Today's perspective

[Grahameeboy]

Two Choices
What would you do?....you make the choice. Don't look for a punch line,
there isn't one. Read it anyway. My question is:
Would you have made the same choice?
At a fundraising dinner for a school that serveslearning-disabled
children, the father of one of the students
delivered a speech that would never be forgotten by all who attended. After
extolling the school and its dedicated staff, he offered aquestion:
"When not
interfered with by outside influences, everything nature does is done with
perfection. Yet my son, Shay, cannot learn things as other children do. He
cannot understand things as other children do.
Where is the natural order of things in my son?"
The audience was stilled by the query.
The father continued. "I believe, that when a child like Shay, physically
and mentally handicapped comes into the world, an opportunity to realize
true human nature presents itself, and itcomes in the way other people
treat that child."
Then he told the following story:
Shay and his father had walked past a park where some boys Shay knew ere
playing baseball. Shay asked, "Do you think they'll let me play?"Shay's
father knew that most of the boys would notwant someone like Shay on thei
team, but te father also understood that if his son were allowed to play,
it would give him a much-needed sense of belonging and some confidence to
be accepted by others in spite ofhis handicaps.
Shay's father approached one of the boys on the field and asked (not
expecting much) if Shay could play. The boy lookedaround for guidance and
said, "We're losing by six runs and the game is inthe eighth inning. I
guess he can be on our team and we'll try to put him in to bat in the ninth
inning."
Shay struggled over to the team's bench and, with a broad smile, put on a
team shirt. His
Father watched with a small tear in his eye and warmth in his heart. The
boys saw the father's joy at his son being accepted. In the bottom of the
eighth inning, Shay's team scored a few runs but was still behind by three.
In the top of the ninth
inning, Shay put on a glove and played in the right field. Even though no
hits came his way, he was obviously ecstatic just to be in the game and on
the field, grinning from ear to ear as his father waved tohim from the
stands. In the bottom of the ninth inning, Shay's team scored again. Now,
with two outs and the bases loaded, the potential winning run was on base
and Shay was scheduled to be next at bat.
At this juncture, do they let Shay bat and give away their chance to win
the game? Surprisingly, Shay was given the bat. Everyone knew that a hit
was all but impossible because Shay didn'teven know how to hold the bat
properly, much less connect with the ball.
However, as Shay stepped up to the plate, the pitcher, recognizing that the
other team was putting winning aside for this moment in Shay's life, moved
in a few steps to lob the ball insoftly so Shay could at least make
contact. The first pitch came and Shay swung clumsily and missed. The
pitcher again took a few steps forward totoss the ball softly towards
Shay. As the pitch came in, Shay swung atthe ball and hit a slow ground
ball right back to the pitcher.
The game would now be over. The pitcher picked up the soft grounder and
could have easily thrown the ball to the first baseman. Shay would have
been out and that would have been the end of the game.
Instead, the pitcher threw the ball right over the first baseman's head,
out of reach of all team mates. Everyone from the stands and both teams
started yelling,
"Shay, run to first! Run to first!"
Never in his life had Shay ever run that far, but he made it to first base.
He scampered down the baseline, wide-eyed and startled.
Everyone yelled, "Run to second, run to second!" Catching his breath, Shay
awkwardly ran towards second, gleaming and struggling to make it to the
base. By the time Shay rounded towards second base, the right fielder had
the ball ... the smallest guy on their team who now had his first chance to
be the hero for his team. He
could have thrown the ball to the second-baseman for the tag, but he
understood the pitcher's intentions so he, too, intentionally threw the
ball high and far over the third-baseman's head. Shay ran toward third base
deliriously as the runners ahead of him circled the bases toward home.
All were screaming, "Shay, Shay, Shay, all the Way Shay"
Shay reached third base because the
opposing shortstop ran to help him by turning him in the direction of third
base, and shouted, "Run to third! Shay, run to third!"
As Shay rounded third, the boys from both teams, and the spectators, were
on their feet screaming, "Shay, run home! Run home!"
Shay ran to home, stepped on the plate, and was cheered as the hero who it
the grand slam and won the game for his team.
"That day", said the father softly with tears now rolling down his face,
"the boys from both teams helped bring a piece of true love and humanity
into this world".
Shay didn't make it to another summer. He died that winter, having never
forgotten being the hero and making his father so happy, and coming home
and seeing his Mother tearfully embrace her little hero of the day!
May your day, be a Shay Day

[Hitcher]

A heart-warming post.

However the bastard in me would probably have cheered Shay around for a second lap...

[Grahameeboy]

A heart-warming post.

However the bastard in me would probably have cheered Shay around for a second lap...

Nah that is not being a bastard mate...........

[James Deuce]

Now for a reality check.

Jay is chromosomally challenged but is diligent and has a spectacular hobby that borders on obsession.

Jay is a coffee connoisseur. Jay attends a barrista course where he surprises everyone, parents and family included, by topping both the written and practical exam. Jay can make practically any pattern you want on top of a coffee with milk froth.

Jay and his parents believe that he now has a decent chance at an independent life, good barristas are difficult to find and with his exceptional skills finding a job should be no problem.

Jay applies for 35 jobs. The interviews are terminated post haste as soon as a prospective employer sees him. Plausible excuses are given to make sure that anti-discrimination and employment law guidelines are met, but deep down, Jay and his parents know that he has been turned down because of a condition that isn't his fault.

Just when things are looking pretty bleak for this A class barrista, a McDonald's McCafe Owner offers him work experience with a view to possible employment. Unfortunately the location of the McCafe isn't the best, but Jay's Mum is thrilled that he has an opportunity and and offers to travel to and from the site if they can work around her part time job.

Jay makes 350 perfect coffees before lunch. He also makes $250 in tips, which McDonald's don't allow, but as he is not officially employed he is allowed to keep. He's made the weekly wage of the average McDonald's part time worker in one morning. He doesn't want to go home and is having a ball, so his mother who is supervising heads off to do some shopping and leaves him there to continue with his hobby. Remember this guy, Jay, has cracked something the rest of us mostly never manage. He's made his hobby his job, and he'll never work again.

When Jay's mother gets back from shopping, Jay is wiping tables down and being berated by a duty manager for being "stupid". Words ensue, and Jay and his mother are asked to leave. Remember he was on work experience making coffee. That was the deal.

My wife watched this unfold at the McDonald's McCafe, where there is a train, in utter horror.

Shay's story, while jolly nice, is no more a reflection of Human Nature than George Bush's politics are a reflection of the "average" New Yorker. The default setting for Humans Being is to shun those who are different, to loathe and ridicule that which they don't understand.

People suck. Never let your guard down. Protect those you love. Be careful who you trust.

[Grahameeboy]

I see where you are coming from, however Life is not perfect Jim2..........I prefer to look on the bright side of life and try not to look at the dark side.......life is to be enjoyed at every opportunity, not wasted on lifes bowls of cherries with pips lying everywhere....for every 1 bad thing there are always 2 good things or more..........

Possibly the case you mentioned was about misunderstanding and feeling threatened and could have happened to anyone, challenged or not

I was going to say you are a grump bugger but decided not too....oh too late I just did.....he he.

Enjoy your day Sir.

[James Deuce]

It must be nice to be delusional. Being a parent of a person in the above category has been quite useful. You can use people's reactions to gauge whether or not they are decent people. 90% of people fail a face to face encounter.

[Paul in NZ]

These stories are very insipiring - reality is often less so I'm afraid.

I'm not perfect, I don't behave predictably or even well some days - sometimes my condition loses me friends and I deal with that, I'm lucky that I can.

Society is probably more tolerant than it has ever been but I'm afraid - thats still not very tolerant and in some cases still quite barbaric and to my knowledge no one has all the answers yet.....

Good on you for trying, stories can change the world but it takes a pretty good one.

[Grahameeboy]

It must be nice to be delusional. Being a parent of a person in the above category has been quite useful. You can use people's reactions to gauge whether or not they are decent people. 90% of people fail a face to face encounter.


Remember I am a parent of a special person too and I tend not to use that person to gauge other people.

"Delusion is based on your vision"

[Toaster]

I enjoyed the story, cheers.

[onearmedbandit]

It must be nice to be delusional. Being a parent of a person in the above category has been quite useful. You can use people's reactions to gauge whether or not they are decent people. 90% of people fail a face to face encounter.


I'm not a mean spirited person, not in the slightest. But having limited interaction with special needs children it can be hard to know how to act. I know we shouldn't act any other way, but it isn't easy. I wouldn't point or stare etc, but I know it would be uncomfortable for me initially. I wouldn't want to react in a way that could scare or upset or insult the child, so I would be very self aware during any encounter and that may show itself to others as a different reaction, one the parents of the child may see as a negative.

In my last job I managed a company of about 25 people, one who was a Downs Syndrome suffer. He is about 44yrs old and was employed as a yard detailer. I treated him no different to any other of the staff and he respected this. Others he would not listen to, but if I asked him to do anything he was at it straight away. I also had to pull him into line on the odd occassion, mostly to with money as he would 'leave' his money at home and ask other employees to buy his lunch (most knew of his ploy but some would still buy him lunch) and not pay the money back. He was easy to handle as he was a grown man, independent enough to make his way in the world with minimal support. But around children I just don't know how to conduct myself initially. Once I've spent some time with them it's easy. My main point is that while it is hard for the child and their family, it can be equally hard for people who want to interact but are not sure of how to.

[BarBender]

Great story G.
Sounds like it was an inspiring evening and one that hit a few reflective chords with you.

I admire you for raising your daughter on your own and having to awaken everyday with your reality - which I hasten to add has probably evolved over time into a blessing for your both.

I doubt many of us in more 'fortunate' circumstances could even cope...and I include myself.

May many more stories like the above go your way.

[Grahameeboy]

I'm not a mean spirited person, not in the slightest. But having limited interaction with special needs children it can be hard to know how to act. I know we shouldn't act any other way, but it isn't easy. I wouldn't point or stare etc, but I know it would be uncomfortable for me initially. I wouldn't want to react in a way that could scare or upset or insult the child, so I would be very self aware during any encounter and that may show itself to others as a different reaction, one the parents of the child may see as a negative.

In my last job I managed a company of about 25 people, one who was a Downs Syndrome suffer. He is about 44yrs old and was employed as a yard detailer. I treated him no different to any other of the staff and he respected this. Others he would not listen to, but if I asked him to do anything he was at it straight away. I also had to pull him into line on the odd occassion, mostly to with money as he would 'leave' his money at home and ask other employees to buy his lunch (most knew of his ploy but some would still buy him lunch) and not pay the money back. He was easy to handle as he was a grown man, independent enough to make his way in the world with minimal support. But around children I just don't know how to conduct myself initially. Once I've spent some time with them it's easy. My main point is that while it is hard for the child and their family, it can be equally hard for people who want to interact but are not sure of how to.

That is very true. People are often in a catch 22 situation and parents of disabled children are often still dealing with having a disabled child themselves so can be extra sensitive.....

At first, I got some really dumb comments........"her legs move so why is she in a wheelchair"............"oh isn't she lucky have a neat wheelchair"....you can imagine.....I just ignore but the worst is "Oh I wish I had one of those".....I just respond "well try it for a week and let me know what it's like eh".....talk about tail between your leg....good thing about Devonport is that locals are used to Nats and really great..........we laugh about getting a roll cage, numbers down he side etc.......

A lot of people think that a kid in a wheelchair also has a mental disability....

It is quite amusing when I let Nats whizz around the park on her own and watch parents wondering where the parent is....I have a remote stop button.

Nats is interesting in that outwardly she does not look disabled which throws some people.

Thank you for your post mate.

[yod]

90% of people fail a face to face encounter.


i didn't know it was a test, how do ya pass?

[Babelfish]

I enjoyed that thanks, and enjoyed the sad cunts trying to "put things in perspective". Lifes funny, sad, good and bad and I wouldnt have it any other way. It has its own perspective and you either see it, or make your own.

Personally I was laughing my arse off at the though of a shitty smelling spastic have a fucking good laugh at kids letting him win

[Grahameeboy]

Great story G.
Sounds like it was an inspiring evening and one that hit a few reflective chords with you.

I admire you for raising your daughter on your own and having to awaken everyday with your reality - which I hasten to add has probably evolved over time into a blessing for your both.

I doubt many of us in more 'fortunate' circumstances could even cope...and I include myself.

May many more stories like the above go your way.

I actually have equal shared custody but statistically, I am one of the few seperated Fathers who a) has not walked out and b) wants equal custody.

Sounds like I am blowing my own trumpet, however, Fathers often get a bad name and I still face prejudice with the Dhb who have turned me in into an invisible Father despite going through the complaints process.....it is just they they are not used to dealing with a disabled child who has a Father sharing custody.............lucky for me NZ Law allows this......Mum was not happy and still is not but tough.

[dogsnbikes]

I can relate to that totally being a step father of A special needs child...and a boss of special needs adult every day is a challenge for them some more so than others and it doesnt take long for you to relise they are brillant in there own right........

I will never forget the day of pet day at the country school when the young lad said to me he couldn't walk harry the lamb in front of all the people...replying in the way of encouragement boy and lamb entered the ring although harry was dragged some of distance he quickly got to his feet and walked beside the boy and together they made it happen......

the smile was so large and the boy full of excitement telling me he was no longer scared although he never won a ribbon he wasn't phased and told me that by just completing the walk he had beaten his fears and won

[James Deuce]

I enjoyed that thanks, and enjoyed the sad cunts trying to "put things in perspective". Lifes funny, sad, good and bad and I wouldnt have it any other way. It has its own perspective and you either see it, or make your own.

Personally I was laughing my arse off at the though of a shitty smelling spastic have a fucking good laugh at kids letting him win


I'm the sad cunt who is the parent of a Down Syndrome kid who faces the same "future" as Jay. My wife watched that shit happen after she'd spent a couple of hours talking to "Jay's" mother about life in general, just yesterday. Most people when confrionted with the reality of disability behave like dicks.

The reality of being Intellectually handicapped, which your daughter isn't Graham, is a great deal bleaker than that load of tripe.

Yod - it's simple - you don't gawp, stare, apologise, or behave like the universe has ended. You treat all people the same and say hello irrespective of any obvious "issues".

[Grahameeboy]

I'm the sad cunt who is the parent of a Down Syndrome kid who faces the same "future" as Jay. My wife watched that shit happen after she'd spent a couple of hours talking to "Jay's" mother about life in general. Most people when confrionted with the reality of disability behave like dicks.

The reality of being Intellectually handicapped, which your daughter isn't Graham, is a great deal bleaker than that load of tripe.

Yod - it's simple - you don't gawp, stare, apologise, or behave like the universe has ended. You treat all people the same and say hello irrespective of any obvious "issues".

How do you judge degree's of bleakness Jim2.

Nats cannot walk, cannot press duplex together, cannot always undo pen tops, cannot feel when she is having a shit (relies on overflow), already has signs of scholiosis, hip flexors are tightening, may need spinal fusion when older, ends up in Starship when she gets a bad cold, may not make 20 and will never be independant...and has to spend 3 hours a day in a standing frame to avoid brittle bones.....saw her x-rays the other day....hardly any bone density.

People with the downs syndrome will have a degree of learning difficulty. However, most people with Down’s syndrome will walk and talk and many will read and write, go to ordinary schools and lead fulfilling, semi-independent lives.
Today the average life expectancy for a person with Down's syndrome is between 50 and 60. A considerable number of people with Down's syndrome live into their 60's.

I know from our chats that you have had a tough time with Alex, however, your comparison is no different to your post about peoples attitude towards disability.

You dissappoint me Jim2.....I know it is stressful, however.....no enough said...no stuff it...as you said "I'm the sad cunt"....I have taken quote so as to avoid an infraction.

[ManDownUnder]

The story sounds made up, but raises an interesting point. Kids can be cruel, but never underestimate their ability to read a situation or person.

Kids are a reflection of their upbringing and are often simply honest. They don't know how to be PC so "Why can't she walk" is a simple yet profound question. Profound because it is one the adults have learned not to ask, despite not actually knowing the real reasons themselves.

Would I have made the same decision to let the little man play? Hell yes. Without hesitation. Which is more important, the lesson he's entitled to join in and try things, and that he's a part of the community, and he should aim to be all he can...

... or winning a single baseball game that people will struggle to remember a week from now?

And no - I'm not being profound. It's a simple fact (as far as I'm concerned).

[surfer]

Nice story, it touched me.

[James Deuce]

How do you judge degree's of bleakness Jim2.

Nats cannot walk, cannot press duplex together, cannot always undo pen tops, cannot feel when she is having a shit (relies on overflow), already has signs of scholiosis, hip flexors are tightening, may need spinal fusion when older, ends up in Starship when she gets a bad cold, may not make 20 and will never be independant...and has to spend 3 hours a day in a standing frame to avoid brittle bones.....saw her x-rays the other day....hardly any bone density.

People with the downs syndrome will have a degree of learning difficulty. However, most people with Down’s syndrome will walk and talk and many will read and write, go to ordinary schools and lead fulfilling, semi-independent lives.
Today the average life expectancy for a person with Down's syndrome is between 50 and 60. A considerable number of people with Down's syndrome live into their 60's.

I know from our chats that you have had a tough time with Alex, however, your comparison is no different to your post about peoples attitude towards disability.

You dissappoint me Jim2.....I know it is stressful, however.....no enough said...no stuff it...as you said "I'm the sad cunt"....I have taken quote so as to avoid an infraction.

For goodness sake I'm not. Take it offline an engage via PM, because you are massively unaware of a huge range of issues with DS. I'm not trying to compete with you.

Your initial post was a load of Reader's Digest rubbish. That was what I was commenting on, not our respective "burdens".

[Grahameeboy]

For goodness sake I'm not. Take it offline an engage via PM, because you are massively unaware of a huge range of issues with DS. I'm not trying to compete with you.

Your initial post was a load of Reader's Digest rubbish. That was what I was commenting on, not our respective "burdens".

No Jim..........we will leave it at that. Sorry for any misunderstanding.

[BuFfY]

Wow, that first story bought tears to my eyes. I don't think I will read the rest of this thread as I have a feeling there will be some harsh words... but thanks for sharing it with us :)

[Lias]

My aunty was born with trisomy-21, she died in her teens.
My sister was born with trisomy-21, she died at 3 months old.
My partner miscarried my firstborn child after having an amnio test.

Even after all that I still believe that society should have compulsory testing for chromosonal abnormalities and compulsory abortion of any positives.

For someone born like that their is no such thing as a normal life, no matter how many warm fuzzies or heartwarming stories you hear. It is better for them to have never been born, and better for society as a whole.

Hows that for a bleak view?

[yungatart]

Adults "fail the test", as you put it Jim, because it is outside their experience.
I am blessed (lucky, if you like) because my eldest brother was intellectually handicapped (an un pc term today, but that's how we knew it then). I grew up around people with disabilites, physical, mental, sometimes both.I learned more from them than I ever taught them and I am grateful that they were in my life.
I now work with special needs kids with a wide range of disabilities and abilities.They still teach me more than I teach them. I'm still grateful to them everyday.
But reality, for the parents of these kids is hard, an uphill battle for funding, for equipment, for help and often, all too often, for acceptance of them and their child/children. They do not want sympathy, or pity.
I see the looks as we take the kids from our centre out walking or to a cafe for morning tea. I also see the generosity and acceptance from some people...just not as often.

[ManDownUnder]

Hows that for a bleak view?

Well formed, biased and one that seeks to remove my rights as a parent... so... it's crap really.

[Paul in NZ]

Hows that for a bleak view?

Not as bad as mine - I saw Jim2 at lunch time - it was horrible...

Life can suck some days folks - it challenges ALL of us everyday because despite appearances - nothings easy. Whats important is that we keep struggling to better our selves and the world we live in. Being hopelessly OTT won't help much but it's better than the opposite.

Keep fighting - keep improving - keep questing.

You know - you improve your body through exercise - you exercise past the point of discofort and then rest and the body rebuilds that muscle stronger, you can do the same with your spirit and intellect..... You just have to push it a bit every day! Being nice to people is a stretch sometimes... I guess...

[ManDownUnder]

They do not want sympathy, or pity.
I see the looks as we take the kids from our centre out walking or to a cafe for morning tea. I also see the generosity and acceptance from some people...just not as often.


Indeed! The measure of a society is the way it treats the young, the old and the infirm. It's not born of sympathy or pity. It's a simple recognition that people need the help of others from time to time.

Some for longer than others... c'est la vie

[James Deuce]

Well Graham has already judged and seen that it is easy, so who am I to argue.

[Grahameeboy]

No I have just said how I feel. Not a judgement. My earlier post which caused some flack (which is fine) was said because your post was percieved as comparing disabilities, hence my post saying sorry for misunderstanding. I am sure a face to face talk would have not had the same result.

I am not saying it is easy. Show me where I say that? Just that I look at the bright side as much as I can so that the painful side does not interfere with my life so much...like YoungTart said, disabled kids do not need our self pity and if there is one thing they, and for me Nats have/has done, is teach me not to feel sorry for myself so if she can be happy then there is no reason why I should not be.

For those KBers who meet me on rides, they probably just see a happy easy going chappie despite my personal circumstances. Paul in NZ said that when he met you it was not a happy sight...........we just deal with things in a different way mate and I both feel for you and worry about how you are coping.

I have had battles to get equipment, the Dhb to get them to recognise that I exists and so on and won...........very tiring at times...........but if I let that all get me down then what good is that to Nats.

Your pm was sad and I know the future, like with Nats, is not good but their future is in your hands, no one elses.

I was not going to reply like I was was not (and will not) reply to your pm because I just thought things were best left but what the eck....I feel your pain mate but you need to remain positive and sunny not just for Alex's, your family's sake but your own mate because being honest, I can see bad vibes in your posts.........you are a great bloke, not saying otherwise, you have a lot to deal with but there is not a lot you, I or anyone else can do about our kids, other than be :sunny:

[Laava]

Anyway, it was a nice story G. There are some nice people out there, I hear stories all the time from my Jo where she works at Kindy with some challenging people and situations. You can always learn something from another regardless of intellect. Some of the nicest people I know are the least intellectual.

[Lias]

Not as bad as mine - I saw Jim2 at lunch time - it was horrible...
For a bleak and sombre thread, that made me giggle alot.