Cam chain replaced but problem not solved

[timphy2]

I recently bought a 1991 zxr250 and when I bought it, the previous owner told me that the cam chain needed replacing because there was rattling coming from the engine. So yesterday I brought my bike into a garage and got the cam chain done and got it serviced to save money on labour. but when i got it back, the rattling noise was still there. I asked the guy and he said that it was the clutch cable that was worn and that needed replacing. Does this sound correct?

It does feel like the clutch cable need to be replaced because if i change gear up fast at 10,000 rpm it will still be in 10,000rpm and then go down. if that makes any sense to you.

I know very little about the mechanical parts of a bike so i wouldn't have a clue and i would appreciate it if someone who did could tell me whats going on.

They quoted me $400 for the cam chain to get done and $300 for the service but because i did ti at the same time i only had to pay $380.

I would appreciate any help. thanks

[Drum]

Well it's only a minor job to replace the clutch cable, so if there's any doubt you should go ahead and change it. You can do it yourself - just get the shop to order you a new cable.

[Madness]

Cam Chain replaced, what about the Chain Tensioner?

I wouldn't have thought a worn Clutch Cable could make for a noisy engine??

[Wasp]

It does feel like the clutch cable need to be replaced because if i change gear up fast at 10,000 rpm it will still be in 10,000rpm and then go down. if that makes any sense to you.
Sounds like what my Bandit was doing, what if you accelerate REALLY hard? does it like slip and let go and the revs go up for a bit?

[timphy2]

Well it's only a minor job to replace the clutch cable, so if there's any doubt you should go ahead and change it. You can do it yourself - just get the shop to order you a new cable.

yes i know but i want to know if its possible whether a worn clutch cable can make such a noise.

[timphy2]

Cam Chain replaced, what about the Chain Tensioner?

I wouldn't have thought a worn Clutch Cable could make for a noisy engine??

The guy thought it was the tensioner in the start, but then called me and told me it was the chain that needed replacing

[timphy2]

Sounds like what my Bandit was doing, what if you accelerate REALLY hard? does it like slip and let go and the revs go up for a bit?

umm yer sorta, its hard cause i only just started riding so i dont know whether its the bike or me doing something wrong. :P

[ninjac]

You are getting clutch slippage, but this shouldn't rattle.
Adjust/replace clutch cable if slippage still occurs then you need to get new/reburbish clutch plates.
Something is still fishy with the cam chain if it rattles.

[Ixion]

Worn clutch cable wouldn't normally make a noise. And usually will cause drag (noisy gear changes, stalling , hard to find neutral) not slip ("power loss", over revving).

But a worn clutch may rattle, and cause slip.

Get someone knowledgeable to listen and ride .

Bear in mind that the cam chain may have needed repalcement as well, so the shop was not necessarily wrong. Though that price sounds rather cheap.

[Motu]

Often it's a case of get rid of one noise and ''create'' another - that was there all the time and sounds similar.

[terbang]

If yer gonna change yer cam chain it is good practise to look closely at the tensioner and associated pads and guides and replace them. Clutch baskets and associated bearings and bits, when worn, will rattle at idle. If the rattle changes or goes away when you pull the clutch lever in, then there's your problem. A good way to test for a slipping clutch is gas it hard in say 4th or 5th and just momentarily bump the clutch (don't do this if you ride a Hayabusa), if it sort of sounds like an automatic car when changing gear and the RPM doesn't immediatly return some sort of sensible figure then you need to look at your friction plates and springs.

[timphy2]

My bike has done 45,000 and apparently the rattling is normal for a bike that has done so many ks. im still not completely satisfied that i can't do anything about this rattling but i will leave it for now. someone mentioned clutch plates so i might look into that. Thanks everybody for the help and advice.

[T.W.R]

My bike has done 45,000 and apparently the rattling is normal for a bike that has done so many ks. im still not completely satisfied that i can't do anything about this rattling but i will leave it for now. someone mentioned clutch plates so i might look into that. Thanks everybody for the help and advice.

Does the rattle increase or decrease with various engine rpm? or is it a consistent rattle? what area of the engine does the rattle emanate from?

Is what you're calling a rattle a rattle or a tapping noise ?

[Ixion]

It's 16 years old , it will have been ruthlessly raped for 45000km. Some engine noise is to be expected.

[timphy2]

Does the rattle increase or decrease with various engine rpm? or is it a consistent rattle? what area of the engine does the rattle emanate from?

Is what you're calling a rattle a rattle or a tapping noise ?

it increases when i drive the bike, but not the rpm. so when i rev it stationary, it doesnt increase, but when i drive i can here it ratting faster. it comes from under the fuel tank, right side ish. ummm kinda in between a rattle and a tapping noise. kinda hard to explain sorry.

[timphy2]

It's 16 years old , it will have been ruthlessly raped for 45000km. Some engine noise is to be expected.

yer true, however some part of the bike must be making that noise, so there is a possibility to replace that part with a new one. but true im sure its had its days of ruthlessly bein raped.

[rookie]

bloody kb wont let me pm you back sorry

Hey Tim

Ok so you have had the cam chain AND(?) the cam chain tensioner replaced?? was the tensioner an auto tensioner or manual??
how long ago??

Ok...so if the chain AND tensioner have been replaced, could you try something for me??
sit on your bike... start her up... put the stand up... chuck it in first... and release the clutch to the point where the bike wants to start moving....

DID THE RATTLE GO AWAY?!

If so, its got the same rattle as mine...its due to wear in the clutch basket(housing). What happens is that the housing wears over time as the plates are constantly vibrating. As the wear increases the rattle gets a bit louder. It doesnt have any affect on the clutch itself...its just noisy. The housing is a bloody expensive part to replace...second hand parts are going to be worn as well.

I wouldnt say its a problem...more of a feature.
oh btw...my bike has done 50,000km now so i'll let you know if it does end up being the cam chain for me.

btw...ive had a shit load of problems between the 47-50,000km mark.
Keep an eye on the battery charge(regulator may need doing), front fork seals, radiator/overflow water level, clutch, clutch and throttle cables, and make sure you keep up with oil and filter changes.

I can help out with most stuff as ive started doing some things myself to try and save money

Let me know how it goes

cheers
Stephen

[rookie]

When the cam chain was replaced the tensioner should have also been replaced...if not then i suggest you pu it back into the shop...Dont worry its cheap, shouldnt be more than $130 including labour.

If the clutch is slipping try adjusting the clutch so that it doesnt...if not possible than you will need to have a fresh clutch kit installed...about $95 for parts... you'll also need new motor oil.

[roadracingoldfart]

As a mechanic i daily have customers that have a "rattle" or "clunk" and all i have to say is that what the cistomer may be hearing is differant to what a mechanic will hear as we have a more trained ear to hear the "normal "engine chassis noises than most. Unless you have the ability to go for a ride with a mechanic and say , its "THAT" noise then they may hear what you dont and place a differant priority on the work required than is really needed based on what is heard by them.
What im trying to point out is even a NASA rocket scientist cant tell you what a noise is without hearing it and you may well find a couple of hundred other peoples ideas are miles away from the truth. ( im not knocking the helpers ) but this sort of thing cant be sorted on a read and reply forum like this unlike a problem of "oil is falling out the hole in the bottom of my engine "
My reccomendation is to go to another bike shop and dont tell them whats already been done but ask them if the noise is something to worry about and can they then give a rough cost to fix it if it has got a problem.
Cheers Paul.

[Max Preload]

If the noise is present at idle, half the battle of finding it, is won.

Narrow the actual source using a mechanics stethescope or simply a screwdriver with the handle in your ear and the blade pushed firmly against vavious parts of the engine.

[RSrider]

Funny, my story sounds identical to the original posters. I have a 1993 ZXR250 C. It has the same rattle as described in the first post. I too took it into my local bikeshop who informed me it was the cam chain/tensioner and advised to replace it. After getting my bike back and a $600 bill, the bike was still making the same noise.

After a little talk they refunded me the money, as they hadnt fixed the reattle, which is what I asked for, the bike had only done 14000kms, there was nothing wrong with the cam chain.

My bike does as you say, rattles until you let the clutch out to the point of take off, then it goes away. Is there ANY way of fixing it?

[discotex]

My bike does as you say, rattles until you let the clutch out to the point of take off, then it goes away. Is there ANY way of fixing it?

Totally normal for bikes to have rattling sounds at idle. Doesn't mean it's broken.

You have to remember that unlike a cage there is nothing absorbing the normal rattles of the engine, gearbox and clutch.

What's important is unusual rattles that get worse with RPM or over time.

[Drum]

I've owned two Kawasaki's and they both had/ have noisy engines. Something to do with the primary chain design I believe (Hi-vo chain).

The Zephyr is typically described as sounding like a sack of hammers.

[rookie]

After a little talk they refunded me the money, as they hadnt fixed the rattle

Nice work on the refund.

I have been off the bike for a while now, but my mechanics repsonse (back when i owned a zxr) was that the rattle was coming from the play between the clutch basket and the clutch plate fingers.

When the clutch was released to the point of take-up then the rattle went away. It didnt affect the clutch operation but sounded a bit rough when idling.

I never got this replaced tho as it was one of those $500 genuine spare part jobs.

[FLYMO]

yeah its got that sound of being a clutch basket gettinga bit warm

[Max Preload]

My bike does as you say, rattles until you let the clutch out to the point of take off, then it goes away. Is there ANY way of fixing it?

What does it do with the clutch engaged (that's you not touching the lever) in neutral?

[jonbuoy]

Carb syn might help if its the clutch plates jangling around in the basket. That should have been done on the service anyway but worth checking.

[RSrider]

In neutral the rattle is present, and it is also present in every other gear until you release the clutch lever.

[The Pastor]

Zxrs rattle its what they do :)