God bless Transit NZ and all that sail in her...

[Krayy]

So when the word went out that they were going to building bus lanes on the Northern Motorway in Auckland, I got excited. Why? Because in Auckland City. motorbikes are given free reign to ride in the bus lanes on Dominion Rd, Great North Rd, Great South Rd etc (bless 'em). So I made some enquiries about whether we'd be afforded the same privledges on the motorway bus lanes and the response came back in the negative.

The reason? Apparantly Transit NZ believe that motorcycles would "slow the bus lanes down". Whether this indicates pure speed or the time taken to merge at the city end was not stated.

All I can say is "Fear the bus driver who drags off motorcycles".

[Skyryder]

Not too sure of all the details but as I drive busses my advice is to stay well clear of them.

Skyryder

[Magua]

Go transit nz :finger: , well atleast I still have the Onewa transit lane.

[vifferman]

Go transit nz :finger: , well atleast I still have the Onewa transit lane.Do you use that, Magua? Give me a toot / wave if you see me some morning. I generally go down there sometime between 7:55 and 8:15; how 'bout you?

[Mongoose]

Go transit nz :finger: , well atleast I still have the Onewa transit lane.

Ahhhhh the joys of living in a place that only has school busses and Intercity busses. Rush hour traffic that lasts for 10(yes ten) minutes at a time. I am so jealous of you folk up there :no:

[Krayy]

Ahhhhh the joys of living in a place that only has school busses and Intercity busses. Rush hour traffic that lasts for 10(yes ten) minutes at a time. I am so jealous of you folk up there :no:

Hell, it only takes 10 minutes to change the broken down wagon's wheel? That's pretty quick!

[vifferman]

Ahhhhh the joys of living in a place that only has school busses and Intercity busses. Rush hour traffic that lasts for 10(yes ten) minutes at a time. I am so jealous of you folk up there :no:Actually, it's usually pretty good. I live 15 minutes from work, and I've done the trip in less than that, although generally it takes about 20 minutes via my scenic back road route. Worst time? 90 minutes in the car (when my bike was at the doctors), with 60 of those being the time it took to travel 1 km down Onewa Road in the non-transit lane, with all the feckin eeedjits that do it every day, 1 person per car. First and last time for that, as I sat there thinking, "Phark this is stupid! I could've walked / cycled / crawled / bussed / pogo-sticked faster than 1 km/hour!" So I took the bus the rest of the week - 25 minutes.
Now if I need to not take the bike, I load the wife's car up with passengers and go in the transit lane.:niceone:

[Magua]

Do you use that, Magua? Give me a toot / wave if you see me some morning. I generally go down there sometime between 7:55 and 8:15; how 'bout you?

I'm heading down that way Wednesday, I've got work experiance at an engineering firm in the city. Keep an eye out for a miss matching Fzr without any side fairings. I think I'll be heading down around 7:40.

[Mongoose]

Hell, it only takes 10 minutes to change the broken down wagon's wheel? That's pretty quick!


Wheel, whats that boss, the wagons around here is on skids and are hauled by oxen :moon:

[ManDownUnder]

Would that be Auckland, or North Shore?

Sure Tranist can say what they like, but I understood the use of bus lanes to be enshrined in law (local body law) so it's the council I'd be ringing personally...

I rang ACC to establish the use of bus lanes by motorcyclists about a year ago and they quoted me chapter and verse on it (I can remember which chapter, and the verse is in the same boat) but I'm sure you could try!
MDU

[Krayy]

Would that be Auckland, or North Shore?

Sure Tranist can say what they like, but I understood the use of bus lanes to be enshrined in law (local body law) so it's the council I'd be ringing personally...



Problem is that the motorway is govt owned and not covered under local ordnances and bylaws even though it runs through them.

[ManDownUnder]

Problem is that the motorway is govt owned and not covered under local ordnances and bylaws even though it runs through them.

Gotcha...

Bugger...

[sAsLEX]

and intersections are goverened by transit and not the local council that controls the bus lanes going through them!

[Krayy]

and intersections are goverened by transit and not the local council that controls the bus lanes going through them!

Now theres something I didn't know. I suppose thats why the (slippery) green paint stops at the intersection.

PS. Hands up whos gone down Chinamans Hill (Gt North Rd coming down to Western Springs from Grey Lynn) in the bus lane in the rain without shitting themselves?
:no:

[ManDownUnder]

Now theres something I didn't know. I suppose thats why the (slippery) green paint stops at the intersection.

PS. Hands up whos gone down Chinamans Hill (Gt North Rd coming down to Western Springs from Grey Lynn) in the bus lane in the rain without shitting themselves?
:no:

I can relate to that one! The gentle right hander (heading uphill), camber completely wrong, car yards just there watching and waiting, looking down on the death trap.

NOT good.

[That Guy]

Ha! Just read this with interest. I recently got a $150 fine for riding in the "bus lane" at the bottom of the harbour bridge heading south. The angry copper pulled me over and as far as I could tell his attitude towards me was such that I had just raped or murdered somone. Geepers he was an angry man. To add insult to injury having been all stroppy, he wrote out my ticket and then tried to talk bikes! What? We're frineds now? Waaaaanker.

Anyway! I digress!

The answer is as you have all said, councils control local raods (generally 50k zones) and Transit controls the motorways. In 50 k zones local govt (North Shore and Auckland City - not sure about others) have both officially ok'd motorcycles using bus lanes - but Transit in their wisdom have not. Anyway I have learnt all this after my $150 ticket. I wrote to the ticketing place in Wellington attaching articles in newspapers from both NSCC and ACC stating it was ok to use bus lanes for motobikes. NO WHERE in either article did it say anything about not being ok in Transit owned areas, where the demark is between council and Transit (still arugable if anyone gets caught) areas are etc. Anyway - they wiaved the fine. Fair enough they said. Therefore if you get caught - use this defence. Just search on council websites and NZherald for the old sotries. Works a treat. :msn-wink: And to that angry cop out there wherever you are - learn to channel your angriness to REAL criminals.

for the reocrd I was only doing about 70 kph at the time too (its and 80 kph zone) but he still said "and you were travelling too fast - you're lucky I don;t give you a speeding ticket".....also for the record - I know some good cops too - they have shitty job so perhaps he had just come from a rape case or something.

[Krayy]

One thing that I did get in the way of info out of them was that, currently, the bus lanes that are on the Northern, and the NW between Pataki and Rosebank, are classed as shoulders until the real, fully sealed ones get built. So in effect if you ride in them now, you're on the shoulder and are fair game.

BTW, are you the REAL "That Guy", or just another one?

[That Guy]

BTW, are you the REAL "That Guy", or just another one?

:killingme Real.....hmmm.....I think you mean THey Guy from Sportscafe? I was That Guy before him....but guess he's more famous. Perhaps I should change to "That Other Guy" or "That first Guy" or as Firestormer called me "That Guy There"......

[Krayy]

I was That Guy before him....but guess he's more famous. Perhaps I should change to "That Other Guy" or "That first Guy" or as Firestormer called me "That Guy There"......

Perhaps you should sue the bugger. In that case, I'll refer to you as "That 'That Guy' that should be That Guy that could introduce me to the bulgarian chick with the big tits"

[That Guy]

Yeah Eva.....That Guy who doesn't know Eva. The other Guy does. Get to know That Guy and you might. But not this That Guy. D'OH! It was so much less confusing talking about tickets in bus lanes!

[Lou Girardin]

and intersections are goverened by transit and not the local council that controls the bus lanes going through them!

Where did you get that one? Local bodies control urban roads and intersections.

[sAsLEX]

the guy I rang at the council, he said they dont control things such as traffic lights and that bus lights etc were therefore BUS only lights and that I was to wait until a green as the LTSA legislation only refers to buses using bus lanes/lights

[ManDownUnder]

the guy I rang at the council, he said they dont control things such as traffic lights and that bus lights etc were therefore BUS only lights and that I was to wait until a green as the LTSA legislation only refers to buses using bus lanes/lights

So, would that mean that I am not allowed to go when the green "B" appears on the traffic light?

Extending that thought... I therefore SIT in the bus lane, praying the driver doesn't push the go button in the bus while I patiently obey the law... a fly under his diesel powered swatter...

??? now THAT doesn't make sense. PLEASE tell me I have the wrong end of the stick
MDU

[sAsLEX]

nope if you are legally in the bus lane and the light goes red and you are at the front of all the busses, when the bus light come s on to let the bus lane through you are to wait for a green disc before moving!! Or as was suggested by the coiuncil guy move your bike to the side of the lane so the busses could sneak by likely hitting you!!!

Another piece of brilliant law from our Gunmints LTSA

[ManDownUnder]

nope if you are legally in the bus lane and the light goes red and you are at the front of all the busses, when the bus light come s on to let the bus lane through you are to wait for a green disc before moving!! Or as was suggested by the coiuncil guy move your bike to the side of the lane so the busses could sneak by likely hitting you!!!

Another piece of brilliant law from our Gunmints LTSA

Sounds like it... I've emailed the LTSA this morning seeking clarification on all the above (use of bus lanes in Auckland city, use of bus lanes on motorways in Auckland city, and the issue of m/c having to stay stationary in the bus lane even when the light goes green.

The last one is of particular interest obviously, and I'll get back to you when I hear back from them (in 10 working days according to the auto reply).

Watch this space!
MDU

[Ghost Lemur]

So, would that mean that I am not allowed to go when the green "B" appears on the traffic light?

Extending that thought... I therefore SIT in the bus lane, praying the driver doesn't push the go button in the bus while I patiently obey the law... a fly under his diesel powered swatter...

??? now THAT doesn't make sense. PLEASE tell me I have the wrong end of the stick
MDU

Unfortunately not.

That was exactly what happened to sAsLEX, went on the green bus light and got a ticket.

So what it means is you can use the lanes but not the lights. Stupid? YES. Dangerous? DEFINITELY. Too funny for words? I THINK SO. :killingme

[vifferman]

Ha! Just read this with interest. I recently got a $150 fine for riding in the "bus lane" at the bottom of the harbour bridge heading south. The angry copper pulled me over and as far as I could tell his attitude towards me was such that I had just raped or murdered somone. Geepers he was an angry man. To add insult to injury having been all stroppy, he wrote out my ticket and then tried to talk bikes! What? We're frineds now? Waaaaanker.
Was he a bike cop?
I got abused (but not ticketed) by some frothy-mouthed shouty guy on an ST1100 for carefully lane-splitting past stopped cars. He got quite aggro, and yelled, "Maybe if you rode like a proper motorcyclist instead of an idiot, you'd stop giving the rest of us a bad name!!":mad:
I was flabbergasted (and I can tell you, I'm not at all fond of having my gast flabbered, no sirreee, JimBob), and to this day (after 4 years of consdering this) I'm still not sure WTF he meant by "riding like a proper motorcyclist". My best guess is: "Maybe if you pretended you were driving a car, ignored all the advantages and fun of bike ownership and riding, and sat in the traffic jams sucking up the noxious fumes, while talking on your cellphone, shaving, and having breakfast and reading the paper, instead of riding very carefully and safely while saving time, you would be adhering to my fascist view of life, have no life or friends, and be a total wanker like me!! So there!! Hmm hmmm!!" :whocares: :calm:

[ManDownUnder]

Unfortunately not.

That was exactly what happened to sAsLEX, went on the green bus light and got a ticket.

So what it means is you can use the lanes but not the lights. Stupid? YES. Dangerous? DEFINITELY. Too funny for words? I THINK SO. :killingme

So self defence isn't a defence against that ticket???

"Your honour, the bus driver behind me saw the green light and I elected to break this dumbass law rather than become roadkill"

Yup - NUTS... but I'm still keen to hear back from the LTSA (nothing personal guys). With that in hand I'll quiet hapily take it to the Minister of Transport and politely request something be done. Of course it is also useful to mention to all the other Ministers of Transport (i.e. the one from National, and everyone else will to poke fun at the one in power).

:Pokey:

[vifferman]

So self defence isn't a defence against that ticket???
Obviously not. What is the ultimate aim/purpose of road laws?

SAFETY.
Supposedly.
But in reality? :wacko:

[ManDownUnder]

Obviously not. What is the ultimate aim/purpose of road laws?

SAFETY.
Supposedly.
But in reality? :wacko:

REVENUE

And don't you forget it!

The only reason traffic is ever allowed to move faster is so they don't have to go so far to collect it. It's a numbers game - the more traffic per minute the more chances of collecting revenue.

Speed cameras exemplify this principle.
MDU

[Devil]

I spoke to the council a while ago about this, they confirmed that no, you couldnt use the bus light. Would be nice if we could, get stuck into them.

[kerryg]

nope if you are legally in the bus lane and the light goes red and you are at the front of all the busses, when the bus light come s on to let the bus lane through you are to wait for a green disc before moving!! Or as was suggested by the coiuncil guy move your bike to the side of the lane so the busses could sneak by likely hitting you!!!

Another piece of brilliant law from our Gunmints LTSA


Well I'm speechless...no I'm not. That is completely barking mad. I can't believe that it can be right, it's too insane. I catch a bus sometimes to town and I can tell you, at the top of Chinaman's Hill when the "B" light comes on those buses hit the accelerator like Michael Schumacher (they only get a second or two before the other traffic gets a green light) and there are often 3 or 4 in a queue so if you want to get rolled flat by 3 or 4 buses the way to do it is to stubbornly sit in the bus lane while waiting for a green light...if the running over doesn't kill you the subsequent kicking and punching by 3 or 4 large Maori bus drivers will finish you off.

On those admittedly (ahem..) rare occasions I take a bike along Great North Rd to the city I don't use the bus lanes, not because of the traffic light issue but because it's so f*****g hazardous. People pulling out from side streets and driveways have to briefly intrude into the bus lane (usually sprinting to out-accelerate a bus bearing down on them at great speed) to get into the traffic, and they pay no respect to anyone in doing so, least of all to MOTORCYCLES who they probably believe should not be in the bus lane anyway and who pose the least physical threat to them. On my last trip into town I had to take evasive action several times in the space of a few kilometres. Bastards just pull out as though you're invisible and as soon as there is the merest semblance of a gap. Better/safer in the normal lanes...

[vifferman]

On those admittedly (ahem..) rare occasions I take a bike along Great North Rd to the city I don't use the bus lanes, not because of the traffic light issue but because it's so f*****g hazardous.Not just the hazards you've outlined, but these: oil and diesel on the road, exhaust fumes, and being unable to see past the buses so you're aware of what potential hazards are ahead.
I gives me the anus-clenching heeby-jeebies when I commute on those very rare damp days we get in D'Auckland and I see the film of filth on the road (and that's just from other bikers using the transit lane!)
So I've taken to not taking the bike if it looks like I might get damp. No point in doing so, if the back tyre spins up instead of the front one elevating.:sly:

[That Guy]

Was he a bike cop?
I got abused (but not ticketed) by some frothy-mouthed shouty guy on an ST1100 for carefully lane-splitting past stopped cars. He got quite aggro, and yelled, "Maybe if you rode like a proper motorcyclist instead of an idiot, you'd stop giving the rest of us a bad name!!":mad:
I was flabbergasted (and I can tell you, I'm not at all fond of having my gast flabbered, no sirreee, JimBob), and to this day (after 4 years of consdering this) I'm still not sure WTF he meant by "riding like a proper motorcyclist". My best guess is: "Maybe if you pretended you were driving a car, ignored all the advantages and fun of bike ownership and riding, and sat in the traffic jams sucking up the noxious fumes, while talking on your cellphone, shaving, and having breakfast and reading the paper, instead of riding very carefully and safely while saving time, you would be adhering to my fascist view of life, have no life or friends, and be a total wanker like me!! So there!! Hmm hmmm!!" :whocares: :calm:

Yes he WAS a bike cop. 4 years later he obvioulsy still pissed at you and passed it on to me. Clearly he enjoys making people's gast's flabbered.

[Coldkiwi]

So I've taken to not taking the bike if it looks like I might get damp. No point in doing so, if the back tyre spins up instead of the front one elevating.:sly:

you wuss! thats what makes damp days on slimy roads so much fun. Get that rear end fish tailing away from the lights!

[ManDownUnder]

you wuss! thats what makes damp days on slimy roads so much fun. Get that rear end fish tailing away from the lights!

You'll bloody need to if you're at the top of Chinaman's hill with a bus up your butt and that "B" comes on...

... oh hang on, I don't think you're allowed to. Obey the law I say! Sure you'll get run over by a BUS (and and his mates behind him) but you'll have a very righteous funeral.

MDU

[ManDownUnder]

In short - no, do not proceed through the white "B" (I thought it were Green?) or you will get a ticket. (Check the URL in the email below... I think that answers the q!)

... course you COULD get mown down by the bus behind you - but that is what the law requires.

No go forth and be good citizens, or road kill, as the law requires. :buggerd:
MDU
=== this is quoted from the email (in fact it is the WHOLE email...)

I have received your further email asking to clarify the issue of motorcyclists using bus lanes.

The issuing of any fines is always at the discretion of the enforcement authorities. The Land Transport Safety Authority (LTSA) has no jurisdiction over infringements.

Bus lanes must show an image, symbol or words indicating that only buses can enter them. If the vehicle you're driving isn't shown, you can't use the lane (unless otherwise advised by the local District/City Council).

Under Section 18, (5)(k) of the Traffic Regulations 1976 it states:

(k) [While a white ``T'' on a black background or a white ``B'' on a black background is displayed, a driver of a light rail vehicle or omnibus] facing the traffic signal may—

(i)Travel straight ahead or turn right or turn left:

(ii)Turn to the right or to the left even though a traffic signal is displaying a red signal in the form of a disc:

Therefore, only the vehicles mentioned above are able to go when the "B" light signals to do so.

I have also attached a link to a page on the Road Code website, which advises that 'all other vehicles must wait for the appropriate green traffic signal'.
http://www.ltsa.govt.nz/roadcode/giving-way/controlled-intersections6.html

Regards

Christina Winitana
Senior Customer Service Representative

[ManDownUnder]

So then I wrote to the Minister of Transport Safety... Harry Duynhoven

I'll let you know if he writes back (I actually knew the guy out of hours - one of the few in that building I have any respect for...)

[rodgerd]

So then I wrote to the Minister of Transport Safety... Harry Duynhoven

I'll let you know if he writes back (I actually knew the guy out of hours - one of the few in that building I have any respect for...)

I remember even a lot of hard-core Nats in New Plymouth vote for him. Pretty impressive.