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View Full Version : $35,000 motorcycle awarded to TV evangelist Tamaki



Bob
14th December 2004, 01:27
Televangelist and Destiny Church leader Brian Tamaki has been given a customised motorcycle, understood to be worth at least $35,000, as payment for speaking at an American church.

The gift comes after Tamaki and his wife Hannah were sent on a luxury South Pacific cruise as a wedding anniversary present from New Zealand's 20 Destiny Churches. Tamaki's sister and her new husband also went.

Tamaki collects a six-figure salary - details of which he refuses to divulge - and lives in a million-dollar clifftop home in Auckland, drives an $80,000 Ford Explorer and received a $35,000 Harley Davidson for his birthday. He also recently bought a new boat worth more than $100,000.

Destiny Church spokeswoman Janine Cardno confirmed Tamaki received another motorbike as an "honourarium" for speaking at the Spirit and Truth conference run by New Birth Missionary Baptist Church in Atlanta in September.


All I can say is... nice work if you can get it...

Storm
14th December 2004, 05:51
Amen to that

avgas
14th December 2004, 05:57
what good is the shepard if you can sell all the sheeps wool :whistle:

Rainbow Wizard
14th December 2004, 06:11
That's disgusting and typical of the US style of his "destiny". You don't see many leaders of churches exploiting a situation like that, the real ones give to the poor and disadvantaged. They wouldn't behave in such a selfish manner as to keep the bike. Well, maybe for a month or two.....
I don't think he's selling the wool, I think he's pulling it over the congregation's eyes, ot at least helping them keep themselves in the dark over what truly is spiritual maturity. Bleating in unison at an Americanised sect sure ain't my cuppa tea but I am a Christian and contribute to my own church in a variety of ways. But if our vicar was an extravagant rocker like Mr Brian "Elvis" Tamaki I wouldn't be there. I hope the IRD get to hear of it and tax him to the gills.

riffer
14th December 2004, 06:20
Just remember fellers -

the lord giveth, and the lord taketh away.

He'll get what's his in the long run.

Blackbird
14th December 2004, 06:20
I'm not sure that Destiny Church is anything to do with being a Christian, more like a straight out business using the gullible to finance it. When I spent some time working in the States, I was staggered just how big "fundamentalism" of this kind is, particularly down south. It's on every tv channnel and every street corner and the presenters all look the same - big teeth, big hair and expensive trinkets. "Send money or you will face eternal damnation" seems to be the common line.

Big business? Certainly. Christianity? Errr..... perhaps not. :argh:

James Deuce
14th December 2004, 06:23
Christian fundamentalists won Bush the election too, so it is a political movement, not just a financial one. I reckon that is Mr Tamaki's ultimate aim.

Hitcher
14th December 2004, 07:56
Power and money. There's always an angle and it usually involves power and money.

MikeL
14th December 2004, 08:16
The nexus between religion, power and money is quite interesting. So interesting that it really deserves a thread of its own. We could call it "Religious Ravings"...

NordieBoy
14th December 2004, 08:25
The nexus between religion, power and money is quite interesting. So interesting that it really deserves a thread of its own. We could call it "Religious Ravings"...

Or "The Raving Religious".

"The Raving".

"Rave On".

Hmmm...

Coyote
14th December 2004, 08:56
All I can say is... Huzzah!

Not only is the government a money making conglomerate,

But so is religion!!!

I love this world we live in! Now 'scuse me as I drink a glass of carrot juice and jump off a cliff :niceone:

Blakamin
14th December 2004, 09:05
With any luck, the wanker will fall off it and bust a few body parts..... :ar15:

vifferman
14th December 2004, 09:15
Not only is the government a money making conglomerate,

But so is religion!!!Has been for eons, Alarumba. The Catholic and Anglican churches in NZ have been big property owners for a long time (probably less so now though).
But the gubmint divested themselves of many of their quangos and other businesses in the 70s and 80s, so they're not as big a conglomerate as used to be the case.

James Deuce
14th December 2004, 09:18
With any luck, the wanker will fall off it and bust a few body parts..... :ar15:
He's been a long term biker. His brothers run a HD touring company.

While I understand the sentiment, I wouldn't wish that particular fate on anyone, you stroppy Aussie ;)

Blakamin
14th December 2004, 09:20
He's been a long term biker. His brothers run a HD touring company.
Yeah....seen their TV show... dont mean he wont fall off tho



While I understand the sentiment, I wouldn't with that particular fate on anyone, you stroppy Aussie ;)
Why not??? he's fleecing thousands of people....

Ok...I hope someone steals his bike and strips it for parts and burns whats left
:rolleyes:

James Deuce
14th December 2004, 09:31
Ok...I hope someone steals his bike and strips it for parts and burns whats left
:rolleyes:

That's more like it! :)

rodgerd
14th December 2004, 10:51
He's been a long term biker. His brothers run a HD touring company.

But he decided there were better ways to get money than work for a living...

Ms Piggy
14th December 2004, 12:00
Christian fundamentalists won Bush the election too, so it is a political movement, not just a financial one. I reckon that is Mr Tamaki's ultimate aim.
It definitely is. I heard him talking on the National Programme the other morning just before the CUB was passed. He has a definte political agenda alright! He also has the theory that "average NZers" (whatever they are) want what he wants.

Paul in NZ
14th December 2004, 13:33
It definitely is. I heard him talking on the National Programme the other morning just before the CUB was passed. He has a definte political agenda alright! He also has the theory that "average NZers" (whatever they are) want what he wants.

Well that proves it.... I must be below average 'cos I don't want a $35,000 custom HD thingy... 10 x $3,500 Moto Guzzis, now yer talkin'

Paul N

Alcohol and pills, it's a crying shame.
You'd think they might've been happy with the glory and the fame.
But fame doesn't take away the pain, it just pays the bills.
And you wind up on alcohol and pills.

Fred Eaglesmith

Gixxer
14th December 2004, 14:34
I love the slick, shinny hair.

rodgerd
14th December 2004, 14:38
It definitely is. I heard him talking on the National Programme the other morning just before the CUB was passed. He has a definte political agenda alright! He also has the theory that "average NZers" (whatever they are) want what he wants.

Well, you do know one of the songs his church has includes lines like, "We come to conquer." It's why they've set up their political party.


He also has the theory that "average NZers" (whatever they are) want what he wants.

I'm sure a lot of average New Zealanders would love to have a mansion and 6 figure salary provided for elaborating on their prejudices. Most of us might be a bit squemish if it was provided by a bunch of poor folks whose kids go without, though.

jrandom
14th December 2004, 14:50
theory that "average NZers" (whatever they are)

That would be all the families with exactly 2.13 children.

Blackbird
14th December 2004, 15:18
I hate to mention this but he's a good ole Tokoroa boy. Used to stand on the footpath trying to round up victims (sorry, converts) in the early days. He wasn't as polished (or rich) then!

His brothers (Tamaki Tours) seem really good guys though.

vifferman
14th December 2004, 15:22
His brothers (Tamaki Tours) seem really good guys though.They're fundamentalist Christians too (Destiny Church as well??)

Coldkiwi
14th December 2004, 16:24
Well, you do know one of the songs his church has includes lines like, "We come to conquer." It's why they've set up their political party.




come on, tell me you've got more of a basis for disliking him than that! is that slant REALLY evident if you read the rest of the song lyrics or are you just having another troll?? (I don't know the song you're refering to btw but I VERY much doubt it)

Velox
14th December 2004, 16:51
They're fundamentalist Christians too (Destiny Church as well??)
Good on them. It's the double standard stuff that's the prob with Brian, not the fact that they're all fundamentalist Christians!

Coyote
14th December 2004, 17:09
I heard on the News a little while back, he expects to be the prime minister [of New Zealand] in 2006.

He's got my vote :niceone:

Wait, I can't vote, oh well, sucks to him :bleh:

Bounty
14th December 2004, 17:14
Just like the Tui ads "It is a Church, not a Cult" - Yeah Right!

Mind you I wouldn't say no to a $35K bike either, just realistic enough to know that it won't happen!

rodgerd
14th December 2004, 17:31
come on, tell me you've got more of a basis for disliking him than that! is that slant REALLY evident if you read the rest of the song lyrics or are you just having another troll?? (I don't know the song you're refering to btw but I VERY much doubt it)

Yes, it is that evident. Tamaki's made it pretty clear what he and his church want: a New Zealand governed according to his interpretation of biblical law.

I'll continue to feel free to throw rocks at the cunt so long as he feels free to push for a theocratic New Zealand.

Ms Piggy
14th December 2004, 17:35
I heard on the News a little while back, he expects to be the prime minister [of New Zealand] in 2006.
This is an example of the sort of stuff I can't stomach about Tamaki and his lot. All these outlandish claims & statements he makes. I recall for his Enough is Enough march on Parliament he was saying it was gonna be a bigger march than the Hikoi - "buzzzzzzzzz" wrong!

Coyote
14th December 2004, 17:50
This is an example of the sort of stuff I can't stomach about Tamaki and his lot. All these outlandish claims & statements he makes. I recall for his Enough is Enough march on Parliament he was saying it was gonna be a bigger march than the Hikoi - "buzzzzzzzzz" wrong!
At least he's optimistic :lol:

Paul in NZ
14th December 2004, 17:52
This is an example of the sort of stuff I can't stomach about Tamaki and his lot. All these outlandish claims & statements he makes. I recall for his Enough is Enough march on Parliament he was saying it was gonna be a bigger march than the Hikoi - "buzzzzzzzzz" wrong!

Do I need a reason not to like him?

Wears too much bling for a normal bloke....

That enough?

Paul N

Hitcher
14th December 2004, 18:24
Isn't it amazing how so-called open-minded liberals respond to the words "Brian Tamaki" and "George W Bush"...

Paul in NZ
14th December 2004, 18:27
Isn't it amazing how so-called open-minded liberals respond to the words "Brian Tamaki" and "George W Bush"...

Hey my mind is open....

But so are my eyes....

Paul N

mangell6
14th December 2004, 18:28
Can't be bothered reading this thread, its about religon and peoples brains go out the door.

Just remember that the media always tell the truth, ok.

Ms Piggy
14th December 2004, 19:08
Hey my mind is open....

But so are my eyes....

Paul N
Exactly. :rolleyes:

Hitcher
14th December 2004, 19:41
Hey my mind is open....
But so are my eyes...
If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck?

Paul in NZ
14th December 2004, 20:02
If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck?

More like....

If it looks like a dick

And talks like a real dick

It must be a dick-tator......

Just my opinion of course....

James Deuce
14th December 2004, 20:17
If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck?

Then it has something to hide. Nothing is exactly how it looks and does.

Jackrat
14th December 2004, 20:39
Isn't it amazing how so-called open-minded liberals respond to the words "Brian Tamaki" and "George W Bush"...

Yeah well most of it's just jealousy aye.
If the sheep are there somebody is going to shear them.In this case it's a bloke named Tamaki.
If it wasn't him it would be somebody else.
That's what sheep are for.
As for his political asperations,to small.
At best an inefective distraction for the larger partys to play with.
Even his so called average New Zealander is recognizable,and they ain't average.

Ms Piggy
14th December 2004, 20:45
If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck?
My opinion on Tamaki and his sort comes from having been as quackers as him once upon a time. In fact I recall hearing him & his wife speak at the church I used to attend in Oamaru and thinking they were inspiring! :shit:

wari
15th December 2004, 03:04
If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck?

DUck walks into a barr ..

DUck - " GOtta any bread?"

BArr-tender - "NOpe"

DUck - " GOtta any bread?"

BArr-tender - "NOpe"

DUck - " GOtta any bread?"

BArr-tender - "NOpe"

DUck - " GOtta any bread?"

BArr-tender - "LOok ... if you dont bugger off, I'M gonna nail your beak to the barr ... "

DUck - " GOtta any nails?"

BArr-tender - "NOpe"

DUck - " GOtta any bread?"

:killingme

avgas
15th December 2004, 05:46
now that is funny

Blakamin
15th December 2004, 08:06
I dont like sheep-religion at the best of times

and I have no bad opinion of GW Bush... he's gotta do what he's gotta do!


(Hides under table waiting for the flames)





DUck - " GOtta any nails?"

BArr-tender - "NOpe"

DUck - " GOtta any bread?"

:killingme
Well Done!!!!! :killingme

James Deuce
15th December 2004, 08:19
I dont like sheep-religion at the best of times

and I have no bad opinion of GW Bush... he's gotta do what he's gotta do!


(Hides under table waiting for the flames)



Well Done!!!!! :killingme

You're Australian - we expect you to have US arse grease on your face.

ajturbo
15th December 2004, 08:34
My opinion on Tamaki and his sort comes from having been as quackers as him once upon a time. In fact I recall hearing him & his wife speak at the church I used to attend in Oamaru and thinking they were inspiring! :shit:


sooooo you lived in Oamaru also ???

Blakamin
15th December 2004, 08:51
You're Australian - we expect you to have US arse grease on your face.
hehehehe.... yes, I'm Australian... but I'm not the PM so I dont do anything to merkins....


http://www.enslavenz.org/tenreasons.html please read reason 1 or 8 :D

Coyote
15th December 2004, 09:22
Just remember that the media always tell the truth, ok.
:killingme

Coldkiwi
15th December 2004, 13:38
so has anyone actually decided whats wrong with giving someone a bike as a "thank you" gift? Or did someone find evidence that Tamaki demanded it as payment?
Yes there's smoke (dontcha love that 'nothing will stand in the way of us publishing the truth' media) but where's the fire??

jrandom
15th December 2004, 13:48
so has anyone actually decided whats wrong with giving someone a bike as a "thank you" gift? Or did someone find evidence that Tamaki demanded it as payment?
Yes there's smoke (dontcha love that 'nothing will stand in the way of us publishing the truth' media) but where's the fire??

A 'thank you gift'? That's disingenuous. Big bucks flow in the world of rabble-rousing media religion. Doesn't really matter whether or not Mr Tamaki demanded it. It's slimy.

And don't get me started on comparing Mr Tamaki's political aspirations to Jesus' statements about being "no part of the world..."

The guy's a snake.

Paul in NZ
15th December 2004, 13:56
so has anyone actually decided whats wrong with giving someone a bike as a "thank you" gift? Or did someone find evidence that Tamaki demanded it as payment?
Yes there's smoke (dontcha love that 'nothing will stand in the way of us publishing the truth' media) but where's the fire??

No one cares about that... Christ on a crutch, compared to wot Judy Bailey gets pastor Brian is a bloody bargain mate...

However....

Judy does not want to take over NZ
Judy is 'nice'
Judies jewellery is tasteful
Judy does not march down the street with goons

I LIKE Judy...

I don't like Brian...

I think we should burn Brian (but stand well back because with all that shite on his hair he will go up like a good un)

Paul N

MikeL
15th December 2004, 14:06
If there's any justice in the hereafter, people like Tamaki and the whole cohort of high living televangelizers preying on the weak and gullible will roast in hell at a far higher temperature than the honest atheists and agnostics who at least put the search for "truth" ahead of self-aggrandizement and enrichment cloaked in a hypocritical piety.

jrandom
15th December 2004, 14:12
If there's any justice in the hereafter, people like Tamaki and the whole cohort of high living televangelizers preying on the weak and gullible will roast in hell at a far higher temperature than the honest atheists and agnostics who at least put the search for "truth" ahead of self-aggrandizement and enrichment cloaked in a hypocritical piety.

A-bloody-men to that, Brother Mike...

Hooks
15th December 2004, 14:27
Well I think you have well and truly done that thread to it's natural death .... any hope of fuckin' Tamaki following it sometime soon ...... :moon:

jrandom
15th December 2004, 14:39
any hope of fuckin' Tamaki

Perhaps, if you paid him enough, and brought your own Vaseline.

Yokai
15th December 2004, 15:00
I've just been to their website (destinychurch.or.nz) and OMG - I so wish I hadn't. But my fave bit on it has to be their signoff...

God Richly Bless you.

which means WHAT exactly ...

I also love the semi patronising, trying to look spiritual gaze that he adopts in all his photos. Ugh - slime......eeeeeee....eeeeey

Why did you lot have to bring up his name and make me google for him? AAAARRRGGHHHHH!

Coldkiwi
15th December 2004, 16:10
A 'thank you gift'? That's disingenuous. Big bucks flow in the world of rabble-rousing media religion. Doesn't really matter whether or not Mr Tamaki demanded it. It's slimy.

And don't get me started on comparing Mr Tamaki's political aspirations to Jesus' statements about being "no part of the world..."

The guy's a snake.

thats an average quality response coming from you J. Surely it matters critically whether he demanded a $35,000 motorcycle for services or whether they just decided to be generous because they liked his preaching (of course, this isn't as sensational so won't make good news).

For crying out loud, the CLCA congregation decided to give a Pizza boy who delivered a pizza to our Pastors sons in church (requested by the assistance pastor during the service) a $800 tip just for the sake of showing generosity. The pizza guy might've been slacking off all day for all we know but is being generous to him slimy too? (note this would be fundamentally different if he had demanded $800 to deliver the pizza).

I just don't see any rigourous arguments against him here. Lots of hate (tongue in cheek perhaps) but I vaguely recall destiny/tamaki getting lined up for hating people a while ago with similar vindication and piss poor reasoning.

James Deuce
15th December 2004, 17:30
thats an average quality response coming from you J. Surely it matters critically whether he demanded a $35,000 motorcycle for services or whether they just decided to be generous because they liked his preaching (of course, this isn't as sensational so won't make good news).

For crying out loud, the CLCA congregation decided to give a Pizza boy who delivered a pizza to our Pastors sons in church (requested by the assistance pastor during the service) a $800 tip just for the sake of showing generosity. The pizza guy might've been slacking off all day for all we know but is being generous to him slimy too? (note this would be fundamentally different if he had demanded $800 to deliver the pizza).

I just don't see any rigourous arguments against him here. Lots of hate (tongue in cheek perhaps) but I vaguely recall destiny/tamaki getting lined up for hating people a while ago with similar vindication and piss poor reasoning.

Did the pizza guy declare tax on the income? He isn't a registered charity unlike the organisation giving him $800. If he didn't both parties broke the law. For some reason churches think they are outside secular law or ethical business practice. The gift of a $35,000 motorcycle to Theresa Gattung for closing an International multi million dollar deal would provoke indignation amongst the general populace, investigation by the SFO, and probably a sacking or two.

Brian Tamaki has labelled me and my lifestyle as being anti-christian, and has publicly stated that a great deal of the ethics that make up my personal belief system are a crime against God and humanity. He has done this in a public forum to hundreds of thousands of NZers. Why are you sticking up for a man that would happily bully the poor and underprivileged into tithing if they want to belong to his church? Why would you support a man who provides no reasoned argument himself for why his belief system is right, as it it is structured entirely on faith?

It grates that Judy Bailey and Theresa Gattung are criticised for the amount they EARN, but Brian Tamaki who has built his empire on the backs of the emotionally and spiritually needy would attract support purely because you have loosely related faith basis for your spirituality that falls into the general spectrum that Mr Tamaki's does.

I don't hate Brian Tamaki. I hate the fact that a neo-fascist cult of personality can rise to such economic power in my little country. The one that welcomes Somali Muslims and Christians, Bosnians, Rumanians, White African refugees, and South East Asians.

SPman
15th December 2004, 18:23
Power and money. There's always an angle and it usually involves power and money. But, seriously though,

Did you mention the power?

..........and the money?

NordieBoy
15th December 2004, 20:13
hehehehe.... yes, I'm Australian... but I'm not the PM so I dont do anything to merkins....


http://www.enslavenz.org/tenreasons.html please read reason 1 or 8 :D

Hmmm....

10. Question: Which has the better chance of stopping an Aussie F-111 bombing raid on Auckland, the Kiwi airforce or a flock of their beloved sheep?
Answer: they both have an equal chance (ie none). Why? Because New Zealand disbanded its combat airforce in the late 90s. Bombs away!

How are the sheep going to get into the city?
Oops. They're already there...

How about Tuesday week?
That'd give us a chance to get a good seat to watch the show from.

:buggerd:

Coldkiwi
16th December 2004, 11:23
Did the pizza guy declare tax on the income? He isn't a registered charity unlike the organisation giving him $800. If he didn't both parties broke the law.

must we go through this??? The pizza dudes money was never actually the churches anyway (went straight from wallets, to collection to pizza guy) so no problems.



Brian Tamaki has labelled me and my lifestyle as being anti-christian, and has publicly stated that a great deal of the ethics that make up my personal belief system are a crime against God and humanity. He has done this in a public forum to hundreds of thousands of NZers. Why are you sticking up for a man that would happily bully the poor and underprivileged into tithing if they want to belong to his church? Why would you support a man who provides no reasoned argument himself for why his belief system is right, as it it is structured entirely on faith?


I don't know enough about Destiny or Brian Tamaki to actually start defending his attitude or the running of his church. But what I am suggesting is that NO-ONE here knows enough about Destiny or Brian Tamaki to be taking such grandiose pot shots with such a miniscule amount of evidence (one web article). I will tell you for a fact that i have heard stories of strange attitudes and proceedures at Destiny that I don't understand and wouyld be pretty uncomfortable with if my church started implementing them. Because of that, I'm not going to defend what he does, but that doesn't mean I have the right to villify him as some all-hating homophobic who's trying to demonise the NZ populace. For all the people brandying around 'hatred'
"I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".... as a wise man once said. You'd care to suggest otherwise?

James Deuce
16th December 2004, 11:32
must we go through this??? The pizza dudes money was never actually the churches anyway (went straight from wallets, to collection to pizza guy) so no problems.


I don't know enough about Destiny or Brian Tamaki to actually start defending his attitude or the running of his church. But what I am suggesting is that NO-ONE here knows enough about Destiny or Brian Tamaki to be taking such grandiose pot shots with such a miniscule amount of evidence (one web article). I will tell you for a fact that i have heard stories of strange attitudes and proceedures at Destiny that I don't understand and wouyld be pretty uncomfortable with if my church started implementing them. Because of that, I'm not going to defend what he does, but that doesn't mean I have the right to villify him as some all-hating homophobic who's trying to demonise the NZ populace. For all the people brandying around 'hatred'
"I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".... as a wise man once said. You'd care to suggest otherwise?

I watched Brian Tamaki on Television for 12 months because I was intrigued to see how a NZ Televangelist would work. Before you scoff, I'd be up feeding kids before work and it was the only thing on. To start with it was "down home", unpretentious, and full of common sense wisdom for getting through life in general.

Destiny has turned into a grandiose production, full of bigotry and faith based leaps of logic that defy the practical evidence of what it takes to get through life, either as a faith advocate or a "faithless bum". Mr Tamaki has developed a following and a culture to suit the goals and aspirations of that following, while lining his pockets with tithes.

As for the $800, if I earned $800 I'd declare it. I've got this weird integrity thing that says that tax isn't optional, and everybody avoiding is making people like me have to pay more and more as time goes by. I guess you have no problem with that.

Hitcher
16th December 2004, 11:38
An $800 tip is pretentious. I'm sure Jesus had something to say about that.

The same amount would run two African orphans for a year.

R6_kid
16th December 2004, 19:33
get him to head out to mangere bridge and preach to all the people down there, but wait, what financial gain would they get from that.... none

Same thing with City Impact Church, the to pastors from that place live round the corner from me - $500,000 house, both have vehicles worth $40,000+ each... the church has a cafe in the foyer...

as my friend that used to go their says its not a church its a cult

tui says - its not a cult its a church, yeah rite! :bleh:

Bob
17th December 2004, 00:06
Guys,

I hate to go all "Moderator" on you, but I think the time has come to close this thread.

I'm really, REALLY pleased to see the debate has, as far as I can see, all been very good natured - but I think perhaps this is not the forum for a theological conversation - and I'm also worried this is going to overshadow all the other news items coming up (and personally I'm more interested in reading about a 320bhp turbine powered superbike!)

Hope this is OK with everyone and you understand why I've done this,

Bob