Observations

[Sniper]

Before you read the post, you are going to read this (Not because you have to, but because you are curious to read what I say) But this is just my opinion. Keep in mind I do not have the years of wisdom such as some on KB and Im also willing to have my mistakes pointed out and try solutions offered. Bit different from your average youngster.

I have noticed an increasing trend of finger pointing and "you are an arsehole for doing X" posts. Ok sure, maybe certain members did do stuff that they shouldnt have done because it would have taken 2 seconds to rethink options and gone with common sense. I am not standing up for them nor defending what they did, I am just curious as to why so many jump on the finger pointing, "You Dun Rong!" band wagon. Im interested to see what makes some tick.

Sure, I can understand that stupid antics can and do end up in tears. A wheelie goes wrong and causes an accident or pillion injury. Speeding results in tickets or going into the back of a parked car. Following too close results in a rear end ect. I could go on for ages with potential bad and stupid situations that end in tears and harm to another human.

I also understand that those that get caught out by police or a fellow human doing something wrong/dangerous/stupid can and do jump up and down and not accept responsibility for their actions. It is an all too common trend to be caught speeding and turn round and blame the cops for filling their quota, targeting you because you are on a bike or just plain didnt like you. It is a dying breed these days that own up when they are caught, accept their punishment and learn from it.

Now I am not implying anything in anyway to Morcs thread. Sure that had a part in my motivation to post this thread, but the reason is I have noticed in real life (Shock horror) that too many people will call someone stupid, an arsehole, a moron or any other name EVEN WHEN THEY SAY SORRY, I KNOW WHAT I DID WAS WRONG. Ok, they may have put me, you, someone else in danger, but when they come out and say sorry about it, you can still harbour an annoyance, but do you still really hate them?

Sure thing, point and call people names who blame everyone but themselves when they get caught out. Those people deserve it. I had a customer at work who was caught doing 123km in a 50km zone the other day. he was locked up overnight, had his license taken off him and was told he may not leave the country until the court case. Part that pissed me off was that he blamed the whole fiasco on my job, me, the NZ govt and the police for targeting tourists. Not once did he admit fault.

Now (after my rather rounded and confusing post) why are people so quick to pass judgement on other bikers when they are caught and admit wrong and they will earn from their mistakes? I would like to find anyone on the site who has not once tried to break the rules (whether they were caught or not) for their own personal gain.

Flame away, but my opions are just that. A thought or an observation that I am curious to know whether it is right or there are reasons I miss for peoples veiws.

[hyobad]

Do you insinuate that saying sorry makes it ok?

[Sniper]

Do you insinuate that saying sorry makes it ok?

No I don't. I think the willingness to learn from your mistake and make an obvious change to your riding style that is noticed and proves you learned does.

On a side note. Like I said, I am just curious, in no way do I wish to call anyone anything (Like I did wrongly on the other thread). Im just curious as to why we are all so quick to point the finger when someone makes an obvious attempt to learn from their mistakes

[Krusti]

I think what people forget is that this site is really no different than standing up on a stage in front of a group of bike riders and making a statement to them all.

You are never going to get the whole crowd to agree with you and of course there will always be hecklers and smart arses. This is life.

If a person seeks the opinion of others they must be willing to listen to the negative as well as positive.

My personal view is that if you do something dumb or stupid and come a croppa and then post it on here and then expect everyone to be simpathetic more fool you.

I have learnt, don't post if you can't take the negative.

As for those few that are just nasty, well we will never get rid of them without turning this site into a closed forum.

[JMemonic]

Green rep added, very valid points and you are right it is all too common to blame others for mistakes or plan silly actions, I freely admit I do stupid things, always have always will I guess, its human but to blame someone else for what I do is not going to happen.

[Sniper]

Cheers JMemonic.

Krusti, I see what you are saying and that makes a tonne of sense. Im still sitting back wondering why I posted this thread. Maybe I'll learn something and maybe others will too.

[yungatart]

Maybe people flame others because it enhances their sense of well being..you know, "holier than thou" types, or because they think that it could have just as easily been them, but they didn't get caught, therefore the person who did must be stupid.
We all like to think we are better than others eh?

[98tls]

My gripe with someone doing warp speed in a 50/km zone would be if it goes wrong then theres a fair chance he/she is going to hurt someone other than himself and would point that out to him/her.I dont bother getting involved to much but i do get sick of hearing people moaning about speeding tickets/cops etc when they get caught in town or on a main road,as has been said before cops must liken it to taking candy from kids.As an older motorcyclist whose had a few good offs over the years,some my own stupidity and some wrong place wrong time i wouldnt wish one on anyone,if i get in someones face about stupidity on a bike its generally because i care about other human beings and in a small way are trying to save them from some pain.My old man used to shake his head and say "why is it not in you to listen to me,ive already done everything you will ever do" wish i had learnt to listen earlier.:girlfight:

[Virago]

Now, you're not going to red-rep anyone who disagrees are you...? :bleh:


...Now I am not implying anything in anyway to Morcs thread. Sure that had a part in my motivation to post this thread, but the reason is I have noticed in real life (Shock horror) that too many people will call someone stupid, an arsehole, a moron or any other name EVEN WHEN THEY SAY SORRY, I KNOW WHAT I DID WAS WRONG...

Morcs' problem is he thinks he's done nothing wrong or dangerous. That's a different scenario altogether.

Yes we all fuck up, we all break the law occasionally. Some do it more than others.

For us old farts it's difficult to read the "I'm young, dumb, and full of cum" posts, wailing about how things went wrong, when we know that the same guys will be posting the same threads again as soon as they get their licences and bikes back. It's difficult being sympathetic over and over again.

[Sniper]

Now, you're not going to red-rep anyone who disagrees are you...? :bleh:.

LOL, nup, my red reps are very rare. I save them for worthwhile redding



For us old farts it's difficult to read the "I'm young, dumb, and full of cum" posts, wailing about how things went wrong, when we know that the same guys will be posting the same threads again as soon as they get their licences and bikes back. It's difficult being sympathetic over and over again.

OK, I see. So it could likened to a young fella reading an older fellas posts and saying, "What would that old fart know, he is from the dinosaurs"

Although I can understand the part about being sympathetic.

Morc has had more than 1 conviction ect, it doesnt seem like he is slowing down and as I said early, I did wrongly attack a couple of posters. But I do believe that people are more open to change or advice if its offered in a better way than, "Tosspot, you are going to kill someone and go to jail and be someones bitch." I realise now that maybe my posts were more along the lines of trying to open up others minds to the fact that a negative comment goes no where, much like if someone tries to intimidate me into doing something, it doesnt work.

If I could change 1 persons method of advice delivery so that more peopled listened, I would be a happy man.


God damn, I hope Im not turning gay

[jade]

Good post again sniper, I tend to browse this forum alot, but dont post that often because of the atmosphere here,
I freely admit to mistakes I make or get caught for, Its noones fault but your own
When people tell me about fines and stuff now that theyve got, im thinking you idiots, but only because Ive learnt that same lesson the hard way before them, and I think thats related to these older riders bagging these young guys making mistakes.
Theyve learnt their lessons along time ago, adapted to what you can and cant get away with and think less of people going through this unnessacary drama
We are meant to be brothers in arms, nobody wants a ticket - nobody wants to crash, but some of us want to do wheelies, and accelerate, and I suspect that all of us riders want to be better riders
so how bout offering some advice rather than saying your an idiot for not knowing the answer ?
Snipes I like to think i fit into your dying breed category, when Ive made a mistake ive come here and talked about it trying to better myself, but all you get is slated.

[NinjaNanna]

I liken my sense of morality to that of the Justice System - repeat offenders deserve no leiniency.

If someone gets caught and learns that's great, the systems works and I'll give you the benefit of the doubt again in around 2yrs or so if you stuff up again.

If you're young dumb and full a cum - and you re-offend with in weeks then, no, in my book you don't deserve a second thought and I have no interest in associating with you.

From my holier than thou point of view neither Morcs or Skidmark have learnt anything - else neither of them would be in the predicament that they are in now.

To the Skidmarks of the world, come back when you really have grown up rather than talking the talk - but failling to walk the walk.

To the Morcs of this world - pull your head in and ride sensibly as defined by the Road Rules - save it for the track and backroads - not the middle of town with a pillion.

And finally, maybe I'm not a real biker - I think somebody should be embarrassed if they lose their license - but on this site many seem to view it as a right of passage, along with binning your bike.

My 2 cent's but who really cares: The idiots of the world will still green rep other idiots and the sensible will green rep the sensible, kind of pointless really.

Nanna by name - Nanna by nature.

[ManDownUnder]

Stu - you're band on the money in what you said... and for once I'll agree with a Them and US analogy. There's them that won't accept personal responsibility for dumb stuff done...

Then there's "us".

As a grossly generalised comment - take a peek at who gets further in life. The fun things is watching people's transition from "them" to "us". Some people do it quickly, some take their prceious time, some are incredibly slow and some never do.

[Kendog]

The three posts below I think sum up this situation perfectly.

I think somebody should be embarrassed if they lose their license - but on this site many seem to view it as a right of passage, along with binning your bike.
Sooooo many threads talking about illegal actions in this place.


My old man used to shake his head and say "why is it not in you to listen to me,ive already done everything you will ever do" wish i had learnt to listen earlier.:girlfight:
People's responses to these types of threads. On the whole, trying to offer advice.


....thinks he's done nothing wrong or dangerous. That's a different scenario altogether.
But these are the threads that wind me/us up the most. They turn into a "look at me, I am being picked on" thread, with the inevitable trip to PD soon to follow.

[007XX]

I'm with Kendog and MDU on this one...

I think that the clash of generations on here is inevitable, and then of course, you have then to contend with the different personalities.

Personally, although I am very often tempted to call some of these boys all sorts of names, I hold myself back from doing it, as I don't think it would help in any way, shape or form...

But then again, no one or nothing can help, except themselves...

Like Ninjanana said, we do end up not really having any patience or sympathy for these attention seekers, having tried to pass on wisdom to them in the past, but to no avail...

Then, one would hope that a little of that wisdom would advise the owner of it to hold his/ her tongue when tempted to lash out with the finger pointing and or nasty comments which do not assist in the problem. If anything, it'll only feed the attention seeker's hunger for the "look at me, look at me" attitude.

Anyone who has had children will know this. Let's just let them make their mistakes and learn (at their own pace) the lessons.

[paturoa]

... why are people so quick to pass judgement on other bikers when they are caught and admit wrong and they will earn from their mistakes?

I think that is the core of your post.

I thought about that for a bit and for me (I judge but rarely post) the answer is easy, if not enlightening.

.... sitting behind our screens it is easy to type what we really think to some "stranger". Face to face we would seldom say what we really think to dumb arses.

Most probably the posters (dumb arses) wouldn't say what they say online, face to face either.

Our individual, values, morals and ethics are what they are. You won't change mine by telling me that I' dumb arse on-line, I will just mirror your thought back to you.

We "humans" at this stage of our development haven't had a full generation of on-line experience to work out when to say what we really think and when not to.

The core thing here is that every one else who has different values, bahaviours etc to me is a dumb arse. I wouldn't tell them that to their face, but sure as bears shit in the woods I'll think it.

I think I need more beer, perhaps I've already had too many - lol

eidt: this is all based on the premise that I'm not a dumb arse!

[Fatjim]

blah blah blah

[jade]

lol at ur sig ^^
can someone explain what the hell green and red rep are ?

[Steam]

lol at ur sig ^^
can someone explain what the hell green and red rep are ?

If someone hates you they'll click the little plus/minus button top right of your post. Then write something rude. If they hate you a lot they'll do it again and again. I have people on my ignore list because they just kept giving me red rep again and again for no good reason.

green rep is good, click it if someone said something you especially like.

But ultimately it means nothing.

[Hitcher]

Everybody fucks up at least once in their lives. How they cope with that and what they learn from it is what is important.

Some Hebrew dude allegedly once said "Judge not lest ye yourself be judged," and "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." He probably had it about right, hard as it is at times not to be amused by the efforts of fuckwits.

[Big Dave]

Some Hebrew dude allegedly once said

Uncle Manny?

[duckonin]

We all have options, the younger ones take the option most exciting to tell their mates about,some older riders "generally" take the safest option, hence the insurance for younger people..

At the end of the day every person is entitiled to their own opinion, take it or leave it does it matter ? they are going to do what they want to do any way.. Speed be a right prat and in general be a right arshole what ever they do untill time catches up with them....Maturty at some point may set in ..::Playnice:

[The Stranger]

I am just curious as to why so many jump on the finger pointing, "You Dun Rong!" band wagon. Im interested to see what makes some tick.


Because I love a good old fashioned roast.
Particularly when it's someone else getting roasted.



I also understand that those that get caught out by police or a fellow human doing something wrong/dangerous/stupid can and do jump up and down and not accept responsibility for their actions. It is an all too common trend to be caught speeding and turn round and blame the cops for filling their quota, targeting you because you are on a bike or just plain didnt like you. It is a dying breed these days that own up when they are caught, accept their punishment and learn from it.



I got a ticket the other day. I didn't bleat on here, I didn't bleat to the cop.
He only got me for 121 when I had been doing way more than that for the last 3 hours (on a closed road of course) so I thought I got off lightly.

So I accept my punishment and learnt from it.
What did I learn?

Well I went and bought a radar detector cause I learnt you can use all the help you can get when speeding.
Is that the kind of thing you meant Sniper?

[Sniper]

I got a ticket the other day. I didn't bleat on here, I didn't bleat to the cop.
He only got me for 121 when I had been doing way more than that for the last 3 hours (on a closed road of course) so I thought I got off lightly.

So I accept my punishment and learnt from it.
What did I learn?

Well I went and bought a radar detector cause I learnt you can use all the help you can get when speeding.
Is that the kind of thing you meant Sniper?

Well, you learnt from your punishment (the ticket) didnt you? It didnt stop you from speeding, but it did make you think twice about doing it without the help of a detector. Granted, it won't slow you down all the time, but there will be a certain bit of time when you are travelling slower than what you normally do and if we believe the stats, apparently that will make you safer too.

[Big Dave]

Is that the kind of thing you meant Sniper?

Works for me. :clap:

HTFU-ed

[The Stranger]

I think that the clash of generations on here is inevitable, and then of course, you have then to contend with the different personalities.

Personally, although I am very often tempted to call some of these boys all sorts of names, I hold myself back from doing it, as I don't think it would help in any way, shape or form...


I can't agree with what I see as a sweeping generalisation "a clash of generations". By and large from what I have seen of the youf associated with KB they are an awesome bunch and an inspiration.

So a very few of the young ones are a bit loose.
But ironically the only 2 people I have met on KB that I wont ride with would be well and truely classed as adults, given their age, in years that is.

If there is in fact a clash, I suggest it is you oldies whom need to pull your heads in and show a little respect.

[Sniper]

The old saying, "Growing old is mandatory, growing up is optional" could apply here.

However old you are in years makes no stand when you don't show that you have learnt anything in the time you have been alive.


(I have no idea what the fuck I meant when I said that, it made sense briefly)

[007XX]

I can't agree with what I see as a sweeping generalisation "a clash of generations". By and large from what I have seen of the youf associated with KB they are an awesome bunch and an inspiration.

So a very few of the young ones are a bit loose.
But ironically the only 2 people I have met on KB that I wont ride with would be well and truely classed as adults, given their age, in years that is.

If there is in fact a clash, I suggest it is you oldies whom need to pull your heads in and show a little respect.

Yes, I was talking in general...and age rarely has anything to do with maturity. But we were talking about verbal abuse (which I mostly see from "younger" members of KB) and finger pointing (which I mostly see from older members of the KB community...If that's not a clash of generation, then what is it?

Now if you want to single out a couple of individuals, then sure, but you can hardly make an overral call for the whole of the KB Community, can you?

For the record, I have no problems with anyone on this site...Oh hang on, yes I do...what's his name again...Oh WGAF?????


The old saying, "Growing old is mandatory, growing up is optional" could apply here.

However old you are in years makes no stand when you don't show that you have learnt anything in the time you have been alive.


(I have no idea what the fuck I meant when I said that, it made sense briefly)

nah, makes perfect sense to me mate! Very well put....:Punk:

[Ixion]

I can't agree with what I see as a sweeping generalisation "a clash of generations". By and large from what I have seen of the youf associated with KB they are an awesome bunch and an inspiration.

So a very few of the young ones are a bit loose.
But ironically the only 2 people I have met on KB that I wont ride with would be well and truely classed as adults, given their age, in years that is.

If there is in fact a clash, I suggest it is you oldies whom need to pull your heads in and show a little respect.

I cannot let that pass unremarked. I entirely agree. I hate old people . Almost (almost!) all the young chaps are a good lot. And technically far better riders than us old farts (growing up with sprotsbikes, and young reactions etc. We make up for it with spidey sense). I've learned a lot from the younger riders, I hope to learn a lot more. Thanks, chaps.

Youse old farts need to loosen up a bit. My observation is that ones shit stinks more as one ages, not less.