Any way to boost stopping power?

[delusionz]

My brakes are mushy, a tight yank on both brakes doesn't pull me back as fast as I would like and I have to also change down quickly which can cause rear wheel skids in the wet. If it wasn't for me obeying the 2 second rule I probably would have rear ended a couple erratically stopping cages by now.

Anyone have any suggestions that are both safe and legal?

Cheers

Forgot to mention the bike is an 07 GPX250, Will take this up when I go for my 1st service but incase they cant/wont do anything I'd like to know what I can do.

[Cajun]

flush the brake fluid system with new flloyd?

but in turn if it hasn't even gone in for its 1000km service the pads might take a bit of time to bed in.

One thing you can try, one night before you go to bed, zip tie your brake lever hard on, and release it the next morning and see how you get on

[SARGE]

My brakes are mushy, a tight yank on both brakes doesn't pull me back as fast as I would like and I have to also change down quickly which can cause rear wheel skids in the wet. If it wasn't for me obeying the 2 second rule I probably would have rear ended a couple erratically stopping cages by now.

Anyone have any suggestions that are both safe and legal?

Cheers

Forgot to mention the bike is an 07 GPX250, Will take this up when I go for my 1st service but incase they cant/wont do anything I'd like to know what I can do.

braided lines for sure ..also try a bleed.. if you want to spend a bit .. change your master cylinder to a smaller unit ( i went from a 16 mm to a 14mm and its like dropping the anchor)

[ManDownUnder]

Good q - I'm sure the raciong fraternity will know the tricks traps in and out.

[FROSTY]

Delusions.Im making a fairly HUGE assumption in saying you apear to be a new rider. --If Im wrong Im sorry.
I'd STRONGLY suggest you get an experienced rider to ride your bike before making any assumptiions.
You may not have a problem at all or you may have glazed up the pads
One think I have noticed with this last generation of GPX's is that the front suspension is really soggy causing massive front end dive under heavy front brakes followed by a premature front end lock up.
There is one other point---are you refering to DRY braking or braking in the wet or when the bike is still cold ??

[delusionz]

Delusions.Im making a fairly HUGE assumption in saying you apear to be a new rider. --If Im wrong Im sorry.
I'd STRONGLY suggest you get an experienced rider to ride your bike before making any assumptiions.
You may not have a problem at all or you may have glazed up the pads
One think I have noticed with this last generation of GPX's is that the front suspension is really soggy causing massive front end dive under heavy front brakes followed by a premature front end lock up.
There is one other point---are you refering to DRY braking or braking in the wet or when the bike is still cold ??

Been riding for 7 months now, have had my current bike for a couple weeks so far. A particular occasion I had in mind was yesterday (5 July) afternoon, the sun was out and the road was dry, I had been riding all morning and a car turning into the gas station next to BK on manukau road stopped in the middle of the road instead of getting her dumb ass off to the median.

Btw I mean to say my brakes aren't bad, They're probably normal for what they are, But I could use some more stopping power to pull me in a bit further back under emergency braking

[avgas]

What tyres you running? as that made all the difference to me on light bikes

[delusionz]

Last night I read an article about a guy in america that has the same bike as me and he wasn't satisfied with his brakes either so he replaced the brake hoses with braided stuff and it made his braking more "linear" he says he had a drop off in pressure after half way it was still the same pressure applied but after the change he had a pickup in braking power past half way. However I read something about it in these forums and they say they don't comply with WOF standards or some shit!

[delusionz]

What tyres you running? as that made all the difference to me on light bikes

Dunlops
Front: 100/80-16
Rear: 130/80-16

[FROSTY]

Dude --to clear up one thing. A braided line WITH The correct compliance numbers ain't gonna give any problems.
But I'd strongly suggest you do other stuff first.
1)Sort out the soggy front end so the forks arent bottomed out in even moderate braking.
2)Fit a better quality front tyre
3)Try a different set of brake pads

[delusionz]

Dude --to clear up one thing. A braided line WITH The correct compliance numbers ain't gonna give any problems.
But I'd strongly suggest you do other stuff first.
1)Sort out the soggy front end so the forks arent bottomed out in even moderate braking.
2)Fit a better quality front tyre
3)Try a different set of brake pads

Cheers for the advice, The bike sinks as soon as I get on it actually, Someone else commented on this with the same bike, But there was nothing they could do about it and couldn't afford aftermarket suspension.

[avgas]

How new are the tyres? how confident are you on the brakes?
You can do things like caliper upgrades and the like.....but it wont affect the fact that its too scary to grab the brakes.....im not shitting you - i once rode a bike where i refused to use the front brake due to fear.
If the tyres are fairly new, rough them up a bit with some sandpaper.
Also a simple thing you can do overnight is to pull the brake lever hard into the handlebar, cable-tie it then leave it overnight. In the morning, pump the brake about 10 times and go for a ride. This helps with air-pockets in the lines and cylinder.
When were the brake pads looked at?

[delusionz]

How new are the tyres? how confident are you on the brakes?
You can do things like caliper upgrades and the like.....but it wont affect the fact that its too scary to grab the brakes.....im not shitting you - i once rode a bike where i refused to use the front brake due to fear.
If the tyres are fairly new, rough them up a bit with some sandpaper.
Also a simple thing you can do overnight is to pull the brake lever hard into the handlebar, cable-tie it then leave it overnight. In the morning, pump the brake about 10 times and go for a ride. This helps with air-pockets in the lines and cylinder.
When were the brake pads looked at?

Everything is brand spankin new, Haven't even had it's first service yet, It's just on 350kms, I'm pretty sure everything is normal for what it is, But I'll definitely bring this up at the first service and see if they think I could do with some extra stopping power

[moT]

in the last 10 years brakeing distances havent changed by much or at all if your bike can get the rear wheel in the air it can brake 100% the only way you can make that better is to shift your weight further back on the bike dont push down on the handle bars while brakeing as it makes the center of gravity further forward the idea is to support your weight with your legs and keep your arms bent this makes the center of gravithy further near the rear which helps keep the rear on the ground which means you can brake more special pads braded lines only make a slight difference special pads mean there is a more smooth predictable brakeing application but hardly improves stopping power braided lines are used so when the line heats up it does not balloon up and reduce stpooing power this only happens under extreme and constant brakeing. my best recommendation is to practice emergency brakeing brake to the full without the rear comeing up (just on the limit) and brakeing tequenique all the other fancy equiptment is not really needed

[moT]

although make sure your suspention does not bottom out under full load thats bad and a decent front tyre is reccomended just make sure its hot before you attempt to brake hard a good 5min ride will make it hot

[moT]

if you dont believe me hop on a bicycle stand up on the bike lean as foreward as you can try and brake as hard as you can without lifting the rear then try again sitting on the seat you will realise you can stop wayy faster then try droping your seat right down and trying it again its even better this is due to body position but doesnt matter where you put your body the rear will still lift (assuming you have a fairly decent bicycle) but is where you positon the weight that makes brakeing power then if you decide to buy hydraulic disk brakes for your bicycle you will see it does not improve brakeing distances but may give you a better feel for the bike

[slopster]

Just pull harder on the lever. Thats guarenteed to increase the braking power (unless you lock up the front wheel or lift the back!).

[moT]

yeah that about sums it up

[FROSTY]

Been riding for 7 months now, have had my current bike for a couple weeks so far.
Please dude get a more experienced rider to take your baby for a lil hoon.


On a more radical front I think the first GPX's had a different front brake setup and i remember clearly standing one on its nose (braking so hard the back wheel was off the ground) after we stiffened up the front end

[moT]

ill happily take it for a test!!

[Pancakes]

Delusionz, you can ask the shop you got it from too, it may have been sitting for a while, they might offer to take a peek for you (should in my opinion but I've found the degree's of customer service vary wildly in bike shops). You did just but a new bike off them though.

Tom, I disagree with a blanket statement like "braided lines only make a slight difference". Depends on whats there now doesn't it?

I've had goes on bikes that had year old lines on them and felt fine but mine is just over a year old and while the lines were ok new they have degraded fairly quickly and now are softer, if this is the case it's best to replace them to get consistent braking in all conditions and like they say "practice makes perfect" and you can't practice the same pressure on your brakes lots if they vary with heat etc. I recon that if you are going to replace your lines going braided is well worth it. To get a good price you can get them made to order through 0800 BRAKES who use certified Goodridge lines and have all the banjo styles etc. Then find a friendly KB'er to help you bleed them. You should be able to bleed your own brakes if you own a bike cos a flush with new fluid every 6 months keeps things nice and responsive. It pains me as a serial bulk buyer but don't get more fluid than you need to, it draws in moisture when it sits around unsealed. Have changed the pads on mine from factory too (around 5000k's, they must have been crap!) and they bite heaps better.

[delusionz]

Hi all, just want to report that I've had a bit better results from my brakes by wiping down the discs with tissues when I go to the gas station and also pulling harder on the brakes. The bike sinks down-forward under heavy braking nomatter what I do or how I sit and the rear doesn't ever come up which was my initial fear of squeezing the front to death.

As for getting an "experienced rider" to ride my bike, Sure why not, if someone I trust on my bike comes along, but I really don't know anyone thus far.

And once again, the bike is brand new, it hadn't even sit in the shop, I went there they didn't have it so I placed an order and it was there the next working day, and then it took half a day for the mechanics to get it ready, then a couple hours to sort out WOF/REG. So No it hadn't been sitting in the shop, No X, Y, Z are not old, It's brand new and was prepared with brand new fluids, It's less than 400km old now, So I don't think bleeding the brakes is the answer. Am still yet to try the cable tie front lever thing though, But will get round to that, The main thing is that I want to check with the dealer first before I do anything though.

[ZeroIndex]

I highly recommend you go for braided lines... was reading somewhere the other day that braided lines are the quickest way to improve your bike's overall performance, just by being able to feel/control the brakes better (something like up to 50%)???!?!

[riffer]

Braided, schmaided...

It's a brand new bike, its a 250, its a fairly inexperienced rider. I personally don't think a 250 will go hard eoungh to need its brakes radically overhauled (and unless you're racing, completely re-doing the brakes lines on a brand new bike is a radical step).

Firstly, at 350kms total the brakes are still bedding in. Also it wouldn't surprise me if there's a bit of air in the lines too. Pretty common in a new bike, from what I've heard. It's one of the things they should check at the first service.

Frosty's advice is good - get an experienced KBer to ride it first - they will let you know if there's a problem.

After that, you need to raise it at the first service.

And you may also want to have a look around here or elsewhere on the net to see if replacing the fork oil with a higher grade fixes the problem without causing the fork oil seals to leak. Also check if it gives you problems with the warranty too.

Other than that, get out there and ride the bike. The more you ride it, the more you will get to know it and its various quirks.

[The Pastor]

dude 7 months and 400km? I do that in half a day!


I think the suspension is shit on the 07 gpx 250, I saw one at unitec and when they guy jumped on it, it was more wallowly than me after half a bottle of rum and half a bottle of JW.

Not sure if they are adjustable forks but you should be able to get the dealer to put some stiffer oil or springs in it.

[Hawkeye]

in the last 10 years brakeing distances havent changed by much or at all if your bike can get the rear wheel in the air it can brake 100% the only way you can make that better is to shift your weight further back on the bike dont push down on the handle bars while brakeing as it makes the center of gravity further forward the idea is to support your weight with your legs and keep your arms bent this makes the center of gravithy further near the rear which helps keep the rear on the ground which means you can brake more special pads braded lines only make a slight difference special pads mean there is a more smooth predictable brakeing application but hardly improves stopping power braided lines are used so when the line heats up it does not balloon up and reduce stpooing power this only happens under extreme and constant brakeing. my best recommendation is to practice emergency brakeing brake to the full without the rear comeing up (just on the limit) and brakeing tequenique all the other fancy equiptment is not really needed


I agree with the you there Tom. Practice is what's needed.
(Not wanting to start one of those 'correct' English wars - but a couple of full stops wouldn't go amiss in there Tom. I almost ran out of air reading that lot - lol).

[bull]

Like others have said get someone experienced to test the bikes brakes and then id say get down to a carpark with a KB mentor and do some emergency braking practice, i did this at 20 / 30 and 50km/h and managed to get a decent braking technique that would stop me fairly quickly. Then i had a hiccup at a set of lights when cruising at a 100km/h when trying to brake hard, ended up with lockup of rear, which in turn caused rear to skid and then the front also started squirming. So then i found that i needed to practice emergency braking at higher speeds(110km/h). A nice quiet country road catered for this and now im quite happy to brake very hard and stop quick without any lockups.
Im still a complete NEWBIE, coming up to 12000km(since Nov 06) on my 250 Hyosung and have learnt lots of useful things from experienced riders and being able to brake effectively is very important and should be practiced to get it sussed out.

[delusionz]

Yep yep, I'll be at the next ATNR and I'll make myself known and bring it up with some of the boys

[ZeroIndex]

Like others have said get someone experienced to test the bikes brakes and then id say get down to a carpark with a KB mentor and do some emergency braking practice, i did this at 20 / 30 and 50km/h and managed to get a decent braking technique that would stop me fairly quickly. Then i had a hiccup at a set of lights when cruising at a 100km/h when trying to brake hard, ended up with lockup of rear, which in turn caused rear to skid and then the front also started squirming. So then i found that i needed to practice emergency braking at higher speeds(110km/h). A nice quiet country road catered for this and now im quite happy to brake very hard and stop quick without any lockups.
Im still a complete NEWBIE, coming up to 12000km(since Nov 06) on my 250 Hyosung and have learnt lots of useful things from experienced riders and being able to brake effectively is very important and should be practiced to get it sussed out.
I did a fair bit of emergency braking today... but I guess that goes hand-in-hand when practicing wheelies in a private carpark (note: not a public road all you haters)

[FROSTY]

Hi all, just want to report that I've had a bit better results from my brakes by wiping down the discs with tissues when I go to the gas station and also pulling harder on the brakes. The bike sinks down-forward under heavy braking nomatter what I do or how I sit and the rear doesn't ever come up which was my initial fear of squeezing the front to death.
I'd be happy to have a quick look at the bike for ya.Give me a yeodle.
I have a feeling you have pre delivery lube on your front disk.My feeling is that a squirt down with brakeclean and a light sand of the pads will have your brakes back to the way they should be.

[Pussy]

Give a change of fluid a go. I use Castrol Response SUPER DOT 4, as opposed to normal Castrol Response. Easy way to tell, the SUPER DOT 4 comes in a silver coloured container ( and the fluid itself is clear), and normal Castrol Response comes in a red container, and the fluid is amber coloured.
With new fluid, and properly bled, you should find a big improvement

[Pancakes]

Yeah, If your not kidding about the wiping with tissues then go see someone soon! Be protective of your discs and pads, the discs get all nasty with crap on them and pads absorb oil and rubbish too.

[ZeroIndex]

My brakes suck ass... thought I'd just share that...
Lesson learnt: Don't replace your old master cylinder/reservoir with a crappy chinese brake master cylinder/reservoir.

[delusionz]

Yeah, If your not kidding about the wiping with tissues then go see someone soon! Be protective of your discs and pads, the discs get all nasty with crap on them and pads absorb oil and rubbish too.

Just dirt and grit from the road comes off, but it definitely makes a difference

[ZeroIndex]

Just dirt and grit from the road comes off, but it definitely makes a difference
And the last thing you want to clean your discs with is CRC.... DON'T DO IT!!!

[imdying]

put WD40 on the disks and spray all your wheels with tyre shine (makes them look cool)Getting your nomination for KB idiot of the month in early?

[delusionz]

CRC? WD40? I don't have a squeeling problem & I want more grip not less grip. U Knobs :P

[ZeroIndex]

CRC? WD40? I don't have a squeeling problem & I want more grip not less grip. U Knobs :P
I'm saying DON'T use it... you're talking about cleaning your discs... I'm giving you good advice on what NOT to use...

[FROSTY]

Delusions---What have you done about your bike since thursday??
The Crap I wiped off your disks was NOT good.