Consumer Guarantees Act: Advice?

[Stella]

Here is the story of my bike, owned for all of three months-ish

* Feb 7 - Bought GN250 from SHOP 1, $2200 cash, 14,00kms, 2004 model.

Having few issues with starting and rear brake will not work roughly once per ride. It would offer no resistance and go clunk. For a while we persevere and put it down to being a newbie. Until I get sick of it and:

* 1 June - Tell SHOP 1 to pick it up and make the damned thing go and fix brake.

They adjusted the brake (has been fine ever since). Told me it started first time for them. Decided problem was possibly me twisting throttle while starting, don't do this on GNs.... Cost: $60

Still having the odd weird battery/starting issue, but better as not draining so quick as leaving throttle alone. Until:

* 26 June: Bike stalled and battery drained. Rang SHOP 1 but no answer so rang SHOP 2 and they came out. Got bike going and I followed him to shop. Wanted to keep overnight to charge battery and test battery and charging system etc.

* 27 June: Told the stator needs to be replaced. Apparently this is the crucial bit that charges the battery while going along. They suggest re-wiring it rather than replacing which is just as good but cheaper. Total cost including labour, testing and picking me up yesterday will be: $475

Told SHOP 1 and they say it is outside of warranty so there.

These issues have been there since I bought it. The brake was a regular and serious issue, and the stator is going to cost over a quarter of what I paid for the bike AND SHOP 1 did not notice it when I told them to find what was wrong.

Any idea if I have a case?
Looking here I think I might.... just not sure http://www.consumeraffairs.govt.nz/consumerinfo/motorvehicles/mv-problems/faultymv-post-15-Dec.html

Thanks for any help :)

[Steam]

The stator is a common suzuki problem, happened with my GN too.
I don't think you have a leg to stand on sorry. Doesn't matter if the problem was there from the beginning, if they didn't know it was there then they did nothing wrong. Did they say anything about it when you bought it?
How long was your warranty for?

[Stella]

The warranty from the shop was for one month. I took it back after three. But the act covers things for much longer, doesn't matter what the seller says if it was an extant fault.

If they did know the fault was there then it would have come under misleading stuff, if they sell something and it has a fault it should still be covered by the act. It does of course depend on stuff. If the bike was ancient, banged up and cheap it would be unlikely to be covered.

Stella

[Drum]

They had their chance to put it right.

It's name and shame time.

[FROSTY]

Im in the motor trade.You are covered under the consumer Garantees act and the sale of goods act.
The goods (bike) must be fit for the purposes intended. The purpose intended is to ride the bike to and from work.
You raised the issues with the shop which in my opinion should have been repaired there and then under waranty.
That they misdiagnosed the problem AND charged you for it isn't your problem

[Steam]

Im in the motor trade.You are covered under the consumer Garantees act and the sale of goods act.
The goods (bike) must be fit for the purposes intended. The purpose intended is to ride the bike to and from work.
You raised the issues with the shop which in my opinion should have been repaired there and then under waranty.
That they misdiagnosed the problem AND charged you for it isn't your problem

So where would you draw the line? Three months in this case, how about six months? A year? And remember it was a second hand bike. How would a buyer go about telling the shop they needed to fix it?
I'm interested cos stuff like that has happened to me before too, but with a car.

[Stella]

Apparently the line is drawn as *six years*!! If the fault was around earlier (and other individual factors are taken into account)

Thanks Frosty, good to hear from someone in the business :)

[Steam]

Apparently the line is drawn as *six years*!! If the fault was around earlier (and other individual factors are taken into account)

Thanks Frosty, good to hear from someone in the business :)

Wow cool. Interesting. Stella, can you tell us how you got on when the matter is all finished, I'd like to know how you went about telling this to the shop and how they reacted.
I can imagine what they'll try to say! Good luck eh.

[Stella]

Steam, I will hopefully remember to give a final update. I imagine you will be kept well updated throughout the process ;)

As to talking to them..... ARGH! I hate doing that. Especially when I don't really know what I am talking about. But will definitely be trying.

Am going to talk to shop 2, the citizens advice bureau and anyone else I can lay my hands on tomorrow before talking to shop 1.

[HenryDorsetCase]

Im in the motor trade.You are covered under the consumer Garantees act and the sale of goods act.
The goods (bike) must be fit for the purposes intended. The purpose intended is to ride the bike to and from work.
You raised the issues with the shop which in my opinion should have been repaired there and then under waranty.
That they misdiagnosed the problem AND charged you for it isn't your problem

I concur with my learned friend, m'lud.

[HenryDorsetCase]

So where would you draw the line? Three months in this case, how about six months? A year? And remember it was a second hand bike. How would a buyer go about telling the shop they needed to fix it?
I'm interested cos stuff like that has happened to me before too, but with a car.

I think (and dont ask me to look up the act) that the coverage for a consumer is for a "reasonable time": Your Judge or DT referee would probably be looking at what sort of bike/goods, intended use, your actual use, time from owning it when the problem surfaced, subsequent conduct etc.

My advice would be to go and deal with the owner of the store, or the manager, not shopfloor level monkeys. Front them up, state your case clearly, tell them what went wrong, and why they should be fixing it. If that doesnt work, then write them a letter, asking for a response within a defined time. If that doesnt go, then you are off to the Disputes Tribunal and/or the Motor Vehicle disputes body thing.

Have fun.

if you want to quote sections of the act, go to www.legislation.govt.nz you'll be able to get statutes as well as regs etc.

[Burger]

Hi Stella,

If you brought the bike from the dealer, and the bike was second hand, or a trade in of any sorts, you unfortunately are not covered under the same level of protection as you would if the bike were new.

However,

You still have rights. If the seller stated that there was a one month warranty then that is fine, but a seller cannot limit your rights as provided to you by law in any way, shape or form. For them to even tell you that you have no recourse is illegal under the Fair Trading Act.

In order for you to solve this issue I suggest you do the following:

Go to see the manager of Shop 1. State what your issue is, and the outcome you would like (in this case, total repair for free). If they do not want to help, state that you will file a grievance with the Disputes Tribunal.

If you have to go to the Disputes Tribunal, it will only cost you $50, and you will likely win your case. I suspect that the manager of Shop 1 will not want to take it that far.

[heyjoe]

hey there Stella,

Firstly - Not nice to hear of your troubles with bike shop 1.
I wonder how the hell did the bike get a WOF with brakes in that state?

Secondly - I agree with what Burger said in recent post.

You do have rights and even though one month was the said warranty period for this used bike - it is UNREASONABLE to not lift a finger to do something about it after three months. That is ridiculous. As an earlier post said 'fit for purpose' and shop 1 is being not acting in the spirit of the consumer guarantees act.

Actually taking them to the Disputes Tribunal may not occur if bike shop 1 rethinks its approach.

Citizens Advice is also a good place to obtain advice (as you have already mentioned). As long as you are fair and reasonable and objective with shop 1 then things should work out in the end. Stick to the facts and remain professional. Don't let it get under your skin. Collect all data such as receipts etc in case you do need to go to tribunal so you can present all the facts and info fully. This will help the facilitator do his/her job and make a fully informed decision.

Good luck and let us know how you get on.

[breakaway]

So where would you draw the line?

It is judged on a per case basis.

[JimBob]

Here is the story of my bike, owned for all of three months-ish

* Feb 7 - Bought GN250 from SHOP 1, $2200 cash, 14,00kms, 2004 model.

Having few issues with starting and rear brake will not work roughly once per ride. It would offer no resistance and go clunk. For a while we persevere and put it down to being a newbie. Until I get sick of it and:

* 1 June - Tell SHOP 1 to pick it up and make the damned thing go and fix brake.

They adjusted the brake (has been fine ever since). Told me it started first time for them. Decided problem was possibly me twisting throttle while starting, don't do this on GNs.... Cost: $60

Still having the odd weird battery/starting issue, but better as not draining so quick as leaving throttle alone. Until:

* 26 June: Bike stalled and battery drained. Rang SHOP 1 but no answer so rang SHOP 2 and they came out. Got bike going and I followed him to shop. Wanted to keep overnight to charge battery and test battery and charging system etc.

* 27 June: Told the stator needs to be replaced. Apparently this is the crucial bit that charges the battery while going along. They suggest re-wiring it rather than replacing which is just as good but cheaper. Total cost including labour, testing and picking me up yesterday will be: $475

Told SHOP 1 and they say it is outside of warranty so there.

These issues have been there since I bought it. The brake was a regular and serious issue, and the stator is going to cost over a quarter of what I paid for the bike AND SHOP 1 did not notice it when I told them to find what was wrong.

Any idea if I have a case?
Looking here I think I might.... just not sure http://www.consumeraffairs.govt.nz/consumerinfo/motorvehicles/mv-problems/faultymv-post-15-Dec.html

Thanks for any help :)

Sorry to rain on your parade but
When did you first notify Shop 1 about these problems?
If it was June1 I think you are out of luck.
If the stator was crook when you bought the bike charging problems would have shown up within the first few days. ie you would need the battery charged every week depending on use. Dont confuse starting problems and charging problems.
As for starting, they should have shown you how to start the bike. most bikes start "better" with certain techniques. They fixed the brake, if you let them know previously that was a problem they should have covered it.
5 mths later Shop 2 tells you it needs a new stator.
I think it is reasonable that if it lasted 5 mths Shop1 could not be expected to warranty the stator.
If the stator had been faulty back in Feb you would have had a constant flat battery back in Feb
Ask Shop2 to just charge the battery for now. Take it back to Shop1 and get them to check the charge rate. They might give you a discount if it does need a new stator. If not ring around or back to Shop2
good luck

[Stella]

Opps, I got my dates wrong, it was March not February that I bought it. So that was three and a half months ago.

The starting problems showed up very early, but we persevered - getting used to a new bike, only being used once a week to go to a carpark for me to tootle around in, doing lots of stopping and starting and low speed stuff which would be hard on the battery. No point taking it to be fixed at this stage.

Till four weeks ago (just under three months since I bought it) when I got sick and tired of it, but they said it went for them and further investigation would cost me more.

The battery has been charged pretty damned regularly. I don't know how often, but I probably have a slew of emails and texts to a friend mentioning it (unfortunately I deleted my phone's outbox yesterday...)

Stella

[Stella]

Well, I rang around and around trying to be as sure of my position and the problem with my bike as I could be.
Heart was thumping when I rang Shop 1...

Of course the guy was rather defensive and kept saying how I hsould have got them to look at it first. Well, hey, I did, and they claimed nothing was wrong! And when I rang I got no answer so I rang the next on the list.

Anyway, we eventually came to an agreement.

He picked up the bike from Shop 2, looked over it and decided it was indeed the stator.
He is sending off the stator to be rewound and will fit it. I pay half the cost of the rewind, he covers the rest plus the labour. $115 for me.

Also had to pay the $82 for Shop 2 to pick it up etc. A bit annoyed about this part, we argued a bit over it. In the end I just want my bike fixed asap. There is only so much antagonism you wish to inflict.

Now hoping like hell the alternator is ok. Apparently it can go if the stator goes or something. I have no idea what to do if I get the call that is dead too.

Anyway, they wont have me as a customer again, and I will hardly be recommending them to the numerous other people I know who are keen to get their license! As far as I am concerned, when they first looked at my bike they decided I was a girl with no experience and therefore Stoopid and don't know how to start a bike. Shop 2 got it going five times in front of me with no trouble, but THEY BELIEVED ME instead of judging me.

So it is mostly a VICTORY for the consumer guarantees act. I'm sure someone with more clout and possibly a Y chromosome would have got it all for free.

$200 compared to $475

[Steam]

Hooray! A mostly success! Good on you, it's a stressful thing to do, haggling like that eh.