Do I have a chance? 88 FZR400 VS VFR400 NC30

[mark247]

I have just bought a 88 FZR400 which i am doing up and gonna use as an everyday commuter. It still needs a bit of work but should be all up and running by next weekend. My mate Tom ( we all know Tom ) has his VFR400 NC30 which has been rejetted and is 59.8hp or something. He has it all stripped down to a race bike. We are going to take our bike to a track day sometime and gonna have a race. He thinks he'll cane me, which he probably will do because he has raced a lot more than i have ( never. )

Now my bike has all the lights and crap on it, and its is slightly slightly less horsepower ( i think ) but it has more high up torque, his has more low down torque.

Do i stand a chance?

Here are some photos of the bikes, since then Toms bike has been painted a horrible yellow.

[moT]

I have just bought a 88 FZR400 which i am doing up and gonna use as an everyday commuter. It still needs a bit of work but should be all up and running by next weekend. My mate Tom ( we all know Tom ) has his VFR400 NC30 which has been rejetted and is 59.8hp or something. He has it all stripped down to a race bike. We are going to take our bike to a track day sometime and gonna have a race. He thinks he'll cane me, which he probably will do because he has raced a lot more than i have ( never. )

Now my bike has all the lights and crap on it, and its is slightly slightly less horsepower ( i think ) but it has more high up torque, his has more low down torque.

Do i stand a chance?

Here are some photos of the bikes, since then Toms bike has been painted a horrible yellow.

an aftermarket yellow paint job makes it go faster didnt you know that?... DUH my bike will have flywheel removed too :)

[R6_kid]

well, he is on a honda, both your bikes are 20+yrs old... his had better suspension from the start. Racing wise... straight line i reckon you should be able to get him. but he will get better power out of the corners. At the end of the day it will come down to skill, especially if you're bikes are similarly paced. Stoner had a 18kmh speed advantage on the straights over rossi, but rossi took the win.

[mark247]

an aftermarket yellow paint job makes it go faster didnt you know that?... DUH my bike will have flywheel removed too :)

Ah, so we will make the race an endurance race, and your battery will go dead and your bike will stop because your flywheel is removed ;)

And all the paint job does is add a few grams to the weight :P

[mark247]

well, he is on a honda, both your bikes are 20+yrs old... his had better suspension from the start. Racing wise... straight line i reckon you should be able to get him. but he will get better power out of the corners. At the end of the day it will come down to skill, especially if you're bikes are similarly paced. Stoner had a 18kmh speed advantage on the straights over rossi, but rossi took the win.

My bike is 19years old and his is 14 years old.

But agree, i think bike specs wise, it will be a close one.

[moT]

well, he is on a honda, both your bikes are 20+yrs old... his had better suspension from the start. Racing wise... straight line i reckon you should be able to get him. but he will get better power out of the corners. At the end of the day it will come down to skill, especially if you're bikes are similarly paced. Stoner had a 18kmh speed advantage on the straights over rossi, but rossi took the win.

what are u talking about i got myself a 14 year old lol

[moT]

we shld orginise a 400cc only track day that wld be fun

[moT]

well, he is on a honda, both your bikes are 20+yrs old... his had better suspension from the start. Racing wise... straight line i reckon you should be able to get him. but he will get better power out of the corners. At the end of the day it will come down to skill, especially if you're bikes are similarly paced. Stoner had a 18kmh speed advantage on the straights over rossi, but rossi took the win.

what makes u say he will get me on the straight and i will get better drive outa corners?

[mark247]

what makes u say he will get me on the straight and i will get better drive outa corners?

Your bike has more down low torque for out of corners than mine ( yours being a V4 )

My bike has more up high torque than yours, by just a bit, for down straights. ( Mine being a inline 4 sewing machine )

[limbimtimwim]

Skill is what counts. The bikes are too similar.

[mark247]

Well if its gonna be close, then im gonna have to get some knee sliders for my draggin jeans :P

[Kickaha]

Do i stand a chance?

It's got more to do with the riders than what bikes they're on

[MidnightMike]

Skill is what counts. The bikes are too similar.

Well, sorry Mark, but id put mone on Tom for this one. :dodge:

[mark247]

Well, sorry Mark, but id put mone on Tom for this one. :dodge:

I do too, he has actually ridden on the track before. If it was a street race it would be mighty close :D

[moT]

i dont want you to come to a track day to race me (i know ill win) i want you to go so u get good so u can beat me:P

[mark247]

i dont want you to come to a track day to race me (i know ill win) i want you to go so u get good so u can beat me:P

oh whatever! so full of crap! you want to beat me you know it lol

[jafar]

it isn't the size of the dog in the fight , its the fight in the dog that counts.
You want the win badly enough you will win simple as that.:devil2:

[moT]

oh whatever! so full of crap! you want to beat me you know it lol

what wld that acomplish maybee if u had been raceing for 5 years and had won national titles and i beat you there wld be satisfaction there.. i just want to see a fello biker improve... ill give u a race in some of the last sessions tho hehehee :)

[mark247]

what wld that acomplish maybee if u had been raceing for 5 years and had won national titles and i beat you there wld be satisfaction there.. i just want to see a fello biker improve

Likely story............ :second:

[Sanx]

There's always sabotage if you're desperate for the win, Mark. Sugar in the fuel tank's a good start.

[mark247]

There's always sabotage if you're desperate for the win, Mark. Sugar in the fuel tank's a good start.

Haha, i dont really care about winning or losing. I just wanted to know if my bike had a chance lol

[gamgee]

whats all this crap about nc30's having nothing up top??? and who rides them below 8 grand anyway, my one I rode for nearly an hour and the revs didn't drop below about 8000rpm, was keeping up with a friend on a cbr600
the fzr hasn't got a chance unless tom can't ride

[ZeroIndex]

an aftermarket yellow paint job makes it go faster didnt you know that?... DUH my bike will have flywheel removed too :)


well, he is on a honda, both your bikes are 20+yrs old... his had better suspension from the start. Racing wise... straight line i reckon you should be able to get him. but he will get better power out of the corners. At the end of the day it will come down to skill, especially if you're bikes are similarly paced. Stoner had a 18kmh speed advantage on the straights over rossi, but rossi took the win.

Tom what speed are you getting down the back straight of the Taupo full track? I was just hitting 180kph, before having to brake, although I must admit, if my brake discs were perfectly straight, I could probably brake later, but at the way it was accelerating, I don't think I'd hit 200kph

[mark247]

whats all this crap about nc30's having nothing up top??? and who rides them below 8 grand anyway, my one I rode for nearly an hour and the revs didn't drop below about 8000rpm, was keeping up with a friend on a cbr600
the fzr hasn't got a chance unless tom can't ride

Crikey, dont get too upset.

I was doing a bit of research and found that at 10,000rpm the FZR has like .5 fount pounds more torque than the VFR.

[mark247]

Tom what speed are you getting down the back straight of the Taupo full track? I was just hitting 180kph, before having to brake, although I must admit, if my brake discs were perfectly straight, I could probably brake later, but at the way it was accelerating, I don't think I'd hit 200kph

I have been told about your FZR zeroindex, streetfighter and stuff aye, 180k is still pretty good for taupo i think

[ZeroIndex]

I have been told about your FZR zeroindex, streetfighter and stuff aye, 180k is still pretty good for taupo i think

It was a streetfighter when I got it, but it's mostly back together... (picture in my profile)

[moT]

Tom what speed are you getting down the back straight of the Taupo full track? I was just hitting 180kph, before having to brake, although I must admit, if my brake discs were perfectly straight, I could probably brake later, but at the way it was accelerating, I don't think I'd hit 200kph

yeah about that my bike almost tops out in last gear whatever that is i dont have a speedo

[mark247]

It was a streetfighter when I got it, but it's mostly back together... (picture in my profile)

Your ones screen is a lot smaller than my ones screen. Have you cut it back?

[ZeroIndex]

yeah about that my bike almost tops out in last gear whatever that is i dont have a speedo
Mine tops out just over 200kph @ 14k (redline), and from memory, 180kph @ 12500 to 13000rpm... so if the VFR redlines in 6th, there is a possibility that it revs out quicker, and I'm not sure on gearing, but that should be in the region of 190 - 200kph bracket...

Your ones screen is a lot smaller than my ones screen. Have you cut it back?

The screen is the standard size for the '87 SP model, it's just missing the top right hand side from a previous owner bin, along with the side fairings :(

[moT]

with the restrictor removed on a vfr it can do 230kph if that helps

[ZeroIndex]

with the restrictor removed on a vfr it can do 230kph if that helps

whoa, that's pretty quick...

[mark247]

with the restrictor removed on a vfr it can do 230kph if that helps

Down hill with a tail wind mate. When i had your VFR up to 197kmh or whatever the GPS said it had id say i had about 750rpm left to go, and i think that would of got me to about 210 or so. But yeah, im sure if you wrang the shit out of it you might get 230kmh.

[ben444]

with the restrictor removed on a vfr it can do 230kph if that helps

hahahahaha.... i don't think so tim... i mean tom...

[moT]

hahahahaha.... i don't think so tim... i mean tom...

read up on the net a vfr can do 130mph i guess thats about 230kph
i wouldnt say it could do it on the back straingt of taupo but yeah

[avgas]

Yep you do stand a chance, but with your bike it would be best to keep in the top quarter revs as he will eat you in the mid range. Just ring the shit out of the little fella.

[ben444]

read up on the net a vfr can do 130mph i guess thats about 230kph
i wouldnt say it could do it on the back straingt of taupo but yeah

nope... 130mph is 209.2kmh... and that's wat I'd expect a good NC30 to do...

[mark247]

read up on the net a vfr can do 130mph i guess thats about 230kph
i wouldnt say it could do it on the back straingt of taupo but yeah

eeeew a 10kmh faster top speed than the FZR. But the ten tons of paint on your bike will even it out. Sweet!

[moT]

nope... 130mph is 209.2kmh... and that's wat I'd expect a good NC30 to do...

ok sorry my bad..are you raceing in the vic club winter series?

[moT]

nope... 130mph is 209.2kmh... and that's wat I'd expect a good NC30 to do...

i wanna get a smaller front sprocket tho no where on taupo am i doing 210

[Chrislost]

with the restrictor removed on a vfr it can do 230kph if that helps

lol?
mine got about 210 on my mates speedo.
that was top of the revs with one tooth down on the front.

[moT]

lol?
mine got about 210 on my mates speedo.
that was top of the revs with one tooth down on the front.

So what do you reccomend then?

[ben444]

ok sorry my bad..are you raceing in the vic club winter series?
all good.. nope... a bit to far for me..


i wanna get a smaller front sprocket tho no where on taupo am i doing 210
i'm running 520 chain using rgv250 front sprockets... you should definately go down at least one at the front... I wouldn't know what the gearing for Taupo would be as I've never been there...

[moT]

if i geared my bike for 190-195kph it would be perfect

[Kflasher]

My FZR '88 can't pull a magot of a pork chop... so I guess you could let Tom's tyres down.

[mark247]

My FZR '88 can't pull a magot of a pork chop... so I guess you could let Tom's tyres down.

Well i have ridden my FZR all fixed up now, and i have ridden Toms VFR. I'd say its going to be pretty even.

[Morcs]

lol?
mine got about 210 on my mates speedo.
that was top of the revs with one tooth down on the front.

Yeah with stock gearing mine topped out at about 220. Though I never got it checked properly.

The RVF on the other hand has an almost accurate speedo (when reading 60 true speed by a speed camera is 59) and it pulls a lot better than the fvr when its singing. Its restricted so at about 185 its got no more pull but at that speed its definately going faster than when the vfr is off the clock.

[moT]

Yeah with stock gearing mine topped out at about 220. Though I never got it checked properly.

The RVF on the other hand has an almost accurate speedo (when reading 60 true speed by a speed camera is 59) and it pulls a lot better than the fvr when its singing. Its restricted so at about 185 its got no more pull but at that speed its definately going faster than when the vfr is off the clock.

the rvf is the restricted versoin of the vfr not just electronic restriction but restricetd by the jets in the carbs. the rfv is about 55hp and the vfr is 59hp. this was due to new japanese regulations but if u wanna put it to the test im more than happy :)

[mark247]

Yeah with stock gearing mine topped out at about 220. Though I never got it checked properly.

The RVF on the other hand has an almost accurate speedo (when reading 60 true speed by a speed camera is 59) and it pulls a lot better than the fvr when its singing. Its restricted so at about 185 its got no more pull but at that speed its definately going faster than when the vfr is off the clock.

Morcs, come to the track day on the 30th. Make it RVF400 VS VFR400 VS FZR400 VS ZXR400!

[moT]

Morcs, come to the track day on the 30th. Make it RVF400 VS VFR400 VS FZR400 VS ZXR400!

2 hondas a yamaha and a kawasaki still need a suzuki

[mark247]

2 hondas a yamaha and a kawasaki still need a suzuki

One of the Honda riders need to put Suzuki stickers on there bike...



HAHA Alex, on his 27hp 1982 GSX400?

[Chrislost]

So what do you reccomend then?

recomend?
nothing try whatever and see what you like...
it still gets about 95 in first.
and who cares about suzuki?
one may turn up etc...

[Morcs]

Im not doing another track day until the summer, when ill have some race fairings and my summer rubber on.

The RVF is not the restricted version of the vfr, it is the predecessor of the vfr and is superior in every way except power as japanese legislation changeD at the time meaning they had to be restricted to 53hp at the wheel rather than 59hp. The electronic restriction is the same as all jap 400's, just most here have been derestricted, mine is fresh from japan. Yes the carbs are smaller to bring the power output down.

[moT]

no chance now since i got my 17" muhahahahahaha

[Disco Dan]

The RVF on the other hand has an almost accurate speedo (when reading 60 true speed by a speed camera is 59)

Is that an 'average' figure Morcs or was it just the one ticket? ;) hehe

When you bringing ya bike over?

[mark247]

no chance now since i got my 17" muhahahahahaha

Wow we! So you have even less of a top speed now ;)

[R1madness]

Funny listening (reading) all about how good NC30s are but they were a slug in race trim here in NZ. The FZRs were always faster and handeled better. You can get a decent choice of tyres for the 17 inch front on the FZR but nothing good for the NC30s 16inch front. That will help mid corner. The NC front end was way to soft, the FZR only needed 15wt fork oil and 10mm less air gap where the NC needed heavier springs as well.
All said and done tho it will truly come down to who has the more experiance on the track.

[ZeroIndex]

Funny listening (reading) all about how good NC30s are but they were a slug in race trim here in NZ. The FZRs were always faster and handeled better. You can get a decent choice of tyres for the 17 inch front on the FZR but nothing good for the NC30s 16inch front. That will help mid corner. The NC front end was way to soft, the FZR only needed 15wt fork oil and 10mm less air gap where the NC needed heavier springs as well.
All said and done tho it will truly come down to who has the more experiance on the track.

Tell me about this "10mm less air gap" How would one go about adjusting that?

[Morcs]

Is that an 'average' figure Morcs or was it just the one ticket? ;) hehe

When you bringing ya bike over?

You know that speed indicator thingy on the great north road as you come down the hill in glen eden, every night I used to go past it at 60, so its very accurate :D

I texted you yesterday? I didnt get a reply? only things left to do is straighten my engine mount bolt.



Funny listening (reading) all about how good NC30s are but they were a slug in race trim here in NZ. The FZRs were always faster and handeled better. You can get a decent choice of tyres for the 17 inch front on the FZR but nothing good for the NC30s 16inch front. That will help mid corner. The NC front end was way to soft, the FZR only needed 15wt fork oil and 10mm less air gap where the NC needed heavier springs as well.
All said and done tho it will truly come down to who has the more experiance on the track.

NC30 doesnt have a 16'' front. It has a 17''.

[ZeroIndex]

...NC30 doesnt have a 16'' front. It has a 17''.

I know the FZR has a 18" rear, which is damn annoying when it comes to finding new tires... I need a new front tire on my FZR.... please can someone recommend some FZR400 tires... 110/70x17 Front, and 140/60x18 Rear... thanks...

Ps. not Hi-jacking this thread, since we're already on the topic of FZR400's :p

[Disco Dan]

You know that speed indicator thingy on the great north road as you come down the hill in glen eden, every night I used to go past it at 60, so its very accurate :D

I texted you yesterday? I didnt get a reply? only things left to do is straighten my engine mount bolt.



ahhh clever ;)

working this arvo, bring her round tomorrow if your free? See if we can straighten your nuts :innocent:

[Morcs]

ahhh clever ;)

working this arvo, bring her round tomorrow if your free? See if we can straighten your nuts :innocent:

I must warn you, it is quite a solid one that needs straightening.

Im working tomorrow and im going out for dinner after, might have to be during the week... By then my nuts will definately need straightening.

Lol talk about going off topic hehe, its a gay thread anyway... it has Tom in it...

[Disco Dan]

I must warn you, it is quite a solid one that needs straightening.

Im working tomorrow and im going out for dinner after, might have to be during the week... By then my nuts will definately need straightening.

Lol talk about going off topic hehe, its a gay thread anyway... it has Tom in it...

ROFL :shutup:

Mid week nut straightening sounds like a plan :yes:

[moT]

I must warn you, it is quite a solid one that needs straightening.

Im working tomorrow and im going out for dinner after, might have to be during the week... By then my nuts will definately need straightening.

Lol talk about going off topic hehe, its a gay thread anyway... it has Tom in it...

Man go have a cry you were the one to post in this thead... and i cant wait to kick ur ass on the track again maybee you will learn something

[Morcs]

Man go have a cry... I cant wait to kick ur ass on the track again

You never kicked my arse, purely for a few reasons:

A) It wasnt a race day
B) I didnt even see you on the track
c) I wasnt racing, I was just enjoying myself.

Have you quite finished playing 'my cock is bigger than yours?'

Mine is bigger.

[moT]

You never kicked my arse, purely for a few reasons:

A) It wasnt a race day
B) I didnt even see you on the track
c) I wasnt racing, I was just enjoying myself.

Have you quite finished playing 'my cock is bigger than yours?'

Mine is bigger.

Thats what they all say...makes no difference anyway ill still kick ur ass

[Morcs]

Ive finally found a use for the 'ignore' feature.

Sweet.

Homo.

[moT]

Ive finally found a use for the 'ignore' feature.

Sweet.

Homo.

lol hahaha

[mark247]

I must warn you, it is quite a solid one that needs straightening.

Im working tomorrow and im going out for dinner after, might have to be during the week... By then my nuts will definately need straightening.

Lol talk about going off topic hehe, its a gay thread anyway... it has Tom in it...

Grow up.......

[R1madness]

The air gap thing.... just add a bit more fork oil. We used to run 15wt. With the springs removed and the forks compressed put a ruler down the inside of the fork leg 200mm. Then pull it out. This will tell you your air gap. Do the same for both legs and top them up by 10mm making sure they are even. Someone on here should be able to tell you the std gap as it was so long ago that i no longer remember it.

DOH yes the NC30 is 17 inch sorry.

Tyres for the FZR..... try shenko. They are a direct copy (including compounds) of the yokohamas we used to race on. How good were they? well good enough to win the 250 proddy championship on RGV250s.

[aff-man]

it's all about what track you will be racing on.. with a few minor mods and some wrench work, as well as having the same riding capability you're fzr will be better suited to different tracks. It's all about how you set your bike up where it makes power how eager you are on the brakes how well your suspension is set up to handle said braking and most importantly (when riding 400's) who is more tubby....:dodge: :dodge: :dodge:

When in doubt sell the fzr and buy http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?p=1093759#post1093759

[delusionz]

There's always sabotage if you're desperate for the win, Mark. Sugar in the fuel tank's a good start.

wasn't that busted on mythbusters some time ago?

[mark247]

wasn't that busted on mythbusters some time ago?

Im not that harsh, id just swap the HT cables around, or turn his fuel off. =P If i did the HT cable thing i can assure you Tom would have no idea what was going on =P No offence!

[okeh]

Im not that harsh, id just swap the HT cables around, or turn his fuel off. =P If i did the HT cable thing i can assure you Tom would have no idea what was going on =P No offence!


Im sure that if I sneaked into your garage at night and swapped your HT leads you wouldnt have a clue either when you went to start it up next morning to go to tech.

*WTF is was running yesterday... havent done anything to it..

[mark247]

Im sure that if I sneaked into your garage at night and swapped your HT leads you wouldnt have a clue either when you went to start it up next morning to go to tech.

*WTF is was running yesterday... havent done anything to it..

Maybe i did that to your car you nobby

[okeh]

Doubt it. Since my car is alarmed you would have trouble opening the bonnet AND my HT leads are numbered.

[ZeroIndex]

Here's the link to my crash thread... excuse the product review, as I was having a quick squizz at that when I clicked the "New Thread" button, so I reviewed the crash gear (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?p=1097998#post1097998)
:p

[mark247]

Doubt it. Since my car is alarmed you would have trouble opening the bonnet AND my HT leads are numbered.

Ok then maybe i just shoved a screw driver in the ECU

[limbimtimwim]

After watching Tom yesterday...

I don't think you have a chance.

[moT]

my bike will be wayyy faster now since i got those rear set pegs

[moT]

my bike will be wayy faster since i put those rear set pegs on they add an extra 15hp

[limbimtimwim]

That's true, about those high horsepower rearsets.

You should cut some speed holes in the headers on number 1 and 4 cylinders. My cousin's uncle's half-brother's girlfriend's best mate whose boss raced dirt bikes in the late 70's told him he found an extra 10 mile an hour in top on his vf1000 like that, so it'll work on your little VFR.

[moT]

That's true, about those high horsepower rearsets.

You should cut some speed holes in the headers on number 1 and 4 cylinders. My cousin's uncle's half-brother's girlfriend's best mate whose boss raced dirt bikes in the late 70's told him he found an extra 10 mile an hour in top on his vf1000 like that, so it'll work on your little VFR.

speed holes? headers?

[mark247]

speed holes? headers?

You dont know what a header is?

[puddytat]

Sorry mate, but the vfr'll leave you behind in the corners I reckon, have a crack tho man!

[cowpoos]

I have just bought a 88 FZR400 which i am doing up and gonna use as an everyday commuter. It still needs a bit of work but should be all up and running by next weekend. My mate Tom ( we all know Tom ) has his VFR400 NC30 which has been rejetted and is 59.8hp or something. He has it all stripped down to a race bike. We are going to take our bike to a track day sometime and gonna have a race. He thinks he'll cane me, which he probably will do because he has raced a lot more than i have ( never. )

Now my bike has all the lights and crap on it, and its is slightly slightly less horsepower ( i think ) but it has more high up torque, his has more low down torque.

Do i stand a chance?

Here are some photos of the bikes, since then Toms bike has been painted a horrible yellow.
if toms riding the honda...you should be able to waste him!!!!



no brainer really!

[moT]

my little vfr will kick anyones ass once i install my neons and a big ugly tacko

[mark247]

my little vfr will kick anyones ass once i install my neons and a big ugly tacko

tacho**

the way you are going you are going to have Hondi written on the side of it in no time

[more_fasterer]

put a monsta taco on it au!