Chinese wipe out a dolphin species

[MD]

What a heartbreaking news story tonight. Bloody Chinese 'out of control and we don't give a shit about it' polluters have driven the only species of river dolphin in the world into extinction.(the Beijing dolphin)
They have robbed the entire world and all future generations of what was a beautiful and unique and harmless creature that had more right to live in China than man.
It's a pity the rest of the world can't boycott the Beijing Olympics, along with all things out of China to send them a message - the planet belongs to all creatures, stop destroying it.

They said this dolphin has been in the Yangtze river delta for 50m years. I don't know what is worse, that they wiped it out or that they didn't try and save it. A British expedition had to go there to try and find and save any surviving dolphins. So did the Chinese not notice what was happening in their own back yard. Of course they did, they just saw a few dollars from unchecked commerce as more important than a 50 milllion year old rare resident, that was an extraordinary species not found anywhere else in the world. I guess our first arrivals did the same with the moa. But in their defence they were ignorant, not deliberately looking the other way and they didn't have the science and technology to save them once the numbers reached the edge of extinction.
The expedition countered 20,000 boats over a distance ( I forget what it was) that averaged one boat for every 800m of water.

Pricks. Once day China will collapse under it's own filth, but we will all suffer the fallout.

[Biff]

They only looked for it for a few weeks over a limited section of the river, and it is one massive mother of a river. There have to be no sightings of one for 50 years before it's officially declared extinct apparently.

I read that the researchers claimed that pollution wasn't the likely cause of any extinction, but more due to the tactics that local fishermen used to catch fish - by electrocution and dynamite mostly. Collateral damage I guess.

Shame.

[MD]

Here's a sight no man will ever see again. But he wont have to walk far to find another shopping mall with a MacDonalds.

[janno]

Yes, the Chinese are infuriatingly irresponsible.

But so are we. As in NZers and Aussies.

We are not as bad. But only just.

Nz has a pretty shocking record for industrial filth and general pollution - it's just because we have such a tiny country that we can get away with blue murder. You probably know about the state of fish stocks in NZ waters. Yes, we've had poaching from Russian, Korean and Jap (I think) vessels, but the kiwi boats had a rape and pillage mentality as well.

I worked on longliners and factory boats a while back, and the amount of fish dumped just made your blood boil. :shit: :angry: :angry:

So what I'm trying to say is it's easy, and justified, to get really pissed off at countries like China and India, but we aren't exactly squeaky clean either.

[doc]

Yes, the Chinese are infuriatingly irresponsible.

But so are we. As in NZers and Aussies.

We are not as bad. But only just.

Nz has a pretty shocking record for industrial filth and general pollution - it's just because we have such a tiny country that we can get away with blue murder. You probably know about the state of fish stocks in NZ waters. Yes, we've had poaching from Russian, Korean and Jap (I think) vessels, but the kiwi boats had a rape and pillage mentality as well.

I worked on longliners and factory boats a while back, and the amount of fish dumped just made your blood boil. :shit: :angry: :angry:

So what I'm trying to say is it's easy, and justified, to get really pissed off at countries like China and India, but we aren't exactly squeaky clean either.
It's their fu.king dolphin they can do what they like with it. Like they weren't eating them were they ? We would never have got to see it anyway it's their loss. We still have Opo's memorial which we really treasure.

[crazefox]

We should go and wipe those F##KS out

[T-Thunder13]

yeah just a pitty theres more chinese than any other race on earth. and they happen to have bought up all america's debt. so hurrah to the soon to be new world leaders. and i dont think we can so f*ck all about it

[crazefox]

yeah just a pitty theres more chinese than any other race on earth. and they happen to have bought up all america's debt. so hurrah to the soon to be new world leaders. and i dont think we can so f*ck all about it

True good point but we can start trying?

[T-Thunder13]

yea lets boycot all things from china............ that leaves me with pretty much nothing. but ill give it the benefit of the doubt

[Grahameeboy]

Yes, the Chinese are infuriatingly irresponsible.

But so are we. As in NZers and Aussies.

We are not as bad. But only just.

Nz has a pretty shocking record for industrial filth and general pollution - it's just because we have such a tiny country that we can get away with blue murder. You probably know about the state of fish stocks in NZ waters. Yes, we've had poaching from Russian, Korean and Jap (I think) vessels, but the kiwi boats had a rape and pillage mentality as well.

I worked on longliners and factory boats a while back, and the amount of fish dumped just made your blood boil. :shit: :angry: :angry:

So what I'm trying to say is it's easy, and justified, to get really pissed off at countries like China and India, but we aren't exactly squeaky clean either.

Those that cast stones eh......don't hear the Chinese criticising the Yanks for Iraq do we and this thread started by criticising the Chinese for not caring yet it sounds like it was just careless fishermen and for all we know the Dolphins are holed up somewhere safe..........the Japs are a lot more malicious.

[Swoop]

I aviod purchasing any product "made in china" whenever possible. The worlds largest polluter is the "peoples respublic", so please do not support this crock of guano.

Poison the rivers. Create massive coal-fired power stations.

Personally I would rather pay more to ensure products are "Made in New Zealand".

[MD]

It's their fu.king dolphin they can do what they like with it. Like they weren't eating them were they ? We would never have got to see it anyway it's their loss. We still have Opo's memorial which we really treasure.
What a dumb comment.
It's their dolphin? How do you figure that?. Did they got back in time and create it? did they buy it off a shop shelf 50 million years ago so they could claim the right to wipe it out?
It's not just their loss. It's everyones loss now and forever, whether you see one in the flesh or not. So they can wipe out the panda as well then by your logic. Did they make the panda bear out of a mechano set or buy it at the warehouse?

Sure over fishing and the three gorges dam contributed. My point was the Chinese Government knew and did nothing. They were warned that damming the river network would cause extinction but went ahead anyway.

Grahameeboy, how exactly do dolphins trapped by dams in a polluted river network find somewhere safe to hide? Maybe the lochness monster can pop over and give them some tips.

Sure my place is full of Chinese made stuff and we have little choice nowadays. That still doesn't excuse their Government for acting decades ago to save them.

[sAsLEX]

Does the Amazon not have river dolphins http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boto


Doesn't make what the Chinese have done any better.

[janno]

Does the Amazon not have river dolphins http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boto


Doesn't make what the Chinese have done any better.

The Amazon ones are being wiped out too, along with thousands of acres of rainforest to make all the shit we "need" these days.

I fully agree with paying more for NZ made products. Plus more jobs = less people languishing on the dole. I always buy Aus made (cos I'm here, natch) - but that's pretty easy considering how big their manufacturing base is.

[BIGBOSSMAN]

Maybe the Chinese fucked them to death? Follow this link :sick:


http://www.sexwork.com/family/dolphins1.html

[The Pastor]

man, where will i get my river dolphin soup now?? Damn it i never did get to taste them

[Hitcher]

New Zealanders should look at our own backyards before we get enraged about a species of dolphin in China getting wiped out. The prognosis isn't that flash for our own Hector's dolphin, not to mention a bunch of bird species including the yellow-eyed penguin and the kakapo. There are only 120 spur-winged plovers left...

[Mekk]

Nothing lasts forever.

Delaying the inevitable is only so we can enjoy them longer. Would cloning endangered animals not achieve the same effect?

[Marmoot]

The Amazon ones are being wiped out too, along with thousands of acres of rainforest to make all the shit we "need" these days.

By Chinese too?
Or are we missing something out in this discussion?

[JimO]

what happened to the moa

[slowpoke]

Individually I take people on their merits...or lack of, but collectively the Chinese culture repulses me. Their record with human and animal rights is fuckin' sickening. Any person who thinks Kiwi's have the same casual disregard for human and animal life as the Chinese is a fool.

[sAsLEX]

what happened to the moa

Same fate as the morioris..........
or however you spell that






pt

[Marmoot]

Individually I take people on their merits...or lack of, but collectively the Chinese culture repulses me. Their record with human and animal rights is fuckin' sickening. Any person who thinks Kiwi's have the same casual disregard for human and animal life as the Chinese is a fool.

Yeah. you're right, they are disgusting. No wonder whales are becoming extinct since chinese ruled the sea circa 1900s and the modern day rate of child abuse and farm animal abuse in NZ is very high, maybe because we have so many chinese came in. Oh wait, am I missing something again....?

[JimO]

enzed has a high rate of child abuse ONLY because of the maori and pacific island population

[janno]

enzed has a high rate of child abuse ONLY because of the maori and pacific island population

My chardonnay liberal side wants to get feathers aruffled over that statement. But my redneck Taranaki farming stock side says, well, just telling it like it is. Be interesting to see what someone who works in the field thinks of that statement.

Even if it's true, it's not going to change anything is it? You can't push all the undesirables off a cliff . . .

[Hitcher]

You can't push all the undesirables off a cliff . . .

Only if one gets caught...

[Pixie]

I regret that the Atlascopcosaurus became extinct.
It could have eaten all these bleeding treehuggers

http://www.dinoruss.com/de_4/5a79a54.htm

[Mekk]

Well this thread deteriorated quickly to blind, ignorant racism.

[imdying]

enzed has a high rate of child abuse ONLY because of the maori and pacific island populationOoooh, I don't know about that... there's more than enough europeans that don't think twice about beating their children. You see them (well, the really stupid ones) in the supermarket some weeks...

Well this thread deteriorated quickly to blind, ignorant racism.Hey! I'm into equality. You might think I'm racist, but I can assure you that I hate all races equally! White, black, brown, yellow, we all do some pretty hideous shite.

/edit: As far as the Chinese go... well, they're just a little slow off the mark. Their only crime (that, on an environmental level, hasn't already been perpetrated by the rest of the world) is that they're doing it 200-50 years later than the rest... in a time of complex and high speed communication systems. The British have done some hideous shite, not the least of which is rooting their environment during the industrial age. Just because the majority of western society has already been there, done that, and had a few years to regret, and get a social conscience, doesn't make them (the Chinese) a bad people/race.

It's what they do over the next 10-20 years that count to me... they're no less allowed to make all the same mistakes that western countries did themselves.

[JimO]

Well this thread deteriorated quickly to blind, ignorant racism.

i may be ignorant but im not blind and i can read, perhaps your the one who is blind

[Mekk]

i may be ignorant but im not blind and i can read, perhaps your the one who is blind

If we go with ignorant then I've made my point.


Hey! I'm into equality. You might think I'm racist, but I can assure you that I hate all races equally! White, black, brown, yellow, we all do some pretty hideous shite.

Yup! Equality can also be looked at from outside the race perspective. I would say there isn't enough data to be able to conclusively say that this particular race or culture is better than any other. A lot of people forget about the proportion of said groups as well.

Anyway, I wonder how many people actually cared about the dolphin's state before they announced it was extinct? I had personally never heard of it until now.

[JimO]

If we go with ignorant then I've made my point.



Yup! Equality can also be looked at from outside the race perspective. I would say there isn't enough data to be able to conclusively say that this particular race or culture is better than any other. A lot of people forget about the proportion of said groups as well.

Anyway, I wonder how many people actually cared about the dolphin's state before they announced it was extinct? I had personally never heard of it until now.


50% of the prison population and 15% of the general population every time there is a violent crime its almost certanly a maori, time to cull them out

[terbang]

Oh no this is rapidy descending into PD..!

[Hitcher]

Bring back the dolphin!

[BIGBOSSMAN]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZmPB-dFkpd4

[SPman]

It's their fu.king dolphin they can do what they like with it. Like they weren't eating them were they ? We would never have got to see it anyway it's their loss.
Yes - they were eating them
Their loss? Eliminate yet another species from the planet?
Regardless of where and by whom, species are being wiped out, it's just another indication that humans are breeding like a virus across the face of the earth and are probably doomed to perish under the weight of our own shit!

[idb]

Bring back the dolphin!

They've got crazy flipper fingers,
No digits there at all..............

[Dilligaf]

You imperialist swines. Happy to have your latest cars and LCDs etc etc yet you think that the third world should be happy to eventually get what? clean water? live in a shack? one meal a day?
How condescending of us in the west, very comfortable, only sometimes giving a tiny percentage of what we have of our vast riches, to criticise those doing what they can to have what we enjoy, (and most of the time don't even think about how good we've got it).
Now I'm not some hippy tree hugger here, but I lived for 6 years in a third world country (no, not NZ :shutup:) and quite frankly it really makes me wonder when people tut tut over them trying to get what we have.
You think the industrialisation that we went through to get to our level of society was pretty? Read up on how for example, the River Thames looked a couple of centuries ago.


(I'm only half joking....)

[imdying]

I've no problem with dolphins for eating, so long as it's sustainable.

[BIGBOSSMAN]

How about sending a few of these over, with an ingeniously designed prosthetic snout? Come on Kiwi's, number 8 fencing wire mode! We can help the Chinese!!!

[idb]

Bloody cetasians!
I never liked them since that popular tv programme 'Fripper' in the seventies.

[BIGBOSSMAN]

Bloody cetasians!
I never liked them since that popular tv programme 'Fripper' in the seventies.

I can't stand the fucking noise they make. Nyaaaa Nyaaaaa. Creepy.
Then there's all that fucking spouting.....:sick:

[avgas]

Yeh bitch and moan about it all you want. You news is so last year and so are you.
Not all of china are bad (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,236446,00.html)
The human race are a bunch of fucken assholes. Your no better.
I had a neighbour that was a microbiologist, he stated that NZ are just as bad as the rest of the world because we have a 'can-do' attitude. Which means we will fuck something else up to prove we are right. Look at our major citys. Don't try and tell me there was no ecology there before we decided to build suburbs.
Go touch yourself elsewhere

[idb]

Yeh bitch and moan about it all you want. You news is so last year and so are you.
Not all of china are bad (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,236446,00.html)
The human race are a bunch of fucken assholes. Your no better.
I had a neighbour that was a microbiologist, he stated that NZ are just as bad as the rest of the world because we have a 'can-do' attitude. Which means we will fuck something else up to prove we are right. Look at our major citys. Don't try and tell me there was no ecology there before we decided to build suburbs.
Go touch yourself elsewhere

Wha' you try to say Fripper....wha' is it boy??!!

[BIGBOSSMAN]

I've no problem with dolphins for eating, so long as it's sustainable.

Very nice with a mixed salad and Tartare sauce :drool:

[BIGBOSSMAN]

And chips - no make that wedges with sour cream. Maybe kumara wedges(hmmm...)

[hdus001]

/edit: As far as the Chinese go... well, they're just a little slow off the mark. Their only crime (that, on an environmental level, hasn't already been perpetrated by the rest of the world) is that they're doing it 200-50 years later than the rest... in a time of complex and high speed communication systems. The British have done some hideous shite, not the least of which is rooting their environment during the industrial age. Just because the majority of western society has already been there, done that, and had a few years to regret, and get a social conscience, doesn't make them (the Chinese) a bad people/race.

It's what they do over the next 10-20 years that count to me... they're no less allowed to make all the same mistakes that western countries did themselves.

Amen to that. My thoughts exactly.

Most of the Western world would not have been this wealthy or "civilised" now had it not been for the plundering & human rights atrocities than UK did in the past few centuries or the environmental abuse in the past few decades.

China & India just happen to be a bit slow off the mark.

And to the person who said "We should go and wipe those F##KS out", with what exactly are you going to wipe out those F##KS? paua shells?
:)

[Mekk]

Regardless of where and by whom, species are being wiped out, it's just another indication that humans are breeding like a virus across the face of the earth and are probably doomed to perish under the weight of our own shit!

Yep, sounds like the natural cycle of things. Has been happening since life began.


*post of postness*

Nice.


50% of the prison population and 15% of the general population every time there is a violent crime its almost certanly a maori, time to cull them out

Stats only represent one part of the whole equation. There is nothing about what causes those stats.

Genocide eh, but then there'd be someone else to blame...then someone else, then someone else. Never ourselves, that's treason!

Anyway, this is off topic. Being racist doesn't justify anything, especially when it comes to finding a solution to saving animals.

[avgas]

Wha' you try to say Fripper....wha' is it boy??!!
Timmy's down a well, and he's with your wife

[MD]

Thank you for the youtube clip bigbossman. Despite your sarcastic comments and others that find it amusing and Ok that a creature can survive 50 million years, only to be wiped out of existence by our over population, I find it a shame.
Yes Europeans were first to have an industrial age and go ape on exploitation of resources and me & you are enjoying the benefits. That was over a 150 years ago and people were not that enlightened then about the consequences and they didn't have the science & technology to respond.

avgas- having a bad hair day are we? "The human race are a bunch of fucken assholes. Your no better"
Don't throw that stupid argument at me that my ancestors did something wrong and therefore it's all my fault. Your ancestors were saints I take it? From your piss poor grammar I take it they were not polluting Europeans anyway. I hope we never meet because I don't like socialising with dickhead wankers.

Those that say we are no better in NZ today. Really. Build a factory and start pumping sludge and toxic shit into the Avon in Chch and see if you get away with it. You would have in 1900 ...maybe.

Most Chinese peasants and fisherman wouldn't have known better over the last decade or so to take action. BUT, the Chinese Government would have known and is one of the richest nations in the world and therefore could have stepped in before it was too late. I appreciate what they are doing to preserve the panda. Probably because they saw a tourist dollar in it.

[James Deuce]

The Yangtze Dolphin was on an endangered list for 40 years too. The Dolphin's habitat has change massively because of the changes to the flow of the Yangtze. The Chinese Government don't care about their own Human population let alone animals.

Damming, flood "protection" (which doesn't work - just ask the UK about the Thames) power generation, all of those hugely changed the environment for this very specialised Dolphin, let alone the issues generated by farming and mining run off and human waste.

I rather suspect Mr Dunn is completely correct in is estimation of the Panda earning cash. The hard to get to bits of the Great Wall of China are starting to crumble. The bits near the extensive resorts positively glow, they get scrubbed with toothbrushes that often (political dissidents propelling the toothbrushes I might add).

Can someone explain to me how an FTA with this country is a good thing?

[flame]

Pricks. Once day China will collapse under it's own filth, but we will all suffer the fallout.


dirdy basdards. Lets build a bloody big bomb and wipe the whole country of f@*kers out. That'l learn em eh.

[Grumpy Gnomb]

wait until the Olmpice and than watch the Chinese wipe out a generaton of athletes who come back sick

[hdus001]

dirdy basdards. Lets build a bloody big bomb and wipe the whole country of f@*kers out. That'l learn em eh.


That shouldnt be hard..after all China doesnt even have an army to resist or fight back :)

[imdying]

That shouldnt be hard..after all China doesnt even have an army to resist or fight back :)It's not like they're a nuclear power or anything eh :lol:

[James Deuce]

That shouldnt be hard..after all China doesnt even have an army to resist or fight back :)

What flavour of crack art thou partaking of?

You realise that the Korean War was called off rather than "won" by the UN don't you? The modern Chinese state was 3 years old and they were absolutely kicking US and Commonwealth butt (experienced butt too I might add - WWII had only been over for 5 years when Korea started) on the ground in Korea in 1950-53. MacArthur got fired for threatening to use nukes, which effectively convinced non-nuclear China to sign a ceasefire.

China uses "Human wave" tactics on the ground. You just pour troops into a front until the other guy runs out of people to fight back with. Better technology might make it a zero-sum game. Might. You fight China on the ground at your peril. They'll close a breach in a front by using tactical nukes on positions that still contain their own troops.

[hdus001]

What flavour of crack art thou partaking of?

You realise that the Korean War was called off rather than "won" by the UN don't you? The modern Chinese state was 3 years old and they were absolutely kicking US and Commonwealth butt (experienced butt too I might add - WWII had only been over for 5 years when Korea started) on the ground in Korea in 1950-53. MacArthur got fired for threatening to use nukes, which effectively convinced non-nuclear China to sign a ceasefire.

China uses "Human wave" tactics on the ground. You just pour troops into a front until the other guy runs out of people to fight back with. Better technology might make it a zero-sum game. Might. You fight China on the ground at your peril. They'll close a breach in a front by using tactical nukes on positions that still contain their own troops.


U mean they are militarily stronger than NZ? :) Ah well..the bomb plan wouldnt work well then would it..anyone got a plan B?

[James Deuce]

Thou art taking the Piss.

[JimO]

U mean they are militarily stronger than NZ? :) Ah well..the bomb plan wouldnt work well then would it..anyone got a plan B?

we could send hone Hawera over there he would sort them out

[duckaddict]

we could send hone Hawera over there he would sort them out

:lol: LOL !!!! :rofl:

[BIGBOSSMAN]

All this bickering over a couple of ugly dead fish. What the fuck is up with you people?? :gob:

[James Deuce]

They're not fish.

[Mekk]

All this bickering over a couple of ugly dead fish. What the fuck is up with you people?? :gob:

People are only "caring" because they've been declared extinct, which means that we can't (or don't have to) do anything. There's people to blame here!

In a week or so it'll slip back out of our memories and we'll look for something else to criticize.

I find it a bit pretentious for those claiming it to be a tragic loss to the planet and ecosystem. If it hadn't made the news, nobody would have cared.

Puppets.

[slowpoke]

I find it a bit pretentious for those claiming it to be a tragic loss to the planet and ecosystem. If it hadn't made the news, nobody would have cared.

Puppets.


WTF???!!! How can you possibly care about something if you don't know it's happened or happening? Are you saying once we do hear of an offensive occurrence we should just ignore it? Should we all just sit back and let bad shit happen without comment?

So people who react to voice their concern over or act against crap happenings in the world are just "puppets" are we? I reckon another "p" word is more appropriate: participants. We choose to participate in life and have some miniscule effect on the direction it takes. On the other hand we have the "spectators" who just laugh and throw rocks at the participants....how noble of them.......

[Mekk]

WTF???!!! How can you possibly care about something if you don't know it's happened or happening?

That's partially my point. People who really do care about these dolphins would be doing what they could to prevent the extinction up until now. They wouldn't suddenly care all of a sudden on notice of their death.


Are you saying once we do hear of an offensive occurrence we should just ignore it? Should we all just sit back and let bad shit happen without comment?

Not at all.



So people who react to voice their concern over or act against crap happenings in the world are just "puppets" are we?

My emphasis in bold.

Puppets of the media, unless the information gained is used to actually make a difference. How many readers of this news do you think will care enough to actually do something about the preservation of other species? I give it a month and most would have forgotten an existence they never knew.



I reckon another "p" word is more appropriate: participants. We choose to participate in life and have some miniscule effect on the direction it takes. On the other hand we have the "spectators" who just laugh and throw rocks at the participants....how noble of them.......

Well see, my stance was throwing rocks at the spectators in showing a pretentious sense of caring about this sort of thing and doing nothing.

As an aside, if I told you of my pet higue (the last of its kind) that had recently died, you could not possibly care about the animal itself. I'm saying this because a higue is something I just made up, something you can't picture or experience in any form. You may care in the sense that you understand it's a loss of mine, but that's a form of caring towards a similar feeling of loss you yourself have experienced, a selfish form of caring that only becomes relevant if able to be related to something you know. You care about the effect of the higue dying on me, not of it and not of preserving other species.

Therefore, how can observers in New Zealand care about a species of animal they have never encountered, only heard of? Are you caring for the loss of China? If so, why all the comments of the Chinese not caring about these animals? If they don't care, isn't that sense or caring on our behalf rendered selfish and pointless? Don't get me wrong, there are genuine people out there trying to do what they can to preserve other animals, and a lot in NZ too. I could take this off on a tangent on the morals of preserving a species as well but I won't.

My point is that this pretentious "caring" put forward by spectators is a selfish reflection of themselves and unless is actually acted upon in preventing further things from happening...is pretentious.

[DEATH_INC.]

It is frustrating to see a species wiped out when it could have been prevented, especially when it is so far from your own control. There isn't much we can do from here, but voicing our opinions about it may make others sit up and do something about the next species that may go.
Do you care when you hear of someone you don't know getting murdered? Same sorta thing really..... just because you don't know of them/it doesn't make it any less of a trajedy...

[James Deuce]

My point is that this pretentious "caring" put forward by spectators is a selfish reflection of themselves and unless is actually acted upon in preventing further things from happening...is pretentious.

It's a shame you couldn't have come up with a point with a bit more depth.

You've completely missed the point. If people don't give a hoot about things they've never seen, or are never likely to, we may as well go back to living in caves.

MD - don't worry mate, some of us get it.

[MD]

People are only "caring" because they've been declared extinct, which means that we can't (or don't have to) do anything. There's people to blame here!


I find it a bit pretentious for those claiming it to be a tragic loss to the planet and ecosystem. If it hadn't made the news, nobody would have cared.

Puppets.
Thanks Death Inc and Jim2 for seeing my point in starting this thread.
Mekk, firstly I'm sorry about your higue, I didn't mean to run it over. It should have been fenced in better anyway.

I for one am not pretending to be caring now I learn that a species is extinct. I am saddened to learn that something I never saw but may have enjoyed seeing, given a chance, is gone forever. Now I and all others have no chance.
Your comment is silly that I am claiming it to be a tragic loss, now that I know about it. So a tragic event is not tragic unless it gets media coverage? I don't think so. Since when did we meassure tragedies based on the number of viewers? I didn't witness the holocaust but I can still understand that it was wrong. I never saw a Moa but wish I could.

As individuals we can't do much. You are quite right though. It is all my fault for not knowing of this pending loss and now playing a spectator after the event. I should have robbed Fort Knox and used all the money to fly to China and do something positive. Silly lazy me. You of course never sit on a couch criticising others. It is great that you took time out from saving the world to criticise a few of us for expressing our dissapointment over a loss we could not prevent.

I for one give regularly to WWF and that other mob. But that's my personal business and I don't care what you think of it. If you want to save the higue go for it.

I can't single handedly save the Tuatara or the Kiwi.. or the higue for that matter. But as a taxpayer I expect our collective Govt to act on our behalf and our Conservation dept seem to work hard. I expect our Conservation dept to find out what animals are at risk, bring it to our attention and try and save it. I have no doubt that many Chinese tree huggers did their best - unfortunately it wasn't enough. My point was that their Govt had massive power and money at it's disposal and probably could have saved a few; Relocate, ship to aquariums for breeding programs, whatever. But leaving it for a foreign British team to come to China to see if they can find any left!

Time for this argument to go the way of the doddo and Baiiji doplhin.

[BIGBOSSMAN]

All jokes aside (i assure you - I was joking!), this is a dreadful event that has occurred. Here's a link to an interesting website that explores the possibility of the current era being one of mass extinction.

Scroll down and you'll see a news article on NZ's Maui dolphin.

http://www.well.com/~davidu/extinction.html

[Mekk]

Thanks Death Inc and Jim2 for seeing my point in starting this thread.
Mekk, firstly I'm sorry about your higue, I didn't mean to run it over. It should have been fenced in better anyway.

I for one am not pretending to be caring now I learn that a species is extinct. I am saddened to learn that something I never saw but may have enjoyed seeing, given a chance, is gone forever. Now I and all others have no chance.
Your comment is silly that I am claiming it to be a tragic loss, now that I know about it. So a tragic event is not tragic unless it gets media coverage? I don't think so. Since when did we meassure tragedies based on the number of viewers? I didn't witness the holocaust but I can still understand that it was wrong. I never saw a Moa but wish I could.

As individuals we can't do much. You are quite right though. It is all my fault for not knowing of this pending loss and now playing a spectator after the event. I should have robbed Fort Knox and used all the money to fly to China and do something positive. Silly lazy me. You of course never sit on a couch criticising others. It is great that you took time out from saving the world to criticise a few of us for expressing our dissapointment over a loss we could not prevent.

I for one give regularly to WWF and that other mob. But that's my personal business and I don't care what you think of it. If you want to save the higue go for it.

I can't single handedly save the Tuatara or the Kiwi.. or the higue for that matter. But as a taxpayer I expect our collective Govt to act on our behalf and our Conservation dept seem to work hard. I expect our Conservation dept to find out what animals are at risk, bring it to our attention and try and save it. I have no doubt that many Chinese tree huggers did their best - unfortunately it wasn't enough. My point was that their Govt had massive power and money at it's disposal and probably could have saved a few; Relocate, ship to aquariums for breeding programs, whatever. But leaving it for a foreign British team to come to China to see if they can find any left!

Time for this argument to go the way of the doddo and Baiiji doplhin.

Ok, I need to apologise here.

My last post was due to an ill-thought out, snap reaction to the blatant racism that was expressed by some as an excuse or reason for us losing this creature.

I understand there are people that genuinely care and are (rightly) upset about this.

I had intended to address the racism of what they were saying and comparing the ignorance of that to the fact that they would not have cared until it was too late and there was someone to blame. I was trying to bring light also to the point that they care more about blaming someone or something else than the actual loss of the dolphin.

Obviously I put it across poorly and for that I'm sorry.

[Mekk]

It is frustrating to see a species wiped out when it could have been prevented, especially when it is so far from your own control. There isn't much we can do from here, but voicing our opinions about it may make others sit up and do something about the next species that may go.
Do you care when you hear of someone you don't know getting murdered? Same sorta thing really..... just because you don't know of them/it doesn't make it any less of a trajedy...


It's a shame you couldn't have come up with a point with a bit more depth.

You've completely missed the point. If people don't give a hoot about things they've never seen, or are never likely to, we may as well go back to living in caves.

MD - don't worry mate, some of us get it.

Again, sorry for that, I messed up my ideas completely. I have a bad tendency to do that if I let passion dictate an argument. See above.

[doc]

It is frustrating to see a species wiped out when it could have been prevented, especially when it is so far from your own control. There isn't much we can do from here, but voicing our opinions about it may make others sit up and do something about the next species that may go.
Do you care when you hear of someone you don't know getting murdered? Same sorta thing really..... just because you don't know of them/it doesn't make it any less of a trajedy...

We seem to just talk and complain more than anything, maybe people feel they doing something complaining. Who care what happens in China ? It seems we have a bigger problem here beating our kids to death, Bet the chinese are upset that we are doing that.
In a weeks time everyone will have moved on and the next topic probably going to be economics (the dollar and house prices) until we get sick of it. But the problem with the kids and the dolphins will still be there and only the genuine will we concerned. Can imagine if you went to China and tried to raise the profile about the dolphins with the Chinese government you would be warmly received.

[James Deuce]

It seems we have a bigger problem here beating our kids to death, Bet the chinese are upset that we are doing that.


Actually they are and comments are being made by the Chinese Govt to the NZ Govt about the Violence and Racism inherent in NZ society. You can thank the abuse Asian language students cop for doing nothing more than attempting to provide themselves with more opportunities in life, which will probably have a positive flow on effect in 20 years for us - if we give them pleasant memories and functional language capabilities.

I know you don't think it is important but damaging or destroying niche ecologies always turn out to have a much bigger impact than expected.

[MD]

Ok, I need to apologise here.

My last post was due to an ill-thought out, snap reaction to the blatant racism that was expressed by some as an excuse or reason for us losing this creature.
...
...
Cheers. The thread went off on a racist tangent because of my poor choice of words in the thread title.
I should have had something like "China loses a dophin species" rather than blame the people as a race.

[Toaster]

We should go and wipe those F##KS out

Well, you will find a few hundred thousand of them on Queen Street in Auckland for starters.

....with what armed forces shall we do that!! Uncle Helen and the social engineering department wiped out our tiny armed forces and turned them into tree hugging peacekeepers and VIP transport services - since she can't use the police motorcade any more without getting a speeding ticket.

[Sollyboy]

New Zealanders should look at our own backyards before we get enraged about a species of dolphin in China getting wiped out. The prognosis isn't that flash for our own Hector's dolphin, not to mention a bunch of bird species including the yellow-eyed penguin and the kakapo. There are only 120 spur-winged plovers left...

Its hard for me to give a rats arse about a few birds when 100s of people die in NZ hospitals each year thru lack of resources , this shit hole country wont even pay for a full coarse of herceptin for our lovely mums and wives yet will spend millions on the preservation of a few animals that lack the will to evolve and adapt , you say only 120 spur winged plovers left i say there will only be 119 left
when I see one

[Lou Girardin]

Its hard for me to give a rats arse about a few birds when 100s of people die in NZ hospitals each year thru lack of resources , this shit hole country wont even pay for a full coarse of herceptin for our lovely mums and wives yet will spend millions on the preservation of a few animals that lack the will to evolve and adapt , you say only 120 spur winged plovers left i say there will only be 119 left
when I see one

Bugger the Herceptin, men can't even get free screening tests for prostate cancer in this Matriarchal dictatorship

[Mekk]

Its hard for me to give a rats arse about a few birds when 100s of people die in NZ hospitals each year thru lack of resources , this shit hole country wont even pay for a full coarse of herceptin for our lovely mums and wives yet will spend millions on the preservation of a few animals that lack the will to evolve and adapt , you say only 120 spur winged plovers left i say there will only be 119 left
when I see one

Animals don't have "will" in the same manner as humans. Having willpower to use over instincts with better judgment is one of the things that separates us. They have survival instincts which they run on, which would suggest they'd try everything they could to survive. The fact that they are not surviving means there's a problem.

You can't just decide to evolve, either.

With power comes responsibility.

[Lissa]

My son (8) over heard this on the news the other night. He wanted to know why they were wiped out. He was very unhappy, I really couldnt give him an answer, and just told him that as a human being we have a responsiblity to look after animals and protect them from extinction. He is an animal lover, he watches animal planet constantly and can not understand why or how a species could be made extinct. Unfortuantly there are people on this earth who think that making money is more important than protecting innocent animals.

http://www.iucnredlist.org/ - is the IUCN Red List of the 15000 animal and plants that face extinction.

Sure we could put our heads in the sand and say well there are more important things to worry about... but we as human beings we are not the only species on this earth, and as apprently the more intelligent of all the species we have a responsiblity to looking after our planet.


Animals don't have "will" in the same manner as humans. Having willpower to use over instincts with better judgment is one of the things that separates us. They have survival instincts which they run on, which would suggest they'd try everything they could to survive. The fact that they are not surviving means there's a problem.Right.. whats wrong is humans are wiping them out, whether we are intentionally doing it or not, it doesnt matter.

[idb]

....... this shit hole country ........

In that case I hope you vote with your feet as soon as you're old enough and leave.
After all...it's no use just complaining is it?
It's action that counts!

[Sollyboy]

In that case I hope you vote with your feet as soon as you're old enough and leave.
After all...it's no use just complaining is it?
It's action that counts!

Why would I leave my country just because some people are turning it to shit , Im here for the long haul and I work daily to do my bit for improving NZ, i just dont see how throwing millions at saving animals will help humans . As for the chinese wiping out a species well boo fucken hoo it would be hard to gather sympathy for a fish when your children are hungry , its too easy to be judgemental when you have a full stomach and a warm house , lets not forget that china is still over 90% peasant type farmers they dont all work in factory or
cruise up and down queen st in flash cars

[Mekk]

As for the chinese wiping out a species well boo fucken hoo it would be hard to gather sympathy for a fish when your children are hungry , its too easy to be judgemental when you have a full stomach and a warm house , lets not forget that china is still over 90% peasant type farmers they dont all work in factory or
cruise up and down queen st in flash cars

Were these dolphin hunted for food? I was under the impression they were killed because of the pollution.

[BIGBOSSMAN]

Bugger the Herceptin, men can't even get free screening tests for prostate cancer in this Matriarchal dictatorship

Image if you were a Yangtze River Dolphin with a prostrate problem in China. Then you'd really be fucked:eek:

[Guitana]

Were these dolphin hunted for food? I was under the impression they were killed because of the pollution.

Yes when you're swimming around all day in industrial waste and excrement it does take a wee toll on your health. I would also say that old charlie chan was also eating a few on the sly!!!
This seems to be something that the chinese also excell at besides mass producing plastic shite that no one really needs and breaks two minutes after you unwrap it!!!
Maybe Dolphin testicles are a delicacy and thats why the population has declined because they cant breed when some arsehole has made sweet and sour with their scrotes!!!!!:sick::sick::sick::sick:

[Mekk]

Yes when you're swimming around all day in industrial waste and excrement it does take a wee toll on your health. I would also say that old charlie chan was also eating a few on the sly!!!
This seems to be something that the chinese also excell at besides mass producing plastic shite that no one really needs and breaks two minutes after you unwrap it!!!
Maybe Dolphin testicles are a delicacy and thats why the population has declined because they cant breed when some arsehole has made sweet and sour with their scrotes!!!!!:sick::sick::sick::sick:

Cheers for that.

[doc]

[QUOTE=Maybe Dolphin testicles are a delicacy and thats why the population has declined because they cant breed when some arsehole has made sweet and sour with their scrotes!!!!!:sick::sick::sick::sick:[/QUOTE]

Oh so twist it around and it's now our problem because we like 'Sweet and sour "

[avgas]

Ha classic - nice to see i spun a few here.
Yeh what i said was a bit of knee jerk reaction for people doing the whole blame thing.
Sadly all catch phrases aside I still stand by my points (Its a european thing:bleh:).
You, I, every bloody person out there - human or close enough is f'ing up the place. Blaming Chinese for the loss of a dolphin in their turf is like pointing fingers at the Kiwis over the Huia (fingers crossed not the end of that).
Its just not that simple. Yes the government probably was aware, just like ours are about Kakapo (not the Kaka - the other one). But sadly it will take miracles to save most of these animals, as Governments in charge of more people give less respect to the environment.
Racist bullshit is just that. Not all Americans are like George bush, not all Koreans eat dogs, not all Chinese kill dolphins and not all kiwis fuck sheep and are psycho's.
I would put money down that half of china a) didn't even know about these dolphins and b) didn't know they died out.
All this bitching in the past should be put to more useful things like trying to save another species from going down the same path.
FYI leave forefathers out of the conversation, what is done in the past does not have to dictate the future - and I'm quite proud of my heritage.

[Marmoot]

What a heartbreaking news story tonight. Bloody Chinese 'out of control and we don't give a shit about it' polluters have driven the only species of river dolphin in the world into extinction.(the Beijing dolphin)
They have robbed the entire world and all future generations of what was a beautiful and unique and harmless creature that had more right to live in China than man.
It's a pity the rest of the world can't boycott the Beijing Olympics, along with all things out of China to send them a message - the planet belongs to all creatures, stop destroying it.

They said this dolphin has been in the Yangtze river delta for 50m years. I don't know what is worse, that they wiped it out or that they didn't try and save it. A British expedition had to go there to try and find and save any surviving dolphins. So did the Chinese not notice what was happening in their own back yard. Of course they did, they just saw a few dollars from unchecked commerce as more important than a 50 milllion year old rare resident, that was an extraordinary species not found anywhere else in the world. I guess our first arrivals did the same with the moa. But in their defence they were ignorant, not deliberately looking the other way and they didn't have the science and technology to save them once the numbers reached the edge of extinction.
The expedition countered 20,000 boats over a distance ( I forget what it was) that averaged one boat for every 800m of water.

Pricks. Once day China will collapse under it's own filth, but we will all suffer the fallout.

What a heartbreaking news story today. Bloody New Zealanders 'out of control and we don't give a shit about the changing land usage have driven some of New Zealand's best loved species of birds closer to extinction.

They are robbing the entire world and all future generations of what were beautiful and unique and harmless creatures that had more right to live in NZ than man.
It's a pity the rest of the world can't boycott the NZ dairy exports, along with all things out of NZ to send them a message - the planet belongs to all creatures, stop destroying it.

They said these birds could still be found in the Waikato area 20 years ago. I don't know what is worse, that they are wiping them out or that they didn't try and save them. So did the NZers not notice what was happening in their own back yard. Of course they did, they just saw a few dollars from building more settlements and farming as more important than rare birds, extraordinary species which may or may not be found anywhere else in the world. I guess our first arrivals did the same with the moa. But in their defence they were ignorant, simply needing the land to build more houses and agricultures to feed their children.

Pricks. Once day NZ will collapse under it's own filth, and we will all suffer the fallout.

[lester1199]

What a heartbreaking news story today. Bloody New Zealanders 'out of control and we don't give a shit about the changing land usage have driven some of New Zealand's best loved species of birds closer to extinction.

They are robbing the entire world and all future generations of what were beautiful and unique and harmless creatures that had more right to live in NZ than man.
It's a pity the rest of the world can't boycott the NZ dairy exports, along with all things out of NZ to send them a message - the planet belongs to all creatures, stop destroying it.

They said these birds could still be found in the Waikato area 20 years ago. I don't know what is worse, that they are wiping them out or that they didn't try and save them. So did the NZers not notice what was happening in their own back yard. Of course they did, they just saw a few dollars from building more settlements and farming as more important than rare birds, extraordinary species which may or may not be found anywhere else in the world. I guess our first arrivals did the same with the moa. But in their defence they were ignorant, simply needing the land to build more houses and agricultures to feed their children.

Pricks. Once day NZ will collapse under it's own filth, and we will all suffer the fallout.


:first::niceone::2thumbsup:clap::rofl::yeah::not:: wavey::D:lol::bleh:

well said. very nicely put.

[MD]

You are quite right Marmoot. We...me...you and your neighbour are all as guilty. You drink milk I assume and consume fruit and veges?

I read the NZ bird story. Next time I'm out near Karori wildlife reserve its 'drop some bling' into the donation box time.
But don't expect me to stop drinking milk.

[idb]

This is just the history of the earth.
65 million years ago 75% of the species on earth were wiped out by an asteroid and mass extinctions have happened regularly since.
Humans are just the modern equivalent of the asteroid....humanoids if you will.

We're just clearing the place out for new and possibly more interesting species.

[Hitcher]

We're just clearing the place out for new and possibly more interesting species.

They'll just have to learn to evolve more quickly.

[idb]

They'll just have to learn to evolve more quickly.

I'm relying on Erich Von Daniken to have got it right.
Time for a re-stock!

[Mekk]

This is just the history of the earth.

You're arguing different perspectives.

The argument from the other side is that we supposedly have the ability to prevent things like this, unlike a natural event like a meteorite.

If you want to go to a greater scale though, you could say all life on this planet is temporary and that we're lucky we've got anything from a universe so hostile towards biological growth in the first place.

Some think it's better to live in the down to earth, everyday part of existence, others think from the stars. I think a healthy balance of both is in order, but that's just another perspective.

[Marmoot]

But don't expect me to stop drinking milk.

Nah. Cows are not nearly extinct yet.

[Paul in NZ]

They'll just have to learn to evolve more quickly.


They are - check out the courts section in the paper

[idb]

You're arguing different perspectives.

The argument from the other side is that we supposedly have the ability to prevent things like this, unlike a natural event like a meteorite.


We are just part of the natural order of things despite our best efforts.

[Mekk]

We are just part of the natural order of things despite our best efforts.

I agree, but when people observe cause and effect the scale from their perspective is that they can save animals and species etc.

As futile as it is, people will still care about it because it's from that "closer" perspective.

[idb]

I agree, but when people observe cause and effect the scale from their perspective is that they can save animals and species etc.

As futile as it is, people will still care about it because it's from that "closer" perspective.

If everyone would just realise that it is futile we could all just relax and be happy.
No more sleepless nights about global warming or melting ice caps.
After all...the Amazon forest is nice but all those trees block out the view.

[Marmoot]

No more sleepless nights about global warming or melting ice caps.

The only thing that can make me a sleepless night is a hot and steamy sex session. Followed by a sleepy day....

[Swoop]

I await the headline "Dolphins' wipe out chinese species"...

[Steam]

I await the headline "Dolphins' wipe out chinese species"...

Nazi killer dolphins!