Phone drivers

[Big Dave]

Phone linked to South Island bus crash

The driver of a tourist bus that plunged down a bank on the South Island's west coast yesterday - with 44 people on board - may have fallen from his seat as he reached for a cellphone before the crash, according to witnesses.http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/1/story.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10435520

Is it time we started to demand that ACC/police/transit etc do something instead of saying 'there is no proof that phones cause accidents.'
What planet are they on??

How many times has a driver nearly hit you/changed lanes on you because he was distracted by a phone?'

It's happened to me plenty I'm going to start making some noise.
I want hands free made compulsory like Aus.

Agree - disagree?

[Robbo]

Yep. I,ve had more close calls than i care to remember involving f/wits who are either talking or texting on a cellphone. Ban the use of cellphones while driving.
The idiots who can't see the problem either have their heads up their arses or don't use the roads.:nono:

[SlashWylde]

Agree, hands free would be a good (and realistic) start. Though I doubt it would stop most people from talking and typing text messages whilst driving. Might be simpler to say "no operating a cell phone in a motor vehicle whilst vehicle is in motion".

It's a sad state of affairs when we have to introduce yet another piece of legislation to enforce common sense on the populace.

[Donor]

Though I do agree with you, it begs the question...

If phones are such an issue with regard to road safety/accident stats, then do we look at removing other 'distractions' such as:

Radios/Stereos
Heater Controls
Cigarette lighters
Centre consoles
Ceiling mounted rear view mirrors

All these things are able to be utilised/adjusted by the car driver, taking their attention away from the journey, how is a cellphone any more dangerous than these things?

Do we ban passengers, as apparently conversation removes a great deal of awareness of the environment.

Not out to argue for or against, just thought I'd throw another line of thought in the thread. :dodge:

[pritch]

Absolutely! Cellphone use while driving is banned where I work but I suspect that this is pretty much ignored. I understand Shell have a slogan "Ignition on, cellphone off." It seems that reality is starting to dawn on everybody except politicians.

Nothing new there...

Harry Dynhoven is the the Minister involved I think. You could check out Parliament's website for contact details or you could take a punt and email:
Harry.Duynhoven@parliament.govt.nz

[Babelfish]

Yep, time and again, when I see some dumbass antics by a cage there's usually a phone stuck to their head. I was in the UK when they enforced hands free, and that had to be wireless I think.

It'll make a bit of difference, but most pricks using a phone in any form while driving are inept at multitasking well enough to keep from smacking you off your bike.

Common sense isnt hands free, its pulling over, or to a lesser degree simply telling someone they'll call back when finished driving. Unfortunately cages are devoid of common sense, at least thats what I always assume they are.

[Trudes]

Agreed!! I wonder if some of it is arrogance? I certainly don't think I'm so important that someone has to speak to me immediately. if I'm driving and the phone rings, I have an answering service, leave a message, I may get back to you when I'm not in charge of a death machine.

[jahrasti]

Though I do agree with you, it begs the question...

If phones are such an issue with regard to road safety/accident stats, then do we look at removing other 'distractions' such as:

Radios/Stereos
Heater Controls
Cigarette lighters
Centre consoles
Ceiling mounted rear view mirrors

All these things are able to be utilised/adjusted by the car driver, taking their attention away from the journey, how is a cellphone any more dangerous than these things?

Do we ban passengers, as apparently conversation removes a great deal of awareness of the environment.

Not out to argue for or against, just thought I'd throw another line of thought in the thread. :dodge:

I saw an article which stated that when on the phone you are as distracted as a drunk driver.
It also stated that when there are occupants in the car, they are engaged in the ride so if something was to happen e.g. going into the corner to fast, then everyone would shut up and the driver would then concentrate on what they were doing. On a cell phone if the same was to happen the person on the phone has no idea what the driver is doing so will not know to stop talking.

[Big Dave]

All these things are able to be utilised/adjusted by the car driver, taking their attention away from the journey, how is a cellphone any more dangerous than these things?



Frequency/duration of use and introduction of divergent thought process.

[Big Dave]

Absolutely! Cellphone use while driving is banned where I work but I suspect that this is pretty much ignored. I understand Shell have a slogan "Ignition on, cellphone off." It seems that reality is starting to dawn on everybody except politicians.

Nothing new there...

Harry Dynhoven is the the Minister involved I think. You could check out Parliament's website for contact details or you could take a punt and email:
Harry.Duynhoven@parliament.govt.nz

If someone will tell me when the next BRONZ meeting is (like I keep asking!) I will table a motion.

i wonder if vodaphone and telecom etc have a policy? If you are looking for something to surf - lets see if we can get some quotes from the telecos on the issue. They'll want to sell some accessories - lets use 'em.

What about a petition. Mr Ixion - know how that works?

ideas ideas ideas???

[MotoGirl]

The idiots who can't see the problem either have their heads up their arses or don't use the roads.:nono:

Or, they're notorious users of their cellphone while driving!
I totally agree though - drivers talking on cellphones are freakin' dangerous and (in my opinion) cause unnecessary carnage on our roads.

[Flatcap]

...drivers talking on cellphones are freakin' dangerous and (in my opinion) cause unnecessary carnage on our roads.

I think we should also target those causing necessary carnage...

[Ixion]

If someone will tell me when the next BRONZ meeting is (like I keep asking!) I will table a motion.

i wonder if vodaphone and telecom etc have a policy? If you are looking for something to surf - lets see if we can get some quotes from the telecos on the issue. They'll want to sell some accessories - lets use 'em.

What about a petition. Mr Ixion - know how that works?

ideas ideas ideas???

Third Wednesday in every month. Except December. It's on the web site. C'mon I know you're an Ozzie, but y' can count to three , if y' try real hard.

Petitions are a waste of time, they are ignored.

[Dave Lobster]

Making it illegal will make no difference.

It is illegal in the UK. It has made no difference. You still see every fourth or fifth driver using their phone (not hands free).
The law is not enforceable. To catch people using their phones, you either need cameras on every street corner (not acceptable), or have a real policeman on every street corner (not practical).

On the up side, Kiwis tend to be far more adept at using their mobiles while driving than the UK.

[Big Dave]

Petitions are a waste of time, they are ignored.

Will remind me next meeting please.

Cool - plan B. Mass email campign.

[Big Dave]

Making it illegal will make no difference.

I.

Made a big differnce in Aus. I noticed it. And nobody does it - heavily enforced.

[Crisis management]

I'm in, anything to stop the high level of distraction that cellphone use causes sounds like a good idea to me.

Who do I email???

[Skyryder]

If someone will tell me when the next BRONZ meeting is (like I keep asking!) I will table a motion.

i wonder if vodaphone and telecom etc have a policy? If you are looking for something to surf - lets see if we can get some quotes from the telecos on the issue. They'll want to sell some accessories - lets use 'em.

What about a petition. Mr Ixion - know how that works?

ideas ideas ideas???


I agree with all that you have said with the exception of phone accessories and by this I take that you mean some kind of hands free device. There have been a number of studies that 'indicate' that attention distraction is no different with hand fee devices as against the cell phone held by the hand.

I'm not normaly against petitions and they can show the level of support for a 'position.' But on this issue..........??????????????............who knows.....nothing ventured nothing gained.

As an ex bus driver this 'crash' was not caused by a cell phone. That's just an excuse. The driver did not put the safety of his passengers as his number one priority. He had the wrong attitude. I'm very interested in who made the call. If it was the company and they were aware of his schedule then some of the blame must be accorded to them. Perhaps you have some friends in the media who may be interested to know. If that could be established through phone records.....................then my advice would be to target one of the tour busses with a protest ride. That wold get some media attention and bring to the attention of the tourist industry just how bad this comapany is. Bad PR is the only way this company is going to change.

Skyryder

[Dave Lobster]

Made a big differnce in Aus. I noticed it. And nobody does it - heavily enforced.

How? More policemen on the streets? Its already been discussed here that once dunkin donuts is closed, the policemen all go home.

[Timber020]

if it was made illegal at lest a good percentage of people would stop doing it, it would probably save a few lives every year. Put a bunch of demerits on it, that would hurt em. Same kind of observation (if not less) that the seatbelt law requires. That saved alot of lives to.

[Big Dave]

How? More policemen on the streets? Its already been discussed here that once dunkin donuts is closed, the policemen all go home.

:-)

They started yanking drivers and smacking them with fines. Of couse you still see some - but very few compared to hyar.

[Swoop]

Put a bunch of demerits on it, that would hurt em.
I believe you have hit the nail on the head!!!
Good point.


BD, I support the initiative. Cellphones are a distraction.

I also support forward firing rocket-pods on bikes. Machineguns optional.

[Robbo]

I believe you have hit the nail on the head!!!
Good point.


BD, I support the initiative. Cellphones are a distraction.

I also support forward firing rocket-pods on bikes. Machineguns optional.

Yep! Sounds like a good scheme. If we start firing at them then they will quickly realise just how using a cellphone when driving can be hazardous to their health and safety.
:ar15:

[kro]

Cellphones are so very important.... not. I have not had a personal cellphone for years, and seem to still be alive.

[Dave Lobster]

:-)

They started yanking drivers and smacking them with fines. Of couse you still see some - but very few compared to hyar.

Don't get me wrong. I'm anti using the phone while driving. I just worry about how the law could be enforced.

And, are 'phones any more dangerous than two or three screaming children in the back seat?

If you ban one thing because it'll save a handful of lives, it sets a dangerous precedent. It wouldn't be long before some overzealous copper fines people for drinking tins of pop while waiting at traffic lights. Don't laugh.. its happened in the UK.

If a policeman sees someone driving dangerously while on the 'phone, doesn't he have the power to fine them for dangerous driving? If they don't do it now, why would they bother if using the 'phone is illegal?
Ie, aren't existing laws adequate?

[Oakie]

My daughters were behind a cell phone using driver on Friday and watched her drive straight into the back of a parked car at about 55kph.

[Big Dave]

Don't get me wrong.

Debate welcome.
I may have even been wrunk.....wrink....wrunge....not as right as usual once.

The three screamin kids don't need one hand to operate, paticularly in your quad turbo gizzamuziki with manual gear change and pull to the left front wheel drive. 'Oh! a hand on the steering wheel - I'll get to that after I change gears.'

[candor]

Long been fence sitting on this one. Some good comments, am not sold by the studies I've seen that its significant. Agree it was attitude (or maybe inebriation screwing up the drivers sense of balance, why he fell off seat), way more than any ringing phone. The ones that do worry me are teen phone addicts with bigger mouths and more fingers than brains. They can be disturbing - but they are that regardless on road - right? Jist punish teens I reckon as its proven they are multitask challenged.

[pzkpfw]

Part of the issue is that laws are there for the lowest common denominator, and there is a difference between 1) prevention and 2) punishment after the fact.

e.g. of 1): Speeding; there's a 100 kph top limit, though we all know there are places it's hardly less safe to be at 110, 120 or whatever. But the limit is there to try to prevent the worst happening, too often.

e.g. of 2) Murder; you can't really police peoples' thoughts, so you kind of have to wait until they've "done it" before you can arrest them for murder.


I'm not 100% certain that all use of a cellphone in a car is all that bad.

When I've left work I will call my wife, while I'm at a red light, to tell her I'm on my way. I use a speed dial to get her, and if the light goes green I say "bye" and drop the phone in my lap.

Should I get a fine for that?


So phone use in a car is one of those things I'd rather see punished when things go wrong, than punished for any use (in case something goes wrong).

* Someone weaving all over while texting - fine the crap out of them.

* Someone crashes while on the phone - put them in jail. (Same as if they were messing with their stereo or lighter).

I know it's too late after they've already killed someone you like, but then, the open road speed limit isn't 80 kph anymore, either, and it's not illegal to change your CD's.

Cheers,

[Hitcher]

Ahh. The BGFT's fucked. Or, if you live in Turangi, the BGVL.

[Ixion]

Would it have made a big differnece if the Kiwi Experience buses had been fitte with RT ? And he crashed fumbling for the RT mic?