FZR disc and rotor assembly

[stunz]

Hi everyone,
I own and ride a Yamaha FZR 250 50kms into the city everyday and on my latest warrant check it has come to pass that *apparently* I have overheated my front disc one too many times (that durned hill!) and now need to acquire a new assembly because of its warped nature. (Feels fine to me, but alas, I can't really argue with the boys that REALLY know what they're talking about)

I can source a factory set-up for about $700 or an aftermarket custom set-up for $300. The only problem with that option is the 3 weeks wait to get it done.

Now I know its not really such a good idea to go looking around for second hand brake parts :confused2 but am also not looking forward to sitting on the train for three weeks.
So, if anyone knows of a decent "wreck" or front rotor assembly that I can get my paws on, my "hole-on-two-wheels-I-pour-money-into-yamaha" and I would be so happy.

Of course, the price should be right, and the part in reasonably good condition. (I just recently shelled out my "bike allowance" on some new rubber, plugs and battery, and I may end up parking it up for a while if no luck here :crybaby: )

Anyway, thanks for reading this.
Stu

[geoffm]

Hi everyone,
I own and ride a Yamaha FZR 250 50kms into the city everyday and on my latest warrant check it has come to pass that *apparently* I have overheated my front disc one too many times (that durned hill!) and now need to acquire a new assembly because of its warped nature. (Feels fine to me, but alas, I can't really argue with the boys that REALLY know what they're talking about)


Who told you it was overheated? If it was the WOF inspector, they would be the only one in the country who knows about bikes. Our local ones are total prats, and a source of never ending hassle. Worst I have come across was Waitakere testing station - never go there. Haven't a clue and will make problems if they can't find any
Is it discoloured? Under thickness limit? Runout (and how much)? Do the brakes pulse? Pads ok?
I bet if you clean it up and take it back it will be fine...
Have a look for FZR400 disks - I think they may be the same. Front disks are always hard to find.
Geoff

[Magua]

"hole-on-two-wheels-I-pour-money-into-yamaha"
:D I know how you feel. Since I bought mine the problems seem to mount and the price just keeps rising.

[White trash]

Who told you it was overheated? If it was the WOF inspector, they would be the only one in the country who knows about bikes. Our local ones are total prats, and a source of never ending hassle. Worst I have come across was Waitakere testing station - never go there. Haven't a clue and will make problems if they can't find any
Is it discoloured? Under thickness limit? Runout (and how much)? Do the brakes pulse? Pads ok?
I bet if you clean it up and take it back it will be fine...
Have a look for FZR400 disks - I think they may be the same. Front disks are always hard to find.
Geoff

Possibly not overheated but below minimum thickness. Now they have to be measured during a WOF inspection, alot of people are seeking new discs.

[stunz]

Thanks Geoff,
I've been informed it is pulse (bent disc) and for sure, it does get a little jittery on the hard squeeze, but it must be real bad cos the testing dude wouldn't even take it out for a spin. Too dangerous.
The pads are fine, no doscolouration, and thickness is ok. A mate has suggested machining the disc as there is plenty of thickness left, but am not totally sold on this idea. If it goes wrong then I have no bike at all.
Thanks for the tip about the 400 discs. Will keep my eyes peeled.

[kerryg]

Thanks Geoff,
I've been informed it is pulse (bent disc) and for sure, it does get a little jittery on the hard squeeze, but it must be real bad cos the testing dude wouldn't even take it out for a spin. Too dangerous.
The pads are fine, no doscolouration, and thickness is ok. A mate has suggested machining the disc as there is plenty of thickness left, but am not totally sold on this idea. If it goes wrong then I have no bike at all.
Thanks for the tip about the 400 discs. Will keep my eyes peeled.


Smythe + Yeates in Cambridge can straighten warped rotors in most cases (I believe F1 Engineering in Hamilton can do the same). Machining bike rotors is not straightforward but I guess you might find someone to do it if you hunt around (the guys who do car rotors are usually not interested in doing bike rotors because the metallurgy is different) but then you may end up with an issue with thickness. The deal with S+Y is you courier it to them and if they can't properly fix it they won't. They do good work, as other members of KB can testify I'm sure

[F5 Dave]

Tis the bugbear of Yams that vintage I’m afraid. Just bought some for my YZF. 2nd pair, have some PFMs on it now, but they succumbed, so now it’s to try Brembos (same as Ducs on some Yams).
& in the same week my RF. Lets spend some money.

I had the RF ones skimmed & it seemed to work. When I bought the bike it had serious warp & the bike juddered when braking from speed. The lass who owned it hadn’t noticed. :wacko: The VTNZ station had just given it a WOF, but I tell you it was serious dangerous! Knackered the head bearings as a result.

I took it home & wouldn’t ride it until fixed. Sadly 4000k later it returns so I’ve just ordered some EBCs from Cyclebrakes in US. $380US a pair. Freight will run a bunch more though.

[riffer]

Steering heads and rotors.

Bloody Yamaha's.

Have the same problem.

And it always seems to get worse come warrant time too...
:angry2::angry2::angry2:

Some nice Brembo's on trademe... 320mm. But I think the FZR250's are 290mm aren't they?

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/Motorbikes/Motorbike-Parts/Wheels-tyres-brakes/auction-17049522.htm

[F5 Dave]

Think I bought the first set of those.

Yeah its a drag, but Hondas of the 80s 90s it was Camchain tensioners, Suzukis it was rust in the tank clogging the carbs & dogey electrics. etc etc

[stunz]

The VTNZ station had just given it a WOF, but I tell you it was serious dangerous! Knackered the head bearings as a result.
You know, the funny thing is, I had the headstock bearings replaced about a month ago, and they didn't tell me then that my brakes were knackered.
Go figure...

[stunz]

Steering heads and rotors.

Bloody Yamaha's.

Have the same problem.

And it always seems to get worse come warrant time too...
:angry2::angry2::angry2:

Ain't that the truth. The little lady has just informed me that I seriously need to look at getting something a little less expensive to keep on the road every six months like a gn250... :eek5:
(for the last 18 months, a new set of tyres, f&B each time it went in for a warrant. Did they just see me coming or do sports tyres only last 5000 kays in real life?...)

[F5 Dave]

Well sometimes when a mechanic is doing a test ride they are more likely to look at what they have just done. But yeah if it shudders then they should have picked it up. When rolling towards the lights with the brakes on lightly & it grips, lets go, grips, lets go that is another symptom.

Vehicles cost money. 5000k out of a tire on a 250 seems pretty quick. Try another brand of tyre & check them for low pressure. Many people run them too low. Measure them.

If you bought a new bike it would not require so much maintenance, but you would be getting mondo devaluation come sell time. Try that on her. Also tell her that you have read (well you're readiing it here, don't mention I just made it up) that modern city dwelling male's sperm count drops if they aren't involved in sporty or outdoor activity so this is cheaper than IVF at a later date.

[Motu]

We often get those remarks (cars) ''how come it needs new brakes,I just got a WoF last week''...''how come it needs new brake hoses,it was just seviced last week''

A WoF is a non intrusive visual inpection,a service is in depth maintanence,but not a safety or compliance test - different aspects of the vehicle are looked at...confusing to the owner I know,but it's nice to have someone to blame eh?

[geoffm]

Thanks Geoff,
I've been informed it is pulse (bent disc) and for sure, it does get a little jittery on the hard squeeze, but it must be real bad cos the testing dude wouldn't even take it out for a spin. Too dangerous.
The pads are fine, no doscolouration, and thickness is ok. A mate has suggested machining the disc as there is plenty of thickness left, but am not totally sold on this idea. If it goes wrong then I have no bike at all.
Thanks for the tip about the 400 discs. Will keep my eyes peeled.

Take your disks along to the wreckers and have a rummage through the piles - Yamaha are famous parts-bin engineers and will often use the parts on a variety of models.
Watch for the amount of offset if they have dished centres.
You may be able to get them straigntened and/or machined. Bike disks are as hard as f**k to turn and do a good job. Best bet is grinding - if they are flat this is easy. if not, you will have to disassemble the bobbins and take the disk outer into a machine shop with a surface grinder. You can buy new bobbins to refix the outer onto the centre. Second hand disks might be cheaper. talk to your localk Yam man, and cross reference the part numbers to other models (they can do this on the computer) so you know what to look for. Also have a look at wreckers in Australia possibly.
Geoff

[F5 Dave]

I'd like to know where you can buy new bobbins. The stock ones are rivets & need to be ground off. My PFM rotor kits came with new bobbins, but to buy spares was a $$$ joke.

[stunz]

Vehicles cost money. 5000k out of a tire on a 250 seems pretty quick. Try another brand of tyre & check them for low pressure. Many people run them too low. Measure them.
Yep, always keep my eye on tyre pressures, keeping them to optimum. (even have a foot pump in the tank bag to adjust as necessary) and I use a harder compound tyre because its *supposed* to last a little longer for the type of riding I do. Hard, but not so fast...(I mean, geez, it is only a fizzer...)

Could be I'm just too fat, err, heavy...and thats whats causing the tyre wear. I also like to lean it over occasionally and that could be another contributing factor... :yes:

The thing is, I have tried medium, soft and hard compunds, but all wear out as quick as each other. Don't really have an opinion on brands, but usually go for the Pirelli. Maybe I just need to try a different kind of bike: alter my riding style.... maybe get myself a Vigaro or something, where leaning over 5 deg off centre will cause the pegs, exhaust and oilpan to scrape the blacktop...and ultimately take away the reason for riding a bike in the first place eh?...

[stunz]

A WoF is a non intrusive visual inpection,a service is in depth maintanence,but not a safety or compliance test...Agreed, a wof is only to see if the vehicle is fit to be on the road.
You'd think, however, that regular servicing would pick up severe safety issues? My last service showed new head stock bearings required, (maybe as a direct result of the bad disc?) but no mention of the disc itself. I know you can get full on, thousand dollar + service jobs that replace nearly everything that can be replaced, but for the good ol kiwi "have a squizz and tell me what needs fixing NOW" service, a warped front disc should have been picked up straight off the bat...considering it is the primary stopping mechanism of the bike.
Oh well, you live and learn...

[vifferman]

What about that outfit in Waihi that advertise brake disks on TradeMe? Anyone here try them for new disks? Their prices seem reasonable.

[stunz]

Apparently, a Ducati 750 disc and rotor will fit...factory version is cheaper by $300 over the Yamaha factory version. $750!!! Either way, my riding days are over for the next couple of weeks... :thud:
I hate trains...

[F5 Dave]

There have been a couple of Kiwi companies that have made discs, I don’t know of any that have been any chop though, but would be happy to hear of good results from someone who has had some with reasonable mileage & they are still straight.

I had a friend investigate the correct material to use & import some at great expense (using plate steel is easy but it tends to warp no matter how it is cut. His theory is it is different densities throughout; thus heats at different rates,= warps). Sadly he closed up his shop & got a job so I don’t know that any where really made or how successfully.

Still think 5000k is bugger all wear for a 250. I typically get 6-8000k rears on my 750 & that is only sport ridden & tyres replaced at the legal stage. Think the MEZ3s lasted the longest, though the Pilot Sports look every bit as good (just as they are being phased out). Usually run at 2.3 & 2.5 bar. Any lower & you will wear tyres quickly.

[F5 Dave]

Apparently, a Ducati 750 disc and rotor will fit...factory version is cheaper by $300 over the Yamaha factory version. $750!!! Either way, my riding days are over for the next couple of weeks... :thud:
I hate trains...


I have just got ducati rotors for my 750. They are 320mm. Here is a list of the Ducatis they fit. Depending on your model I suspect yours are only 290 or 300.


350SS 1991-1997
600SS 1994-1999
M600 / M620ie 1994-2004
620S 2003-2004
748 SP / SPS / Biposto 1995-2003
750SS 1994-1998
750SSie 1999-2002
M750 / M750ie 1997-2002
M800 2003-2004
800S / 800SS 2003-2004
851 / 888
900SS 1991-1997
900SSie 1998-2002
M900 / M900ie 1993-2002
916 SP / Biposto 1994-2001
996 SP / Biposto 1999-2002
ST2 / ST4 / ST4S 1997-2004
M1000 2003-2004
1000SS 2003-2004

What wreckers have you tried?

[curious george]

FWIW, I have ordered from the guy in Waih, seemed really good to deal with, and happy to help.
I get mine hopefully by the end of the week, so I'l let you know...
The contact information I have is:
Graham Cornes
FGB
POwer Motorcycles
Waihi
021 616295

[Kickaha]

I had a friend investigate the correct material to use & import some at great expense (using plate steel is easy but it tends to warp no matter how it is cut. His theory is it is different densities throughout; thus heats at different rates,= warps). Sadly he closed up his shop & got a job so I don’t know that any where really made or how successfully.


We've had a few discs made in different materials,we get them lasercut and surface ground to clean them up

At the moment we have some made from what we were told was a surgical grade of stainless steel on a CBX550 pre 82 bike,these have done a full season and show no signs of warping,the bike won the local championship and gets ridden hard.

We've also got some made from mild steel on the front of a KDX200 and rear of a Ducati 400 and have also used these on a 250 Superkart,neither the KDX or Ducati have done enough work yet to see how they will last but they work well enough,the Superkart discs last one season and we toss them as they dish to much to be reground without making them to thin

[F5 Dave]

Enjoyed my old CBX.

Sounds interesting, What do you estimate it cost by the time it’s all done?

Generally stainless isn’t supposed to be near as good as the more ferrous compounds frictionwise. My PFMs go orange in between rides. With modern sintered compounds perhaps this is not such an issue?

Hardly worth doing one for the KDX I would have thought, I was surprised how cheap they are. I got one either side for mine, think they were motomaster or some some such silly name & they were very reasonable & had no problems with them.

[Kickaha]

Enjoyed my old CBX.

Sounds interesting, What do you estimate it cost by the time it’s all done?

Generally stainless isn’t supposed to be near as good as the more ferrous compounds frictionwise. My PFMs go orange in between rides. With modern sintered compounds perhaps this is not such an issue?

Hardly worth doing one for the KDX I would have thought, I was surprised how cheap they are. I got one either side for mine, think they were motomaster or some some such silly name & they were very reasonable & had no problems with them.

I estimate the cost to be absolutely zero,having friends in that industry thats the only reason we did the KDX discs

Not sure what compound pads (ferodo)Neil runs in the CBX but they work well

We were told meonite is the stuff to use,but we haven't tried sourcing it and know nothing about it.

[stunz]

FWIW, I have ordered from the guy in Waihi, seemed really good to deal with, and happy to help.
I get mine hopefully by the end of the week, so I'l let you know...

Thanks, I've not actually had a lot of time to go looking for the replacement part over the last couple of days and now the bike is parked up cos the jitters at the front do appear to be more pronounced now...(just my imagination? or not?)
Even considering selling the fizzer, right on the start of the good weather too, and that sux.