Biker stuck at lights… as he is too light!

[Bob]

Bikers in Sacramento found they were being delayed at the lights… and delayed… and delayed… until someone else came along and triggered them.

The reason? Local authorities had installed pressure-sensitive sensors to trigger the change of lights… but hadn’t taken into account the light weight of a motorcycle.

Embarrassed local officials have installed a ‘more sensitive controller’, allowing for increased capability of detecting metal. Rick Dondro, assistant director of the county Public Works Department said the old controller couldn't detect motorcycles because they contain less metal than cars. They have now asked local bikers to bring their bikes to the intersection to help them set the new controller to recognise bikes.

[xwhatsit]

Hehehe yeah been-there-done-that, haven't we all here in NZ?

I've just found a new one that doesn't even respond to my side-stand trick; the end of Epsom Ave, at the intersection with Gilles Ave. It's great fun holding a steady 55kph through the chicanes, but then you have to wait for the cages crawling along at 20kph to catch up with you and trigger the lights.

[sAsLEX]

Local authorities had installed pressure-sensitive sensors

Embarrassed local officials have installed a ‘more sensitive controller’, allowing for increased capability of detecting metal. Rick Dondro, assistant director of the county Public Works Department said the old controller couldn't detect motorcycles because they contain less metal than cars.

So do they measure weight or magnetic inductance?

[Bob]

Just been back and looked at my source information.

Doesn't make it clear, but it does initially refer to that fact that a "bike doesn't weigh enough to trigger the sensors that will turn the light green" - but then goes on to say "Rick Dondro, assistant director of the county Public Works Department, said a more sensitive controller recently was installed at the intersection, allowing for increased capability of detecting metal. He said the old controller couldn't detect motorcycles because they contain less metal than cars."

So - maybe - they had a weight-sensitive sensor, but then replaced that with a sensor that picks up on metal... but again blew it as it was calibrated to react to a much larger metal area/volume of metal?

Whatever happened, at least they're trying to get it right!

[Morcs]

Theres a set of lights by repco massey at westgate that never changes late at night... I end up sitting there for ages, then jumping the red...

Really pisses you off if you are one of those people who keeps in gear with clutch in at the lights, you wont put it into neutral as they will change 'any second'... your clutch hand soon diiiieeeeees...

[BMW]

Just been back and looked at my source information.
Doesn't make it clear, but it does initially refer to that fact that a "bike doesn't weigh enough to trigger the sensors that will turn the light green" - but then goes on to say "Rick Dondro, assistant director of the county Public Works Department, said a more sensitive controller recently was installed at the intersection, allowing for increased capability of detecting metal. He said the old controller couldn't detect motorcycles because they contain less metal than cars."

So - maybe - they had a weight-sensitive sensor, but then replaced that with a sensor that picks up on metal... but again blew it as it was calibrated to react to a much larger metal area/volume of metal?
Whatever happened, at least they're trying to get it right!


Most new lights use a sensor on top of the light ( you can see the 'yellow cone") and these do not pick up 'weight' or the magnetic parts of the bike.

Instead they project a 'cone' out from the light that looks for disturbances.

To trigger the light (try this at Westgate as last time it worked for me!) kill the engine and restart it.

This electromagnetic disturbance causes the cone to think there is something really big there! And makes the light have priority!

There is someplace a time frame you have to wait before running a red light.

Hope this helps!

[sAsLEX]

Most new lights use a sensor on top of the light ( you can see the 'yellow cone") and these do not pick up 'weight' or the magnetic parts of the bike.

Instead they project a 'cone' out from the light that looks for disturbances.

To trigger the light (try this at Westgate as last time it worked for me!) kill the engine and restart it.

This electromagnetic disturbance causes the cone to think there is something really big there! And makes the light have priority!




You contradict yourself there.

If it were a passive IR then doing that would have no effect..... unless it were the traditional inductive loop.

[SARGE]

i dont run the lights .. just feels wrong somehow .. but i have no problem riding up on the footpath and turning left .:rockon:

[nadroj]

Just sit there & pay back all those cage drivers who's colleague fucked up. 5 minutes is enough to get the point across & one of them will report it on your behalf.

[xwhatsit]

i dont run the lights .. just feels wrong somehow .. but i have no problem riding up on the footpath and turning left .:rockon:

<hints id="hah_hints"></hints>Hahah yes, I've been known to do the same thing on occasion :)

There's definitely something hard-wired into my brain that red light = bad. It takes a serious amount of frustration with just sitting there at night in the freezing cold before I am able to just go through the light -- even though I'd normally go through that intersection (with no lights, just a Stop sign) in a flash.

[Tim 39]

most in Dunedin have the pressure sensors, there are 4 squares on the road, if you park the whole bike on one of the squares it's enough to trigger them

[Sidewinder]

thats why you do stoppies at lights like our mate jade does. it put all the weight on the front and it will trigger it off!!!!!!!!!! click click make it click!!!!!!!

[lordandrevv]

from what i have heard there are some kind of sensors in the ground that detect metal. While mass has no effect on the sensor, the amount of metal above it does. If you have a look at big intersection on the bicycle lane, sometimes there are 3 triangles painted on the road. They represent a sensor that is sensitive enough to pick up a bicycle. That's what I've heard is used in CHC....

[cooneyr]

So do they measure weight or magnetic inductance?

Magnetic inductance in NZ


Most new lights use a sensor on top of the light ( you can see the 'yellow cone") and these do not pick up 'weight' or the magnetic parts of the bike.

Instead they project a 'cone' out from the light that looks for disturbances.

To trigger the light (try this at Westgate as last time it worked for me!) kill the engine and restart it.

This electromagnetic disturbance causes the cone to think there is something really big there! And makes the light have priority!

There is someplace a time frame you have to wait before running a red light.

Hope this helps!

Wrong those cones have nothing to do with detecting vehicles we use magnetic inductance loops


most in Dunedin have the pressure sensors, there are 4 squares on the road, if you park the whole bike on one of the squares it's enough to trigger them

Again wrong.


from what i have heard there are some kind of sensors in the ground that detect metal. While mass has no effect on the sensor, the amount of metal above it does. If you have a look at big intersection on the bicycle lane, sometimes there are 3 triangles painted on the road. They represent a sensor that is sensitive enough to pick up a bicycle. That's what I've heard is used in CHC....

The 3 diamonds just show you where to stop on a treadly. All loops should be capable of picking up a treadly or motorbike if you know where to stop. Sometimes however the loops get broken and dont work as well as they should.

All loops are actually a single loop of wire wound around the two squares in a figure 8 fashion. I'm not a electrical engineer but a civil eng so here is my interpretation - There is a small current flow through the loops that causes a magnetic field to be generated (physics 101) when the field is disturbed by the presence of a metallic object then the sensor senses.

If you stop on the sides of the squares that are touching i.e. middle line of the "loops" you should trigger the sensors. This is generally the center of the lane which treadlies very realy go near hence don't trigger the sensor. Bikes tend not to stop there either but if you do :D

See attached pic of where to stop.

Cheers R

[davereid]

The lights are supposed to change for a vehicle.

If they don't change they are faulty and you have the right to ignore the lights and use the right-hand rule. You don't have to do dodgy side stand actions or hop off and press the pedestrian cross button !

[cooneyr]

The lights are supposed to change for a vehicle.

If they don't change they are faulty and you have the right to ignore the lights and use the right-hand rule. You don't have to do dodgy side stand actions or hop off and press the pedestrian cross button !

Not true - a red light is a red light and at no time can you assume it is faulty and use the right hand rule. How do decide if a light is faulty? The only way you know a light faulty is if it flashing orange, then and only then do you apply the right hand rule.

Lights have two cycle actuation types either the presence of vehicle over the loops or fixed time. If the loops fail the lights will go to fixed time. Only if the signal controllers fail will the lights default to flashing orange. Lights may take a long time to change some times but this does not mean they have failed - there is a lot of effort put into getting the phases right and they are the way they are for a good reason.

The lights will change for bicycles or larger metal objects if you stop in the right place.

Cheers R

[davereid]

Nope, not true. I got a ticket for it on my scooter, went to court, JP or judge whatever he is took 2 minutes to dismiss it.

Its really simple - if the lights are supposed to do something, and they don't they are faulty.

How the technology works is irrelevant, and you don't have to sit there like a dork waiting for the lights to figure out they are faulty for themselves.

[cooneyr]

Nope, not true. I got a ticket for it on my scooter, went to court, JP or judge whatever he is took 2 minutes to dismiss it.

Its really simple - if the lights are supposed to do something, and they don't they are faulty.

How the technology works is irrelevant, and you don't have to sit there like a dork waiting for the lights to figure out they are faulty for themselves.

So how long do you wait?????? Special circumstance maybe for your ticket but I wouldn't promote the idea of people deciding that lights are faulty. The only way they can actually know is if the lights flash orange. You are taking your life into your own hands if you decide to ignore a red.

Maybe you just stopped in the wrong place i.e. not over a loop???

R

[davereid]

Yeah I had waited a fair while, and it was about 2am !

But imho ignoring lights after you have stopped and checked for traffic is perfectly safe - certainly much safer than going through them on the green assuming the other fella will stop.

[davereid]

But look left, right... and up..

[cooneyr]

Yeah I had waited a fair while, and it was about 2am !

But imho ignoring lights after you have stopped and checked for traffic is perfectly safe - certainly much safer than going through them on the green assuming the other fella will stop.

At 2am in the morning almost all signals are on call only. If the lights are green for one way, unless somebody comes along the other road the lights will not change. The only way you can call the lights in this situation is to position yourself correctly over the loops. I've did this many times on my way to work (back in 1999) at 5.30 in the morning on an ally framed treadly.

Cheers R

[rwh]

At 2am in the morning almost all signals are on call only. If the lights are green for one way, unless somebody comes along the other road the lights will not change. The only way you can call the lights in this situation is to position yourself correctly over the loops. I've did this many times on my way to work (back in 1999) at 5.30 in the morning on an ally framed treadly.

Cheers R

And since there's presumably no expectation that people should know this, I guess you're required to sit there till morning. Are you actually even allowed to reverse away from the intersection in order to find a parking spot? Or far enough to do a U-turn? I just hope it's one of those cases where any cop would use their discretion. I ran one of these the other night when any other option I could think of would have been more dangerous.

Richard

[cooneyr]

I just hope it's one of those cases where any cop would use their discretion. I ran one of these the other night when any other option I could think of would have been more dangerous.

One can only hope!

R

[FkNAmerican]

Yeah I get that shit all the time. The worst is after they repave a road. Mind you in America the average car weighs in a 3,500 lbs (8,900 lbs if there are two actual Americans inside eating a combo meal from Burger King) so a motorcycle doesnt have much of a chance now does it. I just stop for a bit in case a popo is watching and then slowly go through looking both ways.........never been stopped for it.