Stupid, stupid, stupid people

[Finn]

I used to laugh at the stupidity of the average New Zealander, but now it's starting to make me cry. If you think that I am being unreasonable, then I would lump you into this category.

In November, a contractor decides to resurface a small strip of road outside my house in the middle of the fucken night with NOISY FUCKING MACHINERY. I live near a Motorway offramp so their reasoning is that they don't what to disrupt traffic! Even though there is another city offramp very close to mine. As I said in my initial post below, they would have to do it again. Well...

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=61597&highlight=council+cry

Resurfacing (Round 2) started last night at 7pm and finished at approx 6am this morning... in a residential street. Fuckers.

In addition, we had reddish concrete outside my house and it was badly in need of repair. They resurfaced patches of it in December with black shit and it looked like a fucken ghetto. I rang Council and told them that if they wanted their $3,500 rate bill paid, they can fucken do it again, properly. Oops, they did the entire street which lasted 2 weeks and for 4 days, I couldn't get a car or bike out (or in if the timing was bad) of my driveway. Nice.

I could fill up KB with very similar stories of incompetence in this country. For example, a $450,000 bill to repair my house because of kiwi ingenuity, but I won't go there.

Why is it that NZ gets so many things so horribly wrong?

[Sully60]

Because in regards to contracting the lowest price always wins despite the line on most tender invitations that say "the lowest priced tender will not necessarily be accepted". (Insert Tui add here)

There's always another contractor who will do it cheaper than some who knows what they're doing and does it properly and the council (principals) will always try to keep their money in their pockets.

Why does my residential street ( a culdesac) need to be resufaced again?

I agree with you Finn it's a poor state of affairs.

[YellowDog]

Doesn't sound too clever.

I like the motto "Learn from the mistakes of others, you can't afford to make them all yourself".

Maybe someone at the council/government should be looking at other national and international screwups and try to avoid the same.

[Blackbird]

I'm not knocking your argument about the stupidity of some NZ sectors, especially local government and their contractors; but having lived and worked at various places round the globe, it's bloody endemic! It's just that NZ has a small population base and coupled with a strong social network, people get to hear about all the stuff-ups.

Don't get me started about roading stuff-ups down our way either:mad:

Geoff

[Finn]

Because in regards to contracting the lowest price always wins despite the line on most tender invitations that say "the lowest priced tender will not necessarily be accepted". (Insert Tui add here)

There's my other pet hate. While I have nothing against tenders, Kiwi's don't know how to run them properly. In my industry I would say that 80% of tenders fail to meet the original objective. Business for the boys, back handers and shortsightedness.

[Finn]

Don't get me started about roading stuff-ups down our way either:mad:

Geoff

Mate, I would put up with potholes and potheads just to retire and live in the Coromandel.

[onearmedbandit]

Because pride in your work has gone.
Because people are so conditioned to hearing how much better things are overseas (which for the most part they are) that they get lazy and apathetic about NZ.
Because the people in power (be it central government or local) believe they know best and that we couldn't possibly know how to look after ourselves.
Because our best are heading off overseas in search of better pay and better living conditions, leaving us with a deficit of 'smartness' in NZ.
Because....

[MSTRS]

There's my other pet hate. While I have nothing against tenders, Kiwi's don't know how to run them properly. In my industry I would say that 80% of tenders fail to meet the original objective. Business for the boys, back handers and shortsightedness.

And god help you if you want a white, middle-aged male for a particular job, and say so in the position ad....

[Deano]

Finn - ring the Environmental Health Officer at your Council and ask why they aren't adhering to the construction noise standards - NZS6803:1999.

Any noisy roadworks in residential (commercial suburban also) areas of Lower Hutt must cease by 12.00 midnight (which is still greater than the NZ standard allows. Even then, this must be justified with traffic safety issues.

It is often a compromise between resident's sleep and necessary works - if there is an alternative route, then it seems there is a compromise there already and no need to work through the night.

[Finn]

And god help you if you want a white, middle-aged male for a particular job, and say so in the position ad....

Trouble is, their aren't any but I really don't care, just as long as they do their job. My company is like the UN.

[idb]

Everything's good here...

[Finn]

Finn - ring the Environmental Health Officer at your Council and ask why they aren't adhering to the construction noise standards - NZS6803:1999.

Any noisy roadworks in residential (commercial suburban also) areas of Lower Hutt must cease by 12.00 midnight (which is still greater than the NZ standard allows. Even then, this must be justified with traffic safety issues.

It is often a compromise between resident's sleep and necessary works - if there is an alternative route, then it seems there is a compromise there already and no need to work through the night.

Did that in November. He basically told me to go fuck myself as Council signed off the works.

[Deano]

Did that in November. He basically told me to go fuck myself as Council signed off the works.

Write to the Mayor, the CEO, your local MP and the ombudsmen - Council staff just LOVE it when they have to write letters explaining their actions/policies - especially when it goes against a recognised NZ Standard.:niceone:

[kevfromcoro]

Mate, I would put up with potholes and potheads just to retire and live in the Coromandel.

oi..u want to buy a house......

[Finn]

oi..u want to buy a house......

Already looking... on the east coast though. Otama area.

[avgas]

Why is it that NZ gets so many things so horribly wrong?
Know how can do policy.
The germans have the opposite - where its the right thing for the right job.
They cringe at the thought of a Philips doing up a posidrive screw.
But also there is the lack of effort in this country to do the thing right. It has been this reason why i have actually been through 5 jobs in the last 10 years. I'm getting sick of it now and seriously considering overseas. At least there i get paid the big bucks to deal with morons.

[madandy]

Know how can do policy.
The germans have the opposite - where its the right thing for the right job.
They cringe at the thought of a Philips doing up a posidrive screw.
But also there is the lack of effort in this country to do the thing right. It has been this reason why i have actually been through 5 jobs in the last 10 years. I'm getting sick of it now and seriously considering overseas. At least there i get paid the big bucks to deal with morons.

Bingo!
She'll be right mate. We'll knock that up in no time...
I work for a CLub and deal with cimmittees and volunteers daily...I've been sticking with the same club for 4.5 years now and feel the same way about moving offshore...my Patriotism is wearing thin!

[Blackbird]

Mate, I would put up with potholes and potheads just to retire and live in the Coromandel.

I was actually talking about in Tokoroa - Coro is bloody marvellous by comparison. It's standard practice to reseal a road in Tokoroa then come back 2 weeks later and do it properly!

[Blue Velvet]

The germans have the opposite - where its the right thing for the right job.

That explains why German-made stuff is quality.

[ManDownUnder]

Why is it that NZ gets so many things so horribly wrong?

Because those that make the rules are:
1) in power for the sake of their own egos
2) the least worst option available at the time of the election
3) paid peanuts for the job they do - remarkably we end up with Monkeys
4) only in office long enough to think up bribes suitable for the next election (cue Dr Cullen and his pending tax cuts... ooo look!)

Have a hard think about who it should be then get someone decent in power, pay them handsomely, let them rule unchallenged for 10 years and let them make the ugly decisions that need making.

Will it happen - no - too many piglets (with a vote) sucking on the state tit

[MSTRS]

Trouble is, their aren't any but I really don't care, just as long as they do their job. My company is like the UN.

Hey! I am...well, nearly. My ancestors are not my fault....

[Paul in NZ]

There's my other pet hate. While I have nothing against tenders, Kiwi's don't know how to run them properly. In my industry I would say that 80% of tenders fail to meet the original objective. Business for the boys, back handers and shortsightedness.


I disagree - they know exactly how to run them! Run them so that their mates get the job and everyone else that honestly bids for the work looses a fortune - Tenders and RFP's - avoid like the plague unless you have been shoulder tapped because you are just there to make it look good in case we are investigated.

[Swoop]

Already looking... on the east coast though. Otara area.
I didn't know Otara was on the East Coast...

I presume that you had the boi ricers arrive when they knew of loose gravel in the area?

I had a roading crew arrive with hot tar and gravel at 2.45pm on Friday afternoon to reseal the road. Strangely enough there was instantly a massive traffic snarlup when the local school traffic appeared... "How unusual"...:spanking:
Then the rest of the weekend enduring ricers at warp-speed 9 thinking they were rally car drivers. Haven't they heard of dirt roads for that shit?

After seeing how they "sweep" the road, no wonder why so many bikes are taken out by hitting patches of grit and gravel. Fucking pathetic clean-up job!

[Grahameeboy]

I used to laugh at the stupidity of the average New Zealander, but now it's starting to make me cry. If you think that I am being unreasonable, then I would lump you into this category.

In November, a contractor decides to resurface a small strip of road outside my house in the middle of the fucken night with NOISY FUCKING MACHINERY. I live near a Motorway offramp so their reasoning is that they don't what to disrupt traffic! Even though there is another city offramp very close to mine. As I said in my initial post below, they would have to do it again. Well...

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php?t=61597&highlight=council+cry

Resurfacing (Round 2) started last night at 7pm and finished at approx 6am this morning... in a residential street. Fuckers.

In addition, we had reddish concrete outside my house and it was badly in need of repair. They resurfaced patches of it in December with black shit and it looked like a fucken ghetto. I rang Council and told them that if they wanted their $3,500 rate bill paid, they can fucken do it again, properly. Oops, they did the entire street which lasted 2 weeks and for 4 days, I couldn't get a car or bike out (or in if the timing was bad) of my driveway. Nice.

I could fill up KB with very similar stories of incompetence in this country. For example, a $450,000 bill to repair my house because of kiwi ingenuity, but I won't go there.

Why is it that NZ gets so many things so horribly wrong?

Sorry to hear Finn but why did you just not go out and tell them that they were making too much noise and it was not reasonable to carry out work at this time of day, stop work or you would complain and to report back to their bosses.

Has happened a few times down my road and I got them to move...one time they were doing a water test at 3am right outside my house and I didn't want them waking up Nats. They needed to turn on a generator.

They moved.

Yes I laugh at the average NZer who puts up with something unacceptable and does nothing about it when the solution is simple...

I guess if it was someone telling you to put your dog on a lead you would say something?:rolleyes:

Guess it is all about priorities.:apint:

[vifferman]

Sorry to hear Finn but why did you just not go out and tell them that they were making too much noise and it was not reasonable to carry out work at this time of day, stop work or you would complain and to report back to their bosses.
I think if your read Finn's original thread, that's Eggs Zachary what he did do, initially.

[Finn]

Has happened a few times down my road and I got them to move...one time they were doing a water test at 3am right outside my house and I didn't want them waking up Nats. They needed to turn on a generator.

Yeah, but you've got God on your side.

[avgas]

That explains why German-made stuff is quality.
Quality......its f'ing annoying is what it is.
They literally have the right tool for the job....every job = new tool. Its only a matter of time until they decide that each spark-plug requires its own tool!
Even the simplest task with German stuff will take the minimum req'd 1-2 hours.
Overcomplication all the bloody time with German stuff. Really nice, but bloody overcomplicated.

[Steam]

Why...
You've got one thing in common with the average kiwi. You're a bloody whiner.

[Finn]

You've got one thing in common with the average kiwi. You're a bloody whiner.

Must be the English blood.

[sAsLEX]

Because pride in your work has gone.
Because people are so conditioned to hearing how much better things are overseas (which for the most part they are) that they get lazy and apathetic about NZ.
Because the people in power (be it central government or local) believe they know best and that we couldn't possibly know how to look after ourselves.
Because our best are heading off overseas in search of better pay and better living conditions, leaving us with a deficit of 'smartness' in NZ.
Because....

Was interesting at a course today, we were discussing English and how it is taught. The older people in the class from the 60s and 70s had the curriculum that taught sentence structure and what verbs, nouns etc are. Where as us youngsters in the class have missed out on that with the new curriculum having no need for learning the language we must use every day in the world?


I disagree - they know exactly how to run them! Run them so that their mates get the job and everyone else that honestly bids for the work looses a fortune - Tenders and RFP's - avoid like the plague unless you have been shoulder tapped because you are just there to make it look good in case we are investigated.

I laugh that in Defence any large project MUST go to tender........... even if the outcome is no surprise to anyone at all.

[R6_kid]

My road was recently resurfaced... although the the work was started at 8am and didn't cause too much disruption, there wasn't actually really any need to resurface the road yet, it gets sweet fuck all traffic anyway so it not like it needed it.

[Big Dave]

30 posts about Finn bitchin' about road works????

[Finn]

30 posts about Finn bitchin' about road works????

I'm surprised you've got the time to post here. Aren't you supposed to be apologising to all the Abo's?

[Sanx]

I recently wrote to John Banks (as no-one in charge of roading dares publish his email or name) regarding some resurfacing carried out on a road near us. To paraphrase, the road didn't need doing, other than some corrugations on one corner. So - they put coarse-chip down over a 400 metre stretch, but didn't bother to fill in the corrugations first. So whereas before we had a smooth road with a couple of corrugations, we now have a rough noisy road, covered in gravel, with loose gravel covered corrugations. Great success!

So, in the letter I bitched about the general standard of road works and declared the job to be the cheapest, nastiest and shittiest imaginable. However, I did pass on congratulations to the contracting company for the inclusive employment policy that allowed people to employed despite the special form of idiocy required to do such a bad job and think it acceptable.

Surprisingly, the council did respond. Attached is their response. No surprises, just a bunch of bullshit about sweeping the road (hah!) and the overall suitability of the chipseal of a roading surface.

[onearmedbandit]

Was interesting at a course today, we were discussing English and how it is taught. The older people in the class from the 60s and 70s had the curriculum that taught sentence structure and what verbs, nouns etc are. Where as us youngsters in the class have missed out on that with the new curriculum having no need for learning the language we must use every day in the world?





Shit bro, I just went to school to score girls and cause trouble. And I passed both with honours. As for what they taught there, pfft.

[Grahameeboy]

Yeah, but you've got God on your side.

True..................

[Grahameeboy]

I think if your read Finn's original thread, that's Eggs Zachary what he did do, initially.

Yep he just complained to the Council, not the guys doing the job. Mention noise levels and they will soon down tools.

[ElCoyote]

Because pride in your work has gone.
Because people are so conditioned to hearing how much better things are overseas (which for the most part they are) that they get lazy and apathetic about NZ.
Because the people in power (be it central government or local) believe they know best and that we couldn't possibly know how to look after ourselves.
Because our best are heading off overseas in search of better pay and better living conditions, leaving us with a deficit of 'smartness' in NZ.
Because....

Correct, and imports with shonky credentials are replacing them with a far better understanding of greasing palms to obtain tenders. We need these people like we need prevaricating politicians.

[heyjoe]

Well said Finn (post #1), Sully60 (post #2) and Avgas (post #16). I totally agree with you.

[Waylander]

Doesn't sound too clever.

I like the motto "Learn from the mistakes of others, you can't afford to make them all yourself".

Maybe someone at the council/government should be looking at other national and international screwups and try to avoid the same.

They're already looking at the screw ups mate, but to copy instead of learn from.

[Big Dave]

I'm surprised you've got the time to post here. Aren't you supposed to be apologising to all the Abo's?

'bout time too. little johnny was a preeek.

[Sketchy_Racer]

sounds like our street. were on round 4 of them trying to resurface a couple of corners on it..

Like every other smart kiwi, as soon as i have finished my apprenticeship time, im outta this shit hole..

[pete376403]

Same everywhere - frinstance, in Upper Hutt, two doors away from me a house is being renovated, and the section subdivided. This was started at least two months ago, so its fair to say the council were notified at least three months ago. About a week ago I set off for work and discovered Fulton Hogan equipment all over the street as they were resurfacing it. Didn't really need it but the council must have some money in the roading budget that needs using up. The work was completed by Friday afternoon with the new road surface swept of loose chips and the remarking done. The following monday morning contractors were digging a trench across the road from the house being renovated to the sewer pipe on the other side. Needless to say they have not completely levelled the excavation - it's about 30 -50 mm lower and surfaced with plain asphalt. creates a lovely thump-thump as cars pass over

[lb99]

The following monday morning contractors were digging a trench across the road from the house being renovated to the sewer pipe on the other side. Needless to say they have not completely levelled the excavation - it's about 30 -50 mm lower and surfaced with plain asphalt. creates a lovely thump-thump as cars pass over

I work for a contracting company and we sub to the local council, I quite frequently have to dig up a newly surfaced road or somesuch and have the locals nutting off about it, but we are contracted to the council so we do what we are told to do, usually with quite short notice. but I have seen lots money wasted like the time the roadmarkers spent about 2 weeks renewing the cats eyes and markings on a 2km stretch of road, they did a real nice job. a week later FH come along and bung a layer of chipseal over the lot......

[Timber020]

I lived near a rural road in pennsylvania that was dug up and relaid 7 times over one summer. It just happened that the road was one of the few which was under shade throughout the hot summer and had a bar and grill near the roadside (with an immaculate tarsealed carpark I might add). All the other roads were nearly impassable at speeds over 25mph. I used to do jumps in my pontiac bonneville.

Then (if my memory serves correctly) there was that massive tarsealed road that was put down all the way to nowhere, well not quite, it stopped right at the front gate of the property owned by the then crooked police comissioner of queensland. Or in england where in one area anyone who tries to set up competition against a dominant roading contractor find there vehicles constantly catching fire, been that way for nearly 20 years.

We live in one of the least corrupt nations on earth, if you think its better overseas you dont get out enough.