Wellington says no to bikes on footpath. [Archive]

judecatmad

20th November 2007, 08:56

Good lord, and Wellington is one of the better provided for cities as far as bike parking goes! And still the parks fill up cos of the number of bikes around the place.

Fine - if they're going to start penalising people for parking on the footpath when all the bike parks are full (assuming said bikes aren't causing an obstruction of course), we need us one of those 'one bike per road parking space' protests. Car parking in Wellington is so appalling that there will soon be some notice taken!

I suppose we'd have to make sure all bike parks in the vicinity were full first, just so we were actually proving the point tho.....I think that's what was being planned in Auckland.

However, given that we've currently got a cheesecutter campaign going and we do want it to be taken seriously, and for that we need as much public support as possible, which is more important? Parking or the campaign?

RantyDave

20th November 2007, 09:02

The bikes on Boulcott Street have been ticketed, with the meter guy saying they are going to ticket bikes on the footpath from now on.
Really? Was there a bye-law changed somewhere?

A list of councillors - http://www.wellington.govt.nz/about/mayor/index.html. These people are PAID to represent US. Demand that they pay some attention.

Dave

007XX

20th November 2007, 09:11

However, given that we've currently got a cheesecutter campaign going and we do want it to be taken seriously, and for that we need as much public support as possible, which is more important? Parking or the campaign?

That is the objection that came to my mind...are we not a bit worried that making a protest about parking may not detract from the very serious issue of Anti Cheese Cutter campaign?

I'm not criticising, just putting the question out there:cool:

The last thing we want, is people going: "oh man, another bloody bikers' campaign"...if you know what I mean!

Kendog

20th November 2007, 09:23

That’s a fair call re the Cheese cutter campaign.

But this is just another example of a lack of consideration for bikers.
On one hand the council says they want to reduce traffic congestion. Bikes help achieve this, but I don’t think they are catered for sufficiently when it comes to parking. Yes we have free bike parks in the CBD, but over the last few weeks I have noticed a lot of these are so full there are bikes parked all around the area on the footpath.

nudemetalz

20th November 2007, 09:24

Sorry I can't do anything about it, it's enforced by Parkwise, not WCC.

vifferman

20th November 2007, 09:33

However, given that we've currently got a cheesecutter campaign going and we do want it to be taken seriously, and for that we need as much public support as possible, which is more important? Parking or the campaign?
I don't think that is an issue.
Firstly, neither 'campaign' has much to do with public support: both are requiring appeals to bureaucrats. Secondly, we're dealing with two separate and distinct breeds of bureaucrats: politicians/lawmakers and petty local body bureaucrats. Both are known for not giving a crap about what anyone else thinks, and for being insular and uncommunicative.
It is therefore very doubtful about whether one 'campaign' will have much effect on the other, but "having two going at once" could be good for just raising awareness of biking in general.
Provided they're handled correctly, of course.

judecatmad

20th November 2007, 10:03

Sorry I can't do anything about it, it's enforced by Parkwise, not WCC.

But who regulates Parkwise? Surely they can't act outside of the local bylaws and outside of the council's guidance and recommendations?

crazybigal

20th November 2007, 10:11

is it legal to park a bike in a carpark? considering we have free bike parks to use.
man id love to see bikes lined down one of wellington streets, each taking up a car park.:laugh:

darkwolf

20th November 2007, 10:17

Is it not possible to appeal these tickets - that would more likely be the most effective way as it would then slow down the courts process - even more - and they would attempt to do something about it. If you plead the case that there are not enough bike parks and rather than filling up a car park which cause annoyance ot other road users you parked on the foot path out of the way - assuming of course that the bike wasn't smack in the middle of the footpath acting as a barrier.

James Deuce

20th November 2007, 10:26

is it legal to park a bike in a carpark? considering we have free bike parks to use.
man id love to see bikes lined down one of wellington streets, each taking up a car park.:laugh:

No it isn't. Bikes aren't allowed to use pay and display parks in Wellington.

judecatmad

20th November 2007, 10:58

No it isn't. Bikes aren't allowed to use pay and display parks in Wellington.

So what's to be done if all the bike parks are full and the council says it's not within their scope to stop bikes being ticketed for parking where they've always parked as an alternative?

**so confused** Can't park on the footpath if all the parks are full, can't use pay and display if all the parks are full......only alternative is to go home it would seem! Or park in the stadium (they seem to be quite lenient with bikes) - but that's no good for those who work right down the other end of town..... *sigh*

skelstar

20th November 2007, 11:03

Footpaths aren't meant for bikes are they? I think its a bit cheeky using them for such a purpose, and I have done so in the past, but....

Isn't the issue more that you want more bike parks? Be sure of what you are asking for.

Zapf

20th November 2007, 11:07

Stupid wellington... look at Melbourne... Where you get to park bikes everywhere. :rolleyes:

MrMelon

20th November 2007, 12:30

There's some complete wanker of a parking warden down on Grey St who's just ticketed about 40 bikes and he's sitting there ticketing every new one that comes in too. When I pointed out how ridiculous this was sicne all the bike parks around town are chocka, he said it'd encourage us to take public transport. Something seriously needs to be done about this now before it gets way out of hand.

Drum

20th November 2007, 12:42

I totally agree (about something needing to be done). I have been parking in the same spot for more than 2 years and got taxed $60 today. Where was the warning?

And no, I don't think it's "cheeky" to park on the footpath. Take a look where I park and see if I am blocking anyone. There's not even a kerb for crikeys sake. And how come the blue Suzi didn't get a ticket? He's on the red bricks too.

I have a search in at the council to find out the legal status of those bricks and where the road reserve is. You got a fight on your hands you useless council wankers (present company excluded of course!).

I don't believe there is any point in making a public display about this, as we won't get any sympathy from the car driving public. We need to get our point across to the council beurocrats.

nudemetalz

20th November 2007, 12:52

I'll do some investigating and see what I can find out. :)

RantyDave

20th November 2007, 12:54

Take a look where I park and see if I am blocking anyone.
Oh that's you. I park there when I have to go to the dentist. Nice bike - has that whole "grrrrrr" thing going on.

Can I use your picture to send to my councillor?

Dave

RantyDave

20th November 2007, 12:55

I'll do some investigating and see what I can find out.
Re: finding out what the bylaws actually say?

Drum

20th November 2007, 13:01

Oh that's you. I park there when I have to go to the dentist. Nice bike - has that whole "grrrrrr" thing going on.

Can I use your picture to send to my councillor?

Dave

Careful where you park from now on then eh! Unless you want $60 added to the dentists bill.

You can use the picture if you want - they'll be getting a copy from me too with an 'appropriately' worded letter :girlfight:

Till I sort this out Wellington Motorcycles just lost another park out front.

Fatjim

20th November 2007, 13:33

Motorcycles are allowed to park on pay and display parks.

You must however display the ticket clearly.

I just got a ticket for parking on a footpath and will challange it. I suggest everybody does, although I'm sure we'll all get court costs as well.

Oh, and it looks like they'll be a metered parking as soon as the goombas figure out how to charge.

MrMelon

20th November 2007, 13:35

What other option do we have if we can't park on the footpath near the bike parks. I doubt they're going to put enough new bike parks in to accommodate the excess bikes.

James Deuce

20th November 2007, 13:36

Fatjim

20th November 2007, 13:38

Well I got the parking warden to check with "Head office". Computer said yes.

Oh, and update your "buy my bike sig" will ya!

James Deuce

20th November 2007, 13:40

Well I got the parking warden to check with "Head office". Computer said yes.

Oh, and update your "buy my bike sig" will ya!

Computer's wrong.

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showpost.php?p=1167202&postcount=46

Devil

20th November 2007, 13:54

Computer's wrong.

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showpost.php?p=1167202&postcount=46

Ok, I never saw that before. THAT is totally fucking stupid.

*me adds to list of reasons why I wont move back to Wgtn*.

rwh

20th November 2007, 13:59

**so confused** Can't park on the footpath if all the parks are full, can't use pay and display if all the parks are full......only alternative is to go home it would seem!

Well, you can probably find a park closer than Upper Hutt. But it's probably better to take the train in the first place.

I really don't see why we as bikers should have more rights to park than cars - if the carparks are all full, tough for them too.

And the 'bikes reduce traffic congestion' argument - do they really? The 2 seconds gap (ok, tui) between vehicles is much bigger (at speed, anyway) than the length difference between a car and a bike. Ok you can filter - but when you stop filtering and pull back into line - assuming heavy traffic - all you've actually achieved is queue jumping, not an overall efficiency improvement.

For a real improvement in efficiency of transporting commuters, mass transport is the only way.

Pity I hate it.

Richard

Devil

20th November 2007, 14:04

And the 'bikes reduce traffic congestion' argument - do they really? The 2 seconds gap (ok, tui) between vehicles is much bigger (at speed, anyway) than the length difference between a car and a bike. Ok you can filter - but when you stop filtering and pull back into line - assuming heavy traffic - all you've actually achieved is queue jumping, not an overall efficiency improvement.

When you've got multiple bikes together, they take up less space, particularly riding in the staggered formation (2 or more bikes).

Bikes dont block intersections or lanes. They are significantly shorter than most vehicles etc.

James Deuce

20th November 2007, 14:10

Well, you can probably find a park closer than Upper Hutt. But it's probably better to take the train in the first place.

I really don't see why we as bikers should have more rights to park than cars - if the carparks are all full, tough for them too.

And the 'bikes reduce traffic congestion' argument - do they really? The 2 seconds gap (ok, tui) between vehicles is much bigger (at speed, anyway) than the length difference between a car and a bike. Ok you can filter - but when you stop filtering and pull back into line - assuming heavy traffic - all you've actually achieved is queue jumping, not an overall efficiency improvement.

For a real improvement in efficiency of transporting commuters, mass transport is the only way.

Pity I hate it.

Richard

Congestion also includes parking. Conservative estimates give 6 bikes per carpark which in most Western countries equals the number of carparks saved due to each car only having one occupant.

Sometimes I wonder why you took up motorcycles. Riding in line with traffic on the motorway in peak hour traffic is asking to get hurt. Motorcycles do not do well in nose to tail accidents, and there are a few enlightened bureaucracies such as California that actively encourage motorcycles to lane-split, both for safety's sake and reducing congestion.

The moment traffic slows to nose to tail accident speeds, 50km/hr and below, I get out of the queue.

Trains are less energy efficient per passenger than motor vehicles.

crazybigal

20th November 2007, 14:26

these 2 bikes on the right got tickets today, one is just on the footpath by mear cm's crazy its not even in the way, well off the walking area.

MrMelon

20th November 2007, 14:37

There was an even worse one I just noticed down on Grey st. The bike at the end of the bike park, which happened to be parked on tiles, but was between the last "legally" parked bike and a tree (where you can't even walk) got a ticket for parking on the footpath. Just round the corner there's a scooter that's been parked on double yellows all day and guess what. No ticket.

rwh

20th November 2007, 14:48

Congestion also includes parking. Conservative estimates give 6 bikes per carpark which in most Western countries equals the number of carparks saved due to each car only having one occupant.

Sure. So if we convert one park from car to bike, we potentially have 5 more vehicles on the road. Improvement?

Sometimes I wonder why you took up motorcycles. Riding in line with traffic on the motorway in peak hour traffic is asking to get hurt. Motorcycles do not do well in nose to tail accidents, and there are a few enlightened bureaucracies such as California that actively encourage motorcycles to lane-split, both for safety's sake and reducing congestion.

The moment traffic slows to nose to tail accident speeds, 50km/hr and below, I get out of the queue.

I think it was for fun, mostly - not for commuting, although I do. However, I don't commute along the motorway, so I don't get much opportunity to lanesplit, hence don't get much practice, so don't do it most of the time. Until I do get more practice (wide gaps at traffic lights, for example), I don't fancy dodging mirrors of cars that may move in on me without warning, while bumping over catseyes. I'm sure that for those that do it regularly it's no problem.

I accept your comment about not standing up well to a car in the backside, but there are also the issues of people changing lanes having not seen me. In the middle of the lane, I have much more room to move, a better view of the cars in front, and if I'm quick enough, up to two gaps to split into if the need arises.

Trains are less energy efficient per passenger than motor vehicles.

That I'd like to see evidence of. The only energy efficiency problem I see is that they're heavier, which is only an issue during acceleration. Ok they have to stop and start at stations, but the rest of us have intersections. Ok they're pretty blunt aerodynamically, but frontal area per passenger is low. Rolling friction of a metal wheel on a metal rail is low. Perhaps the losses in getting the electrical energy all the way from the power station to the city are significant, but petrol comes further. I'm sure I've missed something, but ...

Richard

magicfairy

20th November 2007, 14:51

There is a much bigger issue at stake. If bikes are not allowed to use Pay and Display that wipes out a ton of parks in town. That means legally we can only use metered parks which seem to be fewer and fewer or bike parks.
So in fact bikes are being given less options than other vehicles, even though they take up less space and cause less congestion.

The stupidity of this can only be exposed by bikes all coming into town and taking up every metered park in Wellington.

Fatjim

20th November 2007, 15:13

I'd much rather get a $60 ticket for parking in a car park than on the footpath.

Drum

20th November 2007, 15:14

OK so I just bumped into one of the slack jawed primates that dispense these tax notices and gave him the hard word. Apparently WCC have a 'no tolerance' approach to bikes on footpaths. He reckons they haven't had a new directive to crack down on us - must just be a coincidence right!

Anyway he didn't know the rules himself as he recommended I occupy one of the nearby multi park pay and display spaces. Moron.

When I asked him if he would give me a ticket if I parked on the asphalt, immediately adjacent to the red brick for which I got fined for parking on, he couldn't tell me. "You might be alright", was all he could muster.

He made tracks when another biker turned up. I know these guys don't make the rules, but they sure are a bunch of total tossers.

RantyDave

20th November 2007, 15:24

He reckons they haven't had a new directive to crack down on us - must just be a coincidence right!
Sure. Just after the elections. Coincidence. Pure fluke.

Y'know, this is exactly how rights are eroded. A little bit at a time. You have to draw the line somewhere and you have to do something other than wave your arms and get upset. I was sick of Chairman Kerry's "for the people, provided they are property developers" regime before and I'm fucking sick of it now.

Time to start harassing councillors, I think.

Dave

dave_a

20th November 2007, 15:32

Wonder if they will try and do me? Im parked where about 20 other bikes park infront of the telecom building its not on the footpath so hopefully ill be right,anyway im sure it must be private property.

Also got a little foot note on my scooter parked up at home in northland,bastards left one saying if i parked on footpath again ill get a ticket,im almost out in karori up a walkway FFS do they expect me to park 50m down the road on the street for it to get stolen or trashed

crazybigal

20th November 2007, 15:39

thats one job i would refuse to do, id rather shovel shit for a living!!

OK so I just bumped into one of the slack jawed primates that dispense these tax notices and gave him the hard word. Apparently WCC have a 'no tolerance' approach to bikes on footpaths. He reckons they haven't had a new directive to crack down on us - must just be a coincidence right!

Anyway he didn't know the rules himself as he recommended I occupy one of the nearby multi park pay and display spaces. Moron.

When I asked him if he would give me a ticket if I parked on the asphalt, immediately adjacent to the red brick for which I got fined for parking on, he couldn't tell me. "You might be alright", was all he could muster.

He made tracks when another biker turned up. I know these guys don't make the rules, but they sure are a bunch of total tossers.

James Deuce

20th November 2007, 16:56

Sure. So if we convert one park from car to bike, we potentially have 5 more vehicles on the road. Improvement?

Eh what? No we have 5 more car parks available. In which you can fit 30 more open topped, two-whelled, self-guided transport pods. Freeing up 25 car parks, and so on. Bikes use less fuel and take up less room. Why are you so against the major benefits of using two wheeled transport in an urban environment?

I think it was for fun, mostly - not for commuting, although I do. However, I don't commute along the motorway, so I don't get much opportunity to lanesplit, hence don't get much practice, so don't do it most of the time. Until I do get more practice (wide gaps at traffic lights, for example), I don't fancy dodging mirrors of cars that may move in on me without warning, while bumping over catseyes. I'm sure that for those that do it regularly it's no problem.

None of that is the drama you make it out to be. It's just practice. It is exceptionally useful for learning just how little space your bike takes up, and is an ideal way to practice your low speed handling skills. I never suggested lansplitting at a huge differential to traffic speed and you learn to use the vehicles on either side of you as shields.

I accept your comment about not standing up well to a car in the backside, but there are also the issues of people changing lanes having not seen me. In the middle of the lane, I have much more room to move, a better view of the cars in front, and if I'm quick enough, up to two gaps to split into if the need arises.
The middle of the lane is the worst place to be in traffic. You can't see stuff in front of the car directly in front of you. You need to be able to hit the gap instantly. I use my brakes and gearbox far less while lanesplitting than I do when riding in traffic, making it both less stressful and more fuel efficient, as well as smoother.

That I'd like to see evidence of. The only energy efficiency problem I see is that they're heavier, which is only an issue during acceleration. Ok they have to stop and start at stations, but the rest of us have intersections. Ok they're pretty blunt aerodynamically, but frontal area per passenger is low. Rolling friction of a metal wheel on a metal rail is low. Perhaps the losses in getting the electrical energy all the way from the power station to the city are significant, but petrol comes further. I'm sure I've missed something, but ...

Richard
http://www.lafn.org/~dave/trans/energy/rail_vs_autoEE.html

http://www.lafn.org/~dave/trans/energy/does_mt_saveE.html

The dude's a rabid greeny too, he's not working for Chrysler or Ford.

Swoop

20th November 2007, 17:29

However, given that we've currently got a cheesecutter campaign going and we do want it to be taken seriously, and for that we need as much public support as possible, which is more important? Parking or the campaign?
Why not both? If organising a group of bikers - take advantage of the opportunity.

Well, you can probably find a park closer than Upper Hutt. But it's probably better to take the train in the first place.

I really don't see why we as bikers should have more rights to park than cars - if the carparks are all full, tough for them too.

And the 'bikes reduce traffic congestion' argument - do they really?

For a real improvement in efficiency of transporting commuters, mass transport is the only way.
I have seen more efficient methods of committing suicide on a bikers' forum, but yours has the potential to be much more colourful.

There is a much bigger issue at stake. If bikes are not allowed to use Pay and Display that wipes out a ton of parks in town. That means legally we can only use metered parks which seem to be fewer and fewer or bike parks.
So in fact bikes are being given less options than other vehicles, even though they take up less space and cause less congestion.
Lets face it, politicians do not grasp the facts when faced with efficiency. Traffic buildup, parking issues and the matter of fast/efficient/inexpensive public transportation do not matter to them.

Fatjim

20th November 2007, 17:35

Well I waxed all philosophical on the way home as I lane splited and darted and reved and backfired and and and.... but anyway.

Tickets are like infractions, you're just gonna get them whether your the silliest idiot (now who springs to mind here) or a Mr Hitcher. Its just life. Who cares, you can't win, the machine is all conquering. But you can have fun while riding to and from work, and I let off quite some steam tonight I can tell you.

Anyway, got home and the ticket was sitting on the dresser so I thought I'd check it out. It was only for $40, not the $60 I was expecting. Thats a dozen of beers I saved today!

The Pastor

20th November 2007, 17:56

Rolling friction of a metal wheel on a metal rail is low.
Richard

The very low rolling resistance of a steel wheel on a rail is partially canceled out by the high weight of passenger trains.

James Deuce

20th November 2007, 17:57

The very low rolling resistance of a steel wheel on a rail is partially canceled out by the high weight of passenger trains.

Which is precisely the conclusion the environmentalist who wrote the studies I posted came to.

The Pastor

20th November 2007, 18:01

Which is precisely the conclusion the environmentalist who wrote the studies I posted came to.
Which is precisely where i copied it from

Str8 Jacket

20th November 2007, 19:20

I had a poor parkwise fulla bailed up at Manners Mall today while he was ticketing a very tidy R6, he had his hands all over it checking for WOF and Rego which was quite clearly visible so I asked him what he was doing.... Apparently as from today they are ticketing ALL bikes not parked legally, ie on the footpath, yellow lines etc..... I didnt bother harrasing him about it as he is just following orders however, I would have thought that they should have been giving out warnings for the last couple of days..... I noticed on my long walk to the train station that they had ticketd alot of bikes, they would have made a FORTUNE today! I have to say that I could not see any tickets on scooters, but I may be wrong......

RantyDave

20th November 2007, 19:43

Apparently as from today they are ticketing ALL bikes not parked legally
I was under the impression it's legal to park on the footpath provided you didn't block anyone/thing.

Dave

Str8 Jacket

20th November 2007, 19:46

I was under the impression it's legal to park on the footpath provided you didn't block anyone/thing.

Dave

Well according to Mr Parkwise they have been advised that as from today they must ticket all bikes pared on footpaths..... Go figure!

davereid

20th November 2007, 20:03

The system can't handle lots of court cases. I'd suggest just writing in, deny the offence and ask for it to go to court. If they get dozens of tickets that they have to take to court, they may rethink. If you have a scooter claim its a moped, and legal to park on the footpath. Or claim that you were on the part of the footpath, but in the part owned by the shop owner, not the council.

I'd suggest that simply getting them to court over each and every offence would stop the rot.

unrealone

20th November 2007, 20:17

Fucking sick bastards. This makes me so angry. That last pic is right outside my building. I'm lucky enough to start work early and tend to always get a park (as tightly as possible of course to allow for more bikes). I still see a few bikes up on footpath when I go our for lunch. Even a scooter that is parked on the other side of the barrier at the end of the park.

Never have they been ticketed up until now. No notification - nothing. Pure profit making CUNTS.

I'm sorry, but I despise the ParkWise wardens. The excuse that, "they're just doing what the boss says" is ridiculous. There aren't meant to be any quotas (although an old friend who works with them tells me they get told each morning that they should be "achieving" a certain amount), so why don't they stop being blatent fucking sheep and go and ticket someone who is actually committing an offense.

/rant

unrealone

20th November 2007, 20:21

these 2 bikes on the right got tickets today, one is just on the footpath by mear cm's crazy its not even in the way, well off the walking area.

The fucking BICYCLE is more of a hazard - that's what should be ticketed there.

Str8 Jacket

20th November 2007, 20:22

Unfortunately EVERy job has quots of some sort... thats how companies make the dollars! When I was working at Min Of inJustice as a collections officer, we had quotas we had to mame monthly.

McJim

20th November 2007, 20:24

Move to Invercargill - there's loads of space down here. :rofl: and apart from the wee fella at the airport I've not seen too much in terms of parking wardens.

Weaver

20th November 2007, 20:37

Taking up car parks is defiently the answer.
Also the bike parks that are in the surrounding towns of wellington ( petone, upper hutt, etc) are taken up by cars half the fucken times. If I had a bike I couldn't care less about being knocked over, i'd park in front of the wankers.

sels1

20th November 2007, 21:13

Move to Invercargill - there's loads of space down here. :rofl: and apart from the wee fella at the airport I've not seen too much in terms of parking wardens.
I've met that plonker, I just pulled the rental car over to uplift a (very) heavy equipment case into the boot, and he's there waving his arms and spouting off and this is despite the fact I was wearing my airport id and was working on equipment for his airport!

On the parking issue, there was an thing last year with the Council looking to charge fees for bike parking and an email campaign was carried out aimed at the Council with many submissions sent in. (And some in-fighting in Council) The upshot was a statment that Council were not going to charge for bike parking. Sounds like whoever lost last time is out for vengance. I cant remember the details but I think it is still on my work pc so will have a look.
Its probably all on public record on the Councils site any.
There were some Councillors that were pro bikes - might pay to bring this nonsense to their attention - you might find it is only a few individuals that are stirring this along - ring your elected representitive and get the story!

Drum

20th November 2007, 21:19

...... It was only for $40, not the $60 I was expecting. Thats a dozen of beers I saved today!

Upon closer inspection it appears I have been fined $60 for parking in an area marked with broken yellow lines. Can anyone see these lines in my original post?? (Post #17). Is this some sort of flamin' joke?

James Deuce

20th November 2007, 21:21

There's your defence Drum. Take some more detailed pictures tomorrow. I've walked past your bike and would be happy to stand up in court and loudly proclaim that it in no way impedes foot traffic, service vehicle, and nor does it interfere with car parks in the vicinity.

unrealone

20th November 2007, 21:30

The little handheld units they use take photos. If they have no photo of it then surely you can protest that there is no proof.

Drum

20th November 2007, 21:36

.... Take some more detailed pictures tomorrow. I've walked past your bike and would be happy to stand up in court and loudly proclaim that it in no way impedes foot traffic, service vehicle, and nor does it interfere with car parks in the vicinity.

Oh I've got plenty of photos and will be dropping my letter in tomorrow.

Thanks for the offer too. I am hopeful of not making it to court.

Regardless, I will have to stop parking there as they will be out for me after the earful I gave creeping jesus.

James Deuce

20th November 2007, 21:38

ahhhhhhh - it's gorn pink!

sombody fink of da kiddies!

Grahameeboy

20th November 2007, 21:39

I found this for Wellington

Parking Offences that Incur a $60 Fine
parking on or within six metres of an intersection
parking on or near a pedestrian crossing
parking on a broken yellow line
double parking
inconsiderate parking
parking on a clearway
parking on a bus-only lane
All other parking offences under the Act incur a $40 fine, including parking on footpaths.

So it seems that it is an offence to park on footpaths.

Timber020

20th November 2007, 22:04

Whats the ticket for taking up a pre payed car park?

Wally Simmonds

20th November 2007, 22:12

I don't understand why this is only now being enforced. It is simply a case of profit making? Who exactly are these people serving by ticketing bikes on footpaths? It makes no sense to me.

James Deuce

20th November 2007, 22:15

Be quiet. According to your profile, you don't even have a bike Wally Simmonds! Go to bed! It's past your bed time lad.

Kendog

20th November 2007, 22:22

Be quiet. According to your profile, you don't even have a bike Wally Simmonds! Go to bed! It's past your bed time lad.

You are on fire tonight.

But in all seriousness, I wonder what is going to happen tomorrow morning once the inadequate number of bike parks are filled up.

rwh

20th November 2007, 22:37

http://www.lafn.org/~dave/trans/energy/rail_vs_autoEE.html

http://www.lafn.org/~dave/trans/energy/does_mt_saveE.html

The dude's a rabid greeny too, he's not working for Chrysler or Ford.

Interesting stuff, thanks. Will have to think on that a bit, but I think I'm right in concluding that:

Trains may be less efficient now, but could be made much more so - they need to be lighter and more utilised. AFAIK the main reason for the extreme weight is to deal with the forces involved in shunting long trains - if commuter rail involved effectively buses on rails - only 30-40 seats - they could be much lighter, and also spaced out more giving less waiting time and hopefully better ridership (and much less wasted space for off-peak services). Driver costs would go up, of course, since you'd need more of them. 15-seat railcars would be the same only moreso - I guess what size is best would depend on the specific circumstances.

The real answer is to not travel.

In the meantime, I'll commute on my bike feeling a bit less guilty - thanks :-)

I might also look at cheaper (to run) bikes ...

Richard

Aerox50

21st November 2007, 08:17

I was under the impression it's legal to park on the footpath provided you didn't block anyone/thing.

Dave

Thats only for us moped riders :banana:

http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/roadcode/about-other-road-users/information-for-moped-riders.html

You must not leave a moped blocking the footpath.

Dodger

21st November 2007, 09:07

Thats only for us moped riders :banana:

http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/roadcode/about-other-road-users/information-for-moped-riders.html

I wonder if the average parking thug can tell the difference between a 50cc and a 100cc scooter? :whistle:

Aerox50

21st November 2007, 11:44

I wonder if the average parking thug can tell the difference between a 50cc and a 100cc scooter? :whistle:

I would imagine so... they have a different rego class ;)

judecatmad

21st November 2007, 11:55

I found this for Wellington

Parking Offences that Incur a $60 Fine
parking on or within six metres of an intersection

That's hilarious - most roadside parks go up to within about 1 or 2m of intersections!!!

Let's ticket everybody! That'll solve Wellington's traffic problems......only then the public transport system will fall over cos it can't cope with the volume...

sels1

21st November 2007, 12:00

From May last year, a reply from my email to Council re the possiblity to charging for bike parking. There is a later one I will post when I find it.

Thank you for your email about charging for motorcycle parking in the CBD.

I can assure you that the Council has not made any decision to charge for motorcycle parking, nor is it considering any such proposal, so I am unclear as to what has caused your concern.

All I can think of is that wires have been crossed over a proposal in our Draft Parking Policy to look into motorcycle parking in the CBD, including the location and number of parking spaces. An appendix of the main report that went to the Council's Strategy and Policy Committee last week included a question regarding the issue of pricing, but this is just a question and does not constitute a Council decision or an intention to charge.

You may wish to read the draft Parking Policy which is being consulted on from 3 May. You can read the policy online at www.wellington.govt.nz and are welcome to make a submission. However, I will also ask Council officers to treat the email you have already sent me as a submission.

Yours sincerely

Kerry Prendergast
MAYOR

Update - Doh - looks like I deleted it. But I know the Council have just reviewed the parking policies....

Dodger

21st November 2007, 13:15

I would imagine so... they have a different rego class ;)

True, if you can ever find the rego tag :)

Fatjim

21st November 2007, 15:33

Not many bikes on the footpath today

Hawkeye

21st November 2007, 16:22

Not many bikes on the footpath today

But the ones that were on the path outside ANZ at lunch time had tickets. 2 scooters and a bike.

Mom

21st November 2007, 16:30

Be quiet. According to your profile, you don't even have a bike Wally Simmonds! Go to bed! It's past your bed time lad.

Harsh, but very funny all the same!

Not many bikes on the footpath today

Thats because the parking bas-turds got them all yesterday, and they are wallet shy today!

AnotherLeon

21st November 2007, 20:35

I've emailed info@wcc.govt.nz and mayor@wcc.govt.nz (the mayor one was just a stab in the dark) with my concerns about the limited parking, and asked "where are we supposed to park now".

edit: oops, found out it should have been kerry.prendergast@wcc.govt.nz

nudemetalz

22nd November 2007, 07:58

The latest on the bike-parking issue in Wellington.

Alrighties. I’ve just had a chat with some higher-ups to do with this dilemma.

Apparently, the ratio between cars to carparks is a lot worse than bikes to bike-parks, ie there is a shortage of carparks.
So, the WCC is not going to increase the bike-parks.
Also, with motorcycles parking on the footpath will result in ticketing, their reason being they believe it is becoming dangerous.
The example they give is Featherston St/Grey St behind ANZ.
They would not want a child either playing with a bike or having it fall on top of them.

Motorcycles are allowed to utilise carparks but they will have to pay like cars do.

Hopefully this gives you the lowdown on what the situation is.

James Deuce

22nd November 2007, 08:03

Motorcycles are allowed to utilise carparks but they will have to pay like cars do.

Not until they change that bylaw are we allowed to use metered parking. $60 ticket for using them. I don't know about you, but any time an authority figure has said something in contravention of one of their own rules it's ended in tears.

Deano

22nd November 2007, 08:07

Dodger

22nd November 2007, 08:11

But the ones that were on the path outside ANZ at lunch time had tickets. 2 scooters and a bike.

Were the scooter's of the moped category?

rwh

22nd November 2007, 08:29

Not until they change that bylaw are we allowed to use metered parking. $60 ticket for using them. I don't know about you, but any time an authority figure has said something in contravention of one of their own rules it's ended in tears.

Only multi-park meters (eg pay&display) - single meters are fine.

Richard

Str8 Jacket

22nd November 2007, 08:33

They should have had a 'grace period', or amnesty of sorts where only warnings were issued until word had got out.

By not ticketing bikes on footpaths in the past, they were effectively condoning it.

Is 'promissary estoppel' (sp) relevant for anyone wanting to get off the ticket ?

I totally agree. Where were the warnings? I reckon there were none cause they damn well knew that they could make $xxxx's of dollars in one day. After having worked for MoJ for 5 years and having spoken to some of the guys I used to work with there is stuff all chance of getting of these tickets guy's. The law states that parking on a foot path is an offence and even though they have never ticketed you before they will just say that you were lucky.
I suggest you pay them BEFORE they go to court and you are stung with the court costs. Also disputing them may also well result in you having to pay the ticket PLUS court costs. Before anyone gets angry, I am just trying to help, I no longer work for MoJ.....

James Deuce

22nd November 2007, 08:54

Only multi-park meters (eg pay&display) - single meters are fine.

Richard

Find me a single meter in Wellington.

They are a dying breed. Even the ones on Cuba St and Abel Smith St have gone.

Grahameeboy

22nd November 2007, 08:58

I totally agree. Where were the warnings? I reckon there were none cause they damn well knew that they could make $xxxx's of dollars in one day. After having worked for MoJ for 5 years and having spoken to some of the guys I used to work with there is stuff all chance of getting of these tickets guy's. The law states that parking on a foot path is an offence and even though they have never ticketed you before they will just say that you were lucky.
I suggest you pay them BEFORE they go to court and you are stung with the court costs. Also disputing them may also well result in you having to pay the ticket PLUS court costs. Before anyone gets angry, I am just trying to help, I no longer work for MoJ.....

Well lets be honest, we know that parking on pavements is debatable so we cannot complain about lack of warnings.

Look at the other angle, motorcyclists got away with free parking for a while when they should have been ticketed, did we say thanks then?

Trudes

22nd November 2007, 09:23

[B][U].
They would not want a child either playing with a bike or having it fall on top of them.

Ummm, What????
WTF are children doing playing with bikes on the footpaths? Oh that's right, I forgot, parents watching their children and making sure they don't tamper with other people's property is something that is often forgotten and left to everyone else to do. I agree with things being made safe for children, but come on, if this is their best excuse for bikes not being parked on footpaths, they can bite my bum, that's pathetic!!:mad:

Str8 Jacket

22nd November 2007, 09:27

they can bite my bum

Can I please?....

Trudes

22nd November 2007, 09:29

Can I please?....

Anytime babe, just be warned, I may like it!:innocent:

Drum

22nd November 2007, 10:08

.....Apparently, the ratio between cars to carparks is a lot worse than bikes to bike-parks, ie there is a shortage of carparks......

Yes, but car usage into the CBD is being discouraged while motorcycle/ scooter use is being encouraged. :brick:

Thanks for looking into it all the same.

nudemetalz

22nd November 2007, 10:58

I agree with things being made safe for children, but come on, if this is their best excuse for bikes not being parked on footpaths, they can bite my bum, that's pathetic!!:mad:

Just remember, I'm only telling you peoples what I got told myself. I don't necessarily agree with it even though I work there.

And thanks Drum, I'm only trying to help.

Anyway, I also looked into what Jim said about bylaws and getting ticketed for using metered carparks.
I spoke to another person at WCC here and this is what I got.

A motorcyclist can park in a metered parking space. However they need to both pay for parking and comply with the appropriate time restrictions. However, the problem is that most parks are now controlled by pay and display machines requiring the driver to display a receipt in the vehicle. Obviously this is an issue for motor cyclists. However, if a ticket was issued and the rider was able to produce a valid receipt the ticket would be reconsidered. If a receipt isn't displayed it is a $40.00 offence.

This is the Council's position on it and not necessarily the Government's.

Swoop

22nd November 2007, 11:17

I don't understand why this is only now being enforced.
Simply because it is the elected official mentality. Local elections have been held, so they can now go back to being c*nts. In a couple of years time they will be nice to us again...

AnotherLeon

22nd November 2007, 20:35

Thank you for your email today regarding motorscooter parking options in Wellington City.

We have forwarded your email to our Parking Services and Infringement Team. They are investigating the situation and will have an answer for you in the next 3-5 working days. For more information on parking in Wellington, please see our website.

www.wellington.govt.nz/services/parking/

Please also find attached a list of the various approved motorcycle/motorscooter parks in Wellington.

<<motorcycles_parking_list.doc>>

Hrrrmmmm, ok.

RantyDave

22nd November 2007, 21:07

Motorcycles are allowed to utilise carparks but they will have to pay like cars do.
If I have to pay I am having the whole fucking slot. The car/carpark ratio can kiss my arse.

Dave

pete376403

22nd November 2007, 21:29

The latest on the bike-parking issue in Wellington.

Alrighties. I’ve just had a chat with some higher-ups to do with this dilemma.

Apparently, the ratio between cars to carparks is a lot worse than bikes to bike-parks, ie there is a shortage of carparks.
.
In a previous thread about bike parking I recieved a reply from WCC and he claimed that bikes are apparently over supplied with parks vis a vis cars. However the figures they used to justify this were very dodgy

quote:
2. List of areas set aside for motorcycle parking in the CBD.

Wellington has motorcycle parking in streets such as Lambton Quay, Featherston, Ballance, Mercer, Johnston, The Terrace, Grey, Vivian, among others. Unfortunately, at this time, we are unable to provide you a complete list due the ongoing changes happening in the city. In the future, we can create a map of these areas that will be made available to the public.

3. Anti-motorcycle stance of the WCC

In New Zealand there are approximately 36,000 registered motorcycles compared to 2.5 million other vehicles. This is a ratio of one motorcycle for every 70 vehicles. Based on the same proportion of parks for motorcycles as for other vehicles, the city could need to provide one motorcycle park to every 70 on-street car parks. Our Parking Services database shows there are approximately 2500 on-street parking spaces in the CBD. Based on the proportions above, 36 motorcycle spaces in the CBD would represent a 70:1 ratio. We are confident a quick count of our motorcycle spaces would exceed 36 by a considerable margin. Therefore proportionately the city is providing more than adequate parking for motorcycles.

Secondly, Wellington on-street car parks have fees and time restrictions leading to turnover of spaces. The city collects more than $10 million a year from on-street parking meters. However, motorcycle parking is free, there are no time restrictions and turnover of parking spaces is low. In fact, an initial investigation on imposing fees for motorbike parking did not get the support from the Councillors.

Finally, the Council's Infrastructure Unit proactively looks for areas in the city where motorcycle parks can be established in road spaces that are not big enough for a vehicle.

We hope that we have answered your queries regarding motorcycle parking in the Wellington CBD area. Please let us know if you have further clarifications on the matter.

Thank you.

Orencio Gueco
Property and Parking Services
Wellington City Council
101 Wakefield Street
Wellington

Phone: 04-8038287
Fax: 04-8013002

However Grubs reply showed the stats are quite incorrect:
"From LTNZ Statistics http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/sta.../table-39.html

Total fleet by Vehicle type to 30 June 2006
================================
1 Mopeds (under 60cc) 21,000
2 Trailers/Caravans 542,316
3 Tractors 35,240
4 Agricultural machines 1,526
5 Non-highway trailers 1,160
6 Mobile machines 14,364
7 Passenger cars/vans 2,702,485
8 Goods vans/trucks/utilities 493,910
9 Buses 18,854
10 Motor caravans 21,781
11 Motorcycles 83,904
12 ATVs 3,691
13 Special purpose vehicles 2,360
=========================
Total 3,942,591

The point is probably well made by the WCC regarding the proportions although one set of discovered porkies might mean there are others about how many parks are provided."

Feel free to give Orencio a call and let him know how you feel

Trudes

23rd November 2007, 05:56

So, have I got this right?? Scooters can park on footpaths, but bikes cannot. So how many scooters are taking up bike parks? Last time I parked in town I noticed about 3 scooters in the park I tried to squeeze my bike in. How about we remind these guys that they are allowed to park on the footpaths (if indeed they are), and leave the parks to the bikes that have to park there. :calm: (deep breath)

James Deuce

23rd November 2007, 07:08

Only 50cc/less than 2kw scooters can park on the footpath.

Drogen Omen

23rd November 2007, 08:11

you are quite right... footpaths are not for bikes...acording to legislation, but then there are not enought bike parks available.

if we are not alowed to park our bikes on the footpath then the council or parkwise or whoever needs to provide some form of motorcycle parking on every street/block in wellington city. this is the fair thing to do so that car drivers and motorcycle drivers are equal.

arguing about congestion... the other benefit to motorbikes is that they are more eco friendly than your avarage gas guzling soccer moms 4x4... like the 2007 black humer driving round wellington with the tiny little 4 foot 5 inch lady i saw driving parking it on willis street the other day... (im supprised she doesnt need a step lader) funiest site ever.

warhorse

23rd November 2007, 10:25

Only 50cc/less than 2kw scooters can park on the footpath.

Does anyone have official websites stating that scooters can legally park on footpaths? I have spoken to Ocenico at Welling Parking Services and also the Land Transport Authority this morning. Neither could confirm that scooters have the legal right to parking on footpaths. I was ticketed yesterday in Hunter St for my 49cc motor being on the edge of the footpath as the bike park was full :mad:

dave_a

23rd November 2007, 10:29

you can legally park on the footpath as you are classed as a moped

dave_a

23rd November 2007, 10:29

aslong as you are not blocking foot traffic

nudemetalz

23rd November 2007, 11:57

I'm still working on getting more info from the people in the know.

Nasty

23rd November 2007, 13:24

Does anyone have official websites stating that scooters can legally park on footpaths? I have spoken to Ocenico at Welling Parking Services and also the Land Transport Authority this morning. Neither could confirm that scooters have the legal right to parking on footpaths. I was ticketed yesterday in Hunter St for my 49cc motor being on the edge of the footpath as the bike park was full :mad:

The following site:

http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/roadcode/about-other-road-users/information-for-moped-riders.html

But what it says is as important as what it doesn't. it says That the parked moped must not block the footpath - therefore not excluding it from parking on it. The arguement is there to be had. It is based around the language rather than anything else. Make sure that your bike is classed as a scooter and registered as such before taking on an arguement or you will loose.

nudemetalz

23rd November 2007, 14:10

The following site:

http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/roadcode/about-other-road-users/information-for-moped-riders.html

But what it says is as important as what it doesn't. it says That the parked moped must not block the footpath - therefore not excluding it from parking on it. The arguement is there to be had. It is based around the language rather than anything else. Make sure that your bike is classed as a scooter and registered as such before taking on an arguement or you will loose.

Well I got it from talking to the people here that no motorcycles or scooters/moped are allowed to park on the footpath.
They will be ticketed if they do.

Nasty

23rd November 2007, 14:32

Well I got it from talking to the people here that no motorcycles or scooters/moped are allowed to park on the footpath.
They will be ticketed if they do.

awesome ... I love how council works ... opps they are my bosses ;)

Drogen Omen

27th November 2007, 13:02

A point which may not have been mentioned in this discussion is that **not all paved areas between the road edge and the buildings are council property**. The boundaries of many buildings extend beyond the frontage of the building.
This means that if you park a motorbike/moped within the boundary of a property, you are technically on private property and the council does not have jurisdiction to issue tickets. In this case, you park at the building owner’s discretion. Arguably, if there is no sign on the building saying you may not park, you can probably park there but you might get towed by the owner.

I too was ticketed by WCC Parkwise last week at a location where I have parked for 18 months. I have never been warned or cautioned by passing wardens and the building owner has not (to my knowledge) denied access.

In the process of finding out about the ticket, I spoke to John ‘We-don’t-give-surnames‘ at Parkwise (04 801355) and Colleen (Thurston I think) 8013554 at the council. Both of them confirmed that Parkwise could not ticket vehicles on private property – enforcement there is a building owner matter. Furthermore, Colleen commented that wardens could/should check the boundaries of properties on the council web site.

Here are some good examples:
Go to the Property Search page on WCC web site: http://www.wellington.govt.nz/services/rates/search/search.html
Look up 181 Willis St : http://www.wellington.govt.nz/services/rates/search/results.php?type=account&list=true&account=1124635
Click on View Aerial Photo. You will see that the boundary extents to some footpath mounted bollards. There are two legal carparks on the pavement inside these bollards.

Other sites of interest are:
- 203 Willis st
- 2 Manners st

To others who may be annoyed at the council’s renewed ‘zero tolerance’ policy on footpath parking, I suggest you lobby in a positive way for improved bike parking. I suspect that antagonizing the council will end up being counter productive. If possible, get permission for a building owner if you can find a good spot on the path to park.

One other thing, in case you weren’t aware, the council bylaws (section 18 – Traffic) do not permit bikes to park on ‘multiple parking areas’ i.e. Pay and Display parks.
However, it is tempting to arrange a ‘one bike per car park‘ protest if the council starts digging it’s heals in :)

ThumperNut

27th November 2007, 15:43

Did someone say that they had advice from the council that motor bikes could use pay and display parks as long as a ticket was purchased? This view was expressed to me by a person I spoke to at Parkwise last week.
If that is the case then the following bylaw sections would seem to apply:

18.4.1 In respect of areas controlled by parking meters:

3. No driver of a vehicle shall park it in a parking space which is already occupied by another vehicle, provided that more than one motor cycle may be parked in a parking space.
4. Where more than one motorcycle occupies a parking space only one parking fee for any authorised period shall be required. However, no motorcycle shall remain parked in the parking space while the parking meter placed at that parking space shows the authorised period has expired.

If that is so, perhaps it would allow several bikers to share a park and take turns (yes it would be a pain) at getting a pay-and-display chit during the day.

However, technically, WCC bylaws do NOT permit motorcycles to use pay-and-display:
18.6.5 No person shall park a motorcycle in any parking meter area controlled by a multiple parking meter, other than in any part specifically set aside for motorcycles.

My opinions are my own - your milage may vary.

James Deuce

27th November 2007, 16:17

However, technically, WCC bylaws do NOT permit motorcycles to use pay-and-display:
18.6.5 No person shall park a motorcycle in any parking meter area controlled by a multiple parking meter, other than in any part specifically set aside for motorcycles.

I've already pointed that out to several WCC employees and Parkwise. They INSIST on attempting to tell me that it is alright to park in a multi-bay meter covered park. They go quiet the moment I quote 18.6.5 back to them. Even trying to get friendly WCC employees to investigate the legality of using multi-bay meter covered parks has proved fruitless.

I'm not a ratepayer in the WCC catchment. Could a ratepayer please attend a meeting and bring this up?

Fatjim

27th November 2007, 16:38

Thumper, those laws only apply to individually metered parks only, not pay and display.

As jim52 pointed out in his youth, there aren't many of those left!

rwh

28th November 2007, 10:08

Here are some good examples:
Go to the Property Search page on WCC web site: http://www.wellington.govt.nz/services/rates/search/search.html
Look up 181 Willis St : http://www.wellington.govt.nz/services/rates/search/results.php?type=account&list=true&account=1124635
Click on View Aerial Photo. You will see that the boundary extents to some footpath mounted bollards. There are two legal carparks on the pavement inside these bollards.

Interesting .. at 150 Willis St, it appears that most of us park on the footpath, despite being one floor up in the carpark :-)

Richard

don rocard

28th November 2007, 10:40

ThumperNut

28th November 2007, 10:45

A further interesting development this morning. One of my colleagues happened to talk to a Parkwise warden on Willis St. The gist of the conversation was that no further tickets would be issued for bikes parked in front of a particular building where the boundary extends well out onto the paved area (although the warden seemed unaware of the fact that this is private property) and that tickets previously issued (last week) would be waived.

I've sent in my explanatory letter today for the ticket I received there so we'll see in due course if this is in fact true. The fact that I have received no more tickets parking there this week suggests that this may be true.

Drum

28th November 2007, 11:00

......A definitive ruling should be demanded from the appropriate authority......
If you force a definitive ruling you'll get one alright - no parking on the footpath!

Ambiguity is our friend, as it is with lanesplitting.

Dodger

28th November 2007, 11:06

Ambiguity is our friend, as it is with lanesplitting.

I'm shocked, you would never lanesplit would you? :girlfight:

Has anyone contested their parking ticket and got off yet?

ThumperNut

28th November 2007, 12:06

Has anyone contested their parking ticket and got off yet?

Working on it. I'll let you know when I have a response to my submission/reason/excuse :)

Drum

28th November 2007, 12:34

My submission is in. Waiting to hear back.

pete376403

28th November 2007, 19:31

:niceone:I think this is a job for B.R.O.N.Z. to get their teeth into as it is a nationwide hassle.A definitive ruling should be demanded from the appropriate authority.In Auckland a bike rider by the name of John Banks the Mayor could be a crusader for this.

And in Wellington it could be counciller Chris Parkin (if he's still on the council)
he has a Ducati or summat like that

ThumperNut

28th November 2007, 19:50

In case it helps anyone, here is a response I received today from WCC regarding motorcycle parking in Coupon Parking Areas. There are some coupon areas quite close to the CBD. (See http://http://www.wellington.govt.nz/services/parking/pdfs/2006-11centralparkingmap.pdf )

---

Dear TN,

Thank you for your email today enquiring if motorcycles parked in coupon parking zones are required to display a coupon.

TN, we have contacted Parkwise regarding your enquiry and they have stated that motorcycles are not required to pay for parking in coupon parking zones, and therefore do not need to display a parking coupon.

If you need further clarification on this, you may contact Parkwise direct on (04) 801 3555. Alternatively you can contact the Wellington City Council Customer Contact Centre on (04) 499 4444 and during business hours we will transfer you through to Parkwise, and after hours we will take the details of your enquiry/compliant and pass them onto an after hours parking warden for their action.

For more information in parking in Wellington, please see our website.

* www.wellington.govt.nz/services/parking/index.html (http://www.wellington.govt.nz/services/parking/index.html)

Please also find attached a list of the various approved motorcycle parks in Wellington.

If we can help you further TN, or you have any questions about Wellington City Council services, please call our 24-hour Customer Contact Centre on (04) 499 4444 or email info@wcc.govt.nz

Regards

Justin Tuttle
Online Channel Coordinator
Citizen Engagement Directorate
Wellington City Council
101 Wakefield St.
Wellington
Contact (04) 499 4444
Fax (04) 801 3138
Email info@wcc.govt.nz

Drum

28th November 2007, 20:55

Letter was waiting for me when I got home. In all their wisdom they have decided to cancel my ticket.

Bullitt

29th November 2007, 20:50

So what does that mean Thumper? We can legally park a bike in a pay and display park without paying anything?

If so that could be the answer, one bike per park...

ThumperNut

29th November 2007, 21:22

You can park a bike in a Coupon Parking area without needing a coupon. However, don't confuse this with Pay And Display.
The parking areas in town where you put money in the nearby machine and get a printed ticket for the vehicle are Pay and Display, not Coupon parking.
The coupon parking areas are further out like in Kelburn, Thorndon, Mt Vic etc and you buy the coupons from dairies or at the Council.

On a slightly different note, it occurs to me that the by-law about bikes and pay and display areas may have a subtle loophole in it, but you would need to get a lawyer type to confirm this (I'm only an engineer!).
The by-law states:
18.6.5 No person shall park a motorcycle in any parking meter area controlled by a multiple parking meter, other than in any part specifically set aside for motorcycles.

Note that it says '.. any parking meter area controlled by a multiple parking meter..'.
My point here is that if there is not a 'part specifically set aside for motorcycles' in the area controlled by a particular pay-and-display meter, this rule would not apply.
To put it another way, could it be inferred that you can park on pay-and-display carparks if there is no directly associated area set aside for motorcycles? You might have to have a pay-and-display chit though.
Might be interesting to test this! :shifty:

Trudes

30th November 2007, 05:57

I like your way of thinking ThumperNut!!! I love picking loopholes in the wording of official stuff, bastards! Would be well worth looking into.

Sanx

30th November 2007, 12:28

On a slightly different note, it occurs to me that the by-law about bikes and pay and display areas may have a subtle loophole in it, but you would need to get a lawyer type to confirm this (I'm only an engineer!).
The by-law states:
18.6.5 No person shall park a motorcycle in any parking meter area controlled by a multiple parking meter, other than in any part specifically set aside for motorcycles.

Note that it says '.. any parking meter area controlled by a multiple parking meter..'.
My point here is that if there is not a 'part specifically set aside for motorcycles' in the area controlled by a particular pay-and-display meter, this rule would not apply.
To put it another way, could it be inferred that you can park on pay-and-display carparks if there is no directly associated area set aside for motorcycles? You might have to have a pay-and-display chit though.
Might be interesting to test this! :shifty:

Nice try, but I don't think it would fly. IANAL, however the use of the word 'any' implies that there may or may not be a dedicated motorcycle area. Had they said 'other than in the part specifically set aside for motorcycles.', I think you might have had a good point. There's also another possibility too: 'controlled by a multiple parking meter'. The indefinite article implies a sole multiple parking meter. Just one. As the meters themselves (in Auckland, anyway) state that if a particular meter is out of order, then go to the next one, it can be argued that most areas are controlled by multiple multiple parking meters, and therefore are not covered by this particular by-law.

On the other hand, I could be talking absolute tripe, so don't blame me if you try this in court and lose.

James Deuce

30th November 2007, 12:32

I would suggest that the part of 18.6.5 that refers to 'part specifically set aside for motorcycles' indicates that there will be pay and display parking for motorcycles at some point, or that they were planning motorcycle pay & display at the time the bylaw was written. I don't think it is a loophole at all.

Dodger

30th November 2007, 12:35

Letter was waiting for me when I got home. In all their wisdom they have decided to cancel my ticket.

Congrats,
Thats $40 less they will get (mind you wasn't your ticket stuffed up so $60?)

AnotherLeon

30th November 2007, 21:17

I got this as a reply from a Kim, on behalf of a Kerry.

Dear Leon

Thank you for your email of 21 November 2007 regarding motorcycles and mopeds parking on footpaths within the Central Business District.

I appreciate your concern that Parkwise has recently started ticketing motorcycles and scooters illegally parked on the footpath. In hindsight, we should have advised affected parties before the change in our enforcement and those responsible have been spoken to in that regard. But at the same time parking on the footpath is illegal and Parkwise will continue to ticket offending vehicles especially where they are either obstructing pedestrians or presenting a safety hazard to pedestrians.

Over the next few months Council Staff will undertake a review of motorcycle parking in the city and this will take into account the ratio of on-street car parks to motorcycle parks, as well as the relative merits of all transport options.

As I’m sure you are aware, we have intense competing demands on our street space, particularly in the CBD. We also want to encourage the use of public transport options as part of our Parking Policy.

None of this solves your parking dilemma. You could consider use of the Tournament Parking Building next to the Duxton Hotel on Wakefield Street. They provide motorcycle/moped parking in a secure all-weather location at no cost. You could also approach other private providers closer to your workplace to discuss if they provide motorcycle/moped parking.

If you have any further questions, please don’t hesitate to contact either Holden Hohaia, Support Manager, direct on 383-4428 or holden.hohaia@wcc.govt.nz or Colleen Thessman, Parking Services Manager, direct on 803-8138 or colleen.thessman@wcc.govt.nz.

Yours sincerely

Kerry Prendergast

MAYOR

Kendog

30th November 2007, 21:25

I got this as a reply from a Kim, on behalf of a Kerry.

Isn't that a nice answer. Wonder what will come of the 'review'.

James Deuce

30th November 2007, 22:05

Isn't that a nice answer. Wonder what will come of the 'review'.

WCC Motorcycle Parking Review, April 2008

"Stop riding motorcycles as they are dangerous.

Get the bus.

All motorcycle parking in Wellington will be removed.

You are hoons and motorcycling is dangerous.

Any motorcycles seen within the WCC catchment will receive a $3000 fine.

Get the bus you hoons."

Kendog

30th November 2007, 22:09

WCC Motorcycle Parking Review, April 2008

"Stop riding motorcycles as they are dangerous.

Get the bus.

All motorcycle parking in Wellington will be removed.

You are hoons and motorcycling is dangerous.

Any motorcycles seen within the WCC catchment will receive a $3000 fine.

Get the bus you hoons."

I'm ok then, I bus to work already :yes:

James Deuce

30th November 2007, 22:14

It takes me 1hr 45 minutes to get the bus and train to work. I live 17kms away. I have to get on the first bus at 6:50am.

If I use public transport to get home I have to be at Petone station by 6:10pm, or there is no bus until the next morning, so I have a 5.5km walk up some of the steepest hills in the Hutt. It costs me more using concession fares to travel on Public transport for a year than I spent to buy the Katana and get it on the road.

They can get fucked.

PirateJafa

30th November 2007, 22:17

What's the problem?

Get some hi-viz vests, orange cones and yellow paint. Apply a little bit of elbow grease and soon you'll have bike parks in handy little places all over town. ;)

Drum

30th November 2007, 22:46

.....They can get fucked.

...Amen...

pzkpfw

1st December 2007, 08:51

I always wondered what "holy fuck" meant...

zukifan101

4th December 2007, 17:17

hey my names david i just registed on "kiwibiker" and im geting realy pissed off about leaving my bike out of the way on the footpath as to make room for cars and geting ticketed for it iv racked up 80 bucks worth of fines and im realy sick of it iv talked to parking nazis and theyv told me to park on the footpath what can we do about it this bikers in wellington cant just stand back and let this keep going on how can bikers live in a city with cars if they cant park on the footpath its impossible.im going to court over my fines and im trying bloody hard to get off them.

Hawkeye

4th December 2007, 17:28

Drum

4th December 2007, 20:33

Gidday Zukifan, and welcome to the site.

Yep, it sucks that they are clamping down on us for parking on the footpath. From our perspective there aren't enough bike parks. From the Council's perspective there are plenty bike parks, and the footpath is for pedestrians.

There doesn't seem to have been enough outrage from ticketed bikers to make the effort of protesting. God knows the car driving and footpath using public won't be on our side.

By the way, nice of you to make a donation. I've also been forced to make a contribution.

Fatjim

4th December 2007, 21:37

Drogen Omen

5th December 2007, 06:20

Public transport..... fuck thats a Joke.

I caught the train from welling to Silverstream on Monday and it cost me $6 one way... I go through $10 a week of 95 octane on my GN250... so as far as I'm concerned public transport is a rip off and it takes to long, took 50 mins by train to Silverstream, takes me 30 mins in bumper'2'bumper traffic jams... I'm sure a scooter would be faster from Upper Hutt to wellington than public transport...

Oh...!!! forgot to say public transport is unreliable.
I have waited for buses that have never turned up... and trains that were late...

I remember a couple years back when the council suggested putting GPS units in the buses and trains and so they could track were they were and if they were running on time and put display systems at the stops so you could see how far away they were... and the bus drivers kicked up a big stink about it cause then they wouldn't be able to slack off...

Motorcycling dangerous...??? its not that bad its just those idiots that think they can ride and ruin it for the rest of us... Just like fucking boy racers and their small dicks...

How many pedestrians have been hit buy buses in the last year... wasn't there a group of school kids that got run over by a bus in Auckland a while back, and they were on the footpath weren't they...! maybe the council should have told the bus driver that its illegal to park his bus on the foot path...

How many times has your car been hit buy a bus driver who doesn't know the size of his bus and thinks you'll move out of the way for him cause he's bigger...

Council's all over can kiss my HAIRY PASTY WHITE ASS if they think i'm gona trade my putter for public transport...

davereid

5th December 2007, 08:10

Public transport..... fuck thats a Joke.

Public Transport :
An expensive and fuel inefficient way, of going slowly, from not quite where you are, to not quite where you want to be, at a time that doesn't suit, in the company of people you may find offensive.

Max Preload

5th December 2007, 08:13

...the council suggested putting GPS units in the buses and trains and so they could track were they were and if they were running on time and put display systems at the stops so you could see how far away they were...

They do the GPS thing here in Auckland on major routes. Doesn't make the buses any bettter though - you just know a little in advance how late you're going to be.

ThumperNut

5th December 2007, 20:27

magicfairy

6th December 2007, 06:01

Aerox50

6th December 2007, 06:29

Just caught something on the radio, apparently parking wardens have been told to "exercise discretion" ticketing bikes on the footpaths, as they have been "over zealous in enforcing the clear footpath regulations" .
As long as they are not blocking the footpath.
The council "recognises they are an increasingly popular form of transport"
So all those letters, emails, phone calls must have done something.

I heard this too, looks like all the effort from bikies and scooterists have gotten the point across :clap:

Sanx

6th December 2007, 08:52

90s

6th December 2007, 09:44

I'm pleased to say my ticket has been canceled. :2thumbsup I wrote a letter basically explaining that the location I was parked in was on private property (based on the councils aerial photos) and therefore, in my view, no infringement of parking policy occurred. The building I park in front of in upper Willis street has a boundary which extends 4-5 meters out. In this case, parking is a building owner matter.

Great :headbang:- and this is the best way to fight this stupid new enforcement of 'policy'. In most of these cases the parking wardens have no jurisdiction over the 'pavement' as technically it belongs to the building next to it if over (usually) 12ft from the roadside, or less in many cases. Check this and then simply say the ticket is not valid :woohoo:.

On saturday the parking wardens had parked IN the St Paul st. bikes only space. They do this all the time, and they never enforce fines for those that park in the bike space on St Pauls at weekends.
Hypocrits.

davereid

6th December 2007, 11:41

If you are sure the ticket is wrong, like you know you are parked on private land, you may be better off just writing in WITHOUT an explanation, and saying "See you in court".

When you send them an explanation, it saves them the time and money of a court case. And if they decide to continue with the ticket, you have shown your hand - they know what you are going to argue.

Dunno about bikes, but in the car its easier just to move the ticket to the nearest car of the same make and model.

Try and choose a chicks car - she will know she is in a Ford, but won't know the rego number, and she'll just pay the fine for you.

rwh

6th December 2007, 16:24

On saturday the parking wardens had parked IN the St Paul st. bikes only space. They do this all the time, and they never enforce fines for those that park in the bike space on St Pauls at weekends.
Hypocrits.

IIRC bike parks (like loading zones) don't apply out-of-hours.

Richard

90s

10th December 2007, 07:01

IIRC bike parks (like loading zones) don't apply out-of-hours.

Richard

Depending on the conditions of the parking space. The bike parks on St Pauls are designated 24/7 bike bays as I have had explained to me by a warden.
Anyone know different?

Felix

11th December 2007, 11:03

Got a ticket on my scooter for parking on the footpath last week. Now my ticket says "Motorcycle" in the vehicle class bit, since its actually a "moped" does that make my ticket null for being incorrectly filled out, or should I go down the "was on the very road-side edge of the footpath, between a parking sign-post and the kerb, and was definitely not blocking anyones way" path?

Drum

11th December 2007, 12:01

Hey Felix, put both facts in the explanation letter. I.e. It is a scooter not a motorcycle and it was also well out of the way. A photo seems to help too.

Hawkeye

11th December 2007, 14:12

For 2 days in a row now, a red CBR1000 has had a ticket on it in Grey St (next to ANZ). It is parked in the bike park and has an up-to-date rego. :confused:
I've been trying to find out who the plonker is that's putting the ticket on it to find out the actual reason.
I could of course just look at the ticket but that means intefering with someone elses bike which is not a happening thing.
So! If the said owner is on here, please tell. Im intrigued!

Moxy

11th December 2007, 20:20

it was also well out of the way. A photo seems to help too.

Are tickets being waived for "out of the way"? I have a few photos showing my bike is on a non-walkable part of pavement (specifically, it's red brick), and well out of the way .. am going to write in in the next couple of days and am planning my letter.

Been parking in same spot for years too with no complaints. My personal case seems to me like it's an over-zealous ticket-happy worker. Got the ticket less than fifteen minutes after parking up also, didn't see him/her coming or going.

Drogen Omen

11th December 2007, 20:25

yay... we won we won...!!! :woohoo:

no more tickes on the bikes at the top end of Willis street.

councel gave notice on the radio that the parking warden was out of line and was just filling his quota... even to the extent of ticketing cars in wilsons carparking buildings...

but motorcycles on footpaths is ok now as long as they ar out of the way and are not causing andy potential danger to pedestrians.

pat on that back to all you wellingtonian bikers... i didnt expect this to get sorted out this quick.

ride safe gang.

Trudes

11th December 2007, 20:28

Moxy

11th December 2007, 20:37

Great news!!! I took the cage to town today out of fear of not being any room in a bike park, having to park on a footpath or anywhere near a footpath, and getting a ticket for my efforts, so it's good to hear we are safe again!!

I took mine in today for graduation... spent about twenty five minutes riding around looking for a space (and staring longingly at the out-of-the-way "footpath" spaces I could have parked) and finally found a dodgy corner of a motorcycle park - was worried that bike would get hit by a bus or whatever.

Is there some official statement on council website somewhere? I've been unable to find it.

Also, I'm guessing writing in will simply waive any outstanding "footpath" tickets?

James Deuce

11th December 2007, 20:54

Great news!!! I took the cage to town today out of fear of not being any room in a bike park, having to park on a footpath or anywhere near a footpath, and getting a ticket for my efforts, so it's good to hear we are safe again!!

It's a long way from anywhere (except Fidel's and Real Groovy) but there's ALWAYS a park for you guys in the Jim2 memorial bike park on Abel Smith St. Even Steam. Even if I have to park on the footpath.

Wally Simmonds

11th December 2007, 22:18

I usually get the last park in that place. Lucky my bike is nice and skinny :P

PuppetMaster

12th December 2007, 09:13

I propose we make that a "Suzuki Only" park.

duckonin

12th December 2007, 09:36

You carn't park your bike on the footpath, but it is legal to have patrons at tables... sprawed all over the pavement having cups of coffee or jugs of beer eating junk food blocking the flow of pedestrians..Nothing worse than coming back to your bike after it has been hit by a wanker,:angry2: park your bike where you know it is safe and if that means the footpath park the buggar there, as long as it does not disturb the flow...
If you get a ticket go to court if you get a fine be like the rest don't pay it.:clap:
Be safe think safe..

Given time the powers of being may come up with a fucken good idea that all wankers are vapourised as soon as the exhibit tendencies of power and compulsion....:clap:

Swoop

12th December 2007, 14:48

What's the problem?

Get some hi-viz vests, orange cones and yellow paint. Apply a little bit of elbow grease and soon you'll have bike parks in handy little places all over town. ;)
Beating them at their own game... I like this option!

For 2 days in a row now, a red CBR1000 has had a ticket on it in Grey St (next to ANZ). It is parked in the bike park and has an up-to-date rego. :confused:
Hopefully the owner has used the same ticket on the bike... If you get a ticket one day, save it for the next day so the praking nazi thinks that the bike has already been taxed.

councel gave notice on the radio that the parking warden was out of line and was just filling his quota... even to the extent of ticketing cars in wilsons carparking buildings...
Geeze! This really is proving the point that parking nazis' are lacking in the intelligence-gene department...

Clivoris

19th December 2007, 17:56

:wari:Just received a very understanding letter cancelling a fine from parking on the path in Shell lane (off the terrace). They were however very clear that I could not expect the same discretion in the future.:2thumbsup

Velox

21st December 2007, 00:38

This is ridiculous!!! I got one too on the bike park outside the Occidental. There is a purpose to that by-law/regs, and ticketing bikes that aren't blocking the footpath is clearly missing the purpose! ....Calm calm calm...

I sent my ticket back with a letter pointing out that I was not in the way at all and that they should have a bit more discretion.

Btw, I don't think the "where else can we park if we can't park in metered parks either" argument works because cars don't expect to be able to find a park in town either. It's just first in first served.

Drum

21st December 2007, 09:01

I've got another letter going in today. If I get off this one it will be 3 and 0.

Fatjim

21st December 2007, 09:32

but motorcycles on footpaths is ok now as long as they ar out of the way and are not causing andy potential danger to pedestrians.

Is this a general thing, or just for Willis st where the footpath is wide and possibly not council property.

Insanity_rules

21st December 2007, 11:06

Well it would seem Wellington no longer allows bikes on footpaths either.

The bikes on Boulcott Street have been ticketed, with the meter guy saying they are going to ticket bikes on the footpath from now on.

Are we ready to make a stand????????

I just got ticketed outside ANZ on Grey St! I vote we stick it up the council BIG time. Who's with me?

I was parked hard up behind the bike park, not in the way of pedestrians or anything. Whats the best protest we can come up with?

Insanity_rules

21st December 2007, 11:18

Hawkeye

21st December 2007, 12:04

At least 5 bikes had tickets on Grey St. (ANZ) today.
Typical council tactics. Verbally tell you it's ok (nothing in writing), leave it a few days and hey presto - more generated revenue.

Velox

24th December 2007, 01:39

I got "let off" my ticket which was generous :sick:

I asked a warden if they had been specifically told to target bikes on footpaths and he said yep and that the orders were from the City Council. Bloody Kerry! This follows her trying to charge bikes for parking in bike parks. The woman doesn't seem to comprehend that bikes create less concestion and demand for car parks which is a huge prob for Wellington.

Nasty

24th December 2007, 07:07

Unless it is in writing you can't park on the paths and not expect a ticket .... someone saying something will not stand up at all.

Drogen Omen

24th December 2007, 07:36

I guess if this keeps up then we should probably do something about it.

I vote for the 1 bike per carpark and see what happens.

Aslong as we pay and display i dont think we should get in too much trouble.

so shall we all set a date for a mass protest???

James Deuce

24th December 2007, 07:48

You're not allowed to pay & display. Motorcycles aren't allowed to use Pay & Display parks or multi park meters. Do NOT listen to Parkwise staff who tell you it is OK, it is expressly forbidden by council bylaw and is you get ticketed it will be a valid ticket.

rwh

24th December 2007, 10:56

Hmm. How about doing it in our cages (for those of us who have them) instead?

Stick a large sign in the back window or something, to the effect of "There isn't enough space to park my motorbike, and I can't park it here, so I brought my car and took up 6 times the space instead"

The wording needs improvement; it needs to let people see the point rather than just making them annoyed at us, which I think the above might.

Richard

Kennif

31st December 2007, 13:24

rwh

31st December 2007, 13:34

http://wellington.govt.nz/plans/bylaws/part18.html

18.6.5 No person shall park a motorcycle in any parking meter area controlled by a multiple parking meter, other than in any part specifically set aside for motorcycles.

and up the top (under 18.1.1):

Multiple Parking Meter means a parking meter which functions in respect of more than one parking space and includes pay and display parking meters.

Richard

Kennif

31st December 2007, 13:38

OK - I found it - thanks.
Isn't our mayor married to some old-fart bikie?

sAsLEX

31st December 2007, 14:00

No it isn't. Bikes aren't allowed to use pay and display parks in Wellington.

I don't know about you, but any time an authority figure has said something in contravention of one of their own rules it's ended in tears.

Bikes are allowed to use buslanes unless "Specifically Excluded" or we don't feel like it.....

They can get fucked.

On saturday the parking wardens had parked IN the St Paul st. bikes only space. They do this all the time, and they never enforce fines for those that park in the bike space on St Pauls at weekends.
Hypocrits.

Welcome to NZ land of the one rule for all, and rules that don't apply to specific sections of society.....

You're not allowed to pay & display. Motorcycles aren't allowed to use Pay & Display parks or multi park meters. Do NOT listen to Parkwise staff who tell you it is OK, it is expressly forbidden by council bylaw and is you get ticketed it will be a valid ticket.

Hang on. If you argued in court that the Councils Representative, in this case the parking "experts" Parkwise, advised you that you could park there, and the fact that 15.6.5 or what ever is not clearly visible at the pay and display meter. You could get off the fine, as you have endeavoured to obey the "expert" and the law through conscientious effort of listening to them and reading all the easily accessible public information?

James Deuce

31st December 2007, 14:12

Hang on. If you argued in court that the Councils Representative, in this case the parking "experts" Parkwise, advised you that you could park there, and the fact that 15.6.5 or what ever is not clearly visible at the pay and display meter. You could get off the fine, as you have endeavoured to obey the "expert" and the law through conscientious effort of listening to them and reading all the easily accessible public information?

Ignorance of the law isn't an excuse.

sAsLEX

31st December 2007, 15:07

Ignorance of the law isn't an excuse.

But following the advice of the Subject Matter Expert, who in this case is wrong, is a valid defence I have used to get off similar tickets in the past. How are we, the simple public, meant to question these fine upstanding members of society charged with keeping our parking spaces safe and free from malignerant loiterers?

James Deuce

31st December 2007, 15:14

Parkwise aren't the legislative body making the law, they are enforcing it on behalf of WCC. Parkwise don't take you to court, WCC does. It isn't a defense. One person may get off it once using your argument, but the case law created won't be in our favour in future.

Kennif

31st December 2007, 16:23

So - in Wellington, motorcycles are allowed to park in spaces with parking meters (so long as the motorcycle is not left leaning against the meter apparently.) But they aren't allowed to park in Pay & Display. Can someone help me with the logic here? Is it to do with how you might go about displaying the coupon? Or what....?
:mad:

James Deuce

31st December 2007, 16:55

You can park a motorcycle in a park that uses a single parking meter. You're not allowed to park on the footpath. Period. They're just letting us get away with it. The only time you can park on the footpath is if it falls within the boundary of a building and the building owner is happy for you to park there.

You can't use a pay and display park as Wilson's Parking don't allow motorcycles. They are private car park facilities, so they can make any rules they want.

You can't use a parking space governed by a multi-bay parking meter. Motorcycles are specifically excluded by Council bylaw. No doubt there is a reason but the bylaw doesn't mention it.

SteveNZ

31st December 2007, 17:45

Guess the council just doesn't like motorised things being parked around the place, as apparently cyclists can chain up their red-light running, traffic-splitting, vehicle-cutting-off bikes wherever they please. Last I checked they didn't need warrants, regos or even licenses, which is good as most of them would probably fail.

Same case as with their new sandwich board laws, one law for them, another (or several others) for everyone else. Possibly largely sour grapes due to their attempting to charge motorbike parking fees being turned down.

That said, the amount of bikes at the corner by the top of plimmers steps on Boulcott street was getting a little out of hand.

Maybe if they actually subsidised the bus companies a bit so they could actually service the horrible things properly to the point where they weren't so awful to use as transport.

Hippies don't like motorbikes, and unfortunately our council is run by them. Blame the fools that voted for them.

Chill

31st December 2007, 18:06

Good old 'Absolutely Positively Wellington sent me this jolly last-day-of-the-year letter:

THE INFORMANT SHOWN ABOVE ALLEGES THAT YOU COMMITTED AN INFRINGEMENT OFFENCE.

Reminder Notice in Respect of Infrigement Offence

Section 21(2) and (3C) (b) SUMMARY PROCEEDINGS ACT 1957

On Tuesday, 20 Nov 2007 at 12:21PM at LAMBTON on GREY STREET, OS ANZ.
In that you being a person in charge of motor vehicle 39WZN did cause it or allow it to be parked on a footpath.

This is an offence against Rule 6.14(1) of the Land Transport (Road User) Rule 2004.

Being a stationary vehicle offence.

The penalty for the offence is: $40

********************

Wasn't in the way of anyone or anything, it was just behind a bloody bench.

HDTboy

31st December 2007, 18:08

Fuck Wellington! It's full of fag parking wardens! Fuckem all!

James Deuce

31st December 2007, 18:09

Eh? We actually get looked after rather well. I have no issue with Wellington City Council providing free parking for me. I do have an issue with motorcyclists who constantly grump that "not enough is being done!"

Enough what?

What is it you want done?

More parks?

Ask nicely, provide a decent case, and you too could have your own memorial bike park, just like I do.

Drogen Omen

8th January 2008, 16:53

rwh

8th January 2008, 17:50

next thing we need to do is get the bike park at top end of willis street by the G4M shop (just up from the manners street lights) to be extended to allow at least another 10 bikes to park there.

Dunno about 10, but there are some ridiculously small carparks there that might as well be turned into bike parks - so often there's a car parked with its back end hanging over the bike park, and its front over the vehicle entrance. You could maybe fit a Golf there, but not much bigger. Certainly not the Ram that often parks in the vicinity ...

I usually get to park my bike in the office building carpark opposite, but otherwise I end up heading down to Mercer St to get a park.

Richard

Bullitt

8th January 2008, 18:12

you too could have your own memorial bike park, just like I do.
In order to have a memorial anything dont you have to be dead:whistle:

And you wernt even using it today...

Steam

8th January 2008, 18:17

James Deuce

8th January 2008, 19:08

In order to have a memorial anything dont you have to be dead:whistle:

And you wernt even using it today...

That's because there were road works vehicles parked in the bike park when I got to work.

James Deuce

8th January 2008, 19:10

Yes I reckon it's for dead people. Not the bike park, the word "Memorial".
When he announced his victory in getting a bike park there I saw the thread and thought "Hey Jim2 is dead!"
Perhaps he is anticipating his death, setting it up so we remember him when he's gone.
It could be called a "monument", but it's a bit flat for that.

Nothing so morbid.

I organised the park, and 3 weeks later they moved my group to Jervois Quay and et al labeled it the Jim2 Memorial Bike Park.

Now I am back at Abel Smith St, I get to use my own Memorial Park.

Weaver

8th January 2008, 19:17

That's because there were road works vehicles parked in the bike park when I got to work.

You should have gotten the parking warden to ticket them, provided you could resist stabbing him while he did it

James Deuce

8th January 2008, 19:58

I like the parking wardens. They get cars towed out of the Jim2 Memorial Carpark.

One more car towed and I'm an Ace.

pzkpfw

8th January 2008, 20:15

I like the parking wardens. They get cars towed out of the Jim2 Memorial Carpark.

One more car towed and I'm an Ace.

Does crazefox do "flags"?

mowgli

9th January 2008, 12:28

wooohooo i got off my ticket cause the park i use is private property and parkwise /city council has no power... hahahahahaha

councel said "the warden was in the fault this time and should have checked the arial photo's"

next thing we need to do is get the bike park at top end of willis street by the G4M shop (just up from the manners street lights) to be extended to allow at least another 10 bikes to park there.

Congrats on losing the ticket :2thumbsup

Can you describe in more detail where the bike park you mentioned is? G4M is 124 Willis which is on the corner with Boulcott St opposite Manners St. I'd like to add it to this thread. (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?p=1368509)

Cheers, Rob

Drogen Omen

25th January 2008, 05:13

Where i park my bike is up by the Athena college next to the church on the corner.

The bike park that needs extending to allow for more bikes is the one infront of that restaurant just up about 20 meters or so from the G4M shop.

twotyred

25th January 2008, 05:45

next thing we need to do is get the bike park at top end of willis street by the G4M shop (just up from the manners street lights) to be extended to allow at least another 10 bikes to park there.

I,ve often thought the same thing,they squeezed two car parks in next to it,one of which is rediculously short... should just extend the bike park up to the next driveway for sure

Drum

25th January 2008, 07:28

Well they refused to let me off the last ticket for parking on the footpath. Apparently my bike is so heavy it will damage the services below. Yeah right.

Dodger

25th January 2008, 10:41

Well they refused to let me off the last ticket for parking on the footpath. Apparently my bike is so heavy it will damage the services below. Yeah right.

Hmmm. My Side stand has left a nice indent where I park. on the plus side I can always park in the same location :)

As for damaging the services, Sounds like crap if you ask me.

James Deuce

6th February 2008, 08:29

http://www.stuff.co.nz/4388957a11.html

Public admission that there aren't enough bike parks.

Whatever next!

Kendog

6th February 2008, 09:22

http://www.stuff.co.nz/4388957a11.html

Public admission that there aren't enough bike parks.

Whatever next!

"Since early December, however, wardens had been told to issue tickets only if they found a scooter obstructing pedestrian access or creating a safety hazard."

Does that actually mean we can park on the footpath again, if out of the way?
But only scooters??

Interesting

Nasty

6th February 2008, 12:44

"Since early December, however, wardens had been told to issue tickets only if they found a scooter obstructing pedestrian access or creating a safety hazard."

Does that actually mean we can park on the footpath again, if out of the way?
But only scooters??

Interesting

I wouldn't .. I don't some warden giving me a ticket at their descretion ....

mowgli

8th February 2008, 08:35

I wouldn't mind so long as there was some way you could tell that they'd exercised their discretion. If I came back to my bike and found a cautionary sticker telling me I was pushing it with my choice of parking slot then I'd be more considerate next time. If I find nothing then how am I to know how close I came to a ticket and why would I do any different next time? Perhaps we should suggest this to Parkwise.

Clockwork

8th February 2008, 15:01

http://www.stuff.co.nz/4388957a11.html

Public admission that there aren't enough bike parks.

Whatever next!

Yeah but they must have known that there wern't enough bike parks when all the bike partks were full and people were having to park on the footpath, it's not as if the bike parks were all empty!!

Also, the line... "The city has 3200 on-street car parks and 340 two-wheeled vehicle parks - about one motorbike park for every 10 car parks." seems a bit disingenuous, I suspect this figure includes the coupon parking area where as far as I know there are no bike parks rather than just the CBD parking? (regardless, bikers arn't going to want to stroll into the city from the inner suburbs in their riding gear et al). but then of course, CBD street parking for cars is short term whereas bike parks are frequently occupied all day. Also, while there may be plenty of off road parking for cars (for a price) there is precious little for bikes.

Quite simply, they plainly didn't give these matters any thought at all when they decided to start acting this way, I wonder if they were distracted by all those dollar signs dancing in front of their eyes!!

Chad

12th February 2008, 21:40

My dad recently got a ticket on a footpath near his work on Willis street, and bein a bike he was pretty annoyed. Rides his bike to save petrol, emmisions and parking, and still gets a ticket. But he had a feeling that the footpath where he was parked was actually owned by the building it ran in front of, there for meaning the council had no durisdiction or right to give tickets. He wrote to a number of people at the council and just about everybody started avoiding and dodging him, and it was pretty obvious they had screwed up and weren't willing to admit it. In due course the ticket got cancelled.

Not sayin I recommend parking on footpaths to see if you can get away with it, but if you do get a ticket, could be worth looking into who's property you are actually parked on. I know for example that at the cafe I work at, we own the footpath infront of the front windows as far out as the building support columns protrude, if that makes sense. Its only half a meter or so, but it just shows, and many places could own a lot more...

marsha

15th February 2008, 22:39

My understanding is that WCC contracts Parkwise to do that job. That way they don't get their hands dirty. But WCC still make the rules. I got ticketed for parking on footpath - i left heaps of room a buggy or wheelchair could get past. I've taken a photo of my scooter parked there and will try to get the ticket revoked. I won't feel I've done enough if I don't make a statement against it. Certaily sounds like revenue generating. Grrr

Nasty

16th February 2008, 06:14

Dakar

1st September 2009, 21:54

Did anyone go to the Ride to Work day last March? Wellington City deputy mayor, Ian McKinnon, said that at peak times there were around 600 motorcycle and scooter commuters coming into the city every hour. “This represents a 40 per cent increase in just one year. Adequate parking for this special group is high on our planning agenda,”

Excuse me?.......little did we know that "high on his planning" was to gain further revenue from commuters,

This stinks, our local authority is nothing more than highwaymen,

MTA Spokesman Andy Cuming spoke of the benefits of biking to work and said, “There has been an enormous growth in the popularity of this form of transport, and this has a number of far-reaching implications in terms of fuel savings, emissions reduction, and traffic planning.”

Well well well, i feel a letter to Mr (if you can call him that) McKinnon coming on,
Pricks....:angry:

Lurch

1st September 2009, 22:01

woah major post necro, new discussion thisaway http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=106738

akshay argade

22nd March 2010, 14:59

hi guys,
i am in auckland, the other day i indicated left at an intersection , went on the footpath , rode 15 20 m to a safe place on the footpath to park my motorcycle, a cop saw this and fined me nzd 150 and gave me 25 demerits..this is rediculous. i told him m i allowed to park my motorcycle on footpath, he said yea, i asked him how am i supposed to get my bike on footpath?
he said climb the curb. i told him thats going to damage my bike, maybe id fall off too..
he didnt say anything
i am not ready to pay that fine.. i have mailed police infringement wellington abt this..
this is crazy..
all i did was took my bike on footpath , rode 15 m to park it safe and i get these fines..?
it was on queens street next to borders...has anyone experienced this/

Ixion

22nd March 2010, 16:42

Riding on footpath does not have demerits.

here, for reference is the list of all demerit offences ranked by ascending ouchiness

10 demerits
Person produces logbook with 1–5 omissions
Drive in emergency stopping lane

20 demerits
Person produces logbook with 6–10 omissions
Fail to drive as near as practicable to the left of the roadway
Fail to allow impeded traffic to pass
Passing at school crossing point or pedestrian crossing
Fail to comply with handheld stop sign
Fail to comply with school patrol sign
Driver fails to stop at stop sign
Driver fails to give way at stop sign
Driver fails to give way at give-way sign
Driver of vehicle changing lanes or turning fails to give way to vehicle not changing lanes or turning
Driver of left-turning vehicle fails to give way to an approaching right-turning vehicle
Driver at intersection fails to give-way to vehicle approaching from right
Driver fails to give way to road user on footpath when entering/exiting driveway
Driver entering roundabout fails to give way
Exceed speed for stopping distance
Exceed speed for stopping distance on road not marked in lanes
Drive too close to vehicle in front
Driver permits riding dangerously
Driver uses mobile phone while driving a vehicle
Driver fails to give way to rail vehicle approaching level crossing
Drive etc, cycle, vehicle, or animal across level crossing when risk of collision with rail vehicle
Fail to comply with stop sign at level crossing
Fail to remain stationary at stop sign until level crossing clear
Driver enters controlled area of level crossing when red signal displayed
Driver enters controlled area of level crossing when barrier arm lowered

25 demerits
Drives a motor vehicle contrary to the conditions of his or her driver licence
Failure to display L plate as required
Use of unauthorised, deceptive, or obscured plates
Driver fails to give way at give-way sign controlling a one-way section of road
Operate vehicle that creates excessive noise
Create excessive noise within or on vehicle
Drive or ride all terrain vehicle, motorcycle, or moped without securely fastened approved helmet
Drive or ride all terrain vehicle, motorcycle, or moped with damaged, etc, safety helmet
Failure to operate a motor vehicle with an exhaust system that complies with relevant noise output standards

30 Demerits
Person produces logbook with 11 or more omissions

35 demerits
Careless or inconsiderate use of motor vehicle
Failure to stop on request or signal of an enforcement officer, or on being followed by motor vehicle displaying flashing blue, or blue and red, lights or sounding a siren
Failure to remain stopped for an enforcement officer,
Driving or attempting to drive when forbidden by an enforcement officer
Person fails to produce logbook
Drives motor vehicle contrary to the conditions of his or her driver licence
Unsafe passing
Impeding vehicle when passing
Passing to right of no-passing line
Driver fails to give way at pedestrian crossing
Driver enters pedestrian crossing when passage blocked
Driver of vehicle fails to give way to pedestrian on shared zone
Requirement to produce approved alternative record to an enforcement officer on demand
Vehicle recovery service vehicles (requirement to complete and retain tow authorities)
Requirement on driver or contractor working within an alternative fatigue management scheme to keep records

50 demerits
Person younger than 20 driving or attempting to drive with excessive breath-alcohol
Failure or refusal—
(a) to wait for the result of a breath screening test or an evidential breath test
(b) to accompany an enforcement officer when so required
to remain for evidential breath test or blood test

And speeding :
speed limit fixed is exceeded by not more than 10 km/h 10
speed limit fixed is exceeded by more than 10 km/h but not more than 20 km/h 20
speed limit fixed is exceeded by more than 20 km/h but not more than 30 km/h 35
speed limit fixed is exceeded by more than 30 km/h but not more than 35 km/h 40
speed limit fixed is exceeded by more than 35 km/h 50

es, there are a lot of them. I've simplified the descvrriptions a bit.

Drives vehicle on footpath is just $150 fine. I park by Borders often. Never had a problem.

breakaway

24th March 2010, 15:51