Women-only track day [Archive]

MotoGirl

7th April 2007, 09:59

please tell why woman always want to reserve things solely for themselves. Why cant you have a section for all learner riders off in the pits on a normal trackday?

The purpose of having a track day only for women is to make them feel comfortable taking their bikes around for a blast, without the pressure of know-it-all men watching over them or playing dirty on the track. It's like when you go bowling and your husband tells you how to improve your technique, even though his score is worse than yours! Some women feel more comfortable taking advice from other women.

So, are you telling me you get intimidated by women who can ride better than you? :bleh:

As for the pit training sessions, I'm surprised no one does this already. I went to the Ride Safe, Ride Right course and everything they taught on the day I had already learnt during a track day's pit session.

Her_C4

7th April 2007, 10:51

It was for normal women ......

Can you define 'normal' for me please? I suspect (along with close acquaintances) that I am anything BUT normal sometimes.....:dodge: :sunny:

Morcs

7th April 2007, 11:59

Bah this is sexist. we dont have men only track days...

Steam

7th April 2007, 12:12

Bah this is sexist. we dont have men only track days...

Oh my god Morcs, did you miss that whole thread, it went on for hundreds of posts and many pages. I suspect you are taking the piss.

slowpoke

7th April 2007, 12:23

The purpose of having a track day only for women is to make them feel comfortable taking their bikes around for a blast, without the pressure of know-it-all men watching over them or playing dirty on the track. It's like when you go bowling and your husband tells you how to improve your technique, even though his score is worse than yours! Some women feel more comfortable taking advice from other women.

Look how far we've come....not.

If I used this language at work and swapped the genders around I reckon I'd be given my DCM (Don't Come Monday) and most women around the country would be shouting up a storm at my shocking behaviour after they read about it in "No Idea".

I'd gladly welcome advice from Flame, or Keystone19 or RossiGal or any other faster rider regardless of gender. I would have thought any serious female rider would think the same way. If someone is too pushy, too arrogant, or belittling you, just tell 'em to sling there hook and find people who are more accurate, insightful and generous with there input.

As I see it women actually have an advantage on the track in that they are generally quite a bit lighter than the blokes. This should and does translate in to faster acceleration, harder braking, higher corner speeds, less tyre wear etc. We (heavier people) need to be protected from you, not the other way around.

If you are a newbie to track days then go in the slow group. If you've got a problem with "dirty tricks" (male or female) tell the organiser and I'm sure the rider in question will be spoken to. If you wanna have a crack...have a crack, 'cos "you're a long time dead."

We've all had the sleepless night before our first track foray, the nervous runs to the dunny, the endless "what if..." loop rolling through our head. But in the end you've just got to show a bit of back bone and just do it.

I suspect it's the flock mentality generating this post and the positive responses: I don't wanna do it by myself, and amongst blokes I feel like I'm by myself. This may be a perfectly valid response but in the end when you get out on the track it's just you and your bike. For some people that is the attraction and for others that is the fear.

Courage isn't about not feeling fear, it's about feeling the fear and doing it anyway. Show a bit of courage ladies.

Morcs

7th April 2007, 13:02

Oh my god Morcs, did you miss that whole thread, it went on for hundreds of posts and many pages. I suspect you are taking the piss.

Course i was! ;)

Trudes

7th April 2007, 13:25

McJim

7th April 2007, 13:30

Why can't we have a Scotsmen only track day?:rofl:

Drew

7th April 2007, 13:36

we did practical exercises (e.g. emergency stops, u-turns etc) in the pits while other groups were on the track.

Glad I'm not an organiser, if you want them to organise more volunteers to teach you the basics, because you cant be arsed finding someone to help.

FFS, does anybody do a fuckin thing for themselves anymore!?

Why would someone want to add more pressure, and possably more bins to a track day.

PS, I dont give a shit if it's girls only, boys only, hermaphrodites only, or fuckin Eunics only, it's the idea of more chaos in the pits on a track day, where half the people dont know, or obey the rules of the environment to begin with I'm having a rant about.

Disco Dan

7th April 2007, 13:43

we did practical exercises (e.g. emergency stops, u-turns etc) in the pits while other groups were on the track.

Glad I'm not an organiser, if you want them to organise more volunteers to teach you the basics, because you cant be arsed finding someone to help.

oh great... another "sexism" thread. You cant discriminate. Too many people voted labour remember?

There are many places you can practice this sort of thing... AWNMR for example... someone has yet to start something similar in other parts of NZ. bit of commitment folks... it doesnt bite.

slowpoke

7th April 2007, 14:15

Why can't we have a Scotsmen only track day?:rofl:

'cos no Scotsmen would pay for it!

Joni

7th April 2007, 14:48

How fucken predicatable... :yawn:

I hope the day comes when a girl can post something on KB about a girls only something, without the mucho men beating their chests about the injustice...

Good on you motogirl, it was discussed before, but I hope it can be organised! :sunny:

:first:

Kendog

7th April 2007, 15:01

please tell why woman always want to reserve things solely for themselves. Why cant you have a section for all learner riders off in the pits on a normal trackday?

oh great... another "sexism" thread. You cant discriminate. Too many people voted labour remember?

There are many places you can practice this sort of thing... AWNMR for example... someone has yet to start something similar in other parts of NZ. bit of commitment folks... it doesnt bite.

Don't forget to bitch and moan in this (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=47344&highlight=suzuki) thread as well.

And for those with short term memory loss, click here (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=44505).

Morcs

7th April 2007, 15:22

Of course, sexism only works one way :rolleyes:

Thats all i have to say on the subject.

Disco Dan

7th April 2007, 15:24

Of course, sexism only works one way :rolleyes:

Thats all i have to say on the subject.

It is the year, two thousand and 50s afterall ;)

MotoGirl

7th April 2007, 18:26

Bah this is sexist. we dont have men only track days...

Sure ya do, it's called MotoGP :dodge:

Meekey_Mouse

7th April 2007, 18:37

I've riden the track with guys and have no problem with (most) of them, no worse than some of the chicks, I can't tell the difference once there's a helmet on their heads. I'm just in for another trackday, regardless who it's for (providing it's one I can join in, i.e not males only or Suzuki only, or Yamaha only or something). The pit skills practice appeals to me though and I haven't been to a trackday yet that offers that, so that's really what sounded appealing to me about the day Motogirl mentioned.:done:

Bingo :D

Also to add to that... men can be all "macho" but some chicks can tend to get "catty" so I don't mind if there are guys or if it's all girls... but I'm really keen on the slow paced maneuver instructions :yes:

MotoGirl

7th April 2007, 18:44

...I'd gladly welcome advice from Flame, or Keystone19 or RossiGal or any other faster rider regardless of gender. I would have thought any serious female rider would think the same way.

A lot of people would be OK with this. All I'm saying is that some women wouldn't feel comfortable asking for advice from a male. So long as you go faster, who cares who helps you do it!

If you are a newbie to track days then go in the slow group. If you've got a problem with "dirty tricks" (male or female) tell the organiser and I'm sure the rider in question will be spoken to. If you wanna have a crack...have a crack, 'cos "you're a long time dead."
Women's days are a good intro and many women would use them before they're confident to show their skills in front of men.

I went to the last two Suzuki track days and even the Slow group would be too quick for many women doing it for the first time.

MotoGirl

7th April 2007, 18:49

Why would someone want to add more pressure, and possably more bins to a track day.
Would you mind explaining how it adds more pressure?

cowboyz

7th April 2007, 19:05

Don't forget to bitch and moan in this (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=47344&highlight=suzuki) thread as well.

And for those with short term memory loss, click here (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=44505).

Thats not real fair. Suzuki track days are sponsered by suzuki. Fair enough they pay for the track for a promotion exercise then so be it. Bit of a bugger Kawasaki dont do the same thing.

The purpose of having a track day only for women is to make them feel comfortable taking their bikes around for a blast, without the pressure of know-it-all men watching over them or playing dirty on the track. It's like when you go bowling and your husband tells you how to improve your technique, even though his score is worse than yours! Some women feel more comfortable taking advice from other women.

So, are you telling me you get intimidated by women who can ride better than you? :bleh:

As for the pit training sessions, I'm surprised no one does this already. I went to the Ride Safe, Ride Right course and everything they taught on the day I had already learnt during a track day's pit session.

Is this really happening? I find people dont give riding tips unless asked but maybe thats the company I keep. And I am not a woman. Is it really true that woman are getting unwanted advise on how to ride? For what it is worth if you can get a womans only trackday are you going to ban all the husbands/boyfriends/men in general from the pits or viewing platforms as well?

How did you get that I am intimidated by woman who ride better than me? Certainly not. I could write a list of all the people who can ride better than me but pretty sure the server is not big enough to hold the list. In saying that I am more than capable of riding my bike at the speed I choose to ride it without falling off.

MotoGirl

7th April 2007, 19:35

...
Is this really happening? I find people dont give riding tips unless asked but maybe thats the company I keep. And I am not a woman. Is it really true that woman are getting unwanted advise on how to ride? For what it is worth if you can get a womans only trackday are you going to ban all the husbands/boyfriends/men in general from the pits or viewing platforms as well?

First, I'm not trying to organise a women's track day. I'm simply trying to find out if anyone does these. Like I said, I've done them in the past and think they're a good idea to get the hang of it.

Second, I'm not implying that unwelcome comments necessarily come from other riders - they could be from male partners or friends etc. It's a similar situation to parents standing on the sideline at a soccer game and screaming at their kids to win. Nobody needs that crap and it's easier to concentrate without them.

cowboyz

7th April 2007, 19:51

First, I'm not trying to organise a women's track day. I'm simply trying to find out if anyone does these. Like I said, I've done them in the past and think they're a good idea to get the hang of it.

Second, I'm not implying that unwelcome comments necessarily come from other riders - they could be from male partners or friends etc. It's a similar situation to parents standing on the sideline at a soccer game and screaming at their kids to win. Nobody needs that crap and it's easier to concentrate without them.

1. ok. if they did organise one it will jsut be another day to put on the list of trackdays I can't go to. If there were any more track days in the calender I would mch prefer they be in a format that a male can take a kawasaki to them.... but I am biased.

2. Still, cant see how not allowing guys on the track is going to solve youe problem... Maybe at the next trackday you can just reserve a few stables for woman only and so no men are allowed to go over there. Then if some guy is giving advice (no matter if he rides or not) then the woman in question can go to the "womans corner" to discuss there riding with other woman. I cant see a guy stopping mid-track to discuss riding technique. Problem solved and guys still get track time.

Then of course if the woman are giving woman advice that the woman don't like you might have to create another section inside the womans section so they can go there and not listen to other woman give advice they dont want to hear..... This could get messy.

Sketchy_Racer

7th April 2007, 20:06

hahaha this is funny.

If women want to have a 'girl' only track day. LET THEM!!

But let see which bunch of females can acctually be botherd organising one!!!!

$50 says there will be a man in the midst of things helping organising... its the way life works...

Seriosly, it sounds like a load of BS to me. If you 'women' want to be alone at the track, pit somewhere away from the men, and don't bug them when you have any mechnical issues, that are sure to arrise. As someone said, once a helmets on, you can't tell the difference, so whats the point...

Soooo,

Guys, whos keen on a mens only trackday??

..
...
....

Yeah, Right

GIXser

7th April 2007, 20:11

to all the guys that have posted on this thread and given a nasty/negative feedback, pull ya heads in , if tha ladies want to throw their own t/day, i say good on ya, id say its probably a great idea, especially for those that are a little nervous , this trackday will teach ya lots of skill, id recommend asking Ghostriderette and keystone to come along and show you guys some tips and tricks eh, ill be more than happy to lend some of you my track gear ie pit tents etc,
go ahead organise it...

ps guys if ya gonna red me over this,, do it to my face over a ride eh...

chanceyy

7th April 2007, 20:12

please tell why woman always want to reserve things solely for themselves. Why cant you have a section for all learner riders off in the pits on a normal trackday?

OI .... being a learner .. I wanna be out on the track ... not in the pits .. :dodge: :nono:

Grub

7th April 2007, 20:13

cowboyz

7th April 2007, 20:22

OI .... being a learner .. I wanna be out on the track ... not in the pits .. :dodge: :nono:

context woman!!

I was talking about the u turns and how to do stuff like that that was suggested above that you should already be able to do before you get a licence!

chanceyy

7th April 2007, 20:24

What you have proposed is against the law ... the law that WOMEN demanded.

You have just made it a thousand times worse by your sexist comments about men. Do not go ahead with this because if you do I will personally lay a complaint with the Human Rights Tribunal and I will make sure the media make a stink about it too.

Oh, no, that's right, all the militant journos are women ... ogh well then, I'll hold my breath until I turn blue

bit OTT there grub ;)

sorry missed ya calls yesterday ... had awesome ride today .. 86 says hi .. he lamenting his wee broken bike at the mo ;) :shit: (& having withdrawl symptoms thats she not in da garage next to betsy )

chanceyy

7th April 2007, 20:26

context woman!!

I was talking about the u turns and how to do stuff like that that was suggested above that you should already be able to do before you get a licence!

settle gretal ... just read the rest of the posts ;)

thats what BH is for :D

cowboyz

7th April 2007, 20:30

chanceyy

7th April 2007, 20:38

thats ok.. but at the next trackday I might have to stand on the top of the stands with a loud speaker yelling advice to you. You might have to keep the 2 stroke under 2000rpm so you can hear me... Oh why, oh why couldnt you just play soccer?????

one very very very simple reason ... I farken Hate soccer .. !!!!!!! farken football or what else you call it ... & ruggers I am a armchair critic ...

now the track day is another story .. but feel free to come poodle with me around the track ... & if i hear ya i might take ya advice ...

MotoGirl

7th April 2007, 21:14

If women want to have a 'girl' only track day. LET THEM!!
But let see which bunch of females can acctually be botherd organising one!!!!
$50 says there will be a man in the midst of things helping organising... its the way life works...

This is a bit silly really. I never said anyone is actually organising such an event! Here's my original post:

I'm purely curious here: Does anyone on KB organise women-only track days? ...

Jeez, sorry for wanting to start a conversation :done:

Grub

7th April 2007, 21:23

Jeez, sorry for wanting to start a conversation :done:

At last ... someone who understands how men feel!

MotoGirl

7th April 2007, 21:25

What you have proposed is against the law ... the law that WOMEN demanded.

You have just made it a thousand times worse by your sexist comments about men. Do not go ahead with this because if you do I will personally lay a complaint with the Human Rights Tribunal and I will make sure the media make a stink about it too.

:rofl: Go for it mate! While you're at it, you might want to retrospectively dob in those who have run a women's track day. Good luck with the Tribunal! :whocares:

Sketchy_Racer

7th April 2007, 21:26

MotoGirl

7th April 2007, 21:37

fair enough,

Well i guess the answer is no, no-one organises one thus far...

And i figure thats because no-one has felt the need for it.

general track days are great, with lots of good people, if you don't like males 'teaching' you, then go talk to a women... Cause there sure are a lot of women out there that could teach you a lot more than a lot of males. Im figuring thats the idea of it??

Thank you, finally a straight answer!

The main idea of a women's track day is to build confidence. These days had experienced riders present and very few racers. They spent a few minutes one-on-one with each and every rider. Most of the women had average riding abilities and it wasn't overly competitive on the track. We were solely there to learn in a pressure-free environment.

In theory, we could achieve a similar thing with novice/beginner-only track days (although we traditionally incorporate these into normal track days).

xwhatsit

7th April 2007, 22:15

Bleh I don't see the problem with it. Male and females -- well at least in late teens/early twenties, which is the age of most people I spend time with socially -- have quite a different social dynamic. Most of my friends are girls. I often find myself in situations where I might be having lunch or going dancing or whatever with all girls. If you add a guy, or especially a couple of guys into that mix of people, the dynamic instantly changes. Certain topics of conversation have to be avoided, there's more aggression and loud joking and laughing.

Testosterone can be a pain in the arse. I know this, that's why many of the friends I choose to spend time wih are female. Likewise, sometimes a group of catty girls can be a pain in the arse.

At something like a trackday, which is a place prone to a lot of aggression and competition and `boys being boys' I can totally sympathise with the girls here wanting a day for themselves. Likewise, I can think of a few situations where I'd want to hang out with just the boys. I'm sure you lads can think of a few too.

Obviously it goes without saying that if there can be a girls-only trackday, there can be a boys-only trackday too. I doubt Motogirl would contest that, or anybody else, really. However it seems rather pointless due to the sheer numbers of boys going to trackdays anyway. But the option remains.

This has very little to do with sexism. It's just that a group of boys running around in high spirits on their fast toys playing up can be a bit of a pisser when you want to concentrate and be left alone. I'm sure there's many guys here who wouldn't want to bring their nagging wives to a trackday, either.

MotoGirl

7th April 2007, 22:22

I'm sure there's many guys here who wouldn't want to bring their nagging wives to a trackday, either. :rofl:

Hallelujah! Someone who actually understands where I'm coming from :rockon:

cowboyz

7th April 2007, 23:21

This has very little to do with sexism. It's just that a group of boys running around in high spirits on their fast toys playing up can be a bit of a pisser when you want to concentrate and be left alone. I'm sure there's many guys here who wouldn't want to bring their nagging wives to a trackday, either.

Have you ever been to a trackday?

Grub

7th April 2007, 23:40

From the PM's I've been getting (it is so lovely to chat to you all too) I don't think you do. It has nothing to do with the merits of women having their own trackday.

Quite simply, a women's-only trackday is against the law. It is discriminatory and therefore cannot be held. The Law prohibits it.

The ironic thing is (and my point entirely) is that this law was agitated for by women because they objected to men-only events. They succeeded. The resulting law made them (and women-only events) illegal.

Just in case you think this is all poppycock and have short memories, last year women made it front-page news that the Waikaremoana Fishing Club have a men-only dormitory, right alongside a family dormitory but a men-only one nevertheless. That there is only one toilet in the corner without screening was apparently beside the point also. That case is being seriously considered as a case of discrimination by the Human Rights Tribunual.

In short, you can't get a law passed and then not be bound by it simply because it's not convenient to you to do so.

Brett

Trudes

8th April 2007, 07:13

I'm not arguing with you Grub, I don't have a law degree and don't know the ins and outs of everything involved, but why are there women's centers where men are not even allowed on the premises? And men and women only days at Golf corses?

Panther

8th April 2007, 09:40

It's like when you go bowling and your husband tells you how to improve your technique, even though his score is worse than yours!
some women wouldn't feel comfortable asking for advice from a male.
Women's days are a good intro and many women would use them before they're confident to show their skills in front of men.
unwelcome comments necessarily come from other riders - they could be from male partners

having a little trouble at home?
hubby not being very helpful with riding tips?

Kickaha

8th April 2007, 10:01

Quite simply, a women's-only trackday is against the law. It is discriminatory and therefore cannot be held. The Law prohibits it.

The law prohibits a lot of things, doesn't mean people can't or won't do them

Drew

8th April 2007, 10:19

Would you mind explaining how it adds more pressure?

It requires more people for marsheling, more time to organise, a logistical nightmare for bikes going out onto the track, and coming back in. The clubs that run these things dont pay the people who staff it, so it's not that easy to find people to put thier hands up.

All I was trying to say, is that a track day, is the wrong place to be teaching basic skills. Dont get me wrong, it would be a great idea to get beginers more confident, but I dont think someone without the required control to do a U turn competently, should be anywhere near a race track. Think about it for a second, we go there to speed, this is indesputable, if we didn't, we could just go for a ride on the road to practice riding. If someone isn't capable of the basics, should we really be encouraging them to learn to ride fast?

BigG

8th April 2007, 10:21

We dont need seperate track days, most track days acomodate for all rider types wether male or feemale or inbitween, they are for learning and having fun going fast or slow, its the experience you go for the people yuo meet and the big Buz. Signe up for the 6th of May this will be fantastic:rockon:

Disco Dan

8th April 2007, 10:23

It requires more people for marsheling, more time to organise, a logistical nightmare for bikes going out onto the track, and coming back in. The clubs that run these things dont pay the people who staff it, so it's not that easy to find people to put thier hands up.

All I was trying to say, is that a track day, is the wrong place to be teaching basic skills. Dont get me wrong, it would be a great idea to get beginers more confident, but I dont think someone without the required control to do a U turn competently, should be anywhere near a race track. Think about it for a second, we go there to speed, this is indesputable, if we didn't, we could just go for a ride on the road to practice riding. If someone isn't capable of the basics, should we really be encouraging them to learn to ride fast?

Good point. Sexism aside, if you cant do basic skills like u-turns you should not be on a track 'fine tuning' skills you have not got yet. You need to go slow before you can go fast ;)

MotoGirl

8th April 2007, 10:37

Dont get me wrong, it would be a great idea to get beginers more confident, but I dont think someone without the required control to do a U turn competently, should be anywhere near a race track. Think about it for a second, we go there to speed, this is indesputable, if we didn't, we could just go for a ride on the road to practice riding. If someone isn't capable of the basics, should we really be encouraging them to learn to ride fast?
Yep, I hear where you're coming from. These could be more a "training day" that just happen to be held at a track.

Everyone is welcome to argue this if he or she wishes to do so, but I think learning basic skills helps you on the track, especially emergency braking exercises. After all, speeding is one thing; slowing down is another!
Edit: I'm referring to people who may be experienced on the road, but not on the track. After a few track days, I'd expect everyone to know these skills already. We all know that you never go your absolute fastest during your first time on a track.

MotoGirl

8th April 2007, 10:49

Quite simply, a women's-only trackday is against the law. It is discriminatory and therefore cannot be held. The Law prohibits it.

You raise an interesting point; however, I don't see how this is different from the Special K Women's Duathlon. Excuse my lack of legal knowledge, but how come this event isn't discriminatory?

Ok, so the aforementioned event isn't motorcycle-related, but how does WIMA get away with discriminating against men? Or Ulysses with under 40s?
What about with Suzuki track days? I don't believe the April one is open to any other brands, so how is this not discrimination?

Drew

8th April 2007, 11:55

The law prohibits a lot of things, doesn't mean people can't or won't do them

I think that would be different for a Maori only track day, or a whites only track day. The law is (no pun intended), black and white here, you may not discriminate.

I dont really give a shit if girls have thier own track days, but I will oppose it, because I would go friggin mental about a race related bias, and essentially, it's the same thing.

cowboyz

8th April 2007, 12:26

You raise an interesting point; however, I don't see how this is different from the Special K Women's Duathlon. Excuse my lack of legal knowledge, but how come this event isn't discriminatory?

Ok, so the aforementioned event isn't motorcycle-related, but how does WIMA get away with discriminating against men? Or Ulysses with under 40s?
What about with Suzuki track days? I don't believe the April one is open to any other brands, so how is this not discrimination?

since you are bringing it up. What about womans gyms? How about that chick last year who moaned about not being able to get a $10 haircut at a barber because the barber only wanted to do mens hair. Kicked a right stink about it. Why dont you make a list of mens only activities and womans only activities. I think you will find it is already extremely one sided womans way.

Apart from getting volenteers there is also a money problem. Trackdays often struggle to get enough people along to cover costs as it is and limiting it to woman I think you shouldnt be surprised if the fee is $400 per person.

Kickaha

8th April 2007, 14:31

I think that would be different for a Maori only track day, or a whites only track day. The law is (no pun intended), black and white here, you may not discriminate.

the law says a lot of things, the prime example would be the 100kph speed limit how many on here obey that?

Womens only track days have been run in the past and I personally see nothing wrong with them

kiwifruit

8th April 2007, 14:34

I'd be in for that!! If you find any info about one, plz let us know about it!:rockon:

im keen too :yes:

MotoGirl

8th April 2007, 15:11

Why dont you make a list of mens only activities and womans only activities. I think you will find it is already extremely one sided womans way.
I'm not going to agree with or dispute your above comment. I do realise that some women get terribly carried away and accuse everyone of being sexist.
I'm simply trying to determine (for my own curiosity) how a women's track day is deemed to be discriminatory, when an event like the Special K Duathlon isn't. One would assume that this event wouldn't exist, let alone be allowed to run, if it was discriminatory.

Trackdays often struggle to get enough people along to cover costs as it is and limiting it to woman I think you shouldnt be surprised if the fee is $400 per person.
This isn't going to be as issue considering I'm not organising one! :rofl:
Oh, by the way, I did the women's day on the old Taupo track so it would've been viable. It cost me a whopping $30 and we only had about 30 women! I have no idea if the organisers even covered their costs.

MotoGirl

8th April 2007, 15:15

im keen too :yes:

:yes: Sounds right up your alley. I've heard you're a girl on two wheels :dodge:

Drew

8th April 2007, 16:45

I dont really give a shit if girls have thier own track days, but I will oppose it, because I would go friggin mental about a race related bias, and essentially, it's the same thing.

the law says a lot of things, the prime example would be the 100kph speed limit how many on here obey that?

Womens only track days have been run in the past and I personally see nothing wrong with them

Since you seem to have ignored the second paragraph of my post. I'll multi it for ya. I have no real problem with girl only track days, but in an effort not to be an hypocrate (spelling), I must oppose it. I would go fuckin APE SHIT over a Maori only track day, and European only track day for that matter. I'm not saying I obey every law all the time, but think about the relevence of a speed limit to a discrimenantly run event. There is none, I agree with one, and refuse to comment on the other, for fear of self incrimination.

MotoGirl

8th April 2007, 16:55

I have no real problem with girl only track days, but in an effort not to be an hypocrate (spelling), I must oppose it.

It's odd how there are different levels of discrimination. Some are bearable; some aren't. But I know what you're saying - our laws have to apply to everthing or nothing.

flame

8th April 2007, 19:05

I have no problem with a womens only track day, or a mens only track day. or a womens only gym or, or a mens only gym, or a womans only bog, or a mens only bog....(I real glad they sometimes have womens only ones coz they aint Pooey!).

Anyways.....I do know some women that went to a womens only track day, I wasn't there so can't comment too much, but I know they had a great time, and learnt alot. Tis a free country and we should have free opportunity to choose, I personally prefer to ride with males because they are the ones that have quite possibly taught me everything I know about riding. However....if that chick that races the Aprilia over in Europe should visit down under....I'd be happy to pay money to learn a few things from her. (bet you guys would pay just to follow her around the track hehehe)

I understand completly why beginner track riding women would like to have there own day. I personaly recal my first ever time on the track, and It was daunting when you don't know the lines/braking markers etc. As a female amongst males I was concerned that I was mucking up there lines, and was worried I was in their way. Nothing personal against any of them at all, just that I felt they were all so much better than me, and their track knowledge was superior, therefore......what the hell was I doing out there!! lol. And feeling like the underdog, makes your confidence level drop a bit more, but there support and helpful advice made me feel at ease. And I learnt so much from sticking with them.....(well...trying too!)

I don't know if a womens only day would be supported enough to make it a viable venture (so fewer women than men, and the cost of track hirage etc.) Perhaps a track day with a session availible for first timers may be a good idea? just to help them get the feel of track riding without peer pressure, though I think it's the experienced folk that are actually going to help you the most.

As long as men and women are having fun, then please don't try and put either down for their requests. If women or men are happy to attend and pay for a single sex track day.....surely it is their own reasons for doing so that others need to respect. No-one is making it compulsory.

Mr. Peanut

8th April 2007, 19:34

Sounds like a good idea to me, can I be the pitboy? :done:

cowboyz

8th April 2007, 19:53

I understand completly why beginner track riding women would like to have there own day. I personaly recal my first ever time on the track, and It was daunting when you don't know the lines/braking markers etc. As a female amongst males I was concerned that I was mucking up there lines, and was worried I was in their way. Nothing personal against any of them at all, just that I felt they were all so much better than me, and their track knowledge was superior, therefore......what the hell was I doing out there!! lol. And feeling like the underdog, makes your confidence level drop a bit more, but there support and helpful advice made me feel at ease. And I learnt so much from sticking with them.....(well...trying too!)

Let me rewrite this to make it relevant to me. Although I am copying your text it is still true.

I understand completly why beginner track riding newbies would like to have there own day. I personaly recal my first ever time on the track, and It was daunting when you don't know the lines/braking markers etc. As a newbie rider amongst more experienced riders I was concerned that I was mucking up there lines, and was worried I was in their way. Nothing personal against any of them at all, just that I felt they were all so much better than me, and their track knowledge was superior, therefore......what the hell was I doing out there!! lol. And feeling like the underdog, makes your confidence level drop a bit more, but there support and helpful advice made me feel at ease. And I learnt so much from sticking with them.....(well...trying too!)

That is what the slow/novice group is for. There is no need for a womans only trackday. If a trackday is organised I would much prefer seeing as many *bikers* out there as possible.

The argument that men give unwanted advice doesn't stand because men can't give advice while on the track. Make your own section in the pits or learn how to say shut the fuck up I dont like what you are telling me. Either way, no need to not allow men on the track.

The woman feel intimidated on the track with men because men are faster and more experienced doesnt stack up either because there are plenty of woman who are more than capable of throwing a good time round the track and those who are slower or new it is not because you are woman that you feel nervous, it is because you are new.

Anyone would think being a woman is a disability the way some people go on around here.

yod

8th April 2007, 19:57

the concept is fine but it just seems to be a waste of a perfectly good track day to limit who can come along (do you normally have too many people to let everyone in?)

it seems to me:

a) the more the merrier
b) you should try and let everybody get as much tracktime as you can

cowboyz

8th April 2007, 20:13

cut it out... cant have anyone popping some sense into this thread.

MotoGirl

8th April 2007, 20:23

...That is what the slow/novice group is for.

I disagree. In my experience, even the slow group is too quick for complete newbies.

Mr. Peanut

8th April 2007, 20:24

I disagree. In my experience, even the slow group is too quick for complete newbies.

Is the track the right place for newbs?

MotoGirl

8th April 2007, 20:27

Is the track the right place for newbs?

Let me rephrase:
I disagree. In my experience, even the slow group is too quick for complete newbies to the track.
You've gotta start somewhere right?

yod

8th April 2007, 20:47

cut it out... cant have anyone popping some sense into this thread.

sorry mate....what was i thinking....:yes:

i wouldnt know anyway...i've never done a track day :weep:

cowboyz

8th April 2007, 20:51

you should. fantastic to go out there and know for sure that there are no on coming cars/horsefloats. There are only a few corners you have to learn and once you work out which way the track goes it is all about you and your bike and the learning really begins.

MotoGirl

8th April 2007, 20:51

sorry mate....what was i thinking....:yes:

i wouldnt know anyway...i've never done a track day :weep:

This gives your comments credibility in my books :rockon:

Having never done a track day, would you feel more comfortable trying it out with people who have a similar skill level as yourself? Or would you rather be dumped into a group who are (more than likely) faster than you and expect you to know the ins and outs of track riding?

Like I said earlier (or maybe I just thought it?), the Slow group at a track day isn't always slow enough for first timers to the track.

yod

8th April 2007, 20:58

This gives your comments credibility in my books :rockon:

Having never done a track day, would you feel more comfortable trying it out with people who have a similar skill level as yourself? Or would you rather be dumped into a group who are (more than likely) faster than you and expect you to know the ins and outs of track riding?

Like I said earlier (or maybe I just thought it?), the Slow group at a track day isn't always slow enough for first timers to the track.

definitely with a group of similar speed...although i find chasing more fun than leading (so i guess i wouldnt be much of a racer i spose :laugh:)

even if i (or anyone) is slower than everybody in the slow group...ya gotta start somewhere or you'll always be slower than the slow group!

MotoGirl

8th April 2007, 21:06

definitely with a group of similar speed...although i find chasing more fun than leading (so i guess i wouldnt be much of a racer i spose :laugh:)

haha, yeah I'm much the same.

even if i (or anyone) is slower than everybody in the slow group...ya gotta start somewhere or you'll always be slower than the slow group!
:yes: although there is a difference between starting in the slow group and staying there. When you start getting quicker, you need to throw yourself out of your comfort zone and into a faster group. The amount you can learn from watching and talking to these guys in incredible!

Now, if only I could take my own advice and stop being so damn scared :rofl:

yod

8th April 2007, 21:16

Now, if only I could take my own advice and stop being so damn scared :rofl:

haha....i only got back into riding 3 months ago after a 10 year break buts it all coming back to me now, although i still find myself second guessing my corner speed as im going in and back off a bit sometimes....getting there tho

my last bike was a GPz900 but im starting out on an NC21 this time which was a good idea i think...cant go ridiculous speeds but still quick enough for heeeaps of fun!

will be pretty keen for a trackday at Manfeild at some stage but just dont wanna bin it and have to pay for the fix up!! :rofl:

cowboyz

8th April 2007, 21:21

I rode with yod on sat and I always suggest newbies to the track go in the slow group first out to learn the track, but he would only be there for one session before moving up. The whole "ride with a group of similar speed" is very subjective and the biggest fear of all newbies. Being apprehensive about simply being on a track and taking that to imply that everyone is doing 300km/hr. In fact, at mansfield at least, the slow group is speed limited to 120km/hr. For experienced road riders it is not difficult to maintain that.
In saying that it is not a big deal if you fall back. Even if you are really slow you might get lapped once in 18 minutes but it takes some effort to be lapped twice. And anyone who is in the slow group finding themselves too quick for it should have enough common sense not to carve slow riders up in the corners.

Trudes

8th April 2007, 21:24

And anyone who is in the slow group finding themselves too quick for it should have enough common sense not to carve slow riders up in the corners.

You'd think wouldn't you...... but that's a whole other thread!:dodge:

MotoGirl

8th April 2007, 21:25

although i still find myself second guessing my corner speed as im going in and back off a bit sometimes....getting there tho
I'm the same - I think that comes from low-siding my VTR because I braked too long. Now I'm just paranoid about slowing down!

To keep this on topic, my current lack of confidence is why I'd feel more comfortable at a training day, such as a women's day. Sometimes it's just better for the confidence to be the fastest in a slow group, rather than the slowest in a fast group.

yod

8th April 2007, 21:26

The amount you can learn from watching and talking to these guys in incredible!

i was out yesterday with a group where i was chasing 3 guys who probably have considerably more experience than i do and it was bloody excellent chasing them through a back road (well, trying to anyway)....they were gradually pulling away but while i was still close enough it was really good to follow them through corners and keep my speed up

i also get put off a bit when i cant see all the way through the corner (especially on a back road)...but i think im probably a bit over cautious sometimes...

but DAMN its good fun!! :Punk: :Punk: :Punk:

cowboyz

8th April 2007, 21:44

Sometimes it's just better for the confidence to be the fastest in a slow group, rather than the slowest in a fast group.

Doesn't that sound just a tad egotistical?

i was out yesterday with a group where i was chasing 3 guys who probably have considerably more experience than i do and it was bloody excellent chasing them through a back road (well, trying to anyway)....they were gradually pulling away but while i was still close enough it was really good to follow them through corners and keep my speed up

i also get put off a bit when i cant see all the way through the corner (especially on a back road)...but i think im probably a bit over cautious sometimes...

but DAMN its good fun!! :Punk: :Punk: :Punk:

You did well. Us guys have been riding together for a while now and you get to know peoples styles. I feel totally comfortable with either 86 or bonez sitting 2mm off my rear wheel because I trust them.
I always get nervous when a new guy shows up on the ashhurst rides. Well nervous is not the right word but something like that. So far we have had one bin in two years and that was one too many. Better to be safe than spending 6 months repairing your bike.
I too get apprehesive when I cant see the exit to the corner. Slows me down a fair bit but then road riding is not all about speed. It is about the company and enjoying being on the bike.

yod

8th April 2007, 22:04

You did well. Us guys have been riding together for a while now and you get to know peoples styles. I feel totally comfortable with either 86 or bonez sitting 2mm off my rear wheel because I trust them.
I always get nervous when a new guy shows up on the ashhurst rides. Well nervous is not the right word but something like that. So far we have had one bin in two years and that was one too many. Better to be safe than spending 6 months repairing your bike.
I too get apprehesive when I cant see the exit to the corner. Slows me down a fair bit but then road riding is not all about speed. It is about the company and enjoying being on the bike.

i hear ya mate, for me it's more about getting through the corners smoothly and trying to improve as i go rather than just out and out speed (altho i like stretching the revs a bit on the faster sections every now and then :laugh:)

i dont tend to stay too close to the guy in front anyway...im usually comfortable at about 20m minimum...had a couple of rear enders in my younger days (in cars thankfully) - a damn good lesson in the consequences of following too close! but also a couple of minor bins as well....im a bit nervous of younger fellas on bikes trying a bit too hard for the sake of their egos, can lead to an unhappy ending for them and others as well

thats why i was happy toodling along behind you in the later section where you were two up and there was gravel everywhere.....gave me a bit of confidence in my tyres' ability to stay attached to the road when i can see another bike doing it in front of me

chanceyy

8th April 2007, 22:35

I disagree. In my experience, even the slow group is too quick for complete newbies.

sorry motogirl, I have to disagree.. I attended the last track day at Manfield & at that stage I had only had approx 6 short road rides & 1 slightly longer road ride ...

I can sure attest to the fact I was nervous, but asked my mentor to plz come with me for a few laps before he buggered off to have his fun, well the sighting session sure got the nerves over with pretty quick, first session was all about trying lines .. & being in the slow novice group kinda headed out at the rear of the field so I would not be swamped by bikes ..

the second session was hell of a good time ... after words with my mentor about lines & cornering went out in the second session & built on the confidence that was starting to grow .. I had a blast ..

recognised that i was starting to tire in the afternoon & spent the time getting the experience cornering, rather than trying to increase speed etc ..

I have not ridden a motorbike for approx 20 yrs, then never a road bike I can certainly attest that the slow/novice group was the perfect place ... I highly recommend that if you are nervous then hang out the back ... it takes a wee while for the leading group to catch you ... & speed is limited to 120 & no overtaking the lead bike (with vest on)

the problem with us newbies is we need to get out there & do it to gain the experience, but how can you do that if you won't give it a go ...

chanceyy

8th April 2007, 22:39

I always get nervous when a new guy shows up on the ashhurst rides. Well nervous is not the right word but something like that. So far we have had one bin in two years and that was one too many. Better to be safe than spending 6 months repairing your bike.
I too get apprehesive when I cant see the exit to the corner. Slows me down a fair bit but then road riding is not all about speed. It is about the company and enjoying being on the bike.

Hopefully I did not make ya toooooo nervous there Cowboyz .. I sure enjoyed it immensely ... to be able to tackle the track again & be alot smoother sure made me smile as did those pearler roads out the back ...

I want do give them another go :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes:

never know what is around a corner when ya can not see ... like sheep .. only encountered about 5 today..... so one never knows what is around the corner .. definately to be safer than sorry

Trudes

9th April 2007, 07:40

I do have to point out though Chanceyy, that I've done a couple of trackdays now, and that was a very slow slow group, they are not always that slow, honest!:sunny:

cowboyz

9th April 2007, 08:23

but then if you convince more newbies to give it a go then the slow group will regulate its own pace and become big enough that those who are riding in the slow group just to be the quickest out on the track will move up to get out of the crowd.

Trudes

9th April 2007, 08:40

Which is what I think happened at that trackday, which was awesome, the pace of the slow group discouraged a lot of the people who can ride in the faster groups from going in the slow group also for extra track time, but doesn't always happen that way.

MotoGirl

9th April 2007, 09:35

...I can certainly attest that the slow/novice group was the perfect place ... I highly recommend that if you are nervous then hang out the back ... it takes a wee while for the leading group to catch you ... & speed is limited to 120 & no overtaking the lead bike (with vest on)

I appreciate your comments there chanceyy! Like Mrs Kendog said, it sounds like your experience in the Slow group may be have the exception instead of the norm.

I've been to several track days and have never even seen the speed of the Slow group speed limited.

:yes: It is a bit inconsistent - in most of my experience, the Slow group has been the slower people of the medium group! It's only at dedicated training days (held at a track) that I've seen a Slow group that was exactly that - slow.

MotoGirl

9th April 2007, 09:42

Doesn't that sound just a tad egotistical?

Sometimes it's just better for the confidence to be the fastest in a slow group, rather than the slowest in a fast group.
Whoops, I forgot to mention timing there!
I was trying to say that I was more far more confident hooning around on my VTR in the Fast group and being able to keep up / pass people (until I binned it).

After that happened, I've lost all my confidence and am now stuck in the Slow group being a chicken. It's disheartening because I know I've got the skills to be in a faster group; I just don't have the balls :rofl:

chanceyy

9th April 2007, 13:08

I appreciate your comments there chanceyy! Like Mrs Kendog said, it sounds like your experience in the Slow group may be have the exception instead of the norm.

I've been to several track days and have never even seen the speed of the Slow group speed limited.

:yes: It is a bit inconsistent - in most of my experience, the Slow group has been the slower people of the medium group! It's only at dedicated training days (held at a track) that I've seen a Slow group that was exactly that - slow.

I have to disagree .. true i have only ridden one track day but i have observed 3 others ... in all the ones i have seen there has been a lead rider that you are not allowed to overtake in both slow & meduim groups ..

also talked to other newbies that have taken part & they have had as much fun/ total learning experience that i have ...

so where are the track days you have been too or observed that do not have a lead rider for the slow/novice & medium groups ?

Kickaha

9th April 2007, 13:36

I have to disagree .. true i have only ridden one track day but i have observed 3 others ... in all the ones i have seen there has been a lead rider that you are not allowed to overtake in both slow & meduim groups ..

only ever seen that in the first session at Taupo and after that it was go at your own pace

they don't do it at all down here (Chch) at the track days

cowboyz

9th April 2007, 13:43

well there is a massive change in preception! I only go to manfield because it is just round the corner. The slow group has a lead rider with a vest and he doesnt go over 120k/hr Even if you start right at the back it is not really hard to catch the lead rider if you are doing 160 or so down the back striaght. The guys who shouldnt be in the slow group get bored very quickly. The medium is limited to 180km/hr and that is about right for me. The fast and race group are go for gold. Really good format and I ASSUMED (my bad) it was like that everywhere.
Maybe having a chat to the organisers and arranging a lead rider for at least the slow group to ensure the burglars stay out of that group?