Duke vs Jap: Perceptions

[nedj]

Being a long time admirer of the duc, I am finally in a position to purchase one. Never having ridden a duc, I had pinned my hopes on a 600 ( only 5'6 and weighing under 70kg). I finally got my leg round and... well... :crybaby:
I was very dissapointed. My first thoughts were , mmm this is gonna be a beast in slow moving traffic. A serious amount of throttle and clutch controll at all times.
Long live the internet! On I went and started reading about peoples percpetions of the 600ss. Needless to say most of the reports said the 600 was .. for want of a better word, lacking. So this got me thinking is the 750 's any better?
Any body here ridden both ranges and be willing to share some of their thoughts on the pro's and cons of Ducai vs Kawa (or any other jap bikes).
:Playnice:

[Two Smoker]

Well the 750SS has similar performance to the ZXR400.... The v-twin ofcourse having more puch down low, but the kwaka up high....

Basically with the Duc's your paying for the name and looks.....

If your keen for a V-twin look at the SV650, if you wanting good performance and worried about height, look at a japper 400, and if you want the ultimate in performance go for a 600 inline 4 sports bike from any of the jappers big four :niceone:

[SpankMe]

( only 5'6 and weighing under 70kg).

That’s plenty tall enough for a SV1000s (http://www.sv-portal.com). I'm only 5'3'' and have no difficulty with the SV.

I considered a Duc 600 when I got my sv650s, but after reading the reviews comparing the bikes, I got the SV because it pisses all over the Duc 600 and 750’s. The only decent Duc’s are the top of the line ones.

[kerryg]

Being a long time admirer of the duc, I am finally in a position to purchase one. Never having ridden a duc, I had pinned my hopes on a 600 ( only 5'6 and weighing under 70kg). I finally got my leg round and... well... :crybaby:
I was very dissapointed. My first thoughts were , mmm this is gonna be a beast in slow moving traffic. A serious amount of throttle and clutch controll at all times.
Long live the internet! On I went and started reading about peoples percpetions of the 600ss. Needless to say most of the reports said the 600 was .. for want of a better word, lacking. So this got me thinking is the 750 's any better?
Any body here ridden both ranges and be willing to share some of their thoughts on the pro's and cons of Ducai vs Kawa (or any other jap bikes).
:Playnice:


Hey Ned, good topic, this thread should get a few people going.... :kick:


So here's my humble timid contribution to the no doubt calm and reasoned dicscussion that will ensue.

I reckon it's " in the eye of the beholder". Like Harleys vs Jappers, or whatever. Really depends what you choose to measure. I've got a Ducati (an older one) and I love riding it. It's probably not as good a machine as a Japanese bike, and you get less bike for your dollars in terms of HP and reliability etc, but it has something a bit special about it that might be mostly in my mind, or not. I've also got a big bore Jap bike and I love riding it too. They're both different and both good. I'd hate to have to choose, and I'm happy to be lucky enough have them both. I've never ridden a Harley but they obviously get people passionate too. I say let's agree that there many kinds of bikes and bikers and types of riding situations, and that a narrow-minded adherence to " Ducati is best" or " Harley is best" or " Japanese is best" creates more heat than it does light.


HOWEVER I have ridden a Ducati 600 and a 750, and I'd have to say that you will get probably get more fun out of a Japanese bike for the money invested...the 600s are pretty under-powered. But they do make that lovely noise and they do come in that nice red colour....... :msn-wink:

[White trash]

I reckon it's " in the eye of the beholder". Like Harleys vs Jappers, or whatever. Really depends what you choose to measure. I've got a Ducati (an older one) and I love riding it. It's probably not as good a machine as a Japanese bike, and you get less bike for your dollars in terms of HP and reliability etc, but it has something a bit special about it that might be mostly in my mind, or not. I've also got a big bore Jap bike and I love riding it too. They're both different and both good. I'd hate to have to choose, and I'm happy to be lucky enough have them both. I've never ridden a Harley but they obviously get people passionate too. I say let's agree that there many kinds of bikes and bikers and types of riding situations, and that a narrow-minded adherence to " Ducati is best" or " Harley is best" or " Japanese is best" creates more heat than it does light.


:

Kerry, that was bloody well put. Couldn't have done it better myself.

And of course we all know that Harleys ARE the best

[nedj]

Yip... your are right. It is going to land up a slanging match. :calm:
Your response is roughly what I was looking for though. Having ridden the 600 and 750 vs the 4 cylinders . It seems that the lower range ducati's are not as ?robust? as what they could be. I guess one has to evalute what purpose a person wishes to use the bike for and then way up the pro's and cons.
Image vs Performance.... tough one. :niceone:

[White trash]

In my oppinion, and that aint worth shee-it, it's not even about image. I really don't think a 600 or 750SS is a particularly attractive bike.

916? Whooaaaarr!

MV? Faarrrk me!

But then, I do like V-Rods......... :niceone:

[Quasievil]

I Brought a new bike today !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :msn-wink:

[Drunken Monkey]

916? Whooaaaarr!


Hell yes, the 916 is one sexy machine... Even my old 88' Gixxer would give them more than a run for their money, BUT if I had that money then I would've taken the Duke any day...

[moko]

Trouble with Ducati 600`s is that they need plenty of maintenance to keep them in one piece.You either pay a fortune for a main dealer to service them or just hope that the home mechanic you bought it from knows his stuff,if not disaster isnt far away.Service costs are truly horrific and I know 2 guys with 600`s,one a very nice S,another with a Monster who cant shift them despite being priced at the same price as a manky Bandit 600 because they havnt got dealer FSH and no-one will touch them.The gearing`s too high,ludicrous steering lock and anything from an SV up-wards will give it a run for it`s money in just about every way apart from being a Ducati if that`s important to you.I`m a definate neutral in this one but honestly you`re far better off with an SV if it`s a V-Twin middleweight you want.If you think you want a 750SS try a few Jap bikes before you buy and see if it still seems like a good idea,every current Jap sports 600 will trash it if performance is what you`re after,if you want an all-rounder then VFR is nice and they sound awesome with loud pipes,I`d go for a late 750.

[DEATH_INC.]

Never ridden a 600/750 but I usta have a 900ss,Loved it even though it lacked power,it was heaps of fun to ride and that sound :Punk: Ended up breaking the engine cases though(from too many wheelies...)

[dangerous]

I test rode a 750ss and a 900paso a few years back and at the time I was riding a 'worked' CX500b...... stop ya bloody laughing, anyway I remember thinking that the CX was faster than the 750 and as quick as the 900.
Having owned Itialian before and loving em, I have still returned to the Jap crap..... so whats that say.


Ended up breaking the engine cases though (from too many wheelies...)
huh.... hows that?..... not that I'm worried about the Storm :mellow:

[Bandito]

Being a long time admirer of the duc, I am finally in a position to purchase one. Never having ridden a duc, I had pinned my hopes on a 600 ( only 5'6 and weighing under 70kg). I finally got my leg round and... well... :crybaby:
I was very dissapointed. My first thoughts were , mmm this is gonna be a beast in slow moving traffic. A serious amount of throttle and clutch controll at all times.
Long live the internet! On I went and started reading about peoples percpetions of the 600ss. Needless to say most of the reports said the 600 was .. for want of a better word, lacking. So this got me thinking is the 750 's any better?
Any body here ridden both ranges and be willing to share some of their thoughts on the pro's and cons of Ducai vs Kawa (or any other jap bikes).
:Playnice:
I once read in pommy magazine that a 600ss was a high cost -low performance and ucomfortable alternative to kawasaki's GPZ 500 commuter! :killingme

[moko]

I once read in pommy magazine that a 600ss was a high cost -low performance and ucomfortable alternative to kawasaki's GPZ 500 commuter! :killingme

My local paper run a really good bike page on a Friday,they tested the latest Harley Sportster and on the whole said it was a great improvement,parting shot was "At last the Sportster can be considered as a valid competitor to the CB500 as a cheap to run commuter" :2thumbsup

[moko]

nedj,timely post here that should solve your problem,check out Quasievil`s post "My New Bike",or something similar and you`ll see comments on the relative merits of the Duc 750 and a Jap 600 from someone who`s owned both.

[LB]

I reckon it's " in the eye of the beholder". Like Harleys vs Jappers, or whatever. Really depends what you choose to measure. I've got a Ducati (an older one) and I love riding it. It's probably not as good a machine as a Japanese bike, and you get less bike for your dollars in terms of HP and reliability etc, but it has something a bit special about it that might be mostly in my mind, or not. I've also got a big bore Jap bike and I love riding it too. They're both different and both good. I'd hate to have to choose, and I'm happy to be lucky enough have them both. I've never ridden a Harley but they obviously get people passionate too. I say let's agree that there many kinds of bikes and bikers and types of riding situations, and that a narrow-minded adherence to " Ducati is best" or " Harley is best" or " Japanese is best" creates more heat than it does light.


HOWEVER I have ridden a Ducati 600 and a 750, and I'd have to say that you will get probably get more fun out of a Japanese bike for the money invested...the 600s are pretty under-powered. But they do make that lovely noise and they do come in that nice red colour....... :msn-wink:

More or less sums up what I think. Though I've got two Ducs, not a Duc and a Jappa, but I've had many bikes over the years.

My Monsters suit me perfectly - got heaps of power for my riding style, light and handle like a dream, comfortable for touring as well as great for short day blasts, they sound magnificent, and have the word "Ducati" on the tank. I love them both to bits and at this stage I can't imagine having anything other than a Duc.

I'm not sure what year the 600 was that you rode, but my understanding is that the latest 620 engine with injection is more responsive than the old 600 engine.

As has been said before many times both on this site and elsewhere: all bikes are good, it's about "horses for courses" and whatever spins your wheels for you is the right bike. There is no such thing as a "bad bike". :D

Good luck!! Let us know what you decide to do.

[Sensei]

Yea riden a 600/750/900 & owned a 750 superlight & 93 907ie ,600 poor power / 750 not much better/ 900 great low down on a tight road but felt weak when on full load , 907 excellent ride & handled great but still no big HP Put your money into a sv650 with a Yosi pipe & you,ll get a great mid range bike for your buck. Happy buying Sensei NP

[FROSTY]

That said guys there is NOTHING on gods little green earth like the sound of a duck with the throttle wide open.
Sometimes it aint about HP or numbers on a page -more about pure riding pleasure.
If it was me -living in auckland so near 2 possible service agents i would say fuggit to whats on the tank and see what I enjoy riding the most.
_ohh and for the record I'd suggest the sv650
They come with aftermarket seats to lower them as well as a rear end lowering kit if that ain't enough

[Two Smoker]

huh.... hows that?..... not that I'm worried about the Storm :mellow:
Well wen you get the oppurtunity to ride with Deaht (if you can keep up :wacko: ) you will understand the word "wheelie" very well......

[dangerous]

Well wen you get the oppurtunity to ride with Deaht (if you can keep up :wacko: ) you will understand the word "wheelie" very well......

read between the lines TS :) (and that wont be a problem :wacko: )

[DEATH_INC.]

huh.... hows that?..... not that I'm worried about the Storm :mellow:
The Duke uses the engine as a stressed member,the cases taking the place of a bottom frame rail....

[Quasievil]

I had my first decent ride yesterday on my new 636R and I musy say it runs rings around the 750ss, I know the 750ss is only an entry Ducati, good looks and a name for sure but cutting edge technology and performance its not, but dont get me wrong, I loved the ducati it was great, however it didnt take me long before I needed something extra. I outgrew it quickly.The obvious next move would be a 748 which is what I wanted, but $$$$$ man for a decent post 98 model with lower Kms your big money, so I looked at the Kawasaki 636R WOW the difference is completely amazing, apart from the horsepower the bike handles beautifully it corners twice as better and does everything twice as better, my face is full on smile when riding it.
I am very excited at the moment

[dangerous]

The Duke uses the engine as a stressed member,the cases taking the place of a bottom frame rail....

Sorry I know we are a tad off topic, I thourght as much but most bikes now days use the engine as a stressed member so in your eyes is this a possibility with most bikes like my VTR or is it that the Duc's have weaker than norm cases?
Cos more likely the fork seals will go, the steering head and frame is more likely to crack before the cases IMO...... Oh all right I am worried about the VTR :rolleyes:

[scumdog]

That said guys there is NOTHING on gods little green earth like the sound of a duck with the throttle wide open.
Sometimes it aint about HP or numbers on a page -more about pure riding pleasure.
If it was me -living in auckland so near 2 possible service agents i would say fuggit to whats on the tank and see what I enjoy riding the most.
_ohh and for the record I'd suggest the sv650
They come with aftermarket seats to lower them as well as a rear end lowering kit if that ain't enough

You're dead right,it ain't just h.p. or numbers, the sound of my Sporty when you change down from (ahem) a high speed will raise the hackles on your neck, not unlike a Duke doing the same. :2thumbsup

[dangerous]

You're dead right,it ain't just h.p. or numbers, the sound of my Sporty when you change down from (ahem) a high speed will raise the hackles on your neck, not unlike a Duke doing the same. :2thumbsup

Couldent agree more, The 1100 Guzzi had IMO the best sound and looks possible like the small Duc's theres nothing like a high compression 2 valve V2 with open pipes theres something about the B.E.A.R's bikes..... but would I have one again, dont no the Jappa is by far the better bike in just about all ways.