zx6r top speed

[slopster]

Had my zx6r wound out today on an appropriate bit of road. It ran out of puff at an indicated 240 and slowly crept to 250 but I don't think it had any more then another couple of km left to go. I know when I rode my mates gsxr600 it was good for an indicated 265 which really is quite a differance.

The 6r doesn't seem to be any slower so I thought maybe the speedo's actually accurate and the gsxr is a little exagerated (but it can be a little hard to judge these things). Anyone else had an 07 6r much past 250

[onearmedbandit]

Last year FastBikes magazine did a test on the 600's after the R6 rev issue. The results were as follows:

R6 Indicated Speed - 168mph Actual Speed - 155mph
ZX6 Indicated Speed - 181mph Actual Speed - 162mph
675 Indicated Speed - 165mph Actual Speed - 155mph
GSX Indicated Speed - 175mph Actual Speed - 157mph
CBR Indicated Speed - 171mph Actual Speed - 156mph

All of their rev counters lied as well, from the GSXR being 700rpm optimistic through to the R6 being 1700rpm over.

[bugjuice]

'indicated' has so many varibles, that it'll never be anywhere near what you're actually doing. I managed to hit the rev limiter in 6th on my 636, out the back of Puke. The 'indicated' speed was reading 287. I've heard of 05/6 bikes reaching a bit more than that. My bike felt strong pulling all the way up to the speed too, didn't feel like it was running out of puff. Get it onto a bigger straight and just whack it right open. I managed my speed with a bit of help from a race ZX10 that I managed to tuck in behind for a couple of seconds on the exit of Castrol

never understood why it's so hard to get the rev counter accurate tho. The R6 one I can kind of understand, cos they were boasting about a massively high redline, when really, most of it was on paper, but the other bikes.. can't be that hard to measure!

[sugilite]

If you want more, gear it down.

[YellowDog]

I have a mate who put lower profile tyres on his FJ1100 becuse it gave him an extra 8-12kph on the speedo. In reality he would have been going slower, not faster.

I got him to run the mod past the dealer who told him that lower profile tyres were not safe for all riding conditions. All this so the speedo can show a few kph more at top speed!

Be careful out there.

[Mikkel]

I have a mate who put lower profile tyres on his FJ1100 becuse it gave him an extra 8-12kph on the speedo. In reality he would have been going slower, not faster.

I got him to run the mod past the dealer who told him that lower profile tyres were not safe for all riding conditions. All this so the speedo can show a few kph more at top speed!

Be careful out there.

Why would you want to do that? :crazy:

Making videos for Youtube?

Can't remember who said it - but in the end the only two people who care about how fast you're going is you and the police officer who pulls you over.

[yod]

ive tested a few cars and bikes against my GPS at various speeds - every single one was reading high

[R6_kid]

I had my '99 R6 out to 267kmh and was only just creaping a kilometer every second or two at that speed and there was a corner fast approaching. This was on stock gearing.

On the dyno it put out 92.8hp or so, and 'only' got to just over 240kmh as indicated on the dyno.

At the end of the day it's not the kind of thing you do all the time anyway, but still interesting to know all the same.

[Krayy]

'indicated' has so many varibles, that it'll never be anywhere near what you're actually doing. I managed to hit the rev limiter in 6th on my 636, out the back of Puke. The 'indicated' speed was reading 287...
How the hell can you look down at the speedo when doing 287 km/h?

I'd be shitting myself.

[onearmedbandit]

never understood why it's so hard to get the rev counter accurate tho. The R6 one I can kind of understand, cos they were boasting about a massively high redline, when really, most of it was on paper, but the other bikes.. can't be that hard to measure!

Oh it's not hard at all. In fact it's achievable with cheap components to get it within 1%. But then what would the marketing guys do?

Remember that the pulses taken for revs would be the same as those taken for injection etc which are incredibly accurate. Any error in the rev's is intentional.

[mynameis]

Someone explain the maths behind indicated vs actual speed to me please?

[onearmedbandit]

Maths? There is no 'maths' behind it as such. The reasons can be mechanical error (unintentional) or simple over reading from the marketing guys (intentional). How many people actually know just how fast they are going? Fuck all, so if you are trying to market your bike as the fastest who will it hurt to have the speedo reading a bit high? Certainly not your sales. Same as revs. Same as weight. These are performance bikes, we want the fastest, lightest and most advanced available. So some figures get smudged.

[mynameis]

Maths? There is no 'maths' behind it as such. The reasons can be mechanical error (unintentional) or simple over reading from the marketing guys (intentional). How many people actually know just how fast they are going? Fuck all, so if you are trying to market your bike as the fastest who will it hurt to have the speedo reading a bit high? Certainly not your sales. Same as revs. Same as weight. These are performance bikes, we want the fastest, lightest and most advanced available. So some figures get smudged.

Thanks. Something which is a bit hard to measure dead accurately, even with the many types of radors out there aye.

[onearmedbandit]

Exactly. How many times have you heard someone saying something like, 'Oh I was pulling 220 out of that corner' or 'I put the frontr back down at 180'? We've all said something like that, because we all use our speedo as the measurement. But we were all wrong.

[Pwalo]

Don't forget that even after the vagaries of speedos and tachometers, you also got the variable of tyre size, weather conditions, rider weight, height etc.

Even identical bikes can have slightly different top speeds (ie not all 2004 GSXRs produced in a certain batch will have identical performance).

[Clivoris]

Aprilia Tuono.
254kmh measured on flying quarter mile.
257kmh recorded on speedometer.
I wonder why other manufacturers can't be that accurate?

[icekiwi]

Get in touch with the dude who has the laser gun and remove the doubt...
I found my speed is connected to my arsehole...faster i go tighter it gets...
265k ("indicated" for the purists)and it feels like a marble bag with the draw string up to the max...
Just enjoy it dude the cops will if they get you over 145...lol

[YellowDog]

Thanks. Something which is a bit hard to measure dead accurately, even with the many types of radors out there aye.
That is why a cop can't do you unless he has had his equipment recently calibrated.

[slopster]

Tested it on a gps today - not to full speed though. Came up with an 8% error speedo reading faster. So that means my actual top speed is around 233 which is definitely too slow for a near new 600. What sort of things would cause this, it runs perfectly other then that. Its bog standard (as far as I know I am the second owner though) and only done 4500km. Does feel quite a bit slower then my old gsxr750t but I'm not that worried cos I got it for the handling, not the power and it sure knows how to go round corners.

[discotex]

Interesting. My speedo and tacho are totally in sync. I was doing calculations for how much top end I'd lose dropping a tooth and I noticed 6000rpm in 6th should be 113km/h.

Next time I went on the motorway I checked and it was spot on.

Guess the rpm and speed could go out at higher rpm though.

[NinjaBoy]

Have you done the jumper mod ? First time on the track without the mod against a GSXR was embarrassing.

[slopster]

No does it really make much difference? I was told it would only make 1 or 2 extra hp. Which wires do I bridge and where do I find them.

[NinjaBoy]

The horsepower difference is not much but the top speed retardation when the exhaust valve closes at top revs is very noticeable.

Do a google for 'jumper mod'. Its a blank (unconnected) plug under the seat which you need to jumper a couple of pins across with some lockwire (or a staple :crazy:)

Hardest part is finding a secluded straight piece of road to get it to the red line !

[HDTboy]

I've got a set of high flow headers for one of these bikes which I modified. There's a lot that can be done to them relatively cheaply to get more power if that's your thing. You know how to get hold of me

[Edbear]

...Can't remember who said it - but in the end the only two people who care about how fast you're going is you and the police officer who pulls you over.

Wise man, that!


Oh it's not hard at all. In fact it's achievable with cheap components to get it within 1%. But then what would the marketing guys do?

Remember that the pulses taken for revs would be the same as those taken for injection etc which are incredibly accurate. Any error in the rev's is intentional.

Interesting point!


Aprilia Tuono.
254kmh measured on flying quarter mile.
257kmh recorded on speedometer.
I wonder why other manufacturers can't be that accurate?


'Cause then they'd get left behind in the "Mine's faster than yours!" race...

[madbikeboy]

Interesting stuff. Mine says 299 sometimes*. It stops there. Not sure what that's about. Maybe the manufacturers got together and decided that if a speedo didn't read any faster than that, it was more socially acceptable.

Speedo's lie like lawyers and politicians. No excuse for the rev counter to lie though - that should be more precise. R6's are quietly infamous for being optimistic with RPM.

*tested under controlled conditions, and not on a public road. :whistle:

[Mikkel]

Tested it on a gps today - not to full speed though. Came up with an 8% error speedo reading faster. So that means my actual top speed is around 233 which is definitely too slow for a near new 600.

Exactly what makes you think 233 km/h is too slow for a near new 600 ccm sportsbike?

Is it because it doesn't match the performance figures released by the manufacturer?

Is it because it's not fast enough for the public road?

Or?

We already touched upon the "little white lies" in marketing...

A speedo deviation of only 8% at these speeds is not bad at all.

Is this at the red line or do you not reach the redline at top-speed?
If not someone could have changed a sprocket (or fitted a close ratio gearbox). If you make the gearing lower you'll have more acceleration but you'll run out of revs before you run out of puff...
If you want to speed you want your gearbox to match your top-speed with the maximum power in the rev range (NOT redline!)

E.g. a dodge viper will not reach it's top-speed in top-gear, but in the second highest instead. The final gear is there to allow "efficient" cruising at high-way speeds and it's so tall that the engine won't hit max power until way after top speed is achieved.

[HDTboy]

Exactly what makes you think 233 km/h is too slow for a near new 600 ccm sportsbike?

Every 600 sportsbike from 2000 on will do over 260km/h indicated.
A 2007 ZX6R will do 280km/h on the speedo with very limited modification.

[mynameis]

That is why a cop can't do you unless he has had his equipment recently calibrated.

Yeap and that is within the last 12 months.

Question how come most times cops clock you at same speeds as indicated though ??

[onearmedbandit]

Exactly what makes you think 233 km/h is too slow for a near new 600 ccm sportsbike?

Is it because it doesn't match the performance figures released by the manufacturer?



It's actually very rare for manufacturers to give performance figures on bikes these days, they are simply not interested in the top speed pursuit. What matters is power, weight, and wheelbase/rake etc. If you look at my post at the top the actual top speed of a ZX6R is higher than what the OP got on his bike, and indicated higher again.

162mph x 1.609 = 261km/h
181mph x 1.609 = 291km/h

[discotex]

So that means my actual top speed is around 233 which is definitely too slow for a near new 600. What sort of things would cause this, it runs perfectly other then that. Its bog standard (as far as I know I am the second owner though) and only done 4500km.

Geared down for stunting/acceleration maybe but that's 30km/h lower than I reckon you should hit.

Were you hitting redline in 6th? What RPM were you showing?

[slopster]

Geared down for stunting/acceleration maybe but that's 30km/h lower than I reckon you should hit.

Were you hitting redline in 6th? What RPM were you showing?

No don't think gearing has been altered. Was near the redline in 5th and still had 6th to go.

Have just done that jumper mod havn't had a chance to test it.

[onearmedbandit]

Well there's your answer, not in top gear and not at redline (which most sportsbikes will do in top.)

[HDTboy]

230 is about right for 5th gear.

[koba]

www.cliffhanger.org.nz (http://www.cliffhanger.org.nz)

There are sprints in september.
Best place to test it objectivley and safley (er)
the 636 in the last results or results before that got to an indicated 290.

[Mikkel]

Every 600 sportsbike from 2000 on will do over 260km/h indicated.
A 2007 ZX6R will do 280km/h on the speedo with very limited modification.


It's actually very rare for manufacturers to give performance figures on bikes these days, they are simply not interested in the top speed pursuit. What matters is power, weight, and wheelbase/rake etc. If you look at my post at the top the actual top speed of a ZX6R is higher than what the OP got on his bike, and indicated higher again.

162mph x 1.609 = 261km/h
181mph x 1.609 = 291km/h

Oh, don't get me wrong. It's not that I wouldn't expect the bike to go faster than 233 km/h... It's more saying that 233 km/h isn't fast enough (for the road). But yeah, I'd be wanting my bike to perform to spec or above as well...

Using a GPS to measure topspeed is probably the best method, but there are heaps of variables with a GPS and unless you're used to using them then it wouldn't be hard to mess up the reading. Slopster - how did you do the measurement?

[slopster]

Oh, don't get me wrong. It's not that I wouldn't expect the bike to go faster than 233 km/h... It's more saying that 233 km/h isn't fast enough (for the road). But yeah, I'd be wanting my bike to perform to spec or above as well...

Using a GPS to measure topspeed is probably the best method, but there are heaps of variables with a GPS and unless you're used to using them then it wouldn't be hard to mess up the reading. Slopster - how did you do the measurement?

Yeah top speed is too fast for the road but topspeed is the only way other then a dyno to objectivly measure. Its easy to let your mind play tricks and you can't really judge accelleration by the seat of your pants.

Used the gps just taped to my tank and displaying speed I didn't go hard stayed within licence keeping speed and compared the gps speed with the speedo to get my error %. The gps does respond slowly (only updates every second) so you need to keep a steady speed to do this accurately.

By the way it seems that all I needed was the jumper mod I hit 269 indicated on the same bit of road so just goes to show how much a US ecu can strangle the bike.

And BTW Mikkel are you still interested in my old gsxr? Sorry to see you crashed you bike the other day. The gsxr does 285 indicated...

[discotex]

By the way it seems that all I needed was the jumper mod I hit 269 indicated on the same bit of road so just goes to show how much a US ecu can strangle the bike.

That's more like it :woohoo:

[jrandom]

'I put the frontr back down at 180'

But she says it so believably, doesn't she?

:niceone:

xDACvcZ7MWI

[jrandom]

there are heaps of variables with a GPS...

Not really heaps, as such.

So long as the GPS has a fix, the only two relevant factors would be:

A. GPS receiver software only reports speed in the XY plane - vertical positioning is too inaccurate for speed calculations, so you can forget about accurate speed if you're not on the flat.

B. In the XY plane, positional accuracy is guaranteed to within 5 metres; practically, it's usually within 2 metres.

Within, say, the SiRFstar GPS modules, speed is reported every second based on a simple calculation of how far away the current position is from the one calculated a second ago, so if you want an accurate speed you'd best be travelling in a straight line, too.

(I know this because I've read the code.)

So if you, say, take a 2m accuracy average, and a vehicle's travelling at 100kph, it'll be moving at 27.8m/s, giving you the possibility of about a 7% error.

However, the nature of the up-to-2m error tends to be a constant across many readings, and only shifts gradually over time. The error variation between two successive GPS positions a second apart is usually almost nonexistent; more in the order of 20cm, max, than 2m.

I'd therefore expect a < 1% error in reported speed from a GPS at 100kph on the flat, decreasing and increasing linearly as the speed being measured went up or down.

A GPS top-speed reading on a motorcycle being ridden in a straight line on the flat would therefore be pretty darn reliable, most likely in the order of a tenth of a percent or so off perfect.

I'm not a GPS receiver designer, though, so for all I know there are hidden quirks and shortcomings of the system that I'm not taking into account. But given that GPS is regularly used to pop cruise missiles directly up the arseholes of ragheads hiding behind mountains a hundred miles away from the launcher, with the only difference in military/civilian signals being the nature of that guaranteed maximum positional error, I'd say that I'm probably making a good bet.

Basically, it boils down to, no guarantees, but the output has a very high chance of being highly accurate.

[Mikkel]

Yeah top speed is too fast for the road but topspeed is the only way other then a dyno to objectivly measure. Its easy to let your mind play tricks and you can't really judge accelleration by the seat of your pants.

Used the gps just taped to my tank and displaying speed I didn't go hard stayed within licence keeping speed and compared the gps speed with the speedo to get my error %. The gps does respond slowly (only updates every second) so you need to keep a steady speed to do this accurately.

By the way it seems that all I needed was the jumper mod I hit 269 indicated on the same bit of road so just goes to show how much a US ecu can strangle the bike.

And BTW Mikkel are you still interested in my old gsxr? Sorry to see you crashed you bike the other day. The gsxr does 285 indicated...

Good to see you got it up there - didn't realise you had a US ECU.

About the GSX-R - sorry I bought the '96 ZX7RR I was looking at the week before you put yours for sale. It came back on trademe a couple of days after the auction ended due to some issues at the other end.
I think one bike for March should be enough ;)

Best of luck with the sale mate, she looks like a fine bike to me! :yes:


Not really heaps, as such.

I was thinking more about what reference system you use - the coordinate system that the GPS operates out from. Can't remember the bloody terms - but it has to do with projections since the earth is not perfectly round and such, so you use different algorithms depending on where you are and what you're trying to achieve...

[Harry the Barstard]

My 05 6rr did an indicated 285. It had a power commander with all the addons an had been properly tuned. It had to be telling porkies but it still went fast enough to loose my licence for 28days.
:spanking:

[icekiwi]

My 05 6rr did an indicated 285. It had a power commander with all the addons an had been properly tuned. It had to be telling porkies but it still went fast enough to loose my licence for 28days.
:spanking:

Hey Harry B
ive got your bike and can vouch for the k's...an i still got my licence.
Shit itself the other day...all good though as its been getting a good caning
Just a typical zx i suppose..lol

[Harry the Barstard]

Hey Harry B
ive got your bike and can vouch for the k's...an i still got my licence.
Shit itself the other day...all good though as its been getting a good caning
Just a typical zx i suppose..lol

Its good to see she is still looking as good as when i sold her. I see you went back to the original screen. It kinda makes me sad to see her again, damm its a sexy bike.

What problems did you have when it "shit itself"?

[icekiwi]

Its good to see she is still looking as good as when i sold her. I see you went back to the original screen. It kinda makes me sad to see her again, damm its a sexy bike.

What problems did you have when it "shit itself"?

Broke a 2nd ring on no1 piston,broke out a bit of the ring land as well.Everything else sweet ass bore head etc,just got it back together and its going heaps better but i'm not 100% happy with it will get it set up again on a dyno...
Its a better bike to ride with the other screen on,seems to be slipperyer...
Better airflow for me but i'm only a short arse...with a big head...lol

[Cr1MiNaL]

Ive had the R-6 upto 289 on Puke had more I thought, I just ran outa track.

[kiwifruit]

<img src="http://i32.tinypic.com/5b5gt0.jpg"/>

[Matt Bleck]

Ive had the R-6 upto 289 on Puke had more I thought, I just ran outa track.


Pic



HE's gunna learn you on the 4th Fruitie!!!!! :rolleyes:

[kiwifruit]

HE's gunna learn you on the 4th Fruitie!!!!! :rolleyes:

yes... i'm ready, tho

might have to trade up to an r6, they sound faster than the r1 :wacko:

[Slingshot]

Here's my R6 tapped out at the sprints. Actual speed across the 1/4 mile: 257.57 Kph

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBHtl86lRUc

[kiwifruit]

Here's my R6 tapped out at the sprints. Actual speed across the 1/4 mile: 257.57 Kph

either you got a lemon, Raj has one with a freakish motor or......... :shutup:

[owner]

either you got a lemon, Raj has one with a moto gp motor or......... :shutup:

to easy just kidding Raj my revs stops climbing at 269. I'd be stoked if it was actually doing more than 250

[Cr1MiNaL]

umm no im not shittin u, thats what it read.

[wharfy]

The most I have had out of my bike is 229 (point something) as measured by the timing lights at a sprint meeting. My GPS locked max speed at 230, the speedo was showing a very optimistic 240 !!
I was into the redline in top gear before I passed the first timing light so I ain't going to go any faster than that :-)

[rufusdion]

Had the SV to a indicated 276km/hr tapped out and redlining with no-more pull.Private road of course.
I know for a fact over 200km/hr the speedo is around 15-20km/hr out

[icekiwi]

Had my calibration check done with the MOT over the weekend...at 130kms reading its 1km out.....bugger!!!

[hayd3n]

230 is about right for 5th gear.

yeah i got dyned 4th gear 210kms 82.38 hp