Revenue collecting.

[Banesto John]

Here is a randon wee morsel I am privy to. The powers that be are going to drop the fines for almost everything, and up the demerit points.

Possibly Cullen is going to sell this as a tax cut, but maybe I'm just cynical.

However, it makes it hard to argue that the tickets are about revenue when the revenue will surely take a dive.

Will it make much difference to how we drive/ride? Less tickets needed to lose the right to drive/ride.

I am thinking it is aimed at the "car enthusiasts" who rack of zillions of bucks in fines and don't give a toss.

Interested in your thoughts.:scooter:

[jimbo600]

Never happen. ACC coughed up money for police to buy a certain number of HP cars, and as such they are obliged to issue fines to compensate.

[oldrider]

Here is a randon wee morsel I am privy to. The powers that be are going to drop the fines for almost everything, and up the demerit points.

Possibly Cullen is going to sell this as a tax cut, but maybe I'm just cynical.

However, it makes it hard to argue that the tickets are about revenue when the revenue will surely take a dive.

Will it make much difference to how we drive/ride? Less tickets needed to lose the right to drive/ride.

I am thinking it is aimed at the "car enthusiasts" who rack of zillions of bucks in fines and don't give a toss.

Interested in your thoughts.:scooter:

It must be something the United Nations wants implemented, Clark's masters! They say jump, she says, how high?

Whatever this government does, it's based on their anti-social, anti-freedom, anti-people attitudes anyway.

I will be glad to see the back of them. Bastards, John.

[craigs288]

It must be something the United Nations wants implemented, Clark's masters! They say jump, she says, how high?

Whatever this government does, it's based on their anti-social, anti-freedom, anti-people attitudes anyway.

I will be glad to see the back of them. Bastards, John.

I think they just change the rules from time to time to see how pliant the population is. Kind of testing the water. If there is no reaction from the public then life goes on as normal but you are slightly more restricted. Or you continue as normal and get punished more often.

We need some kind of divisive issue that the Government ends up pushing its agenda at us, and the majority of the country are opposed to it so that the Government ends up in a position where it has to either do it's job, i.e. doing what the majority of the country wants, or it continues to push it's own agenda at our expense and then it will be obvious to everybody what is already obvious to many right now.

The Government is not there to exercise the will of the public with regard to running the country, which is the reason it exists.
It is there to implement it's own agenda at our expense, in spite of our best efforts

[The Pastor]

Here is a randon wee morsel I am privy to. The powers that be are going to drop the fines for almost everything,



drop them by how much? 5$? 10? - it aint going to happen

whats going to happen is demerits will go up (didnt they just do that last year or the year before?)

Oh joy now you'll have 3 tickets and no licence i love walking:niceone:

[Coldrider]

Drop the fines, increase the demerit points, then put the fines back up in a couple of years when 'the experiment did not work'. Tell Helein to just put the fines & demerit up, to be truthful about the matter instead of treating us citizens like durex survey repondents.
They get stuff all roadside taxes from me anyway.

[MarkyMark]

I dunno, I kind of like the idea. As it is rich people can just laugh off a fine that would have a poor guy living on bread and water to pay off. This way everyone gets hurt equally, rah rah egalitarianism, I say!

[xwhatsit]

As a poor student, I too approve :yes:

Personally, that's how I've seen these type of things anyway. Money is worth different amounts of punishment to different people. More direct punishment (i.e. restricting the use of the thing you were fucking around with) in the form of demerits, or getting banned from the pub, or whatever is a bit better.

[Ocean1]

I dunno, I kind of like the idea. As it is rich people can just laugh off a fine that would have a poor guy living on bread and water to pay off. This way everyone gets hurt equally, rah rah egalitarianism, I say!


As a poor student, I too approve :yes:

Personally, that's how I've seen these type of things anyway. Money is worth different amounts of punishment to different people.

And income is usually a good indication of someone's guilt eh? Reason enough to hammer them rich bastards harder...

I wonder sometimes why there's any reasonably sane people left here. In fact, much as I love my home I can't see me being here much longer. One less "them" for those left to worry about.

[The Pastor]

I feer demeirts way more than demerits, soon you will be 3 tickets at 120km/hr in a 100 zone and you will be walking.

[MotoGirl]

I wonder sometimes why there's any reasonably sane people left here. In fact, much as I love my home I can't see me being here much longer. One less "them" for those left to worry about.

Tell me about it! I generally don't involved in current affairs because the government pisses me off too much and why should I ruin my day because it's full of fuc*wits?. I'd rather not know about what's going on than live in a place that makes me sour.

If this Labour government gets back in I'll be seriously tempted to jump the ditch.

[peasea]

As a poor student, I too approve :yes:

Personally, that's how I've seen these type of things anyway. Money is worth different amounts of punishment to different people. More direct punishment (i.e. restricting the use of the thing you were fucking around with) in the form of demerits, or getting banned from the pub, or whatever is a bit better.

I'm not made of money but I really don't give a rat's arse about tickets; demerits are annoying but they don't make much difference in the long run. After a while of behaving yourself it's back on the pace isn't it?

Fines? Just plead poverty (after pleading not guilty), drip them up for five bucks a week and who cares? I've paid thousands of dollars in fines over the years; has it slowed me down? No. I don't go flat out everywhere but I like to cruise at over 100kph whenever the road and conditions allow. The powers that be need to get off the 'speed kills' bandwagon, it's a crock of revenue-gathering shite.

Fuck the law, it's an ass after all.

[Ocean1]

Tell me about it! I generally don't involved in current affairs because the government pisses me off too much and why should I ruin my day because it's full of fuc*wits?. I'd rather not know about what's going on than live in a place that makes me sour.

If this Labour government gets back in I'll be seriously tempted to jump the ditch.

Come run away with me babe!!! Rumour has it there's a bunch of bikes over there... and have you seen the shape of some of the arses expecting to fit them? Yo- erm, :shifty: We'll be rolling in it in no time. :banana:

[canarlee]

lower the fines and raise the demerits? fine by me.



i wonder where they will make up the shortfall from?<a href="http://plugin.smileycentral.com/http%253A%252F%252Fwww.smileycentral.com%252F%253F partner%253DZSzeb008%255FZNxpt237YYNZ%2526i%253D23 %252F23%255F11%255F52%2526feat%253Dprof/page.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/23/23_11_52.gif" alt="SmileyCentral.com" border="0"><img border="0" src="http://plugin.smileycentral.com/http%253A%252F%252Fimgfarm%252Ecom%252Fimages%252F nocache%252Ftr%252Ffw%252Fsmiley%252Fsocial%252Egi f%253Fi%253D23%252F23_11_52/image.gif"></a>

[P38]

Having just got back from a trip to Queensland lemme fill you in on a what happened to my sons flat mate.

One sunnny "School Holiday" weekend he decided to take his blackbird for a wee ride down the highway. He reckons the day was awesome, good mates, good bikes and lots of great twisties to have fun on. But how things changed.

A week or so later he recieved the notice in the mail... speed camera fine and 3 demierit points and a couple hundred in fines... bastard. School holidays Oh No double the points 6 demerit points, Ouch!

The next day another notice in the mail....another speed camera fine and 3 more demierit points... Hang on they made a mistake! This fine was from the same camera on the same streach of road on the same day... Dumb Asses musta sent the same notice twice..

Hold on again! a flat mate has just spied the time and speed on each notice ... bummer five minutes apart different speeds.

Double Oh No!! Two fines on one day, School Holidays as well double the demrit points.

Do the math start with 12 demerit points then take away 6 + 6 that equals loss of licence. :doh:

Seems that after the ride he visited the local Dairy and got snapped both there an back doing about 70 in a 60kms area.

From what he reckons he'd rather pay off a fine an have his bike licence still.

That would hurt for me too.

BTW parking fines also gets ya demerit points.

P38

[SPman]

It must be something the United Nations wants implemented, Clark's masters! They say jump, she says, how high?

Whatever this government does, it's based on their anti-social, anti-freedom, anti-people attitudes anyway.

Unfortunately, what happens in NZ is happening all around the world, and NZ is nowhere near the most controlled environment, even if it may seem like it at times.

[Magua]

I feer demeirts way more than demerits, soon you will be 3 tickets at 120km/hr in a 100 zone and you will be walking.

Demerits more than demerits? :O

[The Pastor]

Demerits more than demerits? :O
i ph33r demerits way more than fines.

[jafar]

Having just got back from a trip to Queensland lemme fill you in on a what happened to my sons flat mate.

One sunnny "School Holiday" weekend he decided to take his blackbird for a wee ride down the highway. He reckons the day was awesome, good mates, good bikes and lots of great twisties to have fun on. But how things changed.

A week or so later he recieved the notice in the mail... speed camera fine and 3 demierit points and a couple hundred in fines... bastard. School holidays Oh No double the points 6 demerit points, Ouch!

The next day another notice in the mail....another speed camera fine and 3 more demierit points... Hang on they made a mistake! This fine was from the same camera on the same streach of road on the same day... Dumb Asses musta sent the same notice twice..

Hold on again! a flat mate has just spied the time and speed on each notice ... bummer five minutes apart different speeds.

Double Oh No!! Two fines on one day, School Holidays as well double the demrit points.

Do the math start with 12 demerit points then take away 6 + 6 that equals loss of licence. :doh:

Seems that after the ride he visited the local Dairy and got snapped both there an back doing about 70 in a 60kms area.

From what he reckons he'd rather pay off a fine an have his bike licence still.

That would hurt for me too.

BTW parking fines also gets ya demerit points.

P38

Bugger that, @ least we can cop a speed camera with no demerits.:bleh:
Up the fines & do away with demerits .

[MarkyMark]

And income is usually a good indication of someone's guilt eh? Reason enough to hammer them rich bastards harder...

I wonder sometimes why there's any reasonably sane people left here. In fact, much as I love my home I can't see me being here much longer. One less "them" for those left to worry about.


You misunderstand me, I think. Of course don't "hammer 'em harder," hammer 'em the same amount. I'm no bloody socialist :mad: $100 means a lot more to some than it does to others, but a loss of license hurts us all the same. It's just a way of making sure a deep pocketbook doesn't let you ignore laws some can't afford to.

[Ocean1]

You misunderstand me, I think. Of course don't "hammer 'em harder," hammer 'em the same amount. I'm no bloody socialist :mad: $100 means a lot more to some than it does to others, but a loss of license hurts us all the same. It's just a way of making sure a deep pocketbook doesn't let you ignore laws some can't afford to.

Nope, that’s exactly what I figured you meant. And yes, treating people differently based on wealth means you’re a socialist. ~ sic: a political doctrine or system which aims to create a classless society by removing the nation's wealth (land, industries, transport systems, etc) out of private and into public hands.
Learn to take responsibility for your own choices eh? and let everyone else do the same.

[MarkyMark]

...treating people differently based on wealth...

Which I am NOT advocating! I said that giving demerit points punishes everyone equally. How on earth are you reading me as wanting to treat people differently based on wealth?

[Ocean1]

Which I am NOT advocating! I said that giving demerit points punishes everyone equally. How on earth are you reading me as wanting to treat people differently based on wealth?

Appologies dude, as you were. Actually I wonder if incerasing the demerits wouldn't simply tend to hurt everyone, it's easy enough in all good concience to lose your licence now. I could support better enforcement of recidivist offenders, those caught driving disqualified for the Nth time...

[ColonelSponz]

HAHAHA Mark...you little socialist you. Now I understand why you went to all those IS meetings...

[ynot slow]

Everyone it is not revenue,it's a fucken invoice.An invoice from nz finest beaurocratic zone.From now on I call them invoices,we had the guys in our work van last week get picked up without wearing seatbelts,included a passenger,2 vans 3 invoices,looked bloody funny as they were waiting for each other to get to the job.

Another option could be,fine is $... and minimal demerits(ideal for reps),or fine $...less dollars but more points,your choice.

[Skyryder]

Here is a randon wee morsel I am privy to. The powers that be are going to drop the fines for almost everything, and up the demerit points.

Possibly Cullen is going to sell this as a tax cut, but maybe I'm just cynical.

However, it makes it hard to argue that the tickets are about revenue when the revenue will surely take a dive.

Will it make much difference to how we drive/ride? Less tickets needed to lose the right to drive/ride.

I am thinking it is aimed at the "car enthusiasts" who rack of zillions of bucks in fines and don't give a toss.

Interested in your thoughts.:scooter:


It's probably a fairer system than fines. Demerits hit everybody equally where as fines have more impact on the financially less fortunate.

However I suspect this is more to do with the PR and the publics perception that the H/way Police are revinue gathers. Given the hits that the police have taken in recent months anything that will remove this revinue gathering concept from the publics mind and improve the overall perception of the police with an election not too far in the future..................like I said PR.

Skyryder

[MarkyMark]

Great for miscommunication, the old internet.

[canarlee]

Great for miscommunication, the old internet.

bwahahahahaha


no its not "miscommunication", its mis-interpretation.


but yes, it is only the internet.

[Renegade]

(quote craig228)
We need some kind of divisive issue that the Government ends up pushing its agenda at us, and the majority of the country are opposed to

ahh, wsnt that the anti smacking bill?

Question, if it wasnt the Police giving out the tickets and instead some other independant agency would the public still hate the Police, i still dont get it that people hate them so much yet they still call them if the need them, wtf???

i do beleive that "Speed kills" is relative to the situation and taken out of context to suit peoples rants, the fact is that the faster that you travel the less time you have to react to dangerous situations therefore increasing the chance of having a crash, and now is where the "speed kills" actually comes into play, the human body simply cant argue with physics can it? the body just comes apart and the faster you go the more damage you do when you impact, its that simple, unless of course you are superman/woman or have an exo skeleton which i say put your money where your mouth is, ill even supply the bike for you to ride into a concrete wall to prove that speed dosnt kill on impact.

[swbarnett]

and the faster you go the more damage you do when you impact
So it's not the speed, it's the deceleration that kills.

[Renegade]

So it's not the speed, it's the deceleration that kills.

exactly, so it makes sense that the faster you go the faster the deceleration when you hit an object

[swbarnett]

exactly, so it makes sense that the faster you go the faster the deceleration when you hit an object
That's assuming that you hit an object in the first place. Speed is never the only factor. Something else has to go seriously wrong. I'm not suggesting that high speed is appropriate in all circumstances, I'm just saying that I don't believe the risk of high speed given the right conditions is anything to worry about. Afterall, I drive to LIVE, not just survive.

[Renegade]

That's assuming that you hit an object in the first place. Speed is never the only factor. Something else has to go seriously wrong. I'm not suggesting that high speed is appropriate in all circumstances, I'm just saying that I don't believe the risk of high speed given the right conditions is anything to worry about. Afterall, I drive to LIVE, not just survive.

i agree, but speed does add to the chance of something going wrong, and when it does here comes the law of physics.

[swbarnett]

i agree, but speed does add to the chance of something going wrong, and when it does here comes the law of physics.
Speed is only one of many factors yet speed is touted as a single determining factor. Remove any one factor and the equation changes. There's no need to pick on speed to the exclusion of all else.

[Moxy]

i agree, but speed does add to the chance of something going wrong, and when it does here comes the law of physics.

How exactly does speed add to the chance that something will go wrong?

You mean the slower I go on the open road, the more I "add to the chance of something going wrong"?

Then, yes, I agree, moving slower than the flow of traffic definitely adds to the chance that something will go wrong.

Besides, we all know that the reason speed is picked on so much by the po-po is because it's easy to measure. It's easy to say "you were going xxx k in a xx k zone" whereas it's hard to prove that you weren't paying attention, or whatever.

[candor]

This idea originated wih a KBer sometime last year as I recall it. But yes they will be looking to collect elsewhere. The thing is their speed fines revenue is not optimal yet, and there is no road safety justification to increase it - as a recent report (Duignan-M.O.T) shows that fines do nothing to save lives lost due in part to speed factoring anyway.

Its not the drinking / speeding... it's the way we.... do it ?source of quote
Speed revenue is at the level Victoria was a a few years back, then they reduced tolerances and targeted schools (like here now), so tripling it.

Looks like they decided their current popularity would not warrant this - so they'll ease off a bit, but hit us with the rise in GST under discussion or fines for being over 0.05 alcohol or some other such thing less controversial.

From the revenues breakdown the KBer acquired a few mths ago, the fines from licence condition breaches are more lucrative than the speeding jackpot in sheer cash volume anyway. Something many other countries won't have.... yet. Tho they're showing an interest, greedy treasuries - kid tax on parents so the teen gets the blame.

I hear parents now remove the other seats from cars their kids drive. Again count my blessings (no kids)