carbs.Yep, you're wrong :lol: It's called a blow through setup. Superchargers can also have their carb before or after. Problem is, the carb doesn't generally like to get pressurized. The float bowl doesn't function correctly, and the throttle spindles leak. All those problems can be solved of course (by far the easiest way is to enclose the carb in a sealed box so it thinks it's still running at atmospheric, but even that can be a pain... try sealing an accelerator into a box! (you generally wouldn't, you'd use a shaft with a seal)).

[Dai]

Glad to see I'm not too old to learn something.

Thanks for that

[scumdog]

Correct ma if I am wrong but I was always under the impression that turbos worked through the exhaust not the carbs. Superchargers worked through the carbs.

Turbos can be set-up to suck through the carb and blow into the intake so I believe....

[pete376403]

Go to a tech bookshop or look on amazon for a book "Turbochargers by Hugh MacInness" It's an oldie so doesn't include modern developments such as ball bearing t/c but has huge amounts of detail about the calculations for matching and sizing (MacInness was a founder of Rajay)

[EZAS]

ok, Exhaust spins around the Turbo, spins up a wheel/fan that forces air down into the induction which is then controlled by the throttle bodies.

With a carby, does the turbo just slam air straight into the carby? I can't find any pics eh? ... can someone show me a pick of a turbo carby.

[scumdog]

ok, Exhaust spins around the Turbo, spins up a wheel/fan that forces air down into the induction which is then controlled by the throttle bodies.

With a carby, does the turbo just slam air straight into the carby? I can't find any pics eh? ... can someone show me a pick of a turbo carby.

As I said before: MOST of the time the carb is on the intake side of the turbo, the air/fuel mix is sicked in by the turbo and forced into the intake side of the engine.
There is the odd set-up where the carb is on the pressure side as you mentioned above but there are more complications with pressurising a carb than you realise.

[imdying]

http://www.google.co.nz/search?hl=en&q=blow+through+turbo&btnG=Google+Search&meta=

[EZAS]

http://www.google.co.nz/search?hl=en&q=blow+through+turbo&btnG=Google+Search&meta=
Now that's what I needed ... a good 6-7 hours of reading/learning.

Perhaps I'll switch to an Efi system first. How hard is it to migrate from a carby setup to efi'd setup? I just need a parts list :)

[imdying]

Now that's what I needed ... a good 6-7 hours of reading/learning.

Perhaps I'll switch to an Efi system first. How hard is it to migrate from a carby setup to efi'd setup? I just need a parts list :)

What sort of motor/bike is it?

[EZAS]

My/bike '95 ZX9
I have a mate who's gonna be spending about $12,000 on a new bike, but I'd rather spend a few thousand and go with a forced induction system.
In saying that I'm not really wanting huge boost maybe 2-4psi.

If I can turbo this bike, there's nothing to stop me from turboing something else. I've been working 10-12 hour days to get the $$ I don't get my liscence back for awhile so I'd prefer to have the bikes in pieces than have it sitting there begging me to be started.

[imdying]

Considering that you'll probably drop a few thousand without any trouble whatsoever, and given the advances in chassis technology, the amount of weight (comparitively) the 9R carries, the reduction in reliability, etc etc (you get the idea), you would be better of buying a ZX10R. Except at the drag strip, the ZX10R would thoroughly dominate a boosted 9R. Of course, once you've done the ZX10R thing, then you can boost that... and that merely requires dropping some coin and fitting it, it just comes as a kit. If you search the recent posts here, you'll find a thread on ZX10R supercharger kit too.

I really really like to build things... just because I can... I enjoy getting my hands dirty. But don't sink your money into that when a ZX10R would be a far better bike in every respect but quarter mile times. Hell, if you brought a new one, it would come with a warranty!

[mops]

i'd definitely go EFI. there are many cheap options available... link, megasquirt, microsquirt (released recently) and of course VEMS to name few 'cost effective ones'

turbo wise... well there are few different possibilities there....
either very small turbo for low lag, quick response and good midrange or huge turbo, so it spools only at high loads/max throttle.... in such setup you could even run no wastegate at all :)

supercharger is always a good idea...

hard to say, but i know stuff about EFI so any questions ask...

[EZAS]

I picked up a T04B for my old RX-7 for $800 then had it milled out to fit a T-66. I managed to squeeze out 374hp out of it and it ran well for about 20,000k's before I sold it.

The standard RX-7 Turbo's are cheap anyways http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/Car-parts-accessories/Performance/Turbos/auction-79714419.htm
They are basically just T-03's, however I'd expect to be able to pick up "the right" turbo for less than $1,000 (a T-70 is only $850)