F*cking lying pigs

[R6_kid]

Have just recieved my 'notice of prosecution for minor offence' relating to my speeding/loss of licence on the 26th of November last year.

The summary of facts states:
"Speed checked by radar at 139kmh" (that is correct) then goes on to say...

Explanation: "told police he had seen them do a u-turn and pursue him but he chose to continue riding and not-stop."

Now that is bullshit. I saw the cop indicate, i did not see anything else (didnt have mirrors on to see disco lights or him doing a u-turn)... i kept riding, yes, but i slowed down to the speed limit and waited to check that he was following me, at which point i saw him come around the corner like a bat out of hell with disco's on so i pulled over.

He said that he 'knew' i was going to run and asked me if this was true, i said that it was in the back of my mind but had decided not to.

If i had 'continued riding and not stopped' surely i wouldnt be recieving this letter as that would indicate he did not catch me, and also it would have been extremely hard for him to catch my number plate as my relative speed to him on the corner was 220kmh minimum (my 139kmh + him at 80kmh).

So what do i have to do now? I dont completely understand what the charge is the only indication of it being 'drove a vehicle on a road at a speed exceeding 80 kilometres per hour being the applicable speed limit'. So im guessing that means it is just a speeding ticket?

Penalty is a fine of up to $1000 and possibly extra disqualification.

The reverse side of the notification says i can:
1) Deny the charge and appear before the court
2) plead guilty (does this mean i still appear before the court)
3) do nothing and get treated as if i had pleaded guilty.

Is anyone able to shed some light on this for me and what is the best course of action?

[Firefight]

pm two smoker, same sort of thing happened to him, check with Glen (robomedic) he has the name of a good soliciter.

F/F

[R6_kid]

cheers mate will do. Just remember my next door neighbour is an ex-barrister/solicitor and is now a judge, might have a chat to him, though they dont like my bike much!

[MSTRS]

....
"Speed checked by radar at 139kmh" (that is correct) then goes on to say...
....(didnt have mirrors on to see disco lights or him doing a u-turn).......
'drove a vehicle on a road at a speed exceeding 80 kilometres per hour being the applicable speed limit'. .....?

59kph over (I guess you were roadside walking?) = fine + disqual ??
Lucky not pinged for unroadworthy too (no mirrors)
Grovel and hope for the best

[imdying]

Just get a lawyer... you won't even have to appear. They may trade you down to careless if you plead guilty or some thing like that.Sure it'll cost you a grand, but they'll make all your problems go away :)

[Zapf]

care to scan / photograph a copy of the notice?

[mikey]

whyd ya stop you koon.

[Disco Dan]

whyd ya stop you koon.

...should have just gone for it dude... I always thought if i was going fast enough to lose my license that it would be better to leg it + more chance of being able to pull into some driveway around a bend or something till they go past. Hope it works out dude!

[kiwifruit]

get a lawyer man

[Scouse]

The first thing you learn after you get a ticket is when the cop asks you shit say nothing ( if he says hey sonny theres no point trying to do a runner here cos we have go so many units operating around here, dont be tempted to say "yer well if I wanted to run there's no way you would catch me") If you can't get away with saying nowt just dont agree to anything but deffinatly dont let the cop lead you into saying anything that he can twist into somthing he can use against you in court, the reason they talk/Question/provoke you at the side of the road is to get you to say somthing that will make you look like a Twat in front of a Judge if you decide to defend the case. None of this is new shit its standard operating proceedures that the cops have been useing since the days of Sir John Peel

[Swoop]

Had you been told that "anything you say may be taken down and used as evidence in a court of law" etc?

[TLDV8]

http://www.ltsa.govt.nz/legislation/penalty.html



More than 35 kilometres an hour but not more than 40 kilometres an hour

$400

I thought you were walking at 140 kmh ?

Shouldn't this be a a normal busted for speeding pay the fine,get some points.


Exceeding speed limit by 36km/h or more.

50 points

The U turn bit is BS
I got a ticket a few weeks back... Like Hello,i see a cop going the other way so i am going to pull up and wait to see what happens?
I carried on,he did a U turn,lights came on..Common sense says when the lights come on it just became business..Until then it is Mr Plod driving down the road.

[Swoop]

I thought you were walking at 140 kmh?
A couple of mates walked for 50+ over the 100 limit.

[The Stranger]

cheers mate will do. Just remember my next door neighbour is an ex-barrister/solicitor and is now a judge, might have a chat to him, though they dont like my bike much!

The guy representing me on the bullshit dangerous charge seems quite good, he has represented a few here on KB and came recommended from one of them.

You may have to excuse him, he is a (older) boy racer - has a worked turbo Nissan - but at least you know his heart is in the right place, and compared to many quotes I got his prices are quite reasonable.

Can give you his name and number tomorrow if you like.

[Leong]

Good Luck mate.... sorry can't help.

[HenryDorsetCase]

Had you been told that "anything you say may be taken down and used as evidence in a court of law" etc?

not required in NZ as far as I know (thats a UK thing I think, like Miranda in the US)

I second the "get a lawyer" chorus.

[ridetwins]

anyone who is clocked at over 50kph above the speed limit is automatically sent to court for the charge as there is no instant offence notice with a prescribed fine that can be given on the side of the road. basically you'll get a fine of about 10x the speed over the limit you were doing, plus court costs.

"So what do i have to do now? I dont completely understand what the charge is the only indication of it being 'drove a vehicle on a road at a speed exceeding 80 kilometres per hour being the applicable speed limit'. So im guessing that means it is just a speeding ticket?

you wont get disqualified, that only happens if the charge is dangerous driving due to excess speed. if you plead guilty by letter or in court then the court will advise you of the penalty and thats that, no disqual. PM me for more as i have been through this before.

[Toaster]

Yep, its basically a court appearance for a speeding fine. Once you went over 50kmh over the limit (now 40kmh), you go to court. Doesn't look like its got anything to do with what was said. Just the fact that you were going a tad bit fast - which by the sounds of it you admitted to. It will be interesting to hear the result.

[TLDV8]

A couple of mates walked for 50+ over the 100 limit.

I just clicked.
I thought the thread was about doing 139 kmh in a 100 zone not 139 in an 80.

[Swoop]

not required in NZ as far as I know
I think you might be wrong on that one...
Certainly anything criminal it is needed, traffic might be a gray area, however if an officer is soliciting for information from you.........

If a policeman ever says "You have the right to remain silent..." DO SO!!!

[scumdog]

59kph over (I guess you were roadside walking?) = fine + disqual ??
Lucky not pinged for unroadworthy too (no mirrors)
Grovel and hope for the best

No rear vision mirror = $150

[spudchucka]

I think you might be wrong on that one...
Certainly anything criminal it is needed, traffic might be a gray area, however if an officer is soliciting for information from you.........

If a policeman ever says "You have the right to remain silent..." DO SO!!!

Its still your right to say nothing, however the cop doesn't have to tell you that when they are dealing with you over a minor traffic matter. Search the forums, there's been plenty of chatter on this subject before.

[Korea]

Well, you don't have to be non-responsive. Just don't say anything incriminating if you can help it.
Remember, don't be a prick when you've been pulled - it will get you nowhere. Nod and smile etx.
By being amicable, you might just get more (or less as the case may be) than you expect. Be a jerk and you may never hear the end of it...
My 2p

[WarlockNZ]

The police are required to advise you of your rights and the whole remain silent thing as well as anything you say can be used against you .. BUT!! .. only if you are being arrested.

If they are just pulling you over they don't have to advise you of shit.

On a side note .. 50K+ over the posted limit = walking
and yes .. always be polite to the police, we may not like them very much but they are just doing their jobs after all and if you act like a dick, they are more likely to go harder on you .. ( ohhh i'm going to get flamed for that comment)

I've always found a "yes Sir, no Sir" approach works well ... but like i said .. we may not like the police very much, but you have to show some respect for the uniform, even if the man/woman wearing it is a prick.

[Karma]

and yes .. always be polite to the police, we may not like them very much but they are just doing their jobs after all and if you act like a dick, they are more likely to go harder on you .. ( ohhh i'm going to get flamed for that comment)


The police yes, the guys that have to deal with domestic cases in south auckland and that, yes, I've got respect for them.

Now the Highway Patrol on the other hand... :nono:

[WarlockNZ]

The police yes, the guys that have to deal with domestic cases in south auckland and that, yes, I've got respect for them.

Now the Highway Patrol on the other hand... :nono:

well ... they are called snakes for a reason .. It still boggles my mind .. why did the govt merge the MOT and the police. we still have the MOT .. they just drive the blue and yellows now .. I miss the MOT ... the black and whites were so easy to spot! .. ha ha

[avgas]

hate to stir some of you up here with this (as most of you know i usually a calm and sane person).
But if i'm 50+ over the limit, i dont bother stopping. At 50+ they got you by the balls anyway, so may as well be for something decent.
Havnt had to run in quite a few years now, and dont intend to in future - but if the situation calls for it i know what i'm doing.
And before all of you blast me for the whole "Well if you crash you will regret it", all of my accidents have been well below set speed limit, and i have some decent ones - so the decision is not made lightly. Still not happy?- then walk a few hundred miles with the titanium wall decorations i have.

[Coyote]

Fuck da police

[davereid]

Trouble with running is that the death penalty may be applied ! With a car chase, police can use spikes, moving blocks and all sorts of techniques to stop you. And it won't kill you.

But on a bike, they chase you till you crash, or get away.

So, if you are good, and you have a fast superbike, and the cop doesnt want a death on his hands, you'll get away. But then again, maybe you'll just crash.

[Guitana]

So what do i have to do now? I dont completely understand what the charge is the only indication of it being 'drove a vehicle on a road at a speed exceeding 80 kilometres per hour being the applicable speed limit'. So im guessing that means it is just a speeding ticket?

Penalty is a fine of up to $1000 and possibly extra disqualification.

Is anyone able to shed some light on this for me and what is the best course of action?[/QUOTE]

Depends on the judge they threw the book at me maximum penalty $1000
6 months disqualified for doing 236 in a 100k zone.
You're just lucky that "TOP COP" Clint rickards and his mates did'nt pull you over ya might have woken up in the morning feeling disorientated and Violated.
Get a good lawyer to look at the offence notice and pick it apart if the officer has made a statement that's not correct you may have a chance!
Good luck let us know how you get on after you've seen a legal rep!

[N4CR]

gET A LAWYER.
<IMG SRC=http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=51554&stc=1&d=1169344729>

[NighthawkNZ]

had a bad day huh...

Dear Abby,
the police don't like me, i don't like the police... what should I do...?

[R6_kid]

cheers for the feedback guys. Have had a couple of PMs and it would seem that i am only up for the speeding charge, not dangerous etc so once i've got some more info and spoken to a solicitor i'll probably just plead guilty to the speeding, as long as nothing else is tied in to it.

Mikey - like i said, the thought was in my head but the amount of dimwit push bikers i saw ahead were blocking my only clean exit, hence why i decided not to do the runner and the thought stayed in the back of my head instead of becoming my reaction.

Will post back when i know what the full deal is for those that are wanting to know.

As said by some when/if you do get pulled, be polite, give them your licence, yes sir - no sir etc, but dont give up any info that you dont need to. It's got me out of trouble a couple of times wasnt so lucky this time though!

[Lou Girardin]

DON'T make any off the cuff comments about what you might or might not have done.
Name, rank and serial number only.

[Pixie]

Had you been told that "anything you say may be taken down and used as evidence in a court of law" etc?

The standard reply to this is,of course,"knickers"

To the US "Anything you say may be held against you" is,likewise,Pamela Anderson,or the current babe of the week.

[Sycophant]

For what it's worth, I've always had good results by being amicable and honest with the cops, but I've not been snapped for anything like 50k over.

I got pulled up coming off the harbour bridge a couple of weeks ago... Cop said "do you know how fast you were going on the bridge", I said, "no, I don't I was just moving with the traffic." Too my surprise he says "yeah, I saw that, and you had a good following distance too." - he went back to the car, checked my licence and stuff I guess, and then came back and sent me on my way.

As far as I can figure, I was probably going about 90 or so, and he just decided to pull me over (I get off the bridge by the traffic base) and decided to let me be when I wasn't a cock about it.

As for the ticket in the original post - I guess that side of the story is just that, the cop's side of the story, it's how he remembers the conversation. Not entirely wrong I guess, but not really accurate either.

[Shadows]

The judge might consider the any information in determining his ruling. "Decided not to stop" doesn't sound very good and might land you with a harsher penalty. I'd deny that statement in court until I was blue in the face.

[Hawk]

I had a similar experance as Sycophant, in traffic doing the same speed as everyone else, got pulled over, same answer, same result, I put it down to honesty and treating the officer as I would anyone else, with respect and honesty. After all they have job to do just like anyone else.

[The Pastor]

cheers mate will do. Just remember my next door neighbour is an ex-barrister/solicitor and is now a judge, might have a chat to him, though they dont like my bike much!


Remember that as a rule of thumb, judges hate cops, more so when they waste there time with a false case. If the cop has lied about you doing a runner, get a lawyer and use that as a main point in your case. If the cop is found to of lied about one thing in your case you automaticly win.

[Podo]

hate to stir some of you up here with this (as most of you know i usually a calm and sane person).
But if i'm 50+ over the limit, i dont bother stopping. At 50+ they got you by the balls anyway, so may as well be for something decent.
Havnt had to run in quite a few years now, and dont intend to in future - but if the situation calls for it i know what i'm doing.
And before all of you blast me for the whole "Well if you crash you will regret it", all of my accidents have been well below set speed limit, and i have some decent ones - so the decision is not made lightly. Still not happy?- then walk a few hundred miles with the titanium wall decorations i have.

I wouldn't rush into that strategy, unless you like walking that is, a few years back I got pinged at 54kph over the speed limited, the cop let me know that in no uncertain terms he could have my keys on the spot, but he was reasonable and downgraded my offense so I could keep the keys, cost me a solid fine and points of course, but at least I wasn't walking!

[Patrick]

I wouldn't rush into that strategy, unless you like walking that is, a few years back I got pinged at 54kph over the speed limited, the cop let me know that in no uncertain terms he could have my keys on the spot, but he was reasonable and downgraded my offense so I could keep the keys, cost me a solid fine and points of course, but at least I wasn't walking!

Damn.. he was lying too...talked it down from 154...lying prick....

[Dai]

When I was a lot younger and back when there was a seperate traffic department I had a similar experience.

I joined the NZ Army and while away doing my basic training I loaned my bike to my younger brother. While I was away the WOF expired and he got pulled for it by the Traffic Cops.

When I got back a few months later I had a knock on the door one day from a bailiff come to collect my fine. I knew nothing about this and the bailiff advised me to appeal.

This I did. I had letters from my commandin officer and such stating that on the day in question I was in Waiuru Army Camp and not AWOL at all so therefore I couldnt have been riding the bike. (They actually named me as the rider).

The day came and I went to court for my appeal but just before my case came up the traffic police sargent took me aside and told me that they knew I wasnt the rider but if I didnt plead guilty to the charge they were going to do my brother for stealing the bike.

I went before the judge and changed my plea. Judge asked me why I was pleading guilty and I told him exactly what the police sargent had just said to me. The court burst into laughter when I pointed out the sargent.

The judge commended me on my use of the appeal facility and as I had changed my plea to guilty he imposed the fine of 50 cents upon me with no points. He then turned to the sargentand ordered him to report to his chambers immediately.

I dont know what went on in there but I do know that for the next year whenever there was some sort of trouble in my home town I was visited by the police asking me where I was and what I had been doing. As to the sargent, never saw him again. Hope the arsehole lost his job. I was only 20 at the time and he was a bullying SOB.

[avgas]

I wouldn't rush into that strategy, unless you like walking that is, a few years back I got pinged at 54kph over the speed limited, the cop let me know that in no uncertain terms he could have my keys on the spot, but he was reasonable and downgraded my offense so I could keep the keys, cost me a solid fine and points of course, but at least I wasn't walking!
Cant get your keys if he cant get you.
But like i said before.......i dont rush into that strategy anymore. But if the circumstance required/allowed - i know what i'm doing.
Im too sick of the BS dangerous driving charges in this country - its less than actually speeding.

[Patrick]

CDai... he could only do your brother for false details - $750 instant fine, plus the other things he gave your name for.... hope you gave your bro a slapping, ruining your good name... good job for the dick cop.

[vagrant]

Nice one Dai,
A fair few years back I got pinged doing 184k on the straight from Blenheim to Woodbourne.
The cop was the only other car on the road, going the other way. He U turned and chased after me, but didn't put the light and sound show on till he saw me turn into the Base.
I got charged for the same thing, exceding a posted speed limit.
Had my day in court and thought I was going to the wall.
The JP's were really hard on a couple of truck drivers who had accidents with dumbass cage drivers who put themselves into places where the truckies could not see them, I mean, what sort of idiot tries to turn up the inside of an R-tick going round a round about! The Truckie got done for dangerous driving. WTF:sick:

They were going to disqualify me for a month, but they wanted to give me a work permit. The cop said they couldn't give me a work permit in the first month, so they fined me $150 plus cost of $25, shook their fingers at me and said "We don't want to see you on a bike for a month":nono:

(bonus, no demerit points in court:laugh: )

The Cop was gutted, said he should have done me for dangerous as well.

I swapped my bike for a mates car for a couple of days, but he got fed up of being pulled over by every Cop in town.:innocent:

I guess if you show up to court, let the lawyer do all the talking, and look innocent and contrite you will do Ok, all things considered.
You could have been done for dangerous right off the bat, then you would be screwed.:shit:

[Fatjim]

He wouldn't have been able to do your brother for shit. The police testify that it was you, but you they prove it's not you with affidavits. The cops aren't gonna get very far pointing the finger at someone else are they. The judge would just say the scattergun approach ain't gonna work.

[Fatjim]

I've always found a "yes Sir, no Sir" approach works well ... but like i said .. we may not like the police very much, but you have to show some respect for the uniform, even if the man/woman wearing it is a prick.

Funny, cause I've always found a get in their face and act all "bloody pigs, always picking on motorcyclists" works a treat too.

[Dai]

He wouldn't have been able to do your brother for shit. The police testify that it was you, but you they prove it's not you with affidavits. The cops aren't gonna get very far pointing the finger at someone else are they. The judge would just say the scattergun approach ain't gonna work.


I know that now, now that I'm a grand old man of 50, but then I was a very young 20, just out of training and as a result a bit in awe of authoriative figures (ie commanding officers). I was so shocked at the time I believed he could do what he said he could. I was also sure that he wasnt going to get away with threatening me.

Full of piss and vinegar and ready to take on the world.

[Shadows]

I wouldn't rush into that strategy, unless you like walking that is, a few years back I got pinged at 54kph over the speed limited, the cop let me know that in no uncertain terms he could have my keys on the spot, but he was reasonable and downgraded my offense so I could keep the keys, cost me a solid fine and points of course, but at least I wasn't walking!

I've seen the same thing happen, I was on the back of a bike pulled over for going a bit too fast.
The cop asked how fast we were going, the reply was "Awwww about 140", to which the cop replied "And the rest! It took me four k's to catch up with you".

"Just blowing out the cobwebs, mate. Sorry about that".

He told us to be more careful and let us on our way.

[Patrick]

Funny, cause I've always found a get in their face and act all "bloody pigs, always picking on motorcyclists" works a treat too.

Yep... that'll earn you a ticket EVERY time...

[Patrick]

"Just blowing out the cobwebs, mate. Sorry about that".

He told us to be more careful and let us on our way.

Honesty works... with me anyway... extra points for originality!!

[ldnz]

Whats with the whole runner thing? Surely if they get your number plate they can just track you down later?

[deathstar]

well about 2-3 months ago there was all this crap with 6 people being caught on the thursday night ride and ofcourse they pinged and booked me at a speed the manafacturers have proved that the bike can not do .... but anyway .... when we were pulled over 65km's later i asked him where and when i was pinged and he just said ... "i don't know" and yet got a letter through putting it down to an exact minute on an exact corner which is slightly odd since their statements were made 6 weeks after the incident now i can't even remember what i had for breakfast yesterday let alone who i pinged in the dark 6 weeks ago ... sounds like crap to me

[N4CR]

whats with the whole runner thing? surely if they get your number plate they can just track you down later?

they have to be able to read it in the first place.... most of the time you're going to fast for them to read it as you go past anyway. if you can't loose them and they are behind you to read it ya might as well give up.


sounds like crap to me
yeap just like the cop saying jimbo600 jim or whoever was splitting yellows and theycouldn't catch while he had cctv footage of his bike at that time in his garage. a few ****headed cops wrecking the good reputations of the rest.