Why is motobike gear all black?

[Soul.Trader]

So here's an obvious question that needs asking - why is all our gear the same colour as the road? Why spend hunreds, or even thousands, buying expensive motorcycle gear with the sole purpose of trying to be safe - but ironically, all this same gear is black in colour, making is near invisible in certain conditions.

Why isn't there more gear available that's fashionable and brightly coloured? I saw this video a little while ago (http://youtube.com/watch?v=kh2U2O6_m50), which made me wonder why this type of gear isn't more widely available. I'd love to own motorcycle clothing like this, but simply cannot find it. Is it purely a cultural thing, that morocyclists refuse to wear stuff that isn't black?

[Trudes]

Well, doesn't have to be.... Quasi (http://www.quasimoto.co.nz/) has some very brightly coloured gear on offer!

[Highlander]

Black sells so it is most of what the shops stock, because it is most of what they stock black sells.

I make a point of getting something other than black.

Several times I have gone into Bayride and said "can you get me one of these in anything other than black".

[Soul.Trader]

Well, doesn't have to be.... Quasi (http://http://www.quasimoto.co.nz/)has some very brightly coloured gear on offer!

If I go into "Sports Jackets" on Quasi's site, I see black, mostly black, or brightly coloured if you have breasts and a slight physique. The race suits are, *ahem* a bit much, for most people, so I wont really consider them. The Sports Pants come in ONLY black, as does Touring Gear.

[Zoolander]

Why isn't there more gear available that's fashionable and brightly coloured?

Really? None of my gear is black. And there are so many choices available when buying gear I would be surprised if anybody struggled to find colours. Shop around, you'll be suprised.

[Grub]

- why is all our gear the same colour as the road?

EXACTLY! {bling sent}

I had to work really hard to find some gear with colour in it at a reasonable price. I don't get the black-bike craze either .. get this, not just blck but matt black so that it transmits no light at all!

People who do that really have to be mental.

[Soul.Trader]

Really? None of my gear is black. And there are so many choices available when buying gear I would be surprised if anybody struggled to find colours. Shop around, you'll be suprised.

Well I bought my gear today from a pretty well stocked shop. I'm extremely satisfied with my gear, but a little miffed that there wasn't a SINGLE piece of coloured clothing in the shop. BTW, I dont consider stuff like that Quasi gear to be "coloured" just because it has a few coloured streaks on black leather.

[James Deuce]

Bright colours don't help. Some light colours blend you into a confusing background and help motion camouflage convince drivers you aren't really there. People identify shape and size before the identify colour and they most certainly don't view a motorcycle as the same sort of threat as a car or truck.

Wearing bright colours to make you more visible should be secondary to riding like you are invisible.

I answer to your question: Leather is either black or brown for most commercial clothing applications. Post war motorcyclists wore black because it made them look more menacing. It is now the core fashion in motorcycle clothing.

Black also goes with anything. Matching leathers or cordura to your current bike goes horribly wrong when you change from a lime green Kawasaki to a mostly red Honda.

[Trudes]

I had to shop on-line and get my silver and black Shift jacket from the states, give it a go and see what what you can find.

[Soul.Trader]

Bright colours don't help. Some light colours blend you into a confusing background and help motion camouflage convince drivers you aren't really there. People identify shape and size before the identify colour and they most certainly don't view a motorcycle as the same sort of threat as a car or truck.

Everything you said here is true, except the first four words. Nothing will ever convince me that bright colours wont make a difference, nor will it convince the road workers in their hi-vis vests, or hunters wearing orange jackets. We emphasize greatly safety and visibility, and spend thousands keeping ourselves safe, then we wear the worst possible colour for the purpose. It's nothing short of senseless.

[Madness]

People who do that really have to be mental.

Stark-raving certifiably bonkers.

The dude in the YouTube clip looks like a Smurf imho.

[Maha]

Well I bought my gear today from a pretty well stocked shop. I'm extremely satisfied with my gear, but a little miffed that there wasn't a SINGLE piece of coloured clothing in the shop. BTW, I dont consider stuff like that Quasi gear to be "coloured" just because it has a few coloured streaks on black leather.


So ah, what colours would you like leathers to be? Serious question.
I wouldn't buy anything else but black pants (even if there was a choice) I have a Black/White/Blue Jacket.

[98tls]

After road riding for 29 years in nothing but black gear i fail to see the problem really,if your that bothered buy a flouro vest.......really.FWIW ride with your headlight on.

[Soul.Trader]

After road riding for 29 years in nothing but black gear i fail to see the problem really,if your that bothered buy a flouro vest.......really.FWIW ride with your headlight on.

I intend on getting a fluoro vest for bad weather/long night rides, but I really dont agree there is no issue. I'll conceed there isn't an issue as soon as motorcyclists in black gear stop bitching about motorists not seeing them.

[Soul.Trader]

I might add, does anyone else ever feel people come onto this website solely to disagree with other people's posts? The more time I spend here, the more true it seems to be. I really can't see why anyone would disagree that visibility is a good thing?

[hXc]

Black is the new [insert colour of your choice here].
That's why.

[James Deuce]

Everything you said here is true, except the first four words. Nothing will ever convince me that bright colours wont make a difference, nor will it convince the road workers in their hi-vis vests, or hunters wearing orange jackets. We emphasize greatly safety and visibility, and spend thousands keeping ourselves safe, then we wear the worst possible colour for the purpose. It's nothing short of senseless.
Why do so many hunters in bright clothing get shot and killed every year?

You're not comparing like with like either. Our visual processing only works reliably up to about 20 km/hr. Over that and your personal experience is filling in the gaps. People only look at an object on the road for about a 10th of a second when making a decision to pull out in front of it. Motorcycles don't appear to be moving until they are relatively MUCH closer to the driver making the decision, due to their small size in relation to the background and their lack of width to provide clues to the size of the approaching vehicle. We judge approach speed and trajectory by triangulating on two points of the approaching and judging its approach relative to our own velocity. This is why vehicle headlights are at the extreme outside edge of a vehicle. It gives you a shot at guessing it's distance and approaching speed at night because there are two reference points.

Nowhere in this decision making process is colour factored in.

On an open highway, where you have time to analyse an approaching vehicle, factors like colour can be added to the equation, but the second most deadly spot for motorcyclists are intersections, where the decision making process does most emphatically not contain enough time for subtleties like colour.

[MotoGirl]

Bright colours don't help.

That's precisely what I was thinking. People can't see bright pink trucks so why would they notice a biker in a pink jacket? Plus, the black looks good on any bike.

[Grub]

I might add, does anyone else ever feel people come onto this website solely to disagree with other people's posts? The more time I spend here, the more true it seems to be. I really can't see why anyone would disagree that visibility is a good thing?

Don't take any notice of Jim2, it's not personal, he's always like that.

[hXc]

I might add, does anyone else ever feel people come onto this website solely to disagree with other people's posts? The more time I spend here, the more true it seems to be. I really can't see why anyone would disagree that visibility is a good thing?Sounds like someone is referring to themselves in a round-a-bout way...

[hXc]

On an open highway, where you have time to analyse an approaching vehicle, factors like colour can be added to the equation, but the second most deadly spot for motorcyclists are intersections, where the decision making process does most emphatically not contain enough time for subtleties like colour.If I may be so noob-ish...what is the most deadly spot for motorcyclists?

[98tls]

I intend on getting a fluoro vest for bad weather/long night rides, but I really dont agree there is no issue. I'll conceed there isn't an issue as soon as motorcyclists in black gear stop bitching about motorists not seeing them. Motorcyclists could wear faggot purple with pink racing stripes and still not be seen.Buy whatever coloured gear you like but dont ever get to thinking every car driver will see you,much better to "expect the unexpected" and adhere to it strictly when riding on heavily populated roads.

[James Deuce]

I might add, does anyone else ever feel people come onto this website solely to disagree with other people's posts? The more time I spend here, the more true it seems to be. I really can't see why anyone would disagree that visibility is a good thing?

Because other road users don't see you. You must not factor your visibility to other road users into any decision you make while riding a motorcycle. You will be hurt or worse if you do. We disagree with you because of long painful experience. You are quite wrong in your assertion that making yourself visible is in any way important on a motorcycle. It will help with more observant drivers and riders out there, but the first words a motorcyclist invariably hears at an accident site are; "I'm sorry mate, I didn't see you."

Followed by, "You must have been speeding."

Followed by, "Serves you right for riding those death traps."

I'm not having you on.

[James Deuce]

If I may be so noob-ish...what is the most deadly spot for motorcyclists?

Corners.

10fc

[Grub]

I intend on getting a fluoro vest for bad weather/long night rides.

I'd suggest wearing it for short rides, more accidents happen close to home. Busy roads around the mount and the quality of the drivers mandates it. Only riding in Chowick could be worse.

The point about relying on your hi-viz vest is well made though. A couple of serious bikers got very antsy when it was suggested that ACC might mandate them. They felt, with some justification, that new riders would just expect them to work and feel that they didn't have to ride defensively.

I still agree with you though ... I wear viz gear because if it makes just 1% difference of being sen, then I'm nuts not to take that advantage

[98tls]

If I may be so noob-ish...what is the most deadly spot for motorcyclists? Everywhere.

[Soul.Trader]

So I can conclude from this thread that this motorcycle community doesn't think we should be doing everything possible to make ourselves seen? Well, case closed I guess - that would be why I cant get decent coloured gear. But I hope I never see another post from a motorcyclist having a whinge about how a car didn't see them - even though they were wearing black clothes, on a dark coloured bike (which has a tiny profile compared with other vehicles), and probably had no headlight on. Dang stinkin' motorists.

[Maha]

what is the most deadly spot for motorcyclists?


The 'G' Spot???....who the hell knows where that is?....bet its hiding somewhere Black!!!!

[Soul.Trader]

PS: If anyone tries to convince me that black (a colour which reflects next to no light) is no more or less visible than blue or yellow (colours which reflect a lot more light), I know they're full of shit.

[Hitcher]

Black is also more "resistant" to grime and other assaults by The Great Outdoors.

[Hitcher]

The 'G' Spot???....who the hell knows where that is?....bet its hiding somewhere Black!!!!

Rumour has it that it's hiding somewhere pink...

[98tls]

So I can conclude from this thread that this motorcycle community doesn't think we should be doing everything possible to make ourselves seen? Well, case closed I guess - that would be why I cant get decent coloured gear. But I hope I never see another post from a motorcyclist having a whinge about how a car didn't see them - even though they were wearing black clothes, on a dark coloured bike (which has a tiny profile compared with other vehicles), and probably had no headlight on. Dang stinkin' motorists.
I can only conclude that what you read doesnt seem to sink in,read it again slowly,not taking the piss at all but you have been given advice but seem hell bent on ignoring it.

[sAsLEX]

People identify shape and size before the identify colour and they most certainly don't view a motorcycle as the same sort of threat as a car or truck.


There is the argument that a black clad cruiser rider appears more menancing as they appear to the layman to be a gang member



nor will it convince the road workers in their hi-vis vests, or hunters wearing orange jackets.


With the amount of fluro orange on the roads these days with over coneing etc orange doesn't have as much impact as a splash or orange amongst a mainly green and brown background.

When you scan an intersection do you look left to right or right to left?
As this makes a big difference as to what you pick out!


Don't take any notice of Jim2, it's not personal, he's always like that.

What? Correct?

[hXc]

Corners.

10fcThanks mate. I did think of that, but wanted clarification.


So I can conclude from this thread that this motorcycle community doesn't think we should be doing everything possible to make ourselves seen? Well, case closed I guess - that would be why I cant get decent coloured gear. But I hope I never see another post from a motorcyclist having a whinge about how a car didn't see them - even though they were wearing black clothes, on a dark coloured bike (which has a tiny profile compared with other vehicles), and probably had no headlight on. Dang stinkin' motorists.

Dude...you came here asking a question about why our gear is black. You got answers. But the answers you got you don't like, so you conclude that we are all so retarded that we don't care about 'making ourselves seen'? The fact is, it doesn't matter what colour our gear is, car drivers still won't see us. And often it's not from lack of trying, but because of how our brains work. Get over yourself.

[James Deuce]

Most bikes have no headlight switch, so you can't turn them off. One of my bikes is bright orange, my helmet is red and white.

My other bike is Gun Metal gray. I can assure you that there is no difference in the frequency of near misses.

If you feel better wearing bright colours then do so. Feeling good when riding is better than looking good. A sound emotional state contributes more to your safety than your perceived visibility.

The stuff I am talking about has been studied at length by cleverer people than me and I can confirm their theories from 20 years of observations.

However I will say that your emotive responses confirm what has been a bugbear for some on this site for some time.

Young person/newish rider ask for advice. Gets an answer they don't like from an experienced rider who has made a bit of a study out of the issues surrounding motorcycling, and promptly starts denying that there is any validity to that answer.

People have been getting annoyed with me saying it is inevitable that those people will crash, get hurt, or add to the mounting body of evidence suggesting that bikes should be banned because they refuse to learn from others experiences.

The conclusion you should be drawing is; I must ride in a manner that maximises my personal comfort and safety at all times. I am for all intents and purposes invisible.

[scumdog]

I wear black cos tassled jackets seem to come only in black..


But a serious point: It absorbes the heat from the sun better than any other colour, on a cold winters day you tend to appreciate that aspect.:sweatdrop

[Maha]

Rumour has it that it's hiding somewhere pink...


Oh Shit!!!...around the front you mean?....:(

[Swoop]

PS: If anyone tries to convince me that black (a colour which reflects next to no light) is no more or less visible than blue or yellow (colours which reflect a lot more light), I know they're full of shit.
Do not forget about the background. Having a multi-coloured attire breaks up your shape or form, in comparison with a single colour (including but not limited to just black. An all-white set of leathers would do the same).

Part 2: So, if anyone tries to convince you of something (that may or may not be correct) they are automatically wrong?

Rumour has it that it's hiding somewhere pink...
Pink? That's a bit of a girly colour, don't you think?

[Ixion]

Black is the colour that best conceals dried blood

Actually, it's just a historic thing. Raw leather is usually a greyish brownish nondescript colour. Dyding it to bright clear colours is difficult requires a lot more processing than dying it all concealing black (the variations in the natural leather colour will make the dye colours blotchy). So coloured leather stock is significantly more expensive than black.

[98tls]

I wear black cos tassled jackets seem to come only in black..


But a serious point: It absorbes the heat from the sun better than any other colour, on a cold winters day you tend to appreciate that aspect.:sweatdrop And loathe it on hot west coast days,christ i couldnt wait to get mine off at woodstock.

[98tls]

Most bikes have no headlight switch, so you can't turn them off. One of my bikes is bright orange, my helmet is red and white.

My other bike is Gun Metal gray. I can assure you that there is no difference in the frequency of near misses.

If you feel better wearing bright colours then do so. Feeling good when riding is better than looking good. A sound emotional state contributes more to your safety than your perceived visibility.

The stuff I am talking about has been studied at length by cleverer people than me and I can confirm their theories from 20 years of observations.

However I will say that your emotive responses confirm what has been a bugbear for some on this site for some time.

Young person/newish rider ask for advice. Gets an answer they don't like from an experienced rider who has made a bit of a study out of the issues surrounding motorcycling, and promptly starts denying that there is any validity to that answer.

People have been getting annoyed with me saying it is inevitable that those people will crash, get hurt, or add to the mounting body of evidence suggesting that bikes should be banned because they refuse to learn from others experiences.

The conclusion you should be drawing is; I must ride in a manner that maximises my personal comfort and safety at all times. I am for all intents and purposes invisible. If that dosent sink in then i advise riding naked,fuck it nothing like saying "i do it my way"

[sAsLEX]

bla bla bla

What do you know? I suppose you will say the world is not flat and we are not the centre of the universe soon?

[James Deuce]

My mates at the Flat Earth Society would be disturbed to see me even admit I thought that heresy was an option.

[Ragingrob]

My point of view is that cagers don't exactly look and "not" see the black biker, they just don't look.

It's not a fact of what colours people see or don't see, it's whether they even look to see or not!

[McJim]

I was hit by a car at a junction once - I was wearing a high visibility vest at the time. I haven't worn it since and haven't been hit by a car but I'm prepared to believe that's just coincidence.:rofl:

Wear what makes you feel happy - I like red so I wear red - you might think that looks visible but you should see how black it is by the light of sodium lamps at nght.

Red goes with anything except green and if I ever got a Kwak I'd be butt fucked by a Gorilla before I would get a green one.:Pokey:

[Usarka]

So I can conclude from this thread that this motorcycle community doesn't think we should be doing everything possible to make ourselves seen?

First step to doing everything possible to stay safe is to be open to all the possiblities of what will kill you and what will save you. (tip, most of both of these are you)

Attitudes like this are the wrong approach:


Nothing will ever convince me that bright colours wont make a difference, nor will it convince the road workers in their hi-vis vests, or hunters wearing orange jackets.

Being closed minded about safety isn't the way to keep alive. Trying to understand as many different situations and anticipating them is a good start.

Granted high-vis is great for a lot of situations. I could spell out many where it isn't so good (as many here already have), and that black may be better, but you've said you won't listen.

Good luck!

[sAsLEX]

Red goes with anything except green

What you been smoking willis?

<img src=http://www.the-image-works.co.uk/images/bikes/castrol%20sp1.jpg>

<img src=http://www.gridgirls.biz/images/photos/thumbnails/castrol3_jpg.jpg>

[Horse]

I still agree with you though ... I wear viz gear because if it makes just 1% difference of being sen, then I'm nuts not to take that advantage

Actually the research suggests (http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/abstract/328/7444/857) that wearing hi-viz reduces your risk of being involved in an accident by 37%. For some reason people get upset when I mention it.

[McJim]

What you been smoking willis?

Ah but you forget young Grasshopper, I have neither SP nor nice titties. Fat bastards with greying hair can't realistically get away with a red jacket on a green bike....besides, there's a big horny Gorilla at the door - I need to pretend no one is home....

[jrandom]

Actually the research suggests (http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/abstract/328/7444/857) that wearing hi-viz reduces your risk of being involved in an accident by 37%.

Probably a confusion between correlation and causation.

It's been discussed here before; the sort of folk who'd be likely to wear hi-vis stuff are the sort of folk who are less likely to bin in the first place.

[MacD]

PS: If anyone tries to convince me that black (a colour which reflects next to no light) is no more or less visible than blue or yellow (colours which reflect a lot more light), I know they're full of shit.

I really wasn't going to bother again, but for one more time, vision is about contrast, not brightness. The human visual system can adapt over about 10e6 units of brightness, but is sensitive to as little as 1% contrast. A light object against a light background is just as hard to see as a dark object against a dark background. Patterns can produce camouflage effects.

Contrast and motion, two things that will help you be seen on a bike.

Black is fine as long as it in contrast with something else, like that bright headlight on the front of your bike.

Motion: move laterally in your lane when approaching an intersection. Motorists misjudge the distance and speed of approaching motorcyclists (called the time to arrival illusion), moving laterally helps improve that judgement and also causes something termed "popout" where an object can be found in a complex scene without active visual searching.

Guess I'm full of shit, or maybe you're making some unfounded assumptions?

[Horse]

It's been discussed here before; the sort of folk who'd be likely to wear hi-vis stuff are the sort of folk who are less likely to bin in the first place.

Gee, if only the researchers had thought of that. Foolish scientists:


The validity of our findings depends on the ability to control for confounding. In this study a wide range of potential confounders were measured and modelled in the multivariate analyses. Riders wearing high visibility clothing and white helmets are likely to be more safety conscious than other riders. However, we were able to adjust for sociodemographic variables, the propensity for risk taking behaviour (such as younger age, alcohol consumption, licence status, and motorcycle riding experience) and environmental characteristics (such as light conditions, weather, and speed limit zones).

[Kickaha]

After road riding for 29 years in nothing but black gear i fail to see the problem really,if your that bothered buy a flouro vest.......really.FWIW ride with your headlight on.

Only 20 years wearing black for me and the one accident I had it wouldn't have mattered if I had fluorescent flashing lights mounted on my head he still would have got me

I don't ride with my headlights on either, I do ride as though everyone is out to kill me though

[Highlander]

...
Guess I'm full of shit...

Try All Bran and Prunes.

[Hitcher]

Perhaps there should be a "Hoary Chestnut" thread...

[98tls]

Only 20 years wearing black for me and the one accident I had it wouldn't have mattered if I had fluorescent flashing lights mounted on my head he still would have got me

I don't ride with my headlights on either, I do ride as though everyone is out to kill me though No choice for me mate as the ole TLS came with them wired for on all the time,who knows it may have helped.

[skidMark]

I might add, does anyone else ever feel people come onto this website solely to disagree with other people's posts? The more time I spend here, the more true it seems to be. I really can't see why anyone would disagree that visibility is a good thing?


Visability is a good thing but the problem is you get into a state of mind that "Oh they have seen me."

Reality most likely is they have not, then you get nailed. Took 3 cars nailing me off before realising never ever assume they have seen you. They are all out to get you, is a good mentality to have.

3 knocked me off...one guy rammed me with his car nearly knocking me off. Then lied to police, thus i now have no license.

What goes around comes around though. :shifty:

Skid.

[Grub]

Actually the research suggests (http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/abstract/328/7444/857) that wearing hi-viz reduces your risk of being involved in an accident by 37%. For some reason people get upset when I mention it.

Well yeah ... this is KB. We know stuff ... we've been riding for a thousand years ... never had an accident ... I've already made up my mind ... etc etc

When really the reason is ..
" ... not on your life, only queers and mommy's boys wear those things .... I'm a biker FFS, I wear black! ..."

Don't worry, these same arguments were all trotted out over wearing
- seatbelts
- crash helmets
- pushbike helmets

Ya can't let science get in the way of a good closed mind

[James Deuce]

Science funded by a company with a financial stake in proving a point isn't science.

The stuff I was using was from research into the effects of motion camouflage on visibility of motorcyclists and trains. They are both afflicted by the same problem in that they appear to be motionless in regard to the background until they are almost on top of you. Trains because they are so big in relation to the background and bikes because they are so small.

Grub, you know I've been fucked up by accidents BIG time. I'm relaying my experience, on top of the research of scientists who aren't looking at product specific research funding.

Visibility had everything and nothing to do with my accidents and in none of the injury accidents I've had was I doing anything illegal or stupid from a legal perspective for any blame to be pinned on me.

I struggle with your attitude, I really do.

[Grub]

Perhaps there should be a "Hoary Chestnut" thread...

... and to be perfectly balanced a "Whorey Chestnutess" one as well

[Grub]

Science funded by a company with a financial stake in proving a point isn't science..

Discrediting Research 101:
- Attack the methodology
- Attack the integrity
- Attack the sample selection
... if all else fails ...
- Attack the researcher

[sAsLEX]

Well yeah ... this is KB. We know stuff ... we've been riding for a thousand years ... never had an accident ... I've already made up my mind ... etc etc

When really the reason is ..
" ... not on your life, only queers and mommy's boys wear those things .... I'm a biker FFS, I wear black! ..."

Don't worry, these same arguments were all trotted out over wearing
- seatbelts
- crash helmets
- pushbike helmets

Ya can't let science get in the way of a good closed mind

Resaearch has proven higher speeds on open roads reduce crashes and injuries.............. you think that will ever be publicised here?

[Hitcher]

... and to be perfectly balanced a "Whorey Chestnutess" one as well

I am perfectly balanced: I have chips on both shoulders.

[Grub]

I struggle with your attitude, I really do.

And me yours ... but only because like the OP says, why not take every opportunity, no matter how small and insignificant, to raise your visibility.

It doesn't matter how much you hate the idea personally, or think it's all bunkum, if there's any chance at all at all then it can't be a Bad Idea.

It's already been conceded that to rely on being seen is just plain dumb ... and it will hurt you.

[Grub]

Resaearch has proven higher speeds on open roads reduce crashes and injuries.............. you think that will ever be publicised here?

You serious? Can I have a copy please I want to carry it in my wallet for the next time I get stopped.

[sAsLEX]

You serious? Can I have a copy please I want to carry it in my wallet for the next time I get stopped.

Dont think it will work.


But you can research and find any result you wish.


Lies , Damned lies and statistics.......... except the higher speed one is correct after they raised the interstate limits in some states in the states....

[98tls]

After 30 years of devoting my weekends to disproving the theory that ugly people become beautiful people after 13.5 woodstocks i have to be honest and say yes without doubt they do.Ive come to this conclusion without once wearing hi-vis riding gear.

[scracha]

Is it purely a cultural thing, that morocyclists refuse to wear stuff that isn't black?

Hmm...funny you mention that. I noticed that the majority of bikers here wear black. Certainly a far higher percentage than in Eurotrashville.

[98tls]

Just occured to me that maybe its just plain safer to waffle on the interweb about riding than it is to wear the right coloured gear.:beer:

[Horse]

Science funded by a company with a financial stake in proving a point isn't science.
Que? Which one of University of Auckland, University of Sydney, University of Otago have a "financial stake in proving a point"?

[Horse]

But you can research and find any result you wish.

Actually you can't. I mean, it's a common tactic to counter research you disagree with by saying "all research can be fudged" but if that was fundamentally true you wouldn't have those nice shiny motorbikes to ride. And you'd have died at age 4 from some kind of nasty disease.

The awful truth is that science actually works. Even the stuff you disagree with.

[Grub]

Resaearch has proven higher speeds on open roads reduce crashes and injuries..............

Actually I dispute their methodology, their integrity, their sample selection and the motives of the researcher(s)

[Bullitt]

For anyone that hasnt seen my Jacket its about half blue (not sky blue but alot lighter than navy) and half black. Yet see the attached pic where youd think it was totally black. Short of wearing entirely fluro Im not sure it would really make that much difference.

Ive seen research before that bike colour didnt have an impact on crash stats, and the bike is alot more dominant in the front view than I am. (And the front view is by far the most likely one for a car to not see you in then hit you)

While in an ideal world everyone would wear high vis vests its not gonna happen and I wont be doing it any time soon. Well done the companies that make bright coloured stuff though for those who want it though.

[twotyred]

If brightness made much of a difference then we'd never have cars turning in front of us when we've got our bright,modern headlights blazeing... but they still say ".. I didn't see you..." ?:bash:

[HungusMaximist]

To be honest, I wear coloured gear because I like colours and that it matches my bike.

If you want visibility, wear a fluro yellow HI-VIS vest, but that still doesn't mean you can lax off your riding.

Still expect every car out there is trying to run you over..

[Dodger]

Black - It hides the dirt.
In fact my gear is getting blacker by the day :)

[GaZBur]

All my gear is black. I wear black for several reasons and none of it is to look cool or menacing.


Most second hand leathers are black
Black leather is easy to nuggat over the scrapes when you come off (again)
Bright coloured leathers apparently make you look like a power ranger (whatever that is)
Black is a colour that doesn't go out of fashion
Black is a colour that doesn't show oil or blood stains
Black doesn't make my ass look big (after all it's important to consider what people see when you pass them)


When I actually wanted to buy a blue helmet to match the colour of my bike - it did'nt fit with my glasses on. But they had a black one that did!!

[Swoop]

Bright coloured leathers apparently make you look like a power ranger (whatever that is)


Or like a toothpaste tube...

[Blue Velvet]

Black is a very flattering, slimming (absence of) colour.

[Pwalo]

It's usually the cheapest option for decent gear, especially helmets. Not that I'm cheap now.

[The Pastor]

i were black because im a bad ass.

my bike dosent have usd forks so im only 2/3rds bad ass.

[Nagash]

Just get a fluro vest? I think I saw them at the $2 shop. Sorted.

All my leathers are black, makes me look tough on my bright yellow bike.

I reckon that your own body is so small compared to everything else on the road that colour of leathers really don't make a difference, atleast not a difference that equals the added expense of coloured leathers.

[slimjim]

well my dad's hand me down jacket while he was riding was his dad's bomber jacket, that was standard issuse to him while in the airforce, and when i started riding back in the early seventies ,my dad passed it on to me,and fuck it weighed a ton, yup i too now have upgaded and still wear black , as i feel that if the sun is ever too low behind me ,while i'm riding i'll prefer to cast a black spot and hope it cause's a cager to take a double look ,at a black object, rather than take a flash of colour, as a eye flash and ingore and pull out ' yup even handed dad back his father's jacket, still without road damage ,

[Atlas]

The advantage of black or any dark colours is that with bugs, road grime and scrapes, bright leathers look crappy very quickly. Nothing wrong with flouro vests or lights on, not that they really help, car drivers need to first be looking to see you and from my experience (hit by 3 cars in 25 years of riding) they rarely do.
If you spend much time riding, dark colours are the go. If looking for gear I'm more interested in the body armour, keeping warm and dry and for summer ventilation. A high vis vest will do the rest and is easy to get washed. Function over style is the key, will it help save your ass when your down the road?

[McJim]

I've taken some of the advice on this thread and have dressed accordingly for my ride this evening.

Will I be safe now?:rofl: My legs and feet are so white they can be seen from outer space!

[hXc]

I've taken some of the advice on this thread and have dressed accordingly for my ride this evening.

Will I be safe now?:rofl: My legs and feet are so white they can be seen from outer space!Just got to get the Samoan safety shoes and you'll be fine. Oh, and a hi-vis vest.

[McJim]

Just got to get the Samoan safety shoes and you'll be fine. Oh, and a hi-vis vest.

I'm so hard I don't even need Jandals.

[Aero165]

So here's an obvious question that needs asking - why is all our gear the same colour as the road? Why spend hunreds, or even thousands, buying expensive motorcycle gear with the sole purpose of trying to be safe - but ironically, all this same gear is black in colour, making is near invisible in certain conditions.

Why isn't there more gear available that's fashionable and brightly coloured? I saw this video a little while ago (http://youtube.com/watch?v=kh2U2O6_m50), which made me wonder why this type of gear isn't more widely available. I'd love to own motorcycle clothing like this, but simply cannot find it. Is it purely a cultural thing, that morocyclists refuse to wear stuff that isn't black?

Here's a pic of my new gear! Not so much black as it is black an white!!

[madandy]

So I can conclude from this thread that this motorcycle community doesn't think we should be doing everything possible to make ourselves seen? Well, case closed I guess - that would be why I cant get decent coloured gear. But I hope I never see another post from a motorcyclist having a whinge about how a car didn't see them - even though they were wearing black clothes, on a dark coloured bike (which has a tiny profile compared with other vehicles), and probably had no headlight on. Dang stinkin' motorists.

I ride a big(ish) sport bike - The light is always on, sometimes full beam. Its bright red & white. My helmet is similarly coloured. My Bright Blue & White jacket & pant make me no more or less frequently unseen than when I wore mostly black.
I've seen people pull out in front of my old mans big red Volvo stock truck too...:woohoo: splat :shit:

Don't mean to e rude but seeing as you're on a SR250 are you new to riding? If so you'll soon learn most KBer & probably all of the above KBers really do value safety but you'll also learn even a big bright flashing light on your noggin aint gonna stop the odd plonker from forcing you to pratice emergency manouvers.

ride safe
Andy

[madandy]

McJim, your smile alone should ensure your safety :D

[Trudes]

I've taken some of the advice on this thread and have dressed accordingly for my ride this evening.

Will I be safe now?:rofl: My legs and feet are so white they can be seen from outer space!

hehehe, you crack me up Mr. Mc-whiter-than-white-legs-Jim, naughty mate, naughty... All The Gear, All the Time!! :spanking:LOL

[chester]

Here's a pic of my new gear! Not so much black as it is black an white!!
Attached Thumbnails

__________________
Oh.... Aw, mum look!


Do you always wear ya gear in th bedroom and ask for mum:confused:

[Usarka]

I've taken some of the advice on this thread and have dressed accordingly for my ride this evening.

Will I be safe now?:rofl: My legs and feet are so white they can be seen from outer space!

Irresponsible behaviour! People like you make my ACC premiums go up! :angry2:

[McJim]

Irresponsible behaviour! People like you make my ACC premiums go up! :angry2:

Awww Shut the fuck up! :Pokey:

[trump-lady]

I wear pink
I wear baby blue
I hate wearing all black
I am very disapointed with NZ clothing for women and will always buy my gear from overseas

I never follow the crowd
Cept on rides cause I always get lost :)

[janno]

I wear pink
I wear baby blue
I hate wearing all black

Actually the whole pink and baby blue girlies gear really gets on my tits.

I mean, COME ON!! Not all girls are blond or milky skinned . . .

It's fine if you actually suit those colours, as I'm sure you do trump lady, but as a freckled, auburn haired person they make my skin look the same shade as a baboon's arse (with freckles) - red!!

Ideally I'd like gear in a rich, bricky red (not blue based) or else a lime green leather jacket, or cobalt blue . . .

So I've got all black by default. If ever I get to the states, I'm going gear shopping. They have such a cool range for women available over there . . . no I don't have the money to order stuff in and risk it not fitting. So I'll just bitch and moan and wear black instead. :laugh:

[Swoop]

Looks like McJim is riding with his eyes closed in pic#1. Those legs must be seriously white!

[The Stranger]

So here's an obvious question that needs asking - why is all our gear the same colour as the road? Why spend hunreds, or even thousands, buying expensive motorcycle gear with the sole purpose of trying to be safe - but ironically, all this same gear is black in colour, making is near invisible in certain conditions.

Is it purely a cultural thing, that morocyclists refuse to wear stuff that isn't black?

I wear black for cultural reasons.
The culture being, you don't fuck with someone who is 6'2" and wearing black leathers and a black helmet. This cultural issue makes me a lot more visible to car drivers.

[Hitcher]

The highway's jammed with broken heroes on a last chance power drive
Everybody's out on the run tonight
but there's no place left to hide.

[trump-lady]

Actually the whole pink and baby blue girlies gear really gets on my tits.

I mean, COME ON!! Not all girls are blond or milky skinned . . .

It's fine if you actually suit those colours, as I'm sure you do trump lady, but as a freckled, auburn haired person they make my skin look the same shade as a baboon's arse (with freckles) - red!!

Ideally I'd like gear in a rich, bricky red (not blue based) or else a lime green leather jacket, or cobalt blue . . .

So I've got all black by default. If ever I get to the states, I'm going gear shopping. They have such a cool range for women available over there . . . no I don't have the money to order stuff in and risk it not fitting. So I'll just bitch and moan and wear black instead. :laugh:

Agreed!
The only reason I have em is because of when I lived in the USA otherwise Id be in black. Options here are limited for women and thats because we dont have the numbers for retailers to line their shelves with options.
PS im not blonde or milky skinned and not sure if my leathers suits me but its my world hehehe but like you said those colours wouldnt suit you... Id look like funny in lime green me thinks. Beside lime green and a pink bike....hmmmmmm

Like you, I am now in NZ where its fucking hard to get ahead let alone fork over 1000 for gear that might not fit when it gets here......

so I better stop getting fatter cause my leathers are getting tight and Ill be crying and bitching and wearing black too!

[trump-lady]

hmmm can I add there is something very hot about a guy on a sportsbike coordinated with clothing that is not black.
Cruisers on the other hand would look retarded with matching gear
haha even the visual makes me laugh

[scumdog]

I've taken some of the advice on this thread and have dressed accordingly for my ride this evening.

Will I be safe now?:rofl: My legs and feet are so white they can be seen from outer space!


How come your bike doesn't blur the background like mine does when riding sans ATGATT??

[Okey Dokey]

I hesitate to add to an already long thread, but I will!

Hope you are getting leather. It is an investment so it's worth getting what you want. I got my red/grey/black leathers by fax/telephone from the UK 10 years ago. One of the best decisions I've ever made.

I'm a standard sort of size, so the salesman was able to indicate what the equivalent Italian size would be. If you can't find what you want here, look overseas and follow the advice. Good salespeople know their range.

After years of use, they still look as good as new, bar a little rubbing where the fly seam touches the tank. I have every expectation they will continue to last well into the future. The extra cost over basic black is negligible over the years. My husband has come off in his leathers but they don't look scruffy and are still usable.

I deliberately wanted a non-menacing look, and have had lots of comments from non-bikers who like them. But at the end of the day, who really cares as long as you like what you've got.

I never thought about "matching" my bike in colour. I'm not a racer with sponsorship after all. I think sport style leathers are a natural match on a faired bike, and I guess multicolours could look odd on a cruiser. But again, get what you want!

[Blue Velvet]

I wear black for cultural reasons... This cultural issue makes me a lot more visible to car drivers.

:2thumbsup

[Biggles2000]

I can't-won't dress like a "power ranger".

[Number One]

Agreed! Options here are limited for women and thats because we dont have the numbers for retailers to line their shelves with options.
PS im not blonde or milky skinned

Crikey yes! I am addicted to black and as a rule decided that I would try to be more visible on the road.

So of course I purchased a silver bike :doh: preceeded to get black pants...cos I just don't have the legs for white :confused: and got myself a jacket that I would best describe as a 'compromise' between plain black and garish baby pink or blue.

Nice jacket actually really happy wif it...Ixon Nirvana...can even kinda stand the embroidered flowers on the neck and one sholder...:oi-grr: Man that sounds bad but they are pretty subtle...even though they are in sparkly pinky fushia thread....oh dear :laugh:

Here's a review and piccie...and yes I am always interested in 'preserving my femininity' LMAO!
http://www.bikersweb.co.uk/Features/ProductReviews.aspx?ArticleId=180

1 downer - not enough pockets and no zipper airflow vent do dads.

[Aero165]

Here's a pic of my new gear! Not so much black as it is black an white!!
Attached Thumbnails

__________________
Oh.... Aw, mum look!


Do you always wear ya gear in th bedroom and ask for mum:confused:

I had just bought the gear:headbang:. You retard.

[Ragingrob]

Well my gf just bought one of those bright pink cordura jackets haha, so we'll see if people see her or not!

[AllanB]

Its not that long ago that bikes leaked oil everywhere (Thanks Honda for stopping this) and black was -well practical for this type of grime etc.

All my gear is black except my helmet - bike black as well - I always go for a coloiured patterned helmet as even I find a black helmeted rider hard to see sometimes. Bright helmets are the most visible indication of a rider in my books - for the anal note that I say in 'my books' and I have no other research to back this up :niceone:

Also black is well ...... hard arse (unless you are at the blue oyster then watch ya arse).

[Hinny]

[QUOTE=MacD;1409826] vision is about contrast, not brightness. The human visual system can adapt over about 10e6 units of brightness, but is sensitive to as little as 1% contrast.

A black flag is more visible in low light conditions than a day-glo fluorescent one. Learned from commercial long liner. Light coloured flags have high reflective values but 90% of fuck all doesn't amount to much. It becomes a case of notice by exception with the black.

[Hinny]

as a freckled, auburn haired person ...
I've got all black . . . :

And I've seen you at the corners and cafes it seems.
Red hair and black leather, my favourite colour scheme.

Vincent Black Lightning 1952
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tF61W7SGNxU&feature=related

[Mikkel]

Science funded by a company with a financial stake in proving a point isn't science.

It can be. But the conclusions should always taken with a grain of salt. If it smells too much of gland hugging - disregard it.


Hmm...funny you mention that. I noticed that the majority of bikers here wear black. Certainly a far higher percentage than in Eurotrashville.

Well, with the NZ market being fairly limited the stores don't take stock in, in colours that doesn't sell as well. So when black is the biggest seller they don't leave you much choice - except if you're willing to wait for a couple of weeks to have it shipped from overseas.


A black flag is more visible in low light conditions than a day-glo fluorescent one. Learned from commercial long liner. Light coloured flags have high reflective values but 90% of fuck all doesn't amount to much. It becomes a case of notice by exception with the black.

Indeed - black is by no means good camoflage. Contrary to popular belief - even night cameoflage is not black but a medium dark grey (yes, that goes for ninjas as well (not the bikes, stupid)).

Further more - most roads (except for the proper asphalt ones that we don't have many of around here or after rain) are not even close to being black. Black against a grey background actually stands out rather well. If you're going to complain about a colour for riding gear it should be silver or grey as that really matches fog...

And besides - how often do you actually look down onto a biker. Not that often I'd assume and then I guess matching the road surface also becomes quite irrelevant.

[Bonez]

I've taken some of the advice on this thread and have dressed accordingly for my ride this evening.

Will I be safe now?:rofl: My legs and feet are so white they can be seen from outer space!Nice looking pocket bike you have there.

[Hawkeye]

signiture ....

[n0regret5]

i find having two brothers pipes on my bike tends to help with visibility..though i must admit you're right about the black leather thing. i actually had a conversation with a co-worker a few days about this exact topic..hes just gotten back into riding after a 20-odd year hiatus (hes a good old chap, late 60's) and the only coloured gear he could find was the chicks gear and only in cordura/not leather..i have just bought a new jacket, old dririder beast thing and while its largely black there is a fair bit of red and white detail to it (TL is that awesome red colour) and it seems that more people notice me on the road.
maybe its time all the tough-ass harley riding wannabe leathers to make a quiet step off the runway..much like the Motor Company should..hah!

on a far more annoying note, i'm gonna be stripping down my TLs (look out for stuff for sale) to make a streetfighter and painting it satin black..:-D

[n0regret5]

[/QUOTE]Indeed - black is by no means good camoflage. Contrary to popular belief - even night cameoflage is not black but a medium dark grey (yes, that goes for ninjas as well (not the bikes, stupid)).[/QUOTE]

interesting factoid! thanks for this (i'm brilliant for knowing shit you didn't know, telling you, frustrating you and thusly entertaining myself) ninjas all used to wear dark red outfits as they would blend with the foliage, woodwork and stonework, and to hide the blood if they were hit/stabbed/cut/woman. all karate, judo and aikido uniforms were the same until the early 60's when the current ruling whatever decreed it was better to have white uniforms. bastards!

and now you know. pass this on to annoy someone else!

[enigma51]

Im sorry but all the guys in the thread is gay who gives a shit what color your gear is as long as does the job when you sliding down the road

[Jiminy]

Certainly a repost, but I like this link:
http://www.rideforever.co.nz/gear_up/visibility.html

If you get bumped by a car, say, once every five years (purely random number), then wearing bright colors will probably only change it to once every six or seven years. It is a significant difference, but not significant enough for you to notice it on every single ride. And of course, you might wear black and not crash for your entire life. Stats show tendencies, but don't predict the outcome for each individual.

I personlly find it re-assuring and cooler to wear a Quasi black-blue-gray jacket and a helmet with patterns instead of all black, but that doesn't prevent me to feel naked on the bike and to look all around like no one has seen me (or every one wants to kill). And sitting straight on a no-fairing no-windscreen cruiser, my jacket probably makes more difference than 'frogged' on a all-fairing sport bike. However, I don't feel that it makes enough difference for me to wear a high-vis vest and a white helmet.

What I *DO* find sad howevr is that some shops keep selling full black gear sets to beginners while rideforever.co.nz, RoadSafe (and probably other instructors), the road code and other bodies or sources of information recommend you to wear colored gear (especially a non black helmet). I believe colored gear is even more important in your first year(s) of riding until you have learned to read the traffic.

[McJim]

Nice looking pocket bike you have there.

Awww shucks - that's just a polite way of saying 'Oi McJim, you're a fat git!' :rofl:

Chur.

[sAsLEX]

signiture ....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/7190107.stm

[Mikkel]

What I *DO* find sad howevr is that some shops keep selling full black gear sets to beginners while rideforever.co.nz, RoadSafe (and probably other instructors), the road code and other bodies or sources of information recommend you to wear colored gear (especially a non black helmet). I believe colored gear is even more important in your first year(s) of riding until you have learned to read the traffic.

I thought this was a biker site and therefore pretty much PC immune.

Wake up, there's no conclusive evidence that brighter colour will make you *more* visible in most traffic situations.

And ironically, not all learners are NEW to traffic...

[Patar]

Everything you said here is true, except the first four words. Nothing will ever convince me that bright colours wont make a difference, nor will it convince the road workers in their hi-vis vests, or hunters wearing orange jackets. We emphasize greatly safety and visibility, and spend thousands keeping ourselves safe, then we wear the worst possible colour for the purpose. It's nothing short of senseless.

People wear these "bright" colours to stand out. These neon colours create a contrast to the background that they are in.
Coloured motorcycle gear does not come in neon (some have reflective strips, as my jacket does around the shoulders), it comes in normal colours that you are likely to find on buildings and all around indutrialised areas, and hence the colours do not contrast with the background.

Colour may help but not as much as people make out.

[BiK3RChiK]

And ironically, not all learners are NEW to traffic...

Heh! Like I've had my car licence for almost 25 years but I've only just my motorbike licence... I wouldn't say I'm new to traffic!!

Good point! +1

[Hawkeye]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/7190107.stm

Yeah! I've seen that before. They don't make leathers in that stuff so looks like I'm stuck with black.

[Subike]

I guess That I must be colour blind or somthing
But
Having read this thread and others like it
I have taken notice of the colour of any bike that approaches me when out driving, riding, walking, whatever
Everyone approching me looks Black untill side on.
Harleys are the easiest to see with the high crome content , and sprot bikes the worst, dont understand that.
But all the riders look black , or in a shadow, and their colour only becomes apparrent from the side or the back. Including the colour of the bike. This is straight on not side on
Even a high vis vest from the front tends to be in a shadow and appear black.

So my personal opinion, what ever you think as the colour for your riding gear,lots of crome and bright yellow side lights.

Black is easier to keep clean and repaired as well.

[Jiminy]

I thought this was a biker site and therefore pretty much PC immune.

Wake up, there's no conclusive evidence that brighter colour will make you *more* visible in most traffic situations.

And ironically, not all learners are NEW to traffic...

Nothing to do with PC, just my opinion. The 'PC hunt' should not prevent anyone from having an opinion.

I had been driving cars for 15 years and had used push bikes around town for pretty much that long before getting a bike. Sure I was experienced with traffic, but things still felt different on a motorbike.

My issue is that the offer in some shops contradicts what everyone else tells you as a learner before walking into the said shop. Now either we all agree that the research is bullshit and stop telling new bikers to wear some sorts of colors, or some shops would be well advised to offer choices in their beginner sets. In my case, I find the research on the topic very conclusive and walked away from the shop to buy my all of my gear some place there.

From my understanding reading the research, the actual gain of wearing colors is small enough that you won't even perceive it in any single ride, it's on the sum of all rides that you see a trend appearing. It was sufficient for ME to choose a patterned helmet and a jacket with some sort of colors. I am NOT wearing a white helmet and a high viz vest because I find it over the top for ME. What YOU wear is none of my business, I never implied anything about what YOU should wear.

I'd be keen to hear the opinion of those who give motorbike safety courses (RoadSafe?). What do you think, and if you mention the color issue in your course, why?

[Mikkel]

Heh! Like I've had my car licence for almost 25 years but I've only just my motorbike licence... I wouldn't say I'm new to traffic!!

Good point! +1

Can't claim 25 years... not even close. Still 8 years is enough to feel ridiculed by the learners period!


I had been driving cars for 15 years and had used push bikes around town for pretty much that long before getting a bike. Sure I was experienced with traffic, but things still felt different on a motorbike.


Indeed it's different. As has been said - as a first rule assume you're invisible to other roadusers. The colour you wear shouldn't affect that.


From my understanding reading the research, the actual gain of wearing colors is small enough that you won't even perceive it in any single ride, it's on the sum of all rides that you see a trend appearing. It was sufficient for ME to choose a patterned helmet and a jacket with some sort of colors. I am NOT wearing a white helmet and a high viz vest because I find it over the top for ME. What YOU wear is none of my business, I never implied anything about what YOU should wear.

Good point. My general experience with KB is that that is a prudent approach because if you try and tell anyone how to do something be ready to be flamed.

Black isn't a bad colour - in fact it's a badass colour ;)

[moT]

Wearing black leathers makes you instantly ride like a pro!!! and it adds about 50hp EXTRA ON YOUR BIKE!!!!:shit: But dont worry it gets better if the leathers are 2 tone with another cool colour it will also increase your laptimes by 10% every lap... i shit you not!!

[Mikkel]

But dont worry it gets better if the leathers are 2 tone with another cool colour it will also increase your laptimes by 10% every lap... i shit you not!!

Yeah - fuck those bastards who think it's about having the lowest laptimes... They got it WRONG!

:lol:

[Atlas]

If people really care about being seen, buy a hi vis vest, if not don't bother. I personally don't think it makes an ounce of difference, but it might just stop the boys in blue pulling you over for a lecture.

Leather gear with full body armour is the best option and any colour other than black becomes black over time. I'm not averse to the odd reflective strip or colours on my riding gear, but honestly a bright jacket won't save your skin, but a spine protector and some body armour might...

Having been hit by 3 cars in 25 years of riding, if the driver is looking the other way, or makes judgemental errors about driving, it doesnt matter what you look like.:doh:

[BiK3RChiK]

Can't claim 25 years... not even close. Still 8 years is enough to feel ridiculed by the learners period!



Indeed it's different. As has been said - as a first rule assume you're invisible to other roadusers. The colour you wear shouldn't affect that.





Black isn't a bad colour - in fact it's a badass colour ;)

Actually, black isn't technically a colour is it? It is devoid of all colour.

I don't feel ridiculed by the learners process as much as a little insulted!

M

[Mikkel]

Actually, black isn't technically a colour is it? It is devoid of all colour.

Well, it's as much a colour as white then... guess you could call it an achromatic colour. Funny how you can have a shiny black surface isn't it?



I don't feel ridiculed by the learners process as much as a little insulted!


I try and not let it get too much to me. But I can't pretend I'm not seeing it :(

[discotex]

I wear black to make the paint job on my bike stand out :headbang:

[H00dz]

They say that black is slimming.....So when you have custom gear size 9xl like me you need to believe shit like this:niceone:

[discotex]

I thought this was a biker site and therefore pretty much PC immune.


Bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahha :eek:

[JustTrix400]

I have a yellow and white jacket which I got of ebay and ride a yellow CB400. When I was first learning to ride I put on a Hi-Vis although I don't think that helped much. I have seen pink, blue and red jackets in the Joe Rocket range. Spidi put out a black/red and Dionese have a whole black/red/blue/white range too. I thought they made black bike gear to hide the blood stains!!!

[slydesigns]

PS: If anyone tries to convince me that black (a colour which reflects next to no light) is no more or less visible than blue or yellow (colours which reflect a lot more light), I know they're full of shit.

Then I guess the worlds military are "full of shit" as you so eloquently put it. Black is one of the FEW colours not considered natural and thus is easily spotted when soldiers are trying to conceal themselves and their equipment.
Hence why front line weapons are NOT black nowadays, neither are boots etc. And before you ask, I'm speaking form 10 years service experience including operations and not plucking it out of my butt as some of the other "facts" in this thread have been.

Fact one. You see in black and white at night. Fact

Fact two. The colour receptive nerves (cones) in your eyes are concentrated to the centre of your eyes retina and are inefficient in darkness.

Fact three. The main stay of your eyes nerves are the black and white receptors (rods) which work in low light better than the cones and are located on the periphery of your eyes retina.

This is why in darkness you are blind directly in front of you yet if you turn your head side on or look to the side of an object it appears much clearer.

Test the theory yourself at night. It takes 20mins for the cones to shut down fully and the rods to take over. Then try the test.

Fact four. At range, you see shape, movement and CONTRAST but not colour.

Colour IS good, but its a minor part of the equation for being detected. Contrast and shape play a much bigger part.

With the threads Author's views in mind... why would anyone ride a naked bike like his SR? Would hi colour fairings, paint and graphics be the better option than a chrome finish that reflects its surroundings and blends in as well as masking movement? IF you were that worried that is?

[lanci]

Cause it's fucken tough looking!

[sAsLEX]

Black is one of the FEW colours not considered natural and thus is easily spotted when soldiers are trying to conceal themselves and their equipment.
<img src=http://www.ghillie-suits.org/images/ghillie-suits-3.jpg>

Hence why front line weapons are NOT black nowadays, neither are boots etc.


Yes they are....... but we don't really need to hide on ship.

[homer]

Bright colours don't help. Some light colours blend you into a confusing background and help motion camouflage convince drivers you aren't really there. People identify shape and size before the identify colour and they most certainly don't view a motorcycle as the same sort of threat as a car or truck.

Wearing bright colours to make you more visible should be secondary to riding like you are invisible.

I answer to your question: Leather is either black or brown for most commercial clothing applications. Post war motorcyclists wore black because it made them look more menacing. It is now the core fashion in motorcycle clothing.

Black also goes with anything. Matching leathers or cordura to your current bike goes horribly wrong when you change from a lime green Kawasaki to a mostly red Honda.


Thats so true

grey cages blend in with the road,

White cars blend in with shop fronts

[Subike]

Then I guess the worlds military are "full of shit" as you so eloquently put it. Black is one of the FEW colours not considered natural and thus is easily spotted when soldiers are trying to conceal themselves and their equipment.
Hence why front line weapons are NOT black nowadays, neither are boots etc. And before you ask, I'm speaking form 10 years service experience including operations and not plucking it out of my butt as some of the other "facts" in this thread have been.

Fact one. You see in black and white at night. Fact

Fact two. The colour receptive nerves (cones) in your eyes are concentrated to the centre of your eyes retina and are inefficient in darkness.

Fact three. The main stay of your eyes nerves are the black and white receptors (rods) which work in low light better than the cones and are located on the periphery of your eyes retina.

This is why in darkness you are blind directly in front of you yet if you turn your head side on or look to the side of an object it appears much clearer.

Test the theory yourself at night. It takes 20mins for the cones to shut down fully and the rods to take over. Then try the test.

Fact four. At range, you see shape, movement and CONTRAST but not colour.

Colour IS good, but its a minor part of the equation for being detected. Contrast and shape play a much bigger part.

With the threads Author's views in mind... why would anyone ride a naked bike like his SR? Would hi colour fairings, paint and graphics be the better option than a chrome finish that reflects its surroundings and blends in as well as masking movement? IF you were that worried that is?



So anything , that was Black, Gloss or Matt Black,would stand out if it was moving across a night time back ground, Where as a rainbow spectrum coloured object would be harder to spot, as opposed to a white object which be blatently visibile. The black being the extreeme opposite to the white. Stark Contrast, MMmmmm interesting thinking


Good point on the crome reflections too, Be about the same as Polished alloy and stainless steel.

[Mikkel]

Yes they are....... but we don't really need to hide on ship.

Navy ships are not black though... But yes, camoflage for sidearms on a ship is pretty redundant.


So anything , that was Black, Gloss or Matt Black,would stand out if it was moving across a night time back ground, Where as a rainbow spectrum coloured object would be harder to spot, as opposed to a white object which be blatently visibile. The black being the extreeme opposite to the white. Stark Contrast, MMmmmm interesting thinking


Good point on the crome reflections too, Be about the same as Polished alloy and stainless steel.

U is doing it rong!

If there is no light colours become totally irrelevant. If there is only a little light a solid colour is easier to spot than something that has patterns of varying colour.
Also, you spot things that either reflect OR absorb colour easier in the dark. You "sense" a field that has another light level - the larger that field is the easier it is to pick-up.

How low-light and biker clothing colour relates I fail to see - unless you insist on riding with your lights off at night. In which case I think you should worry about something else than the colour of your riding gear.

[ukusa]

Black also goes with anything. Matching leathers or cordura to your current bike goes horribly wrong when you change from a lime green Kawasaki to a mostly red Honda.

It's like the little black dress that chicks wear, looks good on (almost) anything :laugh:

[Hinny]

Black isn't a bad colour - in fact it's a badass colour ;)

A girl friend always asks me "what are you wearing" when she calls.
If I reply "Black leather" she makes a sort of moaning sound.
Could this be because she thinks it makes my ass look bad?

[Mikkel]

A girl friend always asks me "what are you wearing" when she calls.
If I reply "Black leather" she makes a sort of moaning sound.
Could this be because she thinks it makes my ass look bad?

Mate, you need to turn that situation around - QUICKLY!

It's a male prerogative to ask seedy questions like that - and preferably to girls too young and innocent to fully comprehend the entailed dodginess! :yes:

[Mr Merde]

.... Nothing will ever convince me that bright colours wont make a difference, nor will it convince the road workers in their hi-vis vests, or hunters wearing orange jackets. ....

I spent a number of years in the UK working as bike courier on inter city trips. The only time I had any really serious tussles with traffic was one day when riding my ZZR1100 in bright purple and blue with my headlights blazing and my bright flouro yellow jacket on. Car didnt see me and wrote the bike off.

As to hunter with the orange jackets. Not the safest colour in the NZ bush. The safest colour would be skyblue as in the Nato berets but we arent allowed to wear that. Some of the deer here have an underbelly collour that is very similar to the bright orange they sell for visibiolity.

After years riding bikes in all sorts of kit in all sorts of colours I am back to wearing black. Maybe other road users have been desensitised to colours with the multitude of diferent vehicles on the road. In my mind they will notice a black space as much as a colour.

The absence of colour stands out just as much as flouro coloured gear.

[Radar]

I might add, does anyone else ever feel people come onto this website solely to disagree with other people's posts? The more time I spend here, the more true it seems to be. I really can't see why anyone would disagree that visibility is a good thing?

SoulTrader makes a good observation. Indeed, why to people disagree with solid facts? My take on this question is that some people make a conclusion based on emotions, hearsay, shallow opinions, or something other than rationality. Try this on for size:

Research on motorbike accidents:
http://www.cs.wisc.edu/%7Ejohn/vfr/hurt.html

"The failure of motorists to detect and recognize motorcycles in traffic is the predominating cause of motorcycle accidents. ...Conspicuity [easily visible] of the motorcycle is a critical factor in the multiple vehicle accidents, and accident involvement is significantly reduced by the use of motorcycle headlamps (on in daylight) and the wearing of high visibility yellow, orange or bright red jackets."

Just in case you want to trash this research, here is where it comes from:
The "Motorcycle Accident Cause Factors and Identification of Countermeasures," is a study conducted by the University of Southern California (USC). With funds from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, researcher Harry Hurt investigated almost every aspect of 900 motorcycle accidents in the Los Angeles area. Additionally, Hurt and his staff analyzed 3,600 motorcycle traffic accident reports in the same geographic area.

[Ducman]

To answer the original question on why black? It's the easiest and cheapest colour to dye leather. That or leave it the natural brown.

[Lucy]

I drove to Wellington in a van last Thursday night, and must have seen over a hundred motorcyclists heading north. The one that was most visible had a white helmet on. Coming home on Friday I was overtaken by a few bikers in black, on black bikes, they blended with the road pretty much. They may have had their headlights on but I couldnt see that from the back.

[Ixion]

SoulTrader makes a good observation. Indeed, why to people disagree with solid facts? My take on this question is that some people make a conclusion based on emotions, hearsay, shallow opinions, or something other than rationality. Try this on for size:

Research on motorbike accidents:
http://www.cs.wisc.edu/%7Ejohn/vfr/hurt.html

"The failure of motorists to detect and recognize motorcycles in traffic is the predominating cause of motorcycle accidents. ...Conspicuity [easily visible] of the motorcycle is a critical factor in the multiple vehicle accidents, and accident involvement is significantly reduced by the use of motorcycle headlamps (on in daylight) and the wearing of high visibility yellow, orange or bright red jackets."

Just in case you want to trash this research, here is where it comes from:
The "Motorcycle Accident Cause Factors and Identification of Countermeasures," is a study conducted by the University of Southern California (USC). With funds from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, researcher Harry Hurt investigated almost every aspect of 900 motorcycle accidents in the Los Angeles area. Additionally, Hurt and his staff analyzed 3,600 motorcycle traffic accident reports in the same geographic area.

I do not think anyone is arguing that hi-vis is more visible. Indeed, the very name implies it. But (some) people are unconvinced that the difference, nbowdays, is of any significance.

I wore flouro gear years and years ago, long before it was common (it was very hard to get back then). And the fact that it was so rare made it very noticeable. People went "What the hell is that".

I think Mr Hurt's research comes from a similar environment (it was also many years ago now) . The brightly coloured riders in his study were visible because they were rare. We notice exceptions.

Nowdays hi-vis is so common, it is everywhere, people are used to it, it has lost its effect.It is still more visible than non-fluoro, but the difference may be negligable.

[Radar]

Nowdays hi-vis is so common, it is everywhere, people are used to it, it has lost its effect.It is still more visible than non-fluoro, but the difference may be negligable.

Not sure where your Cave of Adullum is, but in the Wairarapa I have only seen one bright vest - on a guy riding a 50cc scooter (except for cops, etc).

So what I need is a big bike, white helmet, and green fluoro vest... :Police:... then have fun watching traffic slow down and behave around me. :laugh:

[Swoop]

It's like the little black dress that chicks wear, looks good on (almost) anything :laugh:
This also gets noticed VERY quickly!!:blip:

[Hinny]

Mate, you need to turn that situation around - QUICKLY!

It's a male prerogative to ask seedy questions like that - and preferably to girls too young and innocent to fully comprehend the entailed dodginess! :yes:

She's young but far from innocent.
The moaning is actually imitative love moaning. Very suggestive and rather exciting!
... I'm sure she really loves my ass.

[moT]

black leathers add 50 extra horsepowers to your bike

[steveb64]

I intend on getting a fluoro vest for bad weather/long night rides, but I really dont agree there is no issue. I'll conceed there isn't an issue as soon as motorcyclists in black gear stop bitching about motorists not seeing them.

Worst case I ever had of a motorist not seeing me - I was wearing black - UNDER a BRIGHT YELLOW one piece wet weather overall, lights (90/100 watt) ON, and with a large red backpack sticking up, on the pack rack! Fucker still turned across the road, right in front of me! :eek5: :shit: ...I was in a string/stream of traffic, he was on the other side waiting to turn, saw me as a gap, so off he went... Oddly - he lost all desire for a cup of coffee, and departed the carpark he was about to park in, as soon as he saw me arriving back... I had to settle for some verbal abuse shouted in his window :argh:, as he went past (looked like he was saying "SORRY SORRY" though!).

Main reason I wear black on a bike - 'cos it doesn't show the dirt (or the oil and grease marks :whistle:)... ...and the bastards can't see ya anyway...

[Zookey]

Well for one i now wear leather,as do all Racing riders,and yes they are colored,but they are one hell of a price; but a cows skin is mostly black so hence the color.I have armored cordex colored and look like some stage show freak in it.perhaps im not girlie built is the reason.

[TOTO]

I wear my hi viz at night with the only reason that if I fall off for some reason I would like a car or a truck from behind me see what has happened and therefore not run me over.

[moT]

if you got a black bike with black leathers and its night all you have to do is switch your lights off and you turn invisible.. good way to hide from cops

[mark247]

if you got a black bike with black leathers and its night all you have to do is switch your lights off and you turn invisible.. good way to hide from cops

and you got caught because you had red leathers?

[Mekk]

I wear black because I like the colour.

I figure the chances of getting hit because I'm not seen are so much greater by the mere fact that I am on a motorcycle anyway. It matters little as to what colour my gear is.

[slick-kev]

would you wanna look like a fag in bright orange bike gears i think not

[toebug]

Want some colour? Grab some camo draggin jeans! Everyone else in tauranga's got them! mmmmmooooooooooooo

[Ripperjon]

I just wrote a big explanation of colour, shape, form, contrast, visibility etc.

Being colourblind, i've picked up a good bit of knowledge on vision over the years.

However, its late, im knackered and it was getting massive and confusing.

So, i'll just say that i dont think that any colour helps you get spotted in a car's mirror as they will either appear black or won't be noticed.

Hi-vis will work though if the car is behind you. Which most of you guys probably won't care about ;) but might help us learners out when we're stuck at 70kmh looking for cops and have 100kmh trucks on our tails.:scooter:

Having said that though, hi-vis stuff is gay as and i love my new black alpinestars jacket.:bleh:

[discotex]

Having said that though, hi-vis stuff is gay as and i love my new black alpinestars jacket.:bleh:

Yep.. I didn't spend thousands of dollars trying to look like a cool sprotsbiker to go an blow it with a high-vis vest :nono: ;)

The white strips on the jacket do look fetching though and I honestly don't think it'll make sweet fuck all difference to whether I'm seen.

My headlight on during the day on the other hand...

[FastBikeGear]

Actually the research suggests (http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/abstract/328/7444/857) that wearing hi-viz reduces your risk of being involved in an accident by 37%. For some reason people get upset when I mention it.

I stronlgy object to you using facts in a discussion such as this. This behaviour is morally unforgiveable.

[moT]

Black = cool
cool = Drift
Leathers = Hide
Hide = Thick skin
Thick skin = Dinosaurs
Black = Drift
Leathers = Dinosaurs
Black Leathers = Dino Drifts

[CHOPPA]

I went a step further and got a hi vis suit..... haha not sure if id wear it to a pub though!

[jonbuoy]

After you've been riding for a few months in all weather your nice brightly coloured outfit till be looking decidedly black anyway. How much of the riders body do you see on a fully faired bike from straight on? Get yourself a brightly coloured helmet if it bothers you.

[alanzs]

Hi viz yellow is the new black.... :shifty:

[alanzs]

I went a step further and got a hi vis suit..... haha not sure if id wear it to a pub though!

I have an Aerostich full suit in hi viz yellow. I wear mine all the time. People notice me, which is the point, even at the pub... :banana: What people think of me is really none of my business.

[pritch]

I really don't think it matters what you wear. When riding around town on the moped (which has stickers all over the front to make it more visible) I see people look straight at me, then immediately pull into the piece of road that I'm about to be occupying. It's possible they have far greater faith in the made-in-China" Suzuki brakes than I do. Then again they probably just don't give a shit.

Which just goes to reinforce the belief I had that the lizard brains only react to a perceived threat. Some are too dim even then...

My perfect scooter accessory would be a holster in the parcel tray to hold a .45 handgun. Most road users should be able to percieve a threat if bullets started whizzing around their ears. Shame about the collateral damage though. :devil2:

[Pwalo]

Black is sooooo slimming.

[wysper]

I have really enjoyed this topic.
It has been interesting reading how people react to opinions and advice that differ from their own.

It was in intersting point from the guy that said no matter what colour the rider was wearing from front on it looked black.

Also the differing science points has been really interesting - cones of the eyes stuff etc.

At the moment I am a cyclist and as a carry over from being a biker i cycle like people cant see me and if they can they are trying to kill me.
When I go through a round about I take a full place on the road, i have never had grief from cars when i do that. It is almost like they appreciate knowing where I am and what I am doing.

As to the hi vis.. i would probably wear it but more so I felt safer. And when I get a motorbike again. I will still ride like no one can see me and they are all trying to kill me. I think the safest thing you can do is ride well and use your anticipation.

Newbies - listen to what some of these experienced members are telling you. Alot of them have learned the hard way.. breaking bones.. loosing skin etc.
They are giving you good free advice.

Lets RIDE :Punk:

[alanzs]

As to the hi vis.. i would probably wear it but more so I felt safer. And when I get a motorbike again. I will still ride like no one can see me and they are all trying to kill me. I think the safest thing you can do is ride well and use your anticipation.



Exactly right.
Hi viz is slimming as well as visible. I never have to ask "does my ass look big in this?" :rockon:

[Swoop]

I stronlgy object to you using facts in a discussion such as this. This behaviour is morally unforgiveable.

It is OK. The facts are wrong... Hi Viz doesn't save yer' arse.

[moT]

you dont need to wear a high vis or leathers the law states the minimum protective clothing that should be worn is a helmet. As long as you wear a helmet (with the strap tightened) nothing can possibly go wrong and you cannot possibly die (except ofcorse if you speed or drink). Its the same with a seatbelt in a car if you wear one you cannot possibly die in a car accident even if ur crushed between 2 trucks at 100kph you will be fine, this rule also is the same with lifejackets and safety harneses. its what i call the protective bubble of OSH and LTSA

[<Rhino>]

My cordura gears all black, can't find anything that otherwise.

[portokiwi]

I have a leather jacket but even that make me look fat...... I blame the padding:2thumbsup.
I brought black becouse at the time thats what they had....
The Fonz wore a black leather jacket. he is cool
James Dean wore a black leather jacket.
The police over seas wear black and they look good.
Fighter pilots wore black leather jackets.
So wearing Black leather jackets are part of our life. feels good, looks great, warm to wear and slimming to the eye. Why change?????:2thumbsup

[Aa7]

since wearing my yellow hi-viz now for the last six months solidly, admitedly at night i feel WAY more visible and safer but for some reason during the day i have been hit once by a woman pulling into me while i'm looking at her face in her mirrors and trying to pull on the anchors while she blamed me for changing lanes into her when i was in the same place all along and she just didnt use her eyes and also knocked off at a roundabout since wearing it.

I used to just have close calls when i wore only my black leathers - it's crazy but i honestly feel more of a traget now during the day in my hi-vis rather than safer. people see them and hone in on then it seems ahahahah at night it works very very well but during the day it seems the yellow is not the best option and black may be better :S:S

the last time i was knocked of my bike was yesterday morning and the woman just said the obligatory "I didnt see you" when i asked her why she drove straight into me so i asked her why she thought i was wearing a bright yellow and reflective striped jacket . she was dumbstruck and had another look just to say "oh yes, so you are. i didnt see that either" :S:S at night these work well but during the day it seems they make little to no extra difference. maybe the orange ones may work better in the day rather than the yellow ones. i might head down to NZ Saftey and buy an orange one just to test this theory but honestly am thinking i will only wear these during the night after my recent experiences with them.

[moT]

very good point. When in rome