"Classic" naked tourers

[vamr]

Like many others here I've covertly been keeping an eye out for the next potential victim to upgrade/sidegrade to.

Although sportbikes are swell (especially the not-so-practical crotch rockets (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/Motorbikes/Motorbikes/Sports/auction-80952974.htm)) and all, I find myself wanting to experience something from another school of thought such as a r80 (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=80229504&key=304566) or Gt550 (http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/Motorbikes/Motorbikes/Classic-vintage/auction-80603541.htm).

The criteria would have to be both the practicality of commuting, reliability, parts availability and not overly complex engine design (primarily as my understanding of such things are limited, however the will to learn is definitely there)... of course this is all an afterthought of aesthetically driven impulses.

The purchase won't be immediate as I still have a year to go of my degree prior to the head-first nosedive into the 9-5 joys of our existence. However, the funds towards the said purchase are slowly coming together and I need to figure out what to budget for.

Could I get some opinions on the practicality of such motorbikes (with a relatively small budget), suggestions of what further to look at and also experiences of ownership (things to expect).

Thanks in advance.

and before you point out my odd sentence structure, I'm a dirty foreigner.

[classic zed]

My Bike makes an excellent tourer and its surprisingly good at keeping with the sports bikes throught the twisty's, parts are not difficult to find on eBay, its very basic mechanically and wherever I park it people want to talk about it.

Nothing better than a big classic :2thumbsup

[Edbear]

Nothing better than a big classic :2thumbsup




Oi! I heard that! (Oh, you meant your bike? Thought you were talking 'bout me...)

[Lou Girardin]

Bandit. Cheapish, quickish, funish. It can scratch, tour, commute, it's cheap and easy to maintain as well.

[Blackbird]

I was really impressed with Jimmy B's Honda X11 (naked Blackbird) when I rode with him last Friday. In terms of performance it'll see off virtually any other naked bike on the market and the ergonomics are superb. The looks aren't everyone's cuppa but in gloss black, Jimmy's bike looked stunning. You can get them at a very sharp price too. And with that glorious Blackbird engine, it will last forever.

[hXc]

Not a classic, and maybe not so much a tourer, although would be quite capable of it; Triumph Speed Triple. Simply, a beautiful bike.

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showpost.php?p=844553&postcount=22

Those others are also lovely bikes.

[xwhatsit]

Son of a bitch! Those last two auctions I was just looking at myself... I want to head in a similar route once I've got my full ticket. There's a nice K75 on trademe as well, something like that would be pretty sweet -- of course it's a faired bike, but it's nothing drastic, and you can still see that beautifully horrendous engine it has. The R80 is also pretty sweet, but in particular I'm hating that paintjob :P.

GT550... Ixion may say otherwise, being the zealot he is, but from what I've heard I wouldn't really call that either a cheap or practical commuting option. A thirsty stroker, and old enough that it is only going to get more and more expensive. Fast, drinks fuel like a pornstar drinks... water..., and evil handling. But almost worth it just for sheer coolness.

[Kickaha]

GT550... Ixion may say otherwise, being the zealot he is, but from what I've heard I wouldn't really call that either a cheap or practical commuting option. A thirsty stroker, and old enough that it is only going to get more and more expensive. Fast, drinks fuel like a pornstar drinks... water..., and evil handling. But almost worth it just for sheer coolness.

They aren't anywhere near as bad as you decribe, handling is no worse than any other bike of that era and aftermarket shocks make them even better

And they aren't that thirsty unless you have an overactive right wrist

[Paul in NZ]

If you want an old bike - go for something that was in production for a long time with little change and still has a good spares back up.

Personally I'd think BMW or Moto Guzzi but both of these will require a slightly higher purchase price and are not that cheap to own. Up side is character and dependability over some quite high mileage.

Paul N

[Ixion]

Much as I like the old two smokers, I couldn't really recommend them as practical day to day transport nowadays. Nothing wrong with the design, just they are now 30 years old, growing frail and fragile, and spare parts range from hard to get to impossible.

Wonderful fun to have one for occasional weekend outings. But not so much fun when your only transport for getting to work is laid up for 3 months while you search the world for a spare part.

[Blairos]

Bandit. Cheapish, quickish, funish. It can scratch, tour, commute, it's cheap and easy to maintain as well.

I second that!

[TerminalAddict]

I found this to be quite interesting :)
http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/Motorbikes/Motorbikes/Classic-vintage/auction-80804474.htm

[Citroenjunkie]

I had a GT550 while I was studying at Uni. I rode to and from my parents on the weekends a round trip of about 240k's. The bike was totally reliable (once the carbs had been cleaned) VERY quick and sadly, used appreciably more petrol than my Fiat 128 when travelling at similar sorts of legal speeds.

My advice get a Honda four, they've been around forever and are consistently fun to ride. :ride:

[Jimmy B]

Hi Vamr,

As Blackbird said the X11 is a whole lot of laughs and can really haul, funnest of the fun things. Have seen them around for 8K in good nick with low Ks. Maybe a handful for regular innercity commute duty but otherwise really easy to ride. Also beauty is in the eye of the beholder but I urge you to see one up close rather than pictures

Good luck with whatever you go for

JB

[Dooly]

I found this to be quite interesting :)
http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/Motorbikes/Motorbikes/Classic-vintage/auction-80804474.htm

Me too.
I used to own one, same colour.

[Wolf]

I used to have tons of fun on my brother-in-law's old GT550 and I looked at buying one just before I got the LS400 but, as Ixion said, they're hard to find parts for and no good as a "one-and-only" bike.

By all means buy one as a weekend plaything in addition to your regular bike and it won't matter if it's off the road for three months.

The R80 looks beautiful. I personally would go for that. It looks like someone has poured a lot of TLC into it.

I took the R100 for a test spin and found it comfortable and a lot of fun to ride. (story is in the "Riding Tales" page of my website, if you're interested).

After the Road-Trails, the naked "classic" tourers are my favourite bikes. If I could afford it, I'd have a 1980s BMW R model - R80 or R100 - as well as the XT but I have to admit a certain bias towards the older BMW boxer twins.

If you can find one in good condition, an old Honda CB550 or 750 would be good. I found the 550 a mite bulky and heavy for my personal tastes, tho' (but I have no idea of how tall you are and you might find it a perfect fit.) Roj's CB750 is a monster and you have to be reasonably tall to ride it.

I utterly loved my old CB360 - small, light, manoeuvrable, reliable - and I toured all over the place on it - I'd heartily recommend a suitably sized Honda CB.

I know people who deride the older touring bikes because of their bench seats, of all things, but personally I have always found them quite comfortable to sit on for lengthy rides. I found the shaped seat of my LS400 far more uncomfortable (but part of that is most likely the back-on-the-tail-bone seating posture of the cruiser compared with the more upright posture of the tourer).

[vamr]

I used to have tons of fun on my brother-in-law's old GT550 and I looked at buying one just before I got the LS400 but, as Ixion said, they're hard to find parts for and no good as a "one-and-only" bike.

By all means buy one as a weekend plaything in addition to your regular bike and it won't matter if it's off the road for three months.

The R80 looks beautiful. I personally would go for that. It looks like someone has poured a lot of TLC into it.

I took the R100 for a test spin and found it comfortable and a lot of fun to ride. (story is in the "Riding Tales" page of my website, if you're interested).

After the Road-Trails, the naked "classic" tourers are my favourite bikes. If I could afford it, I'd have a 1980s BMW R model - R80 or R100 - as well as the XT but I have to admit a certain bias towards the older BMW boxer twins.

If you can find one in good condition, an old Honda CB550 or 750 would be good. I found the 550 a mite bulky and heavy for my personal tastes, tho' (but I have no idea of how tall you are and you might find it a perfect fit.) Roj's CB750 is a monster and you have to be reasonably tall to ride it.

I utterly loved my old CB360 - small, light, manoeuvrable, reliable - and I toured all over the place on it - I'd heartily recommend a suitably sized Honda CB.

I know people who deride the older touring bikes because of their bench seats, of all things, but personally I have always found them quite comfortable to sit on for lengthy rides. I found the shaped seat of my LS400 far more uncomfortable (but part of that is most likely the back-on-the-tail-bone seating posture of the cruiser compared with the more upright posture of the tourer).

Thanks for that, I'm 5'8" or there abouts and around 60kg so am sort of built to take advantage of light japanese bikes.

I'll be sure to try early CBs when I get the chance, although I have developed an appreciation for the 2stroke engine their era has passed and it looks like (as others pointed out) maintenance will be an uphill battle.

[Ghost_Bullet]

I had a Nevada 750 club which I used as a tour bike, gutless though, but did the job.
I have heard good stuff regarding the new Beva 1100.
I now have the Grizz, and though not realy a touring bike, it is comfortable long distance, and if you do not need to carry much stuff then stock lugauge system is sweet.

[HenryDorsetCase]

without having an idea of budget, and you've cast the net fairly wide, and depending on what era you like, I will add my comments to the "get an SOHC4" post above. Ive got a CB400F and I really like it. not everyones cup of tea, but a very well regarded thing in its day. Handles OK (again, for its day) but the big difference between an old bike and a new bike is brakes, followed by tyres, followed by ability to go round a turn. I think its called "handling" and the Japs didnt really get that till the mid-late 80's. I think I could use the 400F as an "only" bike and not feel too short changed. Bits are available (ebay and David Silver are your friends) Its a nice looking thing, too. If you are in Chch you are welcome to take it for a spin (its not insured though).

CB750's (SOHC and DOHC) are BIG: 215kg dry if I remember, and 67hp when new. CB550s are cool as well but a 400F is nearly as quick and handles as well or better.

People want crazy money for them though, a completely mint 400F sold on tardme last year for $4500 (I should have bought it...)

You might have a think about some 80's stuff: (like the VF750F I have in my garage for cheap....) something like a GPz750, Gpz900, or something like that.

Suzuki GSX750 or 1100 maybe a Katana (dreadfully uncomfortable but soooo cool). The key to something this old is condition and maintenance history.

[vamr]

without having an idea of budget, and you've cast the net fairly wide, and depending on what era you like, I will add my comments to the "get an SOHC4" post above. Ive got a CB400F and I really like it. not everyones cup of tea, but a very well regarded thing in its day. Handles OK (again, for its day) but the big difference between an old bike and a new bike is brakes, followed by tyres, followed by ability to go round a turn. I think its called "handling" and the Japs didnt really get that till the mid-late 80's. I think I could use the 400F as an "only" bike and not feel too short changed. Bits are available (ebay and David Silver are your friends) Its a nice looking thing, too. If you are in Chch you are welcome to take it for a spin (its not insured though).

CB750's (SOHC and DOHC) are BIG: 215kg dry if I remember, and 67hp when new. CB550s are cool as well but a 400F is nearly as quick and handles as well or better.

People want crazy money for them though, a completely mint 400F sold on tardme last year for $4500 (I should have bought it...)

You might have a think about some 80's stuff: (like the VF750F I have in my garage for cheap....) something like a GPz750, Gpz900, or something like that.

Suzuki GSX750 or 1100 maybe a Katana (dreadfully uncomfortable but soooo cool). The key to something this old is condition and maintenance history.

The budget would be between 4-6k so it theoretically would facilitate flexibility in choice. Would idealy have change left for a decent tidy up (seals, carbs, tyres...). As I'd initially stated, this isn't an immediate purchase, will be at least 4 months away from actually being in a position to purchase the said bike with the above budget in mind. Bear in mind this isn't a "day-dream" thread.

However, how practical would it be to pick up the "was running before being placed in storage X years ago but STILL LOOKS GOOD" sort of "bargain" to tinker with (am ok for transport as have a running bike + car for when the fore stated decides to seize on me :shutup: )? The major limitation would be my lack of mechanical knowledge which would greatly increase the time spent on any given thing.

Thank you for the offer but am in Auckland.

[Ixion]

Word of warning, be very cautious about two strokes that have been sitting unused for some time (say, > 1 year). They don't like disuse, the crankcase seals dry out.

4 strokes, the problem with being left unused is sludging oil, which can block galleries (so draining the old oil is no cure) and rotting exhausts. BTW the common practice of "start it up once a month" makes this much worse. It needs a decent run to keep things working, enough for everything to heat properly up. And also on roller bearing big ends, lack of use can lead to corrosion and rapid bearing failure .

[Bonez]

CB750's (SOHC and DOHC) are BIG: 215kg dry if I remember, and 67hp when new. CB550s are cool as well but a 400F is nearly as quick and handles as well or better.
Cb550s are better for larger/taller folk. And the cam chain tensioner setup is better. One thing the 400 does have that the 500/550s don't is a slipper for the primary camc hain to rub on instead of chewing into the ali castings when they wear. On the 500/550s this is the oil gallery from the sump pick up to the filter. The sohc cb650s have a spring load primary chain tensioner setup that includes his. The 550s certainly are more nimble than the 750s and handle quite well. I own a DOHC 750 bought from new. Had mine 20 years now. 76hp with fairing and once rolling the weight isn't that bad. Also owned a sohc cb750, so have first hand knowlegde of how they all ride. Cowboyz, Meanie, dhunt and a few other KBers will testify to handling capabilities of the 550 when things get tight. Not up to the modern day sprot bikes, but good all the same. Another underrated old bike, quite simple to work on and dirt cheap. Toured up and down both islands on it no problems. Well non that couldn't be sorted with a bit of lockwire, inslation tape and super glue...........

Bit about the bike-

Ok they have points ignition, this can be replaced by after market solid state units, but I've only replaced one set of points in the 70,000kms I've done on it.

Now as for engine work she got a refresh at about 80,000 and is now due for some more work at 142,000. I bought this for $750 back in 1986 spent around $1500
on it in 1989 plus bought complete new exhaust system for it at around $1200 (plenty of "disposible" income at that time and hated the after market four into ones). Also fitted braided brake lines. Then when the standard muffler gave up the ghost a couple of years ago bought an after market Dunstall replica for $110. Fitted new braided lines about 8 months ago, basicly because the old ones have been on for around 10 years and the teflon inner doesn't last for ever. Oh a pair of fork OEM gaiters and one fork seal. Paint job-was orange, still have a new orange tank in the attic along with spare side covers. Rear wheel bearings on the spare back wheel and steering head bearings were also replaced-can't remember when but have never bothered to get around to fitting tapered rollrs, maybe next time. The standard filter/oil changes every 3-4000kms, fork oil, chains-3 non o-ring, sprockets (only one set in the time Ive had it-regular oil/adjustments I guess), tyres and tune up at twice the recomended interval. Koni rear shocks and 1 inch spacer up front tidied up handling even more. On it's third battery. It's been good to me.

A good SOHC site here- http://www.sohc4.us/
New shoc cb750k parts available here- http://www.yamiya750.com/ click on the "ENGLISH" link.
A good DOHC honda site - http://www.cb1100f.net
A good oldschool GS/GSX site - http://www.thegsresources.com/
I'm sure others can give good old school Kawasaki and Yamaha links.
There's various VJMC sites like this one which have usefull info too- http://www.vjmc.org/


Edit-I'm after a Viper cafe racer style bikini fairing, possibly a couple, if anyone can put me on a good source thanks.

[Wolf]

4 strokes, the problem with being left unused is sludging oil, which can block galleries (so draining the old oil is no cure)
And that's pretty much what HondaCMX450 said had happened to the second-hand engne I put in the GSX250: it had been too long without use, the galleries were blocked and the engine wasn't getting properly lubed, so ride it to work a few times and it's wrecked.

Makes sense, because it ran fine at first and then would die when hot and when you tried to turn it over it wouldn't. Got to the point it wouldn't turn over when cold, either.

When I bought the CB550 the engine was seized and it had to be stripped and repaired - and the bastards didn't put the seals back in properly so it died after only a few months' use (thought it was just because the bike was so old so did nothing about it, sold it to a friend who later autopsied it and said that it had not been properly repaired.)

Been bloody lucky with the blue-smokes - both the Puch and the Zundapp had not been run for around 5 years and they fired up fine and ran well and I left the Zundapp's engine unattended for around a year and a half while restoring it and it was still fine, gave me years of service.

Luck of the draw, I guess.

[Eurodave]

Edit-I'm after a Viper cafe racer style bikini fairing, possibly a couple, if anyone can put me on a good source thanks.

Hey bud, as you may already know I make various fibreglass bikini fairings...... including an exact copy of the one in your pic...........

[Highlander]

Does My baby fit the "Classic Naked Tourer" box?

'92 Honda CB 750 (F2N) I picked it up with just under 10,000 Km and have done 15,000 since. Modification consists of a Pack rack. I use a magnetic tank bag depending on where I am going. Other than that have only done Routine servicing and a couple of tyres.

Have been up to Cape Reinga (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=36433 , same write up in Bike Rider Mag).

Am absolutely loving it.

Thinking seriously about the Southern Cross in 2007, trying to rope in a couple of riding partners.

[Bonez]

Hey bud, as you may already know I make various fibreglass bikini fairings...... including an exact copy of the one in your pic...........
Prefer a plastic one, lighter than fiberglass. Thanks anyway.

[Bonez]

Does My baby fit the "Classic Naked Tourer" box?

'92 Honda CB 750 (F2N) Should be ideal. Also known as the "Nighthawk". Those babies where in production up to 2003, I beleive. So there shouldn't be any parts problems. The engines been around since the CBX750 and no bloody 16 inch front wheel.

[Wolf]

Does My baby fit the "Classic Naked Tourer" box?
Most definitely - and a bloody tidy one, too. Very nice.

[Squiggles]

cx500 :dodge:

[Highlander]

Now that I've read all the posts:

I bought mine 18 months ago in the $4 - $6k range you mention.

I commute on it all the time, and go for a couple hr ride every week or so.

Hasn't missed a beat.

I get 330 - 350 Km from a tank depending on if I'm commuting, blatting 1 or 2 up.

Had it on the track at Taupo and can confirm it is still accelerating when the speedo runs out of numbers at 190 (more than enough for me).

The only thing I have done other than the pack rack is replaced the standard headlight bulb with a Xenon one of the same wattage - well worth the $20 a pair.

[vamr]

Cb550s are better for larger/taller folk. And the cam chain tensioner setup is better. One thing the 400 does have that the 500/550s don't is a slipper for the primary camc hain to rub on instead of chewing into the ali castings when they wear.

From what I've read of other's opinions and feedback it would appear the cb350/60 and cb400 would be more suitable for my physical disposition but I guess there is only one way to find out which would have to be closer to purchasing time.

Subsequently, what are the general opinions of, what I only assume as, kawasaki's equivalent of the CBs namely the KZ and W models or am I just showing my ignorance?


Now that I've read all the posts:

I bought mine 18 months ago in the $4 - $6k range you mention.

I commute on it all the time, and go for a couple hr ride every week or so.

Hasn't missed a beat.

I get 330 - 350 Km from a tank depending on if I'm commuting, blatting 1 or 2 up.

Had it on the track at Taupo and can confirm it is still accelerating when the speedo runs out of numbers at 190 (more than enough for me).

The only thing I have done other than the pack rack is replaced the standard headlight bulb with a Xenon one of the same wattage - well worth the $20 a pair.


Thank you for that, it's definately a beautiful bike you have there. Will hunt around for one sitting in a dealer's lot to sit on at some point in relatively near future.

What, if you don't mind me asking, did you upgrade/sidegrade from to the current bike? Am contemplating whether jumping off a fiddly 150 2 stroke would offer enough experience going to a "modern" 750.

That's damn good millage, I get maybe half that on my 2smoke but then again I tend to sit a quite high in the rev range as a constant.

[Highlander]

Previous bike was a CB400n ('81 if I remember correctly, 400 twin it was) 12 years between bikes so plenty has faded in the memory department. Was a good bike though.

I'm only an inch taller than you so don't think you'll have too much drama with seat height. You'll get better acceleration than me though cause it is a rather HEAVY inch!!

Part of the apeal of my current bike was that it is (by modern standards) old technology, and while having enough power to do the job comfortably (cruise at 100 ish 2 up) wasn't going to get me into real trouble real quick. Being a naked bike you know it when your speed is getting up.

[Bonez]

cx500 :dodge:Ahh, at last someone with class.:yes: It's quite a tall bike though. Yes I know it was ment to be a piss take......

Another small older bike to consider could be a GB400 or 500 single. Fine for solo touring with it's 300+ km fuel range. Can be had for around $1400-$2000. There's a thread on KB about a mate and my tour on our 400s around the east cape. He's five foot nothing and I'm 6 foot.

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=30428

Edit-just popped in to one of the local Honda shops to book Gerty in for the charging system to get sorted. Couple of nice looking Honda Bros, 400 I think, look the bee's knees. Hadn't been prepped for sale yet so no price on them. Ment to be pretty bullet proof.

[Wolf]

From what I've read of other's opinions and feedback it would appear the cb350/60 and cb400 would be more suitable for my physical disposition but I guess there is only one way to find out which would have to be closer to purchasing time.
You won't go too far wrong with a mid-range CB. They're light enough that they're not a hassle on daily commutes (the CB550 was good on the open road but an utter pain in the arse for someone my size at crawling pace in town. I could only fully ground one foot at a time, barely tiptoe with both feet, and the weight meant that stopping and starting at lights, manoeuvring in parking lots and trying to back it up involved a lot of effort.)

My old CB360 seemed to like sitting at 70mph (to my cost) - I suspect that was the speed it was run in at as it didn't like sitting at 60 in top gear - and it wasn't at full throttle. I also handled fine - I took it up the hill south of Taihape before the bastards straightened the road and ruined it for us bikers (fucking whiney-arsed cagers!) and it just glided up the hill, rolling smoothly from side to side around the corners - frigging excellent! That bugger could handle!

Never had any hassles at low speed, commuted to work around Hamilton, did the shopping etc - great both in the confines of the city and out on the open road and that's exactly what I look for in a "one and only" bike.

The bench seat was quite adequate for two-up riding and quite confortable on the long haul - riding posture kept tail-bone clear of the seat, padding was ample beneath the bum, and at my height I found the bike fitted me perfectly - comfortable riding posture, neither cramped nor stretched. As we're similar heights you may find the same (barring major differences in proportions - a friend of mine was the same height as me but a lot shorter in the in-seam and found a lot of bikes "too tall".)

[HenryDorsetCase]

what about one of those 400 cc Hornet lookalikes

Cb1 or something.

[Bonez]

I'm after a Viper cafe racer style bikini fairing, possibly a couple, if anyone can put me on a good source thanks.Hastings Honda can provide the fairings at around $120 for those interested. Got an email last week. Should imagine they are available from all major bike shops for around the same price.

[Catweazle]

I bought one of these new in Oz and over more than a decade ran up 256,000 kms. With original bore, pistons and rings was burning one or two mms of oil between changes when I sold it to return to NZ.

Very nice smooth engine and with an after market screen it makes a great everyday bike in all weather. I drove it 90 kms to work (and back again) every day for five years and did nearly 100 weekend rallies all around NSW.

Replaced cam chain at 125K and alternator chain and bearings at 170K. Had to replace one clicky hydraulic tappet at some stage. Really great with no tappet adjustment to worry about.

Was the best bike I ever had - out of 15 over 38 years.

[avgas]

GB400/500/600
you will never regret it.
Take this advice from someone who hates honda's.

[shafty]

I will echo the recommendations of early Hondas having owned the 500/4, 750/4, GL1000, and quite recently a 77 CB750F Supersport, which I picked up MINT for $2750.

I know you're talking naked, but don't overlook a Yamaha FJ1200. They are decievingly low bikes, - my 5'3" Gal could ride mine, they are super strong and long lasting - you owe yourself a test ride and great value for $$.

Motors are so grunty, you can't really stress them = high mileages no probs.

Have fun deciding!

[Highlander]

Wohoo:yes: that's what I got to look forward to. Mine had 9,700Km on it when I bought it and I have done 17,000 Km since then.

Welcome to KiwiBiker Catweazle.:scooter:



I bought one of these new in Oz and over more than a decade ran up 256,000 kms. With original bore, pistons and rings was burning one or two mms of oil between changes when I sold it to return to NZ.

Very nice smooth engine and with an after market screen it makes a great everyday bike in all weather. I drove it 90 kms to work (and back again) every day for five years and did nearly 100 weekend rallies all around NSW.

Replaced cam chain at 125K and alternator chain and bearings at 170K. Had to replace one clicky hydraulic tappet at some stage. Really great with no tappet adjustment to worry about.

Was the best bike I ever had - out of 15 over 38 years.