How do you change careers? [Archive]

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 09:07

I’m feeling a bit frustrated with my job and think I need a change. I’ve been working at a software development company for five years now. I started out doing support (aka Help Desk) then moved into technical writing, and finally into business analysis.

I quite like making site visits and writing documentation, but I get bored once I’ve described how we’re going to customise the product, and then hand it over to a programmer to create. I’m only 26 so it’s not like I’ve spent 20 years doing a job and can’t be retrained.

Tauranga isn’t a huge city and it’s IT industry consists of about 20 companies. Add to that, software development doesn’t turn me on anyway. I’d be keen to change industries but am hesitant because it would involve taking a huge pay cut (like $10,000). Ideally, I’d like to be an automotive journalist.

I’m not keen on leaving Tauranga because all of my family lives here – plus, it’s so damn expensive to buy a house here. If I sold my house to move away, I’d probably never afford to buy here again if I wanted to come back again.

I know that happiness is the most important thing. I’m keen to hear how you guys have dealt with issues regarding money versus job satisfaction.

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 09:14

Change industries and make Neal work harder for the extra $10,000.
Haha! I love the sound of that :rockon: It's a shame I'm not ready for kids, otherwise I could stay at home and cook him eggs...

_Gina_

29th March 2007, 09:17

vifferman

29th March 2007, 09:18

Don't ask me - I get bored very easily. Perhaps Big Dave or Beemer can tell you.

I've changed careers many times: started off doing chemistry, then geology. I've been a furniture delivererer, a labourer, geological assistant/lab technician, a farm labourer, agricultural research technician / sheep shagger, dairy laboratory supervisor, systems manager, supervisor of software services, software tester/installer, technical writer, and now I'm a professional contributer to sites such as this one.

vifferman

29th March 2007, 09:22

Haha! I love the sound of that :rockon: It's a shame I'm not ready for kids, otherwise I could stay at home and cook him eggs...
Oh - I left that off my CV. For two and a half years (when we lived in Tauranga), I was a contract programmer/analyst, which meant I spent most of my time, cooking, cleaning and doing other domestic duties. I loved the flexibility and the programming (@ $60/hour plus expenses), and enjoyed building a new kitchen from scratch, but hated the loneliness and my wife resenting our crappy house and my income dropping from $40k to about $30k.

Joni

29th March 2007, 09:23

I can relate to what you are saying 100%... Up in Auckland I had a job that most people would think is great, earned good money... but was really not very happy! Made a huge change and came to Chch, I earn almost 30K per annum less here than I did in AKL, but to me I dont really care... I am happy, and the fact that I cant buy as many things as I used to, does not matter.
My opinion, for what ever its worth, if you are not happy... make the change, just ensure the bills can be paid, all the extras money can buy dont really count if you are miserable at the place you spend a major part of your time.

Hmm... dpoes that make sense?

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 09:26

My partner is in that situation too.

I would suggest that the $10,000.00 drop p/a would mean nothing if you were re training to do something that was exactly what you wanted to do.

You would make the adjustments gladly.

Do you know how to get into the Automotive Journalism industry?
Not really, we know a guy who works for the Motorcycle Trader (although I'm not sure what his job title is). We also know the guy from Bike Rider Mag. I've written an article for them before. I wonder if I should think about journalism in general, then try going automotive?

I hear what you're saying about the pay cut. It all makes sense when you put it into perspective.

_Gina_

29th March 2007, 09:27

Hmm... dpoes that make sense?
Certainly does !

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 09:28

My opinion, for what ever its worth, if you are not happy... make the change, just ensure the bills can be paid, all the extras money can buy dont really count if you are miserable at the place you spend a major part of your time.

Hmm... does that make sense?

Thanks Joni, it makes perfect sense :rockon:
I know what I need to do, not sure how hubby will feel about it.

_Gina_

29th March 2007, 09:31

Not really, we know a guy who works for the Motorcycle Trader (although I'm not sure what his job title is). We also know the guy from Bike Rider Mag. I've written an article for them before.
I wonder whether you could carry on working at your current job and start writing more and more stuff for the likes of BRM etc.

I would assume that this might lead to an opportunity to change career?

Good luck with it !

Joni

29th March 2007, 09:33

I think bananaman might surprise you... at the end of the day I am sure he wants you to be happy... so a plan can always be made! :sunny:

James Deuce

29th March 2007, 09:35

DMNTD

29th March 2007, 09:39

3.5 years ago I gave up my job/Co. to seek a better/happier way of life.
Currently earning $65,000 less per annum yet never have felt "richer" in all my Life.
Money is money....easy to make. Happiness is everything :yes:
All I'm saying is Life is way to short to do something you're not completely happy with...I mean what's the point eh?
Go with your gut :rockon:

TerminalAddict

29th March 2007, 09:43

Do it before you have kids.

Once you've got them and a mortgage, it's all over.

There are always exceptions to that rule, and for some reason they seem to come predominantly from the motorcyclist branch of humanity, but fundamentally, once you have a mortgage and kids, you'll die doing what you do at that point to earn a crust.

:cry: now you're just trying to hurt my feelings aren't you

I already have a mortgage, kids, digs, cats, horse, vehicles, etc etc

Changing Jobs is prett6y hard .. let alone changing careers ... doesn't help that I am the primary income earner, and can't afford to take a pay cut

Joni

29th March 2007, 09:45

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 09:46

Money is money....easy to make. Happiness is everything :yes:
All I'm saying is Life is way to short to do something you're not completely happy with...I mean what's the point eh?
Go with your gut :rockon:
Agreed. I've wanted to leave for the past two years and have kept changing jobs (within the company) to try and stay happy.

I'm thinking it's time to bite the bullet. My boss is the one who said you don't grow if you never throw yourself outside your comfort zone! Plus, being unemployed with no money is heaps of motivation to take action. :sunny:

Smorg

29th March 2007, 09:48

Currently earning $65,000 less per annum

Fuck thats a huge pay cut

DMNTD

29th March 2007, 09:54

Fuck thats a huge pay cut

It's actually a lot more than that but didn't want to sound wanky.

Just to reiterate...I feel far wealthier now. I can pay the bills...ride a reasonable bike or two...feed my kids. What else is required?

_Gina_

29th March 2007, 09:56

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 10:04

Just to reiterate...I feel far wealthier now. I can pay the bills...ride a reasonable bike or two...feed my kids. What else is required?
I guess it depends on how materialistic you are!

Busy

29th March 2007, 10:05

Do both.

Go freelance (submit articles to whoever) while your still at your job, as getting a name for yourself or a foot in the door is the hardest part.
You've said you've submitted articles before and know some people in the trade so you are half way there already. You probably wont need training in journalism if you are already submitting stuff (I did a dip. in photo journlaism even though my spelling and gramer is shocking - is only a bit of paper)
Going freelance does two things, gives you a wide range of places to submit (if you choose to test the waters of different styles/fields) and gives you an exciting CV/Portfolio. plus the money can be more but I wont mention that ;)

Doing this while working does take up a lot of time but if you find journalism isnt for you, then you still have a pay packet.
These days its more who you know than what you know.

good luck

DMNTD

29th March 2007, 10:08

I guess it depends on how materialistic you are!

I guess that's one of the reasons I believe in passive income :yes:
If you haven't already I strongly recommend you read Robert Kiyosaki's Rich Dad-Poor Dad. (http://www.richdadpoordad.com/)
Enables one to have a life whilst still being able to pay the bills :rockon:

Smorg

29th March 2007, 10:17

Other than sex - NOTHING !

:rockon:

Can we run away together? I have no money no house and no clothes or friends but I'm really good at sex at thats all we will ever need..........

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 10:20

I guess that's one of the reasons I believe in passive income :yes:
If you haven't already I strongly recommend you read Robert Kiyosaki's Rich Dad-Poor Dad. (http://www.richdadpoordad.com/)
Enables one to have a life whilst still being able to pay the bills :rockon:

Hmm, sounds like changing jobs is actually a case of re-evaluating my priorities and desired lifestyle. That's some serious shit! :doh:

Smorg

29th March 2007, 10:20

It's actually a lot more than that but didn't want to sound wanky.

Just to reiterate...I feel far wealthier now. I can pay the bills...ride a reasonable bike or two...feed my kids. What else is required?

Well you've done better than I could have done in your situation, Im far to materialistic to be throwing that much doe out the window. I love my money even though I never seem to spend it. Bit of a Scrooge Mc Duck:yes:

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 10:41

Has anyone read What Colour is your Parachute? If so, did it help you? A workmate is telling me I should read it.

The_Dover

29th March 2007, 10:43

aren't there any brothels in Tauranga to make up the spare cash?

Bloody Mad Woman (BMW)

29th March 2007, 10:48

I agree with Busy - do both. Or part-time with main job if you can and study journalism.

Agree with Dmntd. You can't buy happiness and love of life.

Today I feel the richest person in the world. I can support myself. I have the basics materially. Don't need anything Want yes!! i.e. new leathers, helmet etc. Have a huge marriage debt but all is being paid off slowly. However I love my work, lead a simplistic lifestyle, and have balance between work and life. Plus fantastic friends.

Take the plunge you won't regret it.

Beemer

29th March 2007, 11:01

Not really, we know a guy who works for the Motorcycle Trader (although I'm not sure what his job title is). We also know the guy from Bike Rider Mag. I've written an article for them before. I wonder if I should think about journalism in general, then try going automotive?

I hear what you're saying about the pay cut. It all makes sense when you put it into perspective.

Sorry to put the damper on things but I know what the pay is like in journalism and I have an idea of what the pay is like in IT. If you think you will only drop $10,000 in salary, you must only be earning about $33,000.

I was in a similar situation when I decided to train as a journalist in 1994. I was a sales rep at that point, earning about $30,000, and after shelling out about $8000 (it's probably more now) in fees at Wellington Polytechnic (now Massey), I started my first job on a newspaper at $23,000. And yes, that was fulltime!

During my time on that paper I had developed an interest in motorsport and covered rallying, road racing and motorcycling as a freelancer for The Evening Post, Speedsport, Kiwi Rider and a few smaller motoring publications. I got paid per photo (usually about $50) and per word (between 30-40c per word), and out of those payments I had to buy and maintain my own camera equipment, pay for petrol, accommodation, film (hardly anyone used digital in those days), etc. It cost me about $1000 to cover the Rally of NZ once you factored in all that - and no, I didn't always cover my costs. I did it because I loved it but I wasn't rolling in money, that's for sure!

Years later I worked as a senior photographer on a daily paper - earning $27,000. Journalists at the Manawatu Standard earn about $36,000 per year before tax, and for that they work shifts and rostered weekends. If you were the editor of a reasonably sized paper (which would only happen after about 10 years or more of hard work), you could earn about $50,000.

As for being an automotive journalist, the market is not that huge in NZ and there are only a few successful females. The Standard no longer has a motoring editor and The Evening Post's motoring section died before the paper merged with The Dominion. I still write some motoring articles and get paid a few hundred dollars for them - the payment all depends on the size of the publication and how much advertising they draw in. You would have to be prepared to travel widely to do this fulltime - most writers for motoring publications are freelancers - which means they usually only get paid for what gets published.

Unfortunately you wouldn't step straight into an automotive writer's position even if there were lots of them on offer. It's one thing to have an interest in a subject, it's quite another to be able to write about it well. Most people who write for these publications are established journalists who have been writing (not just motoring articles) for years and have an established reputation.

I have been freelancing for almost five years now and don't just write - I take photos, do proofreading and editing - and some temping work when things are slow. You'll find most freelance writers do the same. I'm not trying to put you off, but journalism is not a highly paid career on the whole - it is extremely interesting and rewarding, but if you think you will be earning a good salary from day one, you will be very disappointed.

PM me if you want a link to my website or some more information. There are some good debates going at present about rates for freelancers on Journz - http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/journz/ They have a freelancers conference in May and this is one of the topics we will be discussing. You could freelance and offer articles to publications but it won't necessarily get you a fulltime job or make you rich!

And BMW - you can study journalism papers extramurally for graduate diplomas, but the diploma course in journalism is only available fulltime.

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 11:06

aren't there any brothels in Tauranga to make up the spare cash?

Yeah, there are, but they don't want Cajun!

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 11:14

You could freelance and offer articles to publications but it won't necessarily get you a fulltime job or make you rich!

Very informative - thanks for that! It sounds like it takes years to build yourself up, so I guess I'd better do it on the side while I have a full time job.

vifferman

29th March 2007, 12:22

There's always the other option, Adele.
I looked at changing careers years ago, and after paying a whole lot of money to attend a course on finding my perfect job (I also have lots of books on this topic, but not "What Color is Your Parachute"), I walked out when I suddenly realised that most of the things I was interested in, and that made me contented, were things I could do regardless of what my career was. This included photography, music, crafts such as stained glass, bikes, and writing. Having a job that didn't fulfill me made my working hours tough (and I think has wrecked my health), but looked after my family's needs and funded my hobbies.

Ideally (if I'd made a move before I was encumbered and my brain was ferkt), I should have taken the time to think long and hard about what I was going to do with my life, instead of drifting off to university. If I had, now I'd be writing, painting, sculpting, making stuff, and generally being creative instead of slowly decaying at my desk.

Bloody Mad Woman (BMW)

29th March 2007, 12:50

Beemer - I enjoyed reading your reply - crikey I never knew journalism was so lowly paid.

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 12:57

Ideally (if I'd made a move before I was encumbered and my brain was ferkt), I should have taken the time to think long and hard about what I was going to do with my life, instead of drifting off to university.
I envy the people who know what they want to achieve out of their lives. Generally speaking, I have no freakin' clue! Well, about the big picture anyway.

This has always been my biggest problem and I must drive Cajun insane. I’m very very ambitious and somehow manage to blitz any goals I set myself. Hubby considers my goals to be unrealistic, yet I seem to beat them by years; for example, I wanted to own a house by 25 and I did before I was 23.

I get really frustrated when I don’t have a goal or something to work towards. I think this is why I’m in this position at the moment. I’ve achieved everything I set out to do.

I shouldn’t complain – after all, I’m 26, earn reasonable money, have a lovely husband :love:, a house, and all the toys I can dream of. I’ve got everything I want, yet I’m not happy. I’m never happy. :brick:

My life at the moment is effectively killing time until I’m ready to have kids (three to five years away). I don’t enjoy “plodding along” in the status quo – there’s got to be something to achieve, otherwise that action is pointless (if you can even follow this!).

My point is that if I knew what I wanted, I’d have it by now. The frustrating part is determining what I want!

Big Dave

29th March 2007, 12:57

Ideally, I’d like to be an automotive journalist.

It's not a full time job. You have be able to do other things too.

I've got a heap of ad deadlines now (the other things) but I'll type you some pointers later - remind me.

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 12:59

It's not a full time job. You have be able to do other things too.

I've got a heap of ad deadlines now (the other things) but I'll type you some pointers later - remind me.

Cheers
*note to self...*

BarBender

29th March 2007, 13:07

Has anyone read What Colour is your Parachute? If so, did it help you? A workmate is telling me I should read it.

Richard Bolles book is a good start Motogirl.An even better one would be some simple self reflection and self awareness. Perhaps even do a SWOT analysis on yourself? There are a couple of good websites like Tickle.com that focus on raising self awareness in relation to Happiness, Career and Lifestyle. Discovering a little about yourself and who you are is usually- in times like this - a good process to go through. Its not touchy feely. Quite practical and if you can read and identify themes in what you like to do, the way you communicate, the people you like to be around within a work context etc.... it can be pretty easy to nail potential avenues. Am currently going through one of those times myself and managed to score on the short list with a non for profit organisation after 20 years as a corporate suit. In the end it was about values alignment for me. Only figured that out after doing abit of research on myself.

Pwalo

29th March 2007, 13:24

I know that happiness is the most important thing. I’m keen to hear how you guys have dealt with issues regarding money versus job satisfaction.

No happiness isn't the most important thing. Making sure that your family have enough to eat and somewhere to stay are.

Actually that's utter drivel for some one who hasn't got a family. Look it's simple. Do you work to live, or live to work (sorry that's so trite, but I can't think of an easier way to say it).

If you're bored try something else, if it's important enough for you. Otherwise stay where you are and read the classifieds like the rest of us poor suckers.

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 13:32

If you're bored try something else, if it's important enough for you. Otherwise stay where you are and read the classifieds like the rest of us poor suckers.
I appreciate your perspective. However, reading the classifieds is one thing, matching my current salary in Tauranga is another! If money was the only issue, I'd be more likely to stay where I am.

James Deuce

29th March 2007, 13:36

Just to add to my Happy, Happy, Joy, Joy post earlier, being "Happy" is a post modern materialistic concept. Pwalo is correct. Once upon a time, simply providing three meals a day for one's family earned the breadwinner (irrespective of gender) community respect, and a sense of personal achievement and contentment.

Life is full of extremes and if your only goal is to be "Happy", you're going to fail.

Prior to WWII, most people in the "developed" world's goal was the same as the rest of humanity. Somewhere to live, something to eat. This accumulating crap thing only started during the excesses of 1950s America.

Of course it's nice to have stuff, of course it's nice to be rich. Don't look to pursuits or occupation to provide happiness, or set your goals around accumulating more money than you need.

Joni

29th March 2007, 13:45

Life is full of extremes and if your only goal is to be "Happy", you're going to fail.Hmm, I dont agree with you on this one.

My goal was to be happy - however yes with that comes the maturity to plan and takes lifes knocks into account, but you put a plan together taking all things into acocunt, knowing what you want, taking the unexpecteds on as they come, and you generally get there...

Beemer

29th March 2007, 14:06

Beemer - I enjoyed reading your reply - crikey I never knew journalism was so lowly paid.

Yes, low wages and we are lower on the list of people to be respected than car salesmen! Mind you, I bet our standing may be higher than police officers now...

People think journalists are all on huge salaries because they see the likes of Judy Bailey (who admittedly DID have journalism qualifications) being paid $800,000 to read the news, or Paul Holmes earning millions for his tv or radio shows. What no one realises is that they are just talking heads - behind them all is an army of researchers who do all the real work. Years ago I worked as a researcher on a tv show - the presenter got all the credit for the stuff we had worked our arses off uncovering or tracking down!

My husband still thinks I am on a good wicket because of the hourly rate I get paid for some assignments ($65-$75). However, I don't get 40 hours a week at that rate, wish I did! He also thinks that spending an hour or two interviewing someone and taking photos and then another hour or two writing the article for about $700 is bloody good. So in a nutshell, some parts of journalism ARE very well paid and if you can get the work, it can make for a profitable career. But it takes years to get to that stage and in the meantime you can spend a long time earning very little.

Here's an example of that, with a current job vacancy for a sports reporter. The salary has been rubbished on Journz but the reality is, that is what jobs like that pay. And unfortunately, that is what they were paying more than 10 years ago when I qualified, so the salaries have not kept up with other increases.

Company: Taupo Times / Fairfax Media
Location: Taupo, Waikato
Type: Permanent
Pay and benefits: $27,000 plus health insurance
Listed: Thu, 22 Mar

This is a unique opportunity to get a start in an interesting and challenging career in sports journalism.

The successful applicant will have a keen interest in all things sporting, a relevant media degree (which would take you a year and cost about $10,000), and an ability to produce clean, entertaining copy to tough deadlines.

Taupo is the sporting events capital of New Zealand - come and be a part of it!!

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 14:15

Richard Bolles book is a good start Motogirl.An even better one would be some simple self reflection and self awareness. Perhaps even do a SWOT analysis on yourself? There are a couple of good websites like Tickle.com that focus on raising self awareness in relation to Happiness, Career and Lifestyle. Discovering a little about yourself and who you are is usually- in times like this - a good process to go through. Its not touchy feely. Quite practical and if you can read and identify themes in what you like to do, the way you communicate, the people you like to be around within a work context etc.... it can be pretty easy to nail potential avenues. Am currently going through one of those times myself and managed to score on the short list with a non for profit organisation after 20 years as a corporate suit. In the end it was about values alignment for me. Only figured that out after doing abit of research on myself.
Thanks BarBender, you raise a very valid point. I agree that I should do this.

James Deuce

29th March 2007, 14:16

Hmm, I dont agree with you on this one.

My goal was to be happy - however yes with that comes the maturity to plan and takes lifes knocks into account, but you put a plan together taking all things into acocunt, knowing what you want, taking the unexpecteds on as they come, and you generally get there...

Being happy is intangible.

Happiness stems from different things for different people, but being happy for the sake of being happy indicates an altered reality, either through drugs or a deficiency in brain composition.

Happiness mostly stems from setting and meeting goals, from little tiny ones to great big ones.

Setting the goal of being "Happy" is setting yourself up to fail.

Joni

29th March 2007, 14:18

I hear you Jim... maybe my goal was not to be happy, but rather to change the things that made me unhappy... the bi-product would be the reduction of the unhappiness.

:spudwhat:

Pwalo

29th March 2007, 14:41

I hear you Jim... maybe my goal was not to be happy, but rather to change the things that made me unhappy... the bi-product would be the reduction of the unhappiness.

:spudwhat:

I think it's a difference in priorities. I'm 'happy' when I know that my wife and kids are 'happy'. To me this means fed, clothed, educated and housed (and preferably not yelling at each other!).

Everything else, including my biking habits is a nice extra.

I'm sure that my priorities were different when I were a young lad, but I've never cosidered my personal 'happiness' as the one thing that determined what decisions I took. Perhaps it's a difference in the way men and women view things. If you're a bloke you know your main job is to work and provide.

Buggered if I know. Actually I'm not sure if it even matters.

BarBender

29th March 2007, 14:51

Happiness mostly stems from setting and meeting goals, from little tiny ones to great big ones.

Setting the goal of being "Happy" is setting yourself up to fail.

I agree with your previous comment that todays view of happiness tends to be hedonic with an emphasis on immediacy. Perhaps thats why so many people struggle with their chosen careers only to find out on their death beds that they completely missed the point. I think goals are part of it. But I also think Happiness - rather than an emotional state - is more about you fufilling your potential so that sometime in life you display the best version that you can be.

peasea

29th March 2007, 14:55

My partner is in that situation too.

I would suggest that the $10,000.00 drop p/a would mean nothing if you were re training to do something that was exactly what you wanted to do.

You would make the adjustments gladly.

Do you know how to get into the Automotive Journalism industry?

That's not an easy one to get into. I freelance and it's a nutty life. However, I threw spanners for donkey's years and I'd never go back. The trick is to be able to produce readable stuff, on time, every time. I now contribute to seven magazines (three in Oz) but it's been a long haul. I could give you some tips....PM me.

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 16:19

That's not an easy one to get into. I freelance and it's a nutty life. However, I threw spanners for donkey's years and I'd never go back. The trick is to be able to produce readable stuff, on time, every time. I now contribute to seven magazines (three in Oz) but it's been a long haul. I could give you some tips....PM me.
You guys are just the coolest, most helpful folks ever!

The_Dover

29th March 2007, 16:21

Don't mention it.

peanuteater

29th March 2007, 17:25

some great posts/comments by beemer and motogirl and others !!
I changed work areas and took a $12000 pay cut, end of the day, If youre happy at work, its a BIG part of your life, just need to seperate the "needs" from the "wants", but wages in this country are low by comparison to say.. oz.. AND havent kept up with the cost of living over the last 10 or so years.
thers a old quote....
net income $20,000..outgoings=$21,000=unhappy:(
net income $20,000...outgoings=$19,000= happy :)

terbang

29th March 2007, 17:31

I was mechanic in a large Auckland workshop. It was a good secure job that paid relatively well, I had good career prospects and I had a cute girlfriend who wanted to marry, on the outside things looked rosey. I had been an early school leaver at 15 going straight into an apprenticeship and don't get me wrong, a mechanic is a highly skilled job but it was just not for me. I pondered the work to live vs the live to work question and concluded, why do a job that pisses me off for the rest of my life then retire and die..! I have never been a materialistic sort of a person so the money wasn't the issue. Took a few flying lessons and my fliyng instructor said to me 'some people have to work for a living and the rest of us just drive around in planes'. So I took the plunge, drove to the flying school in a nice car with a garage full of motorbikes locked up at home and left a year later on an old beat up XL250, my sole possession, an empty garage and a brand new commercial pilots licence in my back pocket. She was engaged to a builder by then and I hear she is making his life a misery now. I was very happy though a little scared. I lived in the back of a Toyota landcruiser for a while and got paid peanuts as a flying instructor. I was 23.
I have an awesome career now in corporate, law enforcement and airline aviation that, as a bonus pays pretty well, and has allowed me to see damn near all of the world from a birds eye view. I currently fly regional flights on a Boeing 737 for Qantas. Yup he was right, the rest of us do just drive around in planes and fixing bikes is now my hobby.
So should you change your career? Well I reckon so, as life is not a rehearsal..!

peanuteater

29th March 2007, 17:32

The figures above are just an example, and for the record, im married with kids, but have PRETTY much got the mortage down etc,and were all a LONG time dead, my theory is dont leave it till 65 to "enjoy" life, then look back and say " i wish id done that", its pretty hard to go out and do SOME things when youre bodies getting sad.

Beemer

29th March 2007, 18:06

peasea

29th March 2007, 18:55

Over here, New Zeland Petrolhead, New Zealand Rodder, Bike Rider Magazine and New Zealand Classic Car. In Oz, Live to Ride, Choppers and Performance Ford.

I've been with NZPH since day one. I used to write their tech articles while still running my own business, then NZCC came along and I sold by business. I was just sick of spanners. Then Rodder started up and my (now ex) wife went back to work. This allowed me to either write during the day or work on the house. It was also a blast being the house husband. When we split in 01 I had to expand it to survive, cold calling on magazines and sending samples. Some never respond though.

Be warned; 1) It's not as easy as it looks to come up with acceptable pictures all the time; modern magazines are pretty sharp. 2) being creative at 2.00am when you're tired and a deadline is looming isn't easy either. 3) You need to travel; a lot.

However, now that I have a bike I like, a V8 to tour in with my daughters and new lady, another house that's almost renovated and a bourbon in my hand I have to say life ain't too bad. I sure took a dive in the financial stakes to start with but everyone noticed that the grin had returned.

You are, indeed, a long time in the ground.

Big Dave

29th March 2007, 18:55

peasea

29th March 2007, 19:12

The best way to get into the moto journo bit is to just start doing it. Beg borrow steal hire a vehicle bike scooter whatever and start typing.

600
1200
1500

words - double spaced with good quality images
and start hawking it/submitting to the magazines.

eg:http://www.kiwirider.co.nz/index.html

and click on contribute.

If you are good enough someone will run it. Do a few at a good enough quality and they might start buying them off you.

Reliabilty and quality carries the day.

dc

What he said.

Do a few and fire them into whatever magazine you, or your mates, like. To tell you the truth I've never read a copy of Kiwi Rider but I do like Bike Rider. There is plenty of variety with sports bikes, customs and cruisers featured with reviews on gear, stories on travel and even vintage bikes on occasion. If you like reading a particular magazine then it's easier to contribute to.

When I can't ride due to old age or whatever I think I'll go for Mills and Boon.

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 19:52

What he said.
Do a few and fire them into whatever magazine you, or your mates, like. To tell you the truth I've never read a copy of Kiwi Rider but I do like Bike Rider.

Thanks guys, and to you too Big Dave. BRM used to run almost anything so they might be a good place to start. I've certainly read some crap in my time! For example, one of their last track days a woman wrote a two page article about the "track day", yet ONE paragraph related to the track day and the rest was nonsense about WIMA.

I was asked to write one for another track day, but because I'd crashed I was afraid it'd come across like I was racing (which wouldn't be good for my insurance claim).

Disclaimer: No offense to anyone who's ever been published in BRM. :lol:

Toaster

29th March 2007, 20:31

Satisfaction at work all depends on your secretary.

MotoGirl

29th March 2007, 21:31

Satisfaction at work all depends on your secretary.
haha that sounds like the type of "satisfaction" we're all after :rockon:

Hitcher

29th March 2007, 21:52

Changing careers is exponentially harder the longer one stays in a role. One gets typecast by the attitudes of one's employers and by what prospective employers expect to see on one's CV. And this is unfair because, for many roles, hard competencies are marginally relevant. What employers really want, if they're totally honest with themselves, are employees with the right attitude. As far as I am aware, other than the BDOTGNZA's Masters degree in Hardening The Fuck Up (MHtFU), nobody offers qualifications in attitude.

MotoGirl

30th March 2007, 07:45

terbang

30th March 2007, 08:56

Well yes there are stumbling blocks along the way for any career change, but it is most important to do what you have to do to overcome those and not become dispirited along the way. I had to go back to school to change my career. Life for a lot of us isn't handed to us on a plate, so its nose to the grindstone. Now at 47, family, mortgage and all that, I suspect that I would find it more difficult to change my career than at 23 as it is also their livelihood. There are others to consider now. However, I don't see any need to change right now because I am exactly where I want to be, doing exactly what I wanted to do. Flying jet aeroplanes, it's not for everyone but it is for me. Thats because I put my aspirations into practise when I was younger. How many people do you meet, especially when they are frustrated with their lot, make the statement 'I always wanted to be...'.
Sort of like a Tui add really.

Big Dave

30th March 2007, 09:21

'Life' rewards attitude.

Beemer

30th March 2007, 09:48

Do a few and fire them into whatever magazine you, or your mates, like. To tell you the truth I've never read a copy of Kiwi Rider but I do like Bike Rider. There is plenty of variety with sports bikes, customs and cruisers featured with reviews on gear, stories on travel and even vintage bikes on occasion. If you like reading a particular magazine then it's easier to contribute to.

Mmn, I'm almost the other way around! I like the variety in KR but get tired of the focus on Harleys and cruisers in BRM. And the extremely low standard of proofreading/editing. I know KR isn't perfect, but BRM is appalling - the spelling mistakes, grammatical errors and long, rambling articles that are obviously just space fillers means I rarely buy the magazine. A bit of judicious editing would make the articles easier to read and far more interesting. (Mind you, KR's habit of putting things in 'quotation marks' for no apparent reason really irks me too - "which had a somewhat 'wooden' feel to the suspension", "run past the old 'ton' with ease", "where the 'market' goes", "join Ducati at the 'sportsbike' end", "the narrowest of 'working' spaces", "'handling' was just as assured" and "mean you can't 'throw a set of soft panniers over the pillion seat' but Honda can provide both a top box and a set of 'hard' panniers..." - agh, stop it NOW!)

BRM claims to be the best selling NZ bike magazine or something similar but I'd love to know how they can justify that claim as everyone I know who has bought one has never bothered to buy one again!

I don't read everything in KR but I read a lot more of it than many other bike magazines. And the photography is much better - an area in which BRM is often sadly let down.

Motu

30th March 2007, 10:17

BRM claims to be the best selling NZ bike magazine or something similar but I'd love to know how they can justify that claim as everyone I know who has bought one has never bothered to buy one again!

I can tick that box - in fact I don't even think I paid for it,got it as a promo.It seems like a ''Tamaki Bros'' product.

Big Dave

30th March 2007, 10:25

(Mind you, KR's habit of putting things in 'quotation marks' for no apparent reason really irks me too

I'll 'look into it'.

Big Dave

30th March 2007, 10:28

I can tick that box - in fact I don't even think I paid for it,got it as a promo.It seems like a ''Tamaki Bros'' product.

Don't be cruel - Paul is a nice bloke.
None of us in the trade are over-burdened with resources.
Economies of scale of the population. To that end I will say i believe KR does a fabulous job with what we have to work with and of course we are working to make it better every month.

I'm knocking out new design elements now.

Krusti

30th March 2007, 10:30

What got us hooked on BRM was the Cooper family trip through the America's.

Was a good read while recovering from sugery.

Any mag with sportbikes gets purchased here. One of my favourites is Superbike, UK.

My two cents...

Big Dave

30th March 2007, 10:38

Any mag with sportbikes gets purchased here.

I have no interest - Adventurers and cruisers are my pleasures lately.
That's the beauty of the diversity of KR. It covers everything.

I reckon the kids section that Pete runs dilligently every month is one reason to buy it every now and then.
The mag's commitment to bringing Jnrs through the ranks and supporting the grass roots makes me quite proud.

slowpoke

30th March 2007, 11:41

That's the beauty of the diversity of KR. It covers everything.

Hmmm, it's getting away from the thread topic but I reckon the diversity is the problem. You end up with only a few pages that each reader is interested in. I'd rather spend $17 and read every page of Superbike, Performance Bikes, Rapid, Two Wheel Tuner etc than $7 and only read 10 pages of of KR, BRM or Two Wheels.
I know performance bikes aren't everybodies cup of tea but the mud pluggers or tourers or adventure riders etc probably feel the same way.
It's not helping you, I know, 'cos you can't pull a magazine for every category out of your klacker and expect to make a profit in NZ. It's just unfortunate that you HAVE to make a one size fits all product and risk losing those people who prefer a more tailor made product.

On the career change thang: change only happens when the pain of staying as you are is greater than the pain of change.

Yep, I hear you on having a job that sucks, 'cos I frikkin' loathe mine with a passion...but at the end of the day the pay's not bad and my skillset and therefore career options are limited (by my own imagination?). Which is my way of saying that painful as it is, it isn't as painful as starting from scratch and earning sweet FA. But then it might not be as satisfying either......I guess I'll never know.

Big Dave

30th March 2007, 11:46

Hmmm, it's getting away from the thread topic but I reckon the diversity is the problem.

Nope - I'm sorry - but I disagree with you.
I've learned about different aspects of motorcycling and have become very interested in the stuff that I have been exposed to.

I say open your mind. There is much more to the pastime than zoomin' around on sprotsbikes.

Quads are next. Vege is supporting the hillclimb series.

James Deuce

30th March 2007, 11:55

Yes there is BD, but I'll never be a hard core dirt freak so half the mag is effectively a waste of time for me.

Big Dave

30th March 2007, 12:00

Yes there is BD, but I'll never be a hard core dirt freak so half the mag is effectively a waste of time for me.

That would be 1/3rd - Adventure (not always dirt) Diversions - Kids - Racing - Bike Mart - Columns.

And you don't enjoy news of Kiwis like townley and Coppins winning??

Anyway subscribe and you get most of that third for free.

Pwalo

30th March 2007, 12:03

There is much more to the pastime than zoomin' around on sprotsbikes.

What? That's not what my Dad told me!

I used to really be into off road bikes when I was younger, and much harder. But now I'm old and soft it's pretty well the sprotbarks only. I enjoy KR but I only really read half of it at best.

I think we've probably got a bit off topic, which is suprisingly reassuring for a KB thread.

James Deuce

30th March 2007, 12:03

None of the stuff you list is really that interesting for m. It doesn't grab me. Try as I might I can't see the point of spending limited reading time on stuff that is about as interesting as a monthly report.

Hitcher

30th March 2007, 12:08

Aren't we just a little off topic here?

Beemer

30th March 2007, 12:12

Aren't we just a little off topic here?

Not really - MotoGirl wanted advice on becoming an automotive journalist - here are some real people who have worked in that field talking about their work. There are some real people who read said publications comparing what they get out of it and people who have changed careers talking about what worked and what didn't. It's not like [insert your favourite moron] has entered the thread and started talking shit about nothing remotely related to the original topic!

Hitcher

30th March 2007, 12:15

Not really - MotoGirl wanted advice on becoming an automotive journalist

And now we're engaged in a discussion about the relative merits of New Zealand's various motorcycle magazines. Tsk tsk...

Joni

30th March 2007, 12:16

Dont agree Beemer - off topic is off topic, be it drivel or interesting.

Ths thread is about changing careers not about KR and which sections are interesting to whom.

I reckon however people could have a good chat about this... maybe split it into its own thread?

The_Dover

30th March 2007, 12:19

STAY ON TOPIC
<img src="http://media.urbandictionary.com/image/large/neo-nazi-35305.jpg">

Motu

30th March 2007, 12:25

I reckon the kids section that Pete runs dilligently every month is one reason to buy it every now and then.
The mag's commitment to bringing Jnrs through the ranks and supporting the grass roots makes me quite proud.

Careful how you do it,but give Vege a pat on the back for that,even though I don't read the kids section I reckon it's the most important part of the mag - When Dad asks where the hell the Kiwi Rider is this month and finds it on the floor in the kids bedroom,all your hard work is rewarded.As you get older,you realise where the future comes from.

slowpoke

30th March 2007, 12:26

I envy the people who know what they want to achieve out of their lives. Generally speaking, I have no freakin' clue! Well, about the big picture anyway.

This has always been my biggest problem and I must drive Cajun insane. I’m very very ambitious and somehow manage to blitz any goals I set myself. Hubby considers my goals to be unrealistic, yet I seem to beat them by years; for example, I wanted to own a house by 25 and I did before I was 23.

I get really frustrated when I don’t have a goal or something to work towards. I think this is why I’m in this position at the moment. I’ve achieved everything I set out to do.

I shouldn’t complain – after all, I’m 26, earn reasonable money, have a lovely husband :love:, a house, and all the toys I can dream of. I’ve got everything I want, yet I’m not happy. I’m never happy. :brick:

My life at the moment is effectively killing time until I’m ready to have kids (three to five years away). I don’t enjoy “plodding along” in the status quo – there’s got to be something to achieve, otherwise that action is pointless (if you can even follow this!).

My point is that if I knew what I wanted, I’d have it by now. The frustrating part is determining what I want!

Hmmmmm, this is a fairly enlightening post.

You have answered your own question of "why am I not happy?"
By your own admition the thing thats seems to make you happy is achieving your goals...yet as soon as you have achieved them you set new ones so you are not "plodding along"...therefore you will ALWAYS be unhappy.

The status quo (a point where everything is balanced) is actually a highly desirable position to be in yet you are purposely avoiding it.

An action is not necessarily pointless if nothing is achieved. The action in itself can be rewarding. Take your writing goal for example. I suspect that many writers would derive as much satisfaction from the actual act of creation as from the finished product. I achieve nothing by riding my bike around the block yet I come back feeling better for it.

You admit to having everything you could want in life yet you are not happy. You expect something as crass as a job to surpass your family, your home, your relationships with other people? You are looking in the wrong direction.........

Big Dave

30th March 2007, 12:38

A conversation hinted at moto journalism can devolve such.
Gives the girl an idea of what its about.

Big Dave

30th March 2007, 12:41

Careful how you do it,.

Radlier - I think it's called - by Monteiths?

MotoGirl

30th March 2007, 12:52

Hmmmmm, this is a fairly enlightening post.

You have answered your own question of "why am I not happy?"
By your own admition the thing thats seems to make you happy is achieving your goals...yet as soon as you have achieved them you set new ones so you are not "plodding along"...therefore you will ALWAYS be unhappy.
You raise a valid point and I appreciate where you're coming from.

I wonder how it's possible to change my thought pattern so I can be happy with the status quo? Stopping my ambition altogether would be a mistake because I'd never get off the couch! However, I agree that I could tone it down a bit.

Pwalo

30th March 2007, 13:12

You raise a valid point and I appreciate where you're coming from.

I wonder how it's possible to change my thought pattern so I can be happy with the status quo? Stopping my ambition altogether would be a mistake because I'd never get off the couch! However, I agree that I could tone it down a bit.

There's nothing wrong at all with having goals. Why bother existing without them? I just think it's unrealistic to measure your happiness as a direct correlation to achieving them.

We all have things we wish we could do, or have done. Not being able to achieve means diddly squat. It's the trying that's important. Hell just imagine if riders stopped racing because they couldn't beat Rossi.

If you really want to have a go at the journalim thing write to, or call as many publications as you can and find out what they want/need/whatever. Just don't rely on being happy because you have done something, or bought something. I'm sure there's something meaningful that could be said about be able to cope with your own company before..........

Sod that it's just all to much for my frail psyche to cope with. Did I say that I just bought some new overtrou?

slowpoke

30th March 2007, 14:20

Society in general tends to seek pleasure rather than happiness, when there is a world of difference between the two.
We derive pleasure from fleeting acts or moments or from the acquisition of (insert product here) yet we can still be leading fundamentally unhappy lives.

Happiness is a realisation, it is something that steals over us at times in our lives when we are comfortable and safe and emotionally fulfilled. For some people that may mean a time of singular freedom, absolved of the worry's that comes from a lifetime of looking after others. Others may crave the frenetic activity associated with a large family. We're all different, with different priorities, responsibilities, neuroses, tragedies etc that shape what we want out of life

There is no magic formula, no perfect job, no cheque you can write, no box to be ticked that will guarantee happiness. You can do things that will lead you in it's general direction but ultimately happiness finds us rather than the other way around.

Right, I'm off to grab another guilty pleasure outta the 'fridge, 'cos now I'm fuggin' depressed........