To use a clutch?

[Midge]

I had a look round couldnt find a thread like this.

So my question is should i be using the clutch changing between gears?

Im riding a cbr250r.

[MotoGirl]

I had a look round couldnt find a thread like this.

So my question is should i be using the clutch changing between gears?

Im riding a cbr250r.

Your poll is kind of hard to answer. The "No it doesnt matter" option is close, but you'd only do cluthless upchanges going up a gear. It's common practice to use the clutch going down a gear.

[Black Bandit]

Here's a link:
http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=34427

[R1madness]

is it an automatic as well???

[jtzzr]

I use the clutch ,sometimes when changing up ,but usually when accelerating hard I don`t, but always on the down-change with a slight blip (depends on how many people are watching), then the blip is a bit longer.:shutup: P.s Don`t blip on the down shift if you`re not clutching , it could do damage to your bike and you also look retarded ,Ive heard.

[Storm]

From what I understand if its reasonably modern, you can go up without, but you have to clutch down- or not, after all, its your bike :)

[Drew]

Hook up without the clutch if you're hammering it, otherwise use it. Always use it on the down shift. I sometimes dont on the down shift, but that's only when I'm sitting up no hands, (read, posing), slowing down for lights or summat, and those times it's just a wee bit of weight on the lever, and wait for it to mesh in by itself.

[hXc]

If you know what you're doing, you may need no clutch at all. I use a clutch going up from 1st, or down from 2nd, otherwise I hardly use it. Just know your bikes' revs etc and then you'll be sweet.

[jtzzr]

Actually there is a thread on this somewhere under clutchless shifting , would love to find it for you , but I`m too frikin lazy. Hope this helps.

[Mr. Peanut]

I don't use the clutch up or down if I'm going for it. Don't use it from 1st to 2nd either.

[xwhatsit]

Just match the gearbox speed to the engine speed and it's easy as pie. That's what the backing off of the throttle is on the upchange, if you preload the lever then pop the throttle off it'll just snick in by itself when the two speeds match up. Happens in a blink of an eye.

On downchanges, I think it's easier to stuff it up because it's harder to match the two speeds when you're decelerating. I think.

I use the clutch, just because I have an old bike and a lot of engine internals are probably fairly worn anyway, let alone with me mucking up clutchless shifts. I have tried it on occasion, mostly to drag off boy racers at the lights.

Up to you, really. The potential for damage if you fuck up the gearshift is higher than if you use the clutch. But if you do it with the correct technique, it's not really a problem as far as I know. Selector shafts would probably wear a little faster with the inevitable imprecise shifts.

[Drew]

I don't use the clutch up or down if I'm going for it. Don't use it from 1st to 2nd either.

I know of a couple spare gear boxes for an NSR, if yours doesn't blow up the way two smokes tend to, not using the clutch on the downshift might have you wanting a gearbox instead. Unless you get it spot on everytime, it bends selector rods.

[BarBender]

Yes and No.

[imdying]

Clutches are cheap, gearboxes are not. Your call.

[Motu]

You guys need to go for a drive in a 1968 Atkinson,with the Gardiner engine and David Brown 6 speed gearbox.You can't use the clutch past 2nd gear,as you have to shift your left leg to give room for the gearlever.All shifts up or down have to be made without the clutch.....it's a dog box same as your bike,and you will gain an understanding on how it works and what you need to do.It's easy to do on a bike when you can master one of those.I dunno,the yoof of today.....

[DEATH_INC.]

You guys need to go for a drive in a 1968 Atkinson,with the Gardiner engine and David Brown 6 speed gearbox.You can't use the clutch past 2nd gear,as you have to shift your left leg to give room for the gearlever.All shifts up or down have to be made without the clutch.....it's a dog box same as your bike,and you will gain an understanding on how it works and what you need to do.It's easy to do on a bike when you can master one of those.I dunno,the yoof of today.....
:laugh: :laugh:
You funny old buggers. My dad grew up driving trucks for the army (RL Bedfords and the like) and commercially, he usta take great delight in running his charade up and down through the gears with no clutch, no crunching either.
With a dog box (like on a bike) you don't need to, they don't really break from this, unless you just shift with the throttle pinned :thud:

[busaman]

If it works without making any ugly noises do it.

[Bonez]

From what I understand if its reasonably modern, you can go up without, but you have to clutch down- or not, after all, its your bike :)It's not a new thing. Been doing it probably before you were born.

[MSTRS]

Just match the gearbox speed to the engine speed ....

Not really...it's got more to do with the meshed gears being unloaded. Almost impossible to change gear when either accelerating or throttle off. On the upshift, just momentarily back off the throttle whilst putting pressure on the gearshift. Harder to get right, but just do the reverse when downshifting.

[Motu]

F1 cars use dog gear sequental gearboxes same as your bike - have a listen.....do you think they are using the clutch? Sure it's computer controled,at the actuator end.....but it just works the servo that turns the shift drum to the desired point,inside it has gears and dogs,shift drum and selectors,same as your bike.Young guys can beat a computer anyday right?

[toymachine]

I find i get gears popping out more if i dont use the clutch, bu i prefer not too

[Crasherfromwayback]

if yours doesn't blow up the way two smokes tend to,

Two strokes are no harder (in fact probably less so) on gearboxes than four strokes!


Clutches are cheap, gearboxes are not. Your call.

Done correctly, NOT using the clutch is probably easier on the transmission.


F1 cars use dog gear sequental gearboxes same as your bike - have a listen.....do you think they are using the clutch? Sure it's computer controled,at the actuator end.....but it just works the servo that turns the shift drum to the desired point,inside it has gears and dogs,shift drum and selectors,same as your bike.Young guys can beat a computer anyday right?

What Motu says!

[skidMark]

i don't personally , allows for much quicker gear changes , smoother for me, personnal preferance i guess, i had 2 zxr250's and a gpx 250, none of them minded it, and nobody else i know has ever done in a box or anything from doing it

[quallman1234]

Its very easy to lock ur back wheel clutchless changing up or down.

Yes you should use your clutch its there to be used, also makes your gearbox life alot longer.

Clutchless up shifts are ok if you want speed :)

[skidMark]

Its very easy to lock ur back wheel clutchless changing up or down.

Yes you should use your clutch its there to be used, also makes your gearbox life alot longer.

Clutchless up shifts are ok if you want speed :)

um why does it matter if the back wheel locks? , pretty damn easy to unlock it. well if you know how to ride

[limbimtimwim]

um why does it matter if the back wheel locks? , pretty damn easy to unlock it.Suzuki did not supply a key to unlock my back wheel.

Where can I get one??:confused: :confused:

[Storm]

It's not a new thing. Been doing it probably before you were born.

Yeah, but you've been round for AGES longer than me :bleh:

[skidMark]

Suzuki did not supply a key to unlock my back wheel.

Where can I get one??:confused: :confused:

funnily enough, it's called a clutch...grab the lever on the left handlebar...no not the choke,

and pull it in when the wheel locks

[limbimtimwim]

funnily enough, it's called a clutch...grab the lever on the left handlebar...no not the choke, and pull it in when the wheel locksHelp, nothing looks like a noose on the left handlebar either..?!

If the wheel locks, how about turning the right hand?

[breakaway]

I've accidentally switched up and down without using the clutch when I was a total beginner. It went it without complaining at all.

Use the clutch. If it wasn't 'needed', it wouldn't be there. Besides, any real benefit you would get out of it (acceleration boost because you switch faster than the next guy) is probably no use if you're just commuting.

[skidMark]

Help, nothing looks like a noose on the left handlebar either..?!

If the wheel locks, how about turning the right hand?

no clutch in to stop the wheel locking then click it up a gear or two then release clutch

stop being cheeky lol

[onearmedbandit]

watch this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqZY1SReHDI), now I`d ask you if you think the rider is using his clutch at all, but the comments section gives it away.

[skidMark]

watch this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqZY1SReHDI), now I`d ask you if you think the rider is using his clutch at all, but the comments section gives it away.


you neglect to mention it's you, i'm about to watch the vid

[onearmedbandit]

No need to mention that`s it me, just saying that clutchless up and down can be done.

[Quartermile]

:shit: I'm amased that it can be done without skrewing your grearbox, why have cluches then:scratch: oh I want to try it:eek:, but i'm afraid it will damage my old bike:(

[skidMark]

:shit: I'm amased that it can be done without skrewing your grearbox, why have cluches then:scratch: oh I want to try it:eek:, but i'm afraid it will damage my old bike:(

why have clutchs um....to take off the line?

[onearmedbandit]

:shit: I'm amased that it can be done without skrewing your grearbox, why have cluches then:scratch: oh I want to try it:eek:, but i'm afraid it will damage my old bike:(
It`s a little thing called timing, plus bike knowledge. I use my lcutch maybe 30% of my riding. Taking off, stopping, cruising, etc, hard out riding is done mostly without the clutch.

[Quartermile]

. :o oh yea

[skidMark]

. :o oh yea

vote placed for flame warrior nominations , lol all good mate , it's too late and i gotta head off to whangamata at 830 am so time to sleep.

peace out.

[Quartermile]

vote placed for flame warrior nominations , lol all good mate , it's too late and i gotta head off to whangamata at 830 am so time to sleep.

peace out.
I get the impression your a bit of a mess........

[R1madness]

This thread makes me laugh. It also makes me a lot of money. Keep doing your clutchless changes. In winter the shop quietens down a bit so i have spare time for gearbox rebuilds.
Cheers

[MidnightMike]

oh I want to try it:eek:, but i'm afraid it will damage my old bike:(

Ill try it if you do :scooter:

[Krusti]

I'm supposed to change gear? :shit:

[onearmedbandit]

This thread makes me laugh. It also makes me a lot of money. Keep doing your clutchless changes. In winter the shop quietens down a bit so i have spare time for gearbox rebuilds.
Cheers

Never had to rebuild a gearbox in my life.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Its very easy to lock ur back wheel clutchless changing up or down.

Yes you should use your clutch its there to be used, also makes your gearbox life alot longer.

Clutchless up shifts are ok if you want speed :)

There's no reason whatsoever that not using the clutch has any effect on wheel lock-up. Yes the clutch is there to be used......bloody hard to stop at lights/intersections and start gates without them! Launching bikes makes them handy too....other than that (and slipping them when needed)....they're of no real use.


I've accidentally switched up and down without using the clutch when I was a total beginner. It went it without complaining at all.

Use the clutch. If it wasn't 'needed', it wouldn't be there. Besides, any real benefit you would get out of it (acceleration boost because you switch faster than the next guy) is probably no use if you're just commuting.

Even when simply 'commuting', not using the clutch makes upshifts (especially) smoother....less helmet 'clashing' from your pillion if you have one....


:shit: I'm amased that it can be done without skrewing your grearbox, why have cluches then:scratch: oh I want to try it:eek:, but i'm afraid it will damage my old bike:(

See above......old or new...it's no harder on transmissions done correctly.


This thread makes me laugh. It also makes me a lot of money. Keep doing your clutchless changes. In winter the shop quietens down a bit so i have spare time for gearbox rebuilds.
Cheers

Seeing as you own your own bike shop........and in theory are mechanically minded.....I'm amazed you'd make such a comment. You of all people should know motorcycle transmissions are of such a type that clutchless shifts cause absolutely no harm whatsoever! As long as the 'load' is taken off the 'box' (by cracking the throttle off momentarily) when the change is made....doesn't matter if you use the clutch or not.


Never had to rebuild a gearbox in my life.

Snap! I've owned over 50 different bikes in my time with them.....most either race bikes or road bikes that get ridden like race bikes.......I've NEVER had a transmission failure......other than a Honda CR480 that was prone to failure from new!

So people....try 'clutchless' shifts ('up' especially).....just remember to crack the throttle off for a split second to 'unload' the transmission when you stab the lever.......you'll be pleasantly surprised how much smoother and nicer your upshifts will be!

Fact.

[Quartermile]

K, thanks of the confimation:yes:

[R1madness]

Never had to rebuild a gearbox in my life.

Mate. Thats great news but here is the problem that i get presented with quite often.

Customer: Hi my GSXR1000 is jumping out of 2nd gear.
Me: How many km's on it?
Cust: 37000 or so.
Me: Do lots o wheelstands or clutchless gear changes?
Cust: Yea clutches are for pussys.
Me: Ok take a seat, The estimate for repairs is as follows, $1200.
Cust: Eh fuck off its only 2nd gear.
Me: No its not, its 2nd gear, the gear it locks into, the shift fork, and a whole heap o labour. While i am in there i might as well replace 3rd as well cause its going to crap out next.
Cust. Fuck off dickhead i read on the net its fine to do clutchless changes.
Me: Oh have a nice day then.

3 weeks later,
For sale GSXR1000 jumps out o second gear. offers.


Moral of the story.
Its not the first 15000k or the second 15000k that you begin to notice the damage. Its in the 3rd 15000k.
For all you really skilled riders out there that have wrecked a lot of XL125 gearboxes trying to perfect your technique please be fair to the new riders by telling them the whole truth.

[onearmedbandit]

Appreciate that input Ian, and I`ll keep it in mind. But correct me if I`m wrong, if I take the load off the gearbox, am I doing any harm to the `box? Also, did you watch my video in this thread? Tell me if my technique is wrong.

[DMNTD]

I blew 4th gear in my '06 ZX10 (18,000kms)....Kawasaki/bike shop claimed it was due to clutchless shifting which surprised me no end after being told that it was fine to do so as long as I wasn't "crunching" the gears...ie not "unloading" the box before nailing.

Intriguing thread,seems the debate is live and well...unlike my old gearbox

[R1madness]

onearmbandit, your technique is fine and i completely understand your point of view as you have a unique situation. The prob is that even unloading the box you will have to "force" the gear dog to locate in the slot as the gears are rotating at the wrong speeds in relation to each other and the shafts. Its that forcing that rounds off the edges of the dogs and slots and wears/bends the shift fork.
once it starts jumping out of gear you can fix it by undercutting the gears dogs and slots but it makes it harder to shift.
The better the technique the longer the bike lasts.

[skidMark]

I'm amased that it can be done without skrewing your grearbox, why have cluches then oh I want to try it, but i'm afraid it will damage my old bike


why have clutchs um....to take off the line?


Oh yea.



I get the impression your a bit of a mess........

hi pot, my names kettle.