drifting question

[TwoSeven]

Ok, just having a conversation with someone who is a MXr about drifting (front and rear). I can kind of do it to the rear on the 250 - but its more uncontrolled due to cold tires rather than on the 600 where it was technique.

Anyone out there have a handle on a good way to get more control

Having never ridden speedway I'm not sure how they do it, but it seems to be a mix of lean angle and throttle control.

[Blakamin]

Ok, just having a conversation with someone who is a MXr about drifting (front and rear). I can kind of do it to the rear on the 250 - but its more uncontrolled due to cold tires rather than on the 600 where it was technique.

Anyone out there have a handle on a good way to get more control

Having never ridden speedway I'm not sure how they do it, but it seems to be a mix of lean angle and throttle control.
Gary McCoy reckons its flat out on the throttle and then roll off to get the traction back.... wouldnt believe him tho... he's an Aussie with heaps of pins in his body :first:

[vifferman]

'Drifting' is for wankers. Motorcyclists slide, not drift their bikes. And it tends to be the rear, rather than the front, as it's very easy to progress into a lowside when the front has exceeded the limits of traction...

You may also call it 'flat-track', although that's a bit Murkn.
On the WSB / MotoGP bikes, a lot of it's down to power, so it's a controlled power-slide. The guys that have come from 'flat-tracking' or other dirt-bike riding, or who have ridden supermotards tend to do it more often, as it's de rigeur for those sports. Interestingly, Colin Edwards said that riding supermotards mid-season completely stuffed up his MotoGP riding, as the two styles were so different, from a weight-distribution point of view.

[Paul in NZ]

Look, at risk of being an even bigger arsehole than I am already... AND Freely admitting I'm an unfashionable old wanker that rides a funny old motorbike with a ditchpump for an engine that does not even make enough power to overcome the bicycle wheels it is equiped with !

BUT

If you are seriously suggesting that you indulge in regular rear wheel sliding on the road on a 600 regularly, AND you want to start sliding the front as well.. I suggest several options.

1. Book a space in out patients now because you are going to need it! - Soon!

2. Please let us sponsor you into MotoGP because you make that Rossi poofta look like the semi talented simian featured missing link he really is...

3. Buy some decent tyres because yours are either stuffed or you have the pressures all wrong.

4. Fix your suspension 'cos you have confused a good wallow with a slide.

5. I've got NO idea what i'm talking about...

Mate. If you are either doing this on the street already or planning it. It take my hat of to you! You are a braver man than I!

Paul N

[Posh Tourer :P]

Tiggerz, buy a bike with touring tyres.... then you can get movement easier.... I've had some beautiful slow 2 wheel drifts (used in a sense of a slow slide) on the beemer on a dry road, but I wouldnt like to get into a slide... Rear is ok sometimes, but front on the road, no way :shit:...

Get a dirt bike and ride dirt/gravel to get that "control"..... That way you dont need to buy a space at the local A and E/outpatients ward, just take some arnica and band-aids...

[enigma51]

Just buy a pair of dunlop 207's and you will be sliding drifting what ever you want to call it very soon.

[Blakamin]

3. Buy some decent tyres because yours are either stuffed or you have the pressures all wrong.

Paul N
And here I was about to suggest cheaper ones!....
Try and get some tyre that has been sitting in the sun for 40 years.. shame shiko wasnt around waaay back then... they would be like steel now, and we all know how steel on ashphalt likes to grip!

which brings me to the other way... get up heaps of speed and lowside.... bike will drift for ages... (might be a bugga to turn tho)

:Pokey:

[vifferman]

All righty, then!

I'm warmed to this topic now. From personal experience, I *know* how to get this drifting/clowning/sliding/mentalling going.

Get a can of spray-on engine degreaser, and some used engine oil, chainlube, or other DinosaurSpooge-BasedCrud.
If your bike wheels are clean, apply some of the aforementioned DS-BC to the rims, tyres, or whatever. If you're a GrubbyLittlePersonWithANeglectedBike, your're OK, as they'll already been liberally encrusted with DS-BC, insect guts, possum remains, cowshit and other goodies.
Liberally spray the rims, tyres, your underarms, the seat cover, the cat, the neighbour's kids, and anything else that gets in the way, with the engine degreaser.
Go and have a beer. And some mind-altering drugs. And some pain-killers for the fun ahead...
Hose the rims, the tyres, your head, the seat cover, the cat, the neighbour's kids, your head, the road, the guy passing in the street. But not too much. Water is very dangerous, you know.
Get your motor running, head out on the highway, looking for adventure, and whatever comes my way....
Repeat steps 1 through 6, until you've mastered two wheel drifts/slides/stunt-o-rama, or you're hospitalised, locked up, or a gibbering wreck. Or your bike's a smouldering mouldering wreck.
Or summat.
Or not.
Report back to us.
Now I know this method is guaranteed to induce slides of the exciting, insane, anus-clenching, knuckle-whitening variety, as I've tried it myself. Most exciting, it were. :eek:

[SPORK]

:shit:

And I thought you were a responsible, caring, person FS! Spraying the cat, unforgivable! How dare you be so cruel to those that love you. I think I will go to the SPCA in my spare lunch break to buy some cats to chuck at you, crazy cat lady style.

How can you sleep at night?!

[vifferman]

:shit:

And I thought you were a responsible, caring, person FS! Spraying the cat, unforgivable! How dare you be so cruel to those that love you. I think I will go to the SPCA in my spare lunch break to buy some cats to chuck at you, crazy cat lady style.

How can you sleep at night?!Cats don't love anyone. At best, it's Cupboard Love. And they're quite prepared to Bite The Hand What Feeds Em.
CatsREvil.

Hate cats.
CatsREvil.

If a frog had side pockets, he'd carry a handgun.

[Paul in NZ]

:shit:

I think I will go to the SPCA in my spare lunch break to buy some cats to chuck at you, crazy cat lady style.

How can you sleep at night?!

Ah! Another Simpsons fan I see!

[rodgerd]

If you are seriously suggesting that you indulge in regular rear wheel sliding on the road on a 600 regularly, AND you want to start sliding the front as well.. I suggest several options.


And we wonder why our ACC premiums are so high...

[vifferman]

And we wonder why our ACC premiums are so high...No we don't.
We know it's because the bureaucrats have decided it's 'user pays', and they're trying to balance the expenditure for motorcycle-related ACC claims, with the premiums levied on the group who it's easiest to take it from. Regardless of fault, fairness, etc.




Was that a rhetorical question?

[Posh Tourer :P]

Water is very dangerous, you know.

Yah - correlated with almost all mass-murderers, and implicated in a large proportion of drownings...

[White trash]

Cycosis rides a road 600 faster than anyone I've ever met and I've never once heard him wanking on about drifting or even sliding for that matter.

Sure we've all had a couple of slides from time to time and by the grace of god managed to escape unscathed.

Then you feel like a bit of a hero and tell your mates how fucken cool you are at the pub later on. Everyone of them nodding in aggreement.

Back to real riding, who amongst us, on their road bike, can consistantly get through any corner they come across, meet the apex, then just think "I'll gas it up and wheelspin/slide out of this corner with a bit of opposite lock".

You can do that? At any speed/any time you feel like it? On a roadbike? You're my hero and you should be challenging our mates Stroud and Bernard.

For the record, I can "drift" my mini moto on wet grass that's been cut shorter than 1/2 inch.

[HanaBelle]

Cats don't love anyone. At best, it's Cupboard Love. And they're quite prepared to Bite The Hand What Feeds Em.
CatsREvil.

Hate cats.
CatsREvil.

If a frog had side pockets, he'd carry a handgun.

Yay!!! I hate cats tooo...cats must die...cats are cruel nasty lil beasties and destroy native birds...cats make great motorbike seat covers *squash*...(desperate to get back ontopic)..

I worship you now, Firestormer..(drool)

HanaBananas

[scroter]

Just buy a pair of dunlop 207's and you will be sliding drifting what ever you want to call it very soon.

well brian bernard told me if you want to slide push down on the inside peg if you want to avoid it push on the outside peg.to be honest though on my 600 it dosent really slide at all, so how your doin it on a 250 unless your on the grass beats me.

or you can just buy the aforementioned tyres ive got a set with only 1200ks on them if you wnat to buy them.

oh and remeber go check your insurance premium cause if you keep trying your gonna crash.

[vifferman]

Back to real riding, who amongst us, on their road bike, can consistantly get through any corner they come across, meet the apex, then just think "I'll gas it up and wheelspin/slide out of this corner with a bit of opposite lock".

You can do that? At any speed/any time you feel like it? On a roadbike? You're my hero and you should be challenging our mates Stroud and Bernard.Nup. My gonads are neither big enough, nor made of titanium.
However, I did once deliberately slide my bike on the road, when I saw the corner was a bit sandy, and I had a mate on the back. Gave him a big thrill.:eek:
What was I thinking?!? Beats me how I managed it. And feet up, too. :confused:

[Motu]

I've been sliding since I was a kid doing skids in the dirt on my pushbike.I've never been into wheelies,stoppies or jumps - being sideways in a powerslide is what gets my rocks off.After countless gravel road miles,a fair bit of off road riding and a few seasons of dirt track on a hard pack clay track I'd say I've done a bit of sliding - but am by no means an expert or a gun slider.

First off ignore the talk of slippery tyres or going out in slippery conditions,sure you'll slide,but not in a controlled way.You want some sticky tyres,racing wets or my favorite,competion trials tyres,with these you can ride in the drift zone on seal - takes some speed and aggression with the throttle.

Getting into a two wheeled drift on a flat tracker (where's that OwlMorris,he was just in here with his rebuilt SR500 street tracker) is not so much skill - but a big jump in faith....to run deep,deep into the corner under power way past the braking point and then back off and slam the bike down and have both wheels loose traction is sphincter tightening when you first do it,but fuck,what a thrill to ride it there,bucking and slipping,fighting for control over both ends of the bike,hearing your tyres howling as they slide over clay,knowing when to hit the gas and turn the two wheel drift into a powerslide out of the corner.

You will need big bars,coming back into your lap,you have to sit upright with your feet under your bum,you need your shoulders to control this bike.Yes you can do it - but expect to crash....often.

[FROSTY]

Ok, just having a conversation with someone who is a MXr about drifting (front and rear). I can kind of do it to the rear on the 250 - but its more uncontrolled due to cold tires rather than on the 600 where it was technique.

Anyone out there have a handle on a good way to get more control

Having never ridden speedway I'm not sure how they do it, but it seems to be a mix of lean angle and throttle control.
Ok dude I gotta tell you you are seriously asking for serious pain here
I used to get get a bit of drift out of the rose gardens at whanganui on my 250 proddy bike but it always scared the shit outa me
That said if you are serious the best way to learn is buy a lil 4 stroke trailie.
Buy a spare set of rims and fit slicks or just nearly bald road tyres to em.
Fit a slick to the back and hey presto the back will slide/drift. --swap over and the front will drift. its all at slow speeds so it shouldn't hurt

[TwoSeven]

Well after reading all the replies I must say the quality of ignorance is pretty high - well done to those that managed to demonstrate superior ego's and totally not answer my question. Pretty much a wast of time and space really :)

I do appreciate the 'i cant do it therefore you cant do it' attitude from some people - I suspect they are obviously very successfull in life.

Out of interest I grew up racin road bikes on wet grass with my mates - so not afraid of moving a bike around. Havnt binned a bike in over a decade apart from parking on some long grass that turned out to be a ditch and removing the paddock stand without putting the side stand down and ye olde disc lock issue. So you can assume that I have a fair idea on how to ride safely.

I asked a simple question and expected a simple answer - not a demonstration of total wankerdom that some people managed to demonstrate.

Thanks to those people who did manage to reply properly - i have some ideas to work with :)

[White trash]

Well after reading all the replies I must say the quality of ignorance is pretty high - well done to those that managed to demonstrate superior ego's and totally not answer my question. Pretty much a wast of time and space really :)

I do appreciate the 'i cant do it therefore you cant do it' attitude from some people - I suspect they are obviously very successfull in life.

Out of interest I grew up racin road bikes on wet grass with my mates - so not afraid of moving a bike around. Havnt binned a bike in over a decade apart from parking on some long grass that turned out to be a ditch and removing the paddock stand without putting the side stand down and ye olde disc lock issue. So you can assume that I have a fair idea on how to ride safely.

I asked a simple question and expected a simple answer - not a demonstration of total wankerdom that some people managed to demonstrate.

Thanks to those people who did manage to reply properly - i have some ideas to work with :)

Coulda' been read alot of ways actually. Not quite as simple a question as you think.

I've had neumerous bins over the last decade. Allways doing things I thought I could handle easily. Just pointing out the obvious perhaps.

Anyhoo, I'mm off to go for a ride with my "wankerish" friends on some very "wanky" bikes in a mass demonstration of "wankerdom".

Maybe we'll see you there.

[Blakamin]

Anyhoo, I'mm off to go for a ride with my "wankerish" friends on some very "wanky" bikes in a mass demonstration of "wankerdom".

Maybe we'll see you there.
:killingme :killingme :killingme :killingme

I think some southerners dont have a sense of humour :gob: :(

[James Deuce]

Well after reading all the replies I must say the quality of ignorance is pretty high - well done to those that managed to demonstrate superior ego's and totally not answer my question. Pretty much a wast of time and space really :)

I do appreciate the 'i cant do it therefore you cant do it' attitude from some people - I suspect they are obviously very successfull in life.

Out of interest I grew up racin road bikes on wet grass with my mates - so not afraid of moving a bike around. Havnt binned a bike in over a decade apart from parking on some long grass that turned out to be a ditch and removing the paddock stand without putting the side stand down and ye olde disc lock issue. So you can assume that I have a fair idea on how to ride safely.

I asked a simple question and expected a simple answer - not a demonstration of total wankerdom that some people managed to demonstrate.

Thanks to those people who did manage to reply properly - i have some ideas to work with :)

I wouldn't call it ignorance, I'd call it concern. You should actually be touched that people give a shit, despite your, "you all suck and can't ride" attitude. Bear in mind that if it goes wrong on a public road you add to the argument that all motorcyclist should be paying higher insurance premiums and larger ACC levies. I hope some fireman doesn't have scrape your body parts off an immovable object.

Just let us know which ward to send the Rose's chocolates to.

[2_SL0]

Ive done many a powerslide on the dirt/gravel. But on tarseal I can only see pain. You will do it, just not how your expecting. I see it more like, You "drifting" (sliding is a better word) down the road on your ass. The bike drifting (again sliding is the better word) alongside you, maybe in front of you, or worse RIGHT behind you. Take it from the people here this is not something that you want to learn unless you are keen on binning. "What ever floats your boat" :spudbooge

[TwoSeven]

I didnt read the earlier posts the way some people intended them to be read. I asked a simple question and expected a simple answer. I wouldnt have minded the odd comment that I may bin it - or do it somewhere safe or along those lines. That would go along with the par when someone asks how to do something that is technically difficult. :)

Some of the earlier posts were just plane retarded and I wasnt sure if it was done by 8 year olds or someone with a self image problem. Which is what pissed me off. I do expect people to use netiquette as they would good manners in real life. There is a difference between sarcasm and humour and without the use of emoticons its hard to define which is being used.

I asked a serious question and I expected a serious answer - if you dont know then say so. If you are being funny then say so - thats what emoticons are for. :drinknsin

I happen to enjoy stunting on bikes and going fast has no interest for me - I find it rather boring. I do enjoy riding in wet,snow,ice/grass/gravel and I'm not fussed with falling off. I already know how to break a tire loose and move the bike around - what I dont know how to do is make the bike move in a manner closer to what I want it too. Drifting is one of those techniques i'd like to learn in order to get closer to that mark.

For those who say - dont do it because we pay taxes for injury and all that codswollop - I suspect all the people that jump mx bikes, throw rally cars around gravel roads on the sides of cliffs, race bikes, throw themselves off of cliffs and all those other 'dangerous' sports would probably tell you to shove it in the appropriate place lacking sunlight :)

[James Deuce]

For those who say - dont do it because we pay taxes for injury and all that codswollop - I suspect all the people that jump mx bikes, throw rally cars around gravel roads on the sides of cliffs, race bikes, throw themselves off of cliffs and all those other 'dangerous' sports would probably tell you to shove it in the appropriate place lacking sunlight :)

Can you actually read, or are you too busy attaching emoticons to your puerile rubbish?

I said on the road.

If you seriously want to learn how to slide a bike, go racing, be it motorcross, motard, enduro, beach racing or whatever. Just don't practice on a public road. If you are going to level accusations and call people names have some balls and name the people that are getting on your tits.

Otherwise just go practice "drifiting" somewhere offroad and stop wasting your time making inane posts.

[sAsLEX]

throw themselves off of cliffs and all those other 'dangerous' sports

any one esle see the base jumping on three news the other night, mightly impressive and stupid at the same time

[RiderInBlack]

Good on you T. We need more Heros:not: (especially in the parade:msn-wink: ). By the way I don't want to know which ward your are in if things don't go well :doctor: (I'll just eat the box of Roses for myself). It was your choice to be there (as it will be mine if I crap off my bike):bye:

PS: If you suc-seed with your "drift" experiment, let us know how you did it so we can all give it a try:ride: :ride:

[Motu]

I hope I'm one of the sane ones who responded to your post - I've never been met with ridicule talking about sliding on the road,I just get ignored with a he's a wanker look.When getting young guys to ride on the dirt track they would come down with dirt bikes on dirt tyres and ride like they were on dirt...cause they were.But that's not the way to go fast on a flat track - I used to tell them I'm using my street skills out there,not my dirt skills....this is how I ride on the road - then I would go out on my old XS1 street bike and go around the out side of them on the corners.I first learnt to slide a bike on the seal,in the mid 70s I was using trials tyres and doing controled slides on the road...I had no idea it was not the done thing,I didn't realise until later that most people didn't ride like that.

The modern road racing style has been adapted from flattrack racing - heavy on the front on corner entry,then a controled powerslide out.Do you still have flattrack in ChCh? last time I heard they were the last ones doing it.If you can get out on a dirt track and learn to slide on hard pack clay,then you can transfer this to the seal - that's how Kenny Roberts taught the road racers in his school,do it you self.Get a bike with a more traditional set up...a classic look,this gives better weight distubution than a modern street bike or a dirt bike,put a fat front tyre on and ride till you can push the front,and I mean really push the front...use the front to turn the bike,use the front to push the rear out.I know I'm preaching to a hostile audiance,but if you want to do it you can....any wanker can do it.

[James Deuce]

I hope I'm one of the sane ones who responded to your post - I've never been met with ridicule talking about sliding on the road,I just get ignored with a he's a wanker look.When getting young guys to ride on the dirt track they would come down with dirt bikes on dirt tyres and ride like they were on dirt...cause they were.But that's not the way to go fast on a flat track - I used to tell them I'm using my street skills out there,not my dirt skills....this is how I ride on the road - then I would go out on my old XS1 street bike and go around the out side of them on the corners.I first learnt to slide a bike on the seal,in the mid 70s I was using trials tyres and doing controled slides on the road...I had no idea it was not the done thing,I didn't realise until later that most people didn't ride like that.

The modern road racing style has been adapted from flattrack racing - heavy on the front on corner entry,then a controled powerslide out.Do you still have flattrack in ChCh? last time I heard they were the last ones doing it.If you can get out on a dirt track and learn to slide on hard pack clay,then you can transfer this to the seal - that's how Kenny Roberts taught the road racers in his school,do it you self.Get a bike with a more traditional set up...a classic look,this gives better weight distubution than a modern street bike or a dirt bike,put a fat front tyre on and ride till you can push the front,and I mean really push the front...use the front to turn the bike,use the front to push the rear out.I know I'm preaching to a hostile audiance,but if you want to do it you can....any wanker can do it.


You're missing the point, or maybe just going for the troll. You're talking about racing, and he's talking about stunting on public roads. Go racing or go to a carpark, but don't go crashing into lamposts or cars trying to be cool. In fact it would be appropriate to ride like that on gravel roads. Done it myself. But not on a public sealed highway. With modern tyres, if he does get it to slide, he's just as likely to find himself shot over the highside when the tyre grips on a grippier patch of tarmac.

But of course I'm not allowed to express a sensible course of action because that makes me a wanker, or deserved of getting something shoved up my arsehole, according to your little friend who attempts to ameliorate his rudness with pictures. I'll just accept that my ACC levy has to go up every couple of years to pay for the spinal injuries.

[scumdog]

Knobby tyre in the wet + a torquey motor = good "drifts" on tar seal, or as a mate of mine once did - put really thick grease in the tyre tread!!! :doh:

[merv]

.. but these days SD you'd have to enforce the "sustained loss of traction" law eh if anyone did anything so silly or you'd just have to turn a blind eye.

[Motu]

You're missing the point, or maybe just going for the troll. You're talking about racing, and he's talking about stunting on public roads.

Bit of both - I'm trying to stir it up,make people look out of the way they ride their bike,see that others may have done or do things a bit different.I'm talking about racing yes,but also that's how I rode on the road back then - coming out of a corner with the rear wheel 6in out and the front wheel 2in off the deck was not uncommon - I was an idiot and will stand up to any crititsism without trying to justify my actions - I came off some...but I have never been to hospital with motorcycle injuries and have never written a bike off,or involved other people in any misadventures...you may say it's luck,I say you make your own luck.

Stunting for him...maybe,but not for me,I rode alone and still do,everything I do on a bike is for my own enjoyment,not to show others what an idiot I am,um,that's kinda obvious.The only reason I rode on the dirt track was because I was tricked into doing it,then discovered I wasn't embarrassed as I thought riding in front of a crowd.

Point taken about the modern tyres,that's why I think people crash around here,they have no idea what happens to a tyre on the limit - that's why I ride on tyres you'd never be seen on,I can find their limit and know exactly where I am at all times....making my own luck....

[Two Smoker]

You will only do slides on your 250 with Cold tyres..... I have slid a road bike a few times (Andrew's Ducati 400SS) but that was because it was on the edge of the tyre and it was a sport touring tyre...... That sliding was not on purpose but was controlled (dont know how)

On the 400, have only slid it with cold tyres on the road.......

On the track, all my bikes have been in slides, but only because my peg or fairing was digging too much into the track........

Plain and simply your not going to be able to do it on your bike unless you get a super motard.....

I also completely agree with WT.....

[Slipstream]

.
Then you feel like a bit of a hero and tell your mates how fucken cool you are at the pub later on. Everyone of them nodding in aggreement.



Are you sure that they aren't just nodding to the unvoiced question of you just being a wanker ;) :bleh: :eyepoke:

(2 posts to go :))

[White trash]

Are you sure that they aren't just nodding to the unvoiced question of you just being a wanker ;) :bleh: :eyepoke:



Nah. None of my mates are tuff enuff to think that and live to tell the tale.

[scumdog]

.. but these days SD you'd have to enforce the "sustained loss of traction" law eh if anyone did anything so silly or you'd just have to turn a blind eye.

Amazing the amount of "blind eye" I have had at times when wheels have been spinning!!! :pinch:

[TwoSeven]

I hope I'm one of the sane ones who responded to your post - I've never been met with ridicule talking about sliding on the road,I just get ignored with a he's a wanker look.When getting young guys to ride on the dirt track they would come down with dirt bikes on dirt tyres and ride like they were on dirt...cause they were.But that's not the way to go fast on a flat track - I used to tell them I'm using my street skills out there,not my dirt skills....this is how I ride on the road - then I would go out on my old XS1 street bike and go around the out side of them on the corners.I first learnt to slide a bike on the seal,in the mid 70s I was using trials tyres and doing controled slides on the road...I had no idea it was not the done thing,I didn't realise until later that most people didn't ride like that.

The modern road racing style has been adapted from flattrack racing - heavy on the front on corner entry,then a controled powerslide out.Do you still have flattrack in ChCh? last time I heard they were the last ones doing it.If you can get out on a dirt track and learn to slide on hard pack clay,then you can transfer this to the seal - that's how Kenny Roberts taught the road racers in his school,do it you self.Get a bike with a more traditional set up...a classic look,this gives better weight distubution than a modern street bike or a dirt bike,put a fat front tyre on and ride till you can push the front,and I mean really push the front...use the front to turn the bike,use the front to push the rear out.I know I'm preaching to a hostile audiance,but if you want to do it you can....any wanker can do it.

I think there may be a track down here - but I havn't been to investigate - although it might be worth while taking a look to see how they do things.

I used to race around a grass track on a road bike, the basic trick for the corner was to lean the bike over and open the throttle, which made the back end come round - just a matter of pointing the front wheel in the appropriate direction and keeping on the gas. The only times I ever fell off is if I shut the throttle too quick or opened it too much before the rear had come back into line - then you'd either end up butt first or eating grass depending on how it all went.

On the 250 I have a corner I like thats out of the way from everything. With the dragons on it was a matter of setting the throttle and banging the bike on its side - at a certain point round the corner the tire would slip then grip if I got the lean angle right. You could make it go a bit further if you caught it with the throttle and gave it a bit more gas, but would lose it as the bike stood up on the exit - but most often its just a slip and grip. It just plain dont have enough go juice to do more than that.

I've had mixed results on the dunlops - some mornings it will go, some it wont - I can never figure out how those things work - although I dont have the confidence in them to try it in the wet as I did with the dragons.

Not much luck with the front end on the 250 and i've tried a few different ideas - really all I can do it get it to skip in a straight line if I really wail on the brakes - with the dunlops if I turn too quick it just wants to tuck on me which is off putting at best. On my old cibby600 you could just square the corner right off and turn hard and if you got it right the front would skip a bit as it washed off the speed. But for the life of me I cant remember exactly the sequence for doing it.

I'm absolutely hopeless on a dirt bike - the few times I've tried I get a horrible feeling of no balance (no upper body balance) and being up to high - which makes me too nervous to ride the things. I did once have some moderate success on an old bombardiar - but then that was our old clunker rat bike that barely did 20mph on a good day. Will give it another shot some day I guess.

[Kwaka-Kid]

Im not sure dude - but heres my 2c...

I Thought, and still often THINK im sliding the Viffer 400 during races coming out of the hairpin @ pukekohe and previously out of castrol... However im not sure and i doubt it more and more i talk to more experienced riders... I feel the bike shake/squigle and the suspension starts bouncing like up and down on the back end, but its always exiting the corner as i gas it full and i have always tilted the bike up more upright hten the max lean my balls allow me to do. Except once, when i gassed it way too early heading into the apex of castrol and the back end swung, it was slower then i would have imagined a lowside would of been but i was still far from capable of being able to control it.
my thought process was "sweet its starting to get lower, and the back is going further away" and i didnt want to smack off the gas as people say thats how u highside, yet at hte same time i thought it would just ride out... but it just kept on falling and getting closer to the ground as the rear end swung out to overtake me... was pretty graceful i thought and we just went for a slide down the backstraight... but it made me start to think how hard that slide shit really was and that chances are what i feel exiting some corners is just some sort of suspension malfunction.

Either way as hard as it is to believe you do this on your 250 on GPR70SP's (correct?) with enough lean angle to the point that your rolling off the tyre - so minimal tyre is touching, the physics and theory is there to say its possible on ANY machine... However i reckon if youve gotten this far come join the ranks of F3 even on that machine and show us n00bs how its done. I will honestly put half your entry fee up to come do it in the hope that i can follow and possibly learn something.

[Jackrat]

I hope I'm one of the sane ones who responded to your post - I've never been met with ridicule talking about sliding on the road,I just get ignored with a he's a wanker look.When getting young guys to ride on the dirt track they would come down with dirt bikes on dirt tyres and ride like they were on dirt...cause they were.But that's not the way to go fast on a flat track - I used to tell them I'm using my street skills out there,not my dirt skills....this is how I ride on the road - then I would go out on my old XS1 street bike and go around the out side of them on the corners.I first learnt to slide a bike on the seal,in the mid 70s I was using trials tyres and doing controled slides on the road...I had no idea it was not the done thing,I didn't realise until later that most people didn't ride like that.

The modern road racing style has been adapted from flattrack racing - heavy on the front on corner entry,then a controled powerslide out.Do you still have flattrack in ChCh? last time I heard they were the last ones doing it.If you can get out on a dirt track and learn to slide on hard pack clay,then you can transfer this to the seal - that's how Kenny Roberts taught the road racers in his school,do it you self.Get a bike with a more traditional set up...a classic look,this gives better weight distubution than a modern street bike or a dirt bike,put a fat front tyre on and ride till you can push the front,and I mean really push the front...use the front to turn the bike,use the front to push the rear out.I know I'm preaching to a hostile audiance,but if you want to do it you can....any wanker can do it.

I can understand where your coming from here.I resently put dirt track bars on the XS.Instant change of balance,much more control over things like slides,far better control in gravel.I'm pretty sure it's the design of most road bikes today that gets so many in the poo when they hit gravel or slide on the road.I'd far rather have a bike I can blast through gravel on,or slide on wet or dry roads.The alternatives are not much fun.Face plant in gravel or high side on the road,no thanks been there.
This is why supermotos are becoming popular with some people,I can certainly see the appeal.Bikes like the new KTMs and a few others can two wheel drift with ease on dry roads and still be fully under control.
Like you say,(sort of)power slides are a forgotten art,on the right bike they are NOT dangerous.that's the catch,the right bike,few are made today.
IMHO

[Motu]

Oh,it occours to me you guys are still thinking in your sports bike box,that's your main problem.It's all in the tyres...

1) - Competition trials tyre,4.00x18,this is a 2 ply tyre with a very soft tread compound - they are so soft you can turn the knobs 90deg with your fingers...I ran one of these on the rear of my dirt tracker.Have also used them on the street.

2) - Speedway rear tyre,3.75x19,same compound as the trials tyre,but the knobs are a bigger area but lower height,this means they don't squirm around as much.I ran one of these on the front of my dirt tracker.Also have run this as a street tyre.

These are dirt tyres and of course they will let go earlier than even your budget sports tyre...but the compound means they will still grip,really,really well...once the slide is going you can just play in the drift zone.Of course they are illeagal and no one would ever use them on the road,oh no,never.Another reason you need an older traditional style bike,to get the rim size.

Try it before you tell me you can't slide on the road.

Just read your post Jack,you put that in as I was 2 fingering - I agree completly.

[James Deuce]

Bit of both - I'm trying to stir it up,make people look out of the way they ride their bike,see that others may have done or do things a bit different.I'm talking about racing yes,but also that's how I rode on the road back then - coming out of a corner with the rear wheel 6in out and the front wheel 2in off the deck was not uncommon - I was an idiot and will stand up to any crititsism without trying to justify my actions - I came off some...but I have never been to hospital with motorcycle injuries and have never written a bike off,or involved other people in any misadventures...you may say it's luck,I say you make your own luck.

Stunting for him...maybe,but not for me,I rode alone and still do,everything I do on a bike is for my own enjoyment,not to show others what an idiot I am,um,that's kinda obvious.The only reason I rode on the dirt track was because I was tricked into doing it,then discovered I wasn't embarrassed as I thought riding in front of a crowd.

Point taken about the modern tyres,that's why I think people crash around here,they have no idea what happens to a tyre on the limit - that's why I ride on tyres you'd never be seen on,I can find their limit and know exactly where I am at all times....making my own luck....


Fairy Nuff then.

I have hurt myself, and quite badly once. I make no apologies for anything though. Hard won advice that is spurned by those who are 10ft tall and bullet proof, when they asked for it, is faintly insulting.

You and Jack are indeed talking about different bikes and styles to a sport bike which is what Tigger is riding. The chassis flex that used help with smoothly controlling a power slide is all but absent on a sporting 250, so they have a surfeit of traction over power. Good luck to him, but if he practices this stuff on the road he will be hurt. There's too little margin for error as it is, without provoking a potential loss of control deliberately. Falling off at 40km/hr in the dirt hurts a bit, but falling off on the road at 100km/hr with other traffic around is really going to hurt.

[Motu]

Well put,I'm with you completly on this too.

[Blakamin]

Watch "Faster"...



and keep it on the track :niceone:

[TwoSeven]

Fairy Nuff then.

I have hurt myself, and quite badly once. I make no apologies for anything though. Hard won advice that is spurned by those who are 10ft tall and bullet proof, when they asked for it, is faintly insulting.

You and Jack are indeed talking about different bikes and styles to a sport bike which is what Tigger is riding. The chassis flex that used help with smoothly controlling a power slide is all but absent on a sporting 250, so they have a surfeit of traction over power. Good luck to him, but if he practices this stuff on the road he will be hurt. There's too little margin for error as it is, without provoking a potential loss of control deliberately. Falling off at 40km/hr in the dirt hurts a bit, but falling off on the road at 100km/hr with other traffic around is really going to hurt.


I can understand where you are coming from, but I think there is a slight mis-assumption that you are making. It seems to me that you think dirt bikes only do 40km/hr on track and that being on a road bike you automatically do 100km/hr. I also do not know where you got the other traffic around bit as well - I suspect you have added that to your perception model - maybe as an assumption to something I might have implied - but I dont remember ever saying that practicing drifting is something I do in traffic - and even here I may differ because my perception of what 'traffic' is will be different from yours as well. Perhaps you may envision traffic as central city stuff or busy motorway - where I might see it as the street outside my house that is very wide and maybe gets 1 car every 10-15 mins.

I'd suggest that it would be possible to change those values around. In fact, I maybe do 100km/hr about once per month when I go over to akaroa or any other trip. My average speed in town is about 40km/hr (very seldom go quicker than that for normal commuting).

Perhaps you never do any stunting stuff - but the whole idea is technique over speed. An example is breaking the tire loose - which involves lean angle over high speed. And I suspect that the problem is with people who do racing will be more prone to having it happen at a high speed than at a low speed although in my opinion they are more likely to spin a tire up on the hairpin at ruapuna at low speed than on any other corner on that track (although there are a couple where you can put the weight on the rear and feel for traction for a long period of time)

The chaps down at the skateboard parks on their pushbikes are more likely to get hurt than I am (and I was watching some kid do some pretty mean jumps the other week - just with a plastic hat and elbow guards).

As for the flex thing - one of the reason why I like honda cibbies is that they traditionally have a lot of flex in the chassis - as compared with other bikes say from suzuki or yamaha (i'm told kwakas also have flex but I've never ridden enough of em to see). I find rigid bikes too wooden and neutral and lacking in corner ability - but then I guess thats just preference.

[Hitcher]

I can understand where you are coming from, but I think there is a slight mis-assumption that you are making.
No, it is you that is having the "mis-assumption".

What Jim2 (and others) are saying is "if you fall off you will get hurt". They are also saying "if you fall off on the road you stand a greater chance of getting hurt than if you were doing the same nongsville stuff on dirt or in a carpark". These are irrefutable truths. Ignore them at your peril.

The rest of your treatise is just a flimsy attempt at rationalising (to yourself) why it's OK to do dumb shit on a motorbike. What you do on your bike to yourself is your responsibility. Just don't look for endorsement from people who have a more reasoned view of personal accountability than you appear to have.

[Blakamin]

The chaps down at the skateboard parks on their pushbikes are more likely to get hurt than I am

and they're where??? ooohhh skateboard park

why dont you practice on a race track???

Anyone wonder why bike riders get a bad name???

ok, 1 car every 15mins... are they timed like busses?
"one went passed, have time to stunt"...bugga theres another one... he wasnt scheduled, why am I in hospital??


traffic is on any public road! it just might be quiet this second.

[Posh Tourer :P]

Perhaps you never do any stunting stuff - but the whole idea is technique over speed. An example is breaking the tire loose - which involves lean angle over high speed.

Yes and where are you going to find a large number of 15kmh corners (that you can take at 50 to get it "drifting") with good visibility and road surface? Physics dictate that you need to be doing a higher speed if you are doing a higher lean angle, otherwise you fall over. So given that you need to be doing a relatively high speed for a particular corner, you will be riding dangerously, even if you are only doing 50-60kmh. Its not about absolute speed, its about relative speed....

[Motu]

There are some good back streets around Hillsborough that'd be choice.I once did a huge full lock slide and subsequent high side in Carlton St once....I wonder if any little boys were watching at their gate? Probably not - they would never have got on a bike after seeing something as scary as that.

[enigma51]

Im not sure dude - but heres my 2c...

I Thought, and still often THINK im sliding the Viffer 400 during races coming out of the hairpin @ pukekohe and previously out of castrol... However im not sure and i doubt it more and more i talk to more experienced riders... I feel the bike shake/squigle and the suspension starts bouncing like up and down on the back end, but its always exiting the corner as i gas it full and i have always tilted the bike up more upright hten the max lean my balls allow me to do. Except once, when i gassed it way too early heading into the apex of castrol and the back end swung, it was slower then i would have imagined a lowside would of been but i was still far from capable of being able to control it.
my thought process was "sweet its starting to get lower, and the back is going further away" and i didnt want to smack off the gas as people say thats how u highside, yet at hte same time i thought it would just ride out... but it just kept on falling and getting closer to the ground as the rear end swung out to overtake me... was pretty graceful i thought and we just went for a slide down the backstraight... but it made me start to think how hard that slide shit really was and that chances are what i feel exiting some corners is just some sort of suspension malfunction.

Either way as hard as it is to believe you do this on your 250 on GPR70SP's (correct?) with enough lean angle to the point that your rolling off the tyre - so minimal tyre is touching, the physics and theory is there to say its possible on ANY machine... However i reckon if youve gotten this far come join the ranks of F3 even on that machine and show us n00bs how its done. I will honestly put half your entry fee up to come do it in the hope that i can follow and possibly learn something.

Mate the sliding of the back tiry you are doing is because you got those shitty tires on. You know that ones that have dual compound ie rubber and wire. :spudwave:

[TwoSeven]

and they're where??? ooohhh skateboard park

why dont you practice on a race track???



I would - but its fookin expensive and a car park and quiet road are free.

[Paul in NZ]

I stand by my original post.

I have raced grasstrack on a dope burning, Hagon framed grasstracker (500cc speedway bike with a gearbox and rear suspension)

Ridden a speedway bike (fookin' scared the shit out of me)

Owned 500cc 350lb pommie scramblers that we raced on the beach (mudflats at brooklands out side ChCh was ACE) where we would map out a mile oval and you would feet up drift BOTH wheels for 200 ft at both bends no sweat!

I won the one and only ChCh Classic Bike club dirt road sprint / rally on an unregistered, unwarrented Rickman Metisse (OK I was second to Big Mike's Commando but only cos hes freakin mental)

I've ridden my crappy old Triumph over every dirt road on the Port hills and slid things all over.


Before you go calling people wankers, perhaps you better read you first minimal post and then the vital supporting detail added later.

I still say. If you can regularly drift a 600 you should take up racing because you are going to hurt yourself on the road.

I could also explain to you how you could build a pipe bomb, but I wouldn't for the same reasons, it's a bloody stupid thing to do and you will hurt yourself.

Your problem is, you did not get the answer you wanted so you called people names? I'd suggest if you are that temperamental, give up bikes, you will hurt yourself and others!

As for HOW to slide a Grasstracker... Ride it faster and faster, power slide out of the corners earlier and earlier until you are going so frigging fast (trust me, we are talking FAST) that you just know you are not going to make the next bend unless you drift into it (no brakes remember).

fall off!

Vow never to do that again

try again

Eventually, something clicks, you shift your weight just right, load the stirrup on the outside just right, trail your inside (left) leg untill you get the guts to leave it up front and give it death.

The ultimate feeling on a bike I have ever had was powering that thing out of a bend, sliding like a bandit and standing it up, getting more traction, nailing the throttle and holding the front wheel about 3 inches above the deck (still sliding sideways) as you lined it up for the straights.... Phroaar!

Put a horn on a jelly fish...

Paul N

A wanker and an arsehole (apparently)

[Kwaka-Kid]

:not::not::not::not::not::not::not::not::not::not: :not:

Oh my God!

Paul in NZ (and no im not being sarcastic) Your my new idle.

I want in on some of what youve done!

k i know nothing about this grasstrack bike stuff, but i have JUST gotten my XR500 running about 1 hour ago - no exhaust on yet as its waiting to be welded in a few hours when my old man arrives home...

but would this old 1980 beast be anything like a grasstracker? would it be capable of the things you speak of? I am so dead keen on giving it my best shot to master or at least learn some wiiicked stuff on the dirt/sand/grass - anything but legal roads!
:no: that sounds so hardout..:spudwhat: will i ever be capable? :no: Who knows but like i said im really happy to be young and broken bones will hopefully only fix themselves better at this age so i want to do it! now!! like right now!.. ahh the impatience of youth. Also easily excited (though i think your last post would have even excited the most staunch and experienced less-excited people around here)

I think its about the only whole post ive read on KB! (haha my bad!)

[Two Smoker]

Paul, your a legend..... :niceone:

[merv]

k i know nothing about this grasstrack bike stuff, but i have JUST gotten my XR500 running about 1 hour ago - no exhaust on yet as its waiting to be welded in a few hours when my old man arrives home...

but would this old 1980 beast be anything like a grasstracker? would it be capable of the things you speak of? I am so dead keen on giving it my best shot to master or at least learn some wiiicked stuff on the dirt/sand/grass - anything but legal roads!

Just about any sort of dirt bike will do the stuff Paul was talking about, but depending on how its set up it will be good in different ways. Tyres are the main thing - for sliding you've got to be able to have the back end break away, and there are different tyres for different surfaces from hard to mud. If the surface is slippery enough you'll slide no matter what tyres you've got on, but if you want to be fast you've got to have the right balance between sliding and getting enough grip for forward drive.

The amount of wrap around and the block pattern on the knobs makes a difference too. Motu mentioned trials tyres and he is right they are awesome in most conditions especially the soft 2 ply type, but probably only let you down in the thickest of mud when a deep knob does the trick. Tyre pressure is the real deal when it comes to getting a dirt bike right and I always err towards soft as it helps traction on slippery surfaces.

Your XR500 will be great if you play around with it and practice your riding style and set it up to suit mainly fiddling with tyre pressures.

I'm a short arse so I have my dirt bikes set up with the handlebars tipped forward a bit so I can sit closer to the front when I need to, to make the back lighter. If you throw the bike into a slide start off sitting forward and when it hangs out as you need more drive, shift your weight back a bit. On the beach on sand you have pretty good grip so you probably need to keep your weight forward throughout. All the time foot out of course for serious sliding except as below about gravel roads and fast tracks.

On gravel roads I ride almost sitting on the tank except when you hit straight sections of deep gravel you move your weight back again to stop it kind of tank slapping as in wobbling back and forth. That happens if there's too much weight on the front wheel and it digs in. My DR250 was bad at that snaking along at about 120km/hr as it seemed quite front heavy, the XRs weren't and nor is my WR (which is bloody light all together).

I've said before on the old gravel road thread a while back once my speed gets up a bit there is no more fun than sliding feet up. Toss it into the corner and straighten the bike up almost vertically as quick as you can once the back wheel hangs out, keep your weight inside on the curve - not knee down as you aint leaning but move your arse over a bit - gas the engine hard, weight back a bit on the seat to get drive and I reckon there is no more fun than that knowing you are getting corner to corner as quick as you can. Don't slide out too much or else you'll lose drive. If you put your foot down at speed on gravel roads I reckon it will slow you down and bugger your style.

I did srambling and mini-TT racing (mini-TT being as close as I got to flat-track racing) in the old days (Hawkes Bay and Canterbury), never actually got to a beach race, but as Paul says you can end up doing foot up slides and that's like I was saying about gravel roads - once your speed gets up on fast tracks, if the corners aren't extra tight you'll do it quicker feet up and most of you have probably seen photos of the Yanks on their big mile ovals riding like that.

Get the bike going KK and just get out and try it and try it again and again until you feel good doing it and by then we won't be able to wipe the smile off your face. Even after 10 years with my VFR I will not give up on dirt bikes they are just so much fun. Slide all you like and the risk of highsiding is so much less - less chance of the tyres gripping so much to flick you and much less weight to manhandle with the bike and wider bars for leverage so you flick it back the other way if it kicks you. Pure heaven!!!

I'm searching my records for a few pics and so far have only found this one of my Bro' on his DR350 at White Rock, not in action but you can see the result - the nice marks on the sand - can't remember if those were his or mine - but hard sand is fun. Then a pic on the beach at Castlepoint - I'm going to have to make a point of getting action shots, but mainly I get the camera out when we have stopped - can't ride taking pics eh!

[Paul in NZ]

I'm no legend! (except in the bedroom but this is a family show) Merv and Motu got it all pretty spot on!

The thing is. Speedway (and to a limited extent) grasstrack is on a relatively consistent surface in a controlled environment. The road and car parks are NOT!

This is all pretty cool and before I get labeled a blowhard as well as a wanker AND an arsehole (man, am I building up a personality or what?)

Here is some proof.

Can't find pictures of the grasstracker but! 500cc BSA engine running methanol, (massive porting / valves, goldstar race cams, 13:1 compression etc etc.)Triumph 4 speed box (1st and 2nd locked out) in a Alf Hagon (yes, THE ALF Hagon that now makes shocks was world Grass track champ) chassis, Some odd speedway front end and girlings at back.

One person could pick the whole bike up. Also came with a Wal Phillips fuel injector (look it up)

I wanted a 40's speedway sidecar rig (HD Castle forks, JAP 8/80 motor (on dope) so i sold the tracker for $800 but the sidecar fell through! No sweat 'cos i sucked at riding it! No Bollocks!

Attached are!

Rickman (green bike with racing plates)

Norton engined, Ariel framed scrambler (as raced built / raced by the famous Brown Brothers out of Rangiora in the early 60's in the open NZ TT etc). I had it hooked to a Moto Cross Sidecar for a bit... Untill I rode it through our fence (ah hem)

Paul drifts cars! (Austin A40 with doors welded and.. Oh who cares)

What happens when you TRY to drift a BSA on the road

People that I grew up with getting ready to teach you about sliding... And before you get too excited! Thats Brighton Beach in Christchurch and it is a scan of an original photo that I own! Wait 'till you see the rest!

[merv]

Beautiful Paul, especially that last pic.

[Motu]

That's too close to home Paul (I'm a Paul too no less) my Rickman was painted the same green,but was a unit 500,red was a better colour,I just never got around to changing it.Big slides on the beach is about the best you can get I reckon,they can go huge and so out of shape,but you never fall off...much.One day I was charging down the beach at Port Waikato and saw some people sitting up by the dunes....as I got closer I saw what they were doing - surfcasting! The lines were chest high in front of me - I dropped the bike in the sand at speed and fell on my arse,felt like I ripped it in two,rything around on the sand with my ring piece on fire.My XR200 was a bit of fun in sand,it didn't really have enough guts to maintain a slide - I would blast along in 3rd and then slam it down hard on full throttle into a big full locker...but I kept the slide going it would gradualy turn into a two wheel drift and finally a big front wheel slide,hard case going from a rear to front wheel slide on the one turn.

[enigma51]

Paul in NZ how old are you? (All respect though)

[enigma51]

My uncle use to do the sliding thing on the beach with the xr 500 but when ever tried it I ended up digging sand out the ears for about a month or so. You get it just nicely and you will hit a hard piece of sand and then you play superman for a while.

[TwoSeven]

I stand by my original post.

I still say. If you can regularly drift a 600 you should take up racing because you are going to hurt yourself on the road.

I could also explain to you how you could build a pipe bomb, but I wouldn't for the same reasons, it's a bloody stupid thing to do and you will hurt yourself.


Oh well, I think riding a dirt bike on gravel roads where there is no-one around to help you should you end up injured is a stupid thing to do. Each to their own aye. :)

[Blakamin]

Paul in NZ how old are you? (All respect though)
He's 15 at heart!

[Paul in NZ]

Born in 1956. Still get up and go WHOA who is that old C**t in the mirror!

I was having some fun with the last photo! I saved a big stack of original pictures like that from the dump! But!

My uncles used to do all that stuff, Ronnie Moore used to come to our flat a few times (hats off to solo speedway dudes everywhere) and I was lucky enough to hang out with all these sorts of guys (in the picture) when they were in their 50's and 60's and I was 15 and owned a AJS 500. They were all bloody decent to us kids and we were in awe of them!

I LOVED that Norton thing on the beach! 80mph flat out, layin' on the tank giving it death when you hit the soft sand! 80mph to 8mph in 3 feet. Amazin how we survived but shit we had some FUN!

[Blakamin]

Born in 1956. Still get up and go WHOA who is that old C**t in the mirror!

I was having some fun with the last photo! I saved a big stack of original pictures like that from the dump! But!

My uncles used to do all that stuff, Ronnie Moore used to come to our flat a few times (hats off to solo speedway dudes everywhere) and I was lucky enough to hang out with all these sorts of guys (in the picture) when they were in their 50's and 60's and I was 15 and owned a AJS 500. They were all bloody decent to us kids and we were in awe of them!

I LOVED that Norton thing on the beach! 80mph flat out, layin' on the tank giving it death when you hit the soft sand! 80mph to 8mph in 3 feet. Amazin how we survived but shit we had some FUN!


see!!! 15 at heart!!!

[enigma51]

Born in 1956. Still get up and go WHOA who is that old C**t in the mirror!

I was having some fun with the last photo! I saved a big stack of original pictures like that from the dump! But!

My uncles used to do all that stuff, Ronnie Moore used to come to our flat a few times (hats off to solo speedway dudes everywhere) and I was lucky enough to hang out with all these sorts of guys (in the picture) when they were in their 50's and 60's and I was 15 and owned a AJS 500. They were all bloody decent to us kids and we were in awe of them!

I LOVED that Norton thing on the beach! 80mph flat out, layin' on the tank giving it death when you hit the soft sand! 80mph to 8mph in 3 feet. Amazin how we survived but shit we had some FUN!


Riding and fallen on the beach always seems to not hurt as much as when you bin it on the tarmac. :second:

[Blakamin]

Born in 1956. Still get up and go WHOA who is that old C**t in the mirror!

I was having some fun with the last photo! I saved a big stack of original pictures like that from the dump! But!

My uncles used to do all that stuff, Ronnie Moore used to come to our flat a few times (hats off to solo speedway dudes everywhere) and I was lucky enough to hang out with all these sorts of guys (in the picture) when they were in their 50's and 60's and I was 15 and owned a AJS 500. They were all bloody decent to us kids and we were in awe of them!

I LOVED that Norton thing on the beach! 80mph flat out, layin' on the tank giving it death when you hit the soft sand! 80mph to 8mph in 3 feet. Amazin how we survived but shit we had some FUN!

Wish my childhood was like that :confused2

[merv]

Paul's just a young fellah compared to those of us in our second half of a century.

[spudchucka]

I didnt read the earlier posts the way some people intended them to be read. I asked a simple question and expected a simple answer. I wouldnt have minded the odd comment that I may bin it - or do it somewhere safe or along those lines. That would go along with the par when someone asks how to do something that is technically difficult. :)

Some of the earlier posts were just plane retarded and I wasnt sure if it was done by 8 year olds or someone with a self image problem. Which is what pissed me off. I do expect people to use netiquette as they would good manners in real life. There is a difference between sarcasm and humour and without the use of emoticons its hard to define which is being used.

I asked a serious question and I expected a serious answer - if you dont know then say so. If you are being funny then say so - thats what emoticons are for. :drinknsin

I happen to enjoy stunting on bikes and going fast has no interest for me - I find it rather boring. I do enjoy riding in wet,snow,ice/grass/gravel and I'm not fussed with falling off. I already know how to break a tire loose and move the bike around - what I dont know how to do is make the bike move in a manner closer to what I want it too. Drifting is one of those techniques i'd like to learn in order to get closer to that mark.

For those who say - dont do it because we pay taxes for injury and all that codswollop - I suspect all the people that jump mx bikes, throw rally cars around gravel roads on the sides of cliffs, race bikes, throw themselves off of cliffs and all those other 'dangerous' sports would probably tell you to shove it in the appropriate place lacking sunlight :)
Why don't you go out and buy yourself a Jawa and do some speedway riding? Look at the long-track riders, they are doing around 200 kph before they slide it into the next corner.

Just keep it of public roads.

[JohnBoy]

the best way i have seen people drift on bikes was on a track, the guy had a down geared 2004 CBR1000. that dude was coming out of corners counter steering! :shit:
i started to respect this bike when i thought i was riding quick down one of the straights and was passed by him on the back wheel.... not my kettle of fish but maybe yours?
i quite like the idea of rear wheel traction, unless you have the front brakes hard on! :shifty:

[spudchucka]

I would - but its fookin expensive and a car park and quiet road are free.
See how expensive it gets when you get locked up for dangerous driving or you wipe out and end up in a wheel chair...........but I guess you are so good that you could never screw up. :killingme

[Blakamin]

See how expensive it gets when you get locked up for dangerous driving or you wipe out and end up in a wheel chair...........but I guess you are so good that you could never screw up. :killingme
Like this???

[TwoSeven]

You know - I had to take a kid to hospital last year because his skateboard hit a small stone and he fell off and busted his arm in two places - he was wearing all the kit.

Some of you guys must be sniffing glue or something - because some of your statements bear no resemblance to reality.

So far I have heard that.

Sand/grass/race track is softer than road
You will not get injured riding a dirt bike on gravel roads (even if you go fast)
You will always get run over by a car if you dont drive perfectly
You will always go 100kph on a road bike but only 40kph on a dirt bike -even if they are the same capacity.
Everyone will get injured if they try something different.
People who have been riding in the 60s are always better than those who were riding in the 70s 80s or 90s - even if the machinery is totally different and they have never been on a modern machine.
People who go fast on the race track are also fast on the road
People who can ride on the road well will be experts on the race track.
You must be going extremely fast to perform any form of trick on a motorcycle.

I mean - please actually just take a look at what you are saying and think about reality. Some of you are just parroting old wives tales at best.

[Blakamin]

Sand/grass/race track is softer than road
You will not get injured riding a dirt bike on gravel roads (even if you go fast)
You will always get run over by a car if you dont drive perfectly
You will always go 100kph on a road bike but only 40kph on a dirt bike -even if they are the same capacity.
Everyone will get injured if they try something different.
People who have been riding in the 60s are always better than those who were riding in the 70s 80s or 90s - even if the machinery is totally different and they have never been on a modern machine.
People who go fast on the race track are also fast on the road
People who can ride on the road well will be experts on the race track.
You must be going extremely fast to perform any form of trick on a motorcycle.



wow...i never saw any of those statements
:disapint:
must be reading with my eyes shut again <_<

[Posh Tourer :P]

wow...i never saw any of those statements
:disapint:
must be reading with my eyes shut again <_<

Nor here....

What colour are your glasses Tiggerz? They certainly aint anything I can imagine...

[Paul in NZ]

Nor here....

What colour are your glasses Tiggerz? They certainly aint anything I can imagine...

Nah! I've got a pair of those 'special' glasses too...

I suggest you borrow mine Tiggerz and read your own posts... You would be amazed what those glasses translate that too... Funnily enough, I don't seem to be alone in my opinion.

I didn't 'grow up' in the 60's. (some people would claim I still have not managed that yet). Simple maths will show you when I was old enough to get my license. Early 70's.

I never claimed I was better than anyone. Only that I gave some actual examples of my sliding experience ( I also won the only 'lets see how far you can lock up your front wheel coming down Dyers Pass road competition'. The survivors decided not to make it an annual event and the paint on my Triumphs drum brake caught fire).

In fact I gave up grasstrack because I was never going to be good enough to be in the hunt and frankly I freakin' near wet myself with fear on the only time I rode a speedway bike (that wall seemed awful close)

The message I was trying to get across was I'm OLD (ie I survived that) and am humbly suggesting, based on the experiences described, that doing what you described in your first post is going to end badly!

And before you ask. YES I have ridden CBR600 a VTR and a Blackbird as fast as I could at manfield. People have walked around faster, I'm no racer!

If you want to build your skills for stunting, do a bit of trials, scrambles etc and do proper stunting. Doing it in carparks and public roads is daft!

Paul N

ps. If you drop the attitude and read the posts without putting on your angst glasses you will see thus far people have been quite nice (appart from me but I'm repeat arsehole and a wanker)

[James Deuce]

You know - I had to take a kid to hospital last year because his skateboard hit a small stone and he fell off and busted his arm in two places - he was wearing all the kit.

Some of you guys must be sniffing glue or something - because some of your statements bear no resemblance to reality.

So far I have heard that.

Sand/grass/race track is softer than road
You will not get injured riding a dirt bike on gravel roads (even if you go fast)
You will always get run over by a car if you dont drive perfectly
You will always go 100kph on a road bike but only 40kph on a dirt bike -even if they are the same capacity.
Everyone will get injured if they try something different.
People who have been riding in the 60s are always better than those who were riding in the 70s 80s or 90s - even if the machinery is totally different and they have never been on a modern machine.
People who go fast on the race track are also fast on the road
People who can ride on the road well will be experts on the race track.
You must be going extremely fast to perform any form of trick on a motorcycle.

I mean - please actually just take a look at what you are saying and think about reality. Some of you are just parroting old wives tales at best.

What an astonishingly stupid person.

I've played nice so far but if you are heading down this path I ain't playing no more.

Have fun in your perfectly safe, cosy little environment where bad things don't happen because I'm invincible and immortal.

[sanchez]

Try not to listen to Tiggerz too much, if you want to read an almost complete contradiction of what he's posting here (from tiggerz himself) check

http://forums.overclockers.co.nz/showthread.php?s=&threadid=15910

:)

[k14]

Try not to listen to Tiggerz too much, if you want to read an almost complete contradiction of what he's posting here (from tiggerz himself) check

http://forums.overclockers.co.nz/showthread.php?s=&threadid=15910

:)

Very good point there sanchez. If the shoe fits....

[Kwaka-Kid]

For those of you who cant be botherd clicking the link: This was said after some guy said he drifts his car around the road or some junky tin-top rice racer stuff like that.


Fookwit (and I am being polite with you here). I have a personal vendetta out for tin box drivers that show skills required of entry to the darwin awards. You are currently displaying them.

If you actually believe what you posted you should be banned from driving.

Take it to a track please.
Dont just type it.
Read it.
Understand it.

No offence dude but your personalities on these 2 diff boards are complete opposites of eachother. Whatever trouble you are having with your two different states of mind thingy i reckon itd help if you didnt try to rub the majority of the well respected members here the wrong way.

Have a good one dude.

[Blakamin]

No offence dude but your personalities on these 2 diff boards are complete opposites of eachother.
HAHAHA... what a tossa

he could get medication for that KK!

[TwoSeven]

For those of you who cant be botherd clicking the link: This was said after some guy said he drifts his car around the road or some junky tin-top rice racer stuff like that.


Dont just type it.
Read it.
Understand it.

No offence dude but your personalities on these 2 diff boards are complete opposites of eachother. Whatever trouble you are having with your two different states of mind thingy i reckon itd help if you didnt try to rub the majority of the well respected members here the wrong way.

Have a good one dude.

This is my original post.



Ok, just having a conversation with someone who is a MXr about drifting (front and rear). I can kind of do it to the rear on the 250 - but its more uncontrolled due to cold tires rather than on the 600 where it was technique.

Anyone out there have a handle on a good way to get more control

Having never ridden speedway I'm not sure how they do it, but it seems to be a mix of lean angle and throttle control


Kwaka-Kid Can you point out the post I made in this thread and the one you linked to where I contradict myself. The entire post please - in context.


I'll stick with what i've said so far - in both forums.

[jrandom]

Kwaka-Kid Can you point out the post I made in this thread and the one you linked to where I contradict mysel.

Oooh, can I do this one? Please?

Ahem.

I'll type it slowly, so as to be more easily understood.

You see, earlier in this thread, right, you went on about bike-stunting fun on the road. Public roads, and all that? Remember?

And then, on a forum for spotty 13-year-old computer owners and spotty 16-year-old Japanese car owners, you made an excursion to the moral high ground and bagged some feckless youth for claiming that he stunted in his *car* on public roads.

Fortunately, I suspect you still have a teensy-tiny bit of salvagable online respectibility, should you want to continue participating on *this* forum without the general populace thinking of you as a peurile, self-inflated moron. But you should probably start making sensible posts, and stop insulting people. Get the ego under control, etc.

I always wonder how much this sort of nonsense relates to people's real natures. Are you an up-himself git in real life, too, or do you just have a big pair of Internet Balls, coupled with very little Internet Brain?

[Blakamin]

Oooh, can I do this one? Please?

Ahem.

I'll type it slowly, so as to be more easily understood.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :Punk:

[TwoSeven]

Oooh, can I do this one? Please?

Ahem.

I'll type it slowly, so as to be more easily understood.

You see, earlier in this thread, right, you went on about bike-stunting fun on the road. Public roads, and all that? Remember?


Can you quote me please - in context.

[James Deuce]

Hang - Just have to go and get a fresh coffee.

[jrandom]

Can you quote me please - in context.

Oh, fuggoff. The thread is the context. Read it again, then read my post *really quickly* before the preceding stuff fades out of your head.

I can't be arsed prolonging any boring arguments today.

[Posh Tourer :P]

Just to prolong it, Here you go Tiggerz, with context.

Theres a number of quotes which I reckon got the wind up people. They are from a number of different posts, with some more relevant parts highlighted


Out of interest I grew up racin road bikes on wet grass with my mates - so not afraid of moving a bike around. Havnt binned a bike in over a decade apart from parking on some long grass that turned out to be a ditch and removing the paddock stand without putting the side stand down and ye olde disc lock issue. So you can assume that I have a fair idea on how to ride safely.


On the 250 I have a corner I like thats out of the way from everything. With the dragons on it was a matter of setting the throttle and banging the bike on its side - at a certain point round the corner the tire would slip then grip if I got the lean angle right. You could make it go a bit further if you caught it with the throttle and gave it a bit more gas, but would lose it as the bike stood up on the exit - but most often its just a slip and grip. It just plain dont have enough go juice to do more than that.


Not much luck with the front end on the 250 and i've tried a few different ideas - really all I can do it get it to skip in a straight line if I really wail on the brakes - with the dunlops if I turn too quick it just wants to tuck on me which is off putting at best. On my old cibby600 you could just square the corner right off and turn hard and if you got it right the front would skip a bit as it washed off the speed. But for the life of me I cant remember exactly the sequence for doing it.

(In these last two you admit to trying to "drift" on public roads as far as I can see - PT)

The chaps down at the skateboard parks on their pushbikes are more likely to get hurt than I am (and I was watching some kid do some pretty mean jumps the other week - just with a plastic hat and elbow guards).

Oh and the real kicker?





and they're where??? ooohhh skateboard park

why dont you practice on a race track???

I would - but its fookin expensive and a car park and quiet road are free.

[TwoSeven]

So apart from quoting me out of context - you have managed to bold parts that indicate I'm a safe rider, take the bike to safe places to practice and sometimes watch the skateboarders at the local park (you see when you quote out of context it can become double edged).

ok so failing to quote me, link accusations to facts or do anything that a normal person would do the technique is to resort to mis-quoting out of context to create some of the old proverbial

I believe there is one state in the psychological step of an internet retard left to be achieved and and so far only one person has demonstrated the ability to achieve it - however this state is the usual domain of the 8 year old so I am expecting it to be a bit of effort for some of the members here.

Its usually about this stage that some of the more intelligent people will realise that the've made the rather stupid mistake of trying to ego bash someone and have been milked for all their worth.

although there were a few good opinions made by people (which are always worth reading and making a note of) - if not on the subject of the original post - I do listen and take note - just not agree. The rest of the posts were just amusement as far as I am concerned :)

[Blakamin]

I believe there is one state in the psychological step of an internet retard left to be achieved and and so far only one person has demonstrated the ability to achieve it - however this state is the usual domain of the 8 year old so I am expecting it to be a bit of effort for some of the members here.

which bit did I leave out???????????? :disapint:

[James Deuce]

So apart from quoting me out of context - you have managed to bold parts that indicate I'm a safe rider, take the bike to safe places to practice and sometimes watch the skateboarders at the local park (you see when you quote out of context it can become double edged).

ok so failing to quote me, link accusations to facts or do anything that a normal person would do the technique is to resort to mis-quoting out of context to create some of the old proverbial

I believe there is one state in the psychological step of an internet retard left to be achieved and and so far only one person has demonstrated the ability to achieve it - however this state is the usual domain of the 8 year old so I am expecting it to be a bit of effort for some of the members here.

Its usually about this stage that some of the more intelligent people will realise that the've made the rather stupid mistake of trying to ego bash someone and have been milked for all their worth.

although there were a few good opinions made by people (which are always worth reading and making a note of) - if not on the subject of the original post - I do listen and take note - just not agree. The rest of the posts were just amusement as far as I am concerned :)

You're a bigger cock than I thought. Thanks for the entertainment.

[Paul in NZ]

You're a bigger cock than I thought. Thanks for the entertainment.

Thankfully I was right first time and he has not failed to disappoint me.

I just can't think of the last time I had a conversation like this with a person like that at an actual motocycle event... (you know, one you had to ride too) There's not a lot of chit chat about context and stuff...

Hopefully Tiggerz will find all the other fluffy animals and bugger off back to the 100 acre woods for a game of contextual pooh sticks! Or if we are lucky a big butch Heffalump will find him first and teach him to drift... (away)

Sheesh!

[Kwaka-Kid]

bah, looks like the boys have done the replies for me!

anyway to lighten it up a bit anyone got some good drifting pics of themselves?

i was 13 here on the old XR200, the picture doesnt really show it - all it shows is the old beast smoked a bit even back then! but i swear it was kindof doing it :P

[jrandom]

Hopefully Tiggerz will find all the other fluffy animals and bugger off back to the 100 acre woods for a game of contextual pooh sticks!

Why, I think we've discovered the problem.

Tiggerz has lost his bounce!

[TwoSeven]

haha. I think I have found that the egos doent like their cruisy little world challenged. You all managed to get to the last stage - well done. Top points.

Isnt it good to spend days on end trying to insult argue and prove how great you are only to find that the person your trying your best to afflict your cronyism on - was taking the piss.

I hope that the next time you try and inflict your poor attempt at user brow beating on some some poor bastard that just asked a simple question - you'll remember the time you got taken for a ride :)

(still having a chuckle).


What is it jeremy clarkson says.

Loooooserrrsss.

:)

[James Deuce]

haha. I think I have found that the egos doent like their cruisy little world challenged. You all managed to get to the last stage - well done. Top points.

Isnt it good to spend days on end trying to insult argue and prove how great you are only to find that the person your trying your best to afflict your cronyism on - was taking the piss.

I hope that the next time you try and inflict your poor attempt at user brow beating on some some poor bastard that just asked a simple question - you'll remember the time you got taken for a ride :)

(still having a chuckle).


What is it jeremy clarkson says.

Loooooserrrsss.

:)

It wasn't a simple question. Practicing the stuff you are talking about in any public place is what is losing everybody the freedom to enjoy their motor vehicles of any description. There is no such thing as a safe public road or car park. If you wanted to ask a question that would have received a thousand positive answers, it would have been, "What is the best way to learn how to slide a bike"? without adding the crap about practicing in a public place.

As you have been told, learn how to do it on a race track, either sealed or off road. Don't do it where you can hurt my family or someone else's.

The only ego display I've seen here has been yours, in either the frankly pathetic attempt at trolling, or your utter disregard for the quality advice you got given at the start of the thread.

Everybody who has spoken up has done so because they are trying to avoid a fellow motorcyclist getting hurt. You on the other hand have used this forum for sport. You're not a motorcyclist. You're a cock. Go away little boy.

[Two Smoker]

bah, looks like the boys have done the replies for me!

anyway to lighten it up a bit anyone got some good drifting pics of themselves?

i was 13 here on the old XR200, the picture doesnt really show it - all it shows is the old beast smoked a bit even back then! but i swear it was kindof doing it :P
BLOODY HOON :angry2: lol

Hurry up and get some photos of the XR500 going sideways :niceone:

[Paul in NZ]

haha. I think I have found that the egos doent like their cruisy little world challenged. You all managed to get to the last stage - well done. Top points.

Isnt it good to spend days on end trying to insult argue and prove how great you are only to find that the person your trying your best to afflict your cronyism on - was taking the piss.

I hope that the next time you try and inflict your poor attempt at user brow beating on some some poor bastard that just asked a simple question - you'll remember the time you got taken for a ride :)

(still having a chuckle).


What is it jeremy clarkson says.

Loooooserrrsss.

:)

There is only one loser here Tiggerz.... The problem is the loser is just to dim to even understand it....

If you have the mis guided impression you have caused a big chuckle to the whole internet community by demonstrating your dazzling net ability and overwhelming powers of reasoning to humiliate people on this board... You really do need to go practise drifting because the personal contact you will enjoy with the medical proffession may help you understand that the world (the real one) communicates on a great many levels, many of which seem hidden to you.

Most motorcycle boards are more like a gigantic rally fire where you can ask stupid questions (you have that part down pat BTW), rib your mates and have a bit of fun crapping on about everything under the sun. You can certainly take the piss, provided you can take the lumps.

Talking about net etiquitte (spelling?), context etc is seldom required.

You really don't need to actually answer this, it's just an observation but ask yourself this. If we were to run a poll asking who made the biggest wally of themselves in this thread? What do you think the answer would be? And WHY?

Paul N

Ps - For what it's worth! No motorcyclist would ever be caught dead quoting that selfcentred, Paul Holmes of motoring tele infomercialisim Jeremy Clarkson - He has said it on his program a great many times he hates motorcycles... So would I be concerned about his opinions? Nope!

Am I impressed by him and his mates thrashing the nuts of other peoples expensive cars, hell yes, if they could just do more of that and less yap it would be great!

[avgas]

'Drifting' is for wankers. Motorcyclists slide, not drift their bikes. And it tends to be the rear, rather than the front, as it's very easy to progress into a lowside when the front has exceeded the limits of traction...

You may also call it 'flat-track', although that's a bit Murkn.
On the WSB / MotoGP bikes, a lot of it's down to power, so it's a controlled power-slide. The guys that have come from 'flat-tracking' or other dirt-bike riding, or who have ridden supermotards tend to do it more often, as it's de rigeur for those sports. Interestingly, Colin Edwards said that riding supermotards mid-season completely stuffed up his MotoGP riding, as the two styles were so different, from a weight-distribution point of view.
also you dont really need to conserve a motard tyre - where the 180bhp on a supersoft tyre for 30 min you do

[avgas]

cos thats what all this is - bullshit and otherstuff.
Now im a true and true, 4 generation motorcyclist. But i also like to have a little fun ;) But most of this cat fight here is pissing me off.
Shut up - go have a ride
Be a purist, or be a hoon - either way, jump on your bike and ride it the way you want, cos if you leave it in your shed a bitch about life then you dont bloody deserve a bike.
I remember when motorcyclist werent jerks that didnt compare each other like boy racers
enough said - im off to work so i can pay for my rear tyre

[spudchucka]

You know - I had to take a kid to hospital last year because his skateboard hit a small stone and he fell off and busted his arm in two places - he was wearing all the kit.

Some of you guys must be sniffing glue or something - because some of your statements bear no resemblance to reality.

So far I have heard that.

Sand/grass/race track is softer than road
You will not get injured riding a dirt bike on gravel roads (even if you go fast)
You will always get run over by a car if you dont drive perfectly
You will always go 100kph on a road bike but only 40kph on a dirt bike -even if they are the same capacity.
Everyone will get injured if they try something different.
People who have been riding in the 60s are always better than those who were riding in the 70s 80s or 90s - even if the machinery is totally different and they have never been on a modern machine.
People who go fast on the race track are also fast on the road
People who can ride on the road well will be experts on the race track.
You must be going extremely fast to perform any form of trick on a motorcycle.

I mean - please actually just take a look at what you are saying and think about reality. Some of you are just parroting old wives tales at best.
I was going to say that you have seriously lost it but upon reflection I've decided that you never had it in the first place.