Workplace urine test

[Korumba]

Sent to me from the States I like the idea tho..........

URINE TEST

Like a lot of folks in this state, I have a job. I work, they pay me.

I pay my taxes and the government distributes my taxes as it sees fit. In order to get that paycheck, I am required to pass a random urine test with which I have no problem. What I do have a problem with is the distribution of my taxes to people who don't have to pass a urine test. Shouldn't one have to pass a urine test to get a welfare check because I have to pass one to earn it for them??
Please understand, I have no problem with helping people get back on their feet. I do on the other hand have a problem with helping someone sitting on their ass, doing drugs, while I work... Can you imagine how much money the state would save if people had to pass a urine test to get a public assistance check ?????

Pass this along if you agree or simply delete if you don't. Hope you
all will pass it along, though..... something has to change in this country and soon!!!

[Korumba]

Opps posted twice can a mod delete one. Thanks

[pyrocam]

Good Idea! random urine tests at the doll office would shape up the unemployment! Or drive them to gangs to get their money since they wont get it from the govt anymore

[Colapop]

I heard about a guy at South Pacific Tyres in Upper Hutt - was asked to take a urine test. Got called into the bosses office to discuss it... Apparently he stood up part way through the meeting told the boss to get fucked and pissed on his desk!

[Laava]

I heard about a guy at South Pacific Tyres in Upper Hutt - was asked to take a urine test. Got called into the bosses office to discuss it... Apparently he stood up part way through the meeting told the boss to get fucked and pissed on his desk!
Go the Hutt!!!:sunny:

[Drew]

I heard about a guy at South Pacific Tyres in Upper Hutt - was asked to take a urine test. Got called into the bosses office to discuss it... Apparently he stood up part way through the meeting told the boss to get fucked and pissed on his desk!

Did said piss then get tested for drugs? Sounds like a space cadet kinda thing to do. lol

I wonder if it would be legal to do random drug testing on the unemployed, a smarter person than me could write out the idea in political jargon and submit it to the powers that be.

I'll get the ball rolling,

To whome it may concern, DRUG TEST THE FUCKIN LOOSERS!!!

[Toaster]

Great idea.... I have no problem with people randomly testing urine at work (maybe I should rephrase that.... nah, beats the instant coffee).

It would be good to see all beneficiaries tested for booze and drugs before getting a handout from taxpayer funded benefits. I got sick of seeing dickheads doing crimes too and found to be on sickness benefits for 'depression' or ACC injuries - yet they ran from the cops??!!

[T-Thunder13]

if i get drug tested im ferked. i do work however

[Steam]

I'll get drug tested as soon as my boss does. He's a massive stoner although he denies it.

Beneficiaries should be drug tested only if all civil servants, MP's, and WINZ case managers are too. I'm paying their salaries, so I'd like to know they're doing the best job they can.

[Drew]

I'll get drug tested as soon as my boss does. He's a massive stoner although he denies it.

Beneficiaries should be drug tested only if all civil servants, MP's, and WINZ case managers are too. I'm paying their salaries, so I'd like to know they're doing the best job they can.

Yeah, but at least they are workin for the money, I'm pretty sure it's standard in all government contracts that drug testing can be carried out, but not sure if it's ever actually done.

[Grahameeboy]

Yeah, but at least they are workin for the money, I'm pretty sure it's standard in all government contracts that drug testing can be carried out, but not sure if it's ever actually done.

They let civil servants test drugs............:gob:

[Dave Lobster]

Yeah, but at least they are workin for the money.

Ha ha.. that's hilarious!

[DMNTD]

if i get drug tested im ferked....

Same....lucky I am the boss :sunny:

[Big Dave]

How many questions are on the drugs test?

I'm not worried about losers being on Social Security. They get a fuck-allth of what I pay in taxes anyway - all mine goes towards the roads. I sent a note with my last return.

[jrandom]

Pfft.

Getting stoned would have done the CEO at my previous employer a power of good.

I fully support drug testing of all senior executives in any company I work for or hold shares in, primarily to ensure that they're regularly doing something to ameliorate their uptight yuppieness.

[Deano]

The thing is......the clever dole bludgers progress to the sickness benefit, and in some cases....they even start taking heroine and submit a urine sample to prove to the doctor that they are a useless druggie that is unemployable.

I have seen someone do this. He went to the doctor pinged off his face, acted dumb, said he had low self esteem, scratched his face a bit and was restless, vacant look on his face (wasn't a difficult act for him anyway).

Bingo - straight off the dole and onto a sickness benefit. He still sits at home all day, wasted.

The bludgers learn off their mates how to work the system. And the system works for them........pisses me off paying to support these wasters.

[Steam]

... all mine [taxes] goes towards the roads. I sent a note with my last return.

What!! You can nominate where your taxes go?? Is that in the USA? What a brilliant idea.

[Mystery]

This is a great idea! It could give the term "P Dealer" a whole new meaning :yes:

[u4ea]

Even though I havnt worked for a while I am aware of drug testing.If they could determine how long since one had a puff as THC stays in the system 28 days then it would be better.I liken it to a glass of red in the evening or a whole bottle on the weekend..not in work time.
I wonder if beneficiaries were drug tested and refused welfare if proven positive would make the crime rate go up so they will get their fix by other means??
I am a little off topic now but....
If beneficiaries were tested it may stop our wee cherubs getting hurt as well??
I always rekon its a mentality thing..do we smoke ciggies or weed around our babies?do we leave empty bottles and cans and dirty ashtrays laying around?do we encourage our kids to be the best they can or be gangbangers?do we want our kids to be productive in society and give them the tools?..Adults who dont want to work wont as Deano has said but its the flowon effects to the next generation which worries me.

[Big Dave]

Pfft.

Getting stoned would have done the CEO at my previous employer a power of good.

I fully support drug testing of all senior executives in any company I work for or hold shares in, primarily to ensure that they're regularly doing something to ameliorate their uptight yuppieness.

I've noticed in some publishing houses the senior executives would be more likely to test the drugs than be drug tested.

[R1madness]

As an employer i support drug testing, but as a human being i support the freedom of choice. I dont care if my employee has a drink in the weekend or a puff, as long as they do not turn up to work wasted. After all pot was only banned in the face of pressure form alcohol and tabacco industries in the late 1920s in USA. They dont like compitition

[ManDownUnder]

This kinda is like user pays in NZ though. I pay for a lot of people on the dole... Can I use them?

What are the limits? Am I allowed to pick the cute female ones only or do I need a reasonable spread across all demographics?

I have a house to paint, gardens to be completed...

[The Pastor]

did u see that highly sienticific programme myth busters? they did drug tests after eating poppy seed bagles and failed for like 3 days after consumtion. it was on tv so it must be true.

the drug tested was opium.

[u4ea]

did u see that highly sienticific programme myth busters? they did drug tests after eating poppy seed bagles and failed for like 3 days after consumtion. it was on tv so it must be true.

the drug tested was opium.

What you talkin bout Willis????......Now the honest bagel is bad for your health.
:shutup:

[riffer]

I don't really care about the unemployed. Most of the time it's their choice. The government is going to take my taxes anyway so meh. Plenty of other things I'd rather they don't use my money for as well. Americas Cup to start with...

I don't take drugs so I don't give a shit about drug testing. Having to inject yourself six times a day kinda makes you over that.

How about we set up shooting galleries for all the addicts. Then give them uncut smack and sit back and watch Darwin's law take effect on the losers.

[Paul in NZ]

I'd be more into giving them all a smart card with some biometric ID in it so they can only claim ONE benefit....

[Mr. Peanut]

I'd rather they took the dole than my wallet. If a few spend it on drugs, so be it. It's worth it for the fact that there are a few who really need it.

[kro]

Get a pregnant womans pee, and submit that. That oughta raise a few eye brows.

[_Shrek_]

As an employer i support drug testing, but as a human being i support the freedom of choice. I dont care if my employee has a drink in the weekend or a puff, as long as they do not turn up to work wasted. After all pot was only banned in the face of pressure form alcohol and tabacco industries in the late 1920s in USA. They dont like compitition


i agree R1 i use to give the guys 6 weeks notice then go with them and do the test also
its hard to find good bushman on the east coast that dont smoke weed after work or on weekends
if their test proved + i would give them another test in 4 weeks and they had to pass... but if i caught them smoking in the morning or stoned @ work it was :bye::bye:

[Oakie]

Used to think it was a good idea but now that I'm an HR guy I'd probably be the poor schmuck who has to administer the tests at my work. Eewwww!

[Swoop]

I pay for a lot of people on the dole... Can I use them?

I have a house to paint, gardens to be completed...
Better ask the Paremoremo prison guards for clarification on this one....

[deanohit]

Very good Korumba. Its a very valid point and a bloody great idea. I am all for drug testing all the fuckers

[Eddieb]

I'd be more into giving them all a smart card with some biometric ID in it so they can only claim ONE benefit....

I was thinking about this the other day, rather than deposit the benefit into their account, credit it to a debit card that does not function at liqour king etc, gambling establishments and all the other crap some bludgers waste their money on, and doesn't allow cash withdrawls so everything benefit money is spent on can be monitored.

The idea stinks of Big Brother (Which I don't like normally) but if they want to be given money for nothing then there should be some control to ensure it's not squandered. Maybe don't do it for eveyone but have it as an option for those beneficeries who always claim they don't have enough to live on and need 'budget assistance' or are 'suspect'.

[pyrocam]

Write to your MP

MPs do listen to public opinion. So it is important that they hear from you. A courteous letter setting out your views can be very influential. Similarly, if your MP publicly says something you agree with relating to children and their interests, it is important to write and support them.

Most MPs have offices at both Parliament and at their electorate. You can write to them at either. They also have email.

To find out who your MP is and how to contact them go to: www.parliament.govt.nz/mps-and-ministers.html

If you decide to write a letter (‘snail’ mail) instead of email then remember you do not need to put a stamp on the envelope if it is sent to Parliament Buildings, Wellington .

Here are some basic rules when writing to an MP -
* Always be courteous
Remember you are trying to influence the MP’s thinking, not alienate them. So use courteous language. Don’t be sarcastic, judgmental, or question their motives.
* Don’t get emotive
You feel strongly enough to write to them. That carries weight, but it will also make it temnderstate rather than overstate. Don’t use exclamation marks, heavy underlining, italics, or bold font. And don’t write words in capitals to make your point ( GET IT!!!!!!!!)
* Keep to the point
Like all the rest of us, MPs are very busy people. They do want to know what you think on an issue but they don’t want to hear about several issues at the same time. For example, if you are writing to express your concern about the high level of child poverty in New Zealand then keep to that subject, even though you think something needs to be done about school truancy levels also.
* Keep it short
This is related to point three above. Books have been written about child poverty and much research has been done on the subject. You don’t need to convey all that information in your letter. Your MP is most interested to hear that you think ending child poverty should be a policy priority for the incoming government.
* State the purpose of the letter at the beginning


It is useful also to give your letter a heading that sets out what the subject of the letter is, e.g.,

Incoming government must end child poverty in NZ

“I am writing to tell you that I think the levels of child poverty in New Zealand unacceptable …”


please post your letters so we can blatantly rip them off to our MP's also



edit: that link is out of date, here is another http://www.parliament.nz/NR/rdonlyres/5858C8A5-ACDF-4B35-8D7A-3ABB7B19ACDB/59881/listofmembers300708.pdf

[ManDownUnder]

Checked - and this is either a repost (in PD) or not... but it's worth a discussion..!

Edit - this is simply a cut and paste. I like the sentiment but haven't edited it - just chucked it up for comment.

I work, they pay me. I pay my taxes and the government distributes my taxes as it sees fit. In order to earn that pay cheque, as I work in the timber industry, I am required to pass a random urine test, with which I have no problem in passing .

What I do have a problem with is the distribution of my taxes to people who don't have to pass a urine test. Shouldn't one have to pass a urine test to get a welfare cheque because I have to pass one to earn it for them??

Please understand – I have no problem with helping people get back on their feet.

I do on the other hand have a problem with helping someone sit on their arse drinking piss & smoking dope all day.

Could you imagine how much money the state would save if people had to pass a urine test to get a DPB cheque???

Please pass this along if you agree or simply delete if you don't.

Hope you all will pass it along though, because something has to change in this country, and soon!

[justsomeguy]

Very fair comment. I don't see why we need the damn dole anyway for able bodied people.

Only people with physical or mental problems who can't work in mainstream society should get the dole.

Or if they have to give able bodied people the dole, the payments should decrease by 5-10% every week.

[Maha]

[FONT=Arial]I work, they pay me. I pay my taxes and the government distributes my taxes as it sees fit. In order to earn that pay cheque,

Na see ya lost me already Ned...that sounds to much like..My Mothers Uncles Kids Best Friend....:wacko:...its been a long week!...

[Highlander]

Na see ya lost me already Ned...that sounds to much like..My Mothers Uncles Kids Best Friend....:wacko:...its been a long week!...

Are you confused or what? He means my mothers son, who also just happens to be my wifes husband.

[Storm]

He means, dont do drugs mmmkay, drugs are bad.

IE if you are wasting the hard working folks money, (not to mention valuable oxygen) being a lazy c&%t on drugs, you can bloody well work for the money to pay for them.

[Blondini]

You can receive a sickness benefit for being an alcoholic or a drug user:yes:Go figure

[Mom]

You can receive a sickness benefit for being an alcoholic or a drug user:yes:Go figure

Yes you can, Alcoholism is a disease! trust me I was raised by one/two.

I have had tenants on sickness benefits, their only illness being booze. Sad but necessary to provide some support for these people.

I really wish I had the answers mate!

[LilSel]

He means, dont do drugs mmmkay -unless you can afford them? lol



You can receive a sickness benefit for being an alcoholic or a drug user:yes:Go figure - omg...:gob:... thats a bit... weird!!... Here's some money... go get another bottle, nevermind working to earn $$ to pay for it yourself.




I really wish I had the answers mate! I think a lot of people wish they had the answers too...

... I agree with the general jist of 'drug test for DPB'...

[Mom]

... I agree with the general jist of 'drug test for DPB'...

I totally disagree with drug testing DPB beneficiaries!! The tests that should be done are to parenting skills, lifestyle etc. If parenting skills are not up to a standard then extra support needs to be put in place to ensure things work as well as they possibly can.

The reason a DPB is paid is to support the children, they are the treasures that should come first!

Cant imagine a society that says no to a drug positive parent that has kids to support

[LilSel]

I totally disagree with drug testing DPB beneficiaries!! The tests that should be done are to parenting skills, lifestyle etc. If parenting skills are not up to a standard then extra support needs to be put in place to ensure things work as well as they possibly can.

The reason a DPB is paid is to support the children, they are the treasures that should come first!

I speak of the 'general jist'... surely those parenting skills etc would be affected if the parents were stoners??

[Mom]

I speak of the 'general jist'... surely those parenting skills etc would be affected if the parents were stoners??

Yes of course! But you can not deny financial support for struggling families, it is about supporting them. Support being the operative word here, takes more than a bit of weekly financial assistance to ensure our children are safe.

[LilSel]

Yes of course! But you can not deny financial support for struggling families, it is about supporting them. Support being the operative word here, takes more than a bit of weekly financial assistance to ensure our children are safe.

:yes: I agree... Here's hoping some proactive changes come into place to help keep children safer. Sick of seeing the headlines of late.
A few bad apples...

[Grahameeboy]

Very fair comment. I don't see why we need the damn dole anyway for able bodied people.

Some people are able bodied but unemployable.

Only people with physical or mental problems who can't work in mainstream society should get the dole.

You run risk of these folk not getting work and / or making it easier for the Govt to pay dole than spend money helping these folk get jobs. I would like my Daughter to work if she lives than long.........she is mentally alert but just cannot weight bear so some employers make be wary.


Or if they have to give able bodied people the dole, the payments should decrease by 5-10% every week.

And make them destitute after 10 weeks....what does that achieve.

There is no easy answer but penalising those less fortunate than us is not gonna achieve anything.

..........................

[paturoa]

So lets have a conversation that includes a distinction between those who need support, and a'holes who don't.

Trying to justify / validate giving my hard earnt money, to a'holes who don't, by using examples of those who genuinely need my support, is illogical, and at best a waste of electrons.

I know one, he is my brother (sort of rhymes with stoner?),... anyway several times over the years he told me that he was bored with working (or whatever), so he regularly went back on the dole. He kept telling me what is (un)employment status was until one day I told him what I realy thought. It was quite a short conversation.

To this day he never mentions it .....

So for me, the real issue is here is how do we tell the difference between the two.

Drug testing seems a good suggestion to me to start to find the difference. There are probably some others too but that would be off topic?

[Maha]

Are you confused or what? He means my mothers son, who also just happens to be my wifes husband.

Now that i understand completely....:yes:

[Zuki Bandit]

Amen to that mate. You hit the nail on the head!!!:yes:

[kiwifruit]

http://www.passthetest.com/

[paturoa]

http://www.passthetest.com/

Did you see the footnote, this was actualy copied from the Chinese Olympic Committee website.

Edit: ahh - I miss the cut and thrust of a pointless Finn, the_dover or Winja post on topics like this!

[kiwifruit]

Did you see the footnote, this was actualy copied from the Chinese Olympic Committee website.

:lol: :lol:

[deanohit]

Me, I'm was bored with my previous jobs, but I didnt go on the dole, I used a part of my savings to take 6 monthes off. When that ran out I worked until I'd topped up the savings again and had saved enough for some time off again. Me I can work and afford to do what I want and would rather not go on the benefit. I recently gave a mate of mine a rev up about how he hadnt held a job for very long in the 3 years after he left school. He was just bludging of his parents and the dole. We went and found him a job as a decky on a boat within a week and hes a new guy now, not bored, can afford to fix his car and still has money in his pocket. I'm all for drug testing people on the benefit unless you have a good and valid reason such as been a caregiver or something.

[justsomeguy]

..........................

Fair points.

Your daughter can work according to what you say and personally I hope she does find something she enjoys when she is ready and works till she happily retires of old age.

I'm talking about the lowlifes who should work but can't. I've cleaned toilets, flipped burgers and done what it takes in my day, there are always jobs available for those willing to work and willing to put the effort in.

Sure, there are exceptions but there are plenty of people as smart and capable as you who choose to sit on the dole. Maybe 5% a month is more appropriate a drop off.

[justsomeguy]

Me, I'm was bored with my previous jobs, but I didnt go on the dole, I used a part of my savings to take 6 monthes off. When that ran out I worked until I'd topped up the savings again and had saved enough for some time off again. Me I can work and afford to do what I want and would rather not go on the benefit. I recently gave a mate of mine a rev up about how he hadnt held a job for very long in the 3 years after he left school. He was just bludging of his parents and the dole. We went and found him a job as a decky on a boat within a week and hes a new guy now, not bored, can afford to fix his car and still has money in his pocket. I'm all for drug testing people on the benefit unless you have a good and valid reason such as been a caregiver or something.

If you don't mind me asking what do you do? Can't be all that bad if you can save that much :)

[deanohit]

If you don't mind me asking what do you do? Can't be all that bad if you can save that much :)

Was building and landscaping. Work my arse off doin long hours and save as much as I can. Dont drink much and no drugs, ciggies or girlfriend, so I live pretty cheap.

[TLMAN]

I think they should start giving out vouchers instead of hard cash, for supermarkets and the warehouse etc, and they should pay the rent money straight to the landllord or housing nz.

[rwh]

I work, they pay me. I pay my taxes and the government distributes my taxes as it sees fit. In order to earn that pay cheque, as I work in the timber industry, I am required to pass a random urine test, with which I have no problem in passing .

What I do have a problem with is the distribution of my taxes to people who don't have to pass a urine test. Shouldn't one have to pass a urine test to get a welfare cheque because I have to pass one to earn it for them??

I don't have to pass a urine test; nor AIUI do most of the working population. I assume the reason someone in the timber industry does is for safety reasons. There are no special safety issues with either sitting on the couch or looking for work.


Please understand – I have no problem with helping people get back on their feet.

I do on the other hand have a problem with helping someone sit on their arse drinking piss & smoking dope all day.

Sure, that's a problem. But that's different from cutting off their money, and therefore their ability to live.


Please pass this along if you agree or simply delete if you don't.


Ha. That's a recipe for a nice balanced discussion. Not.

That's the main reason I join in these political discussions - otherwise a casual observer could conclude that my opinions are in line with the majority of kiwibiker expressed opinions. I live in hope that there are many who disagree with those expressed opinons who can't be bothered or can't see the point in disagreeing.

Richard

[rwh]

Only people with physical or mental problems who can't work in mainstream society should get the dole.


There are varying degrees of such problems.

As soon as you label someone (or insist that they declare themselves) as having a "mental problem", for one thing you'll reduce their self-esteem and probably make the problem worse, and for another make it much harder to get a job in the future - who'd want to employ someone with a 'mental problem'?

For example: I have spent time on the dole (though not spending it on drink or drugs) with motivational problems, but I'm not permanently unemployable.

Richard

[TLMAN]

I don't have to pass a urine test; nor AIUI do most of the working population. I assume the reason someone in the timber industry does is for safety reasons. There are no special safety issues with either sitting on the couch or looking for work.

Sure, that's a problem. But that's different from cutting off their money, and therefore their ability to live.

Their ability to live should come form working and holding down a stable job not getting cushy with a dole check as a lifestyle choice.

[rwh]

I think they should start giving out vouchers instead of hard cash, for supermarkets and the warehouse etc, and they should pay the rent money straight to the landllord or housing nz.

Warehouse vouchers? I can imagine the competition having a bit of a fit at that idea (ok there's the 'etc', but I assume you still mean 'cheap') ...

Sure the Warehouse has some good deals, but there's also times you'd be better off spending a little more somewhere else - once - to avoid spending a little repeatedly. See many of Robert Taylor's posts, that people here mostly seem to agree with ...

I'm not sure I'd find a decent suit to go job hunting in at one of those cheap shops, either.

Richard

[imdying]

Very fair comment. I don't see why we need the damn dole anyway for able bodied people.When I finished my degree, I was on the dole for two weeks before I found a job... I was pretty financially drained by that stage, so it kept me going for the brief time I need it.

[TLMAN]

Warehouse vouchers? I can imagine the competition having a bit of a fit at that idea (ok there's the 'etc', but I assume you still mean 'cheap') ...

Sure the Warehouse has some good deals, but there's also times you'd be better off spending a little more somewhere else - once - to avoid spending a little repeatedly. See many of Robert Taylor's posts, that people here mostly seem to agree with ...

I'm not sure I'd find a decent suit to go job hunting in at one of those cheap shops, either.

Richard


Did you miss the point?

What the discussion is about is that many people on the dole spend their money on drugs piss and smokes instead of providing the fundamentals for themselves and their children.
They cant be trusted to make the right choice with their money so the choice should be taken from them and they will be forced to spend their dole allowance on the correct things through use of vouchers that can be spent at pre determined stores like supermarkets and department stores like the warehouse etc etc.

And whats this "See many of Robert Taylor's posts, that people here mostly seem to agree with ..." do you speak for all the people here:stupid:

[MSTRS]

...
Sure, that's a problem. But that's different from cutting off their money, ...

...

Whose money??

[ManDownUnder]

Whose money??

oooOOOooo harsh words.... hard to fault though.

Yes. Vouchers for food and drink, power and water. Everyone needs the essentials - I have no problems with that.... so supply them in non negotiable currency.

Beyond that what's left get's paid in cash. Which has to be worked for incidentally. User pays.

The State (i.e. those of us paying tax) pays them... we get to benefit from them. Work to do people... into the Army to get some training, skills and discipline then off you go... work work work. Not nice cushy work either. Some of the crap people don't really want to do.

This ain't no holiday camp. And if it's dangerous work where everyone depends on everyone else being fully compus mentis... drug test away. Find drugs, lose that job... back to a lower paid one.

If they can't afford to live in Auckland then c'est la vie - they move to somewhere they can afford.

I'm not saying this to win friends - this is the cruel reality of the financial world. You put out, you get back. You no put out, you no get back.

No income = no niceties in life... and God forbid they even THINK about crime. Money saved on the dole goes straight to the cops. Pay rises all round for them... more cops, better equipped and better trained.

Bust any theiving little bastards, put 'em through boot camp... kick some more sense and discipline into them. Nothing brutal, but put them into the Army to drag their sorry arses out of bed at 5:00 and go milk cows or anything that makes them think twice about doing that shit again!

Kinda like a boot camp merry go round. They can choose to get off any time at all - just get a job! I did. Was easy enough. Just find something that's not above your station (you don't climb a ladder from the top...). Start with that and GO!


*ding* next!

[rwh]

Did you miss the point?

What the discussion is about is that many people on the dole spend their money on drugs piss and smokes instead of providing the fundamentals for themselves and their children.
They cant be trusted to make the right choice with their money so the choice should be taken from them and they will be forced to spend their dole allowance on the correct things through use of vouchers that can be spent at pre determined stores like supermarkets and department stores like the warehouse etc etc.

With respect, I think you missed mine. There are cases in which "department stores like the warehouse" are not the right choice. And the fact that someone on is on the dole does not imply that they're incapable of making their own decisions (and nor does it imply that they're spending their money on "drugs piss and smokes").


And whats this "See many of Robert Taylor's posts, that people here mostly seem to agree with ..." do you speak for all the people here:stupid:

How do you figure that one? For starters, the word "most" clearly doesn't mean the sameas "all"; and it should be clear that I'm summarising what it appears (ie it's my interpretation) to be the majority view. And obviously I'm not 'speaking for' people, since it should be clear that this is an opinion that I disagree with. Finally I don't appreciate the personal insult (this one: :stupid: in case you didn't get that).

Richard

[scumdog]

oooOOOooo harsh words.... hard to fault though.
Yes. Vouchers for food and drink, power and water. Everyone needs the essentials - I have no problems with that.... so supply them in non negotiable currency.

No income = no niceties in life... and God forbid they even THINK about crime.

Sound like what it's like in South Dakota already (and other States I cannot recall.
Also in California if you get parole?
It's just like prison, cops can search your room without warrant etc etc, you have bugger all rights different to those in prison.
You dont' like those rules? Feel free to return to prison.

[rwh]

Yes. Vouchers for food and drink, power and water. Everyone needs the essentials - I have no problems with that.... so supply them in non negotiable currency.

Beyond that what's left get's paid in cash. Which has to be worked for incidentally. User pays.

Which will leave them with stuff all time or energy to look for proper work, or money for respectable clothes to do it in, or internet access to send off their email applications, or ...

Now let's think about the person just out of university - fees subsidised by the government, because we don't want people stuck unfairly at their parents' income level, right? - who under your regime will have to take the first labouring job available, since they shouldn't be slacking around on the dole - so they're now paying a little bit of tax on their low-paying job, instead of paying more tax on a job they might have to search for a month or two to get. How is that efficient use of taxpayers' money?



The State (i.e. those of us paying tax) pays them... we get to benefit from them. Work to do people... into the Army to get some training, skills and discipline then off you go... work work work. Not nice cushy work either. Some of the crap people don't really want to do.

Ah. I get it. Unemployed people are inherently inferior, and need punishing for the fact that businesses that could use their skills might not need to employ anybody at the moment. And possibly for their parents' low income as well. Did I get that right?


I'm not saying this to win friends - this is the cruel reality of the financial world. You put out, you get back. You no put out, you no get back.

Right. The sooner we get rid of this 'money rules everything' system, the better IMHO.


No income = no niceties in life... and God forbid they even THINK about crime. Money saved on the dole goes straight to the cops. Pay rises all round for them... more cops, better equipped and better trained.

Bust any theiving little bastards, put 'em through boot camp... kick some more sense and discipline into them. Nothing brutal, but put them into the Army to drag their sorry arses out of bed at 5:00 and go milk cows or anything that makes them think twice about doing that shit again!

Kinda like a boot camp merry go round. They can choose to get off any time at all - just get a job! I did. Was easy enough. Just find something that's not above your station (you don't climb a ladder from the top...). Start with that and GO!


*ding* next!

Hmm. Maybe you were being sarcastic? It gets hard to tell sometimes ... hopefully my effort at sarcasm was clear enough.

Richard

[ManDownUnder]

Na mate - the sarcasm was loud and clear... rather than fight with words - let me clarify my position.

My overall "aim" would be to get people into work, to bolster their economy and that of the nation as a whole. That said - I'll address points raised - they obviously point out flaws or omissions in my original post.


Which will leave them with stuff all time or energy to look for proper work, or money for respectable clothes to do it in, or internet access to send off their email applications, or ...


I hear you and no - that would simply defeat what I'm aiming for. Anyone looking for work gets that as top priority. That's the key to get out of the training and discipline cycle (and by discipline I'm not talking the punishment sense. Literally the discipline to get out of bed in the morning, to respect your neighbour, to rely on others and be reliable yourself. To some that may be "punishment" in which case... they need it!)


Now let's think about the person just out of university - fees subsidised by the government, because we don't want people stuck unfairly at their parents' income level, right? - who under your regime will have to take the first labouring job available, since they shouldn't be slacking around on the dole - so they're now paying a little bit of tax on their low-paying job, instead of paying more tax on a job they might have to search for a month or two to get. How is that efficient use of taxpayers' money?

It's the first step on the ladder. It's the very ladder I am climbing and funnily enough you have very closely described my life as an apprentice at my first job. I did my time, learned respect and discipline, and also learned there are ugly jobs out there that while they were "beneath me" as a fitter at a power station, it didn't meant they could be ignored.

Grit on the ground meant wear on the engines if it hit the air intakes... so someone had to sweep around the units. Fun? No. Essential? Yes.

Combine that with my first point of economic improvement being the goal and you will get the lower end, unskilled jobs being done by people who are either happy to do them, or those that haven't found their next calling yet. It means they are employed, and contributing in the meantime though.

Also note... at no point did I ever say the world owes you a living. It doesn't. I have that degree you refer to, and combined with my experience as an apprentice I knew that. I started low, aimed high and started climbing. I'm making it. It's not always been easy but it's always been in a forward direction. Always will be.

I'm young enough (38), successful in my chosen field and now dedicate a portion of my time to helping up those around me. I guess it's a bit of a crusade for me because it annoys the crap out of me when people don't understand the basics.

You don't leave Uni and walk into a plumb job. You start your climb from the bottom of the ladder.
The world does NOT owe you a living.
If you're not willing to push the broom yourself, what's going to happen with person who does rings in sick?
It's nice the State helps those in need, but never confuse "in need" for "needy". Two very different things.
You are ALWAYS free to improve your lot.
The cards will not always fall face up. Stand up, brush yourself off... have another go.
Honesty and integrity stand the test of time. Deceipt and selfishness don't.


On those points... there's a young guy on here that is doing the best he can and starting to make his way in life. He has a few things against him at the moment... so does he lie down and give up? I haven't seen him do it yet.

He's needed a kick in the pants from time to time (as we all do), and when he's ready he does something about it. skidMark is that man. I have a lot of time for him despite dishing out shit to him on a regular basis.


Ah. I get it. Unemployed people are inherently inferior, and need punishing for the fact that businesses that could use their skills might not need to employ anybody at the moment. And possibly for their parents' low income as well. Did I get that right?
LOL nice dig and no.

I have a rule that education and intelligence should never (EVER) be confused. Judging a book by the cover of another is just plain stupid. Employment status simply reflects the effectiveness of an inidividual trying to match their offerings with the needs of industry. My thought is to assist those with the skills meet those needing them. Training, discipline and job hunting are all focussed on exactly that.

If the job on offer isn't one that suits my primary skills (i.e. isn't one I want to ideally do) then I take it and do it while I seek my ideal job... again - a mirror of my current career path. Trust me - it works and works well.

Let's turn that on it's head. I promise you I will never be on the dole a day in my life. Why? Because if I lost my job, I'd have my CV in every recruitment agency in the top 1/2 of the NI and I'd be sweeping streets if I had to in order to keep my family fed. ... and yes I am serious... The concept of a job being "beneath" someone... beneath ANYONE ... is abhorrent. If there is a job that needs doing, and I have nothing else to do - why would I not do it? Why SHOULD I not do it?


Right. The sooner we get rid of this 'money rules everything' system, the better IMHO.

Agreed, the US system sucks. Money runs politics (political sponsorship), affects people's health (them with the biggest advertising budgets sell more of their drugs... rather than the patient getting the most appropriate treatment), remedies all social ills (you punch me, I sue you - but that $5,000 award doesn't take the pain away), and passes the blame onto those with money rather than those actually responsible (In the US... person A shoots person B and who gets sued? The gun maker - because that's where the money is!!!!)

I'm actually talking about the economic benefit to the country and individuals. The ability of the country to produce more and have a more powerful producing workforce because we don't have the financial drain of those that find it too easy sitting back lounging around while drinking from the State tit. This frees money for the internal services - Police, Infrastructure, Health, Education which in turn benefits those using those systems (free health and education... not bad things right?)

At the inidividual level people are contributing, have pride in themselves and their communities. They stop the naval gazing and selfishness that's somehow crept in over the last 50 years, and if we see a neighbour that needs help doing something, we have the moxy, discipline, and resources to actually pop over and help.

People will benefit financially, socially, and (what's the word...?) from a charater growth perspective... integrity I guess.

I see those traits in my father and my Uncles and Aunts. I see it in a number of people, but I see it being knocked out of large sections of some communities. The dole kicks in, it's easier and more lucrative to have a baby and go on the DPB, their young life will be "complete" because there is a lack of other potential - of other inspiration - and of love. That self worth isn't there, and it's contagious because the dole and drugs etc are so lucrative to people without hope and with too much idle time on their hands.

That particular cancer has to be exorcised... and as with cancer, each successive generation gets more and more entrenched. Tough love will be needed in spots. People will need to be pried out of their comfy places and back into the unfamiliar. I have no problem with that.


Hmm. Maybe you were being sarcastic? It gets hard to tell sometimes ... hopefully my effort at sarcasm was clear enough.

Richard

Sorry for the rant - I hope it clarifies.

[Mr Merde]

A very interesting discussion.

I will reserve my input for a day to better clarify my thoughts.


Just a small point.

During the depression in the early 1930's didnt the government create work for a lot of people. The forestry industry springs to mind. They planted millions of pine trees and basicall started our forestry industry.

My granddad was one of those people. He had to leave his kids in an orphanage (grannie died of TB) and follow the work.

I suppose there was a higher work ethic in those days and much less reliance upon a "nanny state" looking after you from cradle to grave.

Merde

[deanohit]

Let's turn that on it's head. I propmise you I will never be on the dole a day in my life. Why? Because if I lost my job, I'd have my CV in every recruitment agency in the top 1/2 of the NI and I'd be sweeping streets if I had to in order to keep my family fed. ... and yes I am serious... The concept of a job being "beneath" someone... beneath ANYONE ... is abhorrent. If there is a job that needs doing, and I have nothing else to do - why would I not do it?

Bloody good one mate and something too many people dont do which is a big part of the whole problem been disscussed here.

[Pancakes]

Did you miss the point?

What the discussion is about is that many people on the dole spend their money on drugs piss and smokes instead of providing the fundamentals for themselves and their children.
They cant be trusted to make the right choice with their money so the choice should be taken from them and they will be forced to spend their dole allowance on the correct things through use of vouchers that can be spent at pre determined stores like supermarkets and department stores like the warehouse etc etc.

And whats this "See many of Robert Taylor's posts, that people here mostly seem to agree with ..." do you speak for all the people here:stupid:

I think he means that those on the dole should be able to buy top notch suspension? What a fricken joke!! I totally agree with the vouchers etc idea not for people with extra or out of the ordinary issues with finding work but definatly for people who just don't want to take the work thats going and build on things from there. It's not about making the kids suffer at all. In fact, they'll be better off if mum spends the money at the supermarket instead of the pub and I'm pretty sure thats the train of thought among the majority of supporters of this idea.

[rwh]

I think he means that those on the dole should be able to buy top notch suspension? What a fricken joke!!

I mean they should be able to buy a decent pair of pyjamas that won't catch fire or poison them with formaldehyde.

Richard

[Pancakes]

I mean they should be able to buy a decent pair of pyjamas that won't catch fire or poison them with formaldehyde.

Richard

You think your $100 Nike T-shirt isn't made in China!?:whocares:

[rwh]

You think your $100 Nike T-shirt isn't made in China!?:whocares:

What $100 Nike T-shirt?

Perhaps you were using it as an example, much as I was.

The point is that one should have some choice in what to buy, in order to avoid buying crap that isn't really fit for the purpose, or won't last very long. Vouchers for cheap shops mean you might end up having to buy 3 items to last the same time as one from somewhere decent, that only costs twice as much. Whether it's a shock or a vacuum cleaner is pretty irrelevant, really.

BTW I wouldn't spend $5 on a Nike T-shirt. Last time I bought a T-shirt with stuff written all over it, yes it was from the Warehouse - but it was because I needed something to clean my car with. Turns out it was hopeless for that, too ...

Richard

[scumdog]

BTW I wouldn't spend $5 on a Nike T-shirt. Last time I bought a T-shirt with stuff written all over it, yes it was from the Warehouse - but it was because I needed something to clean my car with. Turns out it was hopeless for that, too ...

Richard


Sell the car.
Sorted.

[Pancakes]

What $100 Nike T-shirt?

Perhaps you were using it as an example, much as I was.

The point is that one should have some choice in what to buy, in order to avoid buying crap that isn't really fit for the purpose, or won't last very long. Vouchers for cheap shops mean you might end up having to buy 3 items to last the same time as one from somewhere decent, that only costs twice as much. Whether it's a shock or a vacuum cleaner is pretty irrelevant, really.

BTW I wouldn't spend $5 on a Nike T-shirt. Last time I bought a T-shirt with stuff written all over it, yes it was from the Warehouse - but it was because I needed something to clean my car with. Turns out it was hopeless for that, too ...

Richard

Your a crazy fool! Cheap clothes are synthetic, you need a cotton rag to clean your car and not one with writing on it (unless it's got really nice paint then you need the right cleaning stuff) why would you buy a t-shirt to clean your car? You don't have any rags at all?

Yeah I was using it as an example. I'm not talking about stuff that will last long, I'm talking about stuff that will last long enough to get you into a job and up to your first pay. This isn't supposed to be the amount of money you need to have a great lifestyle (the dole, not DPB or sickness etc, they are very different) it's supposed to stop you starving while your job hunting.

[u4ea]

I think they should start giving out vouchers instead of hard cash, for supermarkets and the warehouse etc, and they should pay the rent money straight to the landllord or housing nz.

I absolutly agree with that.Having been on the DPB (sons father used to beat me) and working part time I have seen many a beneficiary neglecting their responsibilities.Even though the Working For Families packages are great now many don't care about work.They have a great lifestyle collecting the benefit and pissing it up and paying their tick bills or popping out another kid to pay for the lifestyle.With rights come responsibilities and that is the point to me.If the government payed for drug testing beneficiaries and funded rehabilitation programmes for long term unemployed(dispenation from work for caregivers,illness or some damm good reason) who tested positive then stopped payments after the programme had finished.That would give folk plenty of time to collect benefit and sort their shit out.Would cost the government in the interum but save them heaps in the long run I'm sure.

[B0000M]

Message from a hard-working Kiwi

I work, they pay me. I pay my taxes and the government distributes my taxes
as it sees fit. In order to earn that pay cheque, as I work in the
timber industry, I am required to pass a random urine test, with which I
have no problem in passing .

What I do have a problem with is the distribution of my taxes to people who
don't have to pass a urine test. Shouldn't one have to pass a urine test
to get a welfare cheque because I have to pass one to earn it for them??

Please understand – I have no problem with helping people get back on their
feet.

I do on the othe r hand have a problem with helping someone sit on their arse
drinking piss & smoking dope all day.

Could you imagine how much money the state would save if people had to pass
a urine test to get a WINZ cheque???

Please pass this along if you agree or simply delete if you don't.

Hope you all will pass it along though, because something has to change
in this country, and soon!

[Jantar]

Posts about this being a repost have been moved to the repost thread http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=36107

[yod]

this is in jokes and humour?

[Finn]

Yeah, why did you put this in Jokes and Humour?

[B0000M]

Yeah, why did you put this in Jokes and Humour?

i found it humourous, thought someone else might too

[scumdog]

i found it humourous, thought someone else might too

Love that pic re 'unmarked car' as your sig.

I just LOVE being the object in your pic - the look on the face of somebody who had just done something dumb (that they wouldn't have had a marked car been around) when they get pulled up is priceless!!

Mwahahah "Shit, where did YOU come from?" is the most common greeting from them.

Back on topic...............

[Boob Johnson]

With a Urine test...


This was written by a rigworker off the Taranaki Coast


-------------------------------------------------------------------------
I work, they pay me. I pay my taxes and the government distributes my taxes as it sees fit.


In order to earn that pay cheque, I work on a rig for a drilling contractor.
I am required to pass a random urine test, with which I have no problem.


What I do have a problem with is the distribution of my taxes to people who don't have to pass a urine test. Shouldn't one have to pass a urine test to get a WINZ cheque because I have to pass one to earn it for them?


Please understand that I have no problem with helping people get back on their feet. I do on the other hand have a problem with helping someone sit on their ass drinking beer and smoking dope.


Could you imagine how much money the government would save if people had to pass a urine test to get a WINZ cheque?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------





Halving the dole queue would obviously be a good idea on paper but where would these people go for their next meal? <_<


One would imagine the crime rate would go through the roof!

[Bren]

Bloody good idea...I would back that 100%

[3umph]

agreed :2thumbsup but down side is that crime rate would most likely rise quite considerably...

[Hitcher]

I think he's taking the piss.

[Mully]

but down side is that crime rate would most likely rise quite considerably...

Nah, cos with the money you save, you give people who earn their money guns with which to defend their hard-earned possessions. Then you dig a big hole and chuck the bodies in there to fertilise the soil.

Ohhhh, ohhhh...... Vigilantes!!!!! Bags me for commanding a unit!!!

[3umph]

I think he's taking the piss.

maybe but it is a good idea:niceone:

[Mom]

I am hunting around for work at the moment, I need extra hours. On the spur of the moment I went into the WINZ office here in town to see if they had anything on their books. They had 2 vacancies, one for a farm hand (live in) so not for me, the other was a sales job. I talked to the work broker there, she was pleased to have someone that she could actually put forward for the vacancy as the employer requires a police check to be done on candidates. She has maybe one client that she can say would pass a police check. So there is another reason that people languish on the dole.

I used to take staff from WINZ via their subsidised wages schemes, the broker I worked with at the time said she was unable to place the majority of her "clients" as they were simply not fit for work, she used to transfer them to disability benefit so her unemployed figures looked better.

Yes to drugs checks, but we still have to support these people. Vouchers for food and clothing, rent, power and the like paid directly to landlords is a better way to go, than simply paying cash for the wasters that some of them are to spend as they see fit, leaving kids hungry and bills unpaid.

[3umph]

When I have been looking for staff I went through WINZ (worst thing I ever did) and the applicants that I got sent were only there to say they had been to the interview and also seemed by there dress and attitude that they had no intentions to actually get the job and work...

[Mom]

When I have been looking for staff I went through WINZ (worst thing I ever did) and the applicants that I got sent were only there to say they had been to the interview and also seemed by there dress and attitude that they had no intentions to actually get the job and work...

Years ago we advertised for a parts/sales person for our bike shop through WINZ or whatever it was called then. I had this scruffy bloke scuff into the shop and put a piece of paper on the counter and ask "can you sign this for me?" When I asked him what it was he told me it was the form that had to go back to WINZ to say he hap appplied for the job. I refused to sign it.

He got a tad pissed off really and started yelling about how he would have his benefit stopped if I did not sign it. Tough luck mate. You did not come in and apply for the job, you just shoved a bit of paper at me and asked me to sign it. Your problem not mine what happens to you as a result.

[firefighter]

It a great idea, the islander niggers (I say this because they are constantly calling each other this) next door could do with this scheme, all they do is drink piss and smoke pot next door, swear at their kids (abusively/iv'e called CYFS and the darkie on the other end could'nt give a shit/almost accusing ME of something), talk in that rediculous (sorry) black accent of not quite english but a lazy revolting sound and their huhuhuhuhuhuh laughter...... infecting my neighbourhood, making noise, parties, in what would otherwise be a nice place, i'd like nothing more than to see them get a piss test before their money.......they might actually find work......there's plenty of jobs out there at their level - and don't tell me there's not as I work part-time also for more than they would get on the dole.(doing shit jobs, iv'e even done the odd rubbish run before you think anything different)

[3umph]

Years ago we advertised for a parts/sales person for our bike shop through WINZ or whatever it was called then. I had this scruffy bloke scuff into the shop and put a piece of paper on the counter and ask "can you sign this for me?" When I asked him what it was he told me it was the form that had to go back to WINZ to say he hap appplied for the job. I refused to sign it.

He got a tad pissed off really and started yelling about how he would have his benefit stopped if I did not sign it. Tough luck mate. You did not come in and apply for the job, you just shoved a bit of paper at me and asked me to sign it. Your problem not mine what happens to you as a result.

yip to many don't want to work... or don't know how to...

it really makes you wonder what the people sending these people to you are thinking as most are 100% inconpatable with the job that needs to be done...
One thing I stressed was a full drivers license... I got all from no license, learners to suspended licenses and as said the only thing they were more concerned about was getting that bit of paper signed

[firefighter]

yip to many don't want to work... or don't know how to...

it really makes you wonder what the people sending these people to you are thinking as most are 100% inconpatable with the job that needs to be done...
One thing I stressed was a full drivers license... I got all from no license, learners to suspended licenses and as said the only thing they were more concerned about was getting that bit of paper signed

How about a "sting" operation, give employer a video camera, when they obviously blow the interveiw or admit they want paper signed and that's it, they get a life-time ban on all government assistance, and a warning that if they break anylaws to live (ie burglary) they get thrown in jail forever. (or put them down either one....) and give them a job to start out, like a rubbish run (fuck I personally do one sometimes and it's not below me) cleaning etcetc and they can earn their right of passage from there (like the world that's been supporting them has had to) :niceone:

[3umph]

How about a "sting" operation, give employer a video camera, when they obviously blow the interveiw or admit they want paper signed and that's it, they get a life-time ban on all government assistance, and a warning that if they break anylaws to live (ie burglary) they get thrown in jail forever. (or put them down either one....) and give them a job to start out, like a rubbish run (fuck I personally do one sometimes and it's not below me) cleaning etcetc and they can earn their right of passage from there (like the world that's been supporting them has had to) :niceone:

I like your way of thinking :laugh::laugh::laugh:

[Headbanger]

I reckon we should just move em onto all this land that has been paid over as reparation for being losers, the key is to not let them back off the land.

A minefield should do it.

[Marmoot]

Halving the dole queue would obviously be a good idea on paper but where would these people go for their next meal? <_<


One would imagine the crime rate would go through the roof!

Didn't realise handing out dole money to avoid them doing crime was a good idea.

Oh wait, we did that with the Triads back where my race came from. It's called "security money"...

[firefighter]

Didn't realise handing out dole money to avoid them doing crime was a good idea.

Oh wait, we did that with the Triads back where my race came from. It's called "security money"...

A bit rediculous really is'nt it? Just shoot the cunts in the face. (ok the second time, I DO believe people deserve a second chance/depending on crime etc)

[Headbanger]

Didn't realise handing out dole money to avoid them doing crime was a good idea.

Oh wait, we did that with the Triads back where my race came from. It's called "security money"...

Some of the more retarded social engineering experts who were beloved by the labour party put froward the idea of paying repeat offenders more dole money then law abiding people based on the theory that if you paid them enough they wouldn't have to steal other peoples shit.

The logic being that it would be cheaper in the long run then the damage they were causing and the untold millions spent on chasing them, convicting them, jailing them and giving them drug and booze money.

If they want to save money then they should use a rope, Every crim in NZ is already on the books.

[cave weta]

[QUOTE=
Halving the dole queue would obviously be a good idea on paper but where would these people go for their next meal?
One would imagine the crime rate would go through the roof![/QUOTE]

Where would they go for their next meal!!!???

If they had to pass a test they would be free of Dope and cheap alcahol and they would be fit for work- plus they will save a hundy each week not buying piss and hooch!

[cave weta]

It a great idea, the islander niggers (I say this because they are constantly calling each other this) next door could do with this scheme, all they do is drink piss and smoke pot next door, swear at their kids (abusively/iv'e called CYFS and the darkie on the other end could'nt give a shit/almost accusing ME of something), talk in that rediculous (sorry) black accent of not quite english but a lazy revolting sound and their huhuhuhuhuhuh laughter...... infecting my neighbourhood, making noise, parties, in what would otherwise be a nice place, i'd like nothing more than to see them get a piss test before their money.......they might actually find work......there's plenty of jobs out there at their level - and don't tell me there's not as I work part-time also for more than they would get on the dole.(doing shit jobs, iv'e even done the odd rubbish run before you think anything different)

Oh my god- do you live next door but one from me??? another thing that shits me is that 2 or 3 days each week they fill my house and garden with toxic stench and black smoke when they burn all their plastic rubbish and shitty nappies cos they are too tight to buy council rubbish bags.:puke:

[firefighter]

Oh my god- do you live next door but one from me??? another thing that shits me is that 2 or 3 days each week they fill my house and garden with toxic stench and black smoke when they burn all their plastic rubbish and shitty nappies cos they are too tight to buy council rubbish bags.:puke:

hahaha, no ours have'nt started burning rubbish yet, maybe because they know what I do for a living and would have them fucked over for it? hmmmm, makes ya think lol....times like this I wish I was a cop so I could have their kids taken off them.....(apprently my word is'nt good enough for CYFS)

[Squid69]

Oh wait, we did that with the Triads back where my race came from. It's called "security money"...

Unfortunatly nz jails are full of those motherfuckers too now.
paid for my my taxes...
gotta love immigration.

[Marmoot]

Unfortunatly nz jails are full of those motherfuckers too now.
paid for my my taxes...
gotta love immigration.

Quit your jibberjabber, fool. :Oi:

You got us bananas' tax money to pay for these scums.
Government is keeping your tax dollars to pay for the maori, pacifica and pakeha crims. Actually, I think we're subsidising you too on this... :bleh:

[R6_kid]

How about if you sit on the dole for more than a year you are drafted into the military. Maybe then the army would have enough soldiers to operate all of their LAVIII's instead of them just sitting.

It would give the people self respect and direction, and although they would still be taking money from the government they would be making a contribution back to the country through their service.

A similar thing could be done if the government set up a state owned civil works company the could compete for contracts and help get all these planned roads upgrades built faster.

[Mully]

times like this I wish I was a cop so I could have their kids taken off them.....(apprently my word is'nt good enough for CYFS)

Until they beat one to death and you get blamed for not speaking out.......

[Headbanger]

A similar thing could be done if the government set up a state owned civil works company the could compete for contracts and help get all these planned roads upgrades built faster.

Like.....The Ministry of Works?, It was disbanded and sold off for good reason. Though given another term the Labour Government would have probably paid 10 billion to buy it all back

[ManDownUnder]

I think he's taking the piss.

Rheineck?

He'd be welcome to it

[cave weta]

hahaha, no ours have'nt started burning rubbish yet, maybe because they know what I do for a living and would have them fucked over for it? hmmmm, makes ya think lol....

So.. with the fire ban on and all... what would happen to them if someone:rolleyes: reported that they were burning in a 44gallon drum?

It shits me, that indirectly, I contribute to their rent so that they can stay home and party 3 or 4 days and nights a week in the garage right next to my boundary with their two fuckin rabid pitbulls launching themselves at the hedge each time I go near.(they havent been out of the section in the two and a half years that they have lived there.) These people live in a dust bowl of dried dogshit, empty beer bottles, broken down nissans and blown- burnout tyres
and the motherfruckin Bass speakers thumping out "By the Rivers of Babylon" and "Silvia's Mother Says" all night while they sing along and drink themselves legless on two kegs of Waikato each week then their friends drive home or sleep on couches in the garden then start all over again at 6.30am with "I shot the Sherriff-But I didnt shoot the Deputy"

apart from them, the neighbourhood is great! all homeowners with jobs and lives and nice gardens.

[slopster]

How about if you sit on the dole for more than a year you are drafted into the military. Maybe then the army would have enough soldiers to operate all of their LAVIII's instead of them just sitting.
.

Why the fuck would the army want those scum. The armys got no use for anyone who doesn't want to be there

[3umph]

Why the fuck would the army want those scum. The armys got no use for anyone who doesn't want to be there

target practice:whistle::whistle:

[imdying]

Why the fuck would the army want those scum. The armys got no use for anyone who doesn't want to be thereEFB; (edit fucking beaten)

[firefighter]

So.. with the fire ban on and all... what would happen to them if someone:rolleyes: reported that they were burning in a 44gallon drum?

probably a nice wee fine- who knows whether they will pay it though! And I think it's up to the council to issue it (not 100%) but if you video it you will probably have a better chance.....will pm you with what i'd do :msn-wink:

[firefighter]

.................................

[firefighter]

Until they beat one to death and you get blamed for not speaking out.......

Oh no don't worry about that, I recorded the time, date etc of the call I made, filed the letter saying they recieved my call etc, i'm saving it for when it happens so I can find the darkie (name written down) I spoke to on the phone who talked down to me like I was a cunt and ask him to explain to me and his boss why he ignored me and acted like I personally was doing something wrong. I was interrogated on the phone in an extremely rude way, I wanted to find him and kick his ass after talking to him but i'm just waiting.....
I won't call them again after this experience, I just have the video camera handy and next time i'll call 111 and hand over the video tape.....CYFS can go fuck themselves after the experience I had on the phone with them....I mean how dare a concerned white fireman seeing this all first hand, willing to be a witness, supported by the neighbours call in his concerns about some abused children?!

[Boob Johnson]

Why the fuck would the army want those scum. The armys got no use for anyone who doesn't want to be there
And thats why this 3 month "boot camp" doesn't work, apparently.

[peasea]

I think he's taking the piss.

It's possible he has squatter's rights.

[firefighter]

Why the fuck would the army want those scum. The armys got no use for anyone who doesn't want to be there

They'd blend in with the rest of them then......:rolleyes:

It can be difficult at times to get people to do things who want to be there (in the real Army), these kids, shy of hitting them, won't do as they're told.

Shoot them in the face.

[peasea]

So.. with the fire ban on and all... what would happen to them if someone:rolleyes: reported that they were burning in a 44gallon drum?

It shits me, that indirectly, I contribute to their rent so that they can stay home and party 3 or 4 days and nights a week in the garage right next to my boundary with their two fuckin rabid pitbulls launching themselves at the hedge each time I go near.(they havent been out of the section in the two and a half years that they have lived there.) These people live in a dust bowl of dried dogshit, empty beer bottles, broken down nissans and blown- burnout tyres
and the motherfruckin Bass speakers thumping out "By the Rivers of Babylon" and "Silvia's Mother Says" all night while they sing along and drink themselves legless on two kegs of Waikato each week then their friends drive home or sleep on couches in the garden then start all over again at 6.30am with "I shot the Sherriff-But I didnt shoot the Deputy"

apart from them, the neighbourhood is great! all homeowners with jobs and lives and nice gardens.

Don't you like Waikato?

[Maki]

Yes to drugs checks, but we still have to support these people. Vouchers for food and clothing, rent, power and the like paid directly to landlords is a better way to go, than simply paying cash for the wasters that some of them are to spend as they see fit, leaving kids hungry and bills unpaid.

Good idea, but it would mean a downturn in income from pokie machines...
:shit:

[peasea]

Good idea, but it would mean a downturn in income from pokie machines...
:shit:


That's right, and don't they use some of that money to treat gambling addictions?:Oops:

[Dave Lobster]

It can be difficult at times to get people to do things who want to be there (in the real Army), these kids, shy of hitting them, won't do as they're told.


Put them in a real army. They'll get hit there. Attitude problems can be sorted out within 48 hours.. really, really easily ;)

[Mom]

I am actually serious about replacing cash with vouchers and bill/rent payments. I used to manage property and one of my absolute bug bears was the tenants that paid their rent last, read never.

I can not say how many letters I wrote to WINZ saying I wanted payment of $xxx or else I was teminating the tenancy. Without fail, WINZ coughed up the arrears. Now this is a gift, the beneficiaries do not have to repay.

For some I used to ask that I got paid directly from WINZ before the tenant got paid. The beneficiary has to agree to it and sign a piece of paper saying so, trouble is they can cancel the agreement whenever they want. WINZ discourage this practise as they want these people to take ownership of their bugetting. What a joke that is in most of the cases I dealt with.

[Boob Johnson]

I am actually serious about replacing cash with vouchers and bill/rent payments.
And its a bloody good idea Mom, long over due. I have had a few bottom feeders through here this past winter, the scam is they get WINZ to pay for say two weeks up front then they check out after a much shorter time & request a refund for days not stayed but I refuse to give them cash back :oi-grr: & will only ever put funds back into a WINZ account. This up sets them terribly :whistle: But hey, fuck em I say. Even had WINZ staff saying it was ok without proper paper work so I go one step further & speak with their superiors, im fucked if ill help some bottom feeder continue leeching off society <_<

[Marmoot]

A beneficiary was told to head to a loan shark, pawn their cell phone and their children's Play Station by a Work and Income staff member. (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10557386)

WTF is with that?

My answer: Nothing!
When I was a wee toddler, our family was so poor I was being perched on my neighbour's fence most nights to watch their TV from the roadside. Did we ask for government assistance? No! My dad worked to his bone to earn us enough money to buy food. We fought through.

People nowadays are so spoiled in their illusions they got their priorities wrong.
It's better to spend the money on things they need, and get off their butt to spend 30 minutes a day with their children rather than feeding them through the playstation.

[Boob Johnson]

A beneficiary was told to head to a loan shark, pawn their cell phone and their children's Play Station by a Work and Income staff member. (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10557386)

WTF is with that?

My answer: Nothing!
When I was a wee toddler, our family was so poor I was being perched on my neighbour's fence most nights to watch their TV from the roadside. Did we ask for government assistance? No! My dad worked to his bone to earn us enough money to buy food. We fought through.

People nowadays are so spoiled in their illusions they got their priorities wrong.
It's better to spend the money on things they need, and get off their butt to spend 30 minutes a day with their children rather than feeding them through the playstation.
Damn straight Marmoot :niceone:

[FROSTY]

Im sure Im repeating myself here but I remember years ago I was yard supervisor at a timber yard. They folded up --no warning to the workers just pulled the pin. -SORRY no job we're broke --so not a penny in redundancy money.
I had wife and kid to feed and a morgage to pay.
The way we worked it then was one week was morgage week the next was food week
So of course it was food week and the food was low
Went to WINZ to get a bit of help. Job hunting and food etc.
I was told to go sell the tv. I kid you not.
Meanwhile sitting at the desk next to me a person was wailing and rocking totally reeking of booze. They said they diddn't have the dole/dpb money to pay for food. Yup --they got a payout right there and then to buy food.

WHEN is this country gonna get tough on the bludgers that make a lifestyle CHOICE to be on the dole/DPB/ sickness benifit?
Instead of shuffling them from one benifit type to another to hide the problem

[3umph]

yes unfortunately now days being on a benefit long term is now seen as a profession and guaranteed income

[Boob Johnson]

WHEN is this country gonna get tough on the bludgers that make a lifestyle CHOICE to be on the dole/DPB/ sickness benifit?
Instead of shuffling them from one benifit type to another to hide the problem
Give Keys a chance, he'll sort these bottom feeders out given enough time

[Dave Lobster]

WHEN is this country going to get tough on the bludgers that make a lifestyle CHOICE to be on the dole/DPB/ sickness benefit?


Ha ha.. NEVER!

You can't do it. Even giving them heaps of free land doesn't get them off the dole/DPB/etc.

[paulmac]

Message from a hard-working Kiwi

I work, they pay me. I pay my taxes and the government distributes my
taxes as it sees fit.

In order to earn that pay cheque, as I work in the timber industry, I
am required to pass a random urine test, which I have no problem
in passing.

What I do have a problem with, is the distribution of my taxes to
people who don't have to pass a urine test.
Shouldn't one have to pass a urine test to get a welfare cheque
because I have to pass one to earn it for them??
Please understand - I have no problem with helping people get back on
their feet.

I do on the other hand have a problem with helping someone sit on
their arse drinking piss & smoking dope all day.
Could you imagine how much money the state would save if people had to
pass a urine test to get a WINZ cheque???
Please pass this along if you agree or simply delete if you don't.

Hope you all will pass it along though, because something has to
change in this country, and soon!

[98tls]

Been posted before but he sure does have a point.All this bullshit re regos etc could be avoided (temporary) by sorting out the many thousands of welfare bludging scumbuckets this countrys bred,before any tree hugger jumps up n down i dont mean all recipients of welfare just the ones that live off it for no good reason other than there sacks of lazy shite.

[StoneY]

Bling bling bling

:clap:

[cc rider]

All this bullshit re regos etc could be avoided (temporary) by sorting out the many thousands of welfare bludging scumbuckets this countrys bred,before any tree hugger jumps up n down i dont mean all recipients of welfare just the ones that live off it for no good reason other than there sacks of lazy shite.yes, thank you, they are all doing fine over here & say :wavey:

ps - is it true, your gov't still pays for them, while here :scratch:

[ready4whatever]

I pissed in a bottle for my mate once back at school

[cc rider]

I pissed in a bottle for my mate once back at school did he watch :shutup:

[SARGE]

What!! You can nominate where your taxes go?? Is that in the USA? What a brilliant idea.

yea .. i had all mine go to help Unwed Mothers


just helping them get started....

[SARGE]

Put them in a real army.

NZ couldnt afford the air fares to get them to one :Oops::Pokey::done:

[cc rider]

yea .. i had all mine go to help Unwed Mothers


just helping them get started....Umm! that's after they became mothers, right, Sarge.... :confused:

[SARGE]

Umm! that's after they became mothers, right, Sarge.... :confused:

everyone has to have aspirations

[cc rider]

everyone has to have aspirationsyeah, sure, but was thinking more along the lines of... were you their inspiration :innocent: :shutup: