Sensing bullshit

[Mekk]

I force fed my way through another episode of Sensing Murder tonight and am amazed this show has enough ratings to stay afloat.

If TV is anything to go by, I'm worried about the lack of skepticism in a day and age where it requires it in order to discern information from misinformation. I personally think it's bloody shocking that psychics are even allowed to dupe people the way they do.

I'm sick of reading about psychics, their claimed "abilities" and the bullshit they construe...at a price!
-

I have several main issues with Sensing Murder in particular:

- All of the cases they go after are at least 15 years old, usually more so that the public media storms are given enough time to die down and so that the facts of the cases are vague enough for anyone to remember and for them to use.

- They mention how they chose a murder case and picked from 75 "psychics" from NZ to come to 3 that were able to discern the certain details. Now if that were statistically speaking, you could have a giant failure percentage (96% to be exact) and have 3 coincidental guesses. They fail to mention how the test was carried out.

- The same ones are used each show, which guarantees succe- I mean acting continuity.

- They choose to read the photos of the victims face down and somehow are able to discern features of the people contained. Features that are distinguishable if you throw in lots of ums and ahs and catch a glimpse of an outline showing through the paper. Let's see them try it with the photos in an iron box. Of course they will say they need to hold the actual picture for them to be able to "sense" the spirit.

- They are then shown the picture of the victim. This leaves many things open to interpretation. They mention how the latest girl is bouncy, a trickster and a bit of a mischief maker. This could be ascribed to the features of her face and because the audience is accepting these facts (without verification from family members) it fits the mold very easily.

- They are brought to the locations of the crimes and are thus able to recall prior knowledge or information about the locations that mysteriously fit in with where they are...read: Symonds St Cemetery, Domain, Museum triangle.

- They are able to stereotype based on their surroundings very vaguely and very easily.

- They never actually SOLVE anything. They just provide maybe clues that the police had already come up with.

- I don't see "Police Psychic" anywhere as a valid job as it has been proven over and over that these people are dancing with coincidence and vague "facts".

- They use so-called private investigators to verify their claims instead of scientists, police and other trustworthy affiants.

- They regularly joke around with the "spirits" or whatever they're inventing in their heads which happen to be the idea of former loved ones. So called psychics have caused much pain to grieving families by giving them hope and being way off the mark (cough: Sylvia Browne) and joking around hardly helps.

- The "spirit" always seems to be playing with them, leading them on. It's a cute way of fitting in with their "mischievous" personality and fills the hour show conveniently. If I died and wanted revenge on my killer (hell yes) I'd fucken straight up tell them who killed me and where I was buried etc.

--

So that's basically everything I can think of at this stage to rant about this piece of shit show that is playing on the unknown. I am sick of critical thinking taking a backseat to wild fantasies and scary music and feel that more people need to stand up and expose these frauds. Thanks.

[NighthawkNZ]

I force fed my way through another episode of Sensing Murder tonight and am amazed this show has enough ratings to stay afloat.


Thats casue you were watching it to help the ratings :scratch: even though you don't like it

[Mekk]

A valid point, pointing out the inaccuracies turned into a bit of a game with the flatmates. Damned marketing got me again!

There are people out there that actually believe this shit though. If everyone knew it was a crock I'm sure they wouldn't watch it.

[bell]

They had a 'behind the scenes' of Sensing Murder episode a few weeks back. It gave quite an insight into their methodologies. It certainly had me thinking twice about some of the issues you raise, as they are things that I've picked up on too. And yes, I'm more than a fraction sceptical.

[Mekk]

I'd like to see a behind the scenes investigation run by scientists, not rating mongers.

[The Pastor]

its all about the money man. don't let it get to you, switch of the devil box and go ride (/ fix if bike is broken) your bike!

[Mekk]

Yeah, if I wasn't sick I wouldn't be wasting my time.

I was initially interested because the case was about K'Rd and surrounding areas and I hoped to see my house. Then I saw bullshit.

[jrandom]

I don't watch television any more. It's all bullshit.

For that matter, I haven't watched a film in ages, and I've stopped keeping up with published reviews on new Hollywood pap.

Film may have been the great art form of the twentieth century, but its merits never really spilled over to the small screen. You know you're jaded when you cant even abide Star Trek any longer.

Never mind. When life gets really boring, one can just fire up a DVD of The Seventh Seal...

<img src="http://www.pbfcomics.com/archive/PBF200-Les_Douleurs_de_la_Mort.jpg"/>

[Chickadee]

Just wondered if you think all persons claiming to be psychic are full of shit:oi-grr: or just this programme?

[Mekk]

I don't believe in any psychics. I just especially despise the ones that are making money from duping people.

[caesius]

Yep you're absolutaly correct - it's a load of crap.

Every point you bring up is correct. Especially how if this information was any use, it would have been used.

This show pisses me off so much I could write pages about it. But that would be boring and non-retarded people already know it.

I suggest switching to channel 1/3. Or turning it off. That works well also I find, even when sick.

[MaxB]

Friend of ours works in TV in Oz. She says the producer of their version of the show takes the selected mediums out for lunch before shooting starts to give them a breifing to "save time" since TV is so expensive to make. Wonder what they talk about?

[H00dz]

Good post...I agree I'm a non-believer as well, I don't watch it if I can help it

[Laava]

I agree, sensing murder is bogus! Saw an interesting documentary called Forgotten Silver a week or so back. Now that was some quality bogus TV!

[GaZBur]

I see you guys doubt psychics. There is also a thread on Diana's inquest here on KB. Now you may not know that Diana was a great believer in psychics. Funnily enough not one of them bothered to tell her it may be a little dangerous getting into a speeding merc with a drugged driver in a Paris tunnel, although I believe one of her regular psychics had a "bad feeling" something was going to happen that day when asked afterwards. None of Diana's psychics have come up with the evidence of Murder either as far as I am aware or did the Royal family put out contracts on them as well to shut them up.

[Swoop]

More quality programming from tvnz...

[bobsmith]

Of Course this is all fiction and crap just like all other TV programmes. The only difference is some of the fiction is more fun to watch than others...

You don't mean to suggest that there are some people out there who actually believe this is not a fiction??? :Pokey:

[terbang]

Hmm yeah, sort of don't know what to make of it really. Never taken much notice of psychics and the likes and, not being a skeptic or religiously driven person, I would need to see for myself before making any judgement. Mind you, TV is all about smoke and mirrors too.

[MSTRS]

Mekk - I can see that you are very astute and not easily fooled. If this is truly the case, then We need to talk. You see, I have US$15M tied up in gold mine shares in the Congo and because I was injudicious in dealing with the President's eldest daughter, I now cannot get the money out. For a mere fraction (US$1.5M) of the value of these shares, I will sign them over to you and you will have no trouble getting them out of the country. I ask that you tell no-one of this transaction, and look forward to being of mutual assistance.

[bobsmith]

MSTRS. Can I take up on your offer instead? Where do I sign my life away?

[007XX]

Mekk - I can see that you are very astute and not easily fooled. If this is truly the case, then We need to talk. You see, I have US$15M tied up in gold mine shares in the Congo and because I was injudicious in dealing with the President's eldest daughter, I now cannot get the money out. For a mere fraction (US$1.5M) of the value of these shares, I will sign them over to you and you will have no trouble getting them out of the country. I ask that you tell no-one of this transaction, and look forward to being of mutual assistance.

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Oh pick me, pick me...Pleeeeeaaaasssee!!!!:clap::shutup:

unfortunately, some people do buy this crap, and actualy believe in it...one of them namely my own Mother! :crazy::weird::slap:

She tried to enrol me into the whole "mediums are real, and pyramid schemes are safe" BS since my younger years...

Wonder I turned out the way I am, as in both skeptical but open minded enough to look into it before knocking it completely...:eek5:

[MSTRS]

MSTRS. Can I take up on your offer instead? Where do I sign my life away?

Ah so sorry. You are not clever enough. Where did it say that you sign anything?

[MSTRS]

.... open minded ....

I think you will find that these schemes work best when you are prepared to open your legs....:eek5: (preparatory for a decent shafting)

[007XX]

I think you will find that these schemes work best when you are prepared to open your legs....:eek5: (preparatory for a decent shafting)

Geez (:lol:), you think? :rolleyes:however how partial I am to a good...Oups, did that come out loud? :innocent:

I could not believe it when about a year ago, she actually asked me if I would give her my bank account number to transfer some funds from the online scheme thing she was on at the time...:shit::chase::argh:

I love my mum, don't get me wrong, but I often wonder if I wasn't switched at birth! :baby::crybaby:

[MSTRS]

I could not believe it ....

People want to believe. That, and good old-fashioned greed.
Fairy tales for (supposed) grown-ups....

[007XX]

People want to believe. That, and good old-fashioned greed.
Fairy tales for (supposed) grown-ups....

Bit like Shortland Street really, isn't it? Bored individuals getting pseudo excitement out of the fictional drama BS of these shows! :sick:

Just found out my manager follows "sensing crap" religiously...:shutup:

[MSTRS]

Wash your dirty mouth out. Shorty St? BS? NZ's own 'Coro ST'? BS? How could you?

[007XX]

Wash your dirty mouth out. Shorty St? BS? NZ's own 'Coro ST'? BS? How could you?

You're right....how could a whole population be wrong and not hypnotised by the fantastic wordplay and educative contents of such shows?:yes:

Each actor truly has the making of an Emmy award Nominee and the plots are forever changing, with the added bonus of giving any of the avid Telespectator a true rendition of what life is all about: cheating spouses, rapes, conniving neighbours, and the list of goodness goes on...

My sincere apologies for intending to be demeaning to such an icon of Kiwi TV role modelling :doh::brick:

[judecatmad]

Friend of ours works in TV in Oz. She says the producer of their version of the show takes the selected mediums out for lunch before shooting starts to give them a breifing to "save time" since TV is so expensive to make. Wonder what they talk about?

Surely if they were any good at what they 'do' they wouldn't need the briefing cos they would already know what she was going to tell them.....

:rofl:

[MSTRS]

What? Defending that utter tripe/magnificent reflection of Kiwi life, now, are we? :doh:
PS - ever get the feeling that you can't win?
PPS - and you needn't think you can use the 'Fine' word. I'm used to that one. :killingme

[007XX]

What? Defending that utter tripe/magnificent reflection of Kiwi life, now, are we? :doh:
PS - ever get the feeling that you can't win?
PPS - and you needn't think you can use the 'Fine' word. I'm used to that one. :killingme

:rofl:

Ok then, How about : "Bite me!"?? :lol:

Unfortunately for you, I am a medium, and I can sense that within two days, your willy is going to have trouble looking up, and you will be looking for a more holistic approach to life... :blink::shake:

[mynameis]

Rightihoo good topic, in my opinion the only way I will be fully convinced that these psychics are true and for real indeed, is if I encountered them personally.

One of the psychics from sensing murder, Deb Webber is doing a show here in NZ and critics are invited to tag along. I wonder what would happen if one of us went to the show and she turned out to "read" us or "sense" to one of our deceased ones and provided detailed private information.

I'd freak myself out and convert to believe them. Here's more info:

http://www.debwebber.com.au/

Knock yourself out. And let me predict what the next few posts will be, "Who's gonna pay $70 to see that shit" hehe if you really and truly want to prove them wrong or want to know about it you might as well go to the show and see for yourself. I am thinking of going just to see what the feck this is all about.

P.S. 0oh if in case you lot are thinking it's a load of shit, then there are equally opposites in the society and I can see her shows are sellouts !! Aaaaaaaah...

[MSTRS]

:rofl::killingme Thanks for the prediction, O Wise Woman. I'll be sure to remember not to really annoy you.....
Nice plug, Mynameis. Hope you got your kickback contract in writing :shifty:

[007XX]

P.S. 0oh if in case you lot are thinking it's a load of shit, then there are equally opposites in the society and I can see her shows are sellouts !! Aaaaaaaah...

The thing is, as skeptical as I am, she is the one that would make me think twice about it!

She is either a very good make believer, or she's the real deal...:confused:

[mynameis]

:rofl::killingme Thanks for the prediction, O Wise Woman. I'll be sure to remember not to really annoy you.....
Nice plug, Mynameis. Hope you got your kickback contract in writing :shifty:


The thing is, as skeptical as I am, she is the one that would make me think twice about it!

She is either a very good make believer, or she's the real deal...:confused:

Well that's what it is mate I get where you're coming from. Say if someone buys a ticket for $70 and sits there and she doesn't do your "predictions" then it's a waste. But hey it all comes down to individual choice, she doesn't guarantee she will "read" everyone in the audience. I am just really curious on wtf this whole thing is about so might tag along a "believer" who's paying for my tickets :D hum hum hum hohoho0o0 :D

Before dismissing someone/somebody's theory, abilities ect just by looking at a TV show it is only wise to see it first hand and experience it first hand. You will then be in a better position to judge.

[fireball]

each to their own eh?

this could very well be a who believes in god thread too

people pay hundreds to see a raving man claiming to listen and talk to god how is this much different?


its all about faith and who believes in what and if TVNZ are getting good ratings from people watching it then someone has to believe in this.

dont moan if you cant do any better.

[007XX]

I am just really curious on wtf this whole thing is about so might tag along a "believer" who's paying for my tickets :D hum hum hum hohoho0o0 :D

Cute! :buggerd: :lol:
Not sure wether you'll find such an individual on KB though...:shifty:

[007XX]

its all about faith and who believes in what and if TVNZ are getting good ratings from people watching it then someone has to believe in this.

dont moan if you cant do any better.

I'm not personally criticising anyone's faith... just that I'm sick of places like TVNZ exploiting it!

*you woken up on the wrong side of the bed today sweet?* :dodge: :hug: :love:

[MSTRS]

Say if someone buys a ticket for $70 and sits there and she doesn't do your "predictions" then it's a waste. ....

I say if lots of someones buy a ticket @ $70...then she gets very well paid. Doesn't matter if the 'show' is Bullshit or not.

[NotaGoth]

Rightihoo good topic, in my opinion the only way I will be fully convinced that these psychics are true and for real indeed, is if I encountered them personally.

One of the psychics from sensing murder, Deb Webber is doing a show here in NZ and critics are invited to tag along. I wonder what would happen if one of us went to the show and she turned out to "read" us or "sense" to one of our deceased ones and provided detailed private information.

I'd freak myself out and convert to believe them. Here's more info:

http://www.debwebber.com.au/

Knock yourself out. And let me predict what the next few posts will be, "Who's gonna pay $70 to see that shit" hehe if you really and truly want to prove them wrong or want to know about it you might as well go to the show and see for yourself. I am thinking of going just to see what the feck this is all about.

P.S. 0oh if in case you lot are thinking it's a load of shit, then there are equally opposites in the society and I can see her shows are sellouts !! Aaaaaaaah...


I've been to one show where the medium was very vague, and would prod for information... To me it all seemed like a huge set up... I do think it is extremely low that people out there play on peoples emotions in order to make money...

HOWEVER...

I've not let that one show stop me from still being open minded about it.. And I do believe that there ARE people out there who do actually have abilities that just can't be explained..

Also... There is someone very close to me who has had a personal reading done... And the women managed to come out with things that no one should have known.. But sure enough.. She knew it all... And she even mentioned things that would happen in 2 years... And what do you know... It happened!

I'd love to have a reading with a psychic done...

It could all turn to custard... And I could find out its all a load of bollocks, and that every psychic/medium is a fake..

Or..........

Something worthwhile could come out of it... Which in turn could ease alot of hurt for myself and my family..

I'd rather find out for myself than always sit here wondering... "what if"

[MotoGirl]

One of the psychics from sensing murder, Deb Webber is doing a show here in NZ and critics are invited to tag along. I wonder what would happen if one of us went to the show and she turned out to "read" us or "sense" to one of our deceased ones and provided detailed private information.

I believe in psychics purely because my own experiences make it difficult for me not to believe in them. Yeah, I guess this means that people can have super powers :dodge:

I've seen Deb Webber live (and no, I didn't pay for my own ticket). When her show was finished, I left feeling unsure about whether or not it was real. It's always possible that there were people planted in the audience for her to talk to.

She walked up to one particular lady and said "I've got loads of people wanting to talk to you. I'm seeing them in coffins." It turns out this particular lady was a funeral director so that kind of explained it!

[Mekk]

I wonder what would happen if one of us went to the show and she turned out to "read" us or "sense" to one of our deceased ones and provided detailed private information.

The problem is, anyone who is able to expose these people are very very quickly shut down.

I remember reading about a lady who went on Oprah as a "critical thinker" to provide resistance to a team of psychics. She was ridiculed, given an unfair amount of coverage and shot down in every way. Of course the audience was completely against her as well.

These people come in packs and they're relentless when together to defend their "abilities".

[Curious_AJ]

I've only ever been able to watch 5mins of the show before I turn it off.. its total crap on that show...

I believe psychics may exist, but they probably wouldnt go flaunting it stupidly on tv like that.... I saw the advert of the one show with "just one blade of grass moving"... there were actually a BUNCH of them moving around the one that the camera was focussed on...

I think the show is an insult to so many people, in so many ways.

[Mekk]

Also... There is someone very close to me who has had a personal reading done... And the women managed to come out with things that no one should have known.. But sure enough.. She knew it all... And she even mentioned things that would happen in 2 years... And what do you know... It happened!

I'd love to have a reading with a psychic done...

It could all turn to custard... And I could find out its all a load of bollocks, and that every psychic/medium is a fake..

Or..........

Something worthwhile could come out of it... Which in turn could ease alot of hurt for myself and my family..

Just one reading and you'd be convinced?

Another thing is that a lot of us seem to undermine the fact that if you spew enough bullshit out there, regardless of the success ratio...something will probably hit home.

What happens is that when the information is spread far, wide and vaguely...loads of it can have nothing to do with you but the moment one little thing relates, you feel shocked and amazed that they could have known. If the psychic or medium or whatever picks up that they've hit something, they will exploit it. They'll then throw a whole lot more "information" out there until something hits again...when that happens your reaction is bigger as this magical person has now hit on two things that they shouldn't have known!

[NotaGoth]

Just one reading and you'd be convinced?

Another thing is that a lot of us seem to undermine the fact that if you spew enough bullshit out there, regardless of the success ratio...something will probably hit home.

What happens is that when the information is spread far, wide and vaguely...loads of it can have nothing to do with you but the moment one little thing relates, you feel shocked and amazed that they could have known. If the psychic or medium or whatever picks up that they've hit something, they will exploit it. They'll then throw a whole lot more "information" out there until something hits again...when that happens your reaction is bigger as this magical person has now hit on two things that they shouldn't have known!

I understand exactly what you have to say don't get me wrong, I am fully aware of what you just posted. I have already seen a "psychic" do exactly that. She would pick people out of the audience, she would also ask them questions, and people would give her answers that she needed. What made it seem like more of a crock is that she wouldn't do private readings for anyone. One bad apple hasn't put me off though.

As for the meeting, I guess that it would depend on what information they came out with. All I can do is find out for myself, if I'm satisfied I'm satisfied.

[Drum]

Ya fake one little moon landing and all of a sudden all of the legitimate moon landings never happened either.

[NotaGoth]

Ya fake one little moon landing and all of a sudden all of the legitimate moon landings never happened either.


:niceone: you are so awesome

[Mekk]

Neither of those astronauts have left the ground, that's for sure.

[mynameis]

If the psychic or medium or whatever picks up that they've hit something, they will exploit it. They'll then throw a whole lot more "information" out there until something hits again...when that happens your reaction is bigger as this magical person has now hit on two things that they shouldn't have known!




No mate it doesn't work that way, I don't think you have enough knowledge and exposure to back up what you are saying. I know you think and feel it's all bullshit but how many psychic shows have you been to or seen on TV. Not that I am a firm believer or supporter, but I am just open minded to it unless and until I can indefinitely prove it wrong, beyond doubt.

Say for example someone had a brother or sister who had cancer but died in a hiking trip say somewhere in South America. Without much probing what are the possibilities and chances that a psychic would be able to get all of the above information right?

Brother/Sister
Had Cancer
Died in a trip to South America hiking.

Without much effort it can be figured out that the chances of someone getting all that right is one in a few million or billion. So prompting and probing and throwing heaps of information out there until it hits someone is not how it works.

There can be a million different scenarios/circumstances/instances/experiences in ones life. The fact that someone is able to isolate it and narrow it down precisely is what startles me.

All I am getting you and other sceptics to do is to ponder. Think critically, as well as the other side of the coin as well, before you draw any conclusions. We are known to jump to answers without much thought. And in my mind unless something is proven wrong without doubt it cannot be dismissed.

[007XX]

All I am getting you and other sceptics to do is to ponder. Think critically, as well as the other side of the coin as well, before you draw any conclusions. We are known to jump to answers without much thought. And in my mind unless something is proven wrong without doubt it cannot be dismissed.[/FONT][/LEFT]

Yep, I'd tend to be with you on that one...as much as I have witnessed a lot of quacks in my time, I still think there is a margin of possibility for the "real deal" out there, and unless I was able to meet every single people claiming to be mediums and without a doubt proven that every one of them is a fake, then I will keep an open mind and not say that it is impossible.

[MSTRS]

I always have a chuckle at the scenario of..."The crystal is just a bit cloudy - perhaps if you pay me a little more, it will clear (Ka-ching) Ah yes now I see...."
Believe if you want. Anyone with a real psychic ability will not be ripping off suckers on stage or tv.

[Curious_AJ]

it is pretty freaky how some people can narrow things down like that... but I stick with what I say when I say that the people who do it for publicity, are usually fake.. the one's who will give private readings etc etc may be the real deal.. but who really knows if "psychics" exist.. people may just be really god at narrowing things down, or extra good guessors or something of the sort.

[Curious_AJ]

I always have a chuckle at the scenario of..."The crystal is just a bit cloudy - perhaps if you pay me a little more, it will clear (Ka-ching) Ah yes now I see...."
Believe if you want. Anyone with a real psychic ability will not be ripping off suckers on stage or tv.

exactly my point :D

[Mekk]

No mate it doesn't work that way, I don't think you have enough knowledge and exposure to back up what you are saying. I know you think and feel it's all bullshit but how many psychic shows have you been to or seen on TV. Not that I am a firm believer or supporter, but I am just open minded to it unless and until I can indefinitely prove it wrong, beyond doubt.

You're right in that aspect, a lot of my information is based on reading about these things which may or may not have bias. That's not to say I don't cast a wide net in searching for my information. I reason with the different sources and go with what sounds the most logical or correct to me.

Now, you say it doesn't work that way as if it does another. What is that?



Say for example someone had a brother or sister who had cancer but died in a hiking trip say somewhere in South America. Without much probing what are the possibilities and chances that a psychic would be able to get all of the above information right?

Brother/Sister
Had Cancer
Died in a trip to South America hiking.

Without much effort it can be figured out that the chances of someone getting all that right is one in a few million or billion. So prompting and probing and throwing heaps of information out there until it hits someone is not how it works.

I know not of a psychic who can consistently get results like these. If there are, they are all achieved under their own conditions. When subjected to double-blind tests they all fail miserably.



All I am getting you and other sceptics to do is to ponder. Think critically, as well as the other side of the coin as well, before you draw any conclusions. We are known to jump to answers without much thought. And in my mind unless something is proven wrong without doubt it cannot be dismissed.

To be fair I have spent a lot of time considering these things. The other side of that coin says that it's easy to jump to the conclusion that they're supernatural beings.

What do you need for proof of them being wrong? I would have thought the double-blind tests that they're subjected to and fail over and over would be enough.

[Calo]

Funny how 99% of people who believe in and financially support these quacks are women. :Pokey:

[007XX]

Funny how 99% of people who believe in and financially support these quacks are women. :Pokey:

Very sad, but true...I guess we all want to believe in something.:calm:

[Maha]

Neither of those astronauts have left the ground, that's for sure.


They were test pilots before being astronauts so, yeah they left the ground once or twice...

[avgas]

All bullshit aside i hope they aren't doing what they do.
Not all that is perceived good is. Some doors are best left closed, or at least guarded when they are open.

[Mekk]

They were test pilots before being astronauts so, yeah they left the ground once or twice...

I was alluding to the psychics, not real astronauts.

[Wolf]

There was a great expose on so-called psychics I saw quite a while back. Many use accomplices - both as targets in the audience and also to chat with people who're gathered outside waiting to go into a live show:

Accomplice: "This should be good. I'm hoping she'll pick me, I'm hoping to get in touch with my uncle Frim."
unsuspecting mark: "Yeah. I want to find out about my brother, James, who died in the Swiss Alps."
Accomplice: "Wow, that's a bugger. How long ago did that happen?"
mark: "Oh four years ago, now. He was with his friend Bernie and their car went off the road..."

And later on, when the psychic regurgitates it back wiith emotional bullshit and "your brother says he loves you", the mark is so overcome with the experience and how accurate the psychic was, the conversation with the other "member of the audience" before the show started is usually forgotten.

Other tricks:

"I see someone standing behind you. A woman..." (to a younger person: ) "your grandmother" (or to an older person: ) "your mother." Pretty good odds that a younger person's mother is still alive but at least one grand mother is dead. pretty good odds that an older person's mother is dead.

Knowing what names are popular in the past can be handy. Say to any NZer over 60 "I'm getting a name... Harry, or Henry." Unless he's lived in a box all his life, he'll have known a Harry or a Henry or both.

So often a "psychics" target volunteers a lot based on one small apparent "hit"

"I'm sensing a woman near you, she's very motherly (notes brief look of scepticism: mother is probably still alive or not very motherly) but she's not your mother, although she was like a mother to you."

"That'd be aunt Mavis, she was like my second mother. She died 6 years ago."

[MSTRS]

That's just spooky Wolf.
How did you know my Aunt Mavis was like a mother to me and died 6 years ago?
And should I pay you??

[wildpudding]

I would of thought it was bullshit as well........until I read a book called Pyschic Warrior by David Morehouse. A very powerful book, everyone should read it.

Stefan

[mynameis]

I guess I will be in a better position to deliver a slightly informed and first hand experienced verdict after going to the Deb Webber show (http://www.debwebber.com.au/event_diary.html) on the 21st of November at Bruce Mason Centre. (Blond lady from Sensing Murder).

A believer in psychics is paying for my tickets and wants me to go and I am quite curious and keen to see a "live" show to judge these psychics better. So I shall let you all know what my opinion is then, at the moment I am open to it neither supporting nor loathing it.

[El Dopa]

I don't watch television any more. It's all bullshit.

For that matter, I haven't watched a film in ages, and I've stopped keeping up with published reviews on new Hollywood pap.

Film may have been the great art form of the twentieth century, but its merits never really spilled over to the small screen. You know you're jaded when you cant even abide Star Trek any longer.

Do what I do. Ignore the telly, keep just enough of an eye on the meeja to see what is generating buzz, and if you think you're interested, hire the film or the box set when it comes out. No adverts, no waiting for the next ep, etc.

The video place in Devonport has a pretty good selection.



Never mind. When life gets really boring, one can just fire up a DVD of The Seventh Seal....

What would your preference be: twister or battleships?

[Bullitt]

My gf is really keen on Sensing Murder, watches it every week and dont seem to doubt any of its accuracy.

I havnt watched it enough to be able to rebuke anything it claims but I dont intend to either. I dont believe in psychics and have never seen any reason to change that.

[Wolf]

That's just spooky Wolf.
How did you know my Aunt Mavis was like a mother to me and died 6 years ago?
And should I pay you??
Cross my palm with VISA...

[Timber020]

I was a total sceptic. 6 years before we met my wife had a reading done, the lady told her a bunch of stuff and wrote it down about her future husband.
Nothing really specific but stuff like the month we met, that we would have the same type of vehicle but not what she had at the time of the reading. After a few years she forgot about it, it wasnt until we had been seeing each other for a while she found the bit of paper.
A couple of years back she went back, the reader told her that she had met her future husband and that in his job he was going to have a big fall (as an arborist this doesnt suprise or please me). She knew other stuff to.

I wouldnt go to a psychic, but Im not totally convinced we can explain everything in this world yet, but I know some strange things have happened that arent easy explained.

[Mekk]

I would of thought it was bullshit as well........until I read a book called Pyschic Warrior by David Morehouse. A very powerful book, everyone should read it.

Stefan

I'm curious about this book, is it meant to be a story or information?

[Zuki Bandit]

A valid point, pointing out the inaccuracies turned into a bit of a game with the flatmates. Damned marketing got me again!

There are people out there that actually believe this shit though. If everyone knew it was a crock I'm sure they wouldn't watch it.
The behind the scenes episode had a hardcore sceptic such as yourself sit in with them the whole time. In the end he didnt have an arguement to stand on.
You dont have to believe it, by why try to pull it apart? I know so many people who watch it, then blurb on about it the next day trying to say how fake it is. DONT WATCH IT THEN!

[MSTRS]

That's just spooky Wolf.
How did you know my Aunt Mavis was like a mother to me and died 6 years ago?
And should I pay you??


Cross my palm with VISA...

Ha!! Got you! You're a fraud. My aunt's name is not Mavis, she is a complete bitch and she aint dead.....
This message brought to you in the interests of exposing so-called psychics for the money-grubbing parasites that they are.

[bert_is_evil]

The way I see it we watch a TV show or pay to see a live show for the purpose of entertainment, just like we would pay to go and see a concert. A person goes to the show and is entertained, just like they would be if they went to see a concert, regardless of whether the singer was having their voice digitally enhanced or the backing vocals were prerecorded. If you don't beleive what is going on is real then you won't be entertained, just like you wouldn't be if you went to a concert beleving the vocalist would be lipsyncing, or if you paid to see a concert of a genre of music you didn't enjoy - so why would you go to that concert or watch that programme? I guess the point I'm trying to make is if people go to a live phsycic show to be entertained, and they are entertained, then they have gotten their moneys worth - just like if they had gone to a concert and been entertained. Would you berate Tom Jones for having a concert and "ripping people off" because you don't happen to like his particular style of entertainment? I doubt it - it's all a matter of taste. I personally don't like rugby but I don't think that the IRB is ripping people off by charging people to see games because I know that the people buying the tickets enjoy it - if I pay to go to a game I'm not going to enjoy, or waste my time watching it on tv then that's my stupid fault (I'm in fact ripping myself off).

Imagine you had some sort of psycic/super power - would you sell tickets to people to see you bending railway irons with your bare hands or lighting things on fire with your eyes? I certainly would! If you could fake the same thing would you still do it? Lots of people do, they are called magicians and few modern magicians admit to the fact that what they are doing is merely an illusion.

[crshbndct]

i rung a psychic once (oh the days of free phone calls on 025 phones) for bit of a giggle. i asked which team was going to win the next formula1 race. she asked which teams were in teh running. i said holden, ford, nissan, lamborghini, honda, toyota, and porsche.

she got a definite feel from the ghost of peter brock that he though holden was the one to put my money on.

also told me MV agusta was the team to back in the 2006 motogp season. again, a really strong, positive feeling from a past rider, someone italian. i suggested was it possibly giacomo doohan, and she said yes that it.

i attempted to take my new found knowledge and use it but allass, i had just wasted about 60 dollars of telecoms money

[Wolf]

Ha!! Got you! You're a fraud. My aunt's name is not Mavis, she is a complete bitch and she aint dead.....
This message brought to you in the interests of exposing so-called psychics for the money-grubbing parasites that they are.
Hah, shows what you know! I actually am a very powerful psychic but I can only read surface thoughts. Using my cunning ruse above I tricked you into thinking about your VISA card which enabled me to get account name, number, expiry date, PIN and the little 4-digit verification code on the back.

Just used that info to buy a brand new BMW F650GS and ordered $7000 worth of aftermarket goodies for it through on-line shopping sites.

Yes, I'm a fraud but my bag is Identity Theft!

BWAhahahahahahaha :motu:

[MSTRS]

Good luck with that, young Wolf. Can you in fact confirm that I even have a Visa card? :no: And that it's not already maxed out? :pinch:

[KATWYN]

What I can't understand is the shear amount of information the Psychics receive by way of names, faces, places, events yet they can't pin point where a body may be buried...? Its like theres a missing link somewhere.

[crshbndct]

another one: we went to the gypsy fair about 2 weeks ago. they were doing palm readings for like $5 and my mrs made me get one. the psychic told me that children would be coming into my life soon. which was really amazing as my missus had a baby 4 days later.

of course the psychic had seen me walking around holding hands with a 9.25 month pregnant woman just minutes before, so that might have tipped her off.

[007XX]

Hah, shows what you know! I actually am a very powerful psychic but I can only read surface thoughts. Using my cunning ruse above I tricked you into thinking about your VISA card which enabled me to get account name, number, expiry date, PIN and the little 4-digit verification code on the back.

Just used that info to buy a brand new BMW F650GS and ordered $7000 worth of aftermarket goodies for it through on-line shopping sites.

Yes, I'm a fraud but my bag is Identity Theft!

BWAhahahahahahaha :motu:


Good luck with that, young Wolf. Can you in fact confirm that I even have a Visa card? :no: And that it's not already maxed out? :pinch:


:corn::corn::corn:

Ok Wolf, what colour are my undies then, eh? :rofl: :eek::dodge:

[MSTRS]

:corn::corn::corn:

Ok Wolf, what colour are my undies then, eh? :rofl: :eek::dodge:

You sure that you should call that string you wear, 'undies' ?

[007XX]

You sure that you should call that string you wear, 'undies' ?

Beeeeppp (wrong answer)Don't quit your day job smartypants....:bleh:

[Wolf]

Beeeeppp (wrong answer)Don't quit your day job smartypants....:bleh:
Yeah, we all know she's "going commando"

[007XX]

Yeah, we all know she's "going commando"

Bwaahahaha...bling sent! :killingme

Nuff said, as you were! :whistle:

[vifferman]

I see you guys doubt psychics. There is also a thread on Diana's inquest here on KB. Now you may not know that Diana was a great believer in psychics. Funnily enough not one of them bothered to tell her it may be a little dangerous getting into a speeding merc with a drugged driver in a Paris tunnel, although I believe one of her regular psychics had a "bad feeling" something was going to happen that day when asked afterwards. None of Diana's psychics have come up with the evidence of Murder either as far as I am aware or did the Royal family put out contracts on them as well to shut them up.
Wow.
Or not.

Why have they got an inquest into her death? I've got it sorted already.
I looked at the photos published in The Harold this week - the last photos taken just a few seconds before she died! Wowowow!
They show her turning around in her seat, looking out the back window to see if the paparazzio are following the car. The other photo shows the Mercedes after the crash - mostly intact (well, at least the passenger 'cell' is), apart from where it's been cut open.

Hmmm....

Pretty obvious really: the silly bitch was twisted around in her seat, had no seat belt on, and didn't survive a crash which would've left only bruising if she had been sitting properly and/or had her belt on. :Pokey:

Boo hoo.

Case closed.

[Mekk]

The behind the scenes episode had a hardcore sceptic such as yourself sit in with them the whole time. In the end he didnt have an arguement to stand on.
You dont have to believe it, by why try to pull it apart? I know so many people who watch it, then blurb on about it the next day trying to say how fake it is. DONT WATCH IT THEN!

So this hardcore skeptic was chosen by them, was he? How about an independent review from a panel of scientists that expose these kind of people all the time?

I feel it necessary to pull it apart to give other people insight into these charlatans. If not that, at least have them question them.

Too much bollocks can be dangerous. There are still people in Papa New Guinea going on witch hunts because they believe people like this are genuine.

[Mekk]

Lots of people do, they are called magicians and few modern magicians admit to the fact that what they are doing is merely an illusion.

I don't agree with that. There are many who openly acknowledge themselves as illusionists. This is why Yuri Gellar (the spoon bending fraud) is under so much fire from magicians all over the world for claiming he has psychic powers when really he's just doing simple sleight of hand illusions.

[bert_is_evil]

So this hardcore skeptic was chosen by them, was he?

He was yes. He was also chosen by the New Zealand police, as one of their lead criminal phsycological profilers, hence his scepticism.

[bert_is_evil]

I don't agree with that. There are many who openly acknowledge themselves as illusionists. This is why Yuri Gellar (the spoon bending fraud) is under so much fire from magicians all over the world for claiming he has psychic powers when really he's just doing simple sleight of hand illusions.

I was referring more to the guys doing the money making rounds currently, like Chriss Angel and David Blaine - neither acknowledge that they are "illusionists"

[Mekk]

He was yes. He was also chosen by the New Zealand police, as one of their lead criminal phsycological profilers, hence his scepticism.

I'm not sure how being a psychological profiler means you understand how psychics work. He may have been a skeptic, but I'm talking about a review from a panel that know the tricks these people employ.

It could have been a nuclear physicist, but what good is that when they're not skilled in this area?


I was referring more to the guys doing the money making rounds currently, like Chriss Angel and David Blaine - neither acknowledge that they are "illusionists"

I don't know about that. They don't claim they have supernatural powers like Gellar either. It is generally accepted that they're magicians/illusionists.

[bert_is_evil]

I don't know about that. They don't claim they have supernatural powers like Gellar either. It is generally accepted that they're magicians/illusionists.

They do claim that what they are doing is real and yes it's generally accepted that they're illusionists and no one really makes a big deal about the fact that what they're doing is an illusion

The phsycic's claim that what they are doing is real, just like these guys do, it's generally beleived by the majority of people that it's not (just like these guys), so why does everyone make a big deal of it?

Like I said either way it's entertaining, and if it's not then why watch it/care?

[Mekk]

Because people are still paying $160 an hour for this bullshit when most of us make an honest living.

There was a psychic in the US that got done for fraud after possessing $250,000 odd in materials from someone because they told them all these things were causing her bad karma.

People go to them for life advice on very important decisions that could make or break them. They believe them and can fuck themselves up completely.

They pretend to communicate with dead loved ones. In the case of Silvia Browne, she tells people who have missing children that they're dead. They then turn up completely fine a few weeks later. The opposite has happened as well, they are told their loved ones are fine and then turn up in a body bag. They prey on people who don't know any better and are at the end of their tethers.

I would expect to be held accountable if I convinced someone that conventional physics don't apply and you can survive a fall from a skyscraper as long as you believe...

They should be tried and done for fraud, every last one of them.

[Wolf]

The opposite has happened as well, they are told their loved ones are fine and then turn up in a body bag.
And protests of "ah, but they were fine at the time I did the reading" don't wash when the coroner's report reveals they've been dead for over a month...

[Mekk]

Yeah, they try to weasel their way out of things like that. Silvia's method is to threaten with lawsuits.

Scum.

[bert_is_evil]

People also pay $200 an hour to stand on a vibrating platform which is supposed to make them fit, or $100 for a moisturiser which is supposed to make their cellulite go away or give them firmer breasts. People pay money to go to motivational seminars. People spend money on vitamins that their body can't absorb in the tablet form. I say buyer beware, your "bullshit" is another persons entertainment.

People go to church and are frowned upon if they don't give money after the surmon or even have to give a percentage of their income to the church. Personally I don't beleive in god and I think that's a huge rip off, but hey that's up to the individual - it's their beleif and it's their money. People make life and death decisions based on what their religion tells them with absolutely no scientific basis or proof but that's socially acceptable for some reason? Better do them for fraud too.

[Sanx]

People make life and death decisions based on what their religion tells them with absolutely no scientific basis or proof but that's socially acceptable for some reason? Better do them for fraud too.

I'll donate to the legal fund to do that.

[El Dopa]

$100 for a moisturiser which is supposed to make their cellulite go away and give them firmer breasts.


Worked for me.....

[Sollyboy]

I don't believe in any psychics. I just especially despise the ones that are making money from duping people.

I despise pharmacists who sell homeopathic remedies knowing they are only expensive bottles of water with no good science or even a reasonable explanation of how they work

[bert_is_evil]

Worked for me.....

I did notice you were looking rather perky last kb trackday

[Mekk]

People make life and death decisions based on what their religion tells them with absolutely no scientific basis or proof but that's socially acceptable for some reason? Better do them for fraud too.

I'd be perfectly OK with doing them for fraud too. Are you agreeing with me or...?


I despise pharmacists who sell homeopathic remedies knowing they are only expensive bottles of water with no good science or even a reasonable explanation of how they work"

Me too, it's disgusting. It's just plain misinformation.

[bert_is_evil]

Well, not exactly - wouldn't prosecuting everyone who makes money out of something that's not scientifically proven be tantamount to a modern day witch hunt? In addition to this what we know to be scientifically correct today is not necessarily what we know to be scientifically correct tomorrow (how many groundbreaking scientists have been discredited as complete nutta's only to discover years after their death that they were actually correct), so no scientific research could go ahead because that reqires the employment of people to carry out the research, which is work that isn't scientifically proven, so they would in effect be profiting from someone's belief that what they were researching would be proved.
:corn:

[bert_is_evil]

I despise pharmacists who sell homeopathic remedies knowing they are only expensive bottles of water with no good science or even a reasonable explanation of how they work

A flatmate once convinced me to try some homeopathic drops to heal a sports injury I had, I tried for a few days to be polite, all it did is give me weird breath :shutup:

[Mekk]

Well, not exactly - wouldn't prosecuting everyone who makes money out of something that's not scientifically proven be tantamount to a modern day witch hunt? In addition to this what we know to be scientifically correct today is not necessarily what we know to be scientifically correct tomorrow (how many groundbreaking scientists have been discredited as complete nutta's only to discover years after their death that they were actually correct), so no scientific research could go ahead because that reqires the employment of people to carry out the research, which is work that isn't scientifically proven, so they would in effect be profiting from someone's belief that what they were researching would be proved.
:corn:

The thing is that when these people are subjected to scientific testing, they are found to be nothing more than the products of chance. This is why most (at least I like to think most) people don't believe in them. If not sue them for fraud, they should be made to undergo scientific testing before they can market their claims.

The only reason there is doubt is because all the big names don't submit themselves for testing as they'd most definitely be found as frauds.

People should at least be able to know if they're paying for something that doesn't work or they're just being misled which falls under several other laws.

I doubt people could market a magic potion as curing all your ailments without listing all the correct ingredients, so why should psychics be able to get away with that?

[bert_is_evil]

I hear what you're saying but people do market that magic potion (or breast enlarging cream or whatever) and yes they do have to tell you what the ingrediants are but they don't have to undergo scientific testing to prove it works before they can market their claims. Along the same lines no church has been able to scientifically prove that there is a god and there is no expectation that they should have to before accepting donations or a share of their congregations income.

What I'm saying is not that the psycics are/are not for real, but that if you make a rule for one you have to apply it to all, and that sort of government control is what people are constantly complaining about, on KB in particular!

[Mekk]

How about a scientifically valid rating system, like a food health rating they have to display?

[007XX]

that magic potion (or breast enlarging cream or whatever) and yes they do have to tell you what the ingrediants are ....

:woohoo:You mean to say it exists:eek:...yes, I've been waiting for this day all my life!!!!
F%^&k the ingredients, where do I sign up?:done:

[Finn]

A flatmate once convinced me to try some homeopathic drops to heal a sports injury I had, I tried for a few days to be polite, all it did is give me weird breath :shutup:

Wasn't Grahameeboy was it?

[bert_is_evil]

How about a scientifically valid rating system, like a food health rating they have to display?

In theory I think that's a great idea.

Now we have agreed what are we going to talk about :confused:

[bert_is_evil]

Wasn't Grahameeboy was it?

why, is he a phsycopath? um, I mean homeopath?...

[Mekk]

Beer and sport.

[bert_is_evil]

How about that rollerderby - there's a sport for all to enjoy, fun for participants and spectators

[avgas]

Ok Wolf, what colour are my undies then, eh? :rofl: :eek::dodge:
The deeper they go the more it will cost you

[007XX]

The deeper they go the more it will cost you

That's ok then cos they are very close to the skin...seemless even, one might say! :innocent:

[MSTRS]

Freudian slip? Seamless or Seemly

[chris]

Similar tactics used here.

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