Trackday Tyre Questions

[Leong]

To the more experienced trackday addicts - any help appreciated! :yes:

I fitted Pilot Powers to my GSXR-600 Labour weekend, and have since done 7000km including 6.5 trackdays riding down to Taupo and back and the odd KB group ride. Bike's not used for anything else. The rear is down to the treadwear indicators on the left side. At the last trackday (Kiwitrackdays 22 Dec) I didn't have confidence in the tyres, and would like do do something about it before the next trackdays we are doing - the Kiwitrackdays at Taupo on the 11 Jan and Manfeild on the 13th.

Didn't have confidence = tyres felt hard. Going thru the tight chicane onto the old track at Taupo especially, the bike was "too" flickable and tyres felt like they could let go suddenly unlike when they were new or fairly new.

Tyre presures. Up till trackday before last, I though I had tyre pressures sorted. I'd been running Fr30 R31cold, and the would each go up 4psi when hot. At the trackday before last the rear went up to 39psi when hot, front was same as previously. So at the last trackday, I tried running the rear at 33psi cold, but it still went up to 40psi when hot. I suspect the ambient and track temps also getting warmer. Unfortunately I didn't try letting the pressure down to see if the increased tyre pressure was what made the tyres feel "hard". Should I just run the Fr30 R31 combination if it feels right, despite the 8psi increase in pressure from cold to hot?

The other reason possibly is that the tyres are more worn, and perhaps this is the reason for the "hard feel". Could this be the case? I know others running the same tyres, at the same state of wear that don't seem to have the same issues. It could also all be in my head from my bin, but I don't think so.

In all likelihood, I 'll put on a new set of tyres prior to the next trackday. Quite keen on the new Pilot Power 2CT, but these won't be available till late January, so I might go for the dual compound Pirelli Diablo Corsa 3s instead. Has anyone had experience with these or found a review comparing these tyres to each other or to the more road oriented Pilot Powers or track oriented Supercorsa Pros?

Thanks

[cowpoos]

To the more experienced trackday addicts - any help appreciated! :yes:

I fitted Pilot Powers to my GSXR-600 Labour weekend, and have since done 7000km including 6.5 trackdays riding down to Taupo and back and the odd KB group ride. Bike's not used for anything else. The rear is down to the treadwear indicators on the left side. At the last trackday (Kiwitrackdays 22 Dec) I didn't have confidence in the tyres, and would like do do something about it before the next trackdays we are doing - the Kiwitrackdays at Taupo on the 11 Jan and Manfeild on the 13th.

Didn't have confidence = tyres felt hard. Going thru the tight chicane onto the old track at Taupo especially, the bike was "too" flickable and tyres felt like they could let go suddenly unlike when they were new or fairly new.

Tyre presures. Up till trackday before last, I though I had tyre pressures sorted. I'd been running Fr30 R31cold, and the would each go up 4psi when hot. At the trackday before last the rear went up to 39psi when hot, front was same as previously. So at the last trackday, I tried running the rear at 33psi cold, but it still went up to 40psi when hot. I suspect the ambient and track temps also getting warmer. Unfortunately I didn't try letting the pressure down to see if the increased tyre pressure was what made the tyres feel "hard". Should I just run the Fr30 R31 combination if it feels right, despite the 8psi increase in pressure from cold to hot?

The other reason possibly is that the tyres are more worn, and perhaps this is the reason for the "hard feel". Could this be the case? I know others running the same tyres, at the same state of wear that don't seem to have the same issues. It could also all be in my head from my bin, but I don't think so.

In all likelihood, I 'll put on a new set of tyres prior to the next trackday. Quite keen on the new Pilot Power 2CT, but these won't be available till late January, so I might go for the dual compound Pirelli Diablo Corsa 3s instead. Has anyone had experience with these or found a review comparing these tyres to each other or to the more road oriented Pilot Powers or track oriented Supercorsa Pros?

Thanks
how fast are you?

[Leong]

Usually faster half of medium group

[justsomeguy]

Hey Leong, good to see you today bud,

As you know I run the same tyres.

My favoured pressures when cold are 37F, 39R psi on the road. 31F,31R to 32F, 33R psi on the track (I'll go lower for Puke, higher for Taupo).

I've noted a consistent 4-5psi increase in temperature after a session.

My rear lasted just under 4000kms, when it got a puncture in Wellington. The guys there said the tyre could be fixed but was worn to a state where it would barely reach Auckland. Perhaps your tyres are too worn.

When they took my tyre off I inspected it and was surprised how thin the surface had become compared to a new tyre and my tyre was barely a month and a half old (too many crazy Coro Loops and days at Taupo and Puke).

However for what it's worth I think some of it is just your head after the bin.

I've run the same tyres as you, done almost as many trackdays and a few typical JSG road rides :innocent: and my tyres seem to give me more than satisfactory feedback.

Now - when Shaun sorted your suspension - what kind of riding did you get him to set it for??

I can barely sit on my bike below 100kmph without being bounced around, but on proper rides and trackdays everything feels in place.

Perhaps you may need some tweaking here and there??

Keep me informed when I see you next......:niceone:

[cowpoos]

stick with your piolets then....I'ld run lower pressue on the rear try 28 rear and 30 front...and check them while the tyres are cold...at a guess it does sound like your tyres are past there used by date...so replacement is a good idea...but the thing with taupo is its very funni with tyres...I ran racetech race tyres of all different compounds and they ripped to shreads [cold shear]...and tryed other types until I settled on pirelli slicks...but then again others hav used pirelli slicks and hav had them rip to shreds too...so if you are using a tyre and they are wearing even and not ripping up just play with your presures abit...some times when your tyre lets go while your trying to keep up with someone and you see them driving away from you alot of the time it could just be your lines...good lines will give you lots of track space [using more of the track] and that takes presure off your tyres alot...I used to happily ride very quickly in the fast group at any trackday on piolet powers...and never really had to much issuses with them...hope this helps??

[Leong]

stick with your piolets then....I'ld run lower pressue on the rear try 28 rear and 30 front...and check them while the tyres are cold...at a guess it does sound like your tyres are past there used by date...so replacement is a good idea...but the thing with taupo is its very funni with tyres...I ran racetech race tyres of all different compounds and they ripped to shreads [cold shear]...and tryed other types until I settled on pirelli slicks...but then again others hav used pirelli slicks and hav had them rip to shreds too...so if you are using a tyre and they are wearing even and not ripping up just play with your presures abit...some times when your tyre lets go while your trying to keep up with someone and you see them driving away from you alot of the time it could just be your lines...good lines will give you lots of track space [using more of the track] and that takes presure off your tyres alot...I used to happily ride very quickly in the fast group at any trackday on piolet powers...and never really had to much issuses with them...hope this helps??

Thanks, The BT014s that came on the bike ripped to shreds booth at Taupo and Puke. PPs wearing evenly and appear to be lasting well.

If I tried 28psi on the rear won't they get even hotter. ( and if they did, does it matter? ). I thought that the aim was to get the tyres to increase in pressure by 10-12% from cold to hot, and if they went up more then you increased the cold pressure?

I WAS catching a motard in the fast group when my tyres let go and I had my off!!! Learnt that day that smooth and consistently good lines was the way to go! Cheers and Thanks!

[cowpoos]

If I tried 28psi on the rear won't they get even hotter.
how do you know heat is your problem???

some times you can have the stickiest tyres on the market....run the same presures as the pros...and yet some twit with shit tyres can ride right round the out side of ya and piss off into the distance....tyres are not the only things holding ya to the road/track....your suspension and you are also major players.... PM me some time if ya wanna hav a bigger chat about this subject

[Two Smoker]

Stick with Powers, they seem to suit your pace well... The "hard" feeling is because the tyre is shagged and been through too many heat cycles... If you want a more track orientated tyre, go for Michelin Power Race...

[blueblade]

Hey TS, how do the Power Race tyres go on the road. I do similar type of riding to Leong - track days and fastish road rides. Was geting about 2500-3000 kms out of 208rr's and liked their feel. Currently running Pilot Power and dont like the lack of feedback, mileage will be much higher than the 208 but thats not really my main consideration. Just want to try something different next time. Do you think Power Race would suit and any idea how it would compare to 208rr ?

[boomer]

Hey TS, how do the Power Race tyres go on the road. I do similar type of riding to Leong - track days and fastish road rides. Was geting about 2500-3000 kms out of 208rr's and liked their feel. Currently running Pilot Power and dont like the lack of feedback, mileage will be much higher than the 208 but thats not really my main consideration. Just want to try something different next time. Do you think Power Race would suit and any idea how it would compare to 208rr ?


i'm with you mate; stay with the 208's or go with the new qualifiers

[Two Smoker]

i'm with you mate; stay with the 208's or go with the new qualifiers

But you boomer are on drugs.... hehehe

Blueblade havent tried the Power race on the road, but im sure they are like any other track based tyre... Take a while to heat up, have good feed back, stick like shit to a blanket, but are crap in the wet. Power race is surprisingly cheap retail aswell...

[boomer]

But you boomer are on drugs.... hehehe

Surely thats even more reason to want sticky shit between me and the road ;) want me to hook you up TS> they'll make you go faster :D

[blueblade]

Thanks TS. Might give them a try. Tend not to do too much road riding in the wet these days so not so much of an issue with that. Cheers

[Leong]

Stick with Powers, they seem to suit your pace well... The "hard" feeling is because the tyre is shagged and been through too many heat cycles... If you want a more track orientated tyre, go for Michelin Power Race...
Thanks TS. I am quite keen to put a new set of Powers on, just to feel/confirm the difference between new and shagged. Went to Whangamata today and until today hadn't noticed the same "hard" feel on the road. Also noticed that my both my mates tyres (all on Powers) felt tacky when hot, but mine not at all. Tried dropping the pressures to the equivalent of 30psi cold and the feel improved dramatically, and tyre got hotter (I think) and slightly tacky to touch. Booked in for new tyres!



Thanks TS. Might give them a try. Tend not to do too much road riding in the wet these days so not so much of an issue with that. Cheers
Hey, I was hoping you'd be giving advice, not receiving it!!! I'd be keen to know just how bad power races would be in the wet. I mean, if you just stuck to 100km/h on main highways would they be dangerous, or only if you push it. Theres been quite a few times we've had fine trackdays, but rain on the way down or back!!

[blueblade]

I can certainly answer that one Leong. Anything with any sort of tread will be OK if you stick to 100k on main roads, but could you actually do that????
I know I cant. When I first got back into bikes I rode a Fireblade with Supercorsas on it all through the winter and never had any real issues. But back then (3 years ago) my pace was a lot slower.

I would say, if you want to try something sportier than the Pilot Powers, but not as radical as the Power Race, give the Dunlop 208rr's a try. They get really sticky on the track but also work well on the road, including in the wet.

[Leong]

I can certainly answer that one Leong. Anything with any sort of tread will be OK if you stick to 100k on main roads, but could you actually do that????

Actually, I could, if I was by myself....but otherwise I may be tempted to push beyond my abilities and that would not be good.

Difficult decision at the moment - Cycletreads are doing good deals on Michelin so PP's are good value, but I wouldn't mind giving something a bit stickier a go, so I may compromise and go for the dual compound Diablo Corsa 3's. From what I can find.... and thats not much, they're better performing than Diablos which were similar to PPs. Will we see you on the 24th?

[blueblade]

I'll be at the track day on 11 Jan if weather is ok. Whats on the 24th ??

[Leong]

The next HRC day

[blueblade]

Oh yeah. Will definitely try to make that one