Learning to throttle blip.

[El Dopa]

Had a good ride this afternoon, scrubbing in the new rear tyre ready for the track day. Amazing how different it feels on the road - I trust the bike much more in the corners.

Anyway. El Bandido is an in-line 4, and makes power best between 9-13K, which is fine out in the sweepers where I spend most of the time switching up and down between the same two or three gears, with decent intervals between changes.

However, coming off straight-ish bits of road into sharper corners involves hard braking and tapping down two or three gears to set myself and the bike up in the right gear for the corner, before I tip in. I'm getting a lot of tail wiggle and lockup when I try to do this at a reasonable speed - the revs are far too low for the lower gear.

I know I need to learn to blip the throttle to match the engine revs for the lower gear - I've read this (http://forums.superbikeschool.com/index.php?showtopic=258), this (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=5779&highlight=throttle+blipping) and this (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=43161&highlight=throttle+blipping).

So I need to brake, change down, hold the clutch in, increase the revs to the correct level, then let the clutch out, right?

My question is: How do I brake reasonably hard, and adjust the throttle position at the same time? How do I twist the throttle and still maintain a decent brake pressure?

Does anyone have any tips for practising this? Like, breaking it down into discrete steps I can practice one at a time?

[Switch]

I'm not a fast rider, but i ride a loudish cruiser so i generally throttle blip alot.
I brake, clutch in, blip the throttle and change gear, let the clutch out, then brake more if needed.
Repeat steps 1,2,3,4,5 if needed :nya:
Spose it takes practice, i just did it to be cool :cool:

[jtzzr]

Please don`t take this as gospel , but what I do is roll of the throttle ,whilst having 2 fingers on the lever using the lever to hold on to which leaves my palm and thumb free to blip the throttle as I`m changing down and as I exit the corner I just roll my palm and thumb around and I`m back on the juice , I know I`ve made this sound complicated and I am quite possibly different from other riders and may seem weird but it works for me, It just takes practice to find out what works for you. i wish you well

[Drew]

I "blip" with all four fingers on the brake lever, it's just a natural thing, however, it is not going to stop the tail waggle you get under severe braking. I can only advise, you stop thinking about what the rear is doing, as untill you are on the way out of the corner with the gas on, it is VERY unlikely to let go.

What I mean is, as soon as you start letting off the brake, weight comes back onto the rear, and it regains traction. Since ya cant tip into a corner under full breaking, it's nothing to worry about. Infact, it is well possible to use the rear slippage, to tighten up your corner entry line, giving a better drive out. I'm only just learning this, but I ride with Jayracer37 a lot, and he does it on every tight corner. More so on the ones he's not familiar with it would seem, but I think that's just showing off cos he cant go round it flat out, so he slides into it a bit slower.

[TygerTung]

Yep that it, you should be able to give it a bit with the palm of your hand when you're still braking, you can't really explain it, just do it! it's not too hard, just give it a go.

[mynameis]

Throttle Blipping While Braking.

I think there are a few things which most of use tend to take for granted, which actually helps a lot.

Make sure your throttle play is nice and good and your clutch as well. Try adjusting them if your hands are big, try maximum space (as far away as possible ). Use the inside bit of the brake lever than the outside as it has more space.

Timing is important so try and concentrate on the point of engagement of the clutch. I use the index and middle finger on brakes and fourth and little one with the thumb on the throttle. Basically it's developing your preference and style which works for you.

Here's a clip of the master Shaun Harris doing it at Taupo recently (courtesy of Leong), see how fast he does it you'll fall off your chair! And apparently it's a skill which takes a bit of time to master but pays off big time for late braking and faster speed corner entry.

http://www.youtube.com/v/3v8EnIYbaqM

[El Dopa]

I "blip" with all four fingers on the brake lever, it's just a natural thing, however, it is not going to stop the tail waggle you get under severe braking. I can only advise, you stop thinking about what the rear is doing, as untill you are on the way out of the corner with the gas on, it is VERY unlikely to let go.


what I do is roll of the throttle ,whilst having 2 fingers on the lever using the lever to hold on to which leaves my palm and thumb free to blip the throttle as I`m changing down and as I exit the corner I just roll my palm and thumb around and I`m back on the juice

I'm not worried about the tail waggle, it just doesn't make for a particularly smooth ride. I reckon if I can get the hang of blipping, I'll be smoother (and hopefully a bit faster), rather than just banging down through the box and using my fat arse to damp the vibration.

What I'm after is the physical positioning and mechanical action of the right hand/fingers/wrist during braking/blipping. I can't work out in my head how you can pull the brake lever towards the bar and maintain pressure, and at the same time roll the throttle.

Normally when I brake, I use all four fingers over the top of the lever (and I'd feel quite uncomfortable using less), and I use my palm on the throttle as a static point, squeezing the lever towards my palm with my fingers.

Normally when I roll on the throttle, the fingers/palm are fully wrapped around the throttle, and I twist my wrist/rotate my fingers back towards myself.

So how do adapt my technique so I can use my fingers on the brake lever, and yet at the same time use my palm? thumb? to rotate the throttle? If I start to play with the throttle, I'm losing my static point and I can't squeeze the brake lever as effectively. Should I be pulling the brake lever backwards with my elbow/shoulder instead?

[Drew]

The thing is, you're not turning the throttle very far at all, so it's more of a quick thumb tuck, than a twist of the wrist. At least for me anyway.

[Black Bandit]

What I'm after is the physical positioning and mechanical action of the right hand/fingers/wrist during braking/blipping. I can't work out in my head how you can pull the brake lever towards the bar and maintain pressure, and at the same time roll the throttle.

Your wish is granted:
shift_blip_throttle (http://www.sportrider.com/ride/RSS/146_0402_shift_blip_throttle/)

Has pics on hand position. The main cause of your difficulty may be using all four fingers to brake and I suspect that two fingers would be sufficient. Incidently I've just started practicing this technique too. It's devilishly tricky to start with but very satisfying when you get it right. The biggest problem I have is over reving on the blip which makes the bike lurch about. Practice makes perfect.

[Denniso]

For road use I genraly blip the throttle without any problem , no thinking required but then I ride a hell of a lot slower on the road , but for track I will just hold the throttle at a set rev range and shift down the gears as I need . On the track I know how many gears I have to go down every corner. On The RS I would hold it at around 8000rpm clutch in and go down to the gear I want to exit the corner in , this saves a hell of a lot attention which you can then spend on getting round the corner . worked for me .

[The Pastor]

I lernt to blip today. Took me about 3 mins, I don't get it right every time, sorta get it right 80% of the time.

You know when you get it right as you can't feel anything when u let go of the clutch, if you get a slight lurch youve done it wrong.

Just shut up and go ride, learn till it works for you.

[HDTboy]

Rather than blipping the throttle if you're not comfortable with it. Why don't you just release the clutch slower?

[Ixion]

Fingers does the brake , palm does the blip. Go ride a big single. You will learn how to blip VERY quicky.

[skidMark]

Throttle Blipping While Braking.

I think there are a few things which most of use tend to take for granted, which actually helps a lot.

Make sure your throttle play is nice and good and your clutch as well. Try adjusting them if your hands are big, try maximum space (as far away as possible ). Use the inside bit of the brake lever than the outside as it has more space.

Timing is important so try and concentrate on the point of engagement of the clutch. I use the index and middle finger on brakes and fourth and little one with the thumb on the throttle. Basically it's developing your preference and style which works for you.

Here's a clip of the master Shaun Harris doing it at Taupo recently (courtesy of Leong), see how fast he does it you'll fall off your chair! And apparently it's a skill which takes a bit of time to master but pays off big time for late braking and faster speed corner entry.

http://www.youtube.com/v/3v8EnIYbaqM

here i was thinking shaun harris was quick not a pisstake here...150-160 through the lighter corners? i can ride that fast :gob:

i'm confused....

he wasn't going quick at all....

[NighthawkNZ]

i'm confused....

he wasn't going quick at all....

me too... what are breaks?

[Grahameeboy]

You could try just using the throttle and gears to slow for corners and use less brake....that is what I do although I have a v-twin (oh and with a slipper clutch) but I imagine your 400 has a fair bit of engine braking.

I just find using brakes too much adds to the list of things to do and think about and you may find that using throttle etc is smoother..........

[CM2005]

try braking with less fingers to start with, then try the blipping thing. the other thing i read in Fast Bikes mag is to put your bike in neutral, hold it on the front brake and push it, while blipping the throttle, and that'll help you get even brake pressure while braking.. Or you could try blipping and rear braking until you get used to it, then use the front brake?

[yod]

Your wish is granted:
shift_blip_throttle (http://www.sportrider.com/ride/RSS/146_0402_shift_blip_throttle/)

Has pics on hand position. The main cause of your difficulty may be using all four fingers to brake and I suspect that two fingers would be sufficient. Incidently I've just started practicing this technique too. It's devilishly tricky to start with but very satisfying when you get it right. The biggest problem I have is over reving on the blip which makes the bike lurch about. Practice makes perfect.

i use first 2 fingers on brake lever and the with the thumb, ring and little finger round the throttle makes it easy to blip just before you let the clutch out

blipping is easy in itself but as black bandit says its getting it to the right revs thats the hard part

incidentally, i only use two fingers on both levers....just habit i think

[more_fasterer]

It took me ages to get it right. Basically, you have to learn how to pivot your fingers relative to your palm. So when you give the throttle a twist with your palm & thumb, your fingers pivot to accomodate and stay in the same place as a result.

Good luck & have fun!

[El Dopa]

put your bike in neutral, hold it on the front brake and push it, while blipping the throttle, and that'll help you get even brake pressure while braking.

Yeah, I was thinking about it today - this'll probably be my starting point. Try to get the muscle memory bedded in before I try it for real. Thanks.


I imagine your 400 has a fair bit of engine braking.

A lot. Takes a bit of getting used to.


Rather than blipping the throttle if you're not comfortable with it. Why don't you just release the clutch slower?

I've been trying that, but I still seem to get a pause halfway through where the revs fall below the gear ratio. Then when I fully release, I get the tailshake and the rev needle jumps vertical.


Your wish is granted:
shift_blip_throttle (http://www.sportrider.com/ride/RSS/146_0402_shift_blip_throttle/)

Just the sort of thing I was after. Ta.

Thankyou one and all for your sound advice.

[mynameis]

here i was thinking shaun harris was quick not a pisstake here...150-160 through the lighter corners? i can ride that fast :gob:

i'm confused....

he wasn't going quick at all....

Well you seem to know everything, and you're talking as if you know the Taupo tracks in and out. Ever ridden there?

But you can't really read and understand my post can you? Im not talking about him being fast or anything, Im just commenting on his blipping which is amazing.

Although he did embarrass a few guys on thousands whether he was going fast/hard or not.

But again if you want to compare yourself with Shaun just by looking at a video clip then knock yourself out. :)

[CM2005]

he does blip fast, and that vids definitely a great example of how practice makes perfect aye? is he on a 600? I've never been to taupo, hoping to get my bucket there on Xmas.

[Metalor]

I thought you were always supposed to blip the throttle when changing down?Or is it just a fancy thing? I try to do it all the time, make changing down way smoother, although sometimes i "over-blip" and the bike lurches forward for a split second and it ends up feeling similar to changing down a gear too soon.

I know I'm only riding a 250, but all the older dudes I know who ride bikes all tell me to blip the throttle...



Oh, AND do I use 91 or 96?? I'm fairly new to biking so I'm trying to learn as much as I can.

[hurricane_r]

Throttle Blipping While Braking.

I think there are a few things which most of use tend to take for granted, which actually helps a lot.

Make sure your throttle play is nice and good and your clutch as well. Try adjusting them if your hands are big, try maximum space (as far away as possible ). Use the inside bit of the brake lever than the outside as it has more space.

Timing is important so try and concentrate on the point of engagement of the clutch. I use the index and middle finger on brakes and fourth and little one with the thumb on the throttle. Basically it's developing your preference and style which works for you.

Here's a clip of the master Shaun Harris doing it at Taupo recently (courtesy of Leong), see how fast he does it you'll fall off your chair! And apparently it's a skill which takes a bit of time to master but pays off big time for late braking and faster speed corner entry.

http://www.youtube.com/v/3v8EnIYbaqM

yeh thats bad ass,, but thats nothing to make u fall of your chair, if u cant do it this fast its point less cause bikes rpm are touchy and if the blip down shit is left to long it doesnt match the rpm

also try using no clutch just tap the throttle and apply pressure to leaver when u tap throttle ul feel it drop a gear...

and try not to take advice from noobs like mynameis, hehe alvin u can barley shift upgear properly let alone a blip down shift hehe

[hurricane_r]

here i was thinking shaun harris was quick not a pisstake here...150-160 through the lighter corners? i can ride that fast :gob:

i'm confused....

he wasn't going quick at all....

iv riden with you and you suck

[Drew]

you suck

So you enjoyed it then?

[hurricane_r]

So you enjoyed it then?

he's the best,,,,,

[Sketchy_Racer]

here i was thinking shaun harris was quick not a pisstake here...150-160 through the lighter corners? i can ride that fast :gob:

i'm confused....

he wasn't going quick at all....

No, No you fucking can't mark...

Shaun has a thing called skill.. something you lack COMPLETLY!!

And i've given you a chance to prove it before.. that offer of a race between me and you at a track, with me on a 125CC bike, and you on what ever the hell you like... bring it

[JayRacer37]

What I mean is, as soon as you start letting off the brake, weight comes back onto the rear, and it regains traction. Since ya cant tip into a corner under full breaking, it's nothing to worry about. Infact, it is well possible to use the rear slippage, to tighten up your corner entry line, giving a better drive out. I'm only just learning this, but I ride with Jayracer37 a lot, and he does it on every tight corner. More so on the ones he's not familiar with it would seem, but I think that's just showing off cos he cant go round it flat out, so he slides into it a bit slower.

Damn, sprung!!

Blipping will come naturally. I just hold the brake with one or two fingers, and use my wrist action (well practiced....) to flick the throttle...it doesn't take much throttle movement to bring th revs up a touch with the clutch semi in, as the clutch doesn't have to come right back when ur on the move. I only use one or sometimes two fingers on the clutch, except at standstill, this way i still have a grip round the bars to turn the bike with.

[JayRacer37]

No, No you fucking can't mark...

Shaun has a thing called skill.. something you lack COMPLETLY!!

And i've given you a chance to prove it before.. that offer of a race between me and you at a track, with me on a 125CC bike, and you on what ever the hell you like... bring it

Shaun DOES have a thing called skill.
That wasn't a fast session though, I've seen the guy go much faster round there.
Just cause it was on the vid, doesn't mean that it was full pace.
All stop talking and bow down, say no more about being able to faster till you seen onboard with Shaun at the IOM :gob: mummy :crybaby:

[Finn]

You're all amatuers. Listen to the master, I shall say this only once...

When braking, use your biggest finger only. That's the one you use to flick people the bird. That's enough for heavy braking and you've still got good throttle control with your other 3 fingers and thumb.

Try it and thank me later.

Note: I am of course referring to the front brake (for the ladies out there)

[Drew]

Damn, sprung!!

You will of course refrain from those shenanigans next weekend on my bike tho yeah? That back tyre needs to last the day.

[Skyryder]

You're all amatuers. Listen to the master, I shall say this only once...

When braking, use your biggest finger only. That's the one you use to flick people the bird. That's enough for heavy braking and you've still got good throttle control with your other 3 fingers and thumb.

Try it and thank me later.

Note: I am of course referring to the front brake (for the ladies out there)

Well fuck me. You mean to tell me the front brake is on the same side as the throttle? No wonder my front brake has never worked...........I've been using the wrong side....................:doh:

Skyryder

[mynameis]

yeh thats bad ass,, but thats nothing to make u fall of your chair, if u cant do it this fast its point less cause bikes rpm are touchy and if the blip down shit is left to long it doesnt match the rpm

also try using no clutch just tap the throttle and apply pressure to leaver when u tap throttle ul feel it drop a gear...

and try not to take advice from noobs like mynameis, hehe alvin u can barley shift upgear properly let alone a blip down shift hehe

0ops sorry boss you're so right I can't even ride properly in a straight line or change up, and I should not be talking about blipping and all the complicated stuff.

KB is blessed with your input Rod ;) now get out there and start racing!

[JayRacer37]

You will of course refrain from those shenanigans next weekend on my bike tho yeah? That back tyre needs to last the day.

ohhh err....ummm....well....its only one session right???
hahaha
I can try...yea..try..thats it :D

[Leong]

Shaun DOES have a thing called skill.
That wasn't a fast session though, I've seen the guy go much faster round there.
Just cause it was on the vid, doesn't mean that it was full pace.


Too right!! He was on my road bike, and did maybe 5 laps? And this is what Blueblade said about it in my video thread...


Just for your info Leong. I tried to follow Shaun earlier in that session when he was on a race bike. Stuck with him for about 3 metres. He was just flying !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:gob:
A bit later he came by on your bike and, although he was going reasonably quick, I can assure you he was substantially slower than on the race bike. Looked like he was either being very careful with someones pride and joy, or possibly concentrating on analysing what the bike was doing. Either way, i managed to keep him in sight for about 4 corners that time.
Really cool to be on the track with someone like him, and an extra bonus to have him play with our bikes in the pits.:yes:

And back to topic...... blipping throttle - I can do fine on the road, but at the track when you're very hard on the brakes and a lot of weight is on the wrists, I find it much more difficult. Any tips ??

[Drew]

And back to topic...... blipping throttle - I can do fine on the road, but at the track when you're very hard on the brakes and a lot of weight is on the wrists, I find it much more difficult. Any tips ??

Not sure about tips, I tend to brake early, rather than later, this gives more time to set up for the corner, a better line, and a harder drive out. Towards the end of a session, my braking becomes later, but my coner speed stays the same. The early braking will also help to get the throttle thing right.

Just another way of easing into a full on thrash. Most people dont do thier fastest laps early on anyway, so fuck all ground is lost.

[speedpro]

Some of the advice is good, some has got me seriously worried. This thread is a good indicator of the requirement for good rider training from the very first moment you put your bum on the seat. I only use the clutch changing down in case I don't get the blip exactly right and even there I only just pull on it enough to make it slip a bit. It's a practice and familiarity thing to be able to brake real hard while tipping in and changing down at the same time. You should be able to brake hard and consistently while blipping for shifts.

However I do recall watching some onboard footage from Mr Rossi and he was just tapping down through the gears and letting the slipper clutch take care of it.

[JayRacer37]

I only use the clutch changing down in case I don't get the blip exactly right and even there I only just pull on it enough to make it slip a bit.

However I do recall watching some onboard footage from Mr Rossi and he was just tapping down through the gears and letting the slipper clutch take care of it.

On track, trying to back shift woitout a clutch is fine unless your in a situation where it is more likely to change the bikes attitude rapidly. An example is the sweeper at manfeild where you are backshifting a gear at full lean-try that with no clutch and u'll likely end up on yr ear.
This follows thru on the road - I wouldn't want to try and clutchless backshift in anything in but in a straight line - IF (and yes I do with regularity) I want to put the bike sideways, I do it with using the clutch lever as a 2nd rear brake - letting it out to get more brake, back in to reduce rear wheel back torque.

Mr Rossi's case is a stethial one. We don't all have a Yamaha unobtanium back-torque clutch, nor a Yamaha computer system that actually is pre programmed to blip the next gear for him - this technology was introduced when all the ex-500 riders complained about having to blip the first MotoGP bikes in 2002, after getting of the two-strokes with FA back-torque.

[hurricane_r]

0ops sorry boss you're so right I can't even ride properly in a straight line or change up, and I should not be talking about blipping and all the complicated stuff.

KB is blessed with your input Rod ;) now get out there and start racing!


your mamma sucks dick so hard, that i had to pull sheets from my ass

you dont need to lie about getting a blow job,

[Metalor]

I'm Ghost Rider.