View Full Version : Speed cameras
ozrobo
27th July 2008, 01:15
ive been watching the fixed speed cameras and followed loads of guys speeding past them on bikes but never seen one go off has anyone had a ticket on one while riding and does it give a good photo:woohoo:
Gremlin
27th July 2008, 05:13
one way to find out for sure, isn't there? :done:
ozrobo
27th July 2008, 09:00
good idea can i borrow ya bike:niceone:
Number One
27th July 2008, 11:09
I've had one on the bike. Was coming towards it too so don't count on getting away with it when you approach front on.
As for the photo I kept meaning to get a copy...it was the first photo taken of me on my new bike and it would be an action shot too - Coming round a sloping downhill corner :lol:
Rockbuddy
27th July 2008, 11:14
I've had one on the bike. Was coming towards it too so don't count on getting away with it when you approach front on.
As for the photo I kept meaning to get a copy...it was the first photo taken of me on my new bike and it would be an action shot too - Coming round a sloping downhill corner :lol:
how did they know it was you? front on no plate showing could be anyone:confused:
CB ARGH
27th July 2008, 11:21
how did they know it was you? front on no plate showing could be anyone:confused:
That's what gets me also. It's not like they can look in their database to see who brought the latest tinted screen and "Bum Fluff" stickers. :girlfight:
Quite possibly they could issue the local officers with the picture of the bike, and if they see you then you're done.
Gosh I don't know, somebody inform our poor souls. Or at least, mine. ;)
Swoop
27th July 2008, 11:22
I've had one on the bike. Was coming towards it too so don't count on getting away with it when you approach front on.
As for the photo I kept meaning to get a copy...it was the first photo taken of me on my new bike and it would be an action shot too - Coming round a sloping downhill corner :lol:
The KB calendar is looking for "action shots". I wonder if the photo is copyright?:scratch:
If you look at your rego, notice how your plate number is bigger than any of the other text?
That makes it easier to read in the photo (if it is visable)... Simple solution is to make sure it is only visable to a traffic <STRIKE>nazi</STRIKE> warden if they look behind the numberplate.
Number One
27th July 2008, 11:22
how did they know it was you? front on no plate showing could be anyone:confused:
I want to say cos I'm the sexiest thing on a bike round these here parts but that would be lying :bleh:
I'm assuming either they have another camera in the van OR...probably more likely the man who drives it and services the camera sits there with a clipboard or some other such device and when the camera goes off he can tell it's a bike so knows to record the number plate...maybe :confused:
CB ARGH
27th July 2008, 11:24
I want to say cos I'm the sexiest thing on a bike round these here parts but that would be lying :bleh:
I'm assuming either they have another camera in the van OR...probably more likely the man who drives it and services the camera sits there with a clipboard or some other such device and when the camera goes off he can tell it's a bike so knows to record the number plate...maybe :confused:
What about fixed cameras though? :p
meteor
27th July 2008, 11:25
Unfortunately for some the photo's are very good and can zoom in enough to see the drivers face... and no they don't have to run the flash all the time so don't count on not getting a ticket just because of no flashing. Oh btw, there's more poles than cameras and they move the cameras around, set them to go off at different times etc. But I know there is a sure way to not get a ticket... don't speed... how easy is that!
Number One
27th July 2008, 11:26
What about fixed cameras though? :p
Haven't been picked up by one...I know where they are and so I am mindful of speed around them...I'm not silly...well maybe just a little...but I ain't made of money so do watch my speed just get carried away now and then is all :bleh:
nallac
27th July 2008, 11:41
so it pays to have ya rego sticker mounted to the rear hugger
convently behind rear the foot peg hanger then.:cool:
Swoop
27th July 2008, 11:49
so it pays to have ya rego sticker mounted to the rear hugger
convently behind rear the foot peg hanger then.:cool:
Especially on the right hand side...
BTW. Camera resolution has been dramatically increased recently (according to Te NEWS)...
Number One
27th July 2008, 11:55
REgo sticker bolted onto back of number plate :niceone: hadn't even thought of that sticker being a give away front on...but they are fucking ugly things - I don't get them being displayed on the frame and such...ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
BigG
27th July 2008, 12:58
If ya go fast enough the camera wont catch you, try it and tell me what happens:wari:
Dave-
27th July 2008, 15:46
"is that right officer, a black bike with a rider wearing black?"
Swoop
27th July 2008, 15:50
Strangely enough, there was a camera van on Hobsonville Rd in this lovely weather today. 1st test of Mr STi's capabilities.
We all know that weather dosen't effect radar signals though... riiiiight.
Jantar
27th July 2008, 16:06
If ya go fast enough the camera wont catch you, try it and tell me what happens:wari:
Believe it or not, but that statement is true. Once your speed exceeds 3*10^5 km/s no camera will get a photo of you. Whats more, you'll be past the camera before you even reach it.
CookMySock
27th July 2008, 16:19
We all know that weather dosen't effect radar signals though... riiiiight.precipitation might reduce the radar and detector units sensitivity, but it should not bring the accuracy into question.
DB
Swoop
27th July 2008, 16:26
precipitation might reduce the radar and detector units sensitivity, but it should not bring the accuracy into question.
I was thinking about the HMNZS Manawanui that was almost run down by a containership due to weather...
That would have made the news.
captain_andrey
27th July 2008, 16:37
I've had a van cam flash at me once from the front but I never got a ticket. There is also a stationary cam on the wellington motorway going to the hutt that is triggered by the pressure wires in the ground. Never managed to set that off.
EDIT: there is also that sign that tells your your speed at one of the motorway off ramps in wellington. I've never managed to activate it.
Number One
27th July 2008, 16:57
EDIT: there is also that sign that tells your your speed at one of the motorway off ramps in wellington. I've never managed to activate it.
If It's Murphy street off ramp it picks me up nice corner too :sunny:
CB ARGH
27th July 2008, 17:04
EDIT: there is also that sign that tells your your speed at one of the motorway off ramps in wellington. I've never managed to activate it.
Back in the day... well... three or so years ago. I was on my pushbike trying to activate one of those speed teller things... I rode past it again and again thinking I was going too slow, so I went past even faster each time. Works when there's two bikes side by side though :yes:
Ixion
27th July 2008, 17:10
I reckon those signs that show y' speed are pretty rude myself.
I'm the first to admit that I'm slower than y' Nanna's Nanna. But I don't reckon the government should be telling me so
A while ago I noticed up ahead one of those signs out Hobsonville way, saw it showing the speeds of the cars ahead. "OK, innersting" I thought.
But when I got to it, instead of showing me my speed, all it said was "SLOW". Well, I KNOW I'm slow. But I reckon it's a bit off having a sign say so, proclaiming it to all the world!
So, a bit peeved, I decided to loop the wwabbitt back and go through again, a goodish bit faster. It STILL just proclaimed I was slow, for all the world to see! Embarassing , it is.
So, real pissed off now (I mean, it's going a bit far when the roadside furniture's jeering at y'), I looped back again and went through full gauntlet. Down on the tank, wound it up , dunno what I was doing, cos all I could see was the fuel cap, but it must have been damn near the ton , in honest money. Look up as I go past , and the bloody thing STILL just tells me I'm slow!
Gave up at that point. Did consider going back and getting the thou, but I was afraid that it might say that was slow too.
Dunno how, but I reckon the gadgets somehow measure the rider not the vehicle.
Rude, I reckon it is.
Buggered if I know how fast y'd have to go to get even a grudging "Fairly Quick" let alone a "Fast".
TimeOut
27th July 2008, 17:11
I've had a van cam flash at me once from the front but I never got a ticket. There is also a stationary cam on the wellington motorway going to the hutt that is triggered by the pressure wires in the ground. Never managed to set that off.
EDIT: there is also that sign that tells your your speed at one of the motorway off ramps in wellington. I've never managed to activate it.
You have to deactivate da STEALTH mode.
captain_andrey
27th July 2008, 17:11
If It's Murphy street off ramp it picks me up nice corner too :sunny:
Yeah thats the one. I was trying to see how accurate my speedo is but I can never get it to activate on me. Must be the stealth like angles on my GT250R :) And yeah, great corner, especially in good weather.
CB ARGH
27th July 2008, 17:18
I reckon those signs that show y' speed are pretty rude... (+ other text)
You know they say "SLOW".... and then after that, they say "DOWN".
I think we're getting somewhere. :shit:
Number One
27th July 2008, 17:21
Yeah thats the one. I was trying to see how accurate my speedo is but I can never get it to activate on me. Must be the stealth like angles on my GT250R :) And yeah, great corner, especially in good weather.
Yeah, I ride a curvy SV and am ahem curvy meself...maybe that's why it picks me up :lol: not exactly any stealth like angles on either of us :laugh:
The Pastor
27th July 2008, 17:22
myself and skidmark once were riding and saw a speed camera, we both sped up to see if it would go off.
I didnt go off,
duckonin
27th July 2008, 18:07
:whistle:Yep cameras do give you a nice pic, my wife wears a pink jacket and it comes up a treat, twice now, shows the plate plain as.. :crybaby:
MaxB
27th July 2008, 18:22
My cage had been snapped and it is an excellent picture. Sharp as.
Bikes have 2 things on their side vs. fixed cameras. The first is that a bike has about 20% of the radar signature of a car. Why? Basically beacuse bikes have such a small frontal area and consist of more radar transparent materials eg plastics and alloy vs. steel and iron.
The second is that the inductive loop set in the road to identify the lane of the offender is calibrated for cars. You need a big mass of steel to set it off. Some bikes will and some bikes won't. Plus you may have seen bikers passing the loop on the left further reducing the effect. Note that the camera will still go off and you can still be manually identified where there are no other targets.
Personally I watch my speed around cameras because of the behaviour of drivers when they see the flash. Had some close calls.
ozrobo
15th August 2008, 23:17
:2thumbsup sweet that seems to have answered my question i guess i been lucky on the bike i still dont go crazy on em but i never been flashed in the cage its always getting me stupid 61 k rule always a crap fine
vindy500
15th August 2008, 23:53
that sign which tells you how fast youre going on the thorndon exit told me i was going 9km today. my speedo must be real out....
Forest
16th August 2008, 00:07
Don't forget that they have more fixed camera locations than cameras. So the camera box might not actually have a camera in it when you drive past.
vindy500
16th August 2008, 00:10
:2thumbsup sweet that seems to have answered my question i guess i been lucky on the bike i still dont go crazy on em but i never been flashed in the cage its always getting me stupid 61 k rule always a crap fine
reckon, its only 20% over the speed limit.
racefactory
16th August 2008, 09:28
well- still the question remains then.... how the hell does a fixed speed camera spot you when you are going towards it??
And what on earth is a camera van?? Never heard of it in my life- never seen one either? what do they look like? are they police cars? how are they usually parked?
I had no idea there are other cameras apart from those ones on the side of the road fixed into the ground on a pole and box..
but the biggest question is how the hell could it get you from front on?
twotyred
16th August 2008, 09:33
well- still the question remains then.... how the hell does a fixed speed camera spot you when you are going towards it??
And what on earth is a camera van?? Never heard of it in my life- never seen one either? what do they look like? are they police cars? how are they usually parked?
I had no idea there are other cameras apart from those ones on the side of the road fixed into the ground on a pole and box..
but the biggest question is how the hell could it get you from front on?
Camera vans are very common in wellington,often see two or three a day myself.
racefactory
16th August 2008, 09:34
never even heard of it in auckland...
-df-
16th August 2008, 10:48
never even heard of it in auckland...
I see them everywhere in auckland, one is just up the road from my place once a week (a dark greeb one).
Quite often parked between PT Chev and waterview turn offs on that little downhill straight as well (a white one).
Easy to spot...if ya see a van with super dark tints with a small hole cut in the tint on the back...its a speed camera van.
racefactory
16th August 2008, 11:13
shite... thanks for heads up. sneaky. are they police in the vans?
Do they only catch you if you are exceeding speed when you go right past them?
Toaster
16th August 2008, 11:23
I'm assuming either they have another camera in the van OR...probably more likely the man who drives it and services the camera sits there with a clipboard or some other such device and when the camera goes off he can tell it's a bike so knows to record the number plate...maybe :confused:
Yes they do. They write down the rego as you pass by.
Some camera operators I had discussions with are so sick of bikers being dickheads thinking they can "get away with it" that they will go out of their way to catch them.
The thing all riders need to remember is that if you keep speeding past cameras and flipping them off etc they will find ways to make our lives harder and harder... front plates... crackdown operations... the more you piss them off the more they will retaliate.
Look at hoons in cars, their pathetic gay wanky jap toy cars with blowdryers for exhausts have now brought about the new noise testing laws. So their own stupid actions brought about tough measures against them... and we get caught as by-catch with bike exhausts generally being louder and now the target of many a complaint to police.
Toaster
16th August 2008, 11:27
well- still the question remains then.... how the hell does a fixed speed camera spot you when you are going towards it??
And what on earth is a camera van?? Never heard of it in my life- never seen one either? what do they look like? are they police cars? how are they usually parked?
I had no idea there are other cameras apart from those ones on the side of the road fixed into the ground on a pole and box..
but the biggest question is how the hell could it get you from front on?
Read my previous post mate... may help you.
They use mufti vans with tinted windows. Usually parked discreetly off to the side of a road and sometimes very hard to see until the last moment. The cameras are angled across the road and the operator can record your plate as you pass by too.
Toaster
16th August 2008, 11:31
Seen them parked in the 50km/h zone in Waitoki (Kahikatea Flat Road) and also in Kaukapakapa (SH16) - both have schools and both have a high number of bikers speeding through them given they are in the middle of 100km/h zones.
Often they park very close to the speed signs too, so you have to be under 54km/h at the time you pass the sign.
And don't think that once you pass the van you are free... units also park at the other end of the zone to catch you as you leave the zone thinking you got a away with it.
My advice, be warned and slow down and put your money to better use than paying fines.... like petrol money for more rides with mates!
nico
16th August 2008, 16:01
never seen one go off on a car but pleanty a cage beein photographed by the rimatex on another note, first time ive driven the cage in months and i get a stupid ticket from a dick head onka last nite has any one ever got a ticked for going through a orange light? as far as im aware orange light means Stop IF SAFE TO DO SO aparently not the way mr aninal pigy reads the road code light turnd orange just as i went through and bang dont know where he was but he was on my like a fat kid on a cup cake no way was i changing his mind either trying to reason with him was pointles what a cock i had a prety good view on cops till last night has any one else had this problem?????? was going through peton:mad::mad:e/lower hutt
Swoop
16th August 2008, 20:32
My advice, be warned and slow down and put your money to better use than paying fines....
My advice. Bel STi. A much better use of your money.:blip:
CB ARGH
16th August 2008, 20:44
My advice. Bel STi. A much better use of your money.:blip:
If I brought that my mum would go mad at me. Put two and two together...
+Sports bike that says it can do 180km/h (what speedo doesn't these days though)...
+Immature teenager
+Radar detector
Hmm... :weep:
Swoop
16th August 2008, 20:50
+Sports bike that says it can do 180km/h (what speedo doesn't these days though)...
+Immature teenager
+Radar detector
Hmm... :weep:
Buy a cruiser then?
DUCATI*HARD
16th August 2008, 21:07
i usually lift the front wheel:devil2: till well past the camera:eek:,,,that seems to work:bleh:
FJRider
16th August 2008, 21:35
ive been watching the fixed speed cameras and followed loads of guys speeding past them on bikes but never seen one go off has anyone had a ticket on one while riding and does it give a good photo:woohoo:
Only if its taken from the front...:banana:
FJRider
16th August 2008, 21:58
If I brought that my mum would go mad at me. Put two and two together...
+Sports bike that says it can do 180km/h (what speedo doesn't these days though)...
+Immature teenager
+Radar detector
Hmm... :weep:
My advice...keep to the speed limits. Much better use of your money...spend it on gas. :laugh:
racefactory
17th August 2008, 00:18
well i tell you what guys, i have a good feeling that if i go fast enough... my 2 smoker may very well put up enough of a blanket to hide my number plate!
....ill let you guys know how it goes...
dont be surprised to find my bike on trademe to cover some... how to say it... incurred expenses.
Winston001
17th August 2008, 00:59
well- still the question remains then.... how the hell does a fixed speed camera spot you when you are going towards it??
And what on earth is a camera van?? Never heard of it in my life- never seen one either? what do they look like? are they police cars? how are they usually parked?
I had no idea there are other cameras apart from those ones on the side of the road fixed into the ground on a pole and box..
The only speed cameras in the deep south are in the back of plain station-wagons, parked on the side of the road. There might be vans, I've certainly had photos in my cage without ever seeing the camera.
So cameras are a completely random feast down here - no predicting them at all.
Incidentally cameras can easily grab a pic of you going away from them, in which case your plate is in plain view.
TimeOut
17th August 2008, 07:36
Plenty of the vans around here, but they usually have their favourite spots to sit and not hard to spot.
FJRider
17th August 2008, 11:15
Plenty of the vans around here, but they usually have their favourite spots to sit and not hard to spot.
Ditto round here too !!!
scumdog
17th August 2008, 11:19
Plenty of the vans around here, but they usually have their favourite spots to sit and not hard to spot.
Yep, white ones, red ones, all sorts.
And they are easy to spot mainly to those who are familiar with their normal locations, some ARE 'creatively' parked.
Blackshear
17th August 2008, 11:30
Are they really capable of such a high res as to zoom in on your rego sticker, stuck to the frame?
Good thing mine's hidden behind my legend plate :bleh:
AND.
What if you bought a chromey-tinted visor? No tickets from the front?!
FJRider
17th August 2008, 11:44
Are they really capable of such a high res as to zoom in on your rego sticker, stuck to the frame?
Good thing mine's hidden behind my legend plate :bleh:
AND.
What if you bought a chromey-tinted visor? No tickets from the front?!
Don't need to "zoom" in... If they get your plate... quick computer check...and if NO rego. has been paid, they add it to the bill... have a nice day... :beer:
Blackshear
17th August 2008, 12:20
Don't need to "zoom" in... If they get your plate... quick computer check...and if NO rego. has been paid, they add it to the bill... have a nice day... :beer:
I meant on the rego sticker, if they can't view your plate from the position of your bike vs camera LOS.
Would be interesting to know their Megapixel power!
FJRider
17th August 2008, 13:18
Unique paint jobs/sticker placments/obvious damage/clothing can get a conviction. Don't ALWAYS need a plate view to get you. Speed camera fines dont get demerits, hand written ones DO...you choose which you prefer...
Blackshear
17th August 2008, 13:27
Unique paint jobs/sticker placments/obvious damage/clothing can get a conviction. Don't ALWAYS need a plate view to get you. Speed camera fines dont get demerits, hand written ones DO...you choose which you prefer...
Stock 250 black bandit, only seen two others around my parts. I see your point, and raise you cautionary measures!
FJRider
17th August 2008, 13:31
I meant on the rego sticker, if they can't view your plate from the position of your bike vs camera LOS.
Would be interesting to know their Megapixel power!
Good enough to get CLEAR plate views of vehicles travellinng at 100 km/hr PLUS... :rockon:
Divot
17th August 2008, 13:42
I meant on the rego sticker, if they can't view your plate from the position of your bike vs camera LOS.
Would be interesting to know their Megapixel power!
Not Digital as yet and still use film. 650 photos per film.
Snap Snap Snap snap
Stormer
17th August 2008, 13:56
I`ve seen plenty all over, although as has been pointed out they have their fav spots which you soon learn in your local area.
They used to use stationwagons with the hatch 3/4 raised, which was a dead giveaway.
Now they`re trying to get sneaky and are using beat up old vans, shooting through the glass.
If you see any vehicle parked on the side of the road on a good straight, usually in the shadows, then treat it with caution.
I get less of a warning with the trusty Escort `cos the beam is not shot straight up the road like a typical radar, but rather more straight or diagonally across.
Still enough warning though if you don`t see the van.
Please disregard all of the above if you are a good motorcyclist and never exceed the posted speed limit and are...yawn...zzzzzzzzzzz
bully
17th August 2008, 16:01
you can ride around the pressure pad.
scumdog
17th August 2008, 17:31
you can ride around the pressure pad.
Vans don't use pressure pads..
FJRider
17th August 2008, 18:43
Vans don't use pressure pads..
I wonder what he's been riding round ??? :lol:
tl_tub
17th August 2008, 20:16
I meant on the rego sticker, if they can't view your plate from the position of your bike vs camera LOS.
Would be interesting to know their Megapixel power!
The new cameras, 11-12 megapixel
scumdog
17th August 2008, 21:51
The new cameras, 11-12 megapixel
Can even spot pimples on the face of the driver - or the pussy-whiskers on the bikes tyre....
kiwi cowboy
17th August 2008, 22:07
Ditto round here too !!!
whot are they in round alex fjrider i havent been pinged but then i watch my speed to and before you say anything let me...........i do ride a onda:baby::clap:
kiwi cowboy
17th August 2008, 22:17
Can even spot pimples on the face of the driver - or the pussy-whiskers on the bikes tyre....
well i aint got pimples[not on my face anyway:clap:]and im gona get da file and file da pussy whiskers off so does that mean i wont get cought:cool:
Sanx
18th August 2008, 11:59
Are camera vans generally operated by sworn officers?
FJRider
18th August 2008, 12:12
whot are they in round alex fjrider i havent been pinged but then i watch my speed to and before you say anything let me...........i do ride a onda:baby::clap:
In a van between Alex and Fruitlands... usually Fruitlands outside the old Cape Broome Hotel. Under the Oak trees...If not a camera, one of those Otago Rugby colours marked cars...you know the ones...:Police:
FJRider
18th August 2008, 12:15
Are camera vans generally operated by sworn officers?
Not as I understand...done on CONTRACT... not commission,...:laugh:
FJRider
18th August 2008, 12:18
well i aint got pimples[not on my face anyway:clap:]and im gona get da file and file da pussy whiskers off so does that mean i wont get cought:cool:
Wont hide the pink paint job...will the 'onda go fast enough...???:sunny:
Swoop
18th August 2008, 12:42
Are camera vans generally operated by sworn officers?
Non-sworn staff. i.e. civilians.
A mate's wife used to do that job in the early days. She used to park up then hopped over a fence, sat in a paddock and read a book.
Not permitted to leave the vehicle nowadays...
Divot
18th August 2008, 13:06
Are camera vans generally operated by sworn officers?
NO They are almost all non sworn
kiwi cowboy
18th August 2008, 17:55
Wont hide the pink paint job...will the 'onda go fast enough...???:sunny:
dont knock da pink[colourblind bugger]and of course it will go fast enough[a good push and long downhill slope:devil2:]:finger::tugger::devil2:
FJRider
18th August 2008, 18:18
dont knock da pink[colourblind bugger]and of course it will go fast enough[a good push and long downhill slope:devil2:]:finger::tugger::devil2:
I won't knock the honda anymore...its got enough knocks.:innocent:
Evo1132
18th August 2008, 18:25
Think a van got me the other day, doin 140ish got her down to about 110ish in about a millisecond, so dunno if it got me or not, I guess them the brakes, hehe
kiwi cowboy
18th August 2008, 18:36
I won't knock the honda anymore...its got enough knocks.:innocent:
i dont worry bout the knocks cos i cant hear them for the rattle:clap:ing
madbikeboy
18th August 2008, 18:50
Yes they do. They write down the rego as you pass by.
Some camera operators I had discussions with are so sick of bikers being dickheads thinking they can "get away with it" that they will go out of their way to catch them.
The thing all riders need to remember is that if you keep speeding past cameras and flipping them off etc they will find ways to make our lives harder and harder... front plates... crackdown operations... the more you piss them off the more they will retaliate.
Look at hoons in cars, their pathetic gay wanky jap toy cars with blowdryers for exhausts have now brought about the new noise testing laws. So their own stupid actions brought about tough measures against them... and we get caught as by-catch with bike exhausts generally being louder and now the target of many a complaint to police.
Umm, err, hmm. I've never flipped the bird. Or a wheelstand (although I'm fucking tempted some days). I don't tend to slow down though... One speed camera ticket in 20 years, but that was on the Hubba Bridge and it was parked on the median facing forward (on my right if that makes sense). It's just not cricket.
Toaster
18th August 2008, 19:36
One speed camera ticket in 20 years, but that was on the Hubba Bridge and it was parked on the median facing forward (on my right if that makes sense). It's just not cricket.
Yeah seen them parked up by the median barrier moving machine thingy's storage garage thingy.
They also park way too close to the change in speed signs where it goes from higher to lower speed zones. They may have changed the rules on this but it used to require a 250m buffer.
Blackshear
18th August 2008, 19:57
I think I got caughted by the one on the way from the Glenfield mall to the roundabout outside Shell today. Went via Kaipatiki to Gfield first, then saw that red van.. RED VAN??!?!one11 on the way back... Just got past it, saw its big fat turd coming out, saw the speedo (65, oops!) Braked hard and am still hoping nothing becomes of it...
FJRider
18th August 2008, 20:51
i dont worry bout the knocks cos i cant hear them for the rattle:clap:ing
So you're saying (admitting) its :clap:ped out...??? :whistle:
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2025 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.