What's the story with lane splitting?

[Squeak the Rat]

Whats the story and legalities with lane splitting?


Is it legal to fix it up with a tar snake (is so is there a maximum size?), or should they do a proper repair job? I hate those damn tar snakes.....

[toymachine]

Edit: Lol. Just had a re-read..

[Whynot]

I dont tend to bother repairing the lanes after i have lane split.
I was actually unaware that my supreme pace was affecting the road in such a way .... :innocent:

[Fub@r]

EDIT:

I was assuming it was a two question post

[Whynot]

its amazing how many people don't actually read the entire post before replying :shutup:

[sunhuntin]

lol...clever. took me a second too. but i wish theyd do a proper repair job!

i found patches in the south island where the road had been resealed...it was as though someone had gone through dragging a huge rake behind them....it was nothing but lines! ok for 4 wheeled vehicles....not so good for two-wheels [but a good way of getting rid of tailgaters...just get hooked up on one and you look about to fall off!]

[ManDownUnder]

All I know is splitting my trousers doesn't concern me too much because there (fortunately) is not a max size on a trouser snake.

[Roj]

Whats the story and legalities with lane splitting?


Is it legal to fix it up with a tar snake (is so is there a maximum size?), or should they do a proper repair job? I hate those damn tar snakes.....


There has been plenty of discussion on lane splitting, read:http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=21150&highlight=lane+splitting

[Drum]

Those tar snakes as we call them (although we do not use tar on our roads!) are just sealing the longitudinal cracks. They do this to stop water getting into the cracks and buggering the base course material below the seal.

It is legal, and is done because it is so much cheaper than a reseal (which can cost upwards of $60 a square meter for asphaltic concrete). Chipseal is cheaper at around $8 per sqm, but it all adds up.

Reseals are usually every 6 to 9 years (depending on traffic volume and road construction) and the tar snakes are used to extend their life span out to this kind of period.

[Squeak the Rat]

I thought it was fairly obvious that this thread was a joke (shows how many people actually read before replying, bahahahaha) but given the infraction and the move to a serious forum like Polics & Law I'll disengage humour and ask a serious question for Mr Drum:


Is it legal to use these "tar snakes" around corners? And is there a maximum width or length?

[bert_is_evil]

does anyone know if there are any rules around moving the road markings? i've noticed in wellington that when the lanes are moved they cover up the old markings with some sort of silicon/teflon type black stuff, then paint new arrows right next to it so you're left with practicly the whole lane unuseable in the wet (most of the time). i've called the council and complained and eventually they remove it but i wonder how many people bin it before that happens.

[Ixion]

I thought it was fairly obvious that this thread was a joke (shows how many people actually read before replying, bahahahaha) but given the infraction and the move to a serious forum like Polics & Law I'll disengage humour and ask a serious question for Mr Drum:


Is it legal to use these "tar snakes" around corners? And is there a maximum width or length?
That's a bit rough. It was obviously a joke. Flick Joni a PM and ask her to reverse it.

[Drum]

.............. but given the infraction and the move to a serious forum like Polics & Law I'll disengage humour ........

Sheesh, thats a bit harsh!

Yes they can be used around corners, and no, there is no restriction on length etc. Some councils tend to use the tar snakes more than others - WCC seems quite keen on them.

Normally if they get enough complaints about excessive use of tar snakes on a particular stretch of road, they may move the reseal date forward - especially if you mention words like "danger to life and property" and "liability".

[Drum]

.....i've noticed in wellington that when the lanes are moved they cover up the old markings with some sort of silicon/teflon type black stuff, then paint new arrows right next to it so you're left with practicly the whole lane unuseable in the wet (most of the time). i've called the council and complained and eventually they remove it but i wonder how many people bin it before that happens.

yeah, it is pretty slippery! Many councils now get the painting Contractor to water or sand blast the old markings off instead of simply covering over them with this crap. Again, complaints are required in volume to affect change.

[Racey Rider]

On a related subject:
Whats with those grooves cut into the road around Lower Hutt? When riding down there the other week I found sections of lane that had been impaled with a grooving machine by the look. wiggly grooves set about 2 inches apart right across the lane. I guess they are for grip, but my bike Hated them.

[ManDownUnder]

Are they actually called Tar Snakes or do they have a proper name?
(for when I complain about them, dont want to sound like a moron)

Tar snakes is good - drag 'em down to my level!

[Whynot]

"Enough is enough! I have had it with these motherfucking tar snakes on this motherfucking road!".

:rockon:

[bert_is_evil]

Tar snakes is good - drag 'em down to my level!

Not to be confused with the road snakes found in Napier:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/3906112a11.html

[Squeak the Rat]

That's a bit rough. It was obviously a joke. Flick Joni a PM and ask her to reverse it.

Cheers Ixion, but I'm not too fussed. I actually think it's quite funny - a lot of threads on KB go off topic, but this has got to be the first that's gone from drivel onto topic!

.

[Drum]

..... Whats with those grooves cut into the road around Lower Hutt? ......Hated them.

As you deduce, they are cut into the road to provide additional resistance against sideways sliding (techincally, they provide additional macro texture). They are typically installed when the seal skid resistance is deficient, but the road is not due for a reseal, or the camber on the road is not right (which is expensive to fix).

I have never liked this method, it is a typical "band aid to fix a broken back" remedy.

[Drum]

Are they actually called Tar Snakes or do they have a proper name?
(for when I complain about them, dont want to sound like a moron)

Typically called crack-sealing or overbanding. (we dont use tar on New Zealand roads).

[xwhatsit]

As you deduce, they are cut into the road to provide additional resistance against sideways sliding (techincally, they provide additional macro texture). They are typically installed when the seal skid resistance is deficient, but the road is not due for a reseal, or the camber on the road is not right (which is expensive to fix).

I have never liked this method, it is a typical "band aid to fix a broken back" remedy.

You bring up an interesting statement there -- about `macro texture', as you put it. I've always wondered about this; the difference in grip between smooth asphalt, and coarse chip seal. Now, obviously you want to maximise the amount of rubber touching the road; so you would think that smooth asphalt would be the best option. But on the other hand... instinctively you feel that the coarse chip seal would be grippier, because it's got all these sharp bumps and stuff that you think would `grab'. In your words, the chip seal has more macro texture. Where's the line between more grip from contact, and more grip from texture?

[Drum]

You bring up an interesting statement there -- about `macro texture', as you put it. I've always wondered about this; the difference in grip between smooth asphalt, and coarse chip seal. Now, obviously you want to maximise the amount of rubber touching the road; so you would think that smooth asphalt would be the best option. But on the other hand... instinctively you feel that the coarse chip seal would be grippier, because it's got all these sharp bumps and stuff that you think would `grab'. In your words, the chip seal has more macro texture. Where's the line between more grip from contact, and more grip from texture?

A-ha! You have stumbled on the difference between macro-texture and micro-texture!

Chipseal, which is little chips of gravel/ metal in a bitumen "glue", works because of the resistance between your tyre and the bits of the gravel that stick out of the bitumen. This is known as macro-texture.

Asphaltic Concrete, the smooth stuff on the motorways, is actually porous (i.e. water can go through it), and it works by the resistance between your tyre and the edges of all the little holes in the asphalt (which let the water through) . Your tyre (on a microscopic level) actually extends into each of the little holes. This is micro-texture.

AC is generally a better surface because it is porous. The water goes down through it and then out to the side. With chipseal the water runs across the surface to the edge/ kerb. AC is also structural, it takes load from vehicles and so the basecourse below lasts longer. Chipseal is merely a seal to keep the water off the basecourse below.

AC becomes slippery when the little holes get filled by dirt (i.e. the water no longer drains away). Chipseal gets slippery when the edges of all the little chips becomes polished/ rounded.

EDIT: Apologies to Squeak for getting your thread on-topic!

[tl_tub]

The majority of asphalt is not porous (or not designed to be), the mixes used around town - mix 10 to mix 20 (10 or 20mm nominal maximum aggregate size)

You usually have to go to the asphalt used on motorways to get any decent level of porosity, this is called OGPA, open graded asphalt mix :yes:

[surfer]

All I know is splitting my trousers doesn't concern me too much because there (fortunately) is not a max size on a trouser snake.


If I see it in the road I will ride over it then, now that we all know it adds to side ways resistance :yes:

[M1CRO]

AC becomes slippery when the little holes get filled by dirt (i.e. the water no longer drains away). Chipseal gets slippery when the edges of all the little chips becomes polished/ rounded.
Ok, I'll bite.. Well not hard anyway...
So.. Referring to AC, when the holes get blocked up, how do they get unblocked? Or dont we care? Or is that when it gets replaced (at some point, but generally 2-4 weeks before the end of the financial year)

[Motu]

I hear lane splitting was invented by Chuck Norris....Make sure he doesn't split a lane near you.

[Lou Girardin]

Tar snakes? Pah! bloody amateurs, we have tar anacondas around here.
(will this get moved to the herpetology forum?)

[Drum]

The majority of asphalt is not porous (or not designed to be), the mixes used around town - mix 10 to mix 20 (10 or 20mm nominal maximum aggregate size)

You usually have to go to the asphalt used on motorways to get any decent level of porosity, this is called OGPA, open graded asphalt mix :yes:

True, but I was trying to keep it simple.

[tl_tub]

True, sorry.. I was bored and have had enough of work :)