Police watch a kid drown and do nothing!

[canarlee]

no the title is NOT a sick joke!


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/manchester/7006412.stm

they said that they were not trained to jump into the pond so couldnt jump in to try and rescue the kid???


so they just stood there and watched him drown! fucking cunts the pair of them! (sorry about the swearing but........)

[Karma]

And you're surprised?

They're not officially trained police, they're just like temps... secondly, things are difficult now that you could be sued for anything you do... it makes people think twice before doing anything, and in this case that was enough for the kid to die.

[canarlee]

i know that they are not "proper police" they are police helpers more than anything.


but to just stand there and watch a kid drown in 6 feet of water? that is sick! im surprised a mobile fone video of it isnt on you tube, supplied by one of them!

2 fishermen jumped in and rescued his sister, are they being sued for not also rescuing the the kid too? NO. which is what you would expect going by your comment karma (not flaming ya, just pissed off with the PC bullshit that surrounds the case).

[Karma]

they may not be no, but what if they'd dragged the boy out and crippled him or something, could have been sued then.

The whole PC thing is bullshit I know, but trouble is that there are too many people waiting to take advantage of anything they can. Sueing people these days is like winning the lottery.

[canarlee]

i know what you are saying, and sadly i agree.


but on your point, they could be sued for not rescuing him after rescuing the girl.

[sAsLEX]

One report I read had a cop saying he wouldn't of expected/wanted even a fully trained officer to go in as they wouldn't of been able to fully predict the dangers........

What getting muddy shoes?

[canarlee]

One report I read had a cop saying he wouldn't of expected/wanted even a fully trained officer to go in as they wouldn't of been able to fully predict the dangers........

What getting muddy shoes?

or they might have caught a nasty horrible cold! now that would never do would it.

[devnull]

Fuck me... that's just so wrong.

What sort of person can do something like that?

Hell, I ended up with a broken wrist once because I stayed with a patient who was badly injured, and in a hazardous situation. Would do the same again... though the 6 weeks in plaster sucked :-)

The world is seriously fucked up when people are reluctant to step up and try to save a life...

[canarlee]

Fuck me... that's just so wrong.

What sort of person can do something like that?



only the fucking police, thats who.



*disclaimer; not ALL the police are like that, just most of the useless scum.

[Mekk]

There isn't enough information in that story to form an educated opinion on the matter.

Who knows why they didn't jump in, perhaps they froze in fear, perhaps there was something else the media (read: fuckwits) easily ommitted.

Perhaps two other people in the same situation would have done the same thing.

Why do people blame first, then recognise tragedies later? It's bad enough being in a PC world without having people furthering it by looking for someone to attack. Something the media is exceptionally good at.

[breakaway]

"The alarm was raised and the PCSOs arrived on the scene. Police said they could see no sign of Jordon in the water, so they radioed trained officers for help."

That implies that he was already under. What do you people expect the police to do? Jump in there and search for the boy as they hold their breath?

I think you people have seen one too many movies.

It's not like they watched him struggle on the surface and refused to go in the water.

[Donor]

no the title is NOT a sick joke!

No, but it is horribly inaccurate and misleading. With the shit our force are copping, you're beginning to sound like a NZ reporter.


i know that they are not "proper police" they are police helpers more than anything.

So suddenly, two "police" did NOT watch a kid drown?


only the fucking police, thats who.
*disclaimer; not ALL the police are like that, just most of the useless scum.

This was in the UK - good on you for managing to tar every officer in every country all over the world with the same brush for actions NOT taken by 2 guys who weren't even cops.

You're a fucking legend.

[Taz]

Soooo.... where were the parents? Why were they not doing their job and supervising their kids when playing around water? Pisses me off when parents expect others to look after the welfare of their kids when they don't themselves.

[deanohit]

Soooo.... where were the parents? Why were they not doing their job and supervising their kids when playing around water? Pisses me off when parents expect others to look after the welfare of their kids when they don't themselves.

Think though mate, how often were you out on your own when you were 10? I know I used to run rampant with my mates all over the place whether down the beach or in the bush and plenty of things could have happened to us alot further from help than a city pond.
I think it's sad that these part-time cops are being flamed for getting there, finding he'd gone under and called for backup. It's not like they watched him thrashing around on the surface. If they'd got there and got in the water and found the body straight away, they'd be commended for their quick actions.
The police are just people like us, not gods although it seems some of them think they are.

[Steam]

They weren't police and they did not watch the kid drown. He was already out of sight under water when they arrived.

"Police (the PCSO's) said they could see no sign of Jordon in the water, so they radioed trained officers for help."

[Edbear]

, perhaps there was something else the media... easily ommitted.....Something the media is exceptionally good at.



But but, if you can't trust the MEDIA, who can you trust...?:blink: (pt)

While the story sounds bad for the PCSO's, one is always skeptical of the media. Anyone who thinks that the media is not ratings driven, (ie: money), is in dreamworld.

There are usually two sides to the story and I'll be interested in the official investigation as there will definitely be one.

The media will always sensationalise or slant a story to win audience. Fairness and accurate reporting of all the facts on both sides doesn't win the ratings war. :2guns:

[devnull]

I agree that the media will portray this in the worst possible light.
Also, the Police don't deserve blame - the two in the article weren't real cops.

As far as I'm aware, things like lifesaving, swimming, etc, are still part of police training.

I really don't think it matters if they were wearing a uniform or not. What really gets me is that anyone, regardless of who they are, would choose to stand and wait instead of acting immediately. Sounds like the fishermen did the right thing - pity there weren't a few more there.

[KATWYN]

There must be more to this story.....its not nice to crucify anyone
involved in this without knowing the actual facts - sensationalized facts don't count

[Pixie]

If it was NZ police they'd immediately decide to rescue the kid,but take 2 days to get the correct approval to get their uniforms wet

[Pixie]

No, but it is horribly inaccurate and misleading. With the shit our force are copping, you're beginning to sound like a NZ reporter.



So suddenly, two "police" did NOT watch a kid drown?



This was in the UK - good on you for managing to tar every officer in every country all over the world with the same brush for actions NOT taken by 2 guys who weren't even cops.

You're a fucking legend.

You seem to forget the incident of a few years ago where the NZ police AOS waited outside a house,for 3 hours, where a woman was dying from stab wounds.She was on the phone to them,but they weren't going to go inside until they had confirmed where the offender was.Unfortunately, while they sat on their fat blue arses, the woman died.

[marty]

Fuck I'm sick of cop-bashing know-it-alls that have all the opinions in the world, but have no fucking idea of reality, nor do they have the balls to actually join up and make a difference.

Wankers.

[Big Dave]

Fuck I'm sick of cop-bashing know-it-alls that have all the opinions in the world, but have no fucking idea of reality, nor do they have the balls to actually join up and make a difference.

Wankers.

How about the way that chinaman killed his wife, dumped the kid, and everyone is on the cop's case for not looking in the boot.

Unbelievable.

ANY decent alpha male would have jumped in - if there was something to see to rescue. I've been there.

[Steam]

Fuck I'm sick of cop-bashing know-it-alls that have all the opinions in the world, but have no fucking idea of reality, nor do they have the balls to actually join up and make a difference.

Wankers.

+1. Marty speak'n the truth.

[ManDownUnder]

But but, if you can't trust the MEDIA, who can you trust...?:blink: (pt)

While the story sounds bad for the PCSO's, one is always skeptical of the media. Anyone who thinks that the media is not ratings driven, (ie: money), is in dreamworld.

There are usually two sides to the story and I'll be interested in the official investigation as there will definitely be one.

The media will always sensationalise or slant a story to win audience. Fairness and accurate reporting of all the facts on both sides doesn't win the ratings war. :2guns:

Yes yes yes and yes. Standing and watching is only possible if you can see the kid. There is some debate over whether they could. Getting in the water reduces their abilito too things becuaew of the lowered vantage point, and the reporter gets a pat on the back from selling a story the world over, earning gazllions for the paper concerned.

Lets wait for the lother side of the story - which will unfortunately be similarly spin doctored - to emerge and watch the battle of the half truths deny a greiving family of what really happened.

Gutting for the family. I feel sorry for them.

[The Pastor]

only the fucking police, thats who.



*disclaimer; not ALL the police are like that, just the alive ones.

Couldn't agree more.

[Ixion]

What do you people expect the police to do? Jump in there and search for the boy as they hold their breath?


Yes. Exactly that. Not because they're police, but because they're men.

They are not condemned as cops but as men. Doesn't matter if you're a copper or a hairdresser, any man would have gone in. It's what you do, shouldn't even need saying. Radio for help, sure, while you're stripping off.

I'm old and fat and ferociously unfit, but I'd be buggered if I'd just stand there gawping.Even if they couldn't swim they could have waded in chest deep and covered the foreshore.

Yes, recognise the danger of eager rescuers themselves getting into trouble. There was picture of the scene. It's not the North Atlantic in a force 10 gale. Prudence and caution are one thing, cowardice is another.

And of course you'd hold your breath. Be a bloody silly thing not to, wouldn't it.



.its not nice to crucify anyone involved in this without knowing the actual facts

Facts that matter are plain enough. Boy drowned. Men stood and did nothing. There's a picture of the scene. Dunno what more "facts" anyone could want.


(One caveat: The article didn't make it clear that the PCSOs were men. They might have been female, which is a different matter)

[klingon]

Yes. Exactly that. Not because they're police, but because they're men.
...
(One caveat: The article didn't make it clear that the PCSOs were men. They might have been female, which is a different matter)

WOT?! :gob:
I certainly hope that was a P/T Ixion. Any self-respecting human being should do all they can to save the life of another human. I know I would.

[surfchick]

I'm a trained lifeguard and was one for years to pay for uni- and having faced the space in which you are deciding whether a situation is a rescue many times and then done the rescues-key to water rescue is keeping the victim IN-SIGHT - it's why surf rescue involves masses of freestyle-type-swimming with blades but often without burying your head underwater in tthe proper free-style form-in case which you are burrowing toward your victim they submerge and due to no refs you can't locate the spot in the sea in all the chop and surf etc.

main point is that on arriving the two cop-types couldn't actually sight the submerged victim. may have worked to take a chance and go in where someone last saw the victim-would have better chances than standing lake-side. Actually in this country its illegal to withold CPR if you are trained in it. Extremely sad story actually. A chain of command that broke down fatally. Children in water unsupervised in practical terms by physically distant or non-swimming parents (or else they would have made the rescued the first cry). Then potential extra searchers who hesitated. All it takes. This was a lake not the sea -no rips etc. That young child should NEVER EVER have had the opportunity to go out of its depth if they couldn't swim.

If you have kids who can't swim - supervise them diligantly and properly. You don't get to relax and eat or whatever and lift your eye off them till they are back on terra-firma. :(

[Patrick]

You seem to forget the incident of a few years ago where the NZ police AOS waited outside a house,for 3 hours, where a woman was dying from stab wounds.She was on the phone to them,but they weren't going to go inside until they had confirmed where the offender was.Unfortunately, while they sat on their fat blue arses, the woman died.

Forget it? I don't even know of it... probably another media beat up by the sounds of it???


Fuck I'm sick of cop-bashing know-it-alls that have all the opinions in the world, but have no fucking idea of reality, nor do they have the balls to actually join up and make a difference.

Wankers.

C'mon Marty, tell us how you really feel, and stop beating about the bush... Pixie knows the answers?


They are not condemned as cops but as men.
The article didn't make it clear that the PCSOs were men. They might have been female, which is a different matter)

The article may not have condemned them as cops but Canarlee has a different view somehow... Check out the thread heading, "Police watch a kid drown and do nothing..."

As for it making a difference because they may have been female?????? Huh?????????

[Timber020]

If the media reported on this thread it would probably headline as

"Motorcyclists think police are all gutless cunts"

They werent police, they may not even have known how to swim, let alone rescue anyone. They arrived after the kid had dissappeared by the sound of it. The "rules" that they are expected to follow prohibit them from getting into dangerous situations.

The real cop who arrived 5 minutes later did jump straight in.

[canarlee]

they are ACPO


Assitant Community POLICE OFFICERS


*edit; they are PCSOs, POLICE CONSTABLE SPECIAL OFFICERS-------------see the word police there? i do........

ok not "real police", but they are police none the less.


also, i do agree with other posters here, what has being a woman got to do with it?


why any person male or female, would not try to help them i dont know.

[Donor]

they are ACPO


Assitant Community POLICE OFFICERS

Actually, the article says
...two community support officers (PCSOs)

Jesus, you really ought to write for the Herald with your factual statements...


ok not "real police", but they are police none the less.

So are they or aren't they??
Bugger me, I'm getting a headache, forget reporting, you need to move into politics with the bollocks and flip flops!

[arsnik]

Im a trained lifeguard and was one for years to pay for uni- and having faced the space in which you are deciding whether a situation is a rescue many times and then done the rescues-key to water rescue is keeping the victim IN-SIGHT - its why surf rescue involves masses of freestyle-type-swimming

So much for KIWI life saving, by professional life savers.

When on holiday in NZ - Taranaki - Opunaki surfing at 10am. An old white woman (~30 years) dragged out a in rip on her plastic malibu, swell heading into rocks, rip going to australia, lots of LIFE SAVERS on the beach, on look out towers with binos, but all talking to hot women, or looking at woman. No one come out to get her when she was waving. I paddle across half the bay over into the channel and helped her stop PANICing whilst being sucked out and decided she wouldnt make the long paddle back round to shore. So told her to ditch her board jump on mine and Id try slow us down as we got slammed int othe rocks. Snapped my beautiful $900 fish. But she got out, cried for a few minutes, hubby came running around the coast. Took over. I left. Walking back to my campervan, Snapped board, THIRD ONE! I saw a life guard, talking to some horrid horse faced blonde in a bikini with no tits.

I asked him, Did you see that women? Him, Which one?
The one being sucked out the channel down there. Him, Yep saw her, haha, old people trying to surf eh
Is your boat not going? Him, Nah she goes mate, been out this morning at dawn. Got a few incase it breaks down.
Were you about to do anything about the woman you had seen, thats now traumatised with broken bones and full of salt water?Him, Look, I dont start til 12, piss off.

The rage came on quicker than electricity, I fought it for a second, then let it get to me, embraced it, and let a few fists loose.

KIWI LIFE SAVERS. WHAT A JOKE. HE WAS ONE OF 9 COUNTED PRESENT AT 11.50AM

[canarlee]

Actually, the article says

Jesus, you really ought to write for the Herald with your factual statements...

read up, i just edited.

[Donor]

read up, i just edited.

So did I... what a team...

Actually, I know a woman, she cleans at the local station and is on the police payroll for it...

...does that make HER a police officer? Her contract has the logo on it after all...

[Katman]

Fuck I'm sick of cop-bashing know-it-alls that have all the opinions in the world, but have no fucking idea of reality, nor do they have the balls to actually join up and make a difference.

Wankers.

Boo fucking hoo.

[canarlee]

So did I... what a team...

Actually, I know a woman, she cleans at the local station and is on the police payroll for it...

...does that make HER a police officer? Her contract has the logo on it after all...

and now you are being petty and pathetic.



their title is PCSO, which means POLICE CONSTABLE SPECIAL OFFICERS. see that word "police"?


the woman you know probably has the title "office cleaner"? oh so slightly different eh?

[peasea]

Had a quick flick through the story, couldn'tr find a mention of the parent's whereabouts.

Why, when things like this happen (tragedy, for sure) the blame falls on someone else? If mum, dad or both had been there........

However; I think anyone with half a brain would have jumped in unless they couldn't swim. It's not like it was Piha with rips or anything so you do have to wonder.

Police assistants or whatever, where's their humanity?

[Donor]

their title is PCSO, which means POLICE CONSTABLE SPECIAL OFFICERS. see that word "police"?

Try "Police Community Support Officer"

It's in the article - you really ought to refrain from arguing heated opinions unless you can be factual and consistent bud...

[Luckylegs]

So did I... what a team...

Actually, I know a woman, she cleans at the local station and is on the police payroll for it...

...does that make HER a police officer? Her contract has the logo on it after all...

Title not important, but... If something is dropped in the Bog, She better know we expect her in there without delay whether the item is bobbing around the surface or sunk behind the s bend......

:lol:

[puddy]

What, one less Pom? Yep, I blame the Mother!

[puddy]

Another one of the 101 reasons why you should n't read the BBC News!

[surfchick]

So much for KIWI life saving, by professional life savers.

When on holiday in NZ - Taranaki - Opunaki surfing at 10am. An old white woman (~30 years) dragged out a in rip on her plastic malibu, swell heading into rocks, rip going to australia, lots of LIFE SAVERS on the beach, on look out towers with binos, but all talking to hot women, or looking at woman. No one come out to get her when she was waving. I paddle across half the bay over into the channel and helped her stop PANICing whilst being sucked out and decided she wouldnt make the long paddle back round to shore. So told her to ditch her board jump on mine and Id try slow us down as we got slammed int othe rocks. Snapped my beautiful $900 fish. But she got out, cried for a few minutes, hubby came running around the coast. Took over. I left. Walking back to my campervan, Snapped board, THIRD ONE! I saw a life guard, talking to some horrid horse faced blonde in a bikini with no tits.

I asked him, Did you see that women? Him, Which one?
The one being sucked out the channel down there. Him, Yep saw her, haha, old people trying to surf eh
Is your boat not going? Him, Nah she goes mate, been out this morning at dawn. Got a few incase it breaks down.
Were you about to do anything about the woman you had seen, thats now traumatised with broken bones and full of salt water?Him, Look, I dont start til 12, piss off.

The rage came on quicker than electricity, I fought it for a second, then let it get to me, embraced it, and let a few fists loose.

KIWI LIFE SAVERS. WHAT A JOKE. HE WAS ONE OF 9 COUNTED PRESENT AT 11.50AM

Yup there;s a mix of lifeguards that concentrate and one's that tootle on the quadbikes checking and nodding at babes. gotta say gutted gutted you lost your board - two things- you did the right thing AND she should have had hubby or herself hook you up for it. however I have to say alot of lifeguards,myself included swim out and drag people out of the surf semi-regular.

surfers do alot of rescuing too as they are usually fit ah hem and can travel faster than a swimmer-two good friends of mine were surfing a summer cyclone swell at hot water beach but had come out of the water. they heard two japanese tourists calling getting sucked out and both boys blasted out the back on the mals picking up one swimmer each. they gave both CPR and the man lived and woman died :(

[puddy]

Is this genuine 'outrage', or 'talkback.........long time listener, daily caller' outrage?

[Luckylegs]

Is this genuine 'outrage', or 'talkback.........long time listener, daily caller' outrage?

Outrage is specifically reserved for two subjects around here... They are (in no particular order...) Speeding Fines and A certain KB'r (who rides too fast, dangerously and needs to get a job)... :lol:

[surfchick]

Why, when things like this happen (tragedy, for sure) the blame falls on someone else? If mum, dad or both had been there........

I take a pretty tuff view on that one - if kids are in or even near water who can't swim - 100% supervision = safer kids. lax or non existent supervison = putting the children's wellbeing into the children's hands and taking your chances with them managing their wellbeing with smaller weaker bodies and less contextual knowledge of water hazards than an adult. the sad thing is a moment of non-concentration from guardians can end in a drowning - happening in families who are normally super careful (as has happened a friend of mine-which was a pool accident with adults nearby but not watching - responded to CPR but severe brain damage for life). I'm not sure about the case in the UK really-details being a bit sketchy-but it's a timely reminder coming up to our summer to mind the kids near water. In recent years in NZ watersports combined passed rugby as the sport participated in by the highest no. of kiwis - kiwis looovvee the water :) therefore kiwi's are cool :cool:

[devnull]

Yes. Exactly that. Not because they're police, but because they're men.

They are not condemned as cops but as men. Doesn't matter if you're a copper or a hairdresser, any man would have gone in. It's what you do, shouldn't even need saying. Radio for help, sure, while you're stripping off.

I'm old and fat and ferociously unfit, but I'd be buggered if I'd just stand there gawping.Even if they couldn't swim they could have waded in chest deep and covered the foreshore.

Yes, recognise the danger of eager rescuers themselves getting into trouble. There was picture of the scene. It's not the North Atlantic in a force 10 gale. Prudence and caution are one thing, cowardice is another.

And of course you'd hold your breath. Be a bloody silly thing not to, wouldn't it.


Facts that matter are plain enough. Boy drowned. Men stood and did nothing. There's a picture of the scene. Dunno what more "facts" anyone could want.


(One caveat: The article didn't make it clear that the PCSOs were men. They might have been female, which is a different matter)

Well said!!

As society has become more and more PC, people seem to have become less likely to involve themselves in assisting others. Doesn't matter if it's a cop being set on by a group of thugs, or a child in trouble, there was once a time that the average person would just jump into the middle and help.

When you compare that attitude with the attitude that many people display today i.e. not wanting to get involved, it sucks. If that's progress, I'm not interested. People have given up too much...

[Mekk]

Everything before the part below.

I agree. It's not about them being cops or trainee cops or whatever the fuck they were, it's about them being cowards. The reporter has just dredged up as much dirt on them as they can by pulling that into the equation.

The problem I have with it is...



Facts that matter are plain enough. Boy drowned. Men stood and did nothing. There's a picture of the scene. Dunno what more "facts" anyone could want.

...is it cowardice? Or is that the slant the reporter put on it? It doesn't seem exceptional for me to believe someone would go there for a story, so I remain skeptical. I think the cowardice is in the reporting here. It's far too easy to accept something that someone else says... who wasn't even there.

Facts that matter are also things like WHY they didn't act, from their perspective. It may seem like cowardice from our side (the reporter's side) but it may be due to something completely different. The fact remains that they did call for help, so they didn't do nothing.

ALL the facts are important, not just the reported ones. Example: "Planes hit twin towers. Government doesn't shoot them down. Government hates the public." Reporter eats.

[marty]

i risked my life a number of times, jumping into the waikato river at both at night and during the day, to save the lives of losers who thought they could swim to their escape. EVERY time i seriously thought about not getting in, as why should i die for some scrote bag burglar. EVERY time though, my partner(s) and i got wet for the cause. 1 guy we never found. i didn't get in one time, after a guy fell/jumped from the claudlands (mcdonalds) bridge and didn't come up. we found him impaled on a logjam under the bridge 3 days later.

what was my point. oh yes. every time, a call is made as to the actions taken. second guessing those calls on the internet is pointless. sometimes those calls are good, sometimes they could be better. if one of the PCSOs had have died searching for an already dead kid, where was the value in that?

i'm surprised there isn't a bunch of bikers riding around looking for little old ladies falling over on the footpath to save, judging by some of the judgmental bullshit that is spouted on here.

[sunhuntin]

i
if one of the PCSOs had have died searching for an already dead kid, where was the value in that?
.


saving private ryan comes to mind...

[peasea]

Outrage is specifically reserved for two subjects around here... They are (in no particular order...) Speeding Fines and A certain KB'r (who rides too fast, dangerously and needs to get a job)... :lol:

Hmm, can't be me, I currently have 5 employers.

[peasea]

i risked my life a number of times, jumping into the waikato river at both at night and during the day, to save the lives of losers who thought they could swim to their escape. EVERY time i seriously thought about not getting in, as why should i die for some scrote bag burglar. EVERY time though, my partner(s) and i got wet for the cause. 1 guy we never found. i didn't get in one time, after a guy fell/jumped from the claudlands (mcdonalds) bridge and didn't come up. we found him impaled on a logjam under the bridge 3 days later.

what was my point. oh yes. every time, a call is made as to the actions taken. second guessing those calls on the internet is pointless. sometimes those calls are good, sometimes they could be better. if one of the PCSOs had have died searching for an already dead kid, where was the value in that?

i'm surprised there isn't a bunch of bikers riding around looking for little old ladies falling over on the footpath to save, judging by some of the judgmental bullshit that is spouted on here.

I, again, ask myself; "where were the parents?" I also would like to add that 'jumping in after some scroat' takes some humanity. WTF? Regardless of whether these people were law enforcement agents or not, there's a kid drowning, it you can swim, help out!

[98tls]

I, again, ask myself; "where were the parents?" I also would like to add that 'jumping in after some scroat' takes some humanity. WTF? Regardless of whether these people were law enforcement agents or not, there's a kid drowning, it you can swim, help out! Sounds logical to me..........coming back from ch-ch today in my ute came across a biker standing by his bike in the pissing rain......only logical to stop/throw bike on back etc...........like you say if you can.....help out.

[marty]

it's 'scrote'.

and maybe those PCSO's couldn't swim. maybe they were like security guards - wanna be cops but couldn't swim a length in under a minute?

[Roadrash]

only the fucking police, thats who.



*disclaimer; not ALL the police are like that, just most of the useless scum.

They AINT COPS!!!, is this another Police slagging thread, or are you gonna get your facts right,

:Oi:

[peasea]

Sounds logical to me..........coming back from ch-ch today in my ute came across a biker standing by his bike in the pissing rain......only logical to stop/throw bike on back etc...........like you say if you can.....help out.

Bravo. I'd do the same.

[peasea]

it's 'scrote'.

and maybe those PCSO's couldn't swim. maybe they were like security guards - wanna be cops but couldn't swim a length in under a minute?


Call them what you will, spell it how you like, the sentiment is the same.
Maybe they couldn't swim, which is what I said.

Where are you going with that?

[peasea]

They AINT COPS!!!, is this another Police slagging thread, or are you gonna get your facts right,

:Oi:

Cop bashing? I didn't see it as that, I saw it as cold-people bashing, cops or not.

I actually think that the average bobby would have jumped in; and therein lies the difference. They weren't 'real' bobbies.

Check that out! I've come to the defence of the police twice in one week!

(Must be running low on bourbon.)

[MD]

This thread needs it's title re-written!
I just read that story and as some have said.
1. They were not police, and most importantly
2. they DID NOT watch the boy drown. Kind of ruins the title don't you think.

What they did do was arrive at a pond after the boy disappeared and the parents still hadn't arrived (therein lies the real question of responsibility me thinks). The anglers had already saved the girl and had no way of finding the boy.
The Police Support officers crime was to arrive on the scene not wearing their Batman issue belts with; GPS sunken body locators; underwater mirky pond visibility googles; micro pocket sized airtanks

I can only assume that since the Anglers went in to help and could only get the sister out that they would have saved the boy - if they could have. The article was clear on this - at that point in time the boy was submerged and out of sight. How then were the CPSO that arrived later supposed to archieve anything more?

The Parents outcries against the CPSOs for not going in smells of hypocrisy, when in fact it was the parents who should have been there to go into the water in the first place.

The Boy was very brave going in to help his little sister. That bit touched me.

[marty]

nowhere. just sick of wankers like carnalee bashing cops, with no idea of reality, or even having read the article properly

[scumdog]

Fuck I'm sick of cop-bashing know-it-alls that have all the opinions in the world, but have no fucking idea of reality, nor do they have the balls to actually join up and make a difference.

Wankers.

Yup.

How many of these cop-bashing comments ever come from ex-cops, you know, the people who have actually 'been there'??

[98tls]

Yup.

How many of these cop-bashing comments ever come from ex-cops, you know, the people who have actually 'been there'?? :Oi:on the inter-web everybodys been there.........just like they all have 12 inch dicks.......:msn-wink:

[peasea]

:Oi:on the inter-web everybodys been there.........just like they all have 12 inch dicks.......:msn-wink:

Not mine, I always win the "Little Penis" competitons, which is why I'm the winner I am.

So, any leads on why mum and dad weren't near their kids when the kids were within spitting distance of the water?

[Patrick]

*edit; they are PCSOs, POLICE CONSTABLE SPECIAL OFFICERS-------------see the word police there? i do........

ok not "real police", but they are police none the less.

So does that mean my Police car, because it says Police, is a Police Officer??????:weird:



Boo fucking hoo.

Hello WINJA Wannabe....


They AINT COPS!!!, is this another Police slagging thread, or are you gonna get your facts right,

:Oi:


Cop bashing? I didn't see it as that, I saw it as cold-people bashing, cops or not.

I actually think that the average bobby would have jumped in; and therein lies the difference. They weren't 'real' bobbies.

Check that out! I've come to the defence of the police twice in one week!

(Must be running low on bourbon.)

Whether it was Canarleees own thread header or he copied it from the original article, it was clearly a go at cops.

You bumped your head Peasea???? My stash of Bourbon has run out... I had better stop now.....

[peasea]

So does that mean my Police car, because it says Police, is a Police Officer??????:weird:




Hello WINJA Wannabe....





Whether it was Canarleees own thread header or he copied it from the original article, it was clearly a go at cops.

You bumped your head Peasea???? My stash of Bourbon has run out... I had better stop now.....

I'm always bumping my head and on occasion I bash my skull.
Nah, fair's fair, cops aren't always to blame......

Right?

[NordieBoy]

Boy helping sister.
Anglers save sister.
Boy goes under.
Anglers call for help.
SCPO's arrive.
No sign of boy - he's somewhere in that large pond.

[Patrick]

Boy helping sister.
Anglers save sister.
Boy goes under.
Anglers call for help.
SCPO's arrive.
No sign of boy - he's somewhere in that large pond.

Sounds about right... but you forgot, "where was mum or dad????"

[Patrick]

I'm always bumping my head and on occasion I bash my skull.
Nah, fair's fair, cops aren't always to blame......

Right?

Supposed to hide the tip of the hook in the bait, ya know....

[peasea]

Supposed to hide the tip of the hook in the bait, ya know....

Ya know it's Sunday, the end of the week, when everyone gets sensitive.

I'm not the only one thinking "where were the parents?" :argh:

If you can't see anything, you can't save it. If the boy was already underwater what's the point in jumping in? Where do you look? What's the best place to jump in? I bet the onlookers feel like crap right now.

[_Shrek_]

no the title is NOT a sick joke!


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/manchester/7006412.stm

they said that they were not trained to jump into the pond so couldnt jump in to try and rescue the kid???


so they just stood there and watched him drown! fucking cunts the pair of them! (sorry about the swearing but........)

i reckon you need to go back and read it again canarlee they are PCSO's police and they arrived after the kid had disappeared so they did the right thing
so "PULL YA HEAD IN", why don't you ask where were the parents or their minder instead of cop bashing

[canarlee]

i reckon you need to go back and read it again canarlee they are PCSO's police and they arrived after the kid had disappeared so they did the right thing
so "PULL YA HEAD IN", why don't you ask where were the parents or their minder instead of cop bashing

and where was i "cop bashing" there?



peasea got it right when he said that i was having a go at them, not at cops!



now you pull ya head in you muppet

[Mekk]

No, you shut up.

No, YOU shut up!

[canarlee]

No, you shut up.

No, YOU shut up!

yebbut the voices told me to tell them to pass on that the other voices aint listening.

[Karma]

I saw some coppers doing a drink drive compulsary test today, good stuff on them, I'm all for that and will happily pay my taxes knowing that drink drivers are being pulled off the road (two boy racer type cars parked up next to the cops).

Doesn't make up for the guy that generated some random numbers to put on my ticket though...

[Patrick]

and where was i "cop bashing" there?



peasea got it right when he said that i was having a go at them, not at cops!



now you pull ya head in you muppet

If ya have a look at your opening post #1... the thread header and opening line.... then the comments about the word "Police" since.... that is where the "cop bashing" idea has come from...

[mstriumph]

.................
Facts that matter are plain enough. Boy drowned. Men stood and did nothing. There's a picture of the scene. Dunno what more "facts" anyone could want.

with respect, that's not the facts as reported in the article? - if they had been as per above, everyone's outrage here would be justified - as it is, i believe it's misplaced



.................
(One caveat: The article didn't make it clear that the PCSOs were men. They might have been female, which is a different matter)

:Oi: call me a heathen - i don't have the quaint, peculiarly western, notion of chivalry that seems implicit in this post........

do you REALLY mean that a person's gender obviates any requirement for them to behave like a human being??? .......

i'm shocked. :mellow:

[sunhuntin]

No, you shut up.

No, YOU shut up!

heheh... brother bear

[Manxman]

There isn't enough information in that story to form an educated opinion on the matter.

Who knows why they didn't jump in, perhaps they froze in fear, perhaps there was something else the media (read: fuckwits) easily ommitted.

Perhaps two other people in the same situation would have done the same thing.

Why do people blame first, then recognise tragedies later? It's bad enough being in a PC world without having people furthering it by looking for someone to attack. Something the media is exceptionally good at.


"The alarm was raised and the PCSOs arrived on the scene. Police said they could see no sign of Jordon in the water, so they radioed trained officers for help."

That implies that he was already under. What do you people expect the police to do? Jump in there and search for the boy as they hold their breath?

I think you people have seen one too many movies.

It's not like they watched him struggle on the surface and refused to go in the water.

...well done you two - these are the most informed & balanced comments I have read on this. However, it is fairly typical and human nature for us to jump to conclusions on what we initially believe to be factual reports, so I'm not flaming everyone else.

Reality is, the media are invariably to blame in cases like this by putting 2 and 2 together and coming up with 45p (about the price of a newspaper). BBC used to be factual and balanced, but are now barely better than the rest. My parting shot is about NZ media, who IMHO, are being infiltrated by ex-pat pom editors/staffers/journos, who are bringing this sort of shi*tty "reporting" technique with them. You just have to watch TV1 and read the Dom to see how often slow news days are filled with what can only be described as Daily Mirror-like and deliberately inflammatory opinion (note...opinion, not fact).

[Ixion]

Some have suggested that the "media" have omitted significant information to sensationalise the story. I have reviewed the quite extensive media reports Unless all the news media in Britain have joined together in a conspiracy, I can see no basis for such an opinion. Nor were the salient facts rebutted in the official statement of the local Assistant Chief Constable, Dave Thompson.

Some further information that was not in the original link.

The two elderly anglers (63 and 66) did in fact wade into the water to rescue the little girl.

When the PCSOs arrived they radioed for help (OK so far). One then cycled back to the road to wait for the police to arrive. The other stood and watched.

Some five minutes after the arrival of the PCSOs , the boys stepfather arrived (with a friend) and immediately entered the water and started searching. The anglers who had retrieved the girl had also returned to the water to search. A few moments after the stepfather , a police sergeant arrived, but was delayed by the need to remove his body armour. During this, the two PCSOs were standing at the water's edge, watching.

It was the step father who retrieved the boy.

The boy was still alive when brought out of the water , though unconscious and not breathing. The police sergeant applied CPR and the boy was airlifted to hospital , where he died in the early hours of the next morning.

Minutes count in drowning. Had the PCSOs attempted to retrieve the boy, several minutes might have been gained. That might have made the difference.

Of course, it might not have. Or they might have been unable to find him. (Though they knew exactly where he went under, and the boy's stepfather who did find him had no fancy gear). But, they could have TRIED. One can always try.

On consideration, I stand by my condemnation. That has nothing whatsoever to do with whether they were police or not. Nor has it anything to do with who, if anyone, should be blamed for the children being there unsupervised.

The facts seem clear and irrefutable to me. And the two , guilty of cowardice, forfeit the right to be called men.

I am glad the two anglers, men of my own generation, were of bolder stuff.

[mstriumph]

but Ixion
you didn't answer the second part of my post ......