Immigration today...

[007XX]

I came across this little pearler a couple of days ago, and thought that highlighted a very relevant point (even if written for OZ). I mean, I am an immigrant, but I've never been on the doll, made sure I am doing everything I can to be as integrated into Kiwi society as one can be and not be a burden...So what do you guys think? This is not a thread for open racism, I just want to know if it's just me getting antsy!

Subject: Let's say I break into your house

A woman wrote the best 'Letter to the Editor' in ages!!

She cuts to the chase and explains things better than all the rubbish
you hear on TV.

Her letter said: Recently, large demonstrations have taken place
across the country protesting the fact that parliament is finally
addressing the issue of illegal immigration.

Certain people are angry that Australia might actually want to protect

its own borders, might make it harder to sneak into this country and,
once here, make it harder (as an illegal immigrant) to stay
indefinitely.

Let me see if I correctly understand the thinking behind these
protests.

Let's say I break into your house.

Then, when you discover me in your house, you insist that I leave. But

I say, 'I've made all the beds and washed the dishes and done the
laundry and swept the floors; I've done all the things you don't like
to do.

I'm hard-working and honest (except for when I broke into your house).

According to the protesters, not only must you let me stay, you must
add me to your family's insurance plan, educate my kids, and provide
other benefits to me and to my family (my husband will do your yard
work)because he too is hard-working and honest, except for that
breaking-in part.

If you try to call the police or force me out, I will call my friends
who will picket your house carrying signs that proclaim my illegal
right to be there. It's only fair, after all, because you have a nicer

house than I do, and I'm just trying to better myself.

I'm hard-working and honest, um, except for well, you know.

And what a deal it is for me!! I live in your house, contributing only

a fraction of the cost of my keep, and there is nothing you can do
about it without being accused of selfishness, prejudice and being an
anti-housebreaker. Oh yeah, and I want you to learn my language so you

can communicate with me! English is too hard for me to learn. You
should also allow me to vote - in my own language, since I live in
your house!

Why can't people see how ridiculous this is?

Only in Australia.

[Flatcap]

At the risk of sounding like a lefty communist, it may be that the person was chased into the house by a bunch of murderous heathens.

Would you kick them back into the street then?

[Dargor]

At the risk of sounding like a lefty communist, it may be that the person was chased into the house by a bunch of murderous heathens.

Would you kick them back into the street then?

At the risk of sounding like a racist it may be that the person is a murderous heathen.:yes:

How was it the london bombings happened again?

Murderous heathens came into my house legally or illegally and blew up my fucken train.


Almost forgot.
Some not-murderous foreigners (who's religion is irrelevant) come knocking on some guys door, the guy gives them one of his rooms. Soon the foreigners multiply and ask for another room, he gives them a room. Things are getting a bit cramped so he starts adding another room to his house. The guy decides to multiply. Now things are getting really cramped and theres no space for his kid to live.
-- meh didn't come out very well, trying to describe the rise in property value.

[Flatcap]

At the risk of sounding like a racist it may be that the person is a murderous heathen.:yes:

How was it the london bombings happened again?

Murderous heathens came into my house legally or illegally and blew up my fucken train.

Is "Murderous Heathen" a race?

I agree with you though - I just tried my commie hat on for a minute....didn't fit too well.

[Dargor]

I agree with you though - I just tried my commie hat on for a minute....didn't fit too well.
Good on ya,
If more people tried their commie hat maybe the world wouldn't be ruled my capitalist swine.

[Flatcap]

Good on ya,
If more people tried their commie hat maybe the world wouldn't be ruled my capitalist swine.

I resemble that remark

[Karma]

At the risk of sounding like a lefty communist, it may be that the person was chased into the house by a bunch of murderous heathens.

Would you kick them back into the street then?


That argument doesn't work.

Take the UK for example, all the people from the eastern block and the arabs etc... trek right across europe before crossing the channel into the UK. It's been said many many times that places like France and Germany have a higher standard of living than the UK, but the one thing they don't have is a welfare system that's giving handouts to anyone that turns up.

It's not about claiming asylum, it's about economic migration.

[boomer]

the world is for everyone.. only the small minded lock them selves up in 'Houses'

and by the way.. its not YOUR house.. you just happen to reside there.. a caretaker.

get a grip bitch

[007XX]

the world is for everyone.. only the small minded lock them selves up in 'Houses'

and by the way.. its not YOUR house.. you just happen to reside there.. a caretaker.

get a grip bitch

That's Mrs Bitch to you buster:Playnice:

And anyway, you missed the point of this thread, but I guess that happens...

[007XX]

Take the UK for example, all the people from the eastern block and the arabs etc... trek right across europe before crossing the channel into the UK. It's been said many many times that places like France and Germany have a higher standard of living than the UK, but the one thing they don't have is a welfare system that's giving handouts to anyone that turns up.

It's not about claiming asylum, it's about economic migration.

I don't know about the UK or Germany, but unfortunately in France there has always been a grave problem of immigration (especially from Algeria) and of poor economic resources to cater for it. Anybody living in Paris would have a very strong opinion on the subject .

It is very much originally from the french gouvernment fucking it up...as always!

[boomer]

That's Mrs Bitch to you buster:Playnice:

And anyway, you missed the point of this thread, but I guess that happens...


i missed the point? maybe you believe you own your 'house' too?

[Dargor]

i missed the point? maybe you believe you own your 'house' too?

So you have an issue with people claiming/owning land, correct? its all Gods land or something.

Do you live under a bridge or did you eat shit and buy a house becoming one of us who "own our house's"

The issue isn't about claiming land, all the land has been claimed(private or state), we pay taxes which get used to pay for leach-immigrants houses.

There's nothing wrong with with non-leach immigrants who contribute to society, except when you let a million into a country that cant keep up with demands, like housing.

[007XX]

i missed the point? maybe you believe you own your 'house' too?

Look Boomer...I don't know you, you don't know me, so why don't we just agree that maybe, just maybe, we should keep an open mind about the other person't point of view???:yes:

I am not looking at starting a huge argument with you, and for whatever its worth, I actually agree with you.. to a point!

What I wanted to know is:

How do people feel about immigrants who blatantly DO NOT try to help themselves and disrespect the existing culture in the country they move into by not learning the native linguo and/or just get on the doll as soon as they are able to....

[Karma]

I don't know about the UK or Germany, but unfortunately in France there has always been a grave problem of immigration (especially from Algeria) and of poor economic resources to cater for it.


Well the french can get fucked, they deliberately set up the sangatte camp to give all the illegals a route through france into the uk, there's even been murmerings about the french educating the illegals into how to get into the UK and claim asylum.

[007XX]

Well the french can get fucked, they deliberately set up the sangatte camp to give all the illegals a route through france into the uk, there's even been murmerings about the french educating the illegals into how to get into the UK and claim asylum.

Really????

[boomer]

Look Boomer...I don't know you, you don't know me, so why don't we just agree that maybe, just maybe, we should keep an open mind about the other person't point of view???:yes:

I am not looking at starting a huge argument with you, and for whatever its worth, I actually agree with you.. to a point!

What I wanted to know is:

How do people feel about immigrants who blatantly DO NOT try to help themselves and disrespect the existing culture in the country they move into by not learning the native linguo and/or just get on the doll as soon as they are able to....

do you speak Maori?

[Flatcap]

Well the french can get fucked, they deliberately set up the sangatte camp to give all the illegals a route through france into the uk, there's even been murmerings about the french educating the illegals into how to get into the UK and claim asylum.

Sounds like something the French would do.

As I recall, they set up a similar process in the '40s to speed German immigration to the UK

[007XX]

do you speak Maori?

Funny you should ask...I have Maori friends who have been teaching me some maori, but I really want to learn it properly...

And if you were trying to imply I should put my money where my mouth is, I did not speak english when I arrived in NZ 13 years ago....

[boomer]

So you have an issue with people claiming/owning land, correct? its all Gods land or something.

Do you live under a bridge or did you eat shit and buy a house becoming one of us who "own our house's"

The issue isn't about claiming land, all the land has been claimed(private or state), we pay taxes which get used to pay for leach-immigrants houses.

There's nothing wrong with with non-leach immigrants who contribute to society, except when you let a million into a country that cant keep up with demands, like housing.

there is no god..

no, i live in a house; which the bank owns..

In a country thats not my own ( unless of course you count the fact my forefathers raped and pillaged and flag planted on these fair shores too)



No matter what country you live in, the state pays.. which mean the people pay. IN FACT i bet a fuckin bottom dollar that of the ***k a year i earn you have eaten away at my tax's.. how bout you pay me back the money you owe me?

[boomer]

Funny you should ask...I have Maori friends who have been teaching me some maori, but I really want to learn it properly...

And if you were trying to imply I should put my money where my mouth is, I did not speak english when I arrived in NZ 13 years ago....

so no.. you don't speak Maori?

in that case sit down and be fukin quiet

[MisterD]

Sounds like something the French would do.

As I recall, they set up a similar process in the '40s to speed German immigration to the UK

Q: How many Frenchmen does it take to defend Paris?

A: Nobody knows, it's never been tried.

[007XX]

Q: How many Frenchmen does it take to defend Paris?

A: Nobody knows, it's never been tried.

Nice one!:yes:

[ManDownUnder]

Q: How many Frenchmen does it take to defend Paris?

A: Nobody knows, it's never been tried.

LOL course not - every time she's threatened she just rolls over... *ahem*

[Dargor]

How do people feel about immigrants who blatantly DO NOT try to help themselves and disrespect the existing culture in the country they move into by not learning the native linguo and/or just get on the doll as soon as they are able to....
Who wouldn't be pissed off at people like that.

"When in Rome, do as the Romans do" is a very appropriate quote.

Existing culture: Culture or ancient culture, all i see in modern culture about ancient culture is all about War. I don't have anything against war, but if you take a look at domestic violence. There are plenty of natives making fun of ancient culture. "When in Rome"? As for modern culture in general, isn't that all about alcohol and sex. They shouldn't do as "the Romans do" but..

learn the native lingo: I think that's a bit bullshit, learn English not any of "this ahh, bro cuz cuz wst cyde" but they may be forgiven, because "when in Rome".

Just get on the doll: That's just horrible, but "when in Rome", maybe it isn't the immigrants fault.

So how do i feel about immigrants? they aren't any worse than the natives, however their recent increase is to blame the property issue on.

[The Lone Rider]

I think the comparison of a house and country is flawed. However, the letter has proven a point.

[Chrislost]

i think the origional post was somthing interesting, however i also believe that if u walk through my local shops you wont see one white kiwi.

and i guess its good that the french didnt get here first or there wouldnt be maoris today.

[ManDownUnder]

so no.. you don't speak Maori?

in that case sit down and be fukin quiet

Yeah but... there's a big difference between conquest and integration. The example given (post 1) is a gross over simplification implying the resources of a single household be diverted to a person wanting them in a manner that is very burdensome to the individual.

Even at it's purest form that argument doesn't hold at a national level unless a proportionate number of immigrants was to arrive at once (let's say 25% of a nations population - assuming a household size of 4 people).

That letter was a shit stir designed to get a bite - and looky looky it did.

The closing line "Why can't people see how ridiculous this is"... because it was presented with a deliberatly provocative bias, and when provoked, logic and reason falls out of people's heads. The rednecks come out and start shouting and before long it's an adrenaline fuelled shouting match where either side would be hard pressed to actually cite any of the facts originally presented.

2c poorer... yet again

[007XX]

i think the origional post was somthing interesting, however i also believe that if u walk through my local shops you wont see one white kiwi.

and i guess its good that the french didnt get here first or there wouldnt be maoris today.

That pretty much sums it up...Thanks!

[The Stranger]

i think the origional post was somthing interesting, however i also believe that if u walk through my local shops you wont see one white kiwi.

and i guess its good that the french didnt get here first or there wouldnt be maoris today.

Um, they did. Well before the english at least.
There is a monument to the french that died at the hands of the maori in the BOI.

[The Lone Rider]

And I want to add that my ex gf is Chinese, and she has to pay tax just like everybody else, has to pay yearly for a new visa (which is required that she also get a signed doctors certificate, and x-rays - both of which cost her over $100 each), as well as her student fees being $10,000 more per year then someone who has citizenship or residency. It recently cost her $3000 just to sit a single NCEA credit that she needed to get her degree. A SINGLE module.. thats hardly anything. In high school, for example, that would be maybe two weeks of studying poetry before moving onto formal writing in an english class!

A lot of that money is going towards paying for the health of NZ citizens and similar.

Luckily she gets residency IF she can find a job once she gets her degree. But it would have cost her a good $50,000 or more for it all up. And her parents paid for a lot of that. And to put things in perspective, she earns more in one weekend working as a nurse aid then her dad earns full time in a month.

I think that is extremely unfair for her. It certainly made things difficult for us when she had to pay $100 just to get some pescription nasal spray for her hayfever and we then cant buy a new fridge, or she can't leave the country incase it effects her reapplication for her visa (again.. no vacation). Dont even get me started on the legal hub bub if you have kids with someone who's here on a visa!

I think it's even more unfair if there are people illegally here getting health checks and such subsidized like any citizen would, as comparatively my ex gf has worked hard for what she has and should at the very least get some help paying doctors fees.

But then also on that note, my family had a fair bit to do with helping settle refuges from the Tampa into NZ. My aunt, who is a high court judge, was on the board that decided what was to become of them when Australia told them to go away. My mum and I, helped settle a family here - she still regularly goes over to their place and tutors them and helps the younger ones with their homework. I have less to do with them now, but previously gave one some guitar lessons and helped sort out some things, and also helped them load firewood on more then one occasion. I think they deserve all that they have gotten, especially the education that they are now getting. I wish I could have my pool table that I gave them back though haha

[Sanx]

Some distinction should be made between illegal immigrants who come to NZ under false pretences simply 'cos they want to go to another country to get a better standard of living (often at the country's expense) and refugees who come here as they cannot live safely in their own country.

My other half arrived here as a 17 year-old with her family in 1996. Her father had been a helicopter engineer in the Iranian military for many years and after the Iranian revolution had instigated a number of protests about the level of mullah-intervention in military affairs, including being forced to make low level bombing runs against civilian targets in the Iran-Iraq war.v Later on, he also criticised the mayor of Tehran (another cleric, and now the country's president rather publically. This got him a reputation as a bit of a troublemaker and as such, he was targeted by the country's religious police.

After he was arrested (no reason given), he was taken to a rather notorious jail in northern Tehran. His family sold their apartment and used the majority of the money to bribe an official to have him released. They bought fake Italian passports and escaped the country. He still has the scars and missing fingernails from his time inside that prison.

After six months in Thailand where they waited for the people-smuggler they had paid to get them tickets, they arrived in New Zealand and claimed refugee status. None of the family spoke more than rudimentary English. they got interviewed at the airport and after a few hours were let loose pending an Immigration Department hearing. They arrived with only a small overnight bag each, and about $300 in their pocket. A kiwi porter at the airport happened to hear them speaking to each other and, as his wife was Iranian, recognised the language. He asked them if they had somewhere to stay and then offered them a room in his house for a couple of weeks until such time they could get some more permanent accomodation.

My partner, despite having finished high-school in Iran, went to school here and did Bursary. For two years, she walked around with a English-Farsi dictionary. Eleven years on, her parents own their own house, started a business, sold it, then started another one. They took English classes in order to fit in a little better, though their English is still not that great. My partner and her younger brother are absolutely fluent, though the accent can prove a little tricky sometimes. All in all, they claimed a benefit for about four weeks only. Yes, they've had education, but that's probably ben countered by the ten and a half years of paying tax.

I'm not saying all refugees are like this. A number of my partner's Iranian acquaintances are thoroughly dishonest people; scrounging money off the state and anywhere else they can get hold of it so they have to work as little as possible. Many of the refugee claims are complete fabrications; something my partner's only too aware of as she does translating and interpreting work for both the Department of Immigration and the Refugee Status Appeals Authority.

What's the point of all this? Well ... refugees and immigrants like my partner and her family - people that have immigrated for whatever reason and then grabbed that opportunity with both hands - are amongst the most vocal objectors to the sort of useless dole-scum wastrels the letter-writer was talking about. They have nothing but absolute scorn for them; mainly as their actions help perpetuate the perception that all immigrants and refugees are scroungers.

[scracha]

I came across this little pearler a couple of days ago, and thought that highlighted a very relevant point (even if written for

Sounds like a lot of racist xenophobic $hite to me. Can't we do an exchange scheme where we kick out a couple of lazy kiwi's for every hard working immigrant?

[The Lone Rider]

Aww fuck dude. Irainian girls are hot! Have you seen all the cute pics of the iranian girls in the military? Mmm tasty. haha