Train adverts

[merv]

OK I know we talked about it here http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=53747 as if it was a Toll NZ campaign but its being supported by a number of organisations including the Chris Cairns Foundation. Starting Monday if you are riding your bike (or driving your cage) don't become a statistic on the railway track otherwise you might spoil the safety awareness week. Seriously though, no matter what day of the week or week of the year (not just safety week) keep away from trains, they are seriously heavy and hurt if they hit you.

Land Transport NZ has guff about it here http://www.ltsa.govt.nz/media/2007/070718.html including small copies of the adverts on this page here http://www.ltsa.govt.nz/advertising/rail.html

Don't get pwned.

[Usarka]

you need a safety campaign to tell people not to get run over by a train?????? :gob:

[merv]

Yeah the problem is the dead guys never pass their learning on to the rest.

[Usarka]

Are we going to see some "hard hitting" safety campaigns about looking out for motorcyclists also? thought not.

[merv]

ACC did one of those - do you reckon it had no effect?

[Usarka]

never saw it - so it cant of been very "hard hitting". have seen those laughable cartoon "watch for biker" stickers though, bet they make drivers think.

[Little Miss Trouble]

lol just like the "bikes just appear at intersections" radio ads? - read 'all bikers speed, thats why they appear so fast' its a load of b/s, i bet heaps more bikers are seriously hurt/killed by moronic car drivers than people killed at train crossings (don't know where to find statisics) yet they still want to imply its our fault?:angry:

[Chrislost]

you need a safety campaign to tell people not to get run over by a train?????? :gob:

trains are really hard to see man!
i know for a fact that i can only see them a few km away(if the rails are straight)

[Albino]

Don't see a train = kill yourself.

Don't see a bike = kill an innocent party.

Which campaign gets more funding?

[merv]

Until now, I guess neither of them. The focus has been too much on speed and alcohol and not on the minority fatality statistics. So who can lobby for bikes then?

[Roj]

lol just like the "bikes just appear at intersections" radio ads? - read 'all bikers speed, thats why they appear so fast' its a load of b/s, i bet heaps more bikers are seriously hurt/killed by moronic car drivers than people killed at train crossings (don't know where to find statisics) yet they still want to imply its our fault?:angry:

Strange that, there was a recent awareness campaign where ACC and police with I think it was Ulyssess were promoting intersection awareness I read about in the NZ Herald, and they mentioned the ACC statistics showed that 75% of motorcycle accidents the rider was NOT at fault.:gob:

[Albino]

The rail safety campaign is a perfect example of how things get done in this country. Media hype.

Trouble is, the media are clever. They know that everyone drives a car and therefore can picture themselves or their family getting smashed by a train. It’s easy to get people interested in a topic when it affects them (the old “what’s in it for me” trick).

Unfortunately though most people don’t ride bikes so no one really cares when a biker gets killed. Yeah yeah I have to look for bikers but at the end of the day I don’t see one then I’ll probably be ok so it’s no big deal. Unlike hitting a train. The media aren’t going to help us on this because it won’t equate to higher ratings or more sales.

So what do we do? Lobby the government for some coverage? Here’s what happens to lobbyists: they either get labelled as extremist whingers, or they get thrown a bone to appease them. Especially when the subject doesn’t directly affect the people being lobbied – there are lots of drivers in government, few if any bikers. The bone is usually a half-arsed attempt (like cheap radio ads or those cartoon watch for bikes stickers) that aren’t affective (see paragraph 3).

Maybe the answer doesn’t lie just in adverstising, but needs to go back to driver training – get the right skills to sink in at the start. Are there currently any road safety iniatives involving driver skills being introduced though these sorts of channels? Or is advertising campaigns and enforcement the only options in the arsenal to combat poor driving……

[ManDownUnder]

you need a safety campaign to tell people not to get run over by a train?????? :gob:

Hell yes - look at the amount of denial around cops targetting the ATNR ....:dodge:

[imdying]

Only retards get run over by trains, we are doing the country a disservice by preventing these people from eliminating themselves from the gene pool.

[kro]

Sweet Mother of mercy, we are now wasting money on telling people to watch out for trains, by way of TV adverts........

If you can't see a train, a barrier or bells won't freaking help. My wife and I just rolled our eyes when Lomu came on TV about power/life support, and now this.......... My faith in humans is eroding.

[Hitcher]

Welcome to the land where people no longer have to take responsibility for their own actions. Caution: May contain biting sarcasm.

[kro]

Aint that the truth mate....... OSH ushered in a new age of hand holding, and it's really gone downhill since then.

[merv]

Yeah well you see I'm a railway guy really and we talked about it already here http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=54006 and now the ads have hit TV. We got them (the ads) from South Australia so you will notice it is Skippys getting flattened not Kiwis but the message is the same - give way to the train and stay off the tracks - otherwise it can hurt.

[merv]

I liked the comment on the other thread about gene pool - and here lies the problem - kill them there is an outcry - let them breed and there is an outcry about how their offspring behave, but hey its Te Reo week too let's not forget that.

[kro]

People want to write their own rules merv, they want to be able to drive over the tracks if the bells are ringing, because they are in a rush, and need to get to the supermarket, and can't wait 2 mins while the train passes.
Again and again we molly coddle that acute minority of people bent on a dinner date with death.

Within 20 mins of this advert airing, my wife has said "omg, what a waste of money, my brother rang me to say the same thing, and 2 aquaintaces in Napier messaged me on MSN and said " fuck our country caters to retarded behaviour so well".

[jafar]

People want to write their own rules merv, they want to be able to drive over the tracks if the bells are ringing, because they are in a rush, and need to get to the supermarket, and can't wait 2 mins while the train passes.
Again and again we molly coddle that acute minority of people bent on a dinner date with death.

Within 20 mins of this advert airing, my wife has said "omg, what a waste of money, my brother rang me to say the same thing, and 2 aquaintaces in Napier messaged me on MSN and said " fuck our country caters to retarded behaviour so well".

Oh you didn't know this? welcome to aunty helens pacific paradise :sick::shutup:

[Romeo]

Within 20 mins of this advert airing, my wife has said "omg, what a waste of money, my brother rang me to say the same thing, and 2 aquaintaces in Napier messaged me on MSN and said " fuck our country caters to retarded behaviour so well".
It gets worse doesn't it? IIRC this is a multi-pronged media campain comprising of TV, radio, billboard and newspaper - not cheap in other words.

Oh, and how many people get killed by trains, Vs. motorcyclists who get killed by cages. There should be a multi-pronged campaign for that as well, and don't forget choking on sausages either!

[scumdog]

I don't give a fat rats arse if some moron gets cleaned by a train 'cos they never saw it..

[BIGBOSSMAN]

Yes, all catered to the lowest common denominator here in NZ. My 13yo daughter came home the other day with one of her school books and the sheer simplicity of it shocked me. Really basic stuff, and what I learned when I was 8 years old. She's doing really well at school, and going by what I saw so is everyone else.
What have we got here eh?? The dumbing down of society, Labour ensuring future votes by creating a massive majority of non-achievers and welfare 'clients'.
It's bloody sickening...

[merv]

Scummy would you book someone you spotted running the red rail crossing lights though? Problem we have is the complete disregard for the warnings particularly by truckers who seem to treat it as some competitve game against the fellow freight business.

Law is simple. When a train is withing 800 metres of a crossing the road as such ceases to exist and the train has right of way and because of its weight and size usually wins, except when a truck hits side on as happened to kill Louise Cairns and the 11 that died near Kerang in Victoria Aus recently.

[tri boy]

Although most of NZs population have probably grown up with rail crossings as we know them, I still think this is a good safety campaign. There may be a small percentage of citizens who could use the education, and if it saves one child/adults life, then I will give it the :2thumbsup.
Trains are big and noisy, but humans can be desensitized and uneducated.

[scumdog]

Scummy would you book someone you spotted running the red rail crossing lights though? Problem we have is the complete disregard for the warnings particularly by truckers who seem to treat it as some competitve game against the fellow freight business.


Book 'em? - hell yeah - and treat them to my thoughts on that sort of carry on.

(Did so with the only one I caught.)

[janno]

Book 'em or tie 'em to the tracks in readyness for the next train? Would be mightly tempting . . .

[merv]

I mentioned earlier the focus on speed an alcohol, well NZ finally got some advertising budget to deal with a minority event. Deaths at level crossings are usually in the range of about 0 - 10 per annum compared to a road toll of 400 or more so it has been seen as a bit of a non-event by burearacy but because of the graphic and catastrophic nature of these crashes the public get all emotive about them and expect magic solutions. The number killed this way is similar to the number of trespassers and probable suiciders killed per annum. So what do you think of the state of mental health in our country too?

[BIGBOSSMAN]

Although most of NZs population have probably grown up with rail crossings as we know them, I still think this is a good safety campaign. There may be a small percentage of citizens who could use the education, and if it saves one child/adults life, then I will give it the :2thumbsup.
Trains are big and noisy, but humans can be desensitized and uneducated.

Eh? Are you kidding??
How about a safety campaign for kids that climb trees, or 'make sure you lift your feet over the kerb when you cross the road, you could stumble and hurt yourself'.
Trains were invented in bloody 1801, we've had over 200 years to get used to them
SHEESH!!!!!

[merv]

Anyway, do you like the adverts all the same?

[jafar]

Problem we have is the complete disregard for the warnings particularly by truckers who seem to treat it as some competitve game against the fellow freight business.

Law is simple. When a train is withing 800 metres of a crossing the road as such ceases to exist and the train has right of way and because of its weight and size usually wins, except when a truck hits side on as happened to kill Louise Cairns and the 11 that died near Kerang in Victoria Aus recently.

What complete & utter bollocks, one accident in another country does not justify your quote !!
If you wish to turn this into a truck bashing thread BRING IT ON:Punk:

[The Pastor]

problem with trains is they look as if they are going quite slow because of their length and size, so people think "i can make it".

Its common sence, but as long as we have a nanny state, people wont think for themselfs.

[The Pastor]

problem with trains is they look as if they are going quite slow because of their length and size, so people think "i can make it".

Its common sence, but as long as we have a nanny state, people wont think for themselfs.

[merv]

What complete & utter bollocks, one accident in another country does not justify your quote !!
If you wish to turn this into a truck bashing thread BRING IT ON:Punk:

Ah both the accidents I mentioned were caused by truckers. Where were you too when the truckers used to regularly crash through the Waiouru barriers? Only an overpass stopped that happening on a regular basis.

There are many other examples too here and in Aus. Anyone remember Makikihi and earlier Shannon and Longburn and in Aus the crashes with Pacific National at Lisomore Vic and with the Ghan south of Darwin in the last year.

Bollocks to your bollocks, and your point is?

Are you telling me you are a trucker that likes to break the law?

[Romeo]

problem with trains is they look as if they are going quite slow because of their length and size, so people think "i can make it".

Just as often is where you have trains going through busy traffic areas, and people are queued up over a train crossing (Like this one on busy <a href="http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&q=riccarton&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=31.977057,59.238281&ie=UTF8&ll=-43.529015,172.608556&spn=0.00357,0.007231&z=17&om=1">Riccarton Road</a>, or <a href="http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&q=riccarton&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=31.977057,59.238281&ie=UTF8&om=1&ll=-43.540628,172.642497&spn=0.001785,0.003616&t=h&z=18&iwloc=addr">outside Polytech</a>). People just rock on out onto them not even thinking that there may be a train comming in 60 seconds - then the bells and lights start going off and they're stuck there. I see it every day on my way to tech, or comming home in heavy traffic and people just idle themselves on the train tracks with no way to go forward.

How do you solve that on busy roads? Either through better education or bridge/tunnels I suppose - Or just assume at least a certain level common sense and play the numbers game.

[BIGBOSSMAN]

How do you solve that on busy roads? Either through better education or bridge/tunnels I suppose - Or just assume at least a certain level common sense and play the numbers game.

I endorse the latter solution.:done:

[oldrider]

Strange that, there was a recent awareness campaign where ACC and police with I think it was Ulyssess were promoting intersection awareness I read about in the NZ Herald,


and they mentioned the ACC statistics showed that 75% of motorcycle accidents the rider was NOT at fault. :gob:

Yes and "we" (motorcyclists) pay 75% more ACC for less than half the vehicle size on the road.

And every other man and his dog cover our part of the road with shit and mud, leaving us left with less than a quarter the space we should have.

Dairy farmers income goes up and their contamination of our roads increases "unchecked" expeditiously and "we" (motorcyclists) bear the cost both physically and financially!

The roads in and around North Otago are turning into a shit hole!

It used to be if the ice don't get you then the grit will but now you can add on to that, mud, shit, gravel, silage, hay, firewood, cows, farmers and a thousand mad bastards in cages to the list!

Worst of all, nobody seems to give a shit! (pardon the pun)

I feel better after that little rant, I must do it again some time! :brick:....John. (sorry, back to train safety)

[merv]

You watch out when you're crossing the tracks though eh John?

Truth is only a few bikers hit trains but the consequences are high.

[jafar]

Ah both the accidents I mentioned were caused by truckers. Where were you too when the truckers used to regularly crash through the Waiouru barriers? Only an overpass stopped that happening on a regular basis.

There are many other examples too here and in Aus. Anyone remember Makikihi and earlier Shannon and Longburn and in Aus the crashes with Pacific National at Lisomore Vic and with the Ghan south of Darwin in the last year.

Bollocks to your bollocks, and your point is?

Are you telling me you are a trucker that likes to break the law?

1/ There were no barriers @ waiouru & it wasn't just trucks that got hit there either .
2/ There will always be examples of accidents / crashes. The reasons for their happening is what is at issue. Your attempt to paint 'truckers' as irresponsible cowboys who race trains is what i am objecting to. It is crap , those accidents are not the result of trucks racing the trains.
The vast majority of truck drivers are courteous & professional in what they do. Your attempt to put them all down because of the mistakes of a few is the bollocks.
3/ Yes i'm a trucker , no i don't go out to break the law , I have well over one million k's up in trucks alone & have had to deal with many situations on the roads in over 25 years as a professional driver.
People make mistakes for whatever reason & some have happened on rail crossings & yes some have involved trucks. Far more have involved cars & pedestrians !

[tri boy]

Eh? Are you kidding??
How about a safety campaign for kids that climb trees, or 'make sure you lift your feet over the kerb when you cross the road, you could stumble and hurt yourself'.
Trains were invented in bloody 1801, we've had over 200 years to get used to them
SHEESH!!!!!

I am struggling to see what the problem is with spending approx $200k on a transport safety campaign.
I would think there is 50,000 crossings a day involving cars/trucks/pedestrians.
Thats a big window of potential human error involving a train that can't stop to avoid a fatality.
Expenditure on this campaign is minimal,(air time at govt rates, and Toll supplying the videos).
The country runs water safety, fire safety ads. All helping to educate people. Whats the real drama here? Or is it NZs short man syndrome coming to the surface again.(what about me?, look at me.) Double sheeesh, and I raise you.

[oldrider]

It is a matter of perception, the road crosses the railway not the "railway crosses the road".

If I owned the railway I would just close all the road crossings, fence them off and make road traffic go all the way to an over-bridge!

Then I would not have any of these stupid accidents to worry about.

The railway would soon be getting pleaded with to give them back their right of way across again, complete with promises to obey the crossing rules!

The public of this nation are fickle bastards and the politicians are space wasters. (IMHO) :mellow: John.

[scumdog]

1/ There were no barriers @ waiouru & it wasn't just trucks that got hit there either .
2/ There will always be examples of accidents / crashes. The reasons for their happening is what is at issue. Your attempt to paint 'truckers' as irresponsible cowboys who race trains is what i am objecting to. It is crap , those accidents are not the result of trucks racing the trains.
The vast majority of truck drivers are courteous & professional in what they do. Your attempt to put them all down because of the mistakes of a few is the bollocks.
3/ Yes i'm a trucker , no i don't go out to break the law , I have well over one million k's up in trucks alone & have had to deal with many situations on the roads in over 25 years as a professional driver.
People make mistakes for whatever reason & some have happened on rail crossings & yes some have involved trucks. Far more have involved cars & pedestrians !

Good one, get into him, next thing he'll turn to cop-bashing on KB!!

[candor]

This campaign is all the psyc patients need.

To me the visuals suggested a fast painless death which I know is just glamorising. And obviously thats what that guy who just drove up the tracks then parked and stood in front his car to get crushed thought too.

His noteworthy act was surely not coincidental. One death caused by the campaign so far?!.

Also no-one seems to be bothered by the report that Reefs dad was blind in one eye (on the train side) and perhaps unfamiliar with the area not helped by sunstrike. So how would this ad have helped them?

These are rare events and there are several more common toll causes that should get priority for high profile campaigns - fatigue, drugs and inattention to name just a few.

This country is far too reactive to well heeled activists and PC posturing. Famous sportsmen get the support for causes known to be statistically minor. Now we have that rugby guy telling us he depended on electricity for life. As if millions of people are killed by vector and empower etc. Not a one yet we have tv ads! That one takes the cake.

Crap - people on dialysis are not acutely ill and won't die if the process is interrrupted. The money spent on that stupid ad telling you to tell your electricity supplier you don'r want them to kill you would be far better spent on road safety ads re cagers observing for bikes or cyclists. Much bigger issue than trains - doh! Only in NZ...........

[kro]

I am struggling to see what the problem is with spending approx $200k on a transport safety campaign.
I would think there is 50,000 crossings a day involving cars/trucks/pedestrians.
Thats a big window of potential human error involving a train that can't stop to avoid a fatality.

The problem is it's wasted money, because the people most likely to get taken out, will be the Ryan Jamiesons of this world, who was clowning around, and got owned.
The other problem is where will this hand holding excercise of danger identification end?. Adverts with some drop kick plunging a knife into a toaster to retrieve a lost crumpet?.

See, we all grieve when people die, and that can not be denied to anyone, but if that person died doing something that 99% of the populace says was stupid, or rushed, or risky, then the fact remains that they tempted their own fate. Any form of indecision, or hasty, un thought out actions near a railway line, carry the potential for disaster.

Don't you think it odd we have had none for so long, and now all of a sudden, we have had several. all in a short soace of time..... the reason is simple, it's because after the first one, people got cautious, and started altering the way they approached crossings, then another fatality occurred, and some people really got jittery and apprehensive at crossings, they did something unnecessarily stupid, and got themselves taken out. This knee jerk advertising, and so called "safety campaign is too late imo, those with the propensity toward doing dumb things around trains have prolly been culled already.
If people had stuck with their original good sense at crossings, we could have seen less deaths.

[BIGBOSSMAN]

I am struggling to see what the problem is with spending approx $200k on a transport safety campaign.
I would think there is 50,000 crossings a day involving cars/trucks/pedestrians.
Thats a big window of potential human error involving a train that can't stop to avoid a fatality.
Expenditure on this campaign is minimal,(air time at govt rates, and Toll supplying the videos).
The country runs water safety, fire safety ads. All helping to educate people. Whats the real drama here? Or is it NZs short man syndrome coming to the surface again.(what about me?, look at me.) Double sheeesh, and I raise you.

If the powers that be continue to treat people as if they have just stumbled from the primordial ooze, the result is a nation full of halfwits and neanderthals - of which I am neither. It offends me to have to put up with this type of public spend on advertising, yet another $200k bill to add to the many you expect us all to willingly cough up out of our taxes. Trains have been here for ever, so have cars, trucks and planes. I haven't seen much advertising aimed at making our biking any safer, and as yet the 'dangerous dogs' issue seems to have been swept under the carpet yet again. There are plenty of issues I consider worthier of my tax dollars.
Therefore you'll have to 'Tri' harder to convince me of your argument.
Triple sheeesh back...

[tri boy]

If the powers that be continue to treat people as if they have just stumbled from the primordial ooze, the result is a nation full of halfwits and neanderthals - of which I am neither. It offends me to have to put up with this type of public spend on advertising, yet another $200k bill to add to the many you expect us all to willingly cough up out of our taxes. Trains have been here for ever, so have cars, trucks and planes. I haven't seen much advertising aimed at making our biking any safer, and as yet the 'dangerous dogs' issue seems to have been swept under the carpet yet again. There are plenty of issues I consider worthier of my tax dollars.
Therefore you'll have to 'Tri' harder to convince me of your argument.
Triple sheeesh back...

So using your rational train:shutup: of thought, humans do not need educating from the moment they draw breath.:scratch:
Mummy and Daddy never taught you anything? Strangers and freindly folk never suggested "don't do that little boss man as it will probably hurt alot"?
We will disagree in this case.
WoooWooooo chuff chuff chufff chuff......SPLAT!:bye::crybaby:

PS If you would like to push for better motor cycle awareness, then please do. I will support any sensible input you make.

[BIGBOSSMAN]

Mummy and Daddy never taught you anything?

Yes they did, and being safe around trains was one of them. As a consequence I have never had an 'issue' around them, ever! You have inadvertedly made my point in a nutshell - what's so difficult about parents handing down their common sense to their children, eh?
The left wing tree huggers would have a public service ad for everything, starting with what type of breakfast to have in the morning to making sure you go to the toilet before going to bed. Let people think for themselves, dammit!! :argh:

[Hitcher]

Right front wheel, right front wheel...

[tri boy]

Right front wheel, right front wheel...

Aah,Sunday morning kiddies requests. Such sweet memories. Tucked up in bed, toast crumbs all every where.:yes:
Damn your old Hitcher.:bleh:

[Edbear]

- what's so difficult about parents handing down their common sense to their children, eh?:



Now there you go, assuming said parents have said common sense to pass on... :yes:

You seen some of the parents around these days...?:gob:

[scumdog]

Aah,Sunday morning kiddies requests. Such sweet memories. Tucked up in bed, toast crumbs all every where.:yes:
Damn your old Hitcher.:bleh:

"Sparky thinks that trains talk...Sparky thinks that trains talk...."

How about "I thought I could...I thought I could''"

It's railway related too.

[scumdog]

Now there you go, assuming said parents have said common sense to pass on... :yes:

You seen some of the parents around these days...?:gob:

Nope.

They're never around the kids wherever else they are.

[Edbear]

"How about "I thought I could...I thought I could''"

It's railway related too.


Or "I think I can, I think I can!"

(As I said to the Missus...)

[BIGBOSSMAN]

Now there you go, assuming said parents have said common sense to pass on... :yes:

You seen some of the parents around these days...?:gob:

There is no better reason for not having public safety ads than the above quote. Eliminate them from the gene pool before it's too late, and we begin our inevitable regression to a simpler, ape like hominid (oops too late for some)...